Profile: Jatar
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• • Official Forums?

  • For now we're too busy with developing the game to run official forums.   They require a significant amount of time to moderate, mostly due to automated spam systems and rude posts.   There will be official forums when we have more man power to moderate them properly.

  • Posted: 5/13/08 4:16 PM
    Citadel of Sorcery
• • What input does MMO magic want to see?

  • Allowing players to know which alts are linked defeats a part of the reason for having them.  However, we do offer players a robust method of handling players who annoy them.   You can ignore them at various levels, including all their Atls if you wish (even though you may not know which are their Alts).  Thus, if you are annoyed by a player you may choose to never see, hear or even know they exist, including all their alternate accounts.   This is the ultimate form of player punishment for bad behavior, and they can't hide behind alternate accounts.  However, due to this there is no need to keep good players from having alternate accounts, or using them with anonymity.

  • Posted: 5/12/08 1:24 PM
    Citadel of Sorcery
• • Quest System Discussion

  • Originally posted by jakin
    

     

    Originally posted by Jatar
    

    Fortunately, there are no laws to break in making an MMO differently from previous MMO games.  In this case I think you may believe that an MMO must be 'endless'.   We have no such belief....  

    Ah ok - I gotcha now.  I didn't understand the concept to be as episodic as it is.  I was still coming from the viewpoint of a classic MMO rather than the newer business models used in Guild Wars and similar.

     

    Thanks for the responses Jatar - best of luck. 

    

    I should add... it is our intention to have the next sequel story ready before players reach the end of the first one so that they can keep playing the game and advancing their character and that character's story.   But you were posing the question of what if they reach the climax before we manage to write the next  sequel.  Our goal is to not let that happen.  We have plenty of time to write the next sequel since each story is quite involved.  Episodic, though technically correct, does not bring up the correct image.  Each story would put a large epic fantasy book series to shame in terms of content.   Our epic adventures should take players a minimum of a year to complete, and for many players, even longer (up to three or so).   That gives us plenty of time to have the next one ready to go, so although our stories reach a climax, most players can continue to adventure without pause.

  • Posted: 5/12/08 9:54 AM
    Citadel of Sorcery
• • What input does MMO magic want to see?

  • Well, on the subject of offering more than one character to a player...

    This is not a simple issue.  I would like to address one thing before talking about this, in Citadel of Sorcery your character has access to ALL Abilities in the game.   There is no reason to have to play two alternate characters in order to get different Abilities.  If you want archer abilities, go get them.   If you want to toss fireballs, go learn that spell.  There are challenges to achieving various abilities, but no restrictions.  

    Now, as to offering multiple characters per account... we will be offering this option.   There are reasons why this is a good idea.  First, no one is required to do this, and since you CAN get any set of abilities for your character, many of the reasons for using multiple characters goes away.   But there are some remaining reasons.   Once example, I know players who belong to a big guild and most often want to interact with their guild members... but not always.  Sometimes they don't want to be social, and they don't want their guild members to feel affronted, so they simply use an alternate character that does not belong to that guild when they are feeling anti-social. 

    Or... no matter how much we try (and let me tell you, we are going the extra mile to allow higher level characters to play with lower level)  there is still some limit to how far apart character levels can be and still have an enjoyable experience when grouped.   However, players can use an alternate character to play with friends just starting the game.

    The end of this discussion for us was simple, make it so that a player is not forced to use an alternate character to experience any portion of the game, but don't stop them from doing so.  You will find this kind of philosophy in may portions of the game design.  Just like doing a quest solo vs. grouped.   We do not stop players from doing either one, we give them the choice on every quest.

     

     

     

  • Posted: 5/11/08 11:18 AM
    Citadel of Sorcery
• • Quest System Discussion

  • Originally posted by jakin
    

     

    Originally posted by Jatar
    

     

     

    Citadel of Sorcery is a story driven adventure.  I can't tell you what that story will be exactly, as each person's path through the game is different.   What drives you on is your progress toward the climax.  But I can't tell you what that will be, no one can.  Think of it as if you had read the first two books of a new fantasy series, and book three has not yet been written by the author... then ask what will come.   I can't tell you, it isn't written yet, but you will want to read that third book to find out what happens.  In the case of our game, you will write that third book for your character, you write it by the choices you make, which affect the future of your story. 

    Quests in this MMO game, though partially generated (customized to the character's story would be closer) are not unconnected, nor are they a linear sequence everyone follows.  Quests in Citadel of Sorcery tie together into your ongoing story, each bringing you closer to your own grand climax.  What keeps you playing is the same thing that keeps you watching a good movie or reading a good book, only you are even more involved.   When this story reaches the grand conclusion... a new one will start, that's the fun of a good sequel.

    
    OK.

     

    So there is a web of partially hand-crafted / partially generated questing which allows a player to run through a contiguous storyline.  Cool.

    Once again - if the quest system is in fact a quantum leap forward in game design then more power to you.  You will all become very rich through licensing if nothing else.

    However, I would be more inclined to expect that sooner or later the patterns to the quests would become apparent.  Humans are evolved to pick out patterns - it's our nature.  The window dressing may be different - but will the actual actions be very different?

    I point to PotBS as an example - most of their 5000 advertised missions were created via templates, and though the text and ship types were different, the basic quest types were the same few types over and over.

    I would also expect that if the content is handcrafted at all, there will be a point where the players catch up to development.  It's a truism that players consume content far faster than developers can create it.

    Example:  I'm a huge fan of George RR Martin's Song of Ice and Fire series.  I started it late and was able to read the first three books in pretty rapid succession, but then I was waiting a year for the next (which I read in a week) and years for the one after, and so on.

    So - are you saying that the way this game is designed the player will never reach that point of waiting for the next sequel?  That the system is designed to produce a functionally endless stream of varied and interesting quest content?

    Or if not - what is the intended pursuit for players that have completed their "climax" for the time being and are waiting for the start of the next installment?

    Fortunately, there are no laws to break in making an MMO differently from previous MMO games.  In this case I think you may believe that an MMO must be 'endless'.   We have no such belief.   The fact is that most players leave current MMOs at some point.  The actual length of time they stay is debatable, but it is an accepted fact that the average player gets bored and moves on to another game at some point.   Our goal is to keep them longer than average simply by having a richer quest experience that climbs to a grand climax worth reaching... an end.   From the beginning we've made no secret of the fact that there is an end to each player’s story.   The idea is simply that we will try to make a unique adventure for each player, their progress driven by several factors: character progression, Tier ascension, new exploration, opponent intelligence progression and finally and most importantly, story progression and the knowledge that if they keep playing there will be the big payoff of a grand climax. 

    If at that point in time the average player wants to keep playing Citadel of Sorcery, well, we’ve already succeeded in our goals… we’ve kept them entertained longer than other MMO games.  There is an old saying, keep them wanting more.  

    When a player does reach the end, and if they still want to play the game, they have two possible options.  First, they could start a new character and play through the game again.  Unlike other MMO games, we have an advantage here, you can create a whole new character and class, and the game story will be different this time through.  However, the second possibility is that we will have the next sequel story finished, at which point they can choose to start that story and progress their character further.  However, we will consider the game a success if we simply keep the average player for the full length of the original story, which will mean they enjoyed our game more than most, and played it longer than most.  

    Analogies can be risky at times, but I’ll risk one now… would you rather watch an epic movie once or an endless soap opera?  Yes, there are people who like soap operas, and there are those who will want to play endless MMO games, no matter how repetitious the game.   But we believe there are more people who want an epic thrill ride, even if it eventually comes to a grand completion.

     

     

  • Posted: 5/11/08 10:39 AM
    Citadel of Sorcery