Originally posted by CyborWolfTK

Originally posted by Scilly
all bg's do is allow "twinks" to kill the non "twinks" to make them selfs feel better... i dont see CU accomodating this tbh

 

 

 Not true. Bg's are an excellent place to lean how to play the game, and

it also allowed people to learn there role in RvR.

   Sorry you had such a bad time, You didn't happen to be one of those fools we always saw

running out solo all by yourself where you?

 /Raises eyebrows

 Hmm

 

 

Also it is very easy to combat twinks: RR/level cap , and no "/rp off" or "/xp off" commands. 

  The way I hear people talk in this thread makes me wonder if any of you played the same game I did.

 I hear some complain- "Oh Bg's where full of people who could not compete in big boy rvr"

Nope, just didn't have time to take out of my life to level grind,,equip grind, not mention ML and CL.

 Bg's allowed me to bring my crafters to an easily attainable level, so that outfitting was fairly easy.

 I then could rvr with out spending my life leveling,grinding, nashing my teeth over rolls, and other BS.

"People just wanted to beat up on the noobies"

Acually a lot of the times we where the people who helped the noobs with gear and info, so that when they got to end game

they knew a little bit about how the game worked. But I'm thinking now you people at the end game probably hated it when a group of "Noobs" came in and where not so easy to pick apart.

 I had alot of people thank me months later for my instruction, and help.

"Blah blah blah Yada yoo Yado goo"

Look if your compairing DaoC BG to any other game's bg just gtfo of this thread. They're not even close. It's not even the same sport.

   Bg's served a vital service in DaoC, and IMO, if your going to cry because someone stomped a mud hole in you the first day you walked into a bg with your store bought robe and stick, your a hoipeless case anyway, and i hope you wont be playing CU,

QQ more.

Originally posted by boxsnd

Originally posted by Raagnarz

Originally posted by boxsnd

Originally posted by SyrixII

Originally posted by boxsnd
People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

So you expect day 1 newbies to fight 5 year veterans with a huge amount of progression behind them? That would drive them away pretty quickly. 

Actually yes. But I say yes because we don't know how the leveling/skill/progression system will work. Some games allow for lower level or less skilled characters to fight semi buffed. Some other games remove hit caps based on levels so lower level or less skilled players can still hit high progressed players albeit not as hard. Until we have the answers on how progression and the world will work, I'm happy to say I am 100% against splitting off the population aside from a newbie area.

In daoc new players even with a few weeks experience in PvE and BGs and being on the same item level (pre-ToA), they were still getting their asses kicked in level 50 RvR. Now imagine having them thrown into the lion's den on day 1 with the most basic items, no progression at all, no experience at all. It would be a terrible mistake.

But you're making one assumption...that this is DAOC. Its not and while it might share some similarities or spiritual inspirations from that game, there are plenty of others it can draw from as well. I don't expect this game to be DAOC but a blend of the best idea from several pvp sandboxy type of games. Separating the player base is usually just a crutch for not being able to figure out a system for vets and newbs to all fight together. It doesn't mean one doesn't exist.

Originally posted by Raagnarz

Originally posted by boxsnd

Originally posted by Raagnarz

Originally posted by boxsnd

Originally posted by SyrixII

Originally posted by boxsnd
People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

So you expect day 1 newbies to fight 5 year veterans with a huge amount of progression behind them? That would drive them away pretty quickly. 

Actually yes. But I say yes because we don't know how the leveling/skill/progression system will work. Some games allow for lower level or less skilled characters to fight semi buffed. Some other games remove hit caps based on levels so lower level or less skilled players can still hit high progressed players albeit not as hard. Until we have the answers on how progression and the world will work, I'm happy to say I am 100% against splitting off the population aside from a newbie area.

In daoc new players even with a few weeks experience in PvE and BGs and being on the same item level (pre-ToA), they were still getting their asses kicked in level 50 RvR. Now imagine having them thrown into the lion's den on day 1 with the most basic items, no progression at all, no experience at all. It would be a terrible mistake.

But you're making one assumption...that this is DAOC. Its not and while it might share some similarities or spiritual inspirations from that game, there are plenty of others it can draw from as well. I don't expect this game to be DAOC but a blend of the best idea from several pvp sandboxy type of games. Separating the player base is usually just a crutch for not being able to figure out a system for vets and newbs to all fight together. It doesn't mean one doesn't exist.

We know that there is progression and item crafting which means veteran players will have more powerful characters. That's all we need to know really. There needs to be a PvP tutorial where newbies fight against newbies for a few days.

Originally posted by CyborWolfTK

 

  The way I hear people talk in this thread makes me wonder if any of you played the same game I did.

 

 I hear some complain- "Oh Bg's where full of people who could not compete in big boy rvr"

Nope, just didn't have time to take out of my life to level grind,,equip grind, not mention ML and CL.

 Bg's allowed me to bring my crafters to an easily attainable level, so that outfitting was fairly easy.

 I then could rvr with out spending my life leveling,grinding, nashing my teeth over rolls, and other BS.

 

"People just wanted to beat up on the noobies"

Acually a lot of the times we where the people who helped the noobs with gear and info, so that when they got to end game

they knew a little bit about how the game worked. But I'm thinking now you people at the end game probably hated it when a group of "Noobs" came in and where not so easy to pick apart.

 I had alot of people thank me months later for my instruction, and help.

 

"Blah blah blah Yada yoo Yado goo"

Look if your compairing DaoC BG to any other game's bg just gtfo of this thread. They're not even close. It's not even the same sport.

   Bg's served a vital service in DaoC, and IMO, if your going to cry because someone stomped a mud hole in you the first day you walked into a bg with your store bought robe and stick, your a hoipeless case anyway, and i hope you wont be playing CU,

QQ more.

Hey Cybor, I think the point people are trying to make is, that pvp activities that could pull people from the main RVR is something we want to avoid.  yes ok so you want to level your crafter in RVR etc, or don't want to play all day/grind in order to function well in the main RVR.

Yes Daoc's BG was done well, in that it wasnt a major source of RPS for people so you can't compare it to WoW or WAR BG's where people can farm rps faster/more consistently than main RVR.  But, what I think people just want to avoid any form of PVP that is going to pull people from the game's main RVR area.

Mark said in a podcast that is one benefit to having no PVE, is that it eliminates that option for people so they have to do crafting, housing, or RVR.  So i think to allow an outlet like a BG, just for kicks for crafters/alts, might not be a good idea, cuz it will pull people away from the games main RVR.

Originally posted by boxsnd

Originally posted by Raagnarz

Originally posted by boxsnd

Originally posted by Raagnarz

Originally posted by boxsnd

Originally posted by SyrixII

Originally posted by boxsnd
People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

So you expect day 1 newbies to fight 5 year veterans with a huge amount of progression behind them? That would drive them away pretty quickly. 

Actually yes. But I say yes because we don't know how the leveling/skill/progression system will work. Some games allow for lower level or less skilled characters to fight semi buffed. Some other games remove hit caps based on levels so lower level or less skilled players can still hit high progressed players albeit not as hard. Until we have the answers on how progression and the world will work, I'm happy to say I am 100% against splitting off the population aside from a newbie area.

In daoc new players even with a few weeks experience in PvE and BGs and being on the same item level (pre-ToA), they were still getting their asses kicked in level 50 RvR. Now imagine having them thrown into the lion's den on day 1 with the most basic items, no progression at all, no experience at all. It would be a terrible mistake.

But you're making one assumption...that this is DAOC. Its not and while it might share some similarities or spiritual inspirations from that game, there are plenty of others it can draw from as well. I don't expect this game to be DAOC but a blend of the best idea from several pvp sandboxy type of games. Separating the player base is usually just a crutch for not being able to figure out a system for vets and newbs to all fight together. It doesn't mean one doesn't exist.

We know that there is progression and item crafting which means veteran players will have more powerful characters. That's all we need to know really. There needs to be a PvP tutorial where newbies fight against newbies for a few days.

Just because there is crafting and progression does not mean that a 5 year player should be doing 10,000 damge per hit and a day 1 player doing 200 damage per hit. (yes, this is a very skewed example) In this very limited example (yes, i am dumbing it down this much because you apparently can't see things any other way), the difference could be more like day 1 guy does 200 damage and 5 year guy does maybe 250 damage. The term "progression" doesn't have to mean power, it could mean versatility or other forms of progression that doesn't involve 1 shot killing people.

So many concerns with new players. If you "coddle" new players, they grow up weaker, less skilled and more reliant on others instead of themselves.

I definitely wouldn't want those types of players on my side. New players should have to endure the struggles of fighting veterans. It will make them better players. Sure it won't be easy, it will be frustrating at times BUT that is what makes a good warrior. 

/thread

Originally posted by shadevice

So many concerns with new players. If you "coddle" new players, they grow up weaker, less skilled and more reliant on others instead of themselves.

I definitely wouldn't want those types of players on my side. New players should have to endure the struggles of fighting veterans. It will make them better players. Sure it won't be easy, it will be frustrating at times BUT that is what makes a good warrior. 

/thread

DAoC was also "coddling" new players with PvE + BGs and they turned out fine :)