Originally posted by heartless

Originally posted by Eir_S

Originally posted by bcbully

wow I said the same thing above this post. When people talk about animations, chars are immediately what I picture... This is why I think GW2's animations are lacking for the most part, oh and smoke all over the place anytime something uses an ability.

Have you seen Archeage's animations?  The race that gets down on all fours to run is way worse than the Charr.  Their animation looks like a full sprint, yet they move the same speed as everyone else.  It's like Tom and Jerry on a treadmill.

I'm honestly not sure what bully is talking about. GW2 has some of the best animations I have seen in an MMO. Even the Charr. I think he's just nitpicking.

I feel the same, Played mostly only norn for bwe 1 & 2 and the animation looked really good. I mean my norn was huge. Most humans were waist high. I almost even felt like I could feel him move, his huge weight coming down with each step. It even looked like it was an effort to stop because of his huge mass (I know that's what she said).

Pretty good attention to detail if you ask me.

Oh and Hazmat suit for the win. whenever someone asked me where to get it i would tell them that it was a reward for soloing the sleeping one from monster slayers quest. good luck =P

I know his reputation, but I was trying to give him the benefit of the doubt there.  I'm just saying if you have a problem with GW2's animations, just look.... well, everywhere else.  SWTOR.  TSW.  Archeage.  There's bad animation in every game.

Originally posted by Xobdnas

From all of the polls ive been seeing over the interweb it appears the 2 above races are very unpopular despite having some of the most aesthetic detail. I think this is due to the large size and, more importantly, the fact that they feel like they move in slow motion. I was set on rolling one of each but after beta have 0 desire to play either, and it looks like im not alone. Anet should consider reworking run animations at the very least. I tried making the shortest of both races but the run was the same despite the height. Its sad to have to ignore 2 uber tough looking races for such a small detail. Of the 2 i would say norn's ice skating run is the more serious issue. I know they are from the north, but they dont have that much ice.

Just because you don't like them doesn't mean everybody dislikes them, it's even okay if the majority prefer not to. I don't like big races and I never have, no reason that should change now.

The animations aren't bad because you don't like them, I don't like them but they sure as hell ain't bad. There's taste and preference and then there are facts.

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Originally posted by Sideras

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Originally posted by Xobdnas From all of the polls ive been seeing over the interweb it appears the 2 above races are very unpopular despite having some of the most aesthetic detail. I think this is due to the large size and, more importantly, the fact that they feel like they move in slow motion. I was set on rolling one of each but after beta have 0 desire to play either, and it looks like im not alone. Anet should consider reworking run animations at the very least. I tried making the shortest of both races but the run was the same despite the height. Its sad to have to ignore 2 uber tough looking races for such a small detail. Of the 2 i would say norn's ice skating run is the more serious issue. I know they are from the north, but they dont have that much ice.

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Just because you don't like them doesn't mean everybody dislikes them, it's even okay if the majority prefer not to. I don't like big races and I never have, no reason that should change now.

The animations aren't bad because you don't like them, I don't like them but they sure as hell ain't bad. There's taste and preference and then there are facts.

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Thats what no one is getting, i love norn top to bottom. Tatts, viking, lore, etc, but cant get over the ice skating run, sad for me.

Originally posted by c-tray

Originally posted by heartless

Originally posted by Eir_S

Originally posted by bcbully

wow I said the same thing above this post. When people talk about animations, chars are immediately what I picture... This is why I think GW2's animations are lacking for the most part, oh and smoke all over the place anytime something uses an ability.

Have you seen Archeage's animations?  The race that gets down on all fours to run is way worse than the Charr.  Their animation looks like a full sprint, yet they move the same speed as everyone else.  It's like Tom and Jerry on a treadmill.

I'm honestly not sure what bully is talking about. GW2 has some of the best animations I have seen in an MMO. Even the Charr. I think he's just nitpicking.

I feel the same, Played mostly only norn for bwe 1 & 2 and the animation looked really good. I mean my norn was huge. Most humans were waist high. I almost even felt like I could feel him move, his huge weight coming down with each step. It even looked like it was an effort to stop because of his huge mass (I know that's what she said).

Pretty good attention to detail if you ask me.

Oh and Hazmat suit for the win. whenever someone asked me where to get it i would tell them that it was a reward for soloing the sleeping one from monster slayers quest. good luck =P

Very good point. A lot of the animations really do a great job conveying the mass of the character. Norn feel like they are powerful in the stride and their combat animations. Charr feel animalistic with the brutal, wild swings and their running. The Asura are my absolutely favorite though, as their big head causes them to lose their balance. Humans and Sylvari are the only ones that feel average, which would make sense, since they are sort of like the middle ground between the big races and the small one.

The attention to detail in this game is unbelievable at times. I mean, pistol shots have a "casing hitting the ground" sound effect which actually changes based on the type of ground you're standing on. It boggles my mind sometimes and really shows the love of developers for their game.

Originally posted by Vesavius

Originally posted by IstrebiteI

2 Selenite

Hitboxes are the same? So, if an Asura stands in front of Charr, and i click on Charr's head, i'll select an Asura?

 

I'll try to illustrate:

	Charr					<-- Click here		Me
	Charr							Me
	Charr			Asura				Me

 

So you're saying that in this situation i'll select an Asura instead of Charr, since his hitbox for the purpose of checking if cursor is pointing at him is the same size as that of a charr?

 

 

You seem to be assuming that the hit box for the asura is the size of the char model..?

The hit box is smaller then the char, and bigger then the asura.

 

no Anet dev have siad that size of the hit box is the same for all char and has nothing to do the the size of the char

=========            =========

|                  |            |    Charr     |

|                  |            |                  |

|                  |            |                  |       <----- Hit Box

|                  |            |                  |

|    Asura     |            |                  |

=========            =========

Originally posted by terrant

Well, the hitbox is the same for every race. So that Norm is as easy to target as an Asura.

 

The motion thing is somewhat true, due to the way they animate. But if you side by side with another race, you'll realize they're the same.

 

Probably aestehtics are the biggest reason any lack of for Charr popularity though. People gravitate to the pretty races. Oh, and also, CHar females aren't exactly...feminine. Which is awesome. I know why the devs chose that and I agree with them. But it won't appeal to some people. Oh well.

I think you hit the issue on the head with your first statement. Those that PvP think these two races are too big but have not read as you and I have that the hit boxes are the same.

Simply for those of the uninformed the hit box is the area of a character model that will acknowledge that you are hitting them. For the Norn and Char this is more center mass while for the Asura it is more of  head shot as you look at them for example.

I personally plan on having a Norn as my main, but I must also add I do not forsee playing PvP any time in the near or distant future.

Originally posted by MercAngel

no Anet dev have siad that size of the hit box is the same for all char and has nothing to do the the size of the char

Actually they did http://www.guildwars2junkies.com/tag/hitbox/

Originally posted by MercAngel

Originally posted by Vesavius

Originally posted by IstrebiteI

2 Selenite

Hitboxes are the same? So, if an Asura stands in front of Charr, and i click on Charr's head, i'll select an Asura?

 

I'll try to illustrate:

	Charr					<-- Click here		Me
	Charr							Me
	Charr			Asura				Me

 

So you're saying that in this situation i'll select an Asura instead of Charr, since his hitbox for the purpose of checking if cursor is pointing at him is the same size as that of a charr?

 

 

You seem to be assuming that the hit box for the asura is the size of the char model..?

The hit box is smaller then the char, and bigger then the asura.

 

no Anet dev have siad that size of the hit box is the same for all char and has nothing to do the the size of the char

 

 

=========            =========

|                  |            |    Charr     |

|                  |            |                  |

|                  |            |                  |       <----- Hit Box

|                  |            |                  |

|    Asura     |            |                  |

=========            =========

I disagree, its not about the hitbox size, but about the visuals. I will taget that which i will see, and all i see is the targets size. I just cant see an asura behind a Norn, so i will automatically target the Norn.

Originally posted by Lord.Bachus

Originally posted by MercAngel

Originally posted by Vesavius

Originally posted by IstrebiteI

2 Selenite

Hitboxes are the same? So, if an Asura stands in front of Charr, and i click on Charr's head, i'll select an Asura?

 

I'll try to illustrate:

	Charr					<-- Click here		Me
	Charr							Me
	Charr			Asura				Me

 

So you're saying that in this situation i'll select an Asura instead of Charr, since his hitbox for the purpose of checking if cursor is pointing at him is the same size as that of a charr?

 

 

You seem to be assuming that the hit box for the asura is the size of the char model..?

The hit box is smaller then the char, and bigger then the asura.

 

no Anet dev have siad that size of the hit box is the same for all char and has nothing to do the the size of the char

 

 

=========            =========

|                  |            |    Charr     |

|                  |            |                  |

|                  |            |                  |       <----- Hit Box

|                  |            |                  |

|    Asura     |            |                  |

=========            =========

I disagree, its not about the hitbox size, but about the visuals. I will taget that which i will see, and all i see is the targets size. I just cant see an asura behind a Norn, so i will automatically target the Norn.

But if the Asura was in front of the Norn even though you cant see him - Well then you are selecting the Asura anyway, if I get this straight?

Im in a big dilemma. Rogue shoulderpads looks stupid on a Norn. But a Human's gear is allmost unnoticeable. You will never notice what shoulders etc a Human has because he is so tiny and all (from a Norn's view that is). Plus the evil racial armor the Norn has rocks every other armor set in the whole game.

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg42/Intui/random/GW2GDCCharactersWallpaper1920x1200.jpg

Norn gear just looks too evil so I cant let it go off any of my chars. I know a Rogue/engineer/whatever else might look a little silly being that high. But come on... That gear just screams "pure evilness", which I enjoy in games.

However the one in the lower left corner... I hope Norn necro can get that scythe too :P

I do tend to find the slow run animation speed to be a bit annoying with large races in any game. The Norn I have played are all close to the shortest possible and the sense of running in slow motion did bother me... for maybe 30 minutes. Then I adjusted to it and it actually did seem to do a good job at conveying the size of the character.

I believe we tend to think of all characters as being "normal sized" when we play them, until something enters the screen that puts the character's size in context. When I first played a Norn in a BWE, I didn't think they were really very big at all, until a Human showed up in the Norn starting zone and looked like a child in comparison. Taking a short human to the Charr starting area also showed a bigger contrast that I expected and I felt very small running around with groups of Charr!

I think the rate at which the legs move is actually perfect for providing a que that conveys the size of your character. It just feels wierd when compared mentally to what we expect for a human sized being. The mind can be very adaptable, though, so there is a good chance that if you stick with it, you'll find it stops bothering you after not much time at all.

I think both races have a lot to offer and even if they are under-represented in people first choices, I think they will see more play as time goes on and people look to experience the game and story from the perspective of various races. Some of my favorite lower level Dynamic Events are in the Norn lands and when I joined a Charr friend for some of his personal story, I thought that element of the Charr was very well done and worth a play.

The only issue I noticed was the largest norn bodytypes, and I assume char as well, had some issues with getting up the tiny planks for the exploration challenges.

My norn warrior had to basically put his feet on the air on either side of the plank to get on it. Took a little getting used to. I think that after logging some real day to day hours in everyone will get used to how their characters move.

Other than that small issue I don't really see any problems.

I do not like tall or big characters but I liked the Charr storyline best in the beta weekends so my main will be a Charr. I also like the way they run on all four limbs. Then too I like tails. LOL. I guess I am just an animal at heart and the Charr look more animal than human. 

The Charr I didn't mind so much, but the Norn definitely bugged me.  I understand they're moving at the same rate as the other races, but that equates to them doing a "slow run", which made me feel like I was taking ages to get anywhere.  Perception is important.

The other issue I had with the Norn was that they're so big, even zoomed out all the way, that I felt way too close to my character.  I kept wanting to scroll out more, but couldn't.  With my human character I felt like I could zoom far enough away to be comfortable again.

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Originally posted by Wyrd01
The Charr I didn't mind so much, but the Norn definitely bugged me.  I understand they're moving at the same rate as the other races, but that equates to them doing a "slow run", which made me feel like I was taking ages to get anywhere.  Perception is important.

The other issue I had with the Norn was that they're so big, even zoomed out all the way, that I felt way too close to my character.  I kept wanting to scroll out more, but couldn't.  With my human character I felt like I could zoom far enough away to be comfortable again.

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I had that same issue. Hopefully I can adjust scroll out distance by launch. More importantly I hope they can get rid of the ice skate shuffle walk.

This thread is full of well thought out posts answering the OP, and also full of people ignoring them.

It's an issue of size and class balance and the animations are the way they are for a reason. After a short time playing most people should be used to the difference in animation. 

During BWE1&2 many people complained about the human starting area being underpopulated compared to the charr and norn areas. The internet polls showing human as the most popular don't match up with reality in this case, it was clearly not so during events where human/charr/norn were the only available choices.

If you can figure out a way to animate a norn so it looks like it's running at the same speed as an asura without changing the actual run speed or giving the asura turbo-speed legs, I'm sure Anet would be interested to hear about it.

About camera zoom: they don't want it to zoom out so far that players can see an unrealistic distance behind themselves, this makes PvP too easy, everyone would run with top-down camera panned back full to see behind themselves and over walls.