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Pathfinder Online Forum » General Discussion » Why not use the actual Ruleset?

7 posts found
  ignore_me

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/04/11
Posts: 2034

 
OP  6/21/12 1:47:21 AM#1

On the PFO forums the conjecture based on discussions with Devs is that the actual PF ruleset will not be used in the game, but will only be there in spirit. This is a big mistake in my opinion. People who know what Pathfinder is will look for it when they come to play this MMO. 

Anybody else feel they are making a mistake if they don't use the ruleset? 

Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011

  MumboJumbo

Elite Member

Joined: 7/18/10
Posts: 3178

Veni, Vidi, Converti

7/06/12 6:40:59 AM#2
Originally posted by ignore_me

On the PFO forums the conjecture based on discussions with Devs is that the actual PF ruleset will not be used in the game, but will only be there in spirit. This is a big mistake in my opinion. People who know what Pathfinder is will look for it when they come to play this MMO. 

Anybody else feel they are making a mistake if they don't use the ruleset? 

Mistake or forced hand or different market expectations or even philosophy/ambitions... who's to say?

  • OGL license is a complication, apparently.
  • TB vs RT-persistence ruleset is another consideration in design.
  • market for such games and ROI probably are a factor in deciding also.
  • middleware is more mature which changes the possibility for mmo development.
That's more or less what can be gleaned so far as context. But to address the question, either form could be good games. The mmo adds the extra dimensions of explore, expand, dominate to the adventuring philosophy of PF because it's aim is simulating world interactions, so it's bringing different/additional things to the table even if it's not specializing in the group-adventure context of say NWN or a pnp/tt session in digital form?? Although there will be dungeons as PvE content as major features so we'll have to see more.
  Vesavius

Old School

Joined: 3/08/04
Posts: 7197

Players come for the game, but they stay for the people- Most Devs have forgotten this.

7/06/12 6:53:22 AM#3

I really want this project to work... I have a lot of love ofr Pathfinder and Paizo in general...

BUT

It isn't Paizo making the game and I am not sure if it is even anything really to do with the PnP RPG anymore, past the brand and the world lore. I have exactly the same problems with it as I have with TESO in fact... the (IMO) inappropriate reliance on PvP and other things.

Still, I do have an open mind and it has my goodwill for now. We shall see how it develops.

  ignore_me

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/04/11
Posts: 2034

 
OP  7/07/12 2:45:42 AM#4

Yeah, I will have to go on goodwill and an open mind I guess.

Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011

  MumboJumbo

Elite Member

Joined: 7/18/10
Posts: 3178

Veni, Vidi, Converti

7/07/12 6:25:03 AM#5
Originally posted by Vesavius

I really want this project to work... I have a lot of love ofr Pathfinder and Paizo in general...

BUT

It isn't Paizo making the game and I am not sure if it is even anything really to do with the PnP RPG anymore, past the brand and the world lore. I have exactly the same problems with it as I have with TESO in fact... the (IMO) inappropriate reliance on PvP and other things.

Still, I do have an open mind and it has my goodwill for now. We shall see how it develops.

When you/anyone use/s PvP acronym it 99% refers to player vs player combat. I think PfO will have that but it will be much more player-driven content with combat a sub-set of that. I think this will be a big difference, eg not just combat/war, but other avenues of interaction that pit players against each other or with each other. An eg, you have sec. zones and other incentives to reduce the risk of being taken out by a player randomly. So it's intended that you can play with probability very low of this happening but if you take risks to earn higher rewards, then that probability will put you in contention with other players more but those players with similar motivations as you (ideally). And secondly there's not much info yet, but ideally there will be roles for non-combat inclinded people who can hire guards (other players) to do the dirty work of pvp-combat.

Originally posted by ignore_me

Yeah, I will have to go on goodwill and an open mind I guess.

Seems MMOs have some big issues with creating online spaces that large populations make sense / adds to the game? Whereas those NWN small groups do succeed. But EvE* seems an exception in a way to this, as well as providing a universe/world where players affect the world and change it. So ideally PfO will succeed as well. But yeah, it's a tall order by track-record of mmorpgs! 

*As well as the less salubrious interactions which CCP sanctions; ie capitalism run amok.

  Loke666

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 16716

7/07/12 6:31:50 AM#6
Originally posted by Vesavius

I really want this project to work... I have a lot of love ofr Pathfinder and Paizo in general...

BUT

It isn't Paizo making the game and I am not sure if it is even anything really to do with the PnP RPG anymore, past the brand and the world lore. I have exactly the same problems with it as I have with TESO in fact... the (IMO) inappropriate reliance on PvP and other things.

Still, I do have an open mind and it has my goodwill for now. We shall see how it develops.

I agree.

While Iactually want more games based on PnP without levels, Pathfinder are not on this list.

Shadowrun, Runequest, Call of Cthulu and ARS Magica, not to mention Warhammer fantasy RPG would all make great leveless MMOs but with Pathfinder they are doing the same misstake Mythic made with WAR: When translating a P&P RPG try to keep as nuch of the original mechanics as possible.

  Tasarak

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/04/09
Posts: 43

8/30/12 9:02:23 PM#7
Originally posted by Loke666
Originally posted by Vesavius

I really want this project to work... I have a lot of love ofr Pathfinder and Paizo in general...

BUT

It isn't Paizo making the game and I am not sure if it is even anything really to do with the PnP RPG anymore, past the brand and the world lore. I have exactly the same problems with it as I have with TESO in fact... the (IMO) inappropriate reliance on PvP and other things.

Still, I do have an open mind and it has my goodwill for now. We shall see how it develops.

I agree.

While Iactually want more games based on PnP without levels, Pathfinder are not on this list.

Shadowrun, Runequest, Call of Cthulu and ARS Magica, not to mention Warhammer fantasy RPG would all make great leveless MMOs but with Pathfinder they are doing the same misstake Mythic made with WAR: When translating a P&P RPG try to keep as nuch of the original mechanics as possible.

Loke666:   While I would  enjoy leveless MMO, you forget that the level cap is projected to take 2.5yrs.  Also, Ryan has stated that a level 20 does not automatically beat a level 1, like in WOW or any other game.  If anyone has the right design philosphy going forward it's Goblinworks/Paizo.  They are fully aware of all the PVP problems in the genre over the past  15 yrs.  I will say from reading all their blogs, it's one of the most exciting projects in the pipeline.