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Darkfall: Unholy Wars Forum » General Discussion » Darkfall UW Does Not Have Good Gameplay?

17 posts found
  Imperator101

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/24/12
Posts: 134

 
OP  3/02/13 11:12:15 PM#1
I have never played in the beta but seeing gameplay videos it, reminded me of elder scrolls oblivion. Your guy is constantly running and swinging a weapon. There is not much incentive to use sword/shield because the game is not balanced properly. Im sure it will still be fun but after playing Skyrim, I wish an MMO would have gameplay like that. 

  snapfusion

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/17/11
Posts: 976

3/03/13 12:03:07 AM#2

DF 1 could of been Oblivion online and had a million subs easy, but AV made a game that only a couple thousand people could stick with.  Full Loot PvP.   They had a money printing machine but they ended up selling lemonaid on a street corner.

edit:  Oh and DF UW?  Unplayable for me, they gutted DF combat, but they will probably do a little better sub wise but I would call more like a hotdog stand now.

  Greymoor

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 12/30/10
Posts: 812

3/03/13 8:55:20 AM#3

The irony of these two posts.

OP has seen DF1 videos and doesn't like the arcade feel and the speed.

The poster below doesn't like the slowed down combat UW has which the OP would probably enioy.

Who to cater to?

  MMOExposed

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/17/10
Posts: 6100

3/03/13 10:46:34 PM#4
Originally posted by Greymoor

The irony of these two posts.

OP has seen DF1 videos and doesn't like the arcade feel and the speed.

The poster below doesn't like the slowed down combat UW has which the OP would probably enioy.

Who to cater to?

explain...

  psykobilly

Novice Member

Joined: 11/19/10
Posts: 347

3/04/13 6:39:51 AM#5
Originally posted by MMOExposed
Originally posted by Greymoor

The irony of these two posts.

OP has seen DF1 videos and doesn't like the arcade feel and the speed.

The poster below doesn't like the slowed down combat UW has which the OP would probably enioy.

Who to cater to?

explain...

It's not any slower in a literal sense.  It's that the amount of skills that one can use in the role system is so limited...   and even then most of the role skills have such high stat costs that in most situations you never use them.  

When I play a mage, I only end up using maybe 3-4 of the 10 spells I have spec'd.

When I play a warrior, I usually only use the movement ability and everything else is very situational.

This makes combat seem slow because there is no bunnyhopping and people are no longer flying all over the place.  They also made transfers go from net positive to net negative (until you are max wisdom, then it's almost even), which forces more resting in combat (boring).

In a nutshell - combat is not slower but it is very dumbed down and much less complex than DF1.

  psykobilly

Novice Member

Joined: 11/19/10
Posts: 347

3/04/13 9:12:04 AM#6
Originally posted by Caldrin
[mod edit]

Hoards from steam will be in game...  and that means there will be hoards of newbs to kill.  Safe zones will be 100% drained of resources forcing people out in game if they want mats.  We'll see what happens 6 months in, but I guarantee the game will be massively active the first 3-4 months.

  Greymoor

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 12/30/10
Posts: 812

3/04/13 1:37:37 PM#7
Originally posted by psykobilly
Originally posted by MMOExposed
Originally posted by Greymoor

The irony of these two posts.

OP has seen DF1 videos and doesn't like the arcade feel and the speed.

The poster below doesn't like the slowed down combat UW has which the OP would probably enioy.

Who to cater to?

explain...

It's not any slower in a literal sense.  It's that the amount of skills that one can use in the role system is so limited...   and even then most of the role skills have such high stat costs that in most situations you never use them.  

When I play a mage, I only end up using maybe 3-4 of the 10 spells I have spec'd.

When I play a warrior, I usually only use the movement ability and everything else is very situational.

This makes combat seem slow because there is no bunnyhopping and people are no longer flying all over the place.  They also made transfers go from net positive to net negative (until you are max wisdom, then it's almost even), which forces more resting in combat (boring).

In a nutshell - combat is not slower but it is very dumbed down and much less complex than DF1.

It sort of is though, momentum and wobble reduce the speed from the arcade style FPS of DF1 to something slower and supposingly more tactical. Depending on personal taste and opinion.

Yes balancing is definately needed on skill costs but that's easily done. Instead of 100+ moves to learn, grind and use each class has something closer to 20. The direction the devs have taken seems clear, only the mage is supposed to spam spells and the skirm/warrior have them for special situations. But the costs are still imbalanced.

It's too early to say for definate how combat will be until we see the primalist affects group play. Trying not to give too much away breaking the NDA...

For sure many DF1 vets are not happy with a limited stat pool.

  raistlinm

Novice Member

Joined: 8/23/11
Posts: 686

3/04/13 1:42:29 PM#8
Originally posted by snapfusion

DF 1 could of been Oblivion online and had a million subs easy, but AV made a game that only a couple thousand people could stick with.  Full Loot PvP.   They had a money printing machine but they ended up selling lemonaid on a street corner.

edit:  Oh and DF UW?  Unplayable for me, they gutted DF combat, but they will probably do a little better sub wise but I would call more like a hotdog stand now.

I've been saying the same thing about this game since I first heard the cries of "VAPORWARE!!!!" I thought wow this sounds like a serious game that seemed it would be the closest thing to playing old school pen and paper D&D and then I heard the phrase that let me know it would be nothing like what my mind thought "full loot pvp".

  Imperator101

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/24/12
Posts: 134

 
OP  3/04/13 9:08:36 PM#9
You can move your sword seamlessly up and down in first person view like Oblivion right? So there won't be many skills avaliable for your class, the ones they presented in the gameplay video are the only skill avaliable for it? Im sure you rank them up and they become more powerful/look different when you use the, at least that is what I am assuming.

  User Deleted
3/04/13 10:34:24 PM#10
Originally posted by Imperator101
You can move your sword seamlessly up and down in first person view like Oblivion right? So their won't be many skills avaliable for your class, the ones they presented in the gameplay video are the only skill avaliable for it? Im sure you rank them up and they become more powerful/look different when you use the, at least that is what I am assuming.

Yes you basically got it right, only leveling the skills wont make them look different, just preform better.

Old darkfall had hundreds of skills, most were reskins within a different school of magic. Many were all but useless, and a lot were buffs, very short term buffs.

New system has a focus more on removing the old soldier of one...where in 1.0 everyone was a light armor wearing, with heavy armor fillers, that wielded a great sword, and used roughly the same combat approach.

It was very difficult, if not impossible under to old system to compete without 3rd party software to auto hotkey and macro, given a huge part of darkfall combat, and still is, your ability to pull a staff out, use magic, pull a bow out, shoot arrows, then pull a melee weapon out and start whacking people...all within the same encounter, often very quickly.

New system takes out a lot of the need to macro things like pulling out a weapon, then switching your hotbar, then loading a skill. All of which in 1.0 was nearly impossible to do on your own in combat, specifically if you were fighting players.

The skill reduction is really for magic and buffs.  Archery which only had one skill to disable the use of a shield now has proper skills. Melee which had the same few skills but for each seperate weapon, which made using off weapons difficult without said 3rd party software, now has no skills, but, you get melee skills within your role now.

 

So in a nut shell...magic loses several hundred skills, archery gains skills, melee gains a more common sense skill system.

Before if you wanted a dash, you had to pull out your staff, have magic leveled to where you got a skill that had pushback/knockup, then cast it on the ground in front of you just right to launch you in the air.  Now theres a dash.

 

Still the bread and butter of combat is going to be melee weapon swings and arrow shots, and cheap to use magic attacks, only now depending on your role.  Also now armor actually does something, where in 1.0 most armor types were useless and everyone just commingled the good light armor and enchanted heavy armor for helmets ect.  Which is good.

 

So in short, yes the game plays like a skyrim style game, only to use magic you need to stop what your doing switch into mage, pick your schools and skills, and put on mage gear.  I almost want to say it mixes that kind of combat with a Guild Wars style "choose your skills" only its not skills you choose but what type of character you want to be.  You level up and progress the skills, the skills base school, and your hard statistics. All of which makes you preform better, given your hard stats carry over no matter what school you are.

  psykobilly

Novice Member

Joined: 11/19/10
Posts: 347

3/05/13 6:36:58 AM#11
Originally posted by Greymoor

It sort of is though, momentum and wobble reduce the speed from the arcade style FPS of DF1 to something slower and supposingly more tactical. Depending on personal taste and opinion.

There's no momentum...  you can stop on a dime and figure 8 the same way you did in DF1.  Not sure why that rumor persists.

Wobble doesn't reduce the speed of the game.  It just means you miss a few more arrows as you are closing distance that you would not have missed in DF1 - not a big deal unless you have serious ego issues.  People who complain about players escaping to the safezone are just bads...  I've had no problem downing peoples mounts and killing before they can escape.  Skirmishers are tough to catch, but that is by design - you have to wear down their stats.  

  Onodrim

Novice Member

Joined: 3/14/11
Posts: 18

3/05/13 4:54:09 PM#12
Im response to your thread title: No it does not have good gameplay.
  taus01

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/12/06
Posts: 1419

3/05/13 11:08:13 PM#13
Originally posted by snapfusion

DF 1 could of been Oblivion online and had a million subs easy, but AV made a game that only a couple thousand people could stick with.  Full Loot PvP.   They had a money printing machine but they ended up selling lemonaid on a street corner.

edit:  Oh and DF UW?  Unplayable for me, they gutted DF combat, but they will probably do a little better sub wise but I would call more like a hotdog stand now.

It "could of been" nothing because that does not exist in the english language. You probably mean "could have been" and even then you are completely wrong. There was nothing good about DF and they certainly did not have a money printing machine. All they had and have now is a very bad game.

You should have concentrated more on learning propper english than playing crappy games like DF.

"Give players systems and tools instead of rails and rules"

  Imperator101

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/24/12
Posts: 134

 
OP  3/06/13 1:11:59 AM#14
Originally posted by Crunchy222
Originally posted by Imperator101
You can move your sword seamlessly up and down in first person view like Oblivion right? So their won't be many skills avaliable for your class, the ones they presented in the gameplay video are the only skill avaliable for it? Im sure you rank them up and they become more powerful/look different when you use the, at least that is what I am assuming.

Yes you basically got it right, only leveling the skills wont make them look different, just preform better.

Old darkfall had hundreds of skills, most were reskins within a different school of magic. Many were all but useless, and a lot were buffs, very short term buffs.

New system has a focus more on removing the old soldier of one...where in 1.0 everyone was a light armor wearing, with heavy armor fillers, that wielded a great sword, and used roughly the same combat approach.

It was very difficult, if not impossible under to old system to compete without 3rd party software to auto hotkey and macro, given a huge part of darkfall combat, and still is, your ability to pull a staff out, use magic, pull a bow out, shoot arrows, then pull a melee weapon out and start whacking people...all within the same encounter, often very quickly.

New system takes out a lot of the need to macro things like pulling out a weapon, then switching your hotbar, then loading a skill. All of which in 1.0 was nearly impossible to do on your own in combat, specifically if you were fighting players.

The skill reduction is really for magic and buffs.  Archery which only had one skill to disable the use of a shield now has proper skills. Melee which had the same few skills but for each seperate weapon, which made using off weapons difficult without said 3rd party software, now has no skills, but, you get melee skills within your role now.

 

So in a nut shell...magic loses several hundred skills, archery gains skills, melee gains a more common sense skill system.

Before if you wanted a dash, you had to pull out your staff, have magic leveled to where you got a skill that had pushback/knockup, then cast it on the ground in front of you just right to launch you in the air.  Now theres a dash.

 

Still the bread and butter of combat is going to be melee weapon swings and arrow shots, and cheap to use magic attacks, only now depending on your role.  Also now armor actually does something, where in 1.0 most armor types were useless and everyone just commingled the good light armor and enchanted heavy armor for helmets ect.  Which is good.

 

So in short, yes the game plays like a skyrim style game, only to use magic you need to stop what your doing switch into mage, pick your schools and skills, and put on mage gear.  I almost want to say it mixes that kind of combat with a Guild Wars style "choose your skills" only its not skills you choose but what type of character you want to be.  You level up and progress the skills, the skills base school, and your hard statistics. All of which makes you preform better, given your hard stats carry over no matter what school you are.

 

Thanks for explaining it in great detail for me. This was the state of DarkFall 1.0 and Im happy I never touched this game. Even though there are not many skills, I can look past that. This game will still have one of the largest MMO worlds ever created, if they can improve the PVE and actually make all the dungeons look diverse then I am sure this game will be fun.

  Snoepie

Novice Member

Joined: 8/18/07
Posts: 493

3/07/13 9:30:32 AM#15

for me darkfall is pretty much over..

 

They went from most competitive hardcore "semi"sandbox pvp full loot game..

To a themepark tank/healer/suport crap

1.0 already had almost no sandbox elements.. the only think it made it a sandbox was the free of choice..

 

Currently this whole crappy Uw system is showing stuff like prowess and rolls which basicly forcing your actions into tank/healer/archer and so forth..

 

besides that they wanted adjust the aiming aspect of the game. but introducing the wobble mechanic with random generator for the hitboxes..

 

Combat is dull as fck.. The whole comminity is pissed about it

Its slow.. movement is boring..

If you run out of stats during fights.. you need to sit down in combat.. common pls.. fck this shit

 

Uw will and can not get the same level of combat of 1.0 had.. because its a new game they say.. fine by me.. but fcking open 1.0 server then!!

  Imperator101

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/24/12
Posts: 134

 
OP  3/08/13 5:13:37 AM#16
Originally posted by Snoepie

for me darkfall is pretty much over..

 

They went from most competitive hardcore "semi"sandbox pvp full loot game..

To a themepark tank/healer/suport crap

1.0 already had almost no sandbox elements.. the only think it made it a sandbox was the free of choice..

 

Currently this whole crappy Uw system is showing stuff like prowess and rolls which basicly forcing your actions into tank/healer/archer and so forth..

 

besides that they wanted adjust the aiming aspect of the game. but introducing the wobble mechanic with random generator for the hitboxes..

 

Combat is dull as fck.. The whole comminity is pissed about it

Its slow.. movement is boring..

If you run out of stats during fights.. you need to sit down in combat.. common pls.. fck this shit

 

Uw will and can not get the same level of combat of 1.0 had.. because its a new game they say.. fine by me.. but fcking open 1.0 server then!!

They just need to improve the UI. I never played the first Darkfall because I thought the combat was to fast and it looked stupid because of that. This looks much better, like a slower placed Elder Scrolls Oblivion when playing in 3rd person but they really need to improve the graphics. It better look good running on max settings, I know they plan to improve player models after release, assuming this game will be successful. 

 

  Snoepie

Novice Member

Joined: 8/18/07
Posts: 493

3/08/13 4:25:23 PM#17
Originally posted by Imperator101
Originally posted by Snoepie

for me darkfall is pretty much over..

 

They went from most competitive hardcore "semi"sandbox pvp full loot game..

To a themepark tank/healer/suport crap

1.0 already had almost no sandbox elements.. the only think it made it a sandbox was the free of choice..

 

Currently this whole crappy Uw system is showing stuff like prowess and rolls which basicly forcing your actions into tank/healer/archer and so forth..

 

besides that they wanted adjust the aiming aspect of the game. but introducing the wobble mechanic with random generator for the hitboxes..

 

Combat is dull as fck.. The whole comminity is pissed about it

Its slow.. movement is boring..

If you run out of stats during fights.. you need to sit down in combat.. common pls.. fck this shit

 

Uw will and can not get the same level of combat of 1.0 had.. because its a new game they say.. fine by me.. but fcking open 1.0 server then!!

They just need to improve the UI. I never played the first Darkfall because I thought the combat was to fast and it looked stupid because of that. This looks much better, like a slower placed Elder Scrolls Oblivion when playing in 3rd person but they really need to improve the graphics. It better look good running on max settings, I know they plan to improve player models after release, assuming this game will be successful. 

 

if you wanne play games for grafhics.. this will never happen in darkfall then..

 

Darkfall is a very nice game grafhics wise.. the only problem is that none can run with uber settings in dense surroundings..

 

for example.. a fight with over 400 players in an area.. you will run your darkfall with 10 fps tops.. don't matter what comp you got..