I have a friend in RL that plays this game, but I just can't get into it. For one, it feels dead--I'm only a level 7 black mage, but I don't play MMOs to solo everything. Personally this is a fundemental problem of level-based games, not just FF, so I'm going to drop this gripe.

My biggest gripe however has to do with the communities attitude. "If you don't sub white mage on summoner, no one will party with you." What. The. Flying. You-know-what. Even my RL friend has this attitude about min-maxing. I can understand why min-maxing is beneficial, espicially after dying and de-leveling, but for me it takes the immersion out of the game. This leads to another gripe: the combat. It seems so static. If I can kill something than I can kill it. No surprises. My friend once told me while watching me play EVE that it seemed more like Excel-in-space. I whole-heartedly agree, but Final Fantasy feels like Excel with the equations already filled out and I just keep telling it to recalculate.

I know this is a troll thread, but in all honesty, I'm also hoping you can soothe my thoughts.

I agree.

To be honest, the multiple classes and subjobs was a major mistake. Along with the Armor. The augments you can put on them were piss poor, and not even worth doing at times.

This BS about always having to play the game how someone else tells you to, just shows the community is poor. It's SquareEnix's fault along with the players for the reason of this. SE designed the game like this, the players just made it happen.

The major fall of this game is it's lack of a good community. The game has it's advantages and disadvantages like any other game. But I've NEVER played a game with this many adults that has a crap attitude. And yes. Alot of the players are over 18. The people who are not adults, I can understand their attitudes, but an adult?!

Btw a little off topic.

I don't believe in "Trolling"

I've looked up trolling in many different places, and even asked many people what it means. Really from what i've read/heard. Everyone is a troll in their own way.

The starting levels are solo. You can party if you want, but it's more efficient to just solo. You get to a point where partying is the best option. Even with all the new solo or smaller group options in this game, full parties are still around as well.

People are just trying to get their exp as fast as they can in a party. You can't help that unless you make your own parties, which isn't hard to do, just people are lazy. SMN's don't have too many useful options for a sub which is why most fall back on /WHM more than anything else. They don't get super strong until later in the game, so they're mostly buffers in parties because they have a timer between abilities for their summons. They really have nothing else to do but heal in that time. But, this coming update seems to be changing things for SMN. No one knows how yet, we'll see.

Don't be discouraged, there are still good people. I see them all the time. I like to say I'm one of them.

Most people party to get EXP. And in terms of getting exp, for smn, /whm is far better than anything else. Partying is a group effort with the express purpose of getting exp. It is both unreasonable and selfish to expect other people to sacrifice exp by inviting a smn/blm or whatever.

That's not the same as saying you can't play smn/blm, you can. However, you're expecting people to only cater to your preferences, and sorry but that's not how life works. Best you learn this from a video game.

Finally, about "It seems so static. If I can kill something than I can kill it. No surprises." Hello...? This is an RPG? Perhaps you mistook this for an RTS or FPS? That quote applies to virtually all computer controlled opponents, so I don't know if you're just not really familiar with computer games or what.

Originally posted by mrcalhou

I have a friend in RL that plays this game, but I just can't get into it. For one, it feels dead--I'm only a level 7 black mage, but I don't play MMOs to solo everything. Personally this is a fundemental problem of level-based games, not just FF, so I'm going to drop this gripe.

My biggest gripe however has to do with the communities attitude. "If you don't sub white mage on summoner, no one will party with you." What. The. Flying. You-know-what. Even my RL friend has this attitude about min-maxing. I can understand why min-maxing is beneficial, espicially after dying and de-leveling, but for me it takes the immersion out of the game. This leads to another gripe: the combat. It seems so static. If I can kill something than I can kill it. No surprises. My friend once told me while watching me play EVE that it seemed more like Excel-in-space. I whole-heartedly agree, but Final Fantasy feels like Excel with the equations already filled out and I just keep telling it to recalculate.

I know this is a troll thread, but in all honesty, I'm also hoping you can soothe my thoughts.

It's not just you, in fact. The reasons you stated are exactly why they are making FFXIV.

Originally posted by ImperialPand

Most people party to get EXP. And in terms of getting exp, for smn, /whm is far better than anything else. Partying is a group effort with the express purpose of getting exp. It is both unreasonable and selfish to expect other people to sacrifice exp by inviting a smn/blm or whatever.

That's not the same as saying you can't play smn/blm, you can. However, you're expecting people to only cater to your preferences, and sorry but that's not how life works. Best you learn this from a video game.

Finally, about "It seems so static. If I can kill something than I can kill it. No surprises." Hello...? This is an RPG? Perhaps you mistook this for an RTS or FPS? That quote applies to virtually all computer controlled opponents, so I don't know if you're just not really familiar with computer games or what.

Your stating to make a good point  ...

People what smn/whm because it fills the role of either primary healer or support heal. That is what the party needs at the time so that is the role they are looking to fill. Without /whm you are not able to heal (well). As Imperial said it is selfish to expect a party to accept you being not what they need in order for you to party with them. If the party was looking for SMN as a DD or buffer then /blm is fine (if not slightly better than /whm). The problem with the game overall is that you do need specific roles for certain parties. For instance a party of 4 THFs can take down colibri very very well and very quickly. But those 4 thf would not do very well with fighting skeletons. So inviting a THF to a skull party is not a good move because it doesn't fit the role the party wants to fill and that is a group of blunt damage melee.

Originally posted by denshing

Originally posted by mrcalhou

I have a friend in RL that plays this game, but I just can't get into it. For one, it feels dead--I'm only a level 7 black mage, but I don't play MMOs to solo everything. Personally this is a fundemental problem of level-based games, not just FF, so I'm going to drop this gripe.

My biggest gripe however has to do with the communities attitude. "If you don't sub white mage on summoner, no one will party with you." What. The. Flying. You-know-what. Even my RL friend has this attitude about min-maxing. I can understand why min-maxing is beneficial, espicially after dying and de-leveling, but for me it takes the immersion out of the game. This leads to another gripe: the combat. It seems so static. If I can kill something than I can kill it. No surprises. My friend once told me while watching me play EVE that it seemed more like Excel-in-space. I whole-heartedly agree, but Final Fantasy feels like Excel with the equations already filled out and I just keep telling it to recalculate.

I know this is a troll thread, but in all honesty, I'm also hoping you can soothe my thoughts.

 

It's not just you, in fact. The reasons you stated are exactly why they are making FFXIV.

Well... other than that MMOs can make them a lot of money :)

Ummm what? FFXIV has been in development since FFXI's release before they knew people would be so gripy. As for the job's / SJ system it really was innovative there will always be a better choice and to some degree you have options but if you think it's smart to play BLM/THF then maybe you should be considering another game.

Originally posted by AsuraGerry

if you think it's smart to play BLM/THF then maybe you should be considering another game.

 /THF does give the greatest INT boost ... not saying it is smart since you sacrifice additional spells and MP, but that whole Flee this is teh ubernes

well i was just trying to come up with a bad example but forgive my knowledge on blm lol my point is it's only natural that the community will gravitate to certain trends that are proven most effective.

Originally posted by ic0n67

Originally posted by AsuraGerry

if you think it's smart to play BLM/THF then maybe you should be considering another game.

 

 /THF does give the greatest INT boost ... not saying it is smart since you sacrifice additional spells and MP, but that whole Flee this is teh ubernes

Yes if you solo. When you solo you can use whatever works for you. In a party situation you choose what's best for a party.

Originally posted by mrcalhou

I have a friend in RL that plays this game, but I just can't get into it. For one, it feels dead--I'm only a level 7 black mage, but I don't play MMOs to solo everything. Personally this is a fundemental problem of level-based games, not just FF, so I'm going to drop this gripe.

My biggest gripe however has to do with the communities attitude. "If you don't sub white mage on summoner, no one will party with you." What. The. Flying. You-know-what. Even my RL friend has this attitude about min-maxing. I can understand why min-maxing is beneficial, espicially after dying and de-leveling, but for me it takes the immersion out of the game. This leads to another gripe: the combat. It seems so static. If I can kill something than I can kill it. No surprises. My friend once told me while watching me play EVE that it seemed more like Excel-in-space. I whole-heartedly agree, but Final Fantasy feels like Excel with the equations already filled out and I just keep telling it to recalculate.

I know this is a troll thread, but in all honesty, I'm also hoping you can soothe my thoughts.

Ok first of all about your min maxing thing.

Certain Jobs in FF work better in combination with some others. For example warrior is a good sub job for melee classes. No one will force you to use it, but it means gameplay wise that your character will not function as effectively in all situations. Certain combos are more effective in group situations and others in solo situations.

The point of FF11 is to be adaptive and choose whatever can help you more in any given situation.

Let's take WHM for example. His best sub jobs for party situations are Black mage and summoner because both of them give desirable traits that maximize his healing potential and they give some utility. When you solo though for farming and what not they may not be the better sub jobs to use. The point really is to understand what you want to do so you can choose the better combos.

As for combat.

Combat is not static. FF imo has a combat that scales up in difficulty and complexity as you level. Add to the equation the various combat challenges the game offers, such BCNMS, story bosses etc and you will notice that it is anything but static.  The worst you can say is that it gives a turn based feeling (even though that is not the case).

All in all don't listen to your friend that much. The community of FF is a very nice one in general, just more geeky than most:P