Richard Aihoshi's Free Zone: F2P and the MSOG Play Style
This week in the Free Zone, Richard Aihoshi looks at single and small group play styles in free to Play MMOs.
Many serious MMOG fans think of the genre as being defined by guilds, raids and other elements that involve bunches of players doing things together. It's true there's no feeling in gaming that truly compares to multiple groups working as one to take down a boss, or to battles with dozens or even hundreds of combatants on each side. However, that's not necessarily the way most users actually play.
A lot of people either prefer the play style sometimes known as massively single-player, or spend more time within it than they might think. I doubt that there's anything approaching a universally accepted definition of this term, so for the purposed of this column, I'll use mine, even though it's something of a misnomer. When I refer to MSOG play, I'm not just talking about soloing, but also small group play similar to what you'd experience in the online mode of a standalone game.
Personally, I play a lot this way. One key reason is that unlike most people, I don't look for one game - or even a few - with the intention of playing it regularly for months or years. That's just not a very good fit for me since I want to be as familiar as any individual can be with the entire breadth of the MMOG category. With the huge number of titles out there now, it's impossible to keep up with them all, but it would be even worse if I were to concentrate a large proportion of my playing time on a small number of titles.
So, I don't. Instead, I tend to dabble. I try out a lot of MMOGs, but only for long enough to form some initial impressions. As a result, it's pretty uncommon for me to reach 100 or even 50 hours. In most cases, I don't even make it to 20. There have even been a couple where I quit after less than five.
This approach isn't perfect; one obvious fault is that I never experience end game content except when someone provides a suitably high-level character. While I usually accept when they're offered, this doesn't happen very often, and I don't request them because the main reason to do so would be for a review or impressions piece, neither of which I write very often.
One thing I've gained, though, is a greater appreciation for the MSOG play style and how it can fit very nicely with F2P games for a lot of people. Basically, if I'm not prepared to commit at least 10 to 15 hours per week, week after week, it's not likely that I'll form strong relationships with anyone from playing with them repeatedly, not even if I join a guild.
So I mainly solo, and sometimes join pick-up groups. As it happens, games tend to be most solo-friendly during the early stages, plus they're designed so level-ups and other rewards are provided more rapidly than later on. When I start to feel like I'm grinding or not being reinforced as often, it's easy to stop and move on to another title since I haven't established any strong connections to hold me.
It's pretty easy to see that the F2P category has considerable appeal for me or anyone else who isn't going to put hardcore or even average hours into a single game. What we may not realize, however, is that there are millions of players like this. Sure, some start out like this and get hooked, but a lot continue to play in what's often called a casual manner.
Another consideration is that not getting to the end or even the mid-game means it's far less likely people will feel they have to spend money to compete. If I know I don't play enough to keep up with people, and don't have friends I want to keep up with anyway, what do I care if some others buy better weapons, bonus EXP items and other things that speed up their advancement?
What this means, in effect, is that one of the major mantras of the vocal anti-F2P minority is relatively or completely unimportant in the MSOG play style. If people choose not to spend anything, it really doesn't have much of a negative impact on them. And if they do, it's likely to be in small amounts like they'd pay with nary a second thought for a snack or cup of coffee.
As I said at the beginning of this column, there's nothing like certain forms of play that are only available in the "true" or "pure" MMOG play style. But there's clearly a place for MSOG as well, perhaps a rather substantial one. I don't have any data, but I do wonder how much of a role the latter is playing in the explosive growth of the F2P category.
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He is the former Editor of RPG Vault and his column, focusing on free to play MMOs, appears on MMORPG.com every Monday.
Nice read, my main issue with F2Ps generally is that they don't seem as complete as a P2P game but I am fast becoming a more casual duck in and out gamer, that does not want to raid, as the commitments to that are too strong and would take too much away from family. Even though I have been caught up in it and possibly will be again just waiting for the kids to leave the family home :)
Good points. Due to a lack of time, patience over the last few years, I've ended up solo 95% plus of the time. Thus games that require grouping for the high end content don't appeal to me. But that tends to leave the really shallow grinders as the alternative. Which gets way beyond boring after awhile. I like WoW as one can solo from 1-80 if one wishes to, but then one will never manage to get much more than blue level gear(I'm not any good at PvP). The few epics my main has are from crafting or the rare guild raid or PUG. But thats just the way of such things<shrug>.
The interesting conundrum, which Mr. Aihoshi doesnt really describe in detail but just hints at, is the fact that the type of gameplay that leads people to the F2P titles, the above-mentioned MSOGs, makes them not quite wanted customers there, whereas they would be LOVED by Pay-to-Play Titles, because they pay, dont use up much of anything, are never unhappy about content and probably dont cause any ruckus ingame either.
The problem is, the F2P genre cannot live on these people, they live (more even thant the Pay-to-Play genre) off the long-termers, the people who see investing money into their characters as a reasonable thing, which probably means they want to stay for a while. Conversely, the Pay-to-Play genre, in the ever-ongoing quest to minimize cost but maximize profits, would rather not have to provide quality long term entertainment, but would be happy to have people playing the low-level starting areas and the simple-to-provide solo content over and over, even if its just for a month or two, since they still bought the client and at least one month subscription.
So, in this I think we see a growing rift between the customers each segment HAS, and the customers each segment ideally wants.
Nice to venture into this aspect of MMO gaming. Good stuff!
I think the MSOG is the silent majority of gamers. They have consoles and play single player games for the most part or are burned out (or aged gracefully into things like full time employment, a family, etc) from time consuming MMO demands. They know it will be a cold day in hell to really experience dedicated end game goals unless...
The game offers something really outstanding.
I don't have numbers or stats, but I believe the MSOG gave us WoW and captured/ converted a lot of these types to give WoW its popularity. The MMO longtooths who reveled in UO, EQ, SWG enjoy the hardcore time commitment these games offered. they scoff at a casual style game, but hardcore players are not the majority.
Ok, it is much easier to understand how from his point of view that RMT is inevitable. He is a dabbler. Nothing wrong with that. And I agree there are a lot of players that do exactly that. Probably best to dabble in the genre rather to dive in, because the time commitment can be overwhelming for someone with other time constraints.
Mr Aihoshi,
Great article and I can really identify with playing an online game solo. I played Hellgate:London solo all the way to cap except for sporadic groups here and there. I had a summoner and never really needed a group, I brought my own. I played that game free 'til the end and can tell you I was still social however still chose to roll alone most of the time. One reason is that I like the way content is made in an open world MMOG, single player built RPG's sometimes have a very linear feel to it. And usually don't have the options that a MMOG has, apart from games like Oblivion and the Neverwinter Nights series.
I am a westerner and can't understand why F2P, which in my opinion should be called pay as you go hasn't had better reception from the P2P camp. I was brought up on "pay this or no play for you!" ideology and no matter if I stopped playing it 2 days after I subscribed I was booked for a month or maybe more.
I like the freedom that a F2P gives me, I almost feel as if the game is disposable in a way. I played perfect world for exactly 4 hours, didn't find it to my taste and uninstalled. Risk free, not a dime lost in the process, and that's a world renowned game! One thing that sometimes turns me off is the fact that it pushes the cash shop on you from the very beggining, but I do realize that this is a business and these games don't run on good looks, charm and personality.
Do you think a game like MxOnline who SEO recently announced was being closed down at the end of june should go the f2p route? It saved Anarchy Online, why not matrix.
Play safe,
~Ink
Actually the P2P segment seeks both the "migrating" gamer and the stable (I will not call it hardcore, because you can still play casually, it's just the fact you play that same game be it 1 hour a month or 10 hours a day) gamer.
The only problem with P2P in that case is because they have a high initial cost, the retail cost plus a monthly fee (which some believe $15 is a rip-off if you play less than half-your-life-hours a month). P2P games would be much more appealing for the "MSOG" players if they allowed a hour-plan purchase.
Back to F2P, F2P actually likes these players, as they'll eventually leech a few dozens of dollars from them before they leave, or they'll get hooked and start paying hundreds of bucks a month for the kind of items the author mentioned, the percentage of players they get hooked in this way is incredibly low, but as they pay much more than a monthly fee game would cost them, it takes few of them to reach that stable income every MMO needs to survive.
Anyway, I understand the MSOG view as I am one of these players (although I have a main "home" game I end up returning, and many of which I cycle through and then I seek a few new experiences) and it is a nice read into showing this playing style many think is the death of MMOs, though I do it with P2P titles.
I dont believe at all that the MSOGs gave us the WoW of today. Mr. Aihoshi is not at all talking about that audience.
The current WoW was aimed at players who want to stick to WoW, want to achieve, want to get most or everything and want to be given the endgame content, but they want it with less time, less practice and less attention involved. They are not dabblers. If anything, most of the "new" WoW crowd are even more interested in items, progress, and their character than even the more fanatic MMORPGs of old, because its all about the feeling of personal reward.
Mr. Aihoshi is talking about people who just dont get into these games that deep. Those that do not need , seek nor want endgame content, because they get lost along the way and probably leave anyway. That is certainly NOT the modern MMO mass audience at all. It may be a large number, but its a large number spread over countless games.
Pay-to-Play games take everyone, yeah. After all, everyone gives them money. But the preferred customer is the undiscerning customer, and in the case of a pay-to-play, a slow moving player is better than an achiever. A dabbler who buys the box and stays 2 months is probably quite common, however with the size of modern p2p MMOs, the dedicated gamer can probably be at the end of the content in the same timespan. Whereas the dabbler may, or may not prolong his subscription, that isnt something the developer can influence a lot, or has to care for. However, with the normal player, who doesnt jump ship ever 10 weeks or so, the developer has to provide content, incentives, has to work for his money. That is why the dabbler, since he pays just the same price for less goods, is more popular.
On the other hand, dabblers are the worst kind of customers to the free-to-plays, since they do not spend money, AND they do not really provide content for the paying players, whether as being group mates, or audience for great items and achievements or generally being active. The MSOG has nothing to offer for a Free-to-Play, until he converts into either a paying, or at least (see past essays by Mr. Aihoshi) a continuosly present gamer to fill the world.
One more thing to take into account: The MSOG, and actual many casual gamers of today, are not very passionate about the games they play. The people that set up a thottbot.com, or allakhazam when it started, the people who write on boards, who bring others to play, who write guides and all, these are the basic lifeblood of many games, they allow the developers to get away with horrible CS and QA, but these are also the people slowly being pushed out in favor of easier customers, like the MSOG. I personally dont think the MSOG really enjoys and dabbles in a game just filled with his peers. Even this kind of player profits and enjoys the background, the addons, the spoiler sites and all the other benefits of a more dedicated player base.
Read the whole article, liked it very much, but <raises hand> I have a question, where did he learn my gaming 'life-story?' ^^
In my opinion there is nothing to disagree with, he made every valid point I might have were our positions are reversed. The few games I have really stuck with were ones were their were people and good social activities, and one game that was just TOO pretty to put down until the client gave my computer the hiccups.
But I would like to say on behalf of those of us who do bounce between f2p's, some of us, myself included don't really have the disposable cash to spend on a subscription game. Even if I did, there would be a chance that I wouldn't like it any better than an f2p.
Personally, I think manufactures need to reconsider the standard model for games and really try to keep the interest of us non-hardcore type of players.
P.S. I absolute adore that he called them MMOg's instead of mmorpg's.
I have to say that at least I now understand both why he thinks RMT is inevitable and generally "doesn't get" hardcore actual MMORPG players. His average time committment to a game makes that glaringly obvious.
I suppose my counter question for the MSOG crowd is simple, why do you seek to play MMORPGs when they clearly don't suit your lifestyle choices - why join a game you lack the time to play properly and then insist that *IT* be changed to accomodate you?
I have nothing against solo play or single player games - in fact I tend to play them myself when life/work/family don't leave me time for MMOs. But I have never gone into an MMORPG when I didn't have the time to commit and expected to get everything anyways.
This snippet cracked me up though, "the vocal anti-F2P minority" , given that every poll here has showed that the majority of people here at least dislike the F2P model.
First, sorry about the double post, but this quote appeared after I started reading the full article and I didn't refresh to see the new comments.
That really isn't true, There have been a couple of f2p's that I am quite passionate about and regularly recommend them to other players. Asda story and Ether Saga Online if you are curious. While it is true enough that I don't play either at the moment, the reason with quitting the first was for a lack of an end game content, i.e. no quests all grind. The other was because it was a bit too much for an un-upgraded computer.
While I certainly can't counter much of your well reasoned argument, everyone is truly looking for something very personal from a game. This is where MMOg's suffer the most, from a lack of variety, while I would certainly not presume to put down the hardcore players out there. I tend to think it's these 'lifeblood players' that make us Msog's so prevelant, game designers want to make money, so they go for what has made money before. Now I can't argue to economics, if there was away to inject innovation into mmog's without risking a complete flop I would think that alot of msog's would convert to the 'faithful' so to speak.
I've never asked that any game be changed to fit my personal choices. They are mine after all. This is simply a hobby for me. As such, my time and attention is limited to those times I have spare of both. I have no problem with spending money in F2P cash shops in games that I enjoy. Its how the Dev's make money after all. I had a lot more time and energy back when Asherons Call first launched(3 plus years). The only other games I've spent years in are Eve(3 plus years) WoW(4 plus years). Everything else tends to be limited to 3-6 months these days. I'm always looking for another game to try, which is why I've played all of the major, and many of the minor games at launch. Perhaps some day the pace of my life will slow down, and/or I'll find a game thats worth spending all of my time/attention on.
I dabble, but mainly because I'm still looking for the right MMO, however I'll take a stab at responding to you.
He understands the hardcore bunch perfectly, it is after all the hardcore group of gamers that fuel RMT, these hardcore gamers just don't have the time to commit that their passion and hunger dictates, so they turn to money to make up for it.
MSOG players probably seek something that can only be found in an MMO, whether this is the persistant world or the social interactions (even if they don't interact), is unclear, it is likely a number of different reasons though. Maybe it is something like watching videos on YouTube without actually ever uploading a video of your own? You want to see what others are doing, you want to be involved in what others are doing, but you don't want to commit yourself to actually doing those things yourself.
Are MSOG the shy people of the MMO world? :)
Even if everyone on MMORPG.com didn't like the F2P model, on a global scale, those who don't like it are definitely a minority. I wouldn't care to force anyone to it though, I view the MMO genre as being two seperate genres, those with a subscription and those without (item shop or not). I believe going forward we will see more cross over between financial models, with shops in subscription games, but there is clearly a different design, development and methodoligy behind the two types of MMO.
I've worked on both subscription MMOs and free MMOs and the communities are vastly different on a generic level, I'm truely happy that both exist though, the genre would be a lot more depressing if everyone had to find $20 mil before they could even start thinking about making an MMO.
It is well written but only to P2P audiences, as there are a number of flaws.
As a game designer in a MMO company, P2P MMO depends on the reputation of the company, strong IP or else the business model would not be viable. However, i would like to thanks all the P2P customers for their support...
F2P comes in as a grimmick to attract the attention of new fans and customers. While many Korean MMO are F2P in other countries, they are P2P in S.Korea however.
True to say, which game company do not wish for P2P to exist forever? Afterall, it is a stable revenue source. But dont expect too much from young teens with limited allowances.
As the game industry develop, the new generation of gamers become wiser, become exposed to better games and are less commited to just one game. They just want to try new stuffs, get their money worth. Who would want to pay for a game that once you stop your subscription, u no longer have any access to your account? It like renting a car. In F2P game, u actually own the car and you top up the gas if you want to travel the extra mileage.
Anyway, the market is flooding with many free2play MMOs that allowed a Player to solo as well. You just need to search for it. That an unfair comparison. Just my 2cents.
Magiclight I think you it all the good points!
I can identify myself as MSOG or even MSORPG.
Based on what? and how it is linked with RMT
- I love creating characters having all the possibilities ahead of me. Thus I like trying new games where I can 'create' life. If games offer character appearance change via RMT I'd be all over it. New hairstyle etc just like in real life.
- I like my characters to look stylish and in general to look good. I rather craft those items myself but I don't mind if I can buy appearance items from RMT (or better yet... buy recipes that I can combine to create something unique). Stress on word appearance. Stats and other things that impact playability should be separate and there I don't want to see RMT used. I want to earn those - that those are based on skill not my wallet.
- I play a lot, minimum 5-6hours a day. But I mainly play solo or duo/trio with the few good friends that I've played with for few years. This is not to say that I can't help others when needed but I want to do that casually - even without joining their group. Some games have this like buffing and healing outside group. So I like doing that when I pass by and I see someone in trouble.
- I also like to roleplay... light rp but still.
- I like housing, mounts etc. This can easily be linked with RMT... it's not essencial for the game play - people don't NEED them. But the ones who like this aspect would spend quite a bit money on it.
The way RMT usually is used is not appealing to me. But if it is used for customer services (changing servers etc) and getting fluff stuff... appealing on the vanity, to the side of us that wants us to make our character to look the way we want... I'd love it but it's not hindering me to experience the game.
MMORPGs don't really cater to players who have little/much time with little/much money that like to solo/play in small group, craft and socialize.
I wonder if SW:TOR is anywhere close to this? I have KOTOR in mind but in MMO environment. Just add in crafting and socializing aspect and that would be my dream.
you remind me of the players in Maple Story. Man there are tons of players who have paid to just have new hair styles or non-functional equips to look like a particular anime character, like naruto.
I'm not saying anything bad, just so you know. Just that you remind me of them. I should thank you actually you make F2P games possible =D =D =D
What makes you think that there is a "proper" way to play and that the proper way is the way you play rather than the way someone else plays? Different people like different things, and if someone plays a game a certain way and gets enjoyment out of it, what is improper about that?
What is there to laugh about in calling F2P haters a minority when, for example, there are F2P games that have anywhere between 4 to 9 times the user accounts that WoW has subscribers? It's not unusual in any arena for a vocal minority to appear more prevalent than it really is simply because it screams the loudest. Polls here are terribly unscientific and flawed, so pointing to them as evidence of anything is probably not a good idea.
lol hardly my style... I'm just a middle-aged female who likes her toons to look good lol. That doesn't yet state whats the actual play-content that I like. I've played EQII, Vanguard and currently playing AoC (since they put RMT into VG). I like challenge in my games.
Give me murder mystery game to play and I still want my character to look good :)
still make me think of them =P It makes me a bit evnious, but I just can't bring myself to pay for any of them. Again I thank you for keeping F2P games Free =)
What makes you think that there is a "proper" way to play and that the proper way is the way you play rather than the way someone else plays? Different people like different things, and if someone plays a game a certain way and gets enjoyment out of it, what is improper about that?
What is there to laugh about in calling F2P haters a minority when, for example, there are F2P games that have anywhere between 4 to 9 times the user accounts that WoW has subscribers? It's not unusual in any arena for a vocal minority to appear more prevalent than it really is simply because it screams the loudest. Polls here are terribly unscientific and flawed, so pointing to them as evidence of anything is probably not a good idea.
He is not attacking, or trying to enforce, a "proper" way of playing. He is merely stating that among the dozens of different ways to play MMORPGs, a few are not suited at ALL, by design, to the genre without it having to be demolished and rebuilt, then alienating other playstyles.
Whether or not there is a majority or a minority of P2P subscribers or not is irrelevant, both market segments have huge numbers, and are viable audiences for dozens of games at once, so there is absolutely no need to further soften up gameplay in order to appeal to enough customers... as EVE shows, you can be supremely profitable with a game that by all accounts should have died in its childbed going by the cries of the modern casuals.
The problem is that some people have playstyles utterly unsuited to the goals they want to reach. Again, these are not the MSOGs in Mr. Aihoshis sense, because to be a MSOG, its pretty important that you LACK the mid-term and long-term goals binding you to a game. Basically, a MSOG is defined by a short timespan to play one particular game, and a general disinterest in both social and achievement ties to any single game.
The problem of players with very lazy, or time-restricted, or unskilled, or simply disinterested playstyles who nevertheless demand games to conform to them, and give them the topmost rewards and achievements, is an entirely different can of worms that has been opened in the past few years and really doesnt pertain to the MSOG playstyle.
As I said before, the interesting thing is that the F2P genre supports and actually encourages a playstyle that is probably the worst possible for its business model.
Wow! I found a soul-mate! :)
You described it so perfectly that nothing else can be added. And your hopes for SWG: TOR has a serious reason - EA mentioned once they are still thinking about paying model. Anyway, it is more and more common in P2P games to add some minor social features for additional fees. Mb one day they will lower general fees and find a better compromise.
Nice read.
I must say that article describes my play style almost word-for-word.
Further, a fair few of the titles I play/try out are F2P too - and sometimes I get nice surprises in that realm too.
Another reason to add to those listed in the article, why my play style is more solo than anything else, is quite simply because a large percentage of players in any given MMOG are either douchebags or just don't mix with my "vibe".
Also, a lot of the time other peoples motives for playing an MMOG are quite different to mine and we just don't mix.
Glad to hear I'm not the only one. :)
He is not attacking, or trying to enforce, a "proper" way of playing. He is merely stating that among the dozens of different ways to play MMORPGs, a few are not suited at ALL, by design, to the genre without it having to be demolished and rebuilt, then alienating other playstyles.
When a game designer creates a game, they have clear visions in mind of how long - in terms of gameplay time - it will take to reach the "endgame" and to acquire items. The "proper" way to approach an MMORPG in which it is intended that you spend months, if not years, playing is to expect to spend that amount of time to reach the rarest content. Likewise, in most the expectation is that you will have to make friends and join a guild to access that highest content.
I have no issue with the actual MSOG players as he describes himself, but there are a significant number (and growing) of players in MMORPGs who don't have (or don't wish to spend) the time to reach those accomplishments and to make the guild connections. They are the ones constantly demanding "more solo content" or complaining about how hard and elitist the endgame is. They tend to be the ones who want to RMT their way around the time aspect. If you're not one of them , then you aren't who I was addressing.
On the 2nd part, he isn't posting on some global news service nor was he talking about global opinion. I have NO idea what the global opinion survey numbers are on F2P vs P2P and I doubt he does either.
When a game designer creates a game, they have clear visions in mind of how long - in terms of gameplay time - it will take to reach the "endgame" and to acquire items. The "proper" way to approach an MMORPG in which it is intended that you spend months, if not years, playing is to expect to spend that amount of time to reach the rarest content. Likewise, in most the expectation is that you will have to make friends and join a guild to access that highest content.
I have no issue with the actual MSOG players as he describes himself, but there are a significant number (and growing) of players in MMORPGs who don't have (or don't wish to spend) the time to reach those accomplishments and to make the guild connections. They are the ones constantly demanding "more solo content" or complaining about how hard and elitist the endgame is. They tend to be the ones who want to RMT their way around the time aspect. If you're not one of them , then you aren't who I was addressing.
On the 2nd part, he isn't posting on some global news service nor was he talking about global opinion. I have NO idea what the global opinion survey numbers are on F2P vs P2P and I doubt he does either.
Assuming that there is a proper way to play based on a perception of developer intent is a bit presumptuous unless perhaps the developer intent is expressly stated, e.g. in an interview. Even so, most developers understand that not everyone has the same play style or playing habits. That's one of the reasons why different options, e.g. RMT are built into games nowadays. Developers want to appeal to a broader cross-section of the population. If a game is built with these options in the mind from the ground up, it's pretty clear evidence of developer intent. If they're added in later on, it's also evidence of developer intent. Unless it's done through third parties and is against licensing agreements, then it's illogical to say that RMT is against the developer's intent and therefore "improper."
As to the changes in the industry, it sounds like you may conflating two issues, which, although they may at times be related, are not necessarily the same. You're probably just going to have to get used to the idea of RMT. There are more MMOs with RMT than without at this point. Even some P2P games have famously been adding it.
The argument about the context of Aihoshi's publication is specious at best. He's writing about the industry, not about this website.
His argument:
Because of my job I dabble at playing MMO’s and think this is what you could all be doing as it works for me.
Mine:
Err hello, earth to Mr Aihoshi, we are not MMO pundits, we play these games because we love them, not because it is our job and I gotta catch erm all! Sorry perhaps our ‘love of MMO’s’ is a ‘anti F2P mantra’? I am vocal but I am not a miniority as you suggest. So far I have regarded this mans articles with some regard and interest but he now shows his true colours.
He states that he has never seen one MMO through to end content. And I am supposed to think this guy is a MMO expert? He is a first 15 levels expert at best. But I thank him for his honesty.
My suggetion to you sir, is that you play a MMO, any MMO to its end comment and then you will get an idea of game community and not just regard them as solo games online. For that matter it will through some light on the nature of RMP transations for you. For someone who does not seem to have visited a cash shop he seems rather to ready to tell us RMP are no big deal!
Well, the current tendency among F2P games is that of MSOGs, that is true indeed. That might be good for someone like you, of course, who doesn't really intend to spend much time in a single game, but for those who are looking to settle in a game with a good community this is not good at all.
I don't really enjoy going around every single game just to see what it is like. You hardly get the best of anything that way (even though there is barely anything special to get from most MMOs today). I really enjoy a strong community in a game, you really notice the difference when you play an usual F2P game and a game that has a mainly cooperative environment. People don't treat you as trash, because they expect to make friends there, they won't simply neglect others just because they don't expect to ever see them again. This might not be the case for you, but many people who don't seek any connection with a game tend to be rude to others when playing it.
There is a reason for what so many people play F2Ps this way. They are boring. No one bothers spending too much time in a game that is far from being fun, as you admitted yourself. I could say the same for a good percentage of P2P games, but at least a good portion of them offer diversity and equitativity to some degree, as well as a better tendency for having friendlier communities (people play them usually intend to stay, because they have to pay to play). F2P games have everything required to generate terrible communities, some don't really intend to play the game thus don't really invest much into game friends, others use microtransactions to try to gain superiority over the general free players just to show off and subjugate them, others just solo grind to hell expecting the fun that never comes, because they want to prove to everyone that they can achieve something great.
What is the solution to gaining recognizement and reaching the end-game with little to no efforts? You either buy cash items or cheat. It's not surprising that every single F2P game out there is a botfest and has a botting software designed specifically for itself. This is just a sign that there is something terribly wrong, yet what I've been seeing is some F2P companies attempting to find means to officialize botting instead of fighting the real causes of the problem, of course that what they intend with this is to gain the monopoly over the easier means to reach the endgame, making the option of buying cash items even more attractive.
This is a reprint of a post from here, but I still think it applies. My stance hasn't changed that's why I carried it over.
Woo boy this thread is hot! Big walls of texts, quotes and enough attitude to put Paris Hilton to shame.
I have to agree with OP and comments made along the way. Yes there is some terrible RMT and terrible games in general around the net. My relationship with the unistall button isn't as a stranger. And we have a choice if we will continue to play said game or not. Now on one hand in RMT, I can leave it there indefinately and if for some reason I go back I just have to patch it and WA-LA! I'm back in business. On the other hand, if I decide to not play said p2p game, I'll use LOTRO as an example; I am actually wasting the rest of the monthly subscription my $10 and if I go back I have to PAY for another subscription whether it be 1,3,6 or 12 months. They are expecting some money from me.
F2P already knows that there is a certain amount of people that will not pay a dime to play their game. They use something called the "89/10/1" rule, and to quote John Davison, co-founder of WhatTheyPlay.com, a Web site that helps parents navigate the many game choices for their kids.
This rule, Davison says, assumes that 89 percent of your audience is playing for free, 10 percent is paying for something and 1 percent is spending a lot of money, buying new clothes or convenience items for their avatars. - Courtesy MSNBC.com
And with Free Realms that has already hit the 2 million mark, 1% of 2mil is 20,000 and now your talking real money. RMT or what I call it, Pay As You Go is the new breed of online content that many favor and the P2P is in my eyes a lease payment due at the end of the month. I really never OWN anything, I just rent it for a certain amount of time.
This market is expandiing and getting more competitive, no one is settling for low quality and they don't have to. These companies are under pressure and already have a few points against them, they need to step up or the next expansion of games is going to hurt the bottom line which is money. These games are a business that doesn't run on good looks, charm and personality servers cost money and so does the manpower to keep them running.
I don't think RMT is inevitable, I feel that is going to be an evolution of an already established machine and stand as a separate entiity. It is going to stay, but it will stand apart from a larger part of the industry and will attract different players. We are all as different as the characters we play in these games.
It all comes down to choice.
Play safe,
~Ink
I can't say I disagree with the mindset of the 'hardcore' gamers, most of them play more of their games of choice in a month than I will play games in a year, I think the developers are making a mistake, 'dumbing down' as some have put it of games to appeal to a more mass-market crowd. While this trend seems inevitable since numbers don't really lie and the more players there are the more money they are making, be it f2p or p2p, I think those that scream down, attack or otherwise hate games for being f2p or for using Rmt's are 'pissing into the wind'. The change is inevitable at this point, as long as their is money to be made developers will keep putting out more and more f2p's, whether or not they are quality.
But I also have to say if the p2p developers gave the masses a few more options than maybe there would be a few more dedicated players out there in the world. For my part, there are a lot of subscription games I would want to try, only I don't have or I don't want to pay to do it. The reason I stick to f2p's is ease of access, I can download it one morning, play it through the afternoon, and occassionally delete it at night. Yes, I realize that some p2p's are simply too big to offer in a free download, but I would certainly think a little harder about some if it did not cost 30-50 dollars to take one out of the store, or if I could get those disks and have 3 months of free gameplay out of the box, instead of the standard 30 days. To hear some people talk you have to spend 30 days just to reach the forefront of the good parts, and months to reach a lvl worthy of notice, and that's if you play more than a few hours a day. The simple fact is, I can't see myself spending money on something I may or may not like, when it is far easier to simply follow a link take a download and play an hour later.
To use another internet trend to add a little perspective, when Napster was free and it's hey day of music 'theft' was at it's peak. How many people were out there decrying that state, how many people were posting to forums to decry these 'theives' just because they went to the store to by the CD's and got a lot of music that wasn't so good on all the tracks they didn't like.
Minority or not, people who decry f2p's on the general principle of it, are making a whole lot of noise and not really saying a whole lot. The simple fact is, RMT's are making money, so fiscally they make sense. While some put down others for not being hardcore, I personally I have just as quickly quit games for some of those very same hardcore players. Before someone tries to take a bite out of me.. I do realize that those kinds of hardcore players, are not generally the same kinds of hardcore players that are found on p2p. Nevertheless one white sheep pretty much looks the same as another white sheep, no matter which field it is in. Maybe the true hardcore shouldn't expect the casual players to make the distinct between the power-haters who call themselves hardcore.
No matter how one might look at it, the more outcry, the more attacks that are thrown down by the hardcore towards those who lack the same drive, the more those lines between sheep blur. And any amount of negativity sent at f2p's, rmt's, Msog's, and whatever other acronyms or names one puts in there is only going to drive away those who are sitting the proverbial fence between the fields, and the true hardcore will continue to shrink in the face of a growing gaming population and continue to be ignored by developers.
Well .. its his playstyle, He does however have no clue what mmo's are about .. this non bonding thing you write..
how wrong can you be...
Personaly my best mate is a Fin (im dutch) We know each other for .. 6 years now , talk about anyting and everyting. some other good friends living near me and those i know from the net found there true love online. and ofcource me, there friend :P
Building someting up over the years whit a comunity makes a verry strong emotional bond between people, some people you will never see again, some will be friends for live.
not playing past newby status (even if you have a free endgame toon you start as newb ) does not tell you anyting about mmo's .
its like playing mass effect till sheppard has done the first mission and then just quit. or like playing fable 2 , do the first become a hero quest and stop there.
You sir should make new Colomn focusing on two week trials. you be having fun and can play as manny as you like .
Okay, I tried. I tried to give this guy the benefit of doubt that he actually had "something interesting" to say within the space of MMOs, f2p or p2p. All I'm seeing, however, is a constant "defensive" series of ranting with a very, very weak attempt at draping it in the form of discussion and/or semi-intelligent opinion. It always leads back to some thinly veiled slap of the face to anyone who doesn't worship at the alter of f2p games next to Aihoshi.
1) If you don't love f2p games, there's obviously something wrong with you.
2) No matter your reason for not liking them, your reasons are neanderthal at best and you are a simpleton.
3) I don't play these f2p games for more than 50 hours (2 days, 2 hours), but in my "impression play period" I can definitively state that they offer top notch quality and if any of you have played them for longer and state anything to the contrary, you're obviously a fool and don't know what you're talking about.
That about sums Aihoshi up for me. Sorry, bud, I don't give a crap how long you've been on some gamesite "writing" about games. You don't "know any better" that a large percentage of the MMO community and really have no place making some of the snide swipes that you make.
I've seen a few Blue Falcons (you can Google it if you don't know what it means) in my time, but you...I'm hard pressed to think of anyone in my personal experieces that surpasses you. And yes, before anyone else says it, moving forward I'll exercise my right not to read these jokes of internet literary "work".
Dana's articles: Spot on. They show he's down here in the trenches and has a finger on the pulse of the heart of the MMO community.
Sanya's articles: Good work. (and as I said before originally I wasn't keen on her when she was at Mythic as CM)
Jess' articles: Ok. I don't agree with his "tastes" as far as MMO gaming and where it "should go, but he doesn't finger point.
Khalathwyr, I can't say that I agree with your assements, as I'm always attempting to learn from everyone. I don't always agree with Aihoshi, but he is usually worth reading to see what his current take on F2P games are. I've played quite a number myself. The longest was Cabal(level 105 warrior). They tend to follow the usual formula that one expects from Asian grinders. Some to a greater or lesser extent(Runes of Magic comes to mind as a good take on some of the WoW dynamics in a F2P game). I've not received the same impressions you state. But F2P hasn't met the best reception in the west(with a few exceptions). Some of that might be due to poor localization, much is due to cut and paste engine reworks. Which might be why he seems defensive at times.
Good write-up and some good discussion here too, most of which I agree with or at least share some common ground. I too try out many F2P's and really feel that while I may not experience endgame content in most of them, that I get a pretty well rounded view of what is available and current gaming trends in the genre. I also do have a few F2P games that I play daily at least to check in along with my usual retail games, and I don't know too many people such as myself who really appreciates some of the really great Free games along with the Pay games. Most people like one type or the other, but there are pros and cons to both. Both can be tons of fun though and certainly beat other forms of popular entertainment any day of the week!
Well, almost all P2P game offer a free trial also, and in some cases you can just start paying once the trial is done if you like the game (like Vanguard, EQ2 and TCoS).
Tjere is one gsme that is in between of P2P and F2P however: Guildwars. You buy it for the cost of a regular game and then you play it as a F2P game after. No cash shops, no buggs and a lot better gameplay than any F2P game. There is a free trial also, if you havn't tried it you really should, it is in a different class from all the F2P games that are out right now.
You still have to pay for the expansions (if you don't buy the pack with everything in, it isn't that expensive) but the business model works, GW is the second best selling western MMO ever.
I know Loke666, but to be honest Final fantasy XI was what got me interested in Mmo's and by the time I had a computer good enough to run them it was fading fast, and none of the others have really captured my interest. There are a few like Eve that came close, but.. well I guess you could say I got my heart set on something else. With XIV announced today, it won't be a terribly long time before I change my inconsistent ways and settle down to become a loyal player. Anyways, with free trials, I might have gotten caught up.. and at certain points not been able to afford to continue. It happens ^^.
I myself have had time spans in life where I haven't had as much time for one reason or another play games. I usually don't play MMOs during this time period because of things that you mention such as not able to group much, end up soloing majority of the time, not able to form lasting relationships with players in game.
Unlike you though I choose to play single player games during times in life when I have less time to play games. Why? The reason is I feel most online MMOs if they are any good will require a good chunk of time to really enjoy them. If I don't have time to form relationships and group a lot then I see it as a waste of my money. Also I find F2P games with are RMT usually not for me because then it really becomes more of casino type game where it is usually a battle of who has the most real life money which isn't the type of game I am interested in playing. I will play a slot machine if I want to bring real life into gaming. I think devs make some really great single player games with depth for times when I don't have much gaming time to play. I play MMOs for different reasons than I play single player games.
I don't need to be online if I am going to be playing by myself soloing. Another option during my MMO downtime when life is hectic is first person shooters.
I think the best way to go for MMOGs is the way AION is being charged in China.
You just simply buy x ammount of hours of play. And don't have to buy new playtime until you depleted it all. This way if you are a casual gamer, you don't have to worry about paying a lot when you can't be online to play. And for the more hardcore players it worked out to cost about $15 or $17 a month for something like 6 hours a day worth of play time.
To be honest I think that is a perfect middle ground, between the f2p and p2p games.
Hmm... I find that setup to be almost as dubious as Item Malls.
Unless the hourly rate is very low, it could still come out to be considerably more than a flat $15 (or equivalent) per month.
They would have to charge around 3.5 cents per hour, based on a 30 day month.
I highly doubt they're charging 3.5 cents per hour, or that if I only play 20 hours out of a month, that I'll use a mere 70 cents worth of play time.
Don't forget that some people like to keep characters logged in while afk if they want to set up a private shop, etc. etc. (assuming the MMO in question has that capability).
I just think a $15-per-month sub fee is a nice, flat, straight-forward way to go about it. That's ~50 cents a day. I'm hard pressed to think of a comparable form of entertainment so inexpensive.
The only real effect this has, along with item shops, is that the developer potentially makes more money over a flat sub fee... but is the *player* getting any more value for their money? Or are we merely paying more for the same amount we've always had, or less?
Perfect for whom? The company? Aion has that model to apease the Chinese *government*(dictatorship). Though I must say that if our own Dear Leaders got that bad, that Blizzard would LOVE it. Can you imagine how much more they would make from their own hard core players? The implications of this go far beyond the casual/hard core gaming styles.
1 (2hours 5minutes) point costs: 0.1805 buying from CH-USA if you buy 100 Points at once. Which equals about 208 hours worth of play time. Which in turn equals 6.9hours / day in a 30 day month.
So to play say nearly 7 hours/day you would pay $18. And this is through a third party retailer that needs to make money on it as well. (SDO doesn't take (foreign) creditcards it seems).
Perfect for whom? The company? Aion has that model to apease the Chinese *government*(dictatorship). Though I must say that if our own Dear Leaders got that bad, that Blizzard would LOVE it. Can you imagine how much more they would make from their own hard core players? The implications of this go far beyond the casual/hard core gaming styles.
Political discussion can get kind of sensitive, and may even run afoul at times of proscriptions in the rules of conduct. My usual rule of thumb is not to engage in political discussion when I don't know what I'm talking about. I understand some people have different rules for themselves.
As a matter of opinion, I happen to agree with Diluvium in that the approach used is an interesting development. It puts a bit more economic risk on the developers, but if they make a game that's engaging and that makes people want to play a lot, the risk may be worth it. From a player's perspective, unless someone plays an inordinate amount of time or the amount charged per unit of time is too high, this model could be economically beneficial to the individual player.
Not sure which assessment you aren't agreeing with, not that I posted this in an attempt to gain your acceptance. Those numbered points are what I (as I stated before) get from Aihoshi. Reading his writing it is very easy to see those sentiments conveyed by him. And as far as learning from everyone, well, you first have to find people that have something, some knowledge or insight that is worthy of being taught. Aihoshi, in my view, hasn't displayed this at any point so far. He seems, in my opinion, to be the beneficiary of being in the right place and time to get a writing break and to be doing this "job". I've yet to read anything "enlightening" from him, even if I disagreed with it which has been the case with Dana and Sanya, that gives merit to him having such a podium to preach from. Point of fact, I have read posts from those in our community that were much more thoughtful and worthy of taking up the space Aihoshi is being slotted.
Essentially, I'm not sure what is so special about his "take" on f2p games as he hasn't displayed, in my view, any qualities in his writing that the vast majority of gamers out there don't have.
Good read.
One thing about my guild in WoW is that being 'needed' kept me playing that game long past the point where I was actually enjoying it. Something that is lacking in most MMORPGs is challenging single player content. Only when the developers must take into account a large number of players do they seem able to abstract the classes down into rudimentary enough numbers in order for the game to be a challenge. People definately are looking for games that they can advance in individually. Most of the people content to raid the same content week in and week out are pretty much just sheep who won't leave the game even if a better game does come out, F2P or P2P, unless the game is 'big enough' to warrant the guild leader jumping ship.
Political discussion can get kind of sensitive, and may even run afoul at times of proscriptions in the rules of conduct. My usual rule of thumb is not to engage in political discussion when I don't know what I'm talking about. I understand some people have different rules for themselves.
As a matter of opinion, I happen to agree with Diluvium in that the approach used is an interesting development. It puts a bit more economic risk on the developers, but if they make a game that's engaging and that makes people want to play a lot, the risk may be worth it. From a player's perspective, unless someone plays an inordinate amount of time or the amount charged per unit of time is too high, this model could be economically beneficial to the individual player.
Simple statements of fact may well be "sensitive" to some, but they remain facts none the less. That in fact is why Aion and many of the other games are using this and related models. I direct your attention to the Chinese governments "crack down" on on line games over the last 18 months. Unless the fact that you dispute is that the Chinese government is a dictatorship? That is self apparent. Any way, enough of that.
As a business model the pay as you go approach, while logical on the surface is prone to creeping abuse(just as RMT is). Not to mention that in this case, the company can place the blame on the government. Free market dynamics idealy would prevent such abuse. Unfortunately most markets are anything but free. Look at the steep barriers to entry of this particular market sector as an example. Like it or not, the subscription game model is the one currently accepted by the majority in the Western world. That may change as time passes, but its not happening any time soon.
/agree. As the Op is a self professed dabbler, without data and may often not get 'the point' of any particular mmo, I’m a little bemused as to why he is given such visibility.
Blue Falcon: a version of the military acronym BF which stands for Buddy F*&%er. That is what someone who behaves in a manner which elevates his personal needs or desires above those of the unit to which he belongs.
froggyruminations.blogspot.com/2004/08/flight-of-blue-falcon.html
This was an interesting article.
I play like this simply because I really don't have the time week after week to devote to a "game".
Gaming, to me, is entertainment, not a lifestyle. Therefore when my time is demanded by other concerns, gaming drops to the wayside.
I also haven't looked for the endgame and endboss since Duke Nukem II. All that time and trouble in a single-player game? To do that in an MMORPG with the time needed to train up, form or join a guild, maintain good relationships, get a good group of mates together and we're going to have to try how many times?
I don't think so.
No, I play games to be entertained, not to work. Work effort I'd rather put into Photoshop. When I get sick of work I want fun, not more work.
So I go kill some mobs, buy or craft some gear, then the phone rings and I'm glad I can just shut it down.
Where does F2P fit into this scenerio?
Simply that I don't have to pay if I don't want to. Any gratification can wait - months if needed without costing me a cent - and that...that is a very good thing.
Id like him to altleast give us and in depth review of a couple free to play than rather just the concept of F2P, because the concept for a F2P is good but its never been done well, or with a good game.
Good points, but do you know how long it takes to get to even mid level in one of the Asian grinders? Its just not time effective. I typically play them up into the 100's, but that takes quite a bit of time, since I'm not on 24/7. Not to mention that all too many of the F2P games use the same engine, thats just been reskinned and rule mod'ed.
I think you just do not like him as a writer, for whatever reasons you may have, but he's not talking about F2P MMOs. He clearly talking about his current playing habits and labeling it as a MSOG playstyle and in turn how F2P MMOs make a good fit for this playing style. Which I might add a lot of players tend to fit in this habit of playing F2P games.
It's like he talking about apples and how he enjoys Granny Smiths, Washingtons, Fujis and all the different kinds apples he can sample and then saying how he enjoys eating them fresh. Now we all know that's not the only way to enjoy an apple. You can bake pies with them, tarts, make juice or apple sauce. The possibilities are available but he enjoys them fresh and thinks lots of people do.
The you come in here and state that oranges are freakin awesome!
I can totally relate to what he is saying. I belong to a guild of players that is very diverse. We play many games, some at the same time, some not.
While we have several that still play WOW mainly, we also have another group that play many different games at once. I can't afford to carry every single game we try out all of the time. We have different work schedules, new babies, and time zone issues. I find myself playing solo alot, even in new games we are all playing. While I very much enjoy those times we can actually all get together at once, it doesn't seem to happen as often these days.
I have no problem at all playing alone. That doesn't mean I don't enjoy that there are lots of others on the server at the same time. MSOG works for me, I can still talk to people, still relate to my guild mates, and not feel like I am missing out on leet lootz.
I couldn't agree more..Although I have played several games VERY hard, I generally tend to play several games more casually nowadays...
I almost always play MMOs...But I almost always play them in a solo-style...
I rarely join guilds or clans, and although I do sometimes play with friends or others, most of the time I'm exploring and fighting on my own...
Good points, but do you know how long it takes to get to even mid level in one of the Asian grinders? Its just not time effective. I typically play them up into the 100's, but that takes quite a bit of time, since I'm not on 24/7. Not to mention that all too many of the F2P games use the same engine, thats just been reskinned and rule mod'ed.
Richard Aihoshi certainly doesn't! He said himself he never gets that far. :P
To be honest all of his articles I've read so far I've found to be big walls of babbling text totally bereft of any actual content.
There seems to be no reference, no actual research and nothing but vagueness and sweeping generalisations about F2P games without ever having to get down to the nitty gritty of specifics.
The fact that he self-professedly jumps from ship to ship with only a quick glance at the sails and no exploration of the boat itself would seem to explain why...