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Elder Scrolls Online Forum » General Discussion » They turned a great sandbox genre into a Themepark.

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171 posts found
  Drakynn

Novice Member

Joined: 3/02/08
Posts: 2051

4/05/13 1:17:10 PM#81
Originally posted by Psychow
Originally posted by Drakynn

heh gotta love the MMORPG.com forum PVP best MMO pvp game there is.

Screw 3 faction warfare here you have multiple game cults evangelizing and demonizing each game set for release and each other.The only real casualties in these wars though...reason and courteousy.

 

Reason and Courteousy were n00bs. They deserved to die...

+1

LMAO

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 3875

4/05/13 1:18:48 PM#82
Originally posted by Drakynn

heh gotta love the MMORPG.com forum PVP best MMO pvp game there is.

Screw 3 faction warfare here you have multiple game cults evangelizing and demonizing each game set for release and each other.The only real casualties in these wars though...reason and courteousy.

Heh...this is mild dude. Want to see real forum PvP? Just head over to TSN Hockey--or any other sport forum fo that matter--now there is fanaticism. Christ, there's a whole industry of Sports Talk built around dissing each other.

  Drakynn

Novice Member

Joined: 3/02/08
Posts: 2051

4/05/13 1:29:42 PM#83
Originally posted by Iselin
Originally posted by Drakynn

heh gotta love the MMORPG.com forum PVP best MMO pvp game there is.

Screw 3 faction warfare here you have multiple game cults evangelizing and demonizing each game set for release and each other.The only real casualties in these wars though...reason and courteousy.

Heh...this is mild dude. Want to see real forum PvP? Just head over to TSN Hockey--or any other sport forum fo that matter--now there is fanaticism. Christ, there's a whole industry of Sports Talk built around dissing each other.

I don't doubt it,Peopel get more passioante about sports teams than video games in general and thne you add anonymity into that...I can jsut imagine lol.

But I sort of worry about our PvP game here with the way the market is going MMORPG.com may decide to add microtransactions and sell advantages like limited immunity to bans or cosmetic ones liek making a games hype meter disappear for a limtied time 8P

  Nanfoodle

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3508

4/05/13 1:39:32 PM#84
Originally posted by Iselin
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Normandy7
I will not be buying this because this is hardly what an Elder Scrolls game should be. This is something just to milk a popular ip. No thanks I'll keep playing Skyrim and waiting for Bethesda's next installment of Elder Scrolls.

With your sig its clear why you are knocking ESO. My guess is in the next 1-2 years people are going to look back at this kickstarter generation of games and wonder how they fell for giving hundrids and sometimes thousands of bucks to help make a game they should have paid no more then 60 bucks for. 

You're assuming mental wellness will break out in North America and specifically in the MMO gaming community. A noble thought but unrealistic.

Over at the Mark Jacobs panhandling forum, they are all rushing to show their commitment (or is it commitability?) by outdoing each other with their pledges.

Ya its a little crazy. If you pay for a game before you see what the product will look like, with some game play trailers, its a risk most gamers wont taket. Here they are chucking tones of money on a concept and with a company thats never proved they know how to manage a business. I rather take my money to Las Vegas.

  baphamet

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/05/06
Posts: 2644

110100100

4/05/13 3:30:07 PM#85


Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Ya its a little crazy. If you pay for a game before you see what the product will look like, with some game play trailers, its a risk most gamers wont taket. Here they are chucking tones of money on a concept and with a company thats never proved they know how to manage a business. I rather take my money to Las Vegas.

lol its a head scratcher for sure. many of those same people will trash on other people for pre-ordering games before playing them.

and yeah, at least in vegas you have a chance to get a return on your investment.

i have pre-orered a lot of games in my time, some of them i didn't spend but a few weeks playing (GW2) and i do not regret it because i can spend $60 on just one night of entertainment, much more than that actually.

but spending hundreds and even thousands of dollars just to hopefully IT a game and get a few goodies with no return on your investment?

LOL that is highway robbery!

  baphamet

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/05/06
Posts: 2644

110100100

4/05/13 3:38:15 PM#86


Originally posted by Normandy7
I will not be buying this because this is hardly what an Elder Scrolls game should be. This is something just to milk a popular ip. No thanks I'll keep playing Skyrim and waiting for Bethesda's next installment of Elder Scrolls.

i don't blame ya, you probably spent all your life savings on the CU KS lol

but hey, if it turns out to be a good game i will thank you suckers for throwing your money away so i can play CU IF it releases. :)

  daltanious

Elite Member

Joined: 4/19/08
Posts: 1846

4/06/13 4:47:44 AM#87
Originally posted by Topherpunch

The root of all evil.....money. Why is Bethesda giving into corporate walkways? You could have created something amazing.

 

Yes, yes, ... they could have created something amazing. But for that you need usually MONEY. Unless you think houndreds of people will work for free to make YOU or few "fans" that share your ideas happy. And all this people will explain to their children back at home no bike because my pay is to low because I must produce something amazing for free.

So there is always some compromise to make.

Personally I love virtually all you hate above. Time will show if they got more benefit from new fans or losing old ones caused more money lose.

  Anakami

Novice Member

Joined: 2/28/12
Posts: 101

4/06/13 6:28:32 AM#88
Originally posted by daltanious
Originally posted by Topherpunch

The root of all evil.....money. Why is Bethesda giving into corporate walkways? You could have created something amazing.

 

Yes, yes, ... they could have created something amazing. But for that you need usually MONEY. Unless you think houndreds of people will work for free to make YOU or few "fans" that share your ideas happy. And all this people will explain to their children back at home no bike because my pay is to low because I must produce something amazing for free.

So there is always some compromise to make.

Personally I love virtually all you hate above. Time will show if they got more benefit from new fans or losing old ones caused more money lose.

I don't see why creating something amazing would suddenly break the budget that is given to those game studios. Amazing means also something different for every person. In the end it comes down to whether they can win over people with their ideas and how they put them into their game.

In the case of TESO they seem to hope on their PvP mechanics as the main appeal that will make people stay subscribed or wanting to buy their game. We will see if they were right with that assumption :)

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 3875

4/06/13 2:00:26 PM#89
Originally posted by Anakami
Originally posted by daltanious
Originally posted by Topherpunch

The root of all evil.....money. Why is Bethesda giving into corporate walkways? You could have created something amazing.

 

Yes, yes, ... they could have created something amazing. But for that you need usually MONEY. Unless you think houndreds of people will work for free to make YOU or few "fans" that share your ideas happy. And all this people will explain to their children back at home no bike because my pay is to low because I must produce something amazing for free.

So there is always some compromise to make.

Personally I love virtually all you hate above. Time will show if they got more benefit from new fans or losing old ones caused more money lose.

I don't see why creating something amazing would suddenly break the budget that is given to those game studios. Amazing means also something different for every person. In the end it comes down to whether they can win over people with their ideas and how they put them into their game.

In the case of TESO they seem to hope on their PvP mechanics as the main appeal that will make people stay subscribed or wanting to buy their game. We will see if they were right with that assumption :)

See? You do understand their design goals... no need to feign ignorance in this thread. 

And you're right, anytime a game is not modeled on WOW and the developers try something different they're taking a risk.

Thank god somebody is.

  Tierless

Novice Member

Joined: 7/01/08
Posts: 2114

joie de vivre

4/08/13 3:51:47 PM#90

I am as mad as anyone but the trick is, stop thinking of TES games that came before. Think of this as a new fantasy MMO. Doing so I went from refusing to play because they are betraying the fan base that supported TES all these years to being open to play if it gets good enough reviews.

mmorpg.com/blogs/Xobdnas

  Tierless

Novice Member

Joined: 7/01/08
Posts: 2114

joie de vivre

4/19/13 10:57:03 AM#91


Originally posted by GrayGhost79

Originally posted by Byrhofen

Originally posted by Topherpunch I am a fan od Elder Scroll, so much that I must protest this game.  I am just going to post all the bad things that I think are very bad ideas. This is not a troll, just a "concerned gamers bad idea, thoughts" post.... Having one PvP area. While I know it is huge I just think putting players in a particular place to PvP is just silly. One mega server, this is good if you were playing a game like EvE or Darkfall where there are no instaces. Gaining skills and spells..... Not cool Targeting..... Why are they ruining the FPS style? Not able to join other faction area's until you reach maxed level (This could be a rumor) Why? What did you do to the old crafting system from Elder Scrolls? What is wrong with combining regular items to make weird combines? Zenimax..... The root of all evil.....money. Why is Bethesda giving into corporate walkways? You could have created something amazing. These are just some things I think they really messed up on. Personally I wish they would stop what they are doing and remake. Theme park is dead. I know some people really like themepark games, but  (this is an assumtion) I really think that is because they have not been given anything else. If Skyrim was an MMORPG with hundreds of people running around doing what they want and killing who they wanted...... There would be only one.
Had to highlight part of your post. If Skyrim was an MMO, and if it had hundreds of players running round doing what they wanted and killing who they wanted, there would be nothing to do but explore. Every NPC in the game would be killed, there would be no quests, it would turn into an MMO version of deathmatch, and most players would hate it. Skyrim works, and is great fun, because it is a single player RPG, just like the previous TES games. So ESO is not the MMO equivalent of Skyrim (or any previous TES game), that does not automatically mean it is bad.
Heres the problem for me at least. Using the Elder Scrolls IP those not interested in the IP are going to write off the game automatically and those interested in the IP are going to expect a game at the very least in the spirit of previous TES games. What we have here is a game that is far to focused on bringing in non TES fans (Namely MMO fans) that are going to simply avoid it anyways due to the IP. Many TES fans are going to buy the game for the IP and hope that it doesn't stray to far from the spirit of the game. 

 

In the end I get the feeling that this is a game thats going to do very well with initial sales due to the IP alone and then quickly dwindle due to failing to appeal to its player base. 

 

When using widely popular IPs you are responsible for delivering something at least in the spirit of that IP. For me TESO is akin to writing a new Harry Potter book and making it a scifi instead. Its not a bad thing to try to get a larger fan base, but with  something as established as this its hard to appeal to a different fan base all together and you increases risk of failure by trying to so there is no need to push aside your current fan base. 

 

I guess I just don't understand, maybe its beyond me to understand. Making an MMO based off of The Edler Scrolls should be a sure thing as long as they at least stay true to the spirit of the IP. I don't understand taking such a gamble as this. To me it would seem harder to sale DAoC to Elder Scroll fans than to sale an Elder Scrolls game. 


"To me it would seem harder to sale DAoC to Elder Scroll fans than to sale an Elder Scrolls game." This line was especially epic, but the entire above post is exactly how I feel about TES.

mmorpg.com/blogs/Xobdnas

  Nanfoodle

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3508

4/19/13 11:27:34 AM#92
Originally posted by Tierless

 



I guess I just don't understand, maybe its beyond me to understand. Making an MMO based off of The Edler Scrolls should be a sure thing as long as they at least stay true to the spirit of the IP. I don't understand taking such a gamble as this. To me it would seem harder to sale DAoC to Elder Scroll fans than to sale an Elder Scrolls game. 


 

"To me it would seem harder to sale DAoC to Elder Scroll fans than to sale an Elder Scrolls game." This line was especially epic, but the entire above post is exactly how I feel about TES.

There is lots of TES fans here that love the game design. I have been playing TES forever and I for one cant wait to play the game they have designed. I personally think all the people crying about the DAoC model have not taken enough time to look into the game. Its dripping with TES lore, story, world and art, combat and the exploring added has some real depth. For a change here on MMOrpg.com. Lets not flip out yelling fail without knowing something about the game. MMOrpg.com forum hate is so thick sometimes I wonder why I even read the forums any more. Get a grip.

  Maelwydd

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 1169

4/19/13 11:36:08 AM#93
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

There is lots of TES fans here that love the game design. I have been playing TES forever and I for one cant wait to play the game they have designed. I personally think all the people crying about the DAoC model have not taken enough time to look into the game. Its dripping with TES lore, story, world and art, combat and the exploring added has some real depth. For a change here on MMOrpg.com. Lets not flip out yelling fail without knowing something about the game. MMOrpg.com forum hate is so thick sometimes I wonder why I even read the forums any more. Get a grip.

People have legitimate reasons to not like the design. It is called having an opinion.

What I find really offensive is the need for people like you to clasify a difference of opinon as HATE. So please, why don't YOU stop posting the HATE and let others share their opinions in peace. So please go ahead and take your own advice and stop reading if all you can do is accuse people of HATE.

  JasonJ

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/19/13
Posts: 414

4/19/13 11:41:01 AM#94
Originally posted by Iselin
Originally posted by Anakami

In the case of TESO they seem to hope on their PvP mechanics as the main appeal that will make people stay subscribed or wanting to buy their game. We will see if they were right with that assumption :)

See? You do understand their design goals... no need to feign ignorance in this thread. 

And you're right, anytime a game is not modeled on WOW and the developers try something different they're taking a risk.

Thank god somebody is.

Try something different by doing something that has been done before...lol.

They are not doing something new, they are doing something old and something not only not new, was not popular, something that caused so much TES fan outrage Zenimax had to go into damage control mode stating that adding 1st person should help quell fans...which caused even more outrage because it was low on their lists of what they hated about the game.

One only has to look on any single TES, mod, or gaming websites forums to see it. This game isnt for TES fans, its for DaoC fans and no amount of spin is going to change that. SWTOR 2.0: IP runiation. About the only good thing I see coming from this is the firing of the designers and the removal of the CEO by the two men on the board that should be running the company, and want to which should lead to other game companies finally realizing that if they are going to take an IP, they better damn well make it for that IPs fans or face big losses.

And yes, SWTOR was a major disaster, twice had massive firings and led to EAs CEO stepping down.

  mari3k

Novice Member

Joined: 2/23/13
Posts: 146

4/19/13 11:46:20 AM#95
Originally posted by Teala
Do like many of us are doing - and don't buy or play the game.   Simple.   Money speaks louder than any words.

Fine, I will buy 2 copys then... lol.

Step in the arena and break the wall down

  Nanfoodle

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3508

4/19/13 11:52:37 AM#96
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

There is lots of TES fans here that love the game design. I have been playing TES forever and I for one cant wait to play the game they have designed. I personally think all the people crying about the DAoC model have not taken enough time to look into the game. Its dripping with TES lore, story, world and art, combat and the exploring added has some real depth. For a change here on MMOrpg.com. Lets not flip out yelling fail without knowing something about the game. MMOrpg.com forum hate is so thick sometimes I wonder why I even read the forums any more. Get a grip.

People have legitimate reasons to not like the design. It is called having an opinion.

What I find really offensive is the need for people like you to clasify a difference of opinon as HATE. So please, why don't YOU stop posting the HATE and let others share their opinions in peace. So please go ahead and take your own advice and stop reading if all you can do is accuse people of HATE.

King of the storm himself. It is what it is. Even Bill Murphy has talked about this hate and how sick of it he is. So I agree with him and its not anything but hate. If the game was a person this would be called prejudging also know as prejudice. We sit here never playing the game and yell how bad and wrong it is. We dont even have game play footage to be able to really even get a peak at it. This game could be the king of TES PvE and no one would know... why? Because you have not played it. So I dont spend much time here any more as I am sick of all the hate, besides I have things Im up to that are much more fun I wish I could talk about but cant. Later all.

  JasonJ

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/19/13
Posts: 414

4/19/13 11:54:30 AM#97
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

There is lots of TES fans here that love the game design. I have been playing TES forever and I for one cant wait to play the game they have designed. I personally think all the people crying about the DAoC model have not taken enough time to look into the game. Its dripping with TES lore, story, world and art, combat and the exploring added has some real depth. For a change here on MMOrpg.com. Lets not flip out yelling fail without knowing something about the game. MMOrpg.com forum hate is so thick sometimes I wonder why I even read the forums any more. Get a grip.

People have legitimate reasons to not like the design. It is called having an opinion.

What I find really offensive is the need for people like you to clasify a difference of opinon as HATE. So please, why don't YOU stop posting the HATE and let others share their opinions in peace. So please go ahead and take your own advice and stop reading if all you can do is accuse people of HATE.

You will notice a pattern, its due to having no choice because there is no real way to refute what is being said. You can see it with how he refuted. "lore, story, world, art, combat and exploring". Only combat and exploring have nothing to do with "looks" which is a cosmetic. The combat hasnt actually been shown fully so that is opinion...and the exploring part is shot to pieces by the design which is walled off closed factions that actually prevents it from being like TES. He never talks about the heart of the game, the DaoC design...which is the very thing TES fans are talking about not liking. He then tries to discredit others opinions with the typical you know nothing attack, when clearly they do by talking about the base game design which is a well known game feature.

The single thing that no one defending the game has ever been able to refute is a simple statement made by another poster on this site.

"if they changed the names of places, npcs and monsters and then changed the way the world looks, would people say "hey this is a TES clone? or would they say hey this is a DaoC clone?" They would say DaoC because the base design is DaoC and the skins are TES".

Cant be refuted because the base game is DaoC, the look is TES. It all comes down to zones with levels all funnelling everyone to the same place, the one and only land PvP can take place in that is behind a magical wall keeping our actual lands safe from harm. Piss poor DaoC themepark PvP design which is nothing like TES where wars took place right in your backyard.

  Maelwydd

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 1169

4/19/13 12:05:22 PM#98
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

King of the storm himself. It is what it is. Even Bill Murphy has talked about this hate and how sick of it he is. So I agree with him and its not anything but hate. If the game was a person this would be called prejudging also know as prejudice. We sit here never playing the game and yell how bad and wrong it is. We dont even have game play footage to be able to really even get a peak at it. This game could be the king of TES PvE and no one would know... why? Because you have not played it. So I dont spend much time here any more as I am sick of all the hate, besides I have things Im up to that are much more fun I wish I could talk about but cant. Later all.

Sorry but YOU bring the hate to these discussions so perhaps you might want to re-consider if Bill is right when he is actually taling about people like you.

And tell me, is saying the game is bad because of design features that we have not been able to verify by playtesting any better or worse then saying it is great when you are in no better a position to justify your opinon with playtesting?

Well the asnwer is they are no different. Only problem is you insist on labelling peoples opinions that you do not agree with as hate. YOU bering the HATE.

  Nanfoodle

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3508

4/19/13 12:08:20 PM#99

 

Originally posted by mari3k
Originally posted by Teala
Do like many of us are doing - and don't buy or play the game.   Simple.   Money speaks louder than any words.

Fine, I will buy 2 copys then... lol.

 

I wish the hate would stop. My wife and will be buying a copy of the game and if the game stay as it stands now I would be glad to show my support now. 

  Nanfoodle

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3508

4/19/13 12:11:28 PM#100
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

King of the storm himself. It is what it is. Even Bill Murphy has talked about this hate and how sick of it he is. So I agree with him and its not anything but hate. If the game was a person this would be called prejudging also know as prejudice. We sit here never playing the game and yell how bad and wrong it is. We dont even have game play footage to be able to really even get a peak at it. This game could be the king of TES PvE and no one would know... why? Because you have not played it. So I dont spend much time here any more as I am sick of all the hate, besides I have things Im up to that are much more fun I wish I could talk about but cant. Later all.

Sorry but YOU bring the hate to these discussions so perhaps you might want to re-consider if Bill is right when he is actually taling about people like you.

And tell me, is saying the game is bad because of design features that we have not been able to verify by playtesting any better or worse then saying it is great when you are in no better a position to justify your opinon with playtesting?

Well the asnwer is they are no different. Only problem is you insist on labelling peoples opinions that you do not agree with as hate. YOU bering the HATE.

You always bring a smile to my face. As long as no one say anything positive about the game the haters are happy in the forum game bashing. I will part now and let the poop storm go on its way. Have fun!!!

 

Originally posted by JasonJ
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by Nanfoodle

There is lots of TES fans here that love the game design. I have been playing TES forever and I for one cant wait to play the game they have designed. I personally think all the people crying about the DAoC model have not taken enough time to look into the game. Its dripping with TES lore, story, world and art, combat and the exploring added has some real depth. For a change here on MMOrpg.com. Lets not flip out yelling fail without knowing something about the game. MMOrpg.com forum hate is so thick sometimes I wonder why I even read the forums any more. Get a grip.

People have legitimate reasons to not like the design. It is called having an opinion.

What I find really offensive is the need for people like you to clasify a difference of opinon as HATE. So please, why don't YOU stop posting the HATE and let others share their opinions in peace. So please go ahead and take your own advice and stop reading if all you can do is accuse people of HATE.

You will notice a pattern, its due to having no choice because there is no real way to refute what is being said. You can see it with how he refuted. "lore, story, world, art, combat and exploring". Only combat and exploring have nothing to do with "looks" which is a cosmetic. The combat hasnt actually been shown fully so that is opinion...and the exploring part is shot to pieces by the design which is walled off closed factions that actually prevents it from being like TES. He never talks about the heart of the game, the DaoC design...which is the very thing TES fans are talking about not liking. He then tries to discredit others opinions with the typical you know nothing attack, when clearly they do by talking about the base game design which is a well known game feature.

The single thing that no one defending the game has ever been able to refute is a simple statement made by another poster on this site.

"if they changed the names of places, npcs and monsters and then changed the way the world looks, would people say "hey this is a TES clone? or would they say hey this is a DaoC clone?" They would say DaoC because the base design is DaoC and the skins are TES".

Cant be refuted because the base game is DaoC, the look is TES. It all comes down to zones with levels all funnelling everyone to the same place, the one and only land PvP can take place in that is behind a magical wall keeping our actual lands safe from harm. Piss poor DaoC themepark PvP design which is nothing like TES where wars took place right in your backyard.

TES is a themepark game that got a themepark model. As for DAoC PvP model its far from the heart of the game. Its just 1 part of the game. The PvE thats been talked about is rich and full of life much like TES. Sure its done in a MMO way but thats what needs to be done as TES with group play a MMO does not make. You have open world dungeons 2 and 5 min. Instance dungeons as well. Solo caves and ruins to explore. Join the mage guild and get rewarded for exploring. There is open world quests and free roaming quests. You also have the new phased events for orgnized guilds and groups to take on and on top of that you get level 50 you get 2 whole maps as elder game to explore to your hearts content. There is so much PvE in this game DAoC AvA map is just one cog in the wheel. A great one but just one. Time to stop beating the same dead horse because your all so far off the mark its not even funny! 

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