So say I start playing this game again and I max out my main and sub class what's left to do? Are there high end groupable dungeons or quests for loot, and if so how many and what are they like? Same with raids... how many are available, how often do guilds raid, and what are the fights like? How many people are allowed on raid, what jobs are most important, and what jobs are the least important? Are these new classes like Blue Mages and Puppetmasters viable in the endgame?

Yes, just take my word for it when I say it's ginormus. There is so much endgame content, you possibly won't be able to do all of it or have anything else to do if you attempt to do them all at once. All of it varies on how many can participate, lets just say it can go from 18 - 64 depending on which one you do.

BLU and PUP are old now, the new ones are DNC and SCH now. Anyway, PUP would have difficulty in certain endgame aspects because their puppet is prone to dying, like a DRG's wyvern. Couldn't honestly say what is the least important. Why does that matter anyway? You level the job you like, if you have endgame linkshells that only want certain jobs, well, I wouldn't join them anyway.

Originally posted by Eliago

So say I start playing this game again and I max out my main and sub class what's left to do? Are there high end groupable dungeons or quests for loot, and if so how many and what are they like? Same with raids... how many are available, how often do guilds raid, and what are the fights like? How many people are allowed on raid, what jobs are most important, and what jobs are the least important? Are these new classes like Blue Mages and Puppetmasters viable in the endgame?

You need at least 3 month to max out 1 job. assuming you have to level multiple sub job to 37 as well.

then you can worry about endgame.

The end game is FFXI is vast, you got many things to do. Most people who played 5 years may even never finish some of the contents...

I played 2 years in total with 3 75 and 3 level 60s. I can say i barely touched 10% of the content (i am rank 10 in 2 city)

Originally posted by Eliago

So say I start playing this game again and I max out my main and sub class what's left to do? Are there high end groupable dungeons or quests for loot, and if so how many and what are they like? Same with raids... how many are available, how often do guilds raid, and what are the fights like? How many people are allowed on raid, what jobs are most important, and what jobs are the least important? Are these new classes like Blue Mages and Puppetmasters viable in the endgame?

There is Assaults, Nyzul Isle, Campaign, Besieged, NM's, Sky, Sea, Dynamis, Salvage, Einherjar, ZNM's, Meriting and HNM's.  I may have missed something.  Also, a good bit of missions you need to be 75. 

Originally posted by wrongfeifong

The end game is FFXI is vast, you got many things to do. Most people who played 5 years may even never finish some of the contents..

He speaks the truth. 

I know quite a few people playing since the NA release who still haven't done too much endgame. That's people who have been playing since 2003.

Plus, even by the time you reach all this content, they will have released even more most likely.

Originally posted by Satimasu

Yes, just take my word for it when I say it's ginormus. There is so much endgame content, you possibly won't be able to do all of it or have anything else to do if you attempt to do them all at once. All of it varies on how many can participate, lets just say it can go from 18 - 64 depending on which one you do.

 

BLU and PUP are old now, the new ones are DNC and SCH now. Anyway, PUP would have difficulty in certain endgame aspects because their puppet is prone to dying, like a DRG's wyvern. Couldn't honestly say what is the least important. Why does that matter anyway? You level the job you like, if you have endgame linkshells that only want certain jobs, well, I wouldn't join them anyway.

Yeah, I haven't played for years so pretty much all the new jobs past Summoner kinda mesh together for me. 

Reason I'm asking is that I've played MMORPGs since the release of EverQuest; I played FFXI for a few months but for some reason I didn't really like it and went back to DAOC and EQ. Now that those games have died, WoW has gotten old, and pretty much every other MMORPG that's been released since has been a huge disappoint, FFXI is looking intriguing again, but I don't want to put a lot of tim in to just get bored again. I tend to play MMOs to complete as much endgame content as my tie allows (had just beated Vashj before I quit WoW a few months ago). I'm curious of the raids are like oldschool EQ/DAOC (contended super powerful npcs) or WoW (instanced content that are more events with gimmicks you have to learn).

I'm also curious about how some jobs are viable, since one of the reasons I didn't enjoy the game the first time was due to choosing a job that made me have to wait hours to find a group, if I could even find one.

They're more like WoW instances but require a lot more work to figure out.

FFXI wasn't built for people to quickly get to the highest level. They made a lot of pre-highest level missions and quests so people wouldn't have to worry about grinding and seeking for hours on end to party.

However, seasoned MMORPG players had own set of ideas on what you are supposed to do in order to become successful in a MMORPG-- reaching the highest level possible is #1 on that list. Players get frustrated when they can't get what they want.
So for the past 3-4 years, Square Enix has been making the journey to 75 easier, which is why it would take 3 months for a daily casual player to reach LV75.

But once you get LV75, you're not going to be doing endgame right off the bat. The main endgame events like Sky, Sea, and Limbus, requires you to damn near complete a huge set of missions. This is why people have been playing since 2003 but still do not have access to 4 year old content.

The first three expansions are what introduced "end game" into FFXI.

HNMs were always there.
Rise of Zilart brought us Sky and Dynamis(where you fight your way through a city)
Chains of Promethia brought us Sea.
Treasures of Aht Urhgan brought us a bunch of WoW-like instances where you get kool gear and an easy route to LV75.

Theres also a bunch of other endgame stuff to do.

FFXI is a unique game, but I think they're dumbing down the content to "fit in".

Some missions are mean, i can tell you that. For example, the 5-1 Skeleton BCNM that is pretty hard, but it is easy if you got the right group.

Maat battles are ALWAYS MEAN to support class. Its hell for BRD and RDM. Was super hard for WHM, but it gotten easier now.

Corsair battle is...simply awesome and frickin hard. Rely on luck so much.

Some BCNM are pretty hard like corsair's AF hat is one.

and getting your AF is always a problem.

COP's missions are always tough

and i still haven't beat the last Mission of RoZ because the boss is too damn hard. (especially my class is complete useless... level 75 COR..my brd/whm on the other account.)

 The different between FFXI to other games is really ...you need a brain to play it. You have to risk de-level (losing 10% experience on death)

and monster aggro left and right. You are given proper way to avoid monsters but you also need to know their property well (damn true sight imps and lamia)

this isn't like WoW, most of the endgame is doable with 6 man group OR a 64 man group (which is easy to get) or a 18 man group (for sky)

Originally posted by reloxer

FFXI is a unique game, but I think they're dumbing down the content to "fit in".

I dunno... I don't think they're trying to "fit in". FFXI is still nowhere near the level of a WoW or similar post-WoW MMO in terms of being designed for "mass consumption". It's still a very niche game. Personally, that's a good thing, IMHO. I think MMOs serve the players better and can deliver a better quality experience when they're focused on a certain niche, and not trying to be everything to everyone. This is what SE has done with FFXI and, while it's not boasting millions of players, it does have a very healthy,  very loyal and mostly very satisfied population of ~500k players.

I think that because there's so much more high-end content - easily more than getting 1-75 on even several jobs would account for - that they want people to be able to reach that content a little more quickly.

In the game's earlier days, when there wasn't such an abundance of high-end content (Sky was the ultimate destination, and Serket was one of the mostly highly contested HNMs, for example) getting to 75 on at least one job *was* a major part of the game; and it did take a while to accomplish.

However, now with so much more content available, from 20 on up, it's more a means to an end than an end in itself.

So... I don't think getting to 75 more quickly is necessarily a bad thing because even with several jobs at 75, there are many things that numerous players will tell you they haven't seen yet.

So again, I don't think they're trying to "fit in" with other games so much as they are trying to put all that content they've added over the years a bit more within reach.

I am not even going to make another Rant about the End game community in terms of HNMLS on here again... -_-

Originally posted by Calintz333

I am not even going to make another Rant about the End game community in terms of HNMLS on here again... -_-

Probably a good idea as, no disrespect intended, but your rants are not an accurate representation of the end-game community as a whole. *Some* are elitist jerks... but not everyone. Seems like you've had a bad time with some people and are assuming that everyone's like that.

It would be helpful if you offered your experience as a warning to others of what types of groups to try and avoid... But when you describe it as though *everyone* at end game is like that... well.. then it's not helpful at all.

I've personally been in several end-game LS's and have known many people in others. They have not, in any way, resembled what you describe.

It all comes down to finding the right people.

Originally posted by WSIMike

Originally posted by Calintz333

I am not even going to make another Rant about the End game community in terms of HNMLS on here again... -_-

Probably a good idea as, no disrespect intended, but your rants are not an accurate representation of the end-game community as a whole. *Some* are elitist jerks... but not everyone. Seems like you've had a bad time with some people and are assuming that everyone's like that.

It would be helpful if you offered your experience as a warning to others of what types of groups to try and avoid... But when you describe it as though *everyone* at end game is like that... well.. then it's not helpful at all.

I've personally been in several end-game LS's and have known many people in others. They have not, in any way, resembled what you describe.

It all comes down to finding the right people.

Well im sorry if you don't like them but iv been in FFXI probably as long as you and my personal experience is much different from your own. In MY server MOST of the end game Linkshells are like I usually discribe them. How do I know this because most of my freinds are ether in one or have been in one at some point, and most of them had to leave it because they could not log in at 5am to do a HNM or they refused to get told when exactly to log on. Worse part is these LS also kick them from it if they don't do this, There ARE some fair balanced HNMLS but in SERAPH server the good MAJORITY are like I described. In a server with only about 1200-1500 US players in PEEK weekend times, its not hard to have freinds in almost all of the top linkshells.

Maybe your experience is not this but mine is, playing this game since 2004 and It has not changed the only thing that changed is there are less players now in my server than there were in the years past, so please don't tell me that is not a good chunk of the community in my server because iv experienced Seraph for 4 years myself as a player so I know my own server.

Secondly, I have NEVER herd of a Guild in WoW, Guild wars, LoTRO or most mmorpgs iv played   force anyone to log on at 3 in the morning to go on a Raid,  and if they don't they would get 1/3 strikes to be removed from Guild. yet I can name 5 HNMLS that make their members do that in Seraph for Spawn time- Windows  Tell me if you have ever seen that kind of treatment of people in any other mmorpg because I sure have not and iv been playing mmorpgs for 9 years. FFXI is the only game where I see people take Linkshells/clans or guild whatever you consider them, to such extreme level.

I write from my own experiences, Ill give you one thing there are HNMLS that are not like that, but in Seraph most that get actual loot and or get things actually done, are like that, and Iv been in this server long enough to see it for myself. So don't  try to tell me its not.

By the way read what I say cairfully I always say MOST or Majority I never say ALL because there are exceptions and I know this as well. i will also put "In my tinny server" From now on to make it more clear.

Originally posted by Calintz333

Originally posted by WSIMike

Originally posted by Calintz333

I am not even going to make another Rant about the End game community in terms of HNMLS on here again... -_-

Probably a good idea as, no disrespect intended, but your rants are not an accurate representation of the end-game community as a whole. *Some* are elitist jerks... but not everyone. Seems like you've had a bad time with some people and are assuming that everyone's like that.

It would be helpful if you offered your experience as a warning to others of what types of groups to try and avoid... But when you describe it as though *everyone* at end game is like that... well.. then it's not helpful at all.

I've personally been in several end-game LS's and have known many people in others. They have not, in any way, resembled what you describe.

It all comes down to finding the right people.

 

Well im sorry if you don't like them but iv been in FFXI probably as long as you and my personal experience is much different from your own. In MY server MOST of the end game Linkshells are like I usually discribe them. How do I know this because most of my freinds are ether in one or have been in one at some point, and most of them had to leave it because they could not log in at 5am to do a HNM or they refused to get told when exactly to log on. Worse part is these LS also kick them from it if they don't do this, There ARE some fair balanced HNMLS but in SERAPH server the good MAJORITY are like I described. In a server with only about 1200-1500 US players in PEEK weekend times, its not hard to have freinds in almost all of the top linkshells.

Okay.. fine. The end-game on YOUR server is mostly like that. That doesn't mean it is everywhere else as well.

Perhaps you should be sure to point that out when you're going on about how terrible the end-game is in FFXI. Lacking that qualifier,  it can be seen as referring to the game overall, which can lead to a bad impression on those reading who don't know either way.

Let's look at your statement right in this thread:

"I am not even going to make another Rant about the End game community in terms of HNMLS on here again... -_-"

Does it mention Seraph or "my server" anywhere in that statement? No, it doesn't. So, for all I or anyone else knows, you're talking about the end game community as a whole, not only on your server.

Here's a way you *could* have stated it:
"If you start on my server (Seraph), I would recommend staying away from the end game because it's mostly elitist jerks".

See the difference?

Maybe your experience is not this but mine is, playing this game since 2004 and It has not changed the only thing that changed is there are less players now in my server than there were in the years past, so please don't tell me that is not a good chunk of the community in my server because iv experienced Seraph for 4 years myself as a player so I know my own server.

I never said that's not how it is on "your server", because you never specified that you were talking only of your server.

Don't put words in my mouth, okay?

You've been speaking in very general terms and so I've been replying in equally general terms. I said that not all end-game LS's or players in FFXI are the way you describe.

Secondly, I have NEVER herd of a Guild in WoW, Guild wars, LoTRO or most mmorpgs iv played   force anyone to log on at 3 in the morning to go on a Raid,  and if they don't they would get 1/3 strikes to be removed from Guild. yet I can name 5 HNMLS that make their members do that in Seraph for Spawn time- Windows  Tell me if you have ever seen that kind of treatment of people in any other mmorpg because I sure have not and iv been playing mmorpgs for 9 years. FFXI is the only game where I see people take Linkshells/clans or guild whatever you consider them, to such extreme level.

... and this is all relevant how? We're talking about FFXI... not Guild Wars, WoW or LoTRO.

That said, I was temporarily part of a clan in Lineage 2 that was run like that. I left before long 'cause I didn't like how it was run. I knew of one other clan in L2 which was run like a dictatorship in much the same way. I also knew of a guild in WoW that was very demanding on its players like that as well.

So, perhaps you aren't aware of them... that doesn't mean they don't exist.

And again, how end-game is in other games has nothing to do with how it is in FFXI.

I write from my own experiences, Ill give you one thing there are HNMLS that are not like that, but in Seraph most that get actual loot and or get things actually done, are like that, and Iv been in this server long enough to see it for myself. So don't  try to tell me its not.

Again, you've never qualified your comments by stating that you were referring specifically to Seraph until now. Your statements have come across as generalizations about FFXI's end-game community overall.

And, again... I'm not telling you how it is or isn't on Seraph.

By the way read what I say cairfully I always say MOST or Majority I never say ALL because there are exceptions and I know this as well. i will also put "In my tinny server" From now on to make it more clear.

I read your posts just fine, thank you... word for word, exactly as you've typed them.

Perhaps on your server "Most" is accurate. On others it might be a minority. On yet others it might be 50/50. The point is, when you don't qualify your statements with specific details, you leave it open to various interpretations.. including incorrect ones.

Of course you know what you mean. That doesn't mean everyone else does as well. Be more specific and qualify your statements and there won't be any confusion.