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Elder Scrolls Online Forum » General Discussion » They turned a great sandbox genre into a Themepark.

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171 posts found
  Topherpunch

Novice Member

Joined: 9/08/12
Posts: 87

 
OP  4/04/13 9:36:31 PM#1

I am a fan od Elder Scroll, so much that I must protest this game.  I am just going to post all the bad things that I think are very bad ideas. This is not a troll, just a "concerned gamers bad idea, thoughts" post....

Having one PvP area. While I know it is huge I just think putting players in a particular place to PvP is just silly.

One mega server, this is good if you were playing a game like EvE or Darkfall where there are no instaces.

Gaining skills and spells..... Not cool

Targeting..... Why are they ruining the FPS style?

Not able to join other faction area's until you reach maxed level (This could be a rumor) Why?

What did you do to the old crafting system from Elder Scrolls? What is wrong with combining regular items to make weird combines?

Zenimax.....

The root of all evil.....money. Why is Bethesda giving into corporate walkways? You could have created something amazing.

These are just some things I think they really messed up on. Personally I wish they would stop what they are doing and remake. Theme park is dead. I know some people really like themepark games, but  (this is an assumtion) I really think that is because they have not been given anything else. If Skyrim was an MMORPG with hundreds of people running around doing what they want and killing who they wanted...... There would be only one.


Come check out what I have to say on my blog http://civilgamer.com

Also check out http;//agonasylum.com for Darkfall player trading and stories forums

  Squeak69

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/21/13
Posts: 952

cheese cheese wheres da bloody cheese

4/04/13 9:37:53 PM#2

oh gods not another one of these.

im not trying to be a ass but this has been knocked around a ton here can you just post in one of a dozen threads on this alreayd instead of makeing a new one.

F2P may be the way of the future, but ya know they dont make them like they used to
Proper Grammer & spelling are extra, corrections will be LOL at.

  latentPotential

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/08/12
Posts: 7

4/04/13 9:41:43 PM#3

It's a bit of a stretch to call the Elder Scrolls series a 'sandbox'. At most it's a free roam rpg and most preliminary media feedback has pointed towards Zenimax keeping that free roam feeling so calm your tits. 

  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

4/04/13 9:42:11 PM#4
Originally posted by Topherpunch

Zenimax.....

The root of all evil.....money. Why is Bethesda giving into corporate walkways? You could have created something amazing.

FYI, the idea for the basis of this game, DaoC, was so bad that Bethesda swore it off. Zenimax Media is just clueless about the MMO genre and they are pinning their hopes that the snake oil salesmen they created Zenimax Online for knows what they are doing.

Im sure if someone had pointed out to them the difference between sandbox and themepark, and how the DaoC ride was only ridden by 250k people and that the IP with its millions of fans would be, tossed to the side with its design, they would have done what every other major studio did...said hell no to DaoC framework.

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  Slampig

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/29/03
Posts: 2372

Whatever you do, do NOT speak ill of Asheron's Call 2...

4/04/13 9:46:59 PM#5
Originally posted by Topherpunch

I am a fan od Elder Scroll, so much that I must protest this game.  I am just going to post all the bad things that I think are very bad ideas. This is not a troll, just a "concerned gamers bad idea, thoughts" post....

Having one PvP area. While I know it is huge I just think putting players in a particular place to PvP is just silly.

One mega server, this is good if you were playing a game like EvE or Darkfall where there are no instaces.

Gaining skills and spells..... Not cool

Targeting..... Why are they ruining the FPS style?

Not able to join other faction area's until you reach maxed level (This could be a rumor) Why?

What did you do to the old crafting system from Elder Scrolls? What is wrong with combining regular items to make weird combines?

Zenimax.....

The root of all evil.....money. Why is Bethesda giving into corporate walkways? You could have created something amazing.

These are just some things I think they really messed up on. Personally I wish they would stop what they are doing and remake. Theme park is dead. I know some people really like themepark games, but  (this is an assumtion) I really think that is because they have not been given anything else. If Skyrim was an MMORPG with hundreds of people running around doing what they want and killing who they wanted...... There would be only one.

Yes yes, that evil money... You know, if it didn't cost MONEY to produce a game like this and it didn't cost MONEY to support a game like this, I might actually agree with you... You can totally continue to play Skyrim, you should in fact. Just remember how much you paid for that game as well, and that was just to play by yourself...

That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!

  Teala

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/16/04
Posts: 7400

"Really officer, they're herbs."

4/04/13 9:48:08 PM#6
Do like many of us are doing - and don't buy or play the game.   Simple.   Money speaks louder than any words.

  Squeak69

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/21/13
Posts: 952

cheese cheese wheres da bloody cheese

4/04/13 9:48:44 PM#7
Originally posted by Slampig
Originally posted by Topherpunch

I am a fan od Elder Scroll, so much that I must protest this game.  I am just going to post all the bad things that I think are very bad ideas. This is not a troll, just a "concerned gamers bad idea, thoughts" post....

Having one PvP area. While I know it is huge I just think putting players in a particular place to PvP is just silly.

One mega server, this is good if you were playing a game like EvE or Darkfall where there are no instaces.

Gaining skills and spells..... Not cool

Targeting..... Why are they ruining the FPS style?

Not able to join other faction area's until you reach maxed level (This could be a rumor) Why?

What did you do to the old crafting system from Elder Scrolls? What is wrong with combining regular items to make weird combines?

Zenimax.....

The root of all evil.....money. Why is Bethesda giving into corporate walkways? You could have created something amazing.

These are just some things I think they really messed up on. Personally I wish they would stop what they are doing and remake. Theme park is dead. I know some people really like themepark games, but  (this is an assumtion) I really think that is because they have not been given anything else. If Skyrim was an MMORPG with hundreds of people running around doing what they want and killing who they wanted...... There would be only one.

Yes yes, that evil money... You know, if it didn't cost MONEY to produce a game like this and it didn't cost MONEY to support a game like this, I might actually agree with you... You can totally continue to play Skyrim, you should in fact. Just remember how much you paid for that game as well, and that was just to play by yourself...

lets not forget the expansions now, they cost just about the same as the game almost

F2P may be the way of the future, but ya know they dont make them like they used to
Proper Grammer & spelling are extra, corrections will be LOL at.

  Toodles

Novice Member

Joined: 10/15/04
Posts: 74

4/04/13 9:49:20 PM#8

Are you honest to god laughing at daocs 250k subscriber base at that point in time? That was an incredibly succesful model before WoW brought in the themepark MMO and their insanely huge player base they had built up in the warcraft and starcraft RTS series.

The MMO population base in the last decade has absolutely skyrocketed so comparing sub numbers to a game released in 2001 is hysterical at best.

  Sentnl

Novice Member

Joined: 3/07/13
Posts: 79

4/04/13 9:57:10 PM#9

I laugh at all these people who think ES was "sandbox". Haha!

Repeatable quests, predictable dungeons, a fixed skillset, and RNG crafting - Is not sandbox.

I sometimes play under the alias "Exposed". Don't tell anybody.

  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

4/04/13 9:59:10 PM#10
Originally posted by Toodles

Are you honest to god laughing at daocs 250k subscriber base at that point in time? That was an incredibly succesful model before WoW brought in the themepark MMO and their insanely huge player base they had built up in the warcraft and starcraft RTS series.

The MMO population base in the last decade has absolutely skyrocketed so comparing sub numbers to a game released in 2001 is hysterical at best.

UO = 350k+

EQ1 = 450k+

SWG = 350k+

Lineage = 1 million +

Even Final Fantasty 11 had far more players...sorry, I dont ware rose colored glasses when looking at the past, DaoC was not even the top 5 MMO and is very unworthy of bastardizing the TES IP with...hell, WoW isnt even worthy of bastardizing the TES IP, there IS NO NEED TO DO IT, TES can stand on its own with its own base design which we already know can be made into an MMO.

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  Squeak69

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/21/13
Posts: 952

cheese cheese wheres da bloody cheese

4/04/13 10:02:04 PM#11
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Toodles

Are you honest to god laughing at daocs 250k subscriber base at that point in time? That was an incredibly succesful model before WoW brought in the themepark MMO and their insanely huge player base they had built up in the warcraft and starcraft RTS series.

The MMO population base in the last decade has absolutely skyrocketed so comparing sub numbers to a game released in 2001 is hysterical at best.

UO = 350k+

EQ1 = 450k+

SWG = 350k+

Lineage = 1 million +

Even Final Fantasty 11 had far more players...sorry, I dont ware rose colored glasses when looking at the past, DaoC was not even the top 5 MMO and is very unworthy of bastardizing the TES IP with...hell, WoW isnt even worthy of bastardizing the TES IP, there IS NO NEED TO DO IT, TES can stand on its own with its own base design which we already know can be made into an MMO.

people keep saying this but i kinda want to see some source info for it, cause i dont actully agree with it.

F2P may be the way of the future, but ya know they dont make them like they used to
Proper Grammer & spelling are extra, corrections will be LOL at.

  latentPotential

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/08/12
Posts: 7

4/04/13 10:05:11 PM#12
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Toodles

Are you honest to god laughing at daocs 250k subscriber base at that point in time? That was an incredibly succesful model before WoW brought in the themepark MMO and their insanely huge player base they had built up in the warcraft and starcraft RTS series.

The MMO population base in the last decade has absolutely skyrocketed so comparing sub numbers to a game released in 2001 is hysterical at best.

UO = 350k+

EQ1 = 450k+

SWG = 350k+

Lineage = 1 million +

Even Final Fantasty 11 had far more players...sorry, I dont ware rose colored glasses when looking at the past, DaoC was not even the top 5 MMO and is very unworthy of bastardizing the TES IP with...hell, WoW isnt even worthy of bastardizing the TES IP, there IS NO NEED TO DO IT, TES can stand on its own with its own base design which we already know can be made into an MMO.

Since it was pretty much purely a pvp game it was pretty successful for the niche it was aiming for. Suffice it to say it was a commercial success and was the pvp game of its day. 

 

  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

4/04/13 10:20:53 PM#13
Originally posted by Squeak69

which we already know can be made into an MMO.

people keep saying this but i kinda want to see some source info for it, cause i dont actully agree with it.

Oh, right...I forgot there are people that dont know about those things called sandbox games.

People dont know that there were faction based games that didnt have magical walls closing off faction lands...and I am not going to name them all because almost every single faction game ever made did not have DaoCs level of developer hand holding.

People dont know that there were games with factions, that allowed you to actually choose the faction AFTER creation and even allowed you to switch sides...like...SWG.

People dont know that there were games with a massive world that wasnt split into three closed off lands...like, ooh, almost every single other game ever made.

People dont know that an MMO can actually allow a player to train and level up any and ALL crafting...again, if you dont actually know that MMOs did this...I can see why you think the way you do...you dont know much about the genre.

You know the one thing I havent seen...someone actually make a long detailed list of how TES is not a sandbox game and that it fits into the themepark DaoC RvR where the entire world is at war yet is compeletely safe except in the magical world of neverland behind invisible walls.

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  Tierless

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/01/08
Posts: 2085

joie de vivre

4/04/13 10:22:29 PM#14

One word, Testanic

mmorpg.com/blogs/Xobdnas

  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

4/04/13 10:23:45 PM#15
Originally posted by latentPotential
Originally posted by jtcgs

UO = 350k+

EQ1 = 450k+

SWG = 350k+

Lineage = 1 million +

Even Final Fantasty 11 had far more players...sorry, I dont ware rose colored glasses when looking at the past, DaoC was not even the top 5 MMO and is very unworthy of bastardizing the TES IP with...hell, WoW isnt even worthy of bastardizing the TES IP, there IS NO NEED TO DO IT, TES can stand on its own with its own base design which we already know can be made into an MMO.

Since it was pretty much purely a pvp game it was pretty successful for the niche it was aiming for. Suffice it to say it was a commercial success and was the pvp game of its day. 

 

No more so than UO or Lineage...next excuse please.

P.S. Anarchy Online was a commerical success and it only retained around 10k of its 100k in sales and is still running today and all of its players call it THE PvP game of its day. Same with Asherons Call players who will tell you they would take one single duel in that game over any DaoC fight any day of the week.

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  Squeak69

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/21/13
Posts: 952

cheese cheese wheres da bloody cheese

4/04/13 10:25:41 PM#16
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Squeak69

which we already know can be made into an MMO.

people keep saying this but i kinda want to see some source info for it, cause i dont actully agree with it.

Oh, right...I forgot there are people that dont know about those things called sandbox games.

People dont know that there were faction based games that didnt have magical walls closing off faction lands...and I am not going to name them all because almost every single faction game ever made did not have DaoCs level of developer hand holding.

People dont know that there were games with factions, that allowed you to actually choose the faction AFTER creation and even allowed you to switch sides...like...SWG.

People dont know that there were games with a massive world that wasnt split into three closed off lands...like, ooh, almost every single other game ever made.

People dont know that an MMO can actually allow a player to train and level up any and ALL crafting...again, if you dont actually know that MMOs did this...I can see why you think the way you do...you dont know much about the genre.

You know the one thing I havent seen...someone actually make a long detailed list of how TES is not a sandbox game and that it fits into the themepark DaoC RvR where the entire world is at war yet is compeletely safe except in the magical world of neverland behind invisible walls.

that is not a answer it is a long winded sarcasm,

a sand box game is a game that you can build withen, very loose definition but non the less the core of it, people do argue on the definition but meh, i personaly do not agree that game you can have a player based economy in makes a game a sandbox, ( otherwise WoW would count as one) ( if you dont agree with my definition, meh like i said its a very argued subject.)

so in short your sacasm didnt offer any actual useful input, and in my personel definition of a sandbox TES has never been one.

F2P may be the way of the future, but ya know they dont make them like they used to
Proper Grammer & spelling are extra, corrections will be LOL at.

  ElRenmazuo

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 3459

4/04/13 10:39:27 PM#17
Originally posted by Toodles

Are you honest to god laughing at daocs 250k subscriber base at that point in time? That was an incredibly succesful model before WoW brought in the themepark MMO and their insanely huge player base they had built up in the warcraft and starcraft RTS series.

The MMO population base in the last decade has absolutely skyrocketed so comparing sub numbers to a game released in 2001 is hysterical at best.

MMOs before WoW like UO, SWG, Lineage and Final Fantasy 11 had far more subs than daoc in those old days...Lineage and FF11 was in at about 1 million at its time with westerners+eastern players.  And some of those mmos had factions without having closed off areas.

  Sentnl

Novice Member

Joined: 3/07/13
Posts: 79

4/04/13 10:40:35 PM#18
Originally posted by Squeak69
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Squeak69

which we already know can be made into an MMO.

people keep saying this but i kinda want to see some source info for it, cause i dont actully agree with it.

Oh, right...I forgot there are people that dont know about those things called sandbox games.

People dont know that there were faction based games that didnt have magical walls closing off faction lands...and I am not going to name them all because almost every single faction game ever made did not have DaoCs level of developer hand holding.

People dont know that there were games with factions, that allowed you to actually choose the faction AFTER creation and even allowed you to switch sides...like...SWG.

People dont know that there were games with a massive world that wasnt split into three closed off lands...like, ooh, almost every single other game ever made.

People dont know that an MMO can actually allow a player to train and level up any and ALL crafting...again, if you dont actually know that MMOs did this...I can see why you think the way you do...you dont know much about the genre.

You know the one thing I havent seen...someone actually make a long detailed list of how TES is not a sandbox game and that it fits into the themepark DaoC RvR where the entire world is at war yet is compeletely safe except in the magical world of neverland behind invisible walls.

that is not a answer it is a long winded sarcasm,

a sand box game is a game that you can build withen, very loose definition but non the less the core of it, people do argue on the definition but meh, i personaly do not agree that game you can have a player based economy in makes a game a sandbox, ( otherwise WoW would count as one) ( if you dont agree with my definition, meh like i said its a very argued subject.)

so in short your sacasm didnt offer any actual useful input, and in my personel definition of a sandbox TES has never been one.

Umm, sandbox is sandbox by definition. You know the box of sand children play in?

A sandbox game is a game where you can do whatever you want and still make personal progress.

SWG was the last sandbox I played. If you killed stuff, you got xp, if you crafted you got xp.. etc. You could be a harvester, a killer, a crafter, a shop owner.. some people put themselves up for hire to do things, some people asked for tips dancing in the cantina...

Sandbox. Do whatever you want, always succeed.

ES is not a sandbox. Wow is not a sandbox, eso is not a sandbox, etc. They have Sandbox ELEMENTS. :) and that's OKAY.

I sometimes play under the alias "Exposed". Don't tell anybody.

  ElRenmazuo

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 3459

4/04/13 10:42:11 PM#19
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Squeak69

which we already know can be made into an MMO.

people keep saying this but i kinda want to see some source info for it, cause i dont actully agree with it.

Oh, right...I forgot there are people that dont know about those things called sandbox games.

People dont know that there were faction based games that didnt have magical walls closing off faction lands...and I am not going to name them all because almost every single faction game ever made did not have DaoCs level of developer hand holding.

People dont know that there were games with factions, that allowed you to actually choose the faction AFTER creation and even allowed you to switch sides...like...SWG.

People dont know that there were games with a massive world that wasnt split into three closed off lands...like, ooh, almost every single other game ever made.

People dont know that an MMO can actually allow a player to train and level up any and ALL crafting...again, if you dont actually know that MMOs did this...I can see why you think the way you do...you dont know much about the genre.

You know the one thing I havent seen...someone actually make a long detailed list of how TES is not a sandbox game and that it fits into the themepark DaoC RvR where the entire world is at war yet is compeletely safe except in the magical world of neverland behind invisible walls.

Cuz gamers these days are a bunch of brainwashed drones programmed to have this closed mentality.  They are sheep who likes to be directed by a shepard.

  Squeak69

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/21/13
Posts: 952

cheese cheese wheres da bloody cheese

4/04/13 10:44:10 PM#20
Originally posted by Sentnl
Originally posted by Squeak69
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by Squeak69

which we already know can be made into an MMO.

people keep saying this but i kinda want to see some source info for it, cause i dont actully agree with it.

Oh, right...I forgot there are people that dont know about those things called sandbox games.

People dont know that there were faction based games that didnt have magical walls closing off faction lands...and I am not going to name them all because almost every single faction game ever made did not have DaoCs level of developer hand holding.

People dont know that there were games with factions, that allowed you to actually choose the faction AFTER creation and even allowed you to switch sides...like...SWG.

People dont know that there were games with a massive world that wasnt split into three closed off lands...like, ooh, almost every single other game ever made.

People dont know that an MMO can actually allow a player to train and level up any and ALL crafting...again, if you dont actually know that MMOs did this...I can see why you think the way you do...you dont know much about the genre.

You know the one thing I havent seen...someone actually make a long detailed list of how TES is not a sandbox game and that it fits into the themepark DaoC RvR where the entire world is at war yet is compeletely safe except in the magical world of neverland behind invisible walls.

that is not a answer it is a long winded sarcasm,

a sand box game is a game that you can build withen, very loose definition but non the less the core of it, people do argue on the definition but meh, i personaly do not agree that game you can have a player based economy in makes a game a sandbox, ( otherwise WoW would count as one) ( if you dont agree with my definition, meh like i said its a very argued subject.)

so in short your sacasm didnt offer any actual useful input, and in my personel definition of a sandbox TES has never been one.

Umm, sandbox is sandbox by definition. You know the box of sand children play in?

A sandbox game is a game where you can do whatever you want and still make personal progress.

SWG was the last sandbox I played. If you killed stuff, you got xp, if you crafted you got xp.. etc. You could be a harvester, a killer, a crafter, a shop owner.. some people put themselves up for hire to do things, some people asked for tips dancing in the cantina...

Sandbox. Do whatever you want, always succeed.

ES is not a sandbox. Wow is not a sandbox, eso is not a sandbox, etc. They have Sandbox ELEMENTS. :) and that's OKAY.

like i said there is no agreed upon definition for it thats why i just sinmply say as i define it. althopugh i agree with ya on all those points to be honest. but for me a game that is a empty world and you cant build in isnt a sandbox its a game useing sandbox as a excuse for lack of depth.

but meh whatever, its going to be a bit before we get a good sandbox like SWG agian, althoguh a few up and comeing have some poential.

F2P may be the way of the future, but ya know they dont make them like they used to
Proper Grammer & spelling are extra, corrections will be LOL at.

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