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Elder Scrolls Online Forum » General Discussion » This game is not a WoW clone, Its an Elder Scrolls Clone with multiplayer

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99 posts found
  Lateris

Novice Member

Joined: 12/29/05
Posts: 1797

~perspective~

12/02/13 7:45:03 PM#81
Originally posted by aesperus
Originally posted by Iselin
Originally posted by Aldous.Huxley
I played NW & as soon as the tutorial dungeon was over, I vomited.

ESO has the opposite effect on me.

I can make no connection between the two. ESO felt like an old friend while NW felt like that kid from high school that never fit in because he tried too hard to be cool.

There is no connection.

Some people just have to show us their disgust for ESO every chance they get. So they pick a MMO that they think everyone dislikes to compare it too.  Neverwinter, SWTOR, GW2, WOW... take your pick.

Pretty much this ^

There are almost no features from the previous Elder Scrolls games that aren't present in TESO. The game may not be identical to MW, or Oblivion, but it doesn't need to be. It's a new game, with most of the staple Elder Scrolls features set in a massively multiplayer setting. In short, it's Elder Scrolls the MMO. Exactly what was promised.

To be honest, it still baffles me how vehemently numerous people want to bash this game. It's almost never a simple 'i didn't enjoy it, because of X'. No, people seem to need to contrive some made up excuse for why this game is either 'pure crap', or 'not an elder scrolls game'.

Well, I'm sorry, but the game is looking to be good (once they iron out the bugs), it's 110% elder scrolls, and I have yet to see anyone make a valid argument for features that should be in the game, would work in an MMO setting, and aren't there currently.

Absolutely agree with you 100% after testing it. I actually even enjoyed the combat. It has a classic feel to it that sucked me in. One shard for all of us.  

  EQBallzz

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/28/13
Posts: 95

12/02/13 8:59:46 PM#82
Originally posted by JJ82
Originally posted by Ender4

 

The art style and graphics have changed in every single Elder Scrolls game, this doesn't really define what the game is like. Graphics aren't what really matter in a game.

And what "Is" an elder scrolls game?

ESO doesn't have the graphics.

ESO doesn't have the combat.

ESO doesn't have the freedom of choice either racial or factionally.

ESO doesn't have the gameplay since its all been changed for their rather old view of what an MMO is.

ESO doesn't have the lore since they changed it so the empire can be both attacked and taken over even thou the lore states that Tiber Septim is the person who eventually conquerors the Empires lands, even in Morrowind it states that the only time the Empire was attacked after the fall of the last protector it was stopped at Morrowind.

ESO doesn't have the open world.

ESO doesn't have scalable content.

ESO doesn't have the modding ability. Sorry but Neverwinter via the Foundry, Shroud of the Avatar and EQ Landmark WILL so don't tell me MMOs cant have it.

ESO locks you into classes and basically into the trinity not to mention locking most skills into the weapon you have equipped. I mean really, making it so a sorc must have a restoration staff equipped in order to heal in an ES game?!?

So what does ESO have that is TES? It has the name in the title and it took the names of places. This would be no different than CBS making a modern day sitcom and naming it The Lord of the Rings. Sorry, you can call it that but that doesn't make it what you named it.

We already know that an MMO can be made open world(too many to name). We already know an MMO can be made without racial/faction locks(too many to name). We already know an MMO can be made without classes(AC1, TSW). We already know an MMO can be made with the ability to create things in game via a foundry(CoH, STO, NWO, SotA, EQ:L). We already know that the combat could have been kept in this MMO(any MMO with action combat). And we already know that if they hadn't of patterned the game off of DaoC they wouldn't have had to butcher the lore, break the world into locked pieces or lock races or factions.

This doesn't tell me the makers of the game wanted to make an online TES game, they wanted to recreate their first MMO and needed a more popular IP to do it with. Kinda sad really because most of these limitations are not necessary. Worse yet, the series that is always moving forward and pushing the limits of its genre is now going to be represented by an MMO that is trying to regress into the past.

 

Certain sacrifices will have to be made with ESO. If your expectation is Skyrim you have unrealistic expectations. That being said..some of your points are either wrong or off the mark.

"ESO doesn't have the graphics." 

Purely subjective. Many didn't think Skyrim looked that great without tons of mods. It may not be the most advanced looking graphics but the graphics are plenty good for an MMO. I doubt most will have an issue with the graphics.

"ESO doesn't have the combat."

Again, purely subjective and based on what exactly? ES combat has always been considered it's weak point. The combat in ESO is similar to NW which has a very good combat system and for those that hated healing in NW there is the targeting outline which was the one major flaw in NW combat..healing was a pain with no target.

"ESO doesn't have the freedom of choice either racial or factionally."

I agree that this sort of sucks and is a point against the game in the sense of being "Elder Scrolls". However, this is one of the tradeoffs that was necessary IMO for the PVP balance issue. They probably could have come up with a more convoluted way to keep it open and still have the 3 factions but I think it would have been harder to implement, manage and balance.

"ESO doesn't have the modding ability. Sorry but Neverwinter via the Foundry, Shroud of the Avatar and EQ Landmark WILL so don't tell me MMOs cant have it."

Not sure I understand this point or what you consider to be "modding". I wouldn't equate the NW Foundry with EQ Landmark at all. They are not really the same thing. NW Foundry was a great idea that was executed poorly and had little value. EQL and SotA are not released yet so I don't think it's worthwhile to even speculate about them. If by modding you are referring to the Skyrim type modding community then I think it's obvious an MMO wouldn't have that so is irrelevant.

"ESO locks you into classes and basically into the trinity not to mention locking most skills into the weapon you have equipped. I mean really, making it so a sorc must have a restoration staff equipped in order to heal in an ES game?!?"

Again, I have to agree that the lack of pure class freedom sort of sucks in the context of ES but again I have to side with ESO for implementing something that provides a more stable group structure which is what basic classes do. Class interdependence is important.

The point about having to use a resto staff to heal might be true for the sorcerer but that is because sorcerer is a dmg dealer. The fact that you have a healing option as a damage dealer is a nice. Conversely, you can roll a Templar and use heavy armor and a 2 hander and still heal without a resto staff. The staff and light armor might be more efficient but there are options. Consider any penalties for not taking the most efficient path a "hybrid penalty" which is always present in some form anyway. You can't have class that is pure dmg dealer and pure healer all in one. That would be absurd.

  CthulhuPuffs

Novice Member

Joined: 3/03/13
Posts: 379

Will consume your soul, yet stay crunchy in milk

12/02/13 11:37:59 PM#83
Originally posted by JJ82

And what "Is" an elder scrolls game?

ESO doesn't have the graphics.

ESO doesn't have the combat.

ESO doesn't have the freedom of choice either racial or factionally.

ESO doesn't have the gameplay since its all been changed for their rather old view of what an MMO is.

ESO doesn't have the lore since they changed it so the empire can be both attacked and taken over even thou the lore states that Tiber Septim is the person who eventually conquerors the Empires lands, even in Morrowind it states that the only time the Empire was attacked after the fall of the last protector it was stopped at Morrowind.

ESO doesn't have the open world.

ESO doesn't have scalable content.

ESO doesn't have the modding ability. Sorry but Neverwinter via the Foundry, Shroud of the Avatar and EQ Landmark WILL so don't tell me MMOs cant have it.

ESO locks you into classes and basically into the trinity not to mention locking most skills into the weapon you have equipped. I mean really, making it so a sorc must have a restoration staff equipped in order to heal in an ES game?!?

So what does ESO have that is TES? It has the name in the title and it took the names of places. This would be no different than CBS making a modern day sitcom and naming it The Lord of the Rings. Sorry, you can call it that but that doesn't make it what you named it.

We already know that an MMO can be made open world(too many to name). We already know an MMO can be made without racial/faction locks(too many to name). We already know an MMO can be made without classes(AC1, TSW). We already know an MMO can be made with the ability to create things in game via a foundry(CoH, STO, NWO, SotA, EQ:L). We already know that the combat could have been kept in this MMO(any MMO with action combat). And we already know that if they hadn't of patterned the game off of DaoC they wouldn't have had to butcher the lore, break the world into locked pieces or lock races or factions.

This doesn't tell me the makers of the game wanted to make an online TES game, they wanted to recreate their first MMO and needed a more popular IP to do it with. Kinda sad really because most of these limitations are not necessary. Worse yet, the series that is always moving forward and pushing the limits of its genre is now going to be represented by an MMO that is trying to regress into the past.

100% agree

 

Bringer of Eternal Darkness and Despair, but also a Nutritious way to start your Morning.

Games Played: Too Many

  jdnyc

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/10/12
Posts: 1729

12/03/13 12:23:11 AM#84
Lol! I can't even with this thread. "WE GOT SOME ACTION COMBAT!" "Must be Neverwinter."
  Tamanous

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/22/09
Posts: 1632

12/03/13 12:32:27 AM#85

You guys are all dinks!

 

 

 

 

Now I think I am really interested in this game. ;)

 

Although I love all the hate. It should be clear to almost anyone with reasonable intelligence that a Skyrim game simply made multiplayer without changes would be terrible. The issue isn't if it should be exactly the same. It won't be when translated to multiplayer. The issue should be if the game ends up with content that keeps players coming back to it. That is the main challenge for mmos today. Everything else simply has to work and be fun even if it is different.

 

Take a step back and realize how stupid you sound repeating the same thing over and over ... "the game won't be the same!". You know it won't be. That isn't the issue. The issue is if the game you end up with is fun and exciting and contributes to the next chapter of the IP. If it falls short in it's game play at any point then the failing is there. 

 

Who seriously expects to have the same single player game ... when hundreds of other players are around? 

You stay sassy!

  BeansnBread

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/19/06
Posts: 5540

12/03/13 12:52:01 AM#86
Originally posted by jdnyc
Lol! I can't even with this thread. "WE GOT SOME ACTION COMBAT!" "Must be Neverwinter."

The combat DOES share a lot of similarities with Neverwinter Online. I'm not sure why everyone has jumped into a defensive posture over it since I think combat was one of Neverwinter's strengths. The other thread that has been popular for "hater vs fanboy" drama over the last couple of days asked what other MMOs Elder Scrolls Online resembles. I'd say there is definitely a resemblance there.

 

I'd also say that even though the game world is instanced, it doesn't FEEL like Neverwinter in that respect at all. It's not an open world, but it's not a series of dungeon instances and small shared zones either.

 

Either way, people are getting way overzealous on both sides. Especially considering that a lot of what is being said is based on people's opinion. People are going to get to play this thing and make their own decision about what the game is like relatively soon. We are 6 or so months out from release and there will likely be some open betas a month or more before that and before that there will likely be footage. For those of us that actually got in beta, there are a wide array of opinions even among them. The forums were vibrant with feedback, some good, some bad, but there were more than enough opinions about every single tiny detail.

 

Can we just get over the idea that it is bad that there are similarities to other MMORPGs in this game? It seems like everyone just wants it to be so unique. That's just going to lead to disappointment. The game is an MMORPG. It acts like one in every way which to some people is going to be difficult to deal with and others its going to be great.

SWTOR is the greatest mmo ever!

  jdnyc

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/10/12
Posts: 1729

12/03/13 1:15:43 AM#87
For me being unique isn't the issue. It's somehow saying that ESO is like Neverwintee solely because of action combat. Is every tab target game the same then?
  BeansnBread

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/19/06
Posts: 5540

12/03/13 1:19:18 AM#88
Originally posted by jdnyc
For me being unique isn't the issue. It's somehow saying that ESO is like Neverwintee solely because of action combat. Is every tab target game the same then?

No, of course not. And I agree with you. Saying the game is like Neverwinter without getting specific about anything is just shitty communication.

SWTOR is the greatest mmo ever!

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5511

12/03/13 1:32:35 AM#89
Originally posted by colddog04
Originally posted by jdnyc
Lol! I can't even with this thread. "WE GOT SOME ACTION COMBAT!" "Must be Neverwinter."

The combat DOES share a lot of similarities with Neverwinter Online. I'm not sure why everyone has jumped into a defensive posture over it since I think combat was one of Neverwinter's strengths. The other thread that has been popular for "hater vs fanboy" drama over the last couple of days asked what other MMOs Elder Scrolls Online resembles. I'd say there is definitely a resemblance there.

I like Neverwinter combat a lot. When people describe the combat in this game I do think of Neverwinter. I'm not sure why that would be a bad thing either. Tera, Neverwinter, and Firefall are probably my 3 favorite combat systems.

I think a mind wipe so people could play an mmo like it was their first time again, would be easier to build than a new mmo people here would actually like. - DamonVile

  franko79

Novice Member

Joined: 4/28/05
Posts: 45

12/03/13 1:32:58 AM#90
Who cares what clone it is ? It is just money grab on ES fans, crap game like start trek, swtor and neverwinter.  Poor animation, combat also is bleeh. Will it sell ? yes... because its ESO will it be good and last long term ? I dont thinks so.
  loulaki

Elite Member

Joined: 12/20/11
Posts: 777

12/03/13 2:31:01 AM#91
Originally posted by sludgebeard
Seriously, everyone who is hating on ESO just take it for what it really is, a new Elder Scrolls installment with multiplayer!

its a Chimaira of WoW, Skyrim, DAOC and 'the Sims' !!!

  STYNKFYST

Elite Member

Joined: 5/27/13
Posts: 300

12/03/13 2:36:43 AM#92
Originally posted by franko79
Who cares what clone it is ? It is just money grab on ES fans, crap game like start trek, swtor and neverwinter.  Poor animation, combat also is bleeh. Will it sell ? yes... because its ESO will it be good and last long term ? I dont thinks so.

Poor animation? Bad combat?

 

I guess you...as well as most on this sight are just out of your mind or are just expecting too much from any MMO to come.

  asrlohz

Novice Member

Joined: 7/29/11
Posts: 648

Alea iacta est, beloved Doomsayers.

12/03/13 2:57:16 AM#93
Originally posted by sludgebeard

Ok just so we are all on the same page here, im talking about this ESO:

 

 

Not this ESO:

Thank you. Maybe people will stop holding onto the development builds they made back in 2009 now. In my honesty opinion, the game looks a lot more lively than Skyrim thanks to all the unique foliage and asset quality in general. Sure, the textures will always be worse but all in all I think that they've added much more diversity in both armour, enviromental assets and Character Design since Skyrim.

  Vonatar

Elite Member

Joined: 7/18/10
Posts: 553

12/03/13 2:58:36 AM#94

Everything in life can be nitpicked, because nothing is perfect. The question is, though, does it need to be perfect, or is good good enough?

 

Whether TESO will be good enough, I don't know. For some people it will be - it will be the desired "Elder Scrolls with friends" or "DAoC reboot". Taking an overall view, my only concern for the game is that they do not fall into the slimline MMO trap of recent years and the game is only fun for a few weeks until there is nothing left to do but PVP. I also do not want to see the mistakes of SWTOR repeated, where story is all there is and the game is just a glorified single-player experience.

  fantasyfreak112

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/20/13
Posts: 523

12/03/13 3:00:12 AM#95
Saying TESO is a Elder Scroll clone is just as far fetched as WoW clone. You're kidding yourself if you think this game is anything like any Elder Scrolls game.
  asrlohz

Novice Member

Joined: 7/29/11
Posts: 648

Alea iacta est, beloved Doomsayers.

12/03/13 3:18:09 AM#96
Originally posted by fantasyfreak112
Saying TESO is a Elder Scroll clone is just as far fetched as WoW clone. You're kidding yourself if you think this game is anything like any Elder Scrolls game.

I think that a lot of TES fans will enjoy TES:O. The majority of them, actually. And the TES Fanbase is an adaptable bunch. Just consider the jumps from Morrowind to Oblivion to Skyrim. Those were massive. 3D came in, hitboxes, physics, voice acting and all manner of interesting things. But also things that they disliked such as the Orcs in Oblivion, the lockpicking system (Which I personally enjoyed), the leveling system, the combat changes, the amount of weapons and armour reduction and the graphical changes. All of that didn't bother anyone too much. Even Skyrim's grindy Radiant Questlines didn't phase anyone too much.

 

The majority of the TES fans interested in TES:O will most likely like it in the same way the majority of the Warcraft RTS fans enjoyed WoW. If a game is well made, that's all good. But if the player is engaged in the story and immersed in the universe, it will be great.

  daltanious

Elite Member

Joined: 4/19/08
Posts: 1678

12/03/13 5:44:28 AM#97
Originally posted by sludgebeard
Seriously, everyone who is hating on ESO just take it for what it really is, a new Elder Scrolls installment with multiplayer!

I hope much more will be Wow clone then ESO. ESO was ... one big, empty, boring .... world. World of avatars that looked like all ate wooden stick for dinner. World where was same epic fight killing some rat regardless level of player. Skyrim I enjoyed more but still could not force myself to stay in for more then month or two as I remember.

  Lord.Bachus

Elite Member

Joined: 5/14/07
Posts: 8532

I believe in life before death... So dont forget to enjoy it while you still can.

12/03/13 6:52:55 AM#98
Originally posted by asrlohz
Originally posted by sludgebeard

Ok just so we are all on the same page here, im talking about this ESO:

 

 

Not this ESO:

Thank you. Maybe people will stop holding onto the development builds they made back in 2009 now. In my honesty opinion, the game looks a lot more lively than Skyrim thanks to all the unique foliage and asset quality in general. Sure, the textures will always be worse but all in all I think that they've added much more diversity in both armour, enviromental assets and Character Design since Skyrim.

Well, the upper picture is proof enough that the grahics dont look anything near Neverwinter...  But then we knew that allready from dozens of videos..

 

High quallity texels is of minor importance to what a game looks like,  its the art style the attention for details and the annimations that make a world look alive...   A world like lotro still keeps surprising me after 7 years its still among the best looking mmo worlds, and thats not because of a high texelrate.

Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations)
Currently playing : The Elder Scrolls Online and Wildstar

  asrlohz

Novice Member

Joined: 7/29/11
Posts: 648

Alea iacta est, beloved Doomsayers.

12/04/13 5:53:25 AM#99
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
Originally posted by asrlohz

Thank you. Maybe people will stop holding onto the development builds they made back in 2009 now. In my honesty opinion, the game looks a lot more lively than Skyrim thanks to all the unique foliage and asset quality in general. Sure, the textures will always be worse but all in all I think that they've added much more diversity in both armour, enviromental assets and Character Design since Skyrim.

Well, the upper picture is proof enough that the grahics dont look anything near Neverwinter...  But then we knew that allready from dozens of videos..

 

High quallity texels is of minor importance to what a game looks like,  its the art style the attention for details and the annimations that make a world look alive...   A world like lotro still keeps surprising me after 7 years its still among the best looking mmo worlds, and thats not because of a high texelrate.

Maybe I'll look into LotR:O when I can. I remember purchasing it back in Vanilla when I couldn't afford a proper PC and used my father's old one. I could barely run it.

And agreed, texture isn't super important, just look at Dishonored, it had the most basic, washed out, texture low graphics I had ever seen in a modern game published by Bethesda but it complemented the world and artstyle so well. That universe was very immersive.

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