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Istaria: Chronicles of the Gifted General Article: The EI Catastrophe, Part I
When EI Interactive purchased Horizons, most thought it would be business as usual. Not so, as Carolyn Koh reports.
By Carolyn Koh on October 27, 2006
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Find out what has gone on since EI purchased Horizons from Tulga Games
Editor's Note: This is the first in a two part series by Staff Writer Carolyn Koh. The first part traces what has happened to Horizons and its community since EI Interactive took over control from Tulga Games.
EI Interactive (EI) acquired the game Horizons: Empire of Istaria from Tulga Games effective July 21, 2006. The agreement transferred ownership of all intellectual property and relevant technology related to Horizons to EI Interactive, as well as the rights to operate the title. The Evolution Engine, an MMORPG development platform built by Tulga Games, and Dark-World Online remains the sole property of Tulga Games. While the agreement did not transfer any employees of Tulga to EI Interactive, some Tulga Games employees in relevant fields - including David Bowman - remained temporarily on staff to assist the transfer to EI Interactive. Ed Andercheck informed us that he planned to interview many former Tulga Games developers for positions at EI Interactive and on July 27th, an announcement introduced the initial Game Management Team which included two employees from Tulga. The transition has proven anything but smooth. The first sign of trouble was seen publicly when EI attempted to change the problematic billing system they inherited. On July 28th, players of Horizons were informed via email & a posting on the forums that come 12:01am August 1st a new billing system would be implemented and they would be required to re-enter their billing information on or before their renewal dates. The news also announced: "This new billing update screen will provide you with a number of payment options to select from... secure via PayPal Subscription, Direct Pay, and Credit Card entry."Unfortunately as forum user Steelclaw informs us in the Istaria community forums, the new billing screen was anything but secure as they were not sent over an encrypted https* connection but a regular http connection. "As of right now, the billing info forms are NOT secure. They post to a http:// url, not a https:// url."This information was immediately picked up by Woody Hearn of GUComics and he issued a Consumer Advisory Warning. "For the protection of existing users, in the face these billing faux pas', GU feels a distinct obligation to advise any and all MMOG gamers to avoid Horizons (even the free trial) until such time as EI Interactive has the billing situation effectively handled and the danger eliminated."This was updated on August 3rd with notification from Game Media Networks Online Division Manager, Luca Mazzasogni, that the billing issue was only with the North American Servers (or those who played on them). Concerned players began talking about various issues with the new billing system, besides the fact that the screens were not secure. Through the past two weeks, the following issues were identified:
;)
EI's first response was to remove the insecure web pages and asked for players to fill in the credit card form online (including security code), print it and mail it to EI.
Predictably, players flooded the community sites with new threads and posts - many angry, many concerned, many inflammatory, all seeking communication from EI and resolution of the problem. Forum moderators tried to stem the flood but as they are player volunteers, were not successful without an official statement from EI Interactive. EI's reaction was to delete threads and eventually locked down the forums, requiring each entry to be approved by moderators before they were posted on the forums. On August 5th, EI informed their subscribers that a new billing system would be set up and apologized for the multi-step process: "Effective immediately, we will be implementing the first phase of a new integrated billing platform. All customer accounts setup prior to August 1st, through the Pay- By-Touch system are now re-enabled. Your customer information will be maintained on the same secure server as it was before. As a result of this change, you now need to do nothing to have your account status maintained exactly as it was previously established.They referred to the problematic billing system that Horizons came with, "...there were numerous issues with previous Horizons billing including a lack of flexibility, subscribers being prematurely or double billed and a lack of confirming emails. This was a substantial enough issue for E I Interactive to take action on as an early priority. We assure you that your service will not be interrupted and we apologize for any concern this multi-step process may have caused."This did not appease players as by then, they were seeking not an acknowledgement of the problems they were facing, but an apology and redress of their individual problems which included overdrawn bank accounts due to billing issues and the inconvenience involved in cancelling credit cards and getting new ones issued.
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;)
The only good thing that has come from any of this is David Bowman will most likely never work in this industry again. I think folks really can't appreciate the negative impact Bowman has had on the MMOROPG industry. One only needs to revisit AC 2 to realize what a consummate screw up DB is . I knew Horizons was doomed the moment they brought him on board and from what info I have been able to glean from a friend at Tugla Bowman has basically misrepresented what Tulga did and did not own and EI is now paying the price. I just hope the new owners are smart enough to bring charges of Fraud against this snake oil salesman.
I always knew Bowman was an Incompetent that basically achieved his position by stabbing co-workers in the back, but I was blown away when I found out just how royally he screwed up AC 2 and almost single-handedly ruined Turbine. When I look at the original design docs of AC2 and see those designs being implemented so well in WoW (Thanks to Mark Kern Formerly of Turbine/Microsoft) I am sickened. Anyone at Turbine will tell you that the Asherons franchise failure was due to the lies and thievery of one person David Bowman.
I honestly wish the best for Horizons new owners, they have purchased an MMO that was built on lies and deceit. The only saving grace is that small Polly-Anna like community that has so far stuck by this Titanic through thin and thinner.
of course i couldn't cancel, and my card was charged. posting, etc. didn't help.... :(
but, after emailing & waiting, the dear dr. cancelled the account and i did get a refund.
a good example of why silence from the devs/distributers hurts more than it helps. but the companies just don't seem to get it. my guess is, that noone wants to take responsibility in fear of loosing their job. sad.
Irrefutable fact is that billing was insecure for a number of days. Fact also is that their servers which stored all client information, including login information, credit card information, etc, was stored as a text file on a server which was known for being easily hacked. Whether it was actually ever hacked in to or not no one can prove. No one has stepped forward to say that future problems with unauthorized credit card transactions can be linked directly to EII's unsecure storage of this information, unfortunately.
As to the "vocal minority", I have been a part of that group since long before the sale. When Tulga ran the company, they not only listened to this minority, they responded to it. Not as we always wanted, of course, but they listened and responded. EII's response to the "vocal minority"? Gag orders. Anyone who speaks out against them in any way is immediately banned from the forums, and in most cases their very existance on the forums is completely removed. Every post ever made by Ophelea (Ms. Heckman in the MMORPG article) was removed from their forums, regardless of the content. EII so wanted to deny Ms. Heckman's claims that they have chosen to deny her very existance. I remember when each of my three children used to do this. If they didn't like what mommy or daddy was saying, they would close their eyes and plug their ears and pretend we didn't exist. Of course, my children out grew this by the time they were 4 years old. How unfortunate it is for the Horizons community that Mr. Andercheck and company seem to have not outgrown this method of interacting with people who disagree with them.
One clarification of fact I'd like to make regarding the article above. When Horizons was turned over to EII, the billing issues were nearly resolved. The billing issues they "inherited" were due to the need to become compliant with new Federal laws which the billing company for Horizons had until August 1st to put in place. Rather than continue with the company which was trying to become federally compliant, EII attempted to use their own billing system, which is why the problems in August started. At no time did EII attempt to consult with anyone from Tulga games, former employee or contracted, for help with resolving the billing system. While they can attempt to lay the blame on the Tulga employees and Gamersinfo.net, and there is nothing that anyone from either of those companies can do to prove that they were NOT contacted, you also will not find that EII has any record of when they DID contact them, or with what problems. Thankfully in the US people are innocent until proven guilty, so the need to provide evidence to support his claims falls on Mr. Andercheck.
I and many others were paying subscribers to Horizons when the transfer happened, and we tried to work WITH the new company in the same manner which we'd worked with Tulga for a long time prior to the sale. Rather than working with us, the management of EII chose to ban us from all forms of communication with them, and ignore our voices. Whether minority or majority matters little to me. The proof of how large a group of customers Mr. Andercheck is refering to when he says "the vocal minority" is in how subscriptions 3 months after the sale are. Perhaps the writer for the second piece could ask that question... though I strongly suspect I know the answer he/she will get already.
As I said, the proof is in actions, not words. :)
David Bowman did not sell Horizons, as he was not the owner. That decision was made by Chris Baker of CP Baker, who was the primary investor in Tulga Games. David actually tried to impress on EI what all went into running Horizons and urged them to hire the Tulga team members, especially critical personnel such as Smeglor and Amon. As far as I know, none of the critical personnel got even a single phone call from EI management. If David was trying to sabotage the purchase or mislead EI about something, why would he be trying to talk them into hiring critical staff?
One comment about Ed's statement on the billing issues:
"That is completely false, we have no log of any customer confidential information being accessed illegally."
It is not illegal to access an unsecured file. Their systems were not 'hacked' as they were not protected in the first place. They have no log of who accessed the file in question because they probably were not keeping such a log. However, the file was there, it was not secured in any way, and I know personally at least two people who accessed it at the request of one of the players who discovered the file and reported it to EI. Personal information entered by Horizons players was, indeed, stored in an unsecured file and was indeed viewed by members of the public. For EI to say it was not is a flat-out lie.
Let me stress once more that it is not in any way illegal for a member of the public to view the contents of an unprotected file on an unprotected, public area of a server. There is no security breach if there was no security in the first place.
BBB Reliability Report
The Better Business Bureau®
Serving Middle Tennessee
P.O. Box 198436
Nashville, TN 37219-8436
(615) 242-4BBB
www.gobbb.org
Enhanced Interactive Communications Corp
501 East Front Street
Butte, MT 59701
Telephone: (406) 299-9174
The BBB reports on members and non-members. If a company is a member of the BBB, it is stated in this report
BBB Definition:
report - A summary of activity reflected in a company's BBB file. Includes basic business background, BBB membership information, and Bureau complaint activity over the previous three years. Also reports may include any known government actions, advertising issues or other information that results from activity conducted by the BBB.
.
Principal: Dr. Raymond Rask, President
Customer Contact: Dr. Raymond Rask, President - (949) 705-6825
File Open Date: August 2006
BBB Membership: This company is not a member.
Additional DBA Names
EI Interactive
Principal Officer
Dr. Raymond Rask is the President of the company.
Customer Service Contact
Dr. Raymond Rask is the complaint contact person for this company and should be contacted at (949) 705-6825 before filing a complaint with the BBB.
Customer Experience
This company first came to our attention in August 11, 2006. We are attempting to develop information on the company. At the present time we do not have enough information to issue a report.
The Bureau develops a report on a firm based on inquiry or complaint activity. The information provided, however limited, is presented to assist you in your purchasing decisions or for any other purpose you deem relevant.
If you have information to assist the Bureau in developing a report, click here.
The BBB suggests you read and understand company promotional materials and contracts and check company references and licensing, where applicable.
Based on BBB files, this company has an unsatisfactory record
BBB Definition:
unsatisfactory record - A company has an "unsatisfactory business performance record" with the Bureau is based on the experiences reflected in BBB files. This file condition results when the company has failed to resolve or respond to complaints, repeatedly failed to respond or resolve issues in a timely manner, failed to resolve the underlying issues for a pattern
BBB Definition:
pattern - More than 2 complaints involving the same allegations usually within 12 months that are significant in relation to the company's size and volume of business.
of complaints, failed to honor their commitment to mediate or arbitrate disputes or honor mediated agreements or arbitrated decisions, failed to substantiate, modify or discontinue false advertising claims that are challenged by the BBB, or failed to discontinue unauthorized use of the BBB name and logo, a Federally protected trademark.
with the Bureau due to unanswered complaints.
When considering complaint information, please take into account the company's size and volume of transactions, and understand that the nature of complaints and a firm's responses to them are often more important than the number of complaints.
The Bureau processed a total of 9 complaints about this company in the last 36 months, our standard reporting period. Of the total of 9 complaints closed in 36 months, 9 were closed in the last year.
Billing or Collection Issues
BBB Definition:
Billing or Collection Issues - Claim alleging billing errors, unauthorized charges, or questionable collection practices.
No Response
BBB Definition:
No Response - The company failed to respond to the complaint.
3 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues.
Unpursuable
BBB Definition:
Unpursuable - The company cannot be located or is out of business.
5 - Company cannot be located.
Customer Service Issues
BBB Definition:
Service Issues - Claims of alleged delay in completing service, failure to provide promised service, inferior quality of provided service, or damaged merchandise as a result of delivery service.
BBB Definition:
Customer Service Issues - Claims alleging unsatisfactory customer service, including personnel's failure to provide assistance in a timely manner, failure to address or respond to customer dissatisfaction, unavailability for customer support, and/or inappropriate behavior or attitude exhibited by company staff.
No Response
BBB Definition:
No Response - The company failed to respond to the complaint.
1 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues.
Company Management
Additional company management personnel include:
Mr. Edward C. Andercheck - Chairman
Additional Addresses, and Telephone Numbers
Additional Addresses
1801 West End Avenue
Suite 110
Nashville, TN 37203
Additional Phone Numbers
(949) 705-6825
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Report as of October 27, 2006
Copyright© 2006 Better Business Bureau®, Inc.
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The information in this report has either been provided by the company or has been compiled by the Bureau from other reliable sources.
As a matter of policy, the Better Business Bureau does not endorse any product, service or company. BBB reports generally cover a three-year reporting period, and are provided solely to assist you in exercising your own best judgment. Information contained in this report is believed reliable but not guaranteed as to accuracy. Reports are subject to change at any time.
Yeah, EI is real big on communication lol. What a joke.
And to set the record straight, Mr. Bowman had nothing to do with the sale of the game until he was told by his boss, the owner, to work with the people at EII to support the transition. I believe if you look around on this forum and the Gamersinfo.net one, you'll see exactly how much Mr. Bowman knew about the sale and when. He made an offer to purchase the game himself which was turned down, in fact. That is how little control he had over the sale to EII. Sadly it is people such as yourself, martinj63, who are making this messy and should have a lawsuit brought against them for spreading... well... bullcrap.
Once.. long ago, I played it, but it was just too buggy for me.. *sighs* I do miss my Dragon though
Wow, just wow!
I feel so bad for all those people who would swear by Horizons and look at the poor thing now.
As a side note to mmorpg.com staff, this is by far the best piece of actual reporting that I've seen on this site in a LONGGGG time. Great job and I'd love to see more stuff long this, as well as more on this story in the future.
I concur! The staff is on the ball with this one. Keep 'em comin', boys
Why hasnt this level of investigation and reporting been done for what is the single biggest story of the last 2 years: SOE and the utter cluster*edit* that is SW:G?
Oh, I know why....
You are intimidated by the big boys, and don't mind picking on the little ones who aren't such a threat to your advertising budget. Instead, we get softball articles like these :
http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/874/SOEAGCBreakfastwithSOE.html
http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/817/SOEChrisKramerSeniorDirectorofCorporateComm.html
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/setview/features/loadFeature/324/gameID/6/from/features/StarWarsGalaxiesNGEInterviewwithCaseyKeefe.htm
My unborn son could hit those out of the park, and he isn't even conceived yet.l
I'd like to know where people somehow get the notion that MMORPG.COM is afraid to say anything bad about SOE? Because of advertising revenue? WHAT advertising revenue?!? Do you see one single ad from SOE here? If you do, please point it out. If you can't, then kindly think of another way to bash the staff here concerning SOE. Because I really don't think they are all too concerned about the ad money
For another thing, do they really need to write an article on a game company that has already been run through the ringer on every other site and by gamers on this site for those two+ years? Everyone knows all about the fiasco that is called SOE. However, not everyone is aware of the things these smaller games/developers are doing because they fall under the radar of most of the other gaming sites. You know what you'll see if MMORPG.COM does another article on SOE? "Oh, gee. Here we go again. Does anyone talk about anything else?". With the SWG current crowd supporting SOE and saying the bashing is a lie and the SWG Vets crowd screaming the NGE ruined their game and SOE needs to die. The same damn thing that's happened everytime SOE/SWG is mentioned here. THAT"S why they don't need to do an indepth article on SOE/SWG.
for trainwreck fans...
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/97610/page/3
has any game so good been so badly mismanaged?
There was an ad for EQ recently, and there was one before for an EQ2 expansion i beleive.
Ok, I'll grant you that. But compared to games that are advertised here for months at a time? The fact is SOE doesn't advertise here even a third as much as the rest of the games with ads here. And I doubt SOE pays more for their ads than anyone else. So the idea that MMORPG.COM is afraid of losing ad revenue still fails.
A big THANK YOU to MMORPG.COM for calling it like it is. I wrote an email to the fine folks here after I was scammed by EI and asked them to protect fellow gamers from this shady company and today they responded with this excellent report.
I loved the part where Ed Andercheck gets caught in a huge lie about not having secured the data and how he tried to fishtail his way out of it when they called him on the obvious lie. He goes on to spin the huge conspiracy theory that there is this big group of liars that are trying to discredit the game. Well he is partially right in saying that... the group is called EI.
Can't wait for part 2... go get 'em.
[quote]Originally posted by martinj63
[b][quote]
Bravo! True form of the David Bowman devotee, blame the fans and deny existence of any employee that speaks out against you. [/b][/quote]
Actually, I was in the Tulga offices as well, this past April. I don't recall meeting either of the people you mentioned. The former Tulga employees I spoke with didn't recognize the names, either. Is it possible these people worked for Artifact back in the David Allen era - like five or six years ago?
I was actually the person that posted the post in question.
I had called Pay-By-Touch after the public announcement was made by EI after the unsecured billing server was taken offline (The one where they stated they were rolling out "Phase 1" of their new billing system.. as if the unsecured server was never brought online). Anyway, Pay-By-Touch explained that the "Horizons Merchant Account" was closed.. and apparently there was a memo sent to the CSRs there to give a very basic response stating they had nothing to do with EI or Horizons.
I posted about this to the community site, and asked what was going on. Dr. Rask responded, blaming a lot of things on Tulga.
The reason why the post was deleted without any notice was that Dr. Rask made very libelous statements regarding Tulga and their involvement in the sale. When I brought up the issue that the unsecured billing servers violated several state commerce laws protecting consumer financial data, and prevent identity theft.. Dr. Rask consulted legal counsel. The lawyer on retainer for EI looked over the thread, and explained to Dr. Rask that his post was indeed -very- libelous, and recommended he post an apology and a "retraction" of his earlier comments.
Dr. Rask deleted the post instead.
Also, the date that Nagafen was introduced to the community and communication improved.. a lot happened that day. They also posted the email addresses for people to email to cancel their subscriptions.. they also announced Dyn and Amadan joining the EI team to work on Horizons.
It just happened that that was the day EI received a certified letter, from the Montana Attorney Generals Office.. Very formal, but very blunt and to the point.. Shape up or ship out.
That is the -ONLY- reason EI decided to get their rears in gear, and why everything all seemed to happen that day.
Coincidentially, myself and several others were banned from the community site.. I was, mainly because I was the first person to bring it to the attention of the AG office, and had been keeping them informed about EI. I was also very vocal on other sites and forums, informing other players who were being billed without consent, and no way to cancel, who to get a hold of at the AG offices. And also, my private inbox on the community site had several PMs from Dr Rask and others, including a copy of the "libelous" post (Dr. Rask CCed me the post to my private message inbox). So by banning my account, they effectively removed any access I had to those PMs (It did NOT prevent me from saving them, and print out hardcopies)
Overall, it was not something I -wanted- to do. I don't like drama.. but I could not sit around and watch people get financially hurt because of the ineptitude and incompetence of a few 'wannabe game developers'. One person, who lives in Australia.. was billed 14 times, for 1 account.. in under 2 weeks time. He was hit with overdraft fees for a good 10 of those, and had to close his account to get them to stop. EI refunded him the money they took, but not the overdraft fees.
So.. I did the morally right thing and alerted the authorities, and in turn EI started to improve. There is at least somebody from EI now talking to the community, and now that the billing is being handled again by PBT, customers now have a 1-800 number they can call to cancel.
All that comes at a cost. I am not able to get in contact with any of my friends, or be a part of the community that I once called 'home' for over 2 1/2 years. I've lost a lot of friends - not cause they don't like me for what I did, but because they don't know what happened or how to get ahold of me, and I can't get a hold of them.
It's sad that you can still be punished for doing the right thing...
I am very glad for this article.. Very concise, and true to the history of the last couple of months since the sale. There are a few minor things, such as the unsecure data being 'legal'.. which is not so in 14 states, including Montana and California, which have very strict "Identity Theft Prevention" laws on the books. But since that entails pretty deep knowledge about commerce laws to know what is considered legal and what isn't by the states, it's perfectly understandable for that to be an oversight.
People have made claims that EI has been trying to cover up their mistakes by rewriting history. The blantant denial by Mr. Andercheck that the unsecured billing server didn't put anyone's financial or personal data at risk, gives quite a bit of credence to such claims.
It is my hope, that with articles like this, future and prospective players will not get double and triple billed like others have before. Hopefully, the information in an article like this may help them get their issues resolved in their favor..
And also, I hope the rest of the MMO community is watching this.. ESPECIALLY developers and would-be developers. EI has, the past 3 months, been a SHINING EXAMPLE of what -NOT- to do, when dealing with a community, such as the one that once played Horizons.
-Menkure
Exactly and right now we have a couple Bowmanites and EI employees, doing damage control wherever they see this story being reported. Their pattern is a simple one. It is the same tactics Bowman used five months after the launch of Horizons when he finally crawled out from hiding under his desk after the single worst launch in MMORPG history.
I'm sorry they dealt you such a crappy hand Mekure, but I am glad that you helped to get the Attorney General involved, because what has transpired is criminal.
What needs to happen here is the indictment of Rask, Andercheck and Bowman they are equally as guilty and the have cost fans thousands of dollars. Just look at one example; one fan had 14 non -reimbursed overdraft fees 14 x over draft fees of 25 dollars is 350.00, 350.00 for a lame ass game that has never been functional and has amounted to a paid Alpha test. An example needs to be made here so other game developers stop and take notice of the consequences of lying and over hyping your product, the example must be a swift, and harsh action that ends with three con-men sitting in a prison cell.
This is one situation where, I think, SOE taking over could actually be an *improvement* to a game.
Though if they did, the first things they'd do:
- redo the entire battle system (it seems to be their favorite thing to do)
- Making leveling faster
- Removing the sub-classing and class-changing
- Making finding and completing quests trivial
- Dumb down the crafting
- Do whatever else they could to make it more like WoW
Oh wait.. actually I'm describing what they did to EQ2... My bad.
Seriously though... I think even SOE would be smart enough to stay the hell away from that rolling trainwreck.
I think Horizons needs to just... die. Seriously. Hasn't it been through enough? Just let it go... let it fade into history. I don't say this as a knock against Horizons because I actually played it for a time and thought it had alot of potential; I loved the crafting system. But seriously, this game has been on failing life-support for some time now, and people just don't want to pull the plug.
Yeah..it has nothing to do with the fact that both games has thousands of fans and a continually growing fan base. If GW continues to grow at its current rate it will catch up with the beloved WoW estimated 1.5-million subscriber base by Next summer.(1.5 million American subs that as been confirmed.... The nebulouse 7 mil Blizzard touts is Worldwide..... and has never once been confirmed by an impartial third party) Over half a million people currently play GW, and Nightfall was the most pre ordered game at gamestop in Sept (BC was a distant fourth)
EvE has been bringing in so many new players that CCP is having to deal with issues of how many people can one system hold? Given the size of a single system that is an enviable problem to have.
One would think that those are as valid reasons for praise than the pittance of revenue this sight might receive.
Yeah..it has nothing to do with the fact that both games has thousands of fans and a continually growing fan base. If
There were mistakes that TULGA made and there were mistakes that EII already has made. Of course.
But where is this game now? It is still alive. It is still fun to play. The European players who have had a rough deal with GN shall get a chance to move to a new US shard that will be created for them. This game might just have a future after all.
Unless enough people shall be convinced otherwise thus leading to a self-fulfilling prophecy.
I cannot help but wonder at the motivation behind some of the hate-posts about the new owners -- to me it seems like the reaction of a rejected lover who wishes to destroy what he cannot have.
Lmao, so all 15 subscribers got a messed up billing system?
Big whoop, thats what you get for playing this crap game.
Since when are sales figures supposed to mirror game reviews ? Get high much ? Any game could hold 30 thousand players in a world thats 99.99 % empty space. Any game could do it if they wanted to. Let's give a medal for cramming people in a booth.
Roll on part two
Wow you are completely clueless aren't you?
Can you prove to me they're not? No you can’t, but since you insist on being an Asshat here are some facts; GW has had to expand its district base four times since factions launched , the sales demand is still such that Arena can still charge initial SMRP, and both prophecies and Factions is on the auto restock list of EB, and Gamestop. The only other MMORPG that is happening with that isn't an initial release is WoW.
But beyond that; drop in to GW on any night and you will see 70 to 80 active districts each district holds about as many as a WoW server, and unlike WoW you won't log in to find the server that just opened is now deserted because The developer is doing anything to cater to the ever dwindling user base.
Now, I am no GW fan fantasy MMOs aren’t my cup of tea, I play because a couple members of my family is into it, anywho GW is doing way better than most folks think, if not Arena would have dropped the Twice a year expansion scenario.
Now on to EvE little man.. I would suggest that you buy a clue about game design and server load management before talking out of your ass. EvE Client server architecture is far from a phone booth, making that correlation is akin to calling deep blue a calculator; and once again shows that you have zero clue about game design in general and MMORPG design in particular, in fact a game like EvE takes way more resources and cohesive topology than a game like EQ or yes even WoW simply because you are dealing with a 3d Environment that doesn’t have the limitations of Newtonian physics, further at any given time there are over 300k call commands from various databases per ship, that’s per ship Skippy, the average MMO might have 350 per toon. Of course I don’t expect you to grock that, just stick with the phone booth theory….that way your brain won’t hurt.info on their running costs and developing budget, casue as you said I'm a little man with little brain.
As far as the technological side of EvE, I made the comparison because as you see in the reviews, technology isn't exactly one of the criteria . Games fun and playability isnt judged on how many people can play on one server. That's something for tech-geeks to drool over not the average gamer sorry.
EvE has many fans, and I could understand why someone would give it an OK score. However the scores it recieves in many instances, as on this website, really go against reason. Game is hard to get into, it is very slow paced, alot of downtime, months to become competetive in the pvp aspect of it. These are all arguemnts against the good scores this game recieves. One more reason not to trust reviews of this site and many others. EvE constantly advertising on this site and the unimaginably good scores ti recieves doesnt exactly fill me with trust.
sorry... but EvE is a great game.. one of the best space games i've played.. and an awesome MMO..
Game isn't really all that hard to get into... plus i think the learning curve is one of the good ways to smooth out the player base.. anyways.. I never see large amount of downtime.. but i don't try to play 24/7. Also any good MMO should takes months to become competetive in PvP. Thats one of the strong points. And as for as being slow paced not really... you can get out there and go pirate hunting and PVE the hell outa that game from start..
now i do have to say that some the jumps take forever.. but thats just managment.. i've been able to keep my jumps to just a few hops..
I beleave that all the stuff you talkeb about is what people like about EVE..
The fact that it takes a little learning to get into it.. (not a WoW system where even the brain dead can play)
shit and it has some of the best player run owned and controled game space in any MMO. as a player corp (aka guild) you can take over intired sectors of space.
and many other things.. i can go one for hours about this.. hell just the tweaking of ships and how you combat things.. i myself like the stealth and distroy way...
as for as server issues and expanding them.. Hell you tell me any other MMO that supports 100's if not a 1000 people fighting in large battles.. i've been in space battles that have had 100's of people going at it for control over a sector that has great resources.. sorry but no other MMo offers this type of gameplay.. and that right there is what gives EVE it's high scores..
anyway thats my rant.
This is not surprising to see, before i was deployed to iraq i cancelled my subscription. (david bowmen, year one timeframe) upon returning a year later i found i had been charged every month during that year. sending emails to tulga did nothing, they shuffled me to IPAY and IBILL but after 3 months of ping pong customer service they referenced my case BACK to tulga/horizons. the next email i recieved, as mine was as colorful as i could make it, was from tulga, stating i had never cancelled and that they have as of this time cancelled my account as requested. the billing sites blaming the other one for the foul up, then turning on tulga for the scapegoat.
well i looked at the email and thought to my self, self, i didnt ask to cancel, i asked for a years refund, any letters sent to me indicated i had "just" then cancelled. sending the cancellation email from way back then never got any response from tulga. imagine that.
folks playing horizons back then will remember double/triple monthly billing, failed cancellations, failed customer support between ipay, ibill and tulga, it was quite the fiasco on the boards, many of the posts on the fraudulant billing deleted as fast as they got put on.
i since then (years later) settled with tulga and received 3/4 of my stolen money back. this note is to let folks know i am seeing the same thing happen, dont be fooled, bowman (in his consultant capacity) and tulga are in my eyes thieves not willing to help anyone but themselves. what this new company will do is anyones guess.
just a heads up and warning on horizons.
lol...
dude.. you ever heard of the word "subjective'? How about "personal opinion"?
That you have the nerve to first say in a previous post that the good reviews it gets are "beyond reason" and now saying Eve definitely isn't as good as the ratings it gets... talk about flying in the face of reason.
*You* don't like the game personally. *You* don't feel the game deserves those ratings. Those are *your* opinions. So perhaps *you* should learn to stay away from absolutes like "definitely isn't as good"... it's not as good in *your opinion*.
Obviously there are thousands of people who disagree with you.
Horizon's in and of itself had a beautiful idea that was originally destroyed by the publisher (atari I think it was though I may be mistaken). Tulga tried, unsuccessfully to make some of those ideas a reality but failed. The fact that EI would buy a game that was limping along, and then cause these kinds of issues says much about the corporate structure surrounding mmo titles. I hope that all new and old companies look at this, along with the actions of Sony last year and are able to not repeat the mistakes of the past.
dude.. you ever heard of the word "subjective'? How about "personal opinion"?
That you have the nerve to first say in a previous post that the good reviews it gets are "beyond reason" and now saying Eve definitely isn't as good as the ratings it gets... talk about flying in the face of reason.
*You* don't like the game personally. *You* don't feel the game deserves those ratings. Those are *your* opinions. So perhaps *you* should learn to stay away from absolutes like "definitely isn't as good"... it's not as good in *your opinion*.
Obviously there are thousands of people who disagree with you.
But, your shooting him down for his own opinion than, right? Makes sense to me.
Oh I love when people do this... completely and probably deliberately misconstrue what you say and then try to throw it back in your face.
Okay... Show me where in my post I tell him his opinion is wrong, or I "shoot it down" in your words?
... give up?
That's because I don't.
What I am telling him is that he's discrediting others' views by stating what is only his opinion as though it were fact.
Case in point:
"No game is perfect and Eve definetly isnt as good as the ratings it gets/reviews."
"definitely isn't as good as the ratings it gets" - I don't see anything in there resembling an "I think" or an "in my opinion", do you? No, he's stating it quite emphatically, using "definitely" to underscore that Eve is unquestionably not worthy of the reviews it receives.
What I am "shooting down", in your words, is the attempt to impose his views on others as though it were fact, and not his opinion. It's a disrespectful and ignorant way to be in an open message forum where everyone's views/opinions, if sufficiently supported, should be respected - or at least respectfully disagreed with. But of course, I realize this is the internet, where such things are seldom seen.
In my opinion, it seems as though he doesn't like the game and it bothers him that others do. That's too bad. But it's still only his opinion - no matter how strongly he feels about it.
Get it?
2. grammar
3. formatting
I didn't make these corrections to be a pain in the behind, but rather to show that even simple, individual sentences can be riddled with mistakes. Overall, the article in question was fairly well-written and balanced. While technical details are important in writing, they're just the vehicle with which the information is delivered. Carolyn's information was researched, balanced, and understandable. If she misplaced a semicolon, I think we can probably forgive her. Since most of the MMORPG.com editorial writers are volunteers and hobbyists rather than professional writers, it's not really expected that they'd have copies of Strunk & White's "Elements of Style" next to their computers. Cheers. =)
(P.S. I enjoyed the article, Carolyn. I was one of the former players who filed with the BBB, and it's nice to see the issues getting some coverage. I'd briefly played the game years ago and found it to be "okay," but not great. When the ownership changed, I went back to see if the game might have changed a bit as well. After realizing it hadn't, I then realized I couldn't cancel my account. There were no publicly listed phone numbers, none of the contact information on E.I.'s webpage was accurate, and when they eventually put up email addresses that could be reached, I had to file for cancellation three times in three weeks before getting a response.)
all these problems with billing and hacked server is sickening. this bowman character was always a bit shady.
looks like this was a quick way to gain some cash fast then worry about the chargebacks later. just this EI's actions and non-actions spell out SCAMMED. It development companies like this that make it really hard for the "little guys" to get any where in the mmorpg business.
I mean how dumb can people be to know how to program and design the code for a billing system but not know that info is over secure lines only? Such BS if you ask me. "oops lets us bill you 3 times today cause bob forgot to buy donuts for the office."
Luckily for me i left this game quickly after beta. it was so obvious where this was heading after release and they went bankrupt. To tell you the truth, spite all the bugs and content that was not in release there was still something about this game that i liked. though i would never give out my info to these #*@(*&(
"thanks for using our unsecure lines, we promise it was criminals who did the hacking, not us."
Wonder if they went and dumped all that cash into some stocks. what ever it is that was done, no matter what they say, this was all planned in advance. looks too smooth.... cough cough, ya right....
hmm so this is where most of the guys from age of mourning went to? dave caught a break with his porn sites and decided to pull some new stunts.
wonder how many times these type of companies can scam people with out any thing being done just cause its a video game in bankruptcy.
i beta tested horizons, and like many thought it showed great promise but did not live to expectations, it's sad to see it goes but it's not such a great loss to the industry.
i am however suprised by the turn of events as depicted in this article. if even half of the written turn of events is true i think lawsuits will be forthcoming in the future.
oh and on a final note, lay off the EVE/GW/WoW glorifing/bashing on this thread, not only they're totally out of context here, but they also reek of fanbois worshiping their game and snubbing all the others.
I can't believe a serious company would do such a retarded thing, this is beyond stupid. What a fraking bunch of noobtards. Please, everyone reminds me to stay clear of anything bearing the name of "Tulga" or "EI".
Bring down the hammer of justice on their bussiness practice!
PS: great coverage, MMORPG! We gotta expose more companies like these to what they realy are - greedy, incompetent and lying bunch of dirty bluecollar wannabeas.
I was a betatester for this game and it ...really really sucked!! There were more then the average beta problems in this game
Although the testers were in the beginning were very loyal the company never listended to any of the the comments they made. In the end I(and many with me) left the game.
I'm not suprised that the game is still not working.I'm not even suprised that there are still problems that were around in beta.
And yes Bowman screwed it up big time
The critique notwithstanding -- playing horizons even in the state the game is currently in is way better than missing out on it.
For me and many others (those that like to craft or like to play dragons) it is still the best game on the market.
I am sorry for everyone who is persuaded by this article and the ensuing discussion not to give it a try. Thats why I detest those people who take a delight in pronouncing it dead.
There was a lot of work done in the last year or so; Dragon Lairs were added, the tutorial/beginner islands and the low level subcontinent Lesser Aradoth received complete makeovers, and perhaps most important, the Ancient Rite of Passage was added and the whole dragon experience was improved greatly.
Trial sub retention rates went from effectively zip to better than 50%, a remarkable figure. The game itself (not counting the Gothic game development expenses) was just becoming profitable due to the increased subscription base. That's what made the game salable; as soon as it hit breakeven, and could show a rising subscription base, Chris Baker's interest could be liquidated.
The game servers still run; the improvements of the last year are still there... a new player should get 1-1 1/2 years of good content before hitting the weak endgame.
EI really didn't know what they didn't know; and they fouled up billing, communications, and failed to even communicate with the devs Tulga fired just before the takeover. (Firing was odd, have not heard the reasons for that. ) On the other paw, EI has pledged to add new content, and to clean up underlying tech and documentation issues first. They say, correctly that that will take quite a while... They're learning. As a very small beginning, but still a beginning, the Fall Festival from last year was just put back into the game; trick or treating, costumes, masks, etc.
So, players are playing, and enjoying the game; it is unique in some respects. Billing seems to be working again, and early tech issues are generally improved. I believe it still has the most mature player base (emotionally and chronologically) of any MMO; these ain't kids playing their first MMO. It would not have lasted this long, against such odds, if there were nothing there.
I'm just glad the write up is somewhere extremely visible and nowhere where EII can have it deleted. ;)
Horizons seemed to be building back a good base and a good reputation the last few years It is sad to see this happen to game that arguably was the best crfating game ever made. I neber thought I wiuld be sad to see David Bowman leave Horizons.
You know, I used to think this too after I left Horizons those many, many moons ago; "I am really going to miss the crafting".
But seeing as we are talking about Horizons, and its selling points, I have to say that the crafting in Saga of Ryzom FAR outdoes the mass-produce slider system of Horizons.
If anyone is thinking of trying out an MMO front a love of crafting standpoint, I would HIGHLY recommend not bothering with the Horizons nightmare and just try out the Ryzom trial.
I played Horizons for a year or so. Hmm probably 2.5+ years since I left now, and I have only thought about going back, for a day, for ONE reason.
To see my old friends.
I wouldn't bother doing that now though because I know they'll all be long gone.
People talk of the immense promise this game had, or o.O "has", when in reality, everything that's supposedly so good about it has been done 10x better in another MMO since.
Except for Dragons...
Well, if you want to play a bug riddled, lag riddled, mobs appearing 20m in front of you riddled game (do they still do this?
My advice to anyone would be to stay the HELL away though.
Great crafting + great exploring + great material gathering = Saga of Ryzom, end of story.
Horizons has failed miserably and has far outlived its use-by date.
But I would sure miss the opportunity to learn every craft with time (and on one char), and I would very much miss the chance to own a plot and decide which structures to build there, to embellish it with decoration and even useful things like machines.
I would miss the player events where we gather from all regions to build a mine, where dragons fly in with building units and me little gnome has the honor to apply them ... the chance to see a building pop into existence that you helped build and that is a boon to the world, like a bridge or a lighthouse...
I would miss so much in Ryzom, even though it could be called a crafting game as well. There's simply no competition with horizons for some experiences a crafter can have.
I have no doubt you'd put me into that category, Snickel, but please understand: I do not under any circumstances want Horizons to fail. What I want is for EI to get its act together, start conducting business in an honest, ethical, legal manner, and invest the time and money it will take for them to be able to add new content and develop new game systems. I'd also be happy if they sold Horizons to an existing, professional development house that would be willing and able to make that investment.
I want EI to be as committed to the success and growth of Horizons as the players are. Right now, they are not, and that's not good enough.
Still I fear we are not in agreement about the means to achieve this -- some TULGA-Fans have gone so far as to advise people to cancel their accounts, as if this could result in any positive development. Maybe they think that this might be a means to convince EII to sell the game to another owner --- I think this cannot and will not work and the only result will be harm to the game due to loss of subscribers and a bleeding out of the communities.
I think bashing the current owner of a game is not the way to achieve improvement. Like punishment will not make children better human beings, if that analogy bringt my point across.
Still I fear we are not in agreement about the means to achieve this -- some TULGA-Fans have gone so far as to advise people to cancel their accounts, as if this could result in any positive development. Maybe they think that this might be a means to convince EII to sell the game to another owner --- I think this cannot and will not work and the only result will be harm to the game due to loss of subscribers and a bleeding out of the communities.
I think bashing the current owner of a game is not the way to achieve improvement. Like punishment will not make children better human beings, if that analogy bringt my point across.
With an attitude like that to parenting i'd hate to have any involvment with children or projects of yours.
This is so sad it almost becomes funny.
To quote Homer Simpson "It's funny because I don't know them."
I was talking about the system of crafting, not how high you can craft.
How has the overall system/setup/mechanics of crafting changed since release?
Gathering up a crapload of resources, pushing a slider all the way to the right, crafting 50 x Generic Sword, then repeating over and over isn't really all that compelling a version of crafting you know..
Is it still the same as this? Or did the mechanics get revamped too?
Has there been many (any) new recipes added for all the tiers since release or a year after?
I am being presumptuous because I think I can safely bet that the setup is exactly the same as when I left the game, bar the ability to craft slightly higher stuff...
Thanks for the great article, it was an interesting read for a former Horizon's player and Im looking forward to part 2. Over the years I have had the urge to give the game another go, and even tried the free trials twice, but never stuck with it. Of all the MMOs out there, Horizons is the one I most wanted to love, yet always ended up disappointing in. I still hang onto a dwindling hope it will one day be the great game it could have and should have been, but I fear that is just wishful thinking.
Still the same bar-slider system. Still can't swim, you just walk along the bottom of the water and out the other side, or drown (except in Pratts Pond, which you can sit at the bottom of with no penalty. Some of the most horrid graphics I've ever seen, and that's at everything maxed. Who the hell wants a seam running down the back of their characters head, beards/hair that disappear into your body, characters that look like they are running with a corncob stuck in some dark place? The novelty of the dragon wears off quickly, so it's not an improvement as such. This game is still in late Alpha/ early beta phase as far as a finished product after all these years. How long can fanboism cause a person to be willing to pay for an unfinished game for years? With all the problems it has, and the state it's in, is it any wonder why a fleabag company like EI would be the only ones willing to touch it? Please. THE GAME IS DEAD. YOU JUST REFUSE TO CLOSE THE CASKET
You can shout THE GAME IS DEAD all you like, it doesn't change reality. The game is alive as long as people are left who play and enjoy it. Pronouncing it dead is just an indication that it is an urgent wish of you that it should be dead. But thats your problem, not the game's.
On the contrary, I do not "wish it dead". However, as I stated, do you really see anyone buying this franchise after all the trouble it's had and the fact that I'm sure it's lost more money than it's made? Why would anyone want to take a financial gamble on a game that has gone through at least 3 owners and has minimal improvements from the time it was first launched in "beta"? And if you really think EI is going to be the one to turn it around, then yes, you are deluded. I've seen their other game and I'm in no way impressed. They do not have the ability, knowledge, or desire to take the steps necessary to bring this game to it's original goals and standards. I'm sorry if you don't agree with me, and I do know how hard it is to let go of a game you love, but when that game is continually being run into the ground by the people who are supposed to be picking it up, I would think that there would have to be a breaking point. you just haven't reached yours. Someone said that the game now has a retention rate of 50% according to the "developers". Well, if only 2 people tried it, and 1 actually stayed, that would make a 50% retention rate, correct? So, to that person, never put all of your faith in numbers, because they are the most easily manipulated aspect of any statistic.
This game is still alive. What hopes it has for the future depends on a lot of different variables, one of them is that people find out for themselves if they like what it offers or not.
This game is still alive. What hopes it has for the future depends on a lot of different variables, one of them is that people find out for themselves if they like what it offers or not.
Horizons has been around for 3yrs. its pretty safe to say that those who were inclined to try it already have. The game and its devs/owners over the years have used up and consequently lost any major playerbase it could have had due to the games poor performance and even worse management. you keep looking through those rose colored glasses snickel! and when they finally pronounce this game dead Im sure you'll be welcome as a positive to the end loyal fanboi in any number of other MMO's
I have given my reasons for liking that game and they are still valid for me.
As for the 'those that were inclined to try it already have'- notion: You should maybe have taken the trouble to read this whole thread. You would have noticed some people who posted that they had originally intended to give this game a try but were dissuaded by the postings.
I tried it back in the day when it first started, it looked interesting but needed refinement for me though, although now i wouldnt touch it with a barge pole, indeed i think alot of others wouldnt just for the lack of confidence i would have in my account security, shame cause i might have gone back for another look one day
To be honnest i think that although this game is obviously not dead it may become stagnant as who would want to join a game with this new track record, and we all know stagnancy leads to death, EI might have signed the death certificate themselves
So basically this guy David Bowman single handedly screwed Turbine and Artifact Entertainment (the company that David Allen founded) and original owner of Horizons: Empire of Istaria. Oh btw, another person named James Jones was the one who brought David Bowman onboard Artifact Entertainment. James Jones basically backstabbed David Allen (the original designer and visionary of Horizons) and kick him out of his own company then he himself got backstabbed by David Bowman and was fired. ROLFMAO.
You can read the whole freaking story here:
http://webz.us/hz/htm/wrh.htm
another reason people are dissuaded from trying horizons.
Er, who received emails regarding this? I didn't get an email, nor did anyone I've spoken to about it. This was one of my major complaints to EII. If you're going to change your billing system and require people to re-enter info, you really do need to send an email to the account holder. Even an email informing the players that the game had been bought would have been nice. Not everyone reads the forums.
This notice was posted in the forums and on the login screen (for both logging in through the standalone launcher and the website). Unfortunately, the people on hiatus but still paying would never know about this unless someone told them.
In reading the article a lot of things popped into my head that I could probably make sense out of if I had facts and details that only people working with Bowman could probably answer. Anyhow, it sounds like this Andercheck guy isn't very trustworthy, and it sounds like EI did some pretty scary stuff to its subscribers some of which sounded despicable.
Well, I had been frequenting the site they have for Dark World Online. www.darkworldonline.net I posted under the name Bravado, and was the most active member on there. Was a pretty lifeless place but that's because it's brand new and we had next to nothing about information or news about DWO except for the interview you guys have on here with Bowman about DWO.
The last thing I posted was the article about horizons. I put up a link to the article on this site and I manually posted it along with a few sentiments . I didn't bash anyone or anything, I did post some questions for the other members, one of which was where responsibility began and ended, and how David Bowman fit into this.
I'm posting here because I want to have a better formed opinion of him, mainly from the people who have factual information about him or worked with him. He seems to be very much referred to as a backstabber, or he is defended in a way that makes him free of any responsibility. Either way, I have no idea really. The only thing that bothers me about the fact that he's a backstabber is that in this industry and the entertainment industry in general, the worst thing you can do is burn your bridges. I am studying to go into game design and I've spoken with some successful people personally, and they made that clear to me. It's sort of hard to swallow that someone could be so successful and would start his own company if he is of the slimey backstabbing sort.
The other reason I'm posting here is to bring to anyone's attention that the message boards on darkworldonline.net are down, and have been for a while. I sort of get the feeling that my posting the article is a reason for that, since it's the frst time I've seen them down. That's only a hunch though, if they came back up with new news or a slightly tweaked UI i wouldn't be surprised at all. If they came back up with my account banned or my thread about the article deleted, I would be a little surprised. I don't know what to expect.
I haven't seen anyone post anything about Dark World Online. I think I remember someone posting about David Bowman not working in the MMO business anymore, or somethin like that. Just wanted to hear more of the constructive thoughts and critiques on Bowman and what he is up to now.
-Mustasio
Mustasio, DWO is pretty much DOA. Chris Baker fired the entire Tulga team when he sold Horizons to EI. David and a few other folks were kept on to train EI personnel in operating Horizons, but once the transition contract expired, they were fired as well. For all intents and purposes, Tulga Games does not exist anymore.
As far as the David Allen story goes, the article that 'exposes' the takeover has been floating around for a few years now. It's totally one-sided (as in, the only person who's side is presented is David Allen's) but a lot of people take it as gospel truth. The thing with the takeover is this: David Allen had spent a lot of his investors' money and there was nothing to show for it but a lot of neat ideas. The investors wanted to see a product ship, and they voted David Allen out. David Bowman had been hired because of his experience at Bungie and Turbine. He had gotten products out the door, and that's why the board of directors put him in charge. David Bowman did not backstab David Allen; David Allen screwed up and his investors fired him for it.
David Allen had some terriffic ideas, but if you look up the interviews and articles he did, anytime someone asked if the game would have a given feature, his answer was always "Yes!" While that may sound great, making a promise without checking to see if the programming team and the game engine can deliver is a really bad idea. If he'd set realistic goals and focused on achieving them, he probably wouldn't have gotten fired from his own project.
After reading that article, I could only think of one thing to say
Kelso, "BURN!!"
Kind of a sad mess really, I tried the game back when it first came out. I liked the crafting and of the few mmorpgs I've played it's had the best character creation process (compared to say... WoW, where your choice is skin color, hair color, hair style, and special features, but your human will still have gorilla arms and a tiny head). I sure wouldn't try going back to it now unless things were to seriously change, I'm not about to hold my breath though.
If I had more time I would look into the David Allen David Bowman stuff myself. If DWO is completely out of the picture now then I can't say David Bowman came out lookn good when it comes to promises.
On the flip side, I don't have to worry about them making a crappy MMO of my favorite genre.
-Mustasio
Right up until the point where the sale of Horizons to EI was finalized, DWO was activly being worked on. David didn't go back on any promises; the owner of the company fired everyone and shut the company down. That's not something David had any choice in.
I do not know. But I can say this David Knew Chris Baker was shopping the game around LONG before anyone did. He also probably knew when the expansion and DWO was announced. I highly doubt any work was going on with DWO when they did not have the resources for enough people to work on Horizons. You trying to say they hired more people to work on DWO ? I find that highly unlikely not to mention no credible facts or evidence to say it was. Horizons had its own issues for an already stretched thin small dev team. No way they could take on working DWO as well. There certainly was no announcement of people being hired to work on it. Contrary in May or June people were actually let go. That too was down played by the fanboi types.
Which leads me to believe the announcement of DWO and the expansion to be a publicity stunt more than fact. I doubt work on either project was actually even occuring. Mr Bowman was getting desperate and was starting to grasp at straws to keep his dream alive.
I also want to say, that the person who did this article has heard their true calling. Very well written and researched article. I wish journalism in general was to the standards this author has met. Please don't ever quit being a journalist.
There's no doubt that David did know that Baker was looking to sell, but as of E3 (when the expansion and DWO were announced), no potential buyer had expressed interest yet. Tulga continued to work on Horizons because, until a sale is finalized, there's no way to know if it will go through or fall apart.
EI claims that the expansion never existed. I think they said that because, being totally clueless about how to develop an MMO, they had no idea what a design document is. A lot of the stuff in the expansion either existed already but wasn't usable (furniture & pets) or was going to be built on systems that already existed (racial housing). The process of approving the design document had to be completed before coding & asset creation, etc. could start, which is why EI said that 'no work had been done on it' and dismissed the design document ( which was still being written) as 'just a bunch of ideas'.
Some Tulga employees had been pulled off of Horizons to work on DWO. The reason for this is simple: Horizons needs a new client very, very badly. However, it would have been a disaster to try to develop & test it on a live game. DWO, had it gone forward, would have been the environment for testing the new client. Once it was stable & ready to go, then we would have seen it in Horizons. So, yes, there were Tulga employees who were not working on Horizons directly, but the work they were doing would have benefitted Horizons in the long run.
Yes, DWO was an attempt to acquire additional investor support. Of course it was. Additional investment money would mean additional headcount and greater stability for Tulga, which in turn would be good for Horizons.
I do believe that David was hoping to attract a buyer who would be willing to invest in the future of Tulga and Horizons. Baker was not in for the long haul, and had no interest in Horizons as a game or as a community. If Horizons had been bought by someone who was committed to developing the game, the player base wouldn't be fleeing like rats from a burning ship.
Thanks for the continuing updates on the Catastrophe that once was 'Horizons'. It was a game with much potential; but major flaws in the original engine--coupled with major flaws in the companies that try to salvage it-- seem to be what's killing (Killed?) a game that was so promising.
Unfortunately, this is the way a lot of Good Games end up. I say 'All the Best 'to All those who still faithfully try & support Horizons, by still trying to play it.
As for me, personally--I chose to look elsewhere some time back; & I'm glad I did. The best thing about Horizons has always been the Player-Community; & that all-too-brief period when Tulga really cared.
To those faithful Horizons Players who still support the ongoing debacle: Please start trying other MMORPGs. There's a number of really Good Titles out there, with much better track records... & Very Solid Player Communities who'd welcome You, anytime.
I hope the author didn't decide to put part 2 on hold in order to get EI's side of the story; their response time seems to be slightly longer then the half-life of enriched uranium...
Bring on part 2 please!!
-Mustasio