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• • Why doesn't anyone talk in MMO anymore.

  • Originally posted by Sovrath
    

     

    So "no" I don't want to just shoot the shit with just anyone. I will continue to get to know people slowly and find people who fit my playstyle or at least my temperment. It doesn't take a huge amount of time to meet people but it does take time to learn a person's true quality.

    
     

    Forgive me for largely snipping your reply, I mean no disrespect by that, as I quite understand what you're saying and in large part I agree.   I too am mostly a solo player, but at the same time, I will strike up a conversation with just about anyone that doesn't involve current politics, sex, real life religion, or sports. 

    But my point was that while some make use of such forums to scout out a guild,  or move as a guild en-masse from one game to the next, quite a few people don't.  I won't make grand assumptions or quote statistics that I have no way of proving, but it seems like a lot of people do it the way I do it, by initially joining up with a randomly encountered person for a quick quest solution, then repeated sharing of goals leads to more formal efforts to work together later on as compatability shows itself.

    Certainly, scouting out boards beforehand is a more efficient approach to determine if the stated goals and temprament of a guild being researched is a good fit, but honestly, I do that after I've encountered some individuals from a guild who it looks like there might be a possible future, and again, I get that from initial casual conversation.  Likewise, I learn whom to avoid from reading such chatter, you can usually tell if there is a personality conflict by the way someone responds to casual questions.  

    All the things you mentioned as taking time, for me at least, have thier seeds in casual chatter of wide area channels, and when people adopt a mentality of bothering only with fellow guild/clan members, whether they mean to or not, they shut out the good with the bad as well as projecting a attitude of elitism, again whether intentional or not, that's whats picked up in the subcontext of non response to people asking directed questions.

  • Posted: 11/17/08 1:54 AM
    General Discussion
• • From Care Bear to ?

  • Originally posted by Bodeus
    

    Yes I am a Care Bear. I have never liked PvP. I have avoided it like the plauge I thought it was.

    I am letting my subscription to WAR run out at least for a while(for various reasons), BUT one thing that Warhammer did  was to get me to try pvp. I still dont think Id like Open free for all pvp but I actually found myself enjoying Scenarios and some of the limited ORvR I got to do.

     Now, I have always played Healers or RDPS in mmos and I am damn good at it. I have found though that playing either of these classes especially in a RvR setting to be very, very, very frustrating. I dont know if it was just the "PUG" nature of scenarios and orvr or something else but I just get so frustrated to the point of giving up or rolling for the other side lol when people just dont seen to want to work together or even speak to one another. Which usually leads to everyone trying to do there own thing and usually failing at whatever the goal is. Even though this caused great frustration and agrovation I found myself going back for more. I found myself trying different things, hoping for different teammates, etc. Now most of the time it seems like my side lost, but 90% of the time even when we lost I was usually at the top of healing/damage depending on my role.

    Is that frustration what attracts people to PvP? Is it the sometimes overwhelming likelyhood of losing to another prson that you enjoy?

    My subscription runs out tomorrow for Warhammer and I find myself contemplating  where to go next and for the first time wondering if it should be one of the other PvPcentric games.

    Can a care bear be converted to a pvper or am I just fooling myself? lol

    
     

    I won't presume to say why you should prefer one type of gameplay over another, but I used to be that way too, prefering PvE content over PvP largely due to my exposure to PvP having started in UO and then in EQ, both of which left a very sour taste in my mouth for different reasons.  As other games attempt to market to the 2 groups, some at the same time, I have come to realize that good PvE can be great fun, but little is as satisfying as defeating another player.

    For me, it goes like this.  I'm meant to beat PvE, provided I fall into the level assignement (or whatever mechanic a system uses for structuring where you go).  In PvP, I'm (ideally) supposed to have a fair chance at winning with the variances being near infinite due to human guidance behind my foe.

    Now in breif what you're running into WAR (which I'm currently playing) is that its a symptom of our culture more than any inherit quality of the game or the style of play.  Take a look around you and see how defensive people are about anyone telling them how to do something.  Look at how quick they are to scoff at the notion of supporting someone else's success, as the world is all about them.  I could go on at great length but these two sum it enough enough to where you can see more of what that implies and how it transfers to online presence.

  • Posted: 11/16/08 10:58 PM
    General Discussion
• • Why doesn't anyone talk in MMO anymore.

  • Originally posted by Sovrath
    

    Originally posted by Illius
    

    I would preffer if the people chatted all over rather then just within the guild.  I remember being able to run along and find someone killing or crafting or whatever they're doing and being able to start up a conversation about anything.  Now you usually get the "can't talk, leveling" or "busy killing, leave me alone".  I think there's not a single thing at fault here but a collection of smaller short comings that add up to a bigger problem.  The mentality of games, along with games that are quite easy to overcome on your own don't necessarily breed any sense of camraderie or any need for others around.  The stigma now amongst most of these players is that other people are dumb or inept and would only hinder their progression.  To them the game is a measuring pole where they can see how well they stack up to the other people and ofcourse they want to be on top, the biggest, strongest, smartest... I think you get my point.

    
     

    Well that is why I usually turn off general chat. I play online games to "play" a game.

    And though I've met great people and enjoy talking with them, most of my conversations go on in the guild. I have had some incredible clan/guild mates and have very much enjoyed their company.

    However, I don't want to sit around and "shoot the shit" with someone "just because".Oh sure if a short conversation starts up that's fine, but in the end, if I'm not playing the game then I could be doing something else.

    I don't play online games to meet people, I play them to play along side with people.

    Now I do understand that many like you enjoy this. But to me that just turns the game into a glorified chat room.

    So when I do see the chatty general chat I just turn it off completely. That's a shame as there might be people who need help and perhaps I can even help them. Especially because some people in game can be very insulting for no reason at all and won't help players.

    But I just can't abide the whole chat room mentality.

    It's very possible that other people are doing the same.

    I mean, talk about killing immersion? People talking about cars, politics, debating WoW (because I see a bit too much of this). If you want to talk you can find me in real life.

    However, I pay monthly so I can take my sword of "Make Evil Pay" and storm the castle.

    Otherwise I can be hanging with my real life friends.

    
     

    I kinda get what you're saying here, but my question is...how did you find a good guild to get in?  Sure you can hit websites or forum boards and scroll through the many recruitment posts there, but myself I base it off of its membership and how much they interact with me.  If they're aloof and only talk to others inside their guild, that equates to snob to me. 

    Its like that really lovely woman you've admired for some time in the lunchroom or the office who always keeps to herself and talks only to her select group of friends, no matter how "wonderful" she might truly be, because of her tendency to interact only with a select group she comes across as a stuck up b***ch.

  • Posted: 11/16/08 10:33 PM
    General Discussion
• • Didn't live up to expectations

  • 
     

    Originally posted by dxt178
    

    * The graphics are fairly bland. I have a high end system and everything is maxed, still environments are basic and unpolished and characters are very basic.

    I felt they were no more bland than WoW, and any game that intends have 50-100 or more players fighting in the same area is going to have to do that until a new leap is made technologically in graphics and data streaming.

    * Combat is similarly bland and unpolished. It feels slightly disconnected and weak.

    Blander than what?  Again, though I am reluctant to constantly use WoW as a basis, its no blander than WoW's system, in fact it struck me as better due to less downtime and having to learn how to pace your activity for the longer battles.

    * Quests are well done but some lack proper direction and can be confusing for no reason.

    Confusing at times yes, as someone who works with a ton of Brits I can only say that I think its the way their minds work.  Cultural differances make the obvious not so much to those outside of the culture.  As for direction, so far I haven't had issue with that, the map pretty much tells me where to go and what I like is that I get alerts via the map as to where new quest givers are.

    * Overall performance and play is just too generic feeling and plain to really draw the player into the action and story. If WAR was a bag of chips it would be the old style white bag with black letters just saying "Chips."

    I have a difficult time understanding where you're coming from on this.  Performance is rock solid for me so far, animation smooth, and the heavy RvR scenario's I've played have had so many players on each side that I was actually shocked at how smooth game play was.  By play I can only assume you mean what you do in the game PvE wise.  In that regard, having played every paid MMO on the market by now, I can say is when you strip away the world lore, they're all the same.  I think here you're reacting to design laws rather than WAR's inherit quality.  It happens after you've played alot of these, the trick is to just step back and not bring the old veteran inside

     

    Unlike many negative "reviews" I do plan on sticking with it for at least the first month and hope it grows on me, but I have a feeling that the overall fit, finish, and polish of WoW just has this title beat in almost every respect. I just wish WoW had some of the positive ideas and aspects of WAR like the grouping and RvR. I still would not go back to WoW, but I don't think WAR is going to hold me as long as it managed to do and I don't think my time in WAR will be as rewarding. I hope to be wrong but fear I won't be.

    This is the only part of your post that annoys me, though not to worry, I know it's not intentional nor personal ;)   First off, WoW has had 4 years of development, and currently enjoys a 150 million dollar revenue every month.  Think on that for a second, even if only 50% of that is not eaten up by overhead, that's still a ton of money every month to do development with.  And yet...they still can't get Arena down.  Patch after patch after nerf after patch with more nerf...and they still can't solidify their borked up Arena concept.  They can't come up with a way to address the AFK issues in the BGs.   World PvP is virtually non existant and even on most PvP servers, its one sided, either you spent weeks assembling a arena set to have even a modicum of a survival chance, or you're just fodder for the retard who does nothing but buys arena ratings so he can gank.  The gear discrepancy overshadows its PvP design so badly that its literally a failed design, a truth that Arena exposes on a constant basis with its cycles of pvp patches.

    However their instances see new tweaks to help with the gearing, that's a plus.  Dailies are a plus, xpacs featuring more lore, more instances, more gear, all pluses, and by now it should be showing what WoW's decided focus is...PvE.  Not that its a bad focus, but clearly in PvP WoW often scratches its head and does a "Nurrrr?"  In fact, if the PvE didn't have the polish it does, given how much money pumps into their accounts every month, I'd consider it a horrid failure. 

    Unfortunately, all that PvE depth is centered around acquiring loot, and it creates a mentality I have grown very weary of.  I used to love the BGs, until Arena came out and forced me to do that first before I could enjoy my BG sessions again, due to the performance discrepancy you'd run into with battling someone that had said gear.  But the entire system that WoW uses to generate its rewards isn't designed well enough to avoid the afk syndrome, in WAR at least, I see everyone participating and getting credit for doing what their class is supposed to do.

    So in closing, while I understand your position of comparing the two games, I personally do not agree with WoW beating WAR, the two are different animals really.  One is a EQ-Lite game with a side of PvP...the other is a PvP game from the ground up with a side of PvE.  If I were a raider, I'd love WoW and hate WAR, fair enough, but PvE content to me isn't nearly as interesting as forming up with friends to bash in some enemy heads.

     

    PS)  There is one thing that is driving me bonkers about WAR however, not mentioned in your post but I'm sure distracts you as well.  Chat.  I have read all the comments that love the fact that there is no global chat, but I find it rather stiffling.  Sure, the global idiot isn't able to annoy you with his retarded attention seeking spamming or sophmoric humor...but my rebuttal to that remains the same, include /ignore and include /leave channel.  problem solved. 

    Lack of solid chat for non guilded individuals is making it extremely difficult for me to get a feel for people, whom I'd like to invite to party with and who is such a ass that I definitely do not want anything to do with them.  And the suggestion to just Vent it doesn't work if you're not part of a guild or a group of friends who joined the game together (who are most likely to form a guild in the first place).  If anything drives me away from the game, it'll be this, as I find it seriously hampers the sense of community development.

  • Posted: 9/24/08 2:07 PM
    WAR (Warhammer Online)