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World of Warcraft : The Evolution of Raiding
Posted Oct 22, 2009 by Jon Wood
MMORPG.com World of Warcraft Correspondent Siji Ibikunle wrties this look at the evolution of the raiding system in Blizzard's hit game.
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No matter what you think about World of Warcraft, few can deny that it is an immersive MMO experience that manages to cover the many aspects of the genre with a level of polish that one would be hard pressed to find elsewhere in one package. Whether you are into PVE, PVP, or RP, you can find it all in WoW at a level that few games are capable of reaching (although, some RPers would adamantly argue that the lack of a housing system is one of the great pitfalls of the game that is yet to be rectified). However, my favorite aspect of the game is PVE; and, further still, raiding. There is nothing like getting together with 9 or 24 guildies - or maybe even a PUG if you are desperate or not willing to be tied down - and downing the great, big baddies that the game has to offer.
Read The Evolution of Raiding.
Good article.
I am not a WoW player but have tried it a few times now. I even went so far as to buy the game and had a sub for a full 2 months.
I want to like WoW. I really do. All I read about it, the size of the community, the story lines, all the raids. It really seems like a great game to me.
In truth what keeps making me turn my lip up is the graphics. I get it, they wanted the game to be accessable to a very large market and Blizzard gets big points for hitting the proverbial nail squarely on the head for that one. But I have a pretty decent computer and after playing games like DDO/ CoX/ Champions the graphics in WoW are so crappy I just don't want to play it. I guess it's not as important to most as it is to me but I like really cool immersive graphics with a feel of realism.
WoW sure does seem to have alot going on all the time, and after reading this article about raids it makes me want to give it another shot, and try to look past the crappy graphics.
I enjoyed the read too.
You don't get it. WoW is supposed to look like the Warcraft games. Which it does very well.
Nuke this game already. Yes it was fun years ago, they did a great job both in quality and success with the game but it's OLD.... OLD! Stop milking the dead cow and use some of that furtune you made off us and release the next gig blizzard. I still can't believe we have to wait another year for the the first major game release from this developer since wow launched. God only knows when they'll give us a new mmo. 2020 by my calculations. It's ridiculas. I never thought I'd say this but thank god there is finally a decent alternative to wow, aion. Whether you like the game or not many former wow heads are finding a home there. I say migrate and let our subs speak for themselves. Blizzard needs to fork out a new game or find themselves new blood.
it was a great game that entertained me for years but it doesnt give me what I need in a mmo anymore. No matter who you are you cant say its a bad game. The problem is a lot of learned and loved it but they have moved on miss the game for what it once was to them. All their memories of the game are all but gone and replaced with leveling, grinding and raiding (the bad way). I loved raiding at first but then when you find your self raiding 25 hours a week and they are all rince and repeat raids you get burned out. I will miss the memories of the game I once loved. Hopefully I will find a game that scratches my mmo itch like wow once did.
Thanks for the comments guys, I appreciate it. Also, before anyone points them out, I have spotted two typos. I said that I started playing during the "second expansion, The Burning Crusade", which is actually the first expansion. Also later in the article, I threw in a rogue "is", the sentence starts something like "It is was". So sorry for the typos if they bothered anybody.
Now, @Babylon9000: Blizzard realizes that a lot of people don't like the fact that they make their graphics accommodate people who aren't willing to shell out a ton of cash for a fancy computer. They have taken steps to alleviate those issues so as to not alienate those who would appreciate better graphics. They have updated the shadows in the game to follow real world physics for shadows, they have included an option to increase the textures and polygon count for player character models, updated cat and bear form for druids and are in the process of updating the other forms, added options to increase spell detail, and in the next expansion they will change to water to look absolutely awesome. If you want to see some pictures as to what is to come, the you should stop by the Blizzard website and check out the Cataclysm page, it looks great. Also, when you played the game, did you ever get into Outland, or just stay in the old world? The graphics in Outland are better than those in the old world, and the graphics in Northrend are better than those in Outland, and when Cataclysm comes out, they are going to revamp the old world so the graphics there will be up to par with anything that is currently available on the market, if you so choose.
I hope that has dispelled any doubts that you may have about the graphics in the game, because they truly are improving as the months and years go by.
@Greymann: WoW is far from dead. They have barely touched upon the lore available in the Warcraft franchise and they still have at least 4 expansion packs worth of content available to make. And like I said to Babylon9000, they are continually updating the graphics. Also, if you ask any raider from either end of the spectrum, they would say that the raids are at a point where they are getting to be challenging for those who want it and accessible for those who don't. Also, in terms of game balance, they are closer to parity between the classes in terms of PvE than they have even been at any other point in the game, and they continue to work towards closing the gap in PvP. The game is constantly improving, and if you would try to take an impartial, fresh, and nonjudgmental view towards it, you would see that. Of course, if you are just here to advertise Aion, which appears to be a more than decent game, then please continue.
Yea, it is easy to look at a game after playing it for years and say, "man, it's just not what it used to be," because you have played it for so long. But out of all the people I've seen who have stuck with this game from the beginning the game is better than when it first started. There are less bugs, no more laggy 40 man raids with half of the people either AFK or being carried, and when was the last time you heard of shadow priests or boomkins being in a 40 man raid in Vanilla WoW, or a ret paladin in TBC? It didn't happen, but now you can bring almost any DPS spec to a raid and expect a decent performance from them as long as the player knows their class.
A lot of the lost greatness in a game can be the result of nostalgia and the almost inevitable jadedness that comes with time. I know that I can't pick up one of the new Pokemon games and enjoy as much as I did Pokemon Red when I was 9 or 10, because then it was new, and I was young, and it just loses that feeling of novelty over the years, even if the new games are better.
what turned me off was grinding to max level, grinding for all the gear I could get from each dungeon so I could do the next dungeon and before that grind was over they would release new levels and new builds, I guess I just hate doing the same dungeon for months and months just to de it with the next patch. I wanted more content but not more levels basically
I disagree here. They are becoming more and more accessible but far from challenging. I think complicated is a better description for WoW raiding these days. If you can learn where to stand or not to stand, when to run left/right, when its safe to cast and when its not, you can easily defeat any WoW encounter on heroic mode. Gone are the days when you had to be exceptionally skilled in your class. We no longer see wipes because a player used the wrong ability or a healer had to pick who to heal and who to let die because they just couldnt keep up with healing everyone...now its about wiping because some random generated spike comes out of the ground or someone hasnt spent enough time rehearsing running back and forth between the waves of acid. Its all well and good that Blizzard wants everyone to be able to access content, but it would be nice if they brought back the aspects that actually made raiding challenging, not complicated, at least for the heroic versions.
I disagree here. They are becoming more and more accessible but far from challenging. I think complicated is a better description for WoW raiding these days. If you can learn where to stand or not to stand, when to run left/right, when its safe to cast and when its not, you can easily defeat any WoW encounter on heroic mode. Gone are the days when you had to be exceptionally skilled in your class. We no longer see wipes because a player used the wrong ability or a healer had to pick who to heal and who to let die because they just couldnt keep up with healing everyone...now its about wiping because some random generated spike comes out of the ground or someone hasnt spent enough time rehearsing running back and forth between the waves of acid. Its all well and good that Blizzard wants everyone to be able to access content, but it would be nice if they brought back the aspects that actually made raiding challenging, not complicated, at least for the heroic versions.
Amen
You don't get it. WoW is supposed to look like the Warcraft games. Which it does very well.
Your right I didn't get it.
Still don't.... I still think the graphics are crappy.
Good game and all, lots of content but not too pretty.
It is now easier than ever to level and gear up a character. I can level a character from 1-80 in a matter of about 3 weeks, averaging about 2 hours per level or so, because leveling is so fast now. Plus, with the badge system, it is easy to upgrade your gear. And I find that when I check out the characters of a lot of the people who complain that the game is to easy, they haven't even beaten half of the bosses that are available in that tier of content. So, to those people I say, go kill the bosses before you complain about them.
It is now easier than ever to level and gear up a character. I can level a character from 1-80 in a matter of about 3 weeks, averaging about 2 hours per level or so, because leveling is so fast now. Plus, with the badge system, it is easy to upgrade your gear. And I find that when I check out the characters of a lot of the people who complain that the game is to easy, they haven't even beaten half of the bosses that are available in that tier of content. So, to those people I say, go kill the bosses before you complain about them.
I've made 5 level 70s and 3 level 80s, that grind just gets old and I've been there since release and I know how much easier the leveling has gotten but if they want to make the leveling so easy each expansion why not just not add levels and add content? AQ style new skills perhaps, if you want the new skills or talent points its a earn it doing something other then grinding out levels. That way when you add an expansion you dont force everyone to dump all that gear they worked to get. For the longest time I was keeping my memorable weapons and armor I had gotten in my bank because each piece had a fun story or memory attached to it. The level 70 and 80 gear just seemed like a grind of raids constantly, I dont have a fun cool story, maybe the first time we cleared something or on the rare occasion that something crazy happened but most of the time it was just killing the same simple bosses over and over in hopes for gear or for tokens to get gear. None of it really matters because in a few months they level cap will be raised and everything you just got is utter junk that you will vendor or de. How does that not bother anyone else but me lol
I disagree here. They are becoming more and more accessible but far from challenging. I think complicated is a better description for WoW raiding these days. If you can learn where to stand or not to stand, when to run left/right, when its safe to cast and when its not, you can easily defeat any WoW encounter on heroic mode. Gone are the days when you had to be exceptionally skilled in your class. We no longer see wipes because a player used the wrong ability or a healer had to pick who to heal and who to let die because they just couldnt keep up with healing everyone...now its about wiping because some random generated spike comes out of the ground or someone hasnt spent enough time rehearsing running back and forth between the waves of acid. Its all well and good that Blizzard wants everyone to be able to access content, but it would be nice if they brought back the aspects that actually made raiding challenging, not complicated, at least for the heroic versions.
Most of the mechanics in the encounters are the same as have been used in other fights from the last expansion. One can only come up with so many new ways to make players wipe. And since when does knowing when to cast and not to cast, and knowing where to stand, not constitute skill? The vast majority of people I played with outside of my hardcore guild had a problem mastering even those points. And the reason that healers couldn't keep every one up before was because of an empty mana bar, not because of skill. I think being able to react quickly is a better test of skill than watching a blue bar tell you whether you can heal or not.
Let's take pallies as an example. In The Burning Crusade, they had two heals: Flash of Light and Holy Light. Spam, spam, spam, spam, spam, the occasional Divine Protection, Lay on Hands, or Divine Intervention when it was needed, win. That was a pallie's job. Fun? No. Now, in addition to those two abilities, they have Beacon of Light, Holy Shock, Sacred Shield, and other situational abilities that they need and use (anyone who actually plays a pally, correct me if I'm wrong on any of those points). A lot of other two button classes have had their skill caps raised, been given more abilities to use, and can't get away with spamming the same thing over and over anymore.
Hi,
Thanks for the update info.
I will have to take another look at WoW. I dont recall what part of the world I was in but never got very far any of the times I played it. I think my highest toon was only level 12. Im sure I never made it to the areas where the improved graphics are.
This is more than enough to make me want to try it again. I cant get into any of the MMos Ive tried lately, and really did find the game play good in WoW Im just fussy about good graphics.
Thanks again!
I've made 5 level 70s and 3 level 80s, that grind just gets old and I've been there since release and I know how much easier the leveling has gotten but if they want to make the leveling so easy each expansion why not just not add levels and add content? AQ style new skills perhaps, if you want the new skills or talent points its a earn it doing something other then grinding out levels. That way when you add an expansion you dont force everyone to dump all that gear they worked to get. For the longest time I was keeping my memorable weapons and armor I had gotten in my bank because each piece had a fun story or memory attached to it. The level 70 and 80 gear just seemed like a grind of raids constantly, I dont have a fun cool story, maybe the first time we cleared something or on the rare occasion that something crazy happened but most of the time it was just killing the same simple bosses over and over in hopes for gear or for tokens to get gear. None of it really matters because in a few months they level cap will be raised and everything you just got is utter junk that you will vendor or de. How does that not bother anyone else but me lol
TBC was release 2 years and some months after Vanilla WoW, and Wrath was released 1 year and 9 months after TBC. How is that raising the level cap every few months? Blizzard releases new content patches every 4-6 months, but that is not raising the level cap. That is adding new content just like you want. People have complained before that they don't release content fast enough. Also if you want to grind for gear, you should try for the Legendary Mace, Val'nyr, Hammer of Ancient Kings, or the ilvl 272 cloaks from ToC. Those are both extremely difficult to get and I am sure you would remember those for some time to come.
And besides you could look at it this way. Instead of seeing new gear as destroying old memories, look at is as creating new ones. Life moves forward, and so does World of Warcraft. When you go from high school to college, you're not like, damn, all that time and all those memories from moving up in high school are gone, you say, I have a chance to make some new memories in college. How is that much different than what you are describing?
@Babylon9000, glad I could make you reconsider, and if you need anymore convincing, go to the official game website and check out the screenshots on the Cataclysm expansion page.
Most of the mechanics in the encounters are the same as have been used in other fights from the last expansion. One can only come up with so many new ways to make players wipe. And since when does knowing when to cast and not to cast, and knowing where to stand, not constitute skill? The vast majority of people I played with outside of my hardcore guild had a problem mastering even those points. And the reason that healers couldn't keep every one up before was because of an empty mana bar, not because of skill. I think being able to react quickly is a better test of skill than watching a blue bar tell you whether you can heal or not.
Let's take pallies as an example. In The Burning Crusade, they had two heals: Flash of Light and Holy Light. Spam, spam, spam, spam, spam, the occasional Divine Protection, Lay on Hands, or Divine Intervention when it was needed, win. That was a pallie's job. Fun? No. Now, in addition to those two abilities, they have Beacon of Light, Holy Shock, Sacred Shield, and other situational abilities that they need and use (anyone who actually plays a pally, correct me if I'm wrong on any of those points). A lot of other two button classes have had their skill caps raised, been given more abilities to use, and can't get away with spamming the same thing over and over anymore.
I guess we will just have different views of what player skill is then. If you are a healer with an empty mana bar, it is most likely due to inefficient spell casting. I would not consider a player who just spams, spams, spams a heal then runs out of mana before the fight is half way over skilled. Empty mana bars are a very quick indicator of someone doing something wrong. I can understand wanting to have quick reaction times, but WoW has never been a twitch based game. IMO knowing when and how to use the proper spells should have more impact on the raid outcome than juking left and right.
I dont even want to get started talking about Paladins. Hybrids that can heal, tank, and DPS just as well as the non-hybrids is a whole other debate.
the problem is fanboys dont let anyone else have their opinions lol they hate because everyone doesnt love what they love
Sorry I am not trying to be a fanboy, I am just trying to maintain a discussion here. I respect your opinions, and I am just trying to counter them with opinions of my own. Sorry if in the process I come across as pushy or disrespectful, that is not the intent.
I really did love wow for years, I started at launch and played up to a month or so into bc, then came back for wotlk and played for a long time but to me at least, the raids aren't as challenging to me other then trying to get past all the poorly geared players trying to do raids that are well over their gear allows them. But I know they will raise the level cap again and possibly again after that, you never know. And it hard for me to spend all my spare time grinding for gear just to know its going to be taken away from me. I enjoy content but at what cost, whats the point other then achievements or to do any dungeon under level 80 dungeons? I just find it silly to have all those dungeons useless now. Why would it hurt to just leave the level system alone and add char .....
just realized I dont think I care enough about this game to continue talking about it lol I just gotta learn to stay away from the wow forums cause its just more talk about how much I dislike the game and how dedicated many of the subscribers are heh Enjoy your game
i find the anti-fanbois to be supremely entertaining.
seriously? you want an expansion that doesn't make you replace your gear? you know damn well if blizz did that you'd be here complaining that there was nothing new for you in the expansion instead.
replacing gear is great but replacing it with crappy greens you find as world loot is quite sad when your talking about an item you may have raided for a hundred times for a month, replacing it with another raid item that you worked for is perfectly normal
Trying to get 40 people online to raid together and spending more than 2 days a week in a dungeon is hardcore. I am a WoW player still, and I love the game, but raiding BC and on is pathetic.
What's the difference between a real mmorpg player and a regular video gamer?
One actually cares about role playing and the other just wants to 'beat' the game (stupid because mmorpgs are never-ending storylines).
After reading the comments, I found more regular video gamers than mmorpg players. That's the problem. If you're going to play WoW (or other mmorpg), make sure you don't get too attached to your item stats. Add a little role play in your journeys.
I leveled a rogue to 53 without getting the Dual-Wielding Skill and it was a blast. The rotations were slightly different and it made me get more attached to my rogue in a RP-kind of way. Sure there are instances and quests along the way but they never stopped me from doing personal quests like stalking this paladin and making him aware that he's not safe. We fought numerous times and he even made a post about our fun little side-story in the forums. No loot, no big monsters, no instanced arena, no epic loot. Just plain old epic PvEvP fun.
WoW is all about loot? The best and most fun players in the game use PvE clothes (ie RP dress, costumes, sticks) to get away from all the mindless raid grinds to go back to the fun part of WoW. They even PvP and PvE with RP clothes on.
If you really want to play WoW like how it's supposed to be played (as a mmorpg), better get your RP on because you're in for a big surprise if you really think you can beat the game just having epic loot.
and if you still need the most epic loot to beat someone in PvP (epeen-related), then you're just bad at WoW. Cancel.
Good article. WoW is a fun game. Polished. Raiding is interesting for a certain time.
But I expect now more from an MMORPG than just an item treadmill with raiding/pvp.
But not giving out greens causes another problem. If they did not give the uber greens then people would say the content was too hard and that the game is just catering to the 30% or so that has the uber gear. Try doing the expansions in just blues or greens from the content before. Now if they just lowered the monsters to the level of the old blues then that 30% would whine that there is no new content for them because it is too easy. So instead they make mobs to the level of the first teir of raid armor from before and give out greens to bring up those that did not raid the previous content. So the raiders have content that is not too too easy and those that did not raid can still compete in the beginning areas.
I think my idea of content and yours is quite different
I know the franchise isn't dead for crying out loud. Warcraft Forever, etc. I'm talking about wow 1.0 or whatever it goes down in history as. Next gen wow which includes blizzards next gen mmo gameplay, much better graphics--a new game, not exp.--is what people are demanding. They are not upgrading graphics. Adding shadows is hardly an upgrade and I don't see much upgrading for future expansions based on that engine. Advertise aion... please, your comment was half way intelligent before that.
The 3.3 patch won't fix raids.
Blizzard has been slapping bandages on this game mechanic that's a holdover from old school MMORPGs for how many years? And spent how much money on it because Kaplan and Chilton are old school radiers? And as the article points out they still haven't gotten it right.
Plus this is Blizzard, arguably one of the best game developers in the industry, and they can't make it work. They'll keep trying to fix raiding forever and they won't be able to make something that actually functions in the modern MMORPG market.
Dinosaurs died out for a reason. Raiding need to make fundamental changes and evolve into something new, something that old raiders probably would not even recognize as raids.
I agree that there needs to be something new.
Raiding is always fun at first, but as others said, it really does suck to have to run the same instance over and over for months. Problem with WoW in my opinion is, once you get 80, gear up for few weeks, and then your character has absolutely nothing to work for outside of raids.
WoW is pretty much a raiding game - that's it. That's what all the content is focused on. I hate the fact that my main char has nothing worthwhile to do unless there is a raid - therefore the only time I even log in, is when there is a raid. As soon as its over, I log out. This makes it feel more like a job, and less like a game, which ruins the fun for me. Especially once it sinks in that the only reason you are "working", is so that you can "work" some more.
Before anyone mentions it... Sure you "can PvP", but their PvP has declined (and is still declining) because its made for PvE with PvP added, not the opposite - and to make both PvP and PvE work, you need to balance the characters around PvP and then balance the NPC's around the characters.
Also, sure they added 5-man content in the patch, but take 5man ToC - if you were raiding before they added ToC, you didnt need any of that gear anyway. So any character that is not a new character will still not need to run any 5mans. The 5-man content is not "endgame" content, and thats the problem.
All the "endgame" content is raids, and that kills the game for me... no variety. WoW is awesome while you have the variety of multiple things to do, but once its all raids... boooring.
There are lots of things to do in the games besides raids. I hope I don't get flamed for making suggestions as to what people could do for fun. Like one guy said earlier, you could actually do some RP in an RPG. You could make a twink with some friends. You can raid capital cities. You can go around taking screenshots of some of the better looking areas of the game. You can look for all of the many easter eggs that Blizzard has placed in the game. You can do the fishing contest in Booty Bay, and soon the one in Kal'uak that they are adding in the next patch. The game doesn't have to boil down to raids, there is lot's more than that available to do. As soon as you make the game all about gear and raids, then there really is nothing you can do to have fun if you are ever disappointed at one point. As I pointed out, there are flaws in the system, but no one can please everyone, and if you have a problem, you can make suggestions as to what can be done better.
Those are fun things for some, not so much for myself. I have friends slaving away daily trying to get their 100th mount...just so they can get a free 101st mount even though you can only ride one at a time. If those type of activities actually progressed my character I wouldnt mind doing them, but I dont enjoy spending days or weeks collecting vanity items. If WoW would ever come out with alternate abilities, that might actually give me a valid reason to continue playing my toon between instance lockouts.
Note that I said theres nothing to do "to work for" besides raids. That means there is no reward or anything to gain from it make it worth doing.
The fun for me (and many others) in RPG's is progression, and if you are doing random things that you dont get any sort of reward or progression from, it's just not fun to do. If I was playing a console RPG, I'd be doing it for teh story the first time, and the 2nd time I would do it to make sure I dont miss any secrets, and possibly play thru different story paths if it is a non-linear game. But once you found all those secrets and have nothing else to do to progress anymore, it's time to move on to a new game.
What you are suggesting is similar to saying, I could just run heroics for fun. The first few times I ran each heroic they were fun, but eventually the only reason to keep doing them was for progression. Once people dont need anything from heriocs anymore, you rarely (if ever) see them running a heroic anymore - the only people I know who still run heroics only do the daily heroic once a day for the triumph badges. But at this point I get more triumph badges then trophies anyway, so I dont even bother doing them anymore.
Character skills dont have any form of progression outside raid, gear has no progression outside of raid, and money well... just isnt neccessary. All the money you need is to buy consumables for the next raid... Once you get to raids there is no other form of progression past it, and that's the problem.
I know some people may have "fun" doing things just for the hell of it, but in RPG games, I do it for the progression (I know many others feel the same way as well - as I mentioned earlier, that's why probably 90% of the people who have gear dont bother doing heroics anymore). If I want fun without progression, the thing I like to do in RPG's is PvP (if available) - but the PvP in WoW is so dissapointing at this point that it's not fun for me anymore either.
For game development in RPG's, the rule to live by has always been "risk vs reward". But if there are no worthy rewards outside of raid, that is the sign of a problem. At this point, 5man content not only does not have rewards, but does not have the "risk" either, which signifies another problem.
Note that I said theres nothing to do "to work for" besides raids. That means there is no reward or anything to gain from it make it worth doing.
The fun for me (and many others) in RPG's is progression, and if you are doing random things that you dont get any sort of reward or progression from, it's just not fun to do. If I was playing a console RPG, I'd be doing it for teh story the first time, and the 2nd time I would do it to make sure I dont miss any secrets, and possibly play thru different story paths if it is a non-linear game. But once you found all those secrets and have nothing else to do to progress anymore, it's time to move on to a new game.
What you are suggesting is similar to saying, I could just run heroics for fun. The first few times I ran each heroic they were fun, but eventually the only reason to keep doing them was for progression. Once people dont need anything from heriocs anymore, you rarely (if ever) see them running a heroic anymore - the only people I know who still run heroics only do the daily heroic once a day for the triumph badges. But at this point I get more triumph badges then trophies anyway, so I dont even bother doing them anymore.
Character skills dont have any form of progression outside raid, gear has no progression outside of raid, and money well... just isnt neccessary. All the money you need is to buy consumables for the next raid... Once you get to raids there is no other form of progression past it, and that's the problem.
I know some people may have "fun" doing things just for the hell of it, but in RPG games, I do it for the progression (I know many others feel the same way as well - as I mentioned earlier, that's why probably 90% of the people who have gear dont bother doing heroics anymore). If I want fun without progression, the thing I like to do in RPG's is PvP (if available) - but the PvP in WoW is so dissapointing at this point that it's not fun for me anymore either.
For game development in RPG's, the rule to live by has always been "risk vs reward". But if there are no worthy rewards outside of raid, that is the sign of a problem. At this point, 5man content not only does not have rewards, but does not have the "risk" either, which signifies another problem.
I agree with you on all points here, which is why I left my first guild for one that was more raiding oriented, but I was just pointing those things out for people who said there was absolutely nothing to do for fun once you're done with raids. I only have 6 mounts, because I really could care less about them, and most of the time I have spent logged was either doing raids or something to prepare for a raid, because that's what I think is fun, too. I play console RPGs the exact same way that you do, I remember aiming for every single rare weapon in Final Fantasy Tactics, all the bonuses in Zelda games, and doing similar things in games like Fire Emblem and Wild Arms.
But I was just trying to point out the fact that while the raids can get old, Blizzard works hard each expansion and patch to try to create a raiding format that is enjoyable for everyone, and they will continue to change it and tweak it until they do. The fact that people are still unhappy with it proves that they need to continue working at it, and the fact that they keep changing it proves that they listen to your problems. As for the lack of different modes of advancement, tey can only make so much PvE content that is high in quality, progressive, and challenging on different levels. I have to admit that the heroics in TBC were more challenging and fun because of it, but I can't remember how many times I had a heroic called because it was to hard for people to beat in less than 3 hours. Now that you don't need raid gear to do Heroics, they are too easy. The PvP could use some work, but I am not a PvP person so I don't do it too often, and I have complained about the state of PvP in the game many times on the official forums.
I had a super strong PvE Raid Priest when TBC came out. My guild was above average and we cleared the first few new raids before I got so bored. It's the same thing over and over. The 40 man raids were awesome! Beating Molten Core then Blackwing Lair. It took skill and coordination on a large effort. Not to mention the pride when you got one of those epic items. It meant something, now it just seems like everyone can attain such high quality gear with half the effort.
WoW is a very good game...
or actually.. "was" a very good game.
Vanilla WoW overtook me like no other game has ever done since EQ/EQOA. I was hooked..
but the more popular it got.. the more I hated it. It stopped being an MMO and started to become the "MTV of MMOs"
They made everything easier, took out things that were challenging, and because it was so popular... the community was terrible. They always claimed that it was a game for "casual players". But, the truth is.. You need to play nearly every day for several hours to keep up with the Jones'. If you stop for a week.. you fall behind. And, by the time you DO actually make some ground in raiding and gear.. they up and change it or make you upgrade.
FFXI had it right in this dept. You could turn on the game at release.. or at present.. and almost all of the content is still just as viable.
I don't get that fuzzy feeling of amazement and exploration that I used to get when I played EQ.. I'm gonna attribute the crappy community to that.. it literally kills all immersion there could have been, It eventually drove me back to EQ2. I wish mmos were a niche genre again. Call me selfish.. but it was alot better when everyone didn't play.
WoW is a great game. Yes there is much room to improve and grow for years to come. The trick is keeping you base fans around as this happens. People get bored quick it seems some quicker than others.
I know some that have left the game to go try the new kid on the block "Aion". Some will be back some won't. Aion becomes PvP after a certain level. It is not a choice it is a fact. For those that like open PvP then they will stick with it if they like the game. I understand it has a drawing effect like EQ and WoW from the start. WoW has become boring for many of its base and long term fans. Outside of raiding there is the dailies that many get tired of and farming; which many get tired of as well.
As for WoW's graphics. No they may not be as real as some may be used to. But if it was required for everyone to have costly graphic cards to play the game then I am sure the player base would diminish. Not everyone can afford those top gaming computers. Thus you can set settings to fit your system. Nice touch I think since I recently had issues with my graphic card and if I had not been able to lower all those setting I would not have been able to play until I could get a new card. It may have been a drag but I could still play. This is much different than EQ was when I played it. EQ required and update to your graphic card and computer pretty much with each expansion they released or you couldn't even play. Then there was the problem of having one that was compatable with the game. It would not run well or at all with many cards out there. This made the game just far too costly to continue with for many.
My big fear with WoW is the PvP it seems to be aiming at. I am not a big PvP fan. Don't get me wrong I don't mind PvPing from time to time, my choice of course. If I wanted to PvP all the time then I would play on a PVP server not a PVE one. I want that choice to be mine. However, since the need for arena points as well as other BG points I have not been so inclined to PvP much. It was my soul means of gearing my hunter when I was unable to raid and to get better gear I did BG's and very little arena.. I have not even cared to PvP since I have to have arena points to get the better gear. I hate arena and find it more of a stress factor than fun. Even back then when I did do it some the matches were not balanced with people around the same gear level and score. Many times were faced toons with superior gear to ours. That was a lost battle from the beginning. Like I said I have not ventured there since the changes. Not worth my time nor my nerves. The game should be fun not stressful.
There is no way Bliz is going to make everyone happy. That is a fact. Changes can cost them accounts or it can win them accounts. Either way there is never going to be a time when everyone is going to be happy. It seems so far Bliz has found something that keeps both sides happy or unhappy. Even some that are bored and tired of the same rinse and repeat. Just like the stupid drops on the World Events bosses. I am sure there is a mount out there somewhere from the HH and the Brew guy but rare is not the correct use of the drop rate. It should say supper/extremely rare. Just like many of the other drops within the game.