Player Perspectives (Archived): Space, The Final Farce Here?
The lead up to Star Trek Online's Beta has been rife with controversy. This week, Jaime Skelton dives into exactly what happened.
Column By Jaime Skelton on November 27, 2009
When watching for hot topics in the community, I've noticed Cryptic is going to be a company laced with controversy. While their heels are still cooling from the heat from Champions Online's launch, now they are faced with troubles and worries about Star Trek Online, their newest title set to launch in February next year.
How is it that a game that hasn't even hit open beta has caused up such a stir? The fuss began with Champions Online, on a special offer launched in August for those who were interested in purchasing six month or lifetime subscriptions. The special offer included “guaranteed” closed beta access for Lifetime subscribers to Champions Online, and access (though not specifically stated as “guaranteed”) for six month subscribers. It's safe to assume that a large portion of the subscribers who took advantage of these offers wanted, and expected, to be able to participate in the beta testing of Star Trek Online.
Fast forward to October 22nd, when Cryptic announces that Star Trek Online's closed beta had begun that day. The Champions subscribers who had been promised beta access were quick to take a look and see if they had access yet – only to find that they, on a large scale, did not yet have access. There was a large amount of confusion, and Cryptic quickly stepped in that very day to explain the way their beta testing worked in terms of invitations sent. StormShade, a Cryptic Community Rep, posted an explanation, stating, “For every period of the beta, we have a set goal for the amount of players we have on the server during any play test [...] At first, the number of people in the closed beta is going to be very small.”
The explanation was reasonable. Plenty of closed betas have been done over a course of several phases, issuing regular waves of invites to testers over a course of time and, on the first day of closed beta testing – even the first week of closed beta testing – it seemed like a reasonable, fair answer. As the days passed on, however, and Champions Online subscribers were still waiting for invitations while Cryptic was giving out closed beta access via contests in their IRC channel, Twitter, and Facebook, things heated up – to over 500 forum pages worth of discussion.
What complicates matters is that at least one post was made (no longer available) that stated that closed beta access would go first to those six month and lifetime Champions Online subscribers. This time frame, according to Cryptic, was given in error, and given supposedly after the offer was expired and the subscriptions had already been purchased. Some argue, however, that it is only common sense that those who bought these subscriptions with guaranteed access would have access before other applicants or contestants.
At the least, Cryptic has reassured these players that they would have their closed beta access by the end of December, a little over a week before open beta starts on January 12th. With only a few hours time frame per day, this doesn't give testers a lot of chance to find, report, and discuss issues before the game transitions into its next phase of beta. It also devalues the exclusivity of open beta. While many are sure that Cryptic will make good on its promises to get all promised testers into closed beta, they feel the spirit of the offer has already been broken.
Is it fair that some of these subscribers are, to today's date, still waiting for closed beta access? I spoke with Brian 'Sata' Alvarez, former Perpetual Entertainment employee and co-host of STOradio, who said absolutely not. “We were told by Cryptic CM Daeke, that the lifetime/six months were to get inside beta first. Once the actual beta started, he retracted his statement and said he misspoke. Well, most have $250 that would be highly disappointed in his ill chosen words [...] I'm willing to state my bank account that most of the CO lifetime/six month purchases, were due in large part to that incentive.” There is some misunderstanding these “lifetimers” were simply trying to buy their way into a beta access. While true for some who purchased Champions Online and a lifetime subscription for the opportunity to begin on Star Trek Online, many others simply purchased the subscriptions with the conviction of getting all added bonuses – including the STO beta access. For those who did purchase the subscriptions only for the STO beta access, however, it seems highly unfair that keys are being given away while those guaranteed access are still waiting.
Sata added, “As lifetimers, we have a legitimate beef; however, some people have been going overboard with the outrage. I feel if we were more strategic and less hyperbolic, Cryptic would have given us some sort of restitution.” He may be right. There was no doubt that Cryptic made at least one mistake in communication with regards to whether access was prioritized as well as guaranteed. There's also discussion that another mistake may have been made in balancing the demand for closed beta spots through Champions Online subscriptions versus the actual planned number of testers during the closed beta phase. While refunds may not be due, the fair expectations of these customers were not met, and restitution could go a long way in calming their anger and restoring their faith in the company.
Not everyone is against Cryptic, however; there are still many people who stand in defense of the company in this situation. One of their counter-arguments, that people shouldn't try to buy their way into a closed beta, I've already partially addressed, and the issue of the purpose of beta testing could take up its own column – and already has by my fellows Jon Wood and Garrett Fuller. We'll shorten the argument for now and say that paying a company to test its product in advance is considered a dubious practice on the part of the buyer and the seller. Other arguments for Cryptic are that they haven't breached their promises to players yet (so far true), or that the beta bonus isn't due to the purchasers of the subscription because it was a freebie, not part of the purchase price (another complicated argument that gets into legalities, and has some players threatening to sue).
In months, or a year, the drama that's chased both Champions Online's launch and Star Trek Online's beta may pass as the proverbial water under the bridge; forgiveness may be widespread and trust rebuilt. “You have to remember,” Sata says, “Perpetual nearly screwed up the IP, until Cryptic saved it. We have to give them tons of credit.” Unfortunately for Cryptic, many have already turned away permanently, disappointed and leaving a trail of negativity in their wake.
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“Perpetual nearly screwed up the IP, until Cryptic saved it."
Oh God, the irony.
Cryptic and train wrecks seem to go hand in hand these days.
I haven't seen the whole beta fiasco as one of the biggest complaints against cryptic's deveopment of STO though it is obviously a problem now I think the line where you stated that both the company and the player can blame themselves holds true. I have no sympathy for anyone who fell for that line and likewise I think Cryptic brought any problems that arise from this on themselves but I think the game is still going to release I will still play it and I hope to enjoy it.
Dunno how you can say that.
They made CoH which even today is still one of the better MMO's out there.
Yeah Champions maybe wasn't so great but it is far from the likes of Vanguard, AoC and Warhammer at launch. I also questioned the wisdom of making a game that was essentually the same game as the last one they made but hell, it's not like there hasn't been an endless march of shit fantasy grinder clones over the last 10 years. I haven't actually tried Champions but I will once it's fleshed out a bit.
I am one of the lifetime subscribers... I bought it because i loved CoX and afcourse i wanted more... And with the added bonus to get into closed beta on one of my favorite tv shows, i just had to buy it.....
As it is now (Having made contact with Cryptic via email a few times), i think that with all the free access they hand out, they should have looked thru the paid ones first.... I do however understand, that paid testers might not provide the best testers, since anyone willing to buy into it, must be someone biased/fanataic about Star Trek.... In both good and bad!
As it is now, with the open beta getting closer, i do want a part of the lifetime subscription refunded, since i dont feel i get all that i paid for... and im not totally on the fences either... if Cryptic offered me 20+ dollars refund, i would be happy to wait for the open beta instead... just dont want to pay for something i dont get...
Cheers
Even though, i've watched every episode of every season 4 times, and seen all the movies. I saw most of the first time through with my family. We're all into the series. I won't be playing this STO from cryptic. Just all the bs they've done to people, has made me completely say there's no reason for me to spend my money on even trying this game. After everythign i've heard about them, i dont' think this game will even come close to the IP that's helped shape my childhood and my interest in technology.
"rife with controversy"? You only covered one issue for the whole article. Is there more?
I did not buy a lifetime or six month subscription for CO. However, I did receive an e-mail from Cryptic telling me if I did buy one of those subscriptions, I would get guaranteed access into STO. In fact it was the main selling point of the e-mail. If I had bought one of those subscriptions and didn't get into closed beta for STO before people getting free access I would be very upset.
I have nothing against Cryptic despite not buying CO, so this isn't the opinion of a someone that's just down on Cryptic, but Cryptic is in the wrong here. Whether intenionally or not they have misled their customers and they need to rectify this. Its both the right thing to do and important to their long term financial sucess.
Cryptic was giving refunds to at least up till 10-23-09 (when i asked for and was given a refund for a 6-month CO sub.)
I did not like the way they handled the STO closed beta invites, was pretty plain by that time that there was no way that i would be getting into the CB by a reasonable (to me) time.
No idea if they are still issuing refunds now, nor if i just got lucky and got a nice CS rep. They have never , to my knowledge, issued any statements one way or the other.
Was a rather large post on their (STO) forums about asking for refunds, around the time i submitted my ticket on CO support web site to get mine. I posted in a few different Sto forum posts as well, to let folks know that a refund was an option back when i got mine.
Anyhow, Cryptic and I are square, i did not get what i was expecting, and asked for a refund, and was given one, with no problem.
Just curious Jaime - can you explain this line ? "We'll shorten the argument for now and say that paying a company to test its product in advance is considered a dubious practice on the part of the buyer and the seller."
Exactly how is the BUYER committing some sort of shady practice? "Wow, I'm really excited about this game, and what I've seen on the website only fuels my fire! I'm so excited, I'd like to beta test it like I did those other 4 MMOs in the past! Wait, I can pay to get into the beta? COOL! Here's my money - cha-ching!"
Let me know how that sounds "shady" or underhanded in some way to you, mmkay?
This article is really suspicious. I'm reminded of the Shakespeare line: "Methinks he dost protest too loudly!" My cynical siren is sounding, telling me the author bought a lifetime sub to CO and is angry at not being in the Closed Beta yet.
Of all the controversy, THIS beta access is the one focused on? No mention of the other legitimate controversies?
Wait until STO is released then the real controversy will start. Who managed to screw up a perfect StarTrek license. Prev or Cryptic? I wish someone like Bioware would have gotten the license for STO. Atleast then it would have stayed true to the license and not become a POTBS clone.
Players were offered entry into STO's Beta in exchange for their paying for a lifetime or six month subscription to Champions Online. This constitutes a Legally binding contract. Criptic is now subject to lawsuits for breach of contract. I hope this happens. This entire episode reeks of Fraud.
The Beta Players that notice bugs and other problems may keep their mouths shut to keep a Champions Online free ride. Its not the wisest of moves but its not the first time that money or trade has affected rational decisions.
A foole and his money be soone at debate: which after with sorrow repents him too late.
[1573 T. Tusser Husbandry (rev. ed.) ix.]
QFT
Ok... I have looked at all the advertisments and i non of the ones i can find did i find anything about "WHEN" said access should be granted. As long as you get in to the closed beta they have made good on their part, and as far asi know... The closed beta ain't over yet i am right.
The only one who has said anything about "first access" was a person, who in all fairnes was not in a position to make sutch claims. So show me were it says "WHEN" you were going to get in to the beta apart from that poor man and his forumpost.
Fraud... It's the new buzzword like, everything is fraud these days... BroadSword i say.
I agree with the author that offering closed beta access to make a subscription to a different game seem more appealing is a shady practice at best, and I also feel that if you DO collect money for said beta, it is your obligation to ensure that all who are given access to this beta be given it before any free beta access is handed out to anyone who isn't on Cryptic's payroll. The problem, of course, is that Cryptic is not able to offer access to those most deserving (those who will, for no salary, test a buggy game and report said bugs to developers in a clear and concise manner). So be it. That was the choice you made when offering closed beta access to people willing to pay for it. The argument cannot be made that the close beta access was a "bonus," and therefore technically free, since both Cryptic and the average consumer know that if the offer were not present, the sales of these subscriptions would probably have dropped by a fair margin. I hope Cryptic does the right thing and starts voluntarily offering refunds or a sizeable discount on the retail box for STO to these subscribers who are not getting the full value of what they purchased.
And no, I am not a CO subscriber...
To that, I say: "Opinions are like a**holes -- everybody's got one."
I'm disappointed by not having received my beta invite (I bought a 6 month sub) but it's definitely not the most pressing issue in my life. I do agree, however, that Cryptic made the STO beta entry a key selling point and is ethically (though perhaps not legally) liable for not following through on what they offered.
I bought the 6 month sub and still haven't got in. Yet I do think that many posters are exaggerating the issue. However it is a bit lame of them to put PR hype (e.g. facebook contest) ahead of loyal customers. Imho if you decide not to continue with cryptic try to get a refund.
Ok... I have looked at all the advertisments and i non of the ones i can find did i find anything about "WHEN" said access should be granted. As long as you get in to the closed beta they have made good on their part, and as far asi know... The closed beta ain't over yet i am right.
The only one who has said anything about "first access" was a person, who in all fairnes was not in a position to make sutch claims. So show me were it says "WHEN" you were going to get in to the beta apart from that poor man and his forumpost.
Fraud... It's the new buzzword like, everything is fraud these days... BroadSword i say.
I'm not a lawyer, but it's my understanding that this argument wouldn't hold up at all in the American courts. I believe that all contracts, offers, etc. have to abide by a "reasonable man" test. That is, when debating certain terms of a contract, the court follows the logic of what a reasonable person would assume. In this case, it's pretty clear cut that a reasonable person would assume that paying for entry would act as a sort of VIP pass in an Amusement Park; you get to skip the lines.
As far as your claim concerning that the person who made the announcement was in no position to do so, this is simply not the case. Daeke (sp?) was an employee of Cryptic Studios. The buck stops there. To the best of m knowledge, cryptic did not *immediately* retract his statement. This is somewhat alarming. This means Cryptic was not paying attention to what their own employees were saying or actually did plan for, at that point, immediate access for Lifetime/6 Month subbers.
Many of my CO guildmates are lifers or 6-monthers and they haven't even gotten a single message from Cryptic about the closed beta. Quite a shame. It is this total lack of conversation which I find not right. I mean, there can always some issues happen, but then you can at least send all those people a mail to inform them about the ongoings.
Same with STO preorder in Europe. In most European countires it doesn't even exist! Most German retailers I phoned had not even heard of STO, and even the big Amazon of UK and Germany haven't even LISTED STO, let alone a pre-order option. There is a TWO WEEK old thread on the STO forums when there will be a European preorder and there isn't a single answer for two weeks, no even, we are working on it or something. Only when I made a relatively aggresive thread, they closed it and at least answered it will be available "soon" (tm).
Cryptic really has no idea how to handle things, it showed in the entire process of Champions, and it shows again. No matter what you think about their games, their PR handling is a catastrophe. No ads, no interviews in any of the German print mags, nada. You expect almost 2 months before release they are a bit more active in getting out the word, but no. Either they are so arrogant they think they don't need to advertise their game for Europeans or they are actually just to dumb to realize. Whoever is in charge of PR and handling f the info at Cryptic needs to be FIRED!
Was there ever any question that something would go sideways with this offer?
Cryptic has never i my experience followed through on a promise without much back peddling and changing the rules midgame.
I love Star Trek but cannot in good confidance give Cryptic anymore of my money.
And yet another thread. Though you try to sound balanced most of the naysayers will take this as yet an opportunity to spill their guts. A decent amount of the replies will be full of lies and slander. You could and should have anticipated that.
When does MMORPG stop making Cryptic black on one and the same issue?
The closed beta hasn't ended yet. They didn't say how long people would be in before open beta. The original deal said nothing about immediate entry. And though I haven't read Daeke's message and don't know the timing, I do believe that at least most people didn't preorder based on that promise.
Anyone thinking that a company would mostly only fill their closed beta with a single source of people should think again.
Others complain about not enough media attention, yet these prices are exactly to keep attention on the game. I'm sure pre order deals will available timely world wide (and I wouldn't buy from most of the big shops anyway).
I would suggest a "reasonable man": seeing an offer 'if you buy this game, you will be able to participate in the closed beta test ' of STO" would reasonably expect if he accepted that offer, he would be able to participate in the closed beta. His acceptance of that offer forms a "contract" and if the company fails to admit him to the promised "closed beta" they are in violation of that contract. The only problem is the award of damages. Most likely he would only be able to recover the subscription fee. The companies real problem is if an ambitious prosecutor decided to indite them for fraud. While I haven seen the offer, the report suggests fraud was committed and the company would be convicted if brought to trial.
"Caveat emptor" Buyer beware, should be everyone's watchword.
Ah.. yes i can not argue with you on that point... My knowledge of the american legal system is rather fuzzy too.
But to my first point, and i am in no way saying that cryptic was particularly proffesional in the way they handeld them self but if they get all pre-orders in before the 11 of december i would still considering it being them fullfilling their part of the deal as a month of beta testing is still quite alot. And it seems your court acts abit different from ours, Here they look alot closer to what was writen in the advert and in this case would most likley rule that no were in the contract did it specify when said acess and that people should stop asuming things.
As to my second point, and here i can only draw upon my own time as a CSR but is it is not Bob from marketing saying so in black and white someone has most likley overstepped their boundaries. But to be honest the main thing that rubbed me the wrong way the fraud bit, as i said drawing on my personall experience there is not all that unlikley that poor Bob in marketing, by the time he got wind of the forum post in particular nearly choked on his BLT sub and Coffey... sommunication between different departments are not always that effectiv.
Still it is one hell of a do-do to make but i have a hard time seeing how it was done with malicious intent or even worse trying to prove that as an outsider.
The Perils of Paulene, err Mmarketing
I'm not emotionally or financially involved in this decision, so this is my detached view on the situation.
Cryptic should have sent out the invites to the CO subscribers that were due invites, first and foremost. They then could have given out invites through contests etc. for the PR gains. It's a bad business practice to burn your investors.
I suspect that they have closed-door reasoning behind their decision not to send out the invites. Perhaps time will tell.
For people who aren't yet in closed beta, be grateful. Early phases of closed beta in games are rife with bugs and horrid-to-the-point-of-being-almost-unplayable performance. Do you really think STO would be any different? If so, could I interest you in this cute little tribble? He's perfectly harmless. I promise.
FYI Gene Roddenbery and Star Trek stole the "Tribbles" from the Robert A Heinlein novel "The Rolling Stones" part of his 'juvenile' series of books. In "The Rolling Stones" a family named "Stone" bought a used Space Ship and traveled around the Solar System. While on Mars they acquired an animal, described just like a "Tribble". On their way to the Asteroid Belt to sell supplies to miners their 'Tribble" multiplied like Rabbits, soon they were being eatin out of their Space Ship. They sold their Tribbles, which made a soothing sound when held, to the miners and got out of Dodge before they Asteroid belt was overrun by the creatures.
Cryptic being Cryptic on what they say, nothing new there.
Developers need to stop insulting the intelligence of gamers with all this hype-monetizing shady stuff, before they get literally destroyed in court. 10 weeks of closed beta, if subscribers only get to play two weeks... I wouldn't be very happy.
2 things ppl:
1. Who in their right mind pays to test someone else's software??? Are we gamers that desperate/gullible or just plain stoopid? *boggle*
2. Has anyone asked themselves WHY Cryptic didn't want to unleash as many beta account as they possibly could to curry favour with the media...? Hey, perhaps the game is a turd & they didn't want it to leak out, or they've badly underestimated their capacity planning. OMG, like that's never happened to a mmo before! <rolls eyes> Or perhaps they just wanted to stay in control of their own SDLC & rollout. Who would've thought!
I like Cryptic & their business model. I'm a huge fan of their CoX franchise which I've played for many years. But this kind of thing just takes the cake. You know all you so-called ST fans out there, you're all on the same side ffs...? They're making a game YOU want to play, they want it to be a commercial success, you want it to be a good game. How does any of this childish BS help? Wake TF up. You paid for a lifetime membership so if you now don't like the game _sight unseen_ because someone else got to play with the toys first (under a NDA mind you!), you're just in it for the whining. Get another hobby & get a life! ;-p
"There is a sucker born every minute." P.T. Barnum The American public has been exceeding that norm. You will never go broke by overestimating the gullibility of the American people.
"In months, or a year, the drama that's chased both Champions Online's launch and Star Trek Online's beta may pass as the proverbial water under the bridge; forgiveness may be widespread and trust rebuilt."
I doubt that. Look at SOE and the Star Wars, and Vanguard, and just about anything else they touch. Once an MMO company starts to get a reputation for screwing up, and/or screwing players or potential players, it is very hard to ever be forgiven. Champions left a bad taste in a LOT of people's mouths, and the direction Cryptic has decided to take this IP (Everyone is a Captain, so away missions with real people require the never would happen in Star Trek 5 Captain away team), and now this, is going to cause bad blood. I know I am passing on STO in favor of SW:TOR. At least there it looks like they are listening to the potential players/fans of the IP.
In this day and age? Yes. I expect it to be different. I was in the Alpha test for LOTRO and it was nearly ship-able then -- closed beta was highly polished. So yeah, I expect MMOs in the Beta testing phase to be nearly ready. Gone are the days when the Beta test was for, well, testing. Beta's ARE marketing -- pure and simple. If Cryptic hasn't realized this, that's a problem. It could be why they're not letting in the Lifers from CO, who almost certainly fill that marketing role. If the game isn't ready for the marketing phase, then they would keep a minimal amount of testers in order to control the information flow.
Ok... I have looked at all the advertisments and i non of the ones i can find did i find anything about "WHEN" said access should be granted. As long as you get in to the closed beta they have made good on their part, and as far asi know... The closed beta ain't over yet i am right.
The only one who has said anything about "first access" was a person, who in all fairnes was not in a position to make sutch claims. So show me were it says "WHEN" you were going to get in to the beta apart from that poor man and his forumpost.
Fraud... It's the new buzzword like, everything is fraud these days... BroadSword i say.
Sure 5 minutes before open Beta they could give those people access to Closed Beta and be with in legal bounds but it doesn't make it right.
I know if it was me in that situation I would demand a refund at the very least or boycott the their products if hey did not compensate me satisfactorily.
Well I am very wary of cryptic. The entire you got to buy your way into beta turned me on them. I don't buy my way into anything. If I like your product I will buy a 6 month or lifetime if offered.
I have to say that nomater what they do STO is kind of tainted, they have already set a bood mood for COX players, current cryptic players and those of us not yet associated with them.
There is very little room for forgivness in the MMO industry now days, you screw your player base and they will leave. This is what happened with STO and COX.
For now I will sit on the sidelines and watch this beta event, I call it a a publicity show as that is what it really is. There is no beta just a bunch of hype trying to sell the game, and I say shame on cyrtip for trying to pull the wool over our eyes.
Oh I am just wondering is there really a beta, does anybody know anybody who is attempting to play this beta, welll publicity stunt.
I'm thankful for the conversation this has started, I've learned alot. Unfortunately one of those things is how disgusted foreigners seem to be with America. Don't worry, you'll be working for India or China soon enough, we can't farm our jobs or national pride out fast enough to them.
I'd be alright if I could get in to test by mid-December, 4 weeks before open beta. Otherwise I'll ask for a full refund as others have. Someone stated on the STO forums that they've commented on mid-December for us.
what turned me off them was the bloody fact that they required you to pay for your 6month or Lifetime subs before even having a chance to play the game, and for those in beta who might of paid for those lifetime subs, they released a launch-day patch that literally shifted the balance of the whole game, untested and unknown to all.
I'm not going to bother with their contests, the whole "sakura park" fiasco is done to death. Cryptic is unoriginal and dull in their ideas, no surprise to me there.
People will still preorder the collector's edition of games even without some fancy beta access. Most of these developers today are probably making more money before the game even launches than 6 months worth of retained subscriptions. In my opinion things are only going to get worse.
Sorry guys. I'm a 6 month sub to CO and got my good news about STO last week. So...they didn't really lie in my case. I mean, they never said we'd all be in at once?
Some people like the former perpetual employee in the article got their facts completly wrong and they keep spouting lies.
It would be nice if the article was updated to include this information. Daeke's statement was after the offer was no longer available, so unless people went back in time they didn't buy the Deal knowing for certain they would get in first. They only assumed they would, which is their fault.
The post on the CO forums by Daeke that started this whole controversy was on sept 13 which is 13 days AFTER the offer was no longer available, the response from Rekhan is on 16th. If you have a post that is before sept 1st find it or someone quoting it pody iy. There was lots of talk on the STO forum about the Lifetime offer, if Daeke said something before the CO boards were wiped someone would have quoted it over at the STO forum.
As an example the infamous quote got over to the STO forum only two days later and there was a massive thread on it. If there was an earlier post by Daeke before sept 1st the same thing would have happened but there isn't any evidence of somoene quoting a Pre sept 1st Daeke statement on the STO forums. So if you can find it, please feel free to post it as your proof.
The thread on STO forums about Daeke's statement
forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php
Links to Daeke's statements
forums.champions-online.com/showpost.php
forums.champions-online.com/showpost.php
Rekhan's Response
forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php
Like I said earlier, Train wreck.
And I never thought much of COX either.
And Cryptic didn't save STO from Perpetual btw, they saw a money making opportunity and seized it. They figured they would pull a Turbine and use a mediocre game like AC2 to fuel the creation of Lotro. So here we have Cryptic trying to use CO to fuel STO but it is backfiring in their face because CO is worse than AC2 ever was to start with. Not to mention it is terrible that they are using one IP subs just to pay for access for a beta to another IP?? sad
The person that wrote this sucks and didn't do there research on the topic and just want to added to something that isn't there.
She should get banned from posting stuff on here and from what I see most people don't like what she writes anyways and it is total BS what she wrote.
Hell she isn't about of STO forums and CO forums she don't even know what is gonna on and what is said, there alot of mis-info she put.
There is no misinformation, I am active in the STO forums and it is a very controversial subject.
I even posted my thoughts on that move, I found it personally quite unethical, but you know it seems like Ferengi have taken over Cryptic's Marketing Department.
In any case, I also predict that the microstransactions store they are planning for the game will also be a sore issue, and a potential scandal if they ever put anything more than cosmetic and vanity items in it that have real functions in the game.
All in all, they mustev known that many people would buy these subs to CO just to get access to STO beta, on the other hand they can't guarantee them access over other players because, well, it would be like selling tickets for a beta, those who pay get it those who do not do not get it, not to count the fact that they are asking people to play to test and improve their product.
it is like asking you to pay for comming and selling my product...just doe snot work like that now does it?
So everyone has to have equal opportunity to access the beta, whether you payed for it or not. Of course all this mess and debate would have been avoided if Cryptic had not make the mistake of promoting STO's beta through the sub of another game, so they made a mistake there, I just hope that they do not make others.
I am preparing my guild for the February launch, I hope this will not prove to be yet another MMORPG dissapointment, we had enough these past years.
I just saw the PAX footage......what a dissapointment. it looked like god mode in space.....Where is the tactics.....oh wait what game engine is this?????the same one as CoX and CO?
Star Trek will be worse than Eve online day 1.
And don't think I aint a trekkie, I own all the boxed sets, All previous games and played Starfleet command for many years. I had a bad feeling about Cryptic getting the licence when they announced it will be developed on the same engine as CoH. Modified or not it won't work well for Trek, mark my words.
And any company that offers First beta access to lifetime and 6mo subscribers to a future beta then dosen't follow up on it......you can bet your ass dollars to doughnuts they are so strapped for cash they can't afford either the servers or the Publicity.
If not enough money for servers then the game is probably being rushed out to pay bills and will be in sorry shape upon release.
If they don't want the Publicity then someone should probably be fired for mismanaging the project to such an extent that they know the game will be only meh.
I am very active on the STO forums and if you read this topic on the sto forums and on here.
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=36899 and seen what people wrote about on here.
And the people that are upset just go to a mirror and laugh at themselfs for there own stupidity.
Cause the deal never said when they will be getting in closed beta or it said that they will be getting in and for them beliving a statement that has " I think " in it.
Which is here http://forums.champions-online.com/showpost.php?p=1050885&postcount=9
And the only thing that is true that was said is the contest winners are going to be the first ones in and he wasn't to sure if the people that bought the 6 month or lifetime subs would be joing them, that is why he said I think.
If someone said " I think " Do you think it is 100% true or he think it is but isn't sure about what he said is to true or not?
Wow, that can barely be considered English, and you live in the US...
And you know some people do have legit reason for having bad grammar and bad spelling.
So please grow up.
I'm sure your reason for having bad grammar is far better than the one you have for why you get so defensive when people point out that you'd be better understood if you worked on your spelling and sentence structure in a forum discussion. Whatever reasons you might have for your grammatical deficiencies, they don't mean much in an English-speaking forum where you're trying(?) to carry on an intelligent conversation with others. Before questioning my maturity, you might try demonstrating a bit of your own.
Well you post did nothing to add to the conversation that was going on in this thread, but was a attack on someone for there grammar and there you assuming that my grammar problems could be because you think that I speak a different language.
As far as my maturity goes its a whole lot better than yours; if yours was like mine you wouldn't have posted anything about someone grammar cause they could have a million different reason why from a mental disabilities like me to not knowing English very well.
"The person that wrote this sucks and didn't do there research on the topic and just want to added to something that isn't there."
Ok, so you want to start attacking me personally because you have such eloquent and mature points to express, correct? Let's just dissect your first post and leave it at that. In your first "sentence" you attack the author of the article personally by saying she "sucks." An emotional outburst like this has no place in a valid, reasonable argument. It invalidates whatever else comes after it, and it was most kind of you to let us know your state of mind before we even bother reading further.
"She should get banned from posting stuff on here and from what I see most people don't like what she writes anyways and it is total BS what she wrote."
More personal attacks with absolutely nothing to substantiate them... blah blah blah...
"Hell she isn't about of STO forums and CO forums she don't even know what is gonna on and what is said, there alot of mis-info she put."
Again, vague random nonsense that contributes nothing to the discussion at hand. My initial response to your postings was kind, because I only mentioned your limited command of the English language, at least as it is expressed in a written form. It was certainly not phrased as an attack, but rather as an observation, which was accurate regardless of your situation, mental, cultural, or otherwise. If you want to speak of people who deserved to be banned from forums, you might take a moment to see if you yourself live in a glass house before you go tossing stones, bricks, or other weighty items of your choosing about. You are contributing far less to our discussion than the author, in my estimation.
Well I would bet there not going to ban one of their writers, lol asking them to do that is funny at best. One thing is true about the entire situation. There is a huge controversy about this. The other writers have writtin articles too about the same subject.
Not only this forums board but other forums boards all over the internet are poking fun at cryptic over this entire situation. Like it or not its a huge problem for them.
Your entire post pretty much confirmed this statement for me, didn't need to question your grammar.
You might disagree with the writer, but no need to attack her like a pit bull. Probably should consider never using the word "sucks" when discussing the quality of someone's work.
A better approach is to clearly make your point (which you tried to do but it got lost in the anger and fanaticism) and let the facts speak for themselves.
Say it with me.... "these are just games" See, no need for anger just because someone doesn't care for STO or perhaps has something wrong about the game. Just correct them and move forward.
Your faith in Cryptic is something we've all seen a dozen times before, you'll love them now and come to despise them later and will never be heard of again.
No matter how you or they try to spin it now, there was an expectation by people who bought long term subs for CO that they would get preferred treatment in the STO beta selection.
Honestly I think this article was rather overblown. They make it out like it's some big controversy over the entire state of the game, when really it's just about people mad they didn't get into beta yet and a misunderstanding with the developers on that same topic.
Personally, I believe this is rather irresponsible journalism. The writer seems to be trying to inflate the issue and make it out to be a game-breaking problem, when it's really not. For shame. Can we please get some editors to check the articles from now on for stuff like this? It makes the site a laughing stock when it comes to integrity. I would expect to see the flavour of this article more in a troll post on a forum than touted as a legitimate news item.
Once again we have poof the longer the thread, the more it degenerates into a flame war.
I fully agree that those who bought the subscriptions to CO just for the STO beta access where making a bad decision. People should buy a game based on whether they want to play it, not whether they get some free extra that goes along with the purchase.
But, on the other hand I can fully understand why these people are pissed off. Cryptic has actually held contest to give away beta keys? Really? As far as I'm concerned that's a huge slap in the face to those who already won a "contest" by buying subscriptions to Champions Online. First of all, betas are supposed to be for testing the game, I doubt the common sense of any company that uses their game's beta as a big PR move. Second, if they are able to give away beta keys as contest prizes, then they ought to have given those beta keys to people who shelled out cash for them.
It seems to me that Cryptic isn't the indie company that developed the great City of Heroes and City of Villains. They've become another soulless corporate whore out for nothing but profits. I have always felt that because video games are an art, they suffer hugely when corporations develop them with nothing in mind but profits. It's the same type of difference in quality as G.I. Joe and Casablanca. One film can be considered a work of art unto itself, the other is a mindless, heartless cash grab.
I (don't) look forward to Cryptic's mindless cash grab video games in the future. STO included.
As I said in my other post; a game company would be crazy to have only one source of testers for their closed beta. So they add other people by running contests, which also does keep some attention on the game. I guess they also grab from the pool of people that signed up for the closed beta. That way they probably get roughly 50% of CO-preorder customers.
I see nothing wrong with that. So, the remaining rant in your post is moot.
I do feel you could have called this article
'Space, The Final Affront Here?'
Crypitc is owned by Atari, one of the worst gaming companies..
I dont understand why people are surprised. And I dont understand why there is people who are excited about STO.
The super hero genre was supposed to be what Cryptic do best, yet Champions was an awfull game and now proably have less playyers than CoX even thou it released just a couple of months ago.
I bought the lifetime sub to Champions because I loved the pencil and paper version since it first came out and because I did enjoy City of Heroes for a long time (until I hit the xp grind wall, which in all fairness almost all MMO's of that era suffered from.)
The closed beta access to STO that came with the lifetime sub to Champions while a nice perk, was not the reason I bought the sub. I did get reassurance by several members of the Cryptic staff that I spoke to at a convention that I was on the 'short list.'
Still, to the contrary I do not recall getting a guarantee of closed beta access.
I'm not sure vilifying the company when you desire a positive result may be the best course to follow. Then again squeaky wheel and all that.
I'll hope to do my best to judge STO as a game on it's individual merits (I'm a longtime Trekkie too), and if I like I'll keep it. If not I won't. It is simple as that.
If I had to guess they never said "guranteed beta access", since the legal reading of that is 100% access to the beta (much like if it said "guranteed internet access" in your isp contract - which it probably doesn't). Saying that no idea if that stands true for the US legal system.
I personally purchased my lifetime sentance to CO because I thought CO would have long term appeal. Doh! :P
Not having access to the STO beta is annoying (and Cryptic sure have broken the spirit of the arrangement, and if anyone actually bothers to sue them i'd bet they lose it legally too). But I have far bigger things to cry in my milk about. If the game is excellent, then i'll forgive them as the fickle customer I am, when it sucks though... I guess i'll just go on waiting for ToR.
The Star Trek licence is too large to stay at a bad MMO for long (alas bad = not making enough money). Which means we may in another 4-5 years see a proper attempt.
Can anyone supply the text of the offer? That should clear up the question if they offered a contract or not.
hehe That's great!
I never realized all this was going on tbh. Im shocked at yet another developer making crap up. I for one will not buy this game now after reading this.
Can't jump the gun though, closed BETA is still on and so all those who went in with the lifetime subscriptions and buy in promise has not yet been forfeited so, maybe a little patience is in order. I know its hard to have patience in this McDonalds/Walmart culture we are in, but we aren't even into December yet and the hew and cry is reaching ridiculous levels. And WHEN the closed BETA period ends and IF I do not get in, THEN I will complain and write the powers that be, until then, I am not going to go crazy or add to the hyperbole already being thrown around... civility should be the order of the day...
So Mote It Be
Can anyone supply the text of the offer? That should clear up the question if they offered a contract or not.
Limited Champions Subscription Deals!
August 5, 2009
We at Cryptic Studios and Atari are excited to announce our Champions Online six-month and lifetime subscription plans. Players who sign up for our long-term subscriptions will receive special perks, including eight additional character slots, special costume sets and guaranteed access to the Star Trek Online closed beta!
"Beyond the deep discount on the subscription rates, we wanted to come up with added incentives and exclusives that, as gamers, we could get excited about," said Jack Emmert, Cryptic Studios' Chief Operating Officer. "With an early commitment to Champions Online, granting guaranteed early access to our next big game, Star Trek Online, seemed like a great way to engage Cryptic’s biggest fans in other projects at the studio.”
Here are the great features our loyal customers will receive.
Discounted Lifetime Subscription
Guaranteed Star Trek Online Closed Beta Access
Eight Additional Character Slots
Foxbat Vanity Pet
Art Deco Costume Set
Retro Future Costume Set
STO Mirror Universe Costume Set
Discounted Six-month Subscription
Guaranteed Star Trek Online closed beta access
Retro Future Costume Set
Don’t miss out on these great deals! You can purchase your subscriptions now!
Discounted Lifetime Subscription
$199.99 USD
$219.99 CAN
£119.99 GBP
€147.99 EUR
Discounted Six-month Subscription
$59.99 USD
$65.99 CAN
£35.99 GBP
€44.99 EUR
A lot more. First, there's the "Starship Interior" controversy. Cryptic basically said that there would be no starship interiors for the ships at launch. They would essentially be space-going mounts. This was not seen as a good move for a game based on a TV show that takes place 90% of the time inside a starship or space station of some sort. Cryptic eventually (sort of) capitulated a few weeks ago when they announced that starship bridges would be in the game at launch.
Then there is the "No Player Crews" debacle. Many people, used to watching the movies and TV show in which this game is based, think it's stupid that every player will be a captain and have NPC crews. Your favourite character is Dr. Crusher and you want to be a medical officer in game? Screw that! Cryptic says you can't be like your favourite character. You grok Spock? Too bad! Science officers are only NPCs in Cryptic's narrow little universe.
The third is the "Combat, Combat, Combat" gaffe. The vast majority of the information Cryptic has released about this game is combat oriented. It looks like this game will be nothing more than a space/ground hybrid shoot-'em-up based on the videos and other information Cryptic has put out. Remember those episodes of that television show called "Star Trek" (TNG, DS9, Voyager, etc) where no phasers are fired at all and no fighting ever takes place? You know, those classics like "The Inner Light," "The City on the Edge of Forever," and "Duet?" Forget them. They don't exist in Cryptic's world. People often say "this isn't supposed to be a Star Trek Simulator!!" Well, then change the name to "Star Trek Combat Simulator Online" and let's have a little truth in advertising.
Next is the "Starship Holy Trinity" rigamarole. It seems that Cryptic is going to import wholesale the "Healer/Damage Dealer/Tanker" mechanic used in most fantasy MMOs and apply it to space combat. Many people agree that this mechanic is stupid and limiting in the first place, but it also does not follow the rules of reality or Star Trek (which this game is supposedly based on) at all.
There may be more controversies that I've forgotten or I'm not aware of, but those are a bunch that have come up since this game was announced.
This looks like an implied contract to me. They guaranteed access to closed beta. while they did not say when, the implication is buyers would get access at the start of beta. Class Action Suit anybody?
The correct line is "The lady doth protest too much, methinks." It is spoken by Queen Gertrude in Act III, Scene II of Hamlet. The famous "play within a play."
Thanks dude, you've just made up my mind about this game. Will no one *ever* do a faithful, respectful homage to Roddenberry & the ST universe in pc game form...? *huge Shrek sigh*. Oh well, back to LOTRO or AoC 'tis! :)
Doubt it. They can just open up the server farm to FFA access for closed beta entrants in the last few days & let everyone crash & burn or wait in queues for long hours. That will satisfy the letter of the law I imagine.
I forgot the "Cash Shop" uproar. Cryptic is probably going to have a cash shop where people can buy in-game items that will "mostly" not affect gamplay. I imagine it'll be the same thing as Champions Online's C-Store (or whatever it's called.) People who hate the idea of cash shops in subscription based games and people who are wary of others being able to buy stuff to make the game easier are understandably upset by this choice. It seems like a pure money grab.
I've said it before and i'll say it again, would you guys please refrain for just 'quoting' previous posts as you end up with a screen full of regurgitated drivel, please try and quote only the 'topic' you are answering, y'know, just snip out the bit you are talking about, give us a break.
2 pages of 'quotes' within 'quotes' just dilutes the whole thread.
Daymn, how many hay-bails do they want to throw at this camel? ;)
Yes, that's what the 'victims' want to make the world believe. But they know better themselves. Though I guess too many people start to believe their owns false ideas...
It truly amazes me the amount of Hucksterism and yellow journalism that takes place in the gaming media.
I fully expect next weeks article to read:
Do people hate Cryptic more than Hitler or Satan?
Or
STO: Cryptics failure before launch.
I would expect the courts would look at this scheme with a jaundiced eye. It's would be prima fasia evidence of an attempt to hide the basic fraud.
FYI Gene Roddenbery and Star Trek stole the "Tribbles" from the Robert A Heinlein novel "The Rolling Stones" part of his 'juvenile' series of books. In "The Rolling Stones" a family named "Stone" bought a used Space Ship and traveled around the Solar System. While on Mars they acquired an animal, described just like a "Tribble". On their way to the Asteroid Belt to sell supplies to miners their 'Tribble" multiplied like Rabbits, soon they were being eatin out of their Space Ship. They sold their Tribbles, which made a soothing sound when held, to the miners and got out of Dodge before they Asteroid belt was overrun by the creatures.
Bit late to the party here, but if you're going to blame someone for stealing the idea of Tribbles, you should point your angry finger at David Gerrold, the person who came up with the premise and sold it to Gene Coon, the producer of Star Trek.
I know it adds nothing to the discussion, but I really hate it when someone angrily throws about misinformation, spitting and fuming. And also, for the record, I've read that book many, many times. Good read, for young and old alike!
Bit late to the party here, but if you're going to blame someone for stealing the idea of Tribbles, you should point your angry finger at David Gerrold, the person who came up with the premise and sold it to Gene Coon, the producer of Star Trek.
I know it adds nothing to the discussion, but I really hate it when someone angrily throws about misinformation, spitting and fuming. And also, for the record, I've read that book many, many times. Good read, for young and old alike!
I don't see any anger in my post. Roddenbery was the Producer of Star Trek so he is the person responsible. Me thinks thou art trying to start a flame war, or at least making a mountain out of a molehill. Relax. Since "Tribbles" came up in the discussion I was only adding historical perceptive. Roddenbery took Heinlein's creature and build an great episode out of it. In my youth, I was in love with Podkane of Mars.
Thanks for that, there must be more difference between legal systems than I thought then, I have to say i'm astounded it was stated that explicitly. As the one and only reading of that (here) is "if there is a beta you have access to it". If you remove the word guranteed and just said "Star Trek Online Close Beta Access" - that's the "we'll let you in when we feel like it, even if it's the last 5 seconds" interpretation.
It's free money for whoever actually bothered to sue them, I guess they are relying on our apathy as much as our fandom.
Although if I had to hazard a guess there's quite a cross over between Lawyer and Star Trek fan, them be some high value poker hands they be playing for sure ;)
Cryptic should be very, very careful. A faux pas like this could easily get them cast as in a negative light like Sony. As a side note, I don't buy any of their arguments regarding the $250 access to the beta. IMO this was deceptive marketing that provided some income to keep the investors interested. I've never played a game developed by Cryptic and am going to hold off on purchasing STO until I see how they treat the players.
I think they are already at that point. This entire publicity stunt might cost them. Then again it might not. The entire were only having a small group of folks testing his at various stages speaks volumes to me of how bad it could possibly be. Thus the need to keep the control group small to prevent leaks of what is really going on with the testing.
So far its all hype, the kind of hype that keeps me away from the game until I start reading really ver good stuff about it, after having seen so many so so star trek games that were all so bad.
Another slandering article on mmorpg.com . The title is way off base to the content of the story. O noes , Cryptic has made mistakes, the game is ruined. blah blah, seriously fail at writing about mmorpg's. from what I gathered about mmorpg.com, they are here to give insightful information about up coming games, not stir the troll pot for a let bash cryptic today, day.
Just quit writing, save the database space for people who actually can write. I'm so fed up with people who think they have a right to something that isn't even in closed beta, the right to drive companies names in the dirt for a quick thrill of posting articles that do nothing positive for a community, the right to act like a high and might authority of mmorpg genre, and yet these people crawl right back in Wow and pretend they are the end all be all of mmo gaming. Fuck off, really. Sick of these weak ass articles, would rather have mmorpg podcast back, then this crap.
Paying 250 dollars for beta access is just sad to me. Much better things to spend your cash on.
I agree with this. This all seems like a lot of whining about absolutely nothing. Players have put betas on some kind of pedestal these days, like it's so important to get in to an MMO 3 months before release. But betas are typically very limited, lagged, buggy, and generally annoying to be involved in, at least until it gets close to release. It's not like people are missing out on some glorious thing, IMO.
I do think that offering beta access to STO as a perk for the CO subscription was a bad idea, but not because of this fiasco it's caused. A beta should be populated by as diverse a group as possible based on the answers given in the applications. You want different age groups, gaming experience, and computer hardware in your beta. If most of the STO testers have to come from the group of CO subscribers, they could have a lot of gamers that are too similar to each other and therefore they won't get the best information out of the beta test. Based on all of the complaints, it seems Cryptic is not just taking from the pool of CO subscribers first, but also taking testers from other sources in order to maintain a diverse group of testers which is the right thing to do.
It sucks if you spent $250 to get into a beta test, but that's your fault because no offense but that's a pretty dumb thing to spend money on. The fact is you paid for a CO subscription, and the STO beta is a freebie. They can put you into the beta 1 day before it goes to open beta, and they will be 100% making good on their end of the bargain, so give it a rest and go play with your super hero.
Wow, someone feels a lot of baseless rage and anger.
It's also just that 250 bucks is a lot of money in the first place. I would never get lifetime to any mmo because no way am I going to be playing any MMO for the rest of my days. Wont happen. There is always something new and better coming out eventually. In this economy I can't afford such a cost anyway. It is indeed silly to be able to buy your way into a beta. How the hell do they know your a good tester then? Some teen with mom and dads money could buy his way in and never report any bugs and just exploit all day long. See who actually has experience and contributes meaningfully on the forumns. Don't do it based on cash. Way to show how much you don't care. Kinda the first step towards showing all you care about is money.
The correct line is "The lady doth protest too much, methinks." It is spoken by Queen Gertrude in Act III, Scene II of Hamlet. The famous "play within a play."
Thank you. That's what I get for relying on Google, and not going directly to the source.
Buying ones way into a beta overall would more than likely produce much better testers than any other method. Only people who are really interested in the game and willing to put it through its paces and scream about all the broken things and help the devs fix them would be willing to actually pay to enter a closed beta.
On the flip side how stupid of a game company to piss off a base of players who have allready demonstrated a willingness to shell out big bucks on an unproven game. These are the people they should be pursuing in hopes of getting them to buy long subs to STO. To ignore them while giving out large numbers of otherwise random invites to people half of which probably dont really care about the game but just want to see if its worth playing as a sort of free trial is again just plain stupid.
I personally have been around long enough to know that beta offer wasnt going to honoured the way people thought it would be when champions came out and had no interest in it in any case, however, for all those who were excited about STO and are now getting hosed from their point of view...its just a bad way to build a business.
Cryptic has been one of the worse MMO companies I can remember from the beginning of MMO's (UO and EQ). Cryptic had a decent IP like Champions and rushed it into release. The beta testers were telling them it wasn't ready and they didn't listen. Then, on top of everything they rushed a fool hearty patch on release day that completely changed the way the game was. Without so much as testing it they just released it. Then, they had the fiasco with the sucking people into purchasing lifetime and 6 month subs for CO. People were guaranteed access to the Closed beta. I knew from what Cryptic did with the Champions beta that these people would not be in the closed beta very long before the open beta began. They are just repeating what they did PR wise with Champions. Now, the madness ensued with the beta invites and how Cryptic was allowing people into closed beta now that didn't buy lifetime subs. Cryptic has no real clue how to do PR.
I have childed Cryptic Daeke myself on twitter because the guy is using a Cryptic twitter account talking about playing every other game in the world, but his own. Half the time when he does release info it is wrong. I honestly have no idea how they put this guy in charge of PR for Cryptic.
Cryptic has egg on their face now 3x. The Champions release, The Halloween patch/free weekend when no one could log into the game for almost the entire weekend and servers were down, and now the last free weekend over the Thanksgiving holiday. People I know tried to download the game and patch and play, but were again not able too, because of the way Cryptic runs their company. Not enough bandwith, poor infrastructure, and terrible communication with their fans.
I have been waiting for Star Trek since the days of Perpetual. We have waited a long time for this game. When Cryptic got the license I was intrigued and wished for the best, but after seeing how they ran/run Champions I am all but worried this game will get half assed and we will all be disappointed. One of my main concerns is that fact the game is nothing but Combat from the gameplay trailers,etc. Combat is only one facet of Star Trek and it seems Cryptic is making the game their main focus which is a shame since Star Trek is not just about combat.
I'm waiting patiently to see how the game turns out. I don't have a lot of hope for it, but I hope I am wrong.
Why don't we wait until the game launches before crucifying it.
pretty sad when trolls are writing columns for mmorpg.com. Shoot you might as well give me a column to sactify this entire website. The column would be called "When bad writers, get worse"
Sad when Cryptic's fanboys come here defending that company when the obvious is so easy to see.
More than 50% according to cryptic people they will not give the exact number beyond that.
Something that has been mentioned before is the reasonable person test. How would a reasonable person judge the offer of Closed beta access. Well to make that judgment the first thing a reasonable person would need to do is know what the closed beta process is.
In general the closed beta process is an external testing process where in a limited number of total users are invited in groups over time slowly building server population and testing for bugs balance and sever capacity using the widest possible player base the company can get.
Thus a judge using the reasonable person test knowing what a closed beta involves would likely either laugh you out of the court room or depending on the humor of said judge have a not so pleasant response.
In short you paid for a process with a limited number of users allowed in at a time and said invites sent out over time not all at once which is exactly what you are getting.
But then again you did not. What was bought was a champions online 6 month or life time sub. Lets see people have those check. Included in the offer was where some champions online in game bonus items people have those so another check. Also included in the life time sub where special costumes for STO after launch the game has not launched yet so waiting on a check. And of course the big subject of the day a promise that one of those ultimately limited closed beta slots would be yours for many that is already a check or others its still a check in waiting but you know the closed beta is still going on the only date attached to the offer was sometime this year and last I checked this year is not over yet.
If they made any mistakes it was in marketing to a group of gamers and assuming they might actually know a thing or 2 about games ops. The lesson here is obvious always use the 2 yearold test. Which is anything you offer or explain should always be worded in a manner even a 2 yearold can understand that way you generally avoid any break downs in communication.
All you ppl crying foul is so pathetic and anyone trying to predict the success or failure of a game before launch is a fool.
Here's the thing I find funny: how many people does this impact on? Could all the players with lifetime subs to ChampO or a six-month account please raise their hands?
Because if you didn't buy one of those, it isn't an issue that impacts on you. If you did buy one of those accounts, closed beta is still going so there is still the opportunity for you to get in and meet the contractual agreement.
If Cryptic finishes closed beta without letting in the people who have a legitimate claim to access, then sure, the forums can blow up. Otherwise it really is a storm in a teacup (and a poorly written article - I was looking for at least more than one controversy for something to be 'rife'... even the short testing period is probably more controversial than a limited number of players not getting into closed beta).
Is Ms Skelton one of those holding a ChampO life / 6-month pass, waiting for her closed beta invite?
Didn't read the whole article...
Reading about Cryptic's mess up once is fine, reading about it twice on the same site is just wasting my time and everyone else's.
Is it me or have the columns become somewhat boring and repetative recently?
If you bought the Lifetime package for Champions Online because you wanted to get into STO beta, you deserve to get taken for a ride. Buy a game because you want to play THAT game not in the chance to pre play another game.
I swear these are the same people who prolly get scammed by every fly by the night pyramid scheme.
I am one of those who got influenced by the beta offer when I bought the 6 month sub for CO.
Fortunately for me, CO was such a bad experience that I don't really worry about not getting into the STO beta now. :)
Cryptic is lead by people who have almost no understanding of what makes a game tick, it became very clear after they left CoX and had NCsoft hire a new dev team to take over that game, they turned it around and made it a lot better than it were while Cryptic handled it.
So I have no expectations that STO will be worth anything.
When did mmorpg.com become the TMZ of gaming?
I got a lifetime on CO and I'm not in the STO beta yet. Am I worrying about it? No, from what I hear, The servers are up only a few hours a week anyways. Cryptic have also said that all COX life and 6 months invites will be sent out by the end of December so we'll all get in.
Just to clarify some things: I am not one of the people affected, nor was I asked by anyone affected to do the column. I haven't subscribed to a Cryptic MMO since City of Villains was released. If something has affected me directly, I'm usually pretty blunt about stating so. You may not think so, but I do believe in journalistic integrity.
One of the goals of the column, as I stated when it first began, is to act as a voice for community issues and reactions to MMO gaming affairs. I quote myself:
There will be times it reads a little like an advice column for newer MMO players who are finding themselves indoctrinated into the community. Other times it will be thoughts on recent events or player interactions. Sometimes it will be "voice of the community trying to reach the ear of the big guys." Ultimately, it will adapt around the community and what they are saying (or want to say.)
From my experience as a reader, a column is not news. While it should hold itself to fact-checking (and I did check my facts, thank you - read below for one point on that), it is ultimately a place of author's opinion. In my case, it also includes presenting the opinion of other people. A column is a place where the author presents issues, and yes, pushes buttons. Ultimately, my goal is to present an issue and get people thinking and talking about it. Whether you agree with me or not doesn't personally matter.
In regards to the "given supposedly after the offer was expired" complaint: I chose this wording carefully. I originally chose to write "admittedly after the offer was expired." Why did I change the wording? Two reasons:
Ultimately, with no proof to back up either a "definitely after" or a "definitely during" statement, I opted to go with the same wishy-washy language that was being used in discussion elsewhere. A good choice on my part? Probably not, and I should have expounded on both of those points above rather than shortening the phrase.
If I got any other facts wrong, I'm welcome to correcting them, as always, if given proof that I was wrong. You can ask any of my numerous press contacts with the various MMO companies, and know that I always ask for corrections if necessary and make them immediately after I'm aware there's a problem. I'm no more human than the rest of you, but I do recognize that I am held to certain standards and am more than happy to meet them.
Wow , talking about not getting your facts right. Cryptic developed COH jointly with NCsoft and after the 1st year or so. NCsoft decided to purchase the full rights to the game and hired on most of the development team from Cryptic. So basically the people that made it better was the same people that developed it in the first place.
Can anyone supply the text of the offer? That should clear up the question if they offered a contract or not.
http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x202/NekoLLX/lolpok.jpg
and the infamous ninja Edit
http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x202/NekoLLX/before1.jpg
http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x202/NekoLLX/after1.jpg
Fair enough. I still don't know why you focused on ONE issue though, when there have been a great many controversies surrounding STO. It sounded as though you were going to touch on them, but then expounded on the beta access -- which to my mind isn't THAT important in the grand scheme of things especially when it was clear that no time line for beta entry was specifically given.
BWAhahahahahahahahahah!
Oh....good one.
I thought it was a good article. Personally I think the entire controversey is trivial. I have my doubts with the game just entering closed beta that this game will release in February. What is the big deal about getting in beta early? My guess is the game is still quite buggy.
I think the criticism of the writer is absurd. Seems that some of you just want to troll instead of read the article.
Wow , talking about not getting your facts right. Cryptic developed COH jointly with NCsoft and after the 1st year or so. NCsoft decided to purchase the full rights to the game and hired on most of the development team from Cryptic. So basically the people that made it better was the same people that developed it in the first place.
Notice I said "is lead", its the leadership there is the problem, not the working men. Once they were gone the real people were free to put in the improvements everyone knew was needed.
I bought the lifetime for CO because I enjoy CO. They have since the launch day of CO been slowly niggling away at my loyalness. The day 1 patch was a major upset. There's not even true global chat channels..the only way to get a global like chat channel is create one or join a guild where you can speak to everyone no matter what instance they're in. Insane high ingame costs for retcons and the constant refusals to even consider that their prices are not actually feasable within a reasonable amount of game play time is another niggling upset. The overwhelming unbalance when it comes to the very very very very few group dungeons is another upset.
But I've held on because I am having some fun, but as time has moved on there's not been much to really build the community until Halloween around the sametime that the Beta Started. Even then the moment halloween went away the community went back to being pretty much non existant in game.
Being a reasonable person I figured alright most beta's are atleast 6 months to a year long. To be fair and have a wide audience of testers most likely I wont' be on the first wave, fine I wasn't on the first wave. I enjoyed the halloween event and the new pvp map (the only pvp map that is actually fair to all builds pvp or pve). Time has strolled along and I've patiently been playing champions a couple of days a week (so not to burn through the very short amount of content). Then the worst thing happens.
They announce open beta dates. WTH is this? Open Beta dates? Barely 3 months after Closed Beta started? Basically this sings that even closed beta is a pure promotional showing. THere's no way in 3 months with the servers only being up for a few hours a week that closed beta is in any way shape or form making a true impact. Contest winners continue to be brought into the game. I figure alright one good wave by late November and the rest of us will be in and they'll just bring in the contest winners. Hell no..by some mere lucky post I ran into I see that they're going to continue keeping thos of us with 'gaurenteed' access waiting until nearly the end of december. At most I might get a week's worth of time in closed beta if the servers stay down. Sure I'll get rolled into Open but what the hell does that matter? The deal with my patronage to CO was Closed Beta. I could careless about Promotional Open Beta.
Cryptic by being very very uncommunicative about the issue and trying to even calm the stemming wave of anger, the outpouring loss of subscribers is just heading down a bad path. I can't overlook this failure on their part to be a Better Business.
Their business move is 100% shady in my book. If I'm not in closed beta by Christmas Day I will be asking for all my money back except for the months that I did play (its only fair they get paid for the couple olf months I have used their service). I won't buy STO no matter how good it is and I won't resub to CO. That is my current plan at this moment. I wish to be a reasonable customer with reasonable expectations. Just because its honoring the deal if they give me even 1 hour of closed beta access does not make it right..infact that makes it a pretty big helping of Bad Business pratices and that they dont' give a damn about payign customers or future paying customers. As much as I hate to say it Cryptic might as well rename themselves Funcom and sail under the Failcom flag.
Thanks for the long winded sdescription of trolling. Maybe read this website EULA.