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Elder Scrolls Online Forum » General Discussion » WHYYYY LEVELS WHYYYY

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128 posts found
  Scalpless

Elite Member

Joined: 3/22/07
Posts: 1353

1/23/13 6:02:02 AM#21
Did they actually say the game opens up when you reach max level? If they did, then either max level is really easy to reach or this game is one of those "be bored for 100 hours until you reach endgame" deals. That's enough for me to not even consider playing it.
  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

1/23/13 6:07:43 AM#22
I think why they have levels.
1 guild mates can't instantly power up new players / characters with gifted gear
2 players have to commit sometime before entering pvp, so players cant cheese it by flooding the campaign with low level alts of a different alliance
3 they want players to have time exploring the world.
4 they are maybe going with the lowly prisoner in rags start of the tes single player game, sp they want that strong sense of early progression from tes "wow I've got a set of armour" without braking endgame by having veterans going around 1 shotting new 50s
  Maelwydd

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 1169

1/23/13 6:12:55 AM#23
Originally posted by immodium
Originally posted by Maelwydd
Originally posted by Grinnz
There are just a lot of things from a single player game, that just won't work for a MMO. I think leveling up via Alchemy doesn't strike me as a good way for leveling in a multiplayer game.

I disagree. Playing Vanguards at the moment and you can level your character up to max seperately in Adventuring, Crafting and diplomacy. If you want to play just a crafter you can hit max without ever having to swing a sword.

That is perfect character development for me. You get better at what you specifically do, not some arbitary level that means that even though you have never used something you are automatically god like when using it.

I agree that there should be certain ways in leveling your toon other than combat (like in a ES game).

 

Like others have mentioned though they need to think about the whole gear/weapon progression. Whats to stop a vet giving a noob full dragonbone armour?

Off the top of my head...

A person unskilled in the use of heavy armour will find it very heavy to the point that they cannot move. Link the use of items to the skill used. So a noob will have no skill in heavy armour so effectively they will be wearing an impressive looking item but it will offer zero protection as tehy struggle to move it it and are sitting ducks.

A better example would be a sword of demon killing....

Well you don't have the weight issue with armour so how to stop noobs using such a powerful weapon? Again, link it to the relevent skill. Only through a lot of practive will you be good at using a sword. Till you are proficient your hits will not be quick and fluid and will be less powerful and due to your lack of experience using such a weapon you will be unable to harness it's special powers.

Items have nothing to do with using other ways to level excluding combat. If someone wants to use a combat weapon or armour then I see no problem linking their use to the relevent combat skills. A crafter is unlikely to be able to use the items unless they also have skills in combat. And what is the problem with that?

 

  MyTabbycat

Novice Member

Joined: 8/19/12
Posts: 306

1/23/13 6:13:34 AM#24

You really should listen to the interview with Paul Sage as he touches on this some.

Yes, you level up with experience. Once you hit level 50, you will stop leveling but you are only about 1/3rd of the way finished with progressing your character.

Every weapon you use, every piece of armor you wear etc has its own leveling. As you use it, you become more proficient and unlock new abilities. When you are level 50, you continue to work on your skills to unlock new abilities to make your character more versatile. The more versatile your character, the more you are able to adapt to and handle different situations in the game.

  alkarionlog

Elite Member

Joined: 3/19/09
Posts: 1067

1/23/13 6:17:20 AM#25

from wht I remember from they last intervies, ESO will have the pretty stantard lvling like others mmos, so if you want something like skyrim and or morrowind, forget, its will not be here.

 

and jsut to explain about lvling in morrowind, you when creating your char you had to choose some skills for "major skils" that means the skills on major line will be used to define your lvl also the major line lvl faster then the other in minor line(I'm forgeting something here, pretty sure its like this on oblivion but had something else on mnorrowind, but it pretty much this, I think it have major skills minor skills and the one not use for the lvl), also each skill is associate with a stats so the better this skill is better chance for you when you lvl have a +5 bonus to choose for your stat, so several guides and people looking for the max on all char, low lvl run, would choose for major skills they would never use or you can only lvl it if you want, so all combat lines skills would be minors and since from lvl on tehy would try to max this skills.

 

oblivion same thing(but only with major and minor skills), skyrim make the thing a whole lot simplier, you don't have have major/minors skills anymore here all skills will lvl you but on each lvl up you get perks points to spend on skills(fallout 3 anyone?).

FOR HONOR, FOR FREEDOM.... and for some money.

  immodium

Elite Member

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 1355

1/23/13 6:20:35 AM#26
Originally posted by Maelwydd

 - snip-

Im guessing they will have to go down that path, adding skill points to let you use or get benefits from armour/weapons.

It deviates from ES games though as I wasn't restriced in what I could wear/wield.

  faxnadu

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/28/08
Posts: 956

1/23/13 6:25:34 AM#27
Originally posted by jimdandy26
Originally posted by cwliias
Originally posted by jimdandy26
What? Previous ES games have levels too.

They have levels in the facet of you use a sword and it levels up yes... Not go grind XP and level up your character before you can REALLLY play the game

Morrowind had actual player levels too, and from what I understand so did Skyrim.

 

And yes, they have traditional levels, that was revealed way back when they told us that we were not getting real time combat either. ie we have a gcd.

yea, useless rage out of nothing op, grow up ;)

  apocoluster

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/15/07
Posts: 1305

\m/,

1/23/13 6:33:18 AM#28
Originally posted by MyTabbycat

You really should listen to the interview with Paul Sage as he touches on this some.

Yes, you level up with experience. Once you hit level 50, you will stop leveling but you are only about 1/3rd of the way finished with progressing your character.

Every weapon you use, every piece of armor you wear etc has its own leveling. As you use it, you become more proficient and unlock new abilities. When you are level 50, you continue to work on your skills to unlock new abilities to make your character more versatile. The more versatile your character, the more you are able to adapt to and handle different situations in the game.

I have to say. That sounds pretty f'in awesome. Hopefully this version of AA levels slower than character levels

No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin

  proxy42086

Novice Member

Joined: 8/31/09
Posts: 29

1/23/13 6:35:58 AM#29

learn to like it or dont play now stop crying.

 

game isnt even in beta yet and people qqing , pathetic

just wish game devs would say this is how it is not stfu and get over it

  GoldenArrow

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/09/08
Posts: 1133

1/23/13 6:43:08 AM#30

People still have a hard time in understanding that TESO will be a MMORPG.

Not a sequel to the ES series.

  Lawlmonster

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/07/09
Posts: 952

Take my advice, I'm not using it anyway.

1/23/13 6:47:40 AM#31
Originally posted by proxy42086

learn to like it or dont play now stop crying.

 

game isnt even in beta yet and people qqing , pathetic

just wish game devs would say this is how it is not stfu and get over it

Yeah, that's exactly how you get people to buy things from you, tell them to shut the fuck up and get over it. I'm really curious as to how you think a professional development team is supposed to conduct itself. Maybe, instead of taking some ridiculous authoritarian stance that gets us nowhere, you could do a little personal research into the subject, and maybe, just maybe, you'll discover that the fans of the single player Elder Scrolls series have a few reasons to be upset, and that you're actually posting a response on a forum that's been designed for debate. It's pretty weird, I know. Just let it sink in a moment.

"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)

  Lawlmonster

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/07/09
Posts: 952

Take my advice, I'm not using it anyway.

1/23/13 6:49:52 AM#32
Originally posted by GoldenArrow

People still have a hard time in understanding that TESO will be a MMORPG.

Not a sequel to the ES series.

I think everyone understands this, it's not a hard concept to grasp. Why people are bothered by the design for TESO is that it could have technologically been far more similar to their single player series, while remaining an MMO. You don't need skill bars, PvP zones, tab targeting, and a bunch of gimmicky horse shit to make an online game.

"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)

  kosac

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/21/05
Posts: 199

1/23/13 6:56:15 AM#33
welcome back in middle age.. in year 2013 new game with exp based levels and fixed class system..  :))
  Shaike

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/23/12
Posts: 290

At first there were games, then MMOs, then MMORPGs then I understood I had no life :-)

1/23/13 6:57:03 AM#34
Originally posted by GoldenArrow

People still have a hard time in understanding that TESO will be a MMORPG.

Not a sequel to the ES series.

Off-Topic i know just curious - anyone knows if there will be any contiuation to the ES series? another DLC to Skyrim maybe? or another game? Anyone?

I couldn't find anything anywhere about this.....

Just my 2 cents...

  DanitaKusor

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/17/09
Posts: 550

1/23/13 6:58:58 AM#35
Originally posted by Maelwydd

Off the top of my head...

A person unskilled in the use of heavy armour will find it very heavy to the point that they cannot move. Link the use of items to the skill used. So a noob will have no skill in heavy armour so effectively they will be wearing an impressive looking item but it will offer zero protection as tehy struggle to move it it and are sitting ducks.

A better example would be a sword of demon killing....

Well you don't have the weight issue with armour so how to stop noobs using such a powerful weapon? Again, link it to the relevent skill. Only through a lot of practive will you be good at using a sword. Till you are proficient your hits will not be quick and fluid and will be less powerful and due to your lack of experience using such a weapon you will be unable to harness it's special powers.

Items have nothing to do with using other ways to level excluding combat. If someone wants to use a combat weapon or armour then I see no problem linking their use to the relevent combat skills. A crafter is unlikely to be able to use the items unless they also have skills in combat. And what is the problem with that?

Once you have learned how to swing a sword the quality of the sword isn't going to effect your skill with it because you already know the basics.  Most of learning to fight with a sword is understanding how to hold your weapon, where to place your feet and how to attack and counter an enemy's attacks without leaving yourself defencless.

If the sword of demon killing was a completely different class of weapon (e.g. a two-handed sword when you are used to one-handed blades + shield) then yes you will need to learn how to use it.  But if you are merely moving from one similar weapon to a better crafted or magically enchanted weapon of the same type why wouldn't you be able to use it just as well as you could a basic sword?

So I wouldn't restrict low level players from using any weapons in the game but I would make them less effective with those weapons because they aren't as skilled as a higher level player.  I really dislike the standard MMO route of restricting a player from even picking up a weapon that is physically identical to their current weapon because it's a higher level and they can't use it yet.  It's a very lazy design.

The Enlightened take things Lightly

  proxy42086

Novice Member

Joined: 8/31/09
Posts: 29

1/23/13 7:01:53 AM#36
Originally posted by Lawlmonster
Originally posted by proxy42086

learn to like it or dont play now stop crying.

 

game isnt even in beta yet and people qqing , pathetic

just wish game devs would say this is how it is not stfu and get over it

Yeah, that's exactly how you get people to buy things from you, tell them to shut the fuck up and get over it. I'm really curious as to how you think a professional development team is supposed to conduct itself. Maybe, instead of taking some ridiculous authoritarian stance that gets us nowhere, you could do a little personal research into the subject, and maybe, just maybe, you'll discover that the fans of the single player Elder Scrolls series have a few reasons to be upset, and that you're actually posting a response on a forum that's been designed for debate. It's pretty weird, I know. Just let it sink in a moment.

Ive been of the ES myself , I am also disappointed about it. But in every game there are levels there has to be. Every ES had levels.  Theres nothing i can do about it except to overlook it cause I want to play that game.

If you dont like how a game is designed you either ignore it and play it, or you dont play at all.

 

Look at the sorry state of some games where devs listen to appease masses that flock to forums.

  Lawlmonster

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/07/09
Posts: 952

Take my advice, I'm not using it anyway.

1/23/13 7:07:21 AM#37
Originally posted by proxy42086
Originally posted by Lawlmonster
Originally posted by proxy42086

learn to like it or dont play now stop crying.

 

game isnt even in beta yet and people qqing , pathetic

just wish game devs would say this is how it is not stfu and get over it

Yeah, that's exactly how you get people to buy things from you, tell them to shut the fuck up and get over it. I'm really curious as to how you think a professional development team is supposed to conduct itself. Maybe, instead of taking some ridiculous authoritarian stance that gets us nowhere, you could do a little personal research into the subject, and maybe, just maybe, you'll discover that the fans of the single player Elder Scrolls series have a few reasons to be upset, and that you're actually posting a response on a forum that's been designed for debate. It's pretty weird, I know. Just let it sink in a moment.

Ive been of the ES myself , I am also disappointed about it. But in every game there are levels there has to be. Every ES had levels.  Theres nothing i can do about it except to overlook it cause I want to play that game.

If you dont like how a game is designed you either ignore it and play it, or you dont play at all.

 

Look at the sorry state of some games where devs listen to appease masses that flock to forums.

I'm not complaining about the leveling system, really. I mean, I hate the fact that it'll be reduced to having to quest for experience, turning in objectives like "kill ten rats", but I can live with it to some degree. I just don't understand why anyone would come to a forum for discussion, and tell people to shut up or get used to it. Naturally, there's nothing any one of us could do to alter the path of development by posting on this board, I'd hope most of us realize that, but the reason it exists is to debate, argue, or discuss, sort of like we're doing now that we've moved beyond "stfu and deal with it, nerd".

"This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

1/23/13 7:24:10 AM#38
Shaike
Dragonborn dlc is out for skyrim on pc on Feb the 5th

Dawnguard was dlc1, dragonborn is dlc2. Hearthfire isn't an official dlc, its more a content pack like horse armour in oblivion.

Bethseda plan to make 4 total dlcs for skyrim. Plus perhaps some more hearthfire type things. They signed a deal with Microsoft that the xbox would get the first 2 dlcs in advance of other platforms.

The 3rd dlc will Involve the machinations of the thalamor and make the orc strongholds more of a faction.
The 4th dlc will have the civil war step up and let the player decide who will rule skyrim. Will also involve the dunmer dispora.

In addition all 4 dlcs have extra content not in game for the modding community - e.g. werebears. They aim is that by the time all 4 main dlcs ate out, there will be enough resources in the toolset for the community to recreate Morrowind and oblivion within the skyrim engine / advancement system.

Finally they are doing some prep work for tes6, with strong rumours its set in elswher and will feature a new wave of akavir invasion from the eastern continent. Bethseda themselves are not in the main working on TESO. It's being built by zenimax online studios, however they have pulled in a few people from other zenimax teams including both bethseda and ID.
  Betaguy

Novice Member

Joined: 12/31/04
Posts: 2647

Some folks are like Slinkies, totally useless but great fun to watch when pushed down stairs

1/23/13 7:28:03 AM#39

Originally posted by cwliias
... When i heard the words... "When the player hits lvl 50 thats when the game really opens up"... I cried a little... Am i over reacting and if so why and how in the hell is that not going to ruin this game... seriously... player lvls in a ES game... Sounds like a joke to me.

Originally posted by cwliias


Originally posted by jimdandy26
What? Previous ES games have levels too.

They have levels in the facet of you use a sword and it levels up yes... Not go grind XP and level up your character before you can REALLLY play the game

 Not sure what games you two have been playing but yes ES games have normal conventional levels as well. Not in the sense of just leveling up skills/items.  There is a base level that levels up like in any game.  You should go replay Skyrim and take a closer look.

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

1/23/13 7:28:10 AM#40
Lawl
I would be very suprised if kill ten rats quests is the only way to get experience.

I would expect strong xp for just killing stuff in general and exploration. You are supposed to just stumble upon open dungeons and stuff much like the single players

I would also expect it from pvp, unless they are restricting pvp to endgame only.

They might do crafting xp too.
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