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Elder Scrolls Online Forum » General Discussion » Cryodiil and 3 alliances/seige weapons/keeps reminisce of Dark Age of Camelot

10 posts found
  Kuanshu

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/19/04
Posts: 277

 
OP  6/17/13 11:38:14 AM#1

Hello all :)

Anyone here play Dark Ageof Camelot? I played beta, release, and until our last relic fell in the last keep as the last man standing on the Merlin Server and shortly thereafter.

ESO is very reminisce of DAoC

DAoC had 4 races per Realm; ESO has 3 races per Alliance

DAoC had a huge PvP zone with keeps protecting relics which each Realm had to protect or lay siege (using seige weapons) to in order to gain advantage and get bonuses to their realm and then gain dominion over the other Realms; ESO has Cryodiil and it is comprised of Keeps and Siege Weapons and claiming and holding keeps gives bonuses and advantages to their alliance until one of them is placed as EMPEROR of Cryodiil.

You can PvP and also PvE in the contested zone in DAoC;ESO states Cryodiil is the PvP zone yet you can also do quests and PvE and yet there are also towns and merchants as well as your alliance gaining influence of these areas if you occupy the keeps in the area.

In DAoC however a keep could be contested at any time and no matter how good the keep improvements were it could be easily taken at any hour and was often taken during low population hours; ESO has stated they are going to have timers and such to prevent this from happening and this only makes sense as peeps gotta sleep, work, etc...as this is a game and there is life to be lived as well.

DAoC was lopsided simply because certain classes/races had advantages and early on Midgard had this and all of the Powergaming Guilds knew this early on and so that is where they put their might on the Merlin Server; ESO is mainly a skill based game with levels yet primary emphasis is on raising skills as there are limitations due to point placement and the role of the character/template therein and one has yet to discern how racial traits and advantages play into this scheme. Curious however as to how ESO will handle a lopsided population or serious powergamer guilds on a particular alliance. I am aware everyone will be on a megaserver yet within a particular channel on whatever platform they choose to use to play ESO.

So many correlations to draw from concerning DAoC and ESO as this is the nature of this genre and surely MMORPGs have evolved as such to date because of the great MMORPGs of the past.

I for one am really looking forward to Elder Scrolls Online as I have watched my son play Oblivion and Skyrim and have played them as well with him.

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 3702

6/17/13 11:46:50 AM#2

Yes, there are lots of us around here (Iselin, Theurgist, Guinevere) but we keep the RvR aspects of the game quiet so we don't set-off the "true TES fans." Matt Firor stole and perverted the Elder Scrolls dontchaknow... mum's the word

And welcome...you'll soon find-out what I mean.

  Entinerint

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/06/12
Posts: 713

6/18/13 7:10:12 AM#3

Welcome to May 2012.  I guess people are still finding out about this game even now.

As for DAOC, it was a deeply flawed game that 250,000 people played and everyone looks back on with rose-colored glasses because it was very different for its time.  I guess retreading 10-year-old game designs is the norm though so I'm sure it'll be great!

  azzamasin

Elite Member

Joined: 6/06/12
Posts: 2623

We live in a fantasy world, a world of illusion. The great task in life is to find reality.

6/18/13 7:12:46 AM#4
Originally posted by Entinerint

Welcome to May 2012.  I guess people are still finding out about this game even now.

As for DAOC, it was a deeply flawed game that 250,000 people played and everyone looks back on with rose-colored glasses because it was very different for its time.  I guess retreading 10-year-old game designs is the norm though so I'm sure it'll be great!

There are gamers who do not read forums nor follow gaming sites and a huge part of advertising is still via "word of Mouth."  I suspect TESO will always have people who haven't heard of the game all the way up till launch.

If your idea of a Sandbox is open FFA Full Loot PvP, full crafted world with minimal support for anything combat then your sandbox ideas are bad! Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

  zaylin

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/11/06
Posts: 792

6/18/13 3:39:14 PM#5
Originally posted by Entinerint

Welcome to May 2012.  I guess people are still finding out about this game even now.

As for DAOC, it was a deeply flawed game that 250,000 people played and everyone looks back on with rose-colored glasses because it was very different for its time.  I guess retreading 10-year-old game designs is the norm though so I'm sure it'll be great!

I don't think its about retreading a game design. If you really read posts from vets/fans of DAoC, It was the Realm Pride, and Community that emerged Because of the design. You really think the programers back then would realize the impact DAoC would have on future PvP/RvR out looks?

I honestly dont think trying to recapture that feeling is a bad thing, just have to approche it right. And I think WAR left a lot of people with a bad taste in their mouth.

I for one was to late to the train so to  speak to experience the Realm Pride magic :)  everyone talks about. But have always had a urning to do so. Because to me having a fun,engaging,active community is one of the true magics IMO, wether it has a single player, multi player, mmo player aspect.

  Iselin

The Listener

Joined: 3/04/08
Posts: 3702

6/18/13 4:19:34 PM#6
Originally posted by zaylin
Originally posted by Entinerint

Welcome to May 2012.  I guess people are still finding out about this game even now.

As for DAOC, it was a deeply flawed game that 250,000 people played and everyone looks back on with rose-colored glasses because it was very different for its time.  I guess retreading 10-year-old game designs is the norm though so I'm sure it'll be great!

I don't think its about retreading a game design. If you really read posts from vets/fans of DAoC, It was the Realm Pride, and Community that emerged Because of the design. You really think the programers back then would realize the impact DAoC would have on future PvP/RvR out looks?

I honestly dont think trying to recapture that feeling is a bad thing, just have to approche it right. And I think WAR left a lot of people with a bad taste in their mouth.

I for one was to late to the train so to  speak to experience the Realm Pride magic :)  everyone talks about. But have always had a urning to do so. Because to me having a fun,engaging,active community is one of the true magics IMO, wether it has a single player, multi player, mmo player aspect.

 I'm actually sort of skeptical myself about anyone's ability to duplicate that feeling. A big part of it was the lack of content that DAoC had compared to the 2013 MMO standard--RvR didn't have to compete with as many other in-game activities as ESO will. Questing was minimal and PvE raids of any sort only came in later on with the Dragon and a few other things. As a matter of fact I remember a clear change in the community's response to "The Hibs are attacking! Come help defend!" whenever the Albion dragon was scheduled to make an appearance. When people do the same things together, they tend to connect more and stay connected...that was most of it.

Realm separation was another device that helped create the "us vs. them" feeling that also contributed.

But the main thing, IMHO, was that DAoC came out a time when neither MMOs nor broadband were mainstream. There was still an air of "Holy Shit! I'm grouped with a dude from NYC, another one from Anchoarage and a girl from Winnipeg...how neat is that?" It was different times and the MMO players were a tighter community that had much more in common with each other than the current millions do. We're a hell of a lot more plugged-in now and pretty blasé about it. That novelty element is gone.

Don't get me wrong, I hope that feeling can be re-created because it made you want to log-in and play again with all your new friends. But I doubt it can be done again.

But even without that, RvR has a lot more potential for large scale strategic and tactical organized fantasy warfare than either scattered open world or time-limited scenario quickies with 20 people. That's what I'm looking forward to and it's more than enough for me if the design of the terrain, keeps, etc., is conducive to that type of play. And if they make the rewards appropriate for good RvR instead of the mess they created in WAR that led to keep-flipping zergs with zero defense because no other type of PvP was as efficient for accumulating points...which you needed to get better at RvR.

It wasn't that way at first in WAR when the scenarios were the fastest way to level or accumulate points--the leveling obsessed went there instead and some good RvR happened out in the world for a little while. But once they nerfed that, keep flipping was what it became all about. This is something ESO has to get right for AvA to have a chance at succeeding.

A great community and realm pride? That would just be a bonus.

  SoMuchMass

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/16/13
Posts: 583

6/18/13 4:22:57 PM#7
Matt Firor the Game Director of ESO is from DAoC.  A lot of other devs from ESO are from DAoC including the Lead PvP guy.
  zaylin

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/11/06
Posts: 792

6/19/13 2:03:45 AM#8

RvR has a lot more potential for large scale strategic and tactical organized fantasy warfare than either scattered open world or time-limited scenario quickies with 20 people. That's what I'm looking forward to.

Yep, Fully agree. As I said in another post, I stopped playing Guild Wars 2 because the WvW was just a zerg fests for the most part (again). And on top of that the Q time would be anywhere from 30 minutes to almost 2 hours,lol kinda reminded me of trying to sack a capital city in WAR (imo).

But after watching a couple of videos with PvP Lead:Brian Wheeler, it SOUNDS promising {crosses fingers} especially how everyone gets  a campaign asigned, so no wait time, and if not much is going on in your campaign you have a side one to jump into.

  Kuanshu

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/19/04
Posts: 277

 
OP  6/19/13 9:19:12 AM#9
Originally posted by SoMuchMass
Matt Firor the Game Director of ESO is from DAoC.  A lot of other devs from ESO are from DAoC including the Lead PvP guy.

Well that explains alot and yes I am relatively new to this forum as I have been on hiatus for a few years from gaming MMORPGs

I wonder which server they played on in DAoC; In beta before launch some of the serious powergaming pvp guilds were going to the Merlin Server so it had a really competitive air about it in gameplay and I was really in the mood back then so that is where I had my start which climaxed into alot of notoriety and from what I was told my character was talked about for sometime thereafter and sold often. I will freely admit this simply cuz participating in MMORPGs for me was leisure yet it was such an obsessive, competitive, impulsive recreation for me that I devoted way too much time towards I wanted some benefit or rather recompensation out of it in the end I often sold my characters from MMORPGs and rightly so...

Simply said I only played DAoC in the beginning as death in Realm vs Realm was so quick that many didn't realize they died until afterwards. Though this may be more realistic it is a game and should be enjoyable for everyone involved. Yes Dark Age of Camelot was the smoothest beta I had ever participated in at that time and it ran flawless. First game that really introduced mounts as travel between areas. Keeps and Siege Weapons with 3 Realms in contention was the masterstroke and the reason it was a hit for as long as it was no matter how unbalanced gameplay was or how poorly implimented much of the Realm vs Realm zone was implimented. It was revolutionary in many ways to this industry and a success in its own way and admired by many, as we see so clearly with ESO PvP Design Plan.

I do not fault developers or ESO in any way if they are going to utilize many facets of DAoC Realm vs Realm Warfare; rather I applaud them and rightly so. If they can really pull this off and bring it fruition on PC/Mac, PS4, and Xbox One their investors and fans will be quite impressed.

What has everyone be wanting for years? Good Graphics, Immersive Gameplay, Interactive and Dynamic AI, Awesome PvP yet not just Open  world PvP but more like your a part of something like  RvR (realm vs realm), FvF (faction vs faction) , AvA (alliance vs alliance), Dynamic and everchanging  deatailed environment, Questing/Exploring/Adventuring as a group or on your own, etc...I really see ESO offering much of this and then some.

So what if they borrow from successful MMORPGs of the past as this is the nature of this genre and how things have evolved.

 

 

  zaylin

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/11/06
Posts: 792

6/19/13 9:22:28 PM#10

Well Put  Kuanshu. Keeping my finger crossed too. 2 of my buddies are hoping they pull this off as well, big fans of the ES-SP series. We 3 amigos :) have been looking for an MMO we all can enjoy again.

My buddy even said the famous words "Man I wish Skyrim was multi-player". There is nothing like sharing epic adventures with your pals :) .And most in the last 3 years have not caught all of our attention.