In the end the most important thing is selling more copies.

Because botters gotta bot

More Bans=more copies sold. Solid logic indeed

Originally posted by TGSOL

Originally posted by zymurgeist

Originally posted by TGSOL

Originally posted by Cymdai

The worst part is, this isn't the only person doing this.

 

There are people streaming via own3dtv, twitchtv, etc etc, where they demonstrate how they are botting, how much money they make, etc etc.

This problem has always been prevalent, but especially so in the Diablo series. The fact that they openly called out Blizzard to say "Hey, we're hacking your players and cheating, what are you gonna do about it?" is just a slap in the face. 

The whole point of the "always online" was supposedly to greatly reduce botting/hacking/etc. Looks like that turned out about as well as everyone but the most ardent fanboys expected.

 No it wasn't. Your strawman is on fire.

Yes, it was. Diablo 2 was rampant with bots, hacking, item duping, illegal-third party sales, etc. "Always online DRM" and the "RMAH" was supposed to be Blizzards answer to these problems.

with the rmah, third-party sales become partly blizz sales too, as they make profit from them. Shame this game has suffered from accounts being hacked, and they just changed it to where if your account has been hacked more than two times, you can't use the RMAH.

Originally posted by Mundus

No one forces you to use that RMAH. I for one do not use it. Though I don't buy items in general. There's just no point to it since there will always drop a better item a few minutes later. Besides it's totally unimportant what kind of items you wear, is it not? I mean there' s not even PvP. So it's not like you needed better items than your opponent or anything.

I just finished playing Nightmare mode. In the entire playthrough I got a drop that was better than what I had already equipped, once.

Blizzard Community Manager "Bashiok":

...

"In addition to all the other benefits that we believe ultimately come from having everyone online such as an active, centralized community, a popular arena system, accessible character storage, etc. etc. Diablo III is built on a client/server architecture, which means not all the data for the game or mechanics reside on the client (your computer).

This is not too unlike World of Warcraft where the world itself, the art, the sounds, etc. are on your machine, but all of the NPC’s and enemies are controlled by the server. Diablo III doesn’t function in all of the exact same ways, but things like monster randomization, dungeon randomization, item drops, the outcomes of combat, among others, are all handled and verified by the client talking to the server, and vice versa.

We’ve learned a lot from this type of architecture from World of Warcraft, and the added security and oversight it provides. It allows a great deal of control over the game at all times for all players, so if we know there’s an issue or bug we can usually address it right then and there through a live hotfix. Hotfixes can’t be used for everything, we’re still going to have client patches, but we’re definitely looking forward to being able to deliver a consistently high quality experience to all players simultaneously through processes like hotfixes.

In addition there are some pretty intense security concerns. While there’s never a fool proof solution to stopping hack and cheats, we’ve found that a strict client/server architecture is a huge barrier for their development and use.

Ultimately we made the decision to make the game client/server based because of the security and quality it can provide to those playing, and as a bonus it reinforces a lot of our ideals for a thriving online community."

...

As I said, always online = a way to make the game more "secure" from hacking/cheating/duping/etc.

Originally posted by Paradigm68

Originally posted by Mundus

No one forces you to use that RMAH. I for one do not use it. Though I don't buy items in general. There's just no point to it since there will always drop a better item a few minutes later. Besides it's totally unimportant what kind of items you wear, is it not? I mean there' s not even PvP. So it's not like you needed better items than your opponent or anything.

I just finished playing Nightmare mode. In the entire playthrough I got a drop that was better than what I had already equipped, once.

 Really? My dps doubled, my armor doubled and lots of other stat benefits. I never use the auction house. .

Originally posted by TGSOL

Blizzard Community Manager "Bashiok":

 

"In addition to all the other benefits that we believe ultimately come from having everyone online such as an active, centralized community, a popular arena system, accessible character storage, etc. etc. Diablo III is built on a client/server architecture, which means not all the data for the game or mechanics reside on the client (your computer).

This is not too unlike World of Warcraft where the world itself, the art, the sounds, etc. are on your machine, but all of the NPC’s and enemies are controlled by the server. Diablo III doesn’t function in all of the exact same ways, but things like monster randomization, dungeon randomization, item drops, the outcomes of combat, among others, are all handled and verified by the client talking to the server, and vice versa.

We’ve learned a lot from this type of architecture from World of Warcraft, and the added security and oversight it provides. It allows a great deal of control over the game at all times for all players, so if we know there’s an issue or bug we can usually address it right then and there through a live hotfix. Hotfixes can’t be used for everything, we’re still going to have client patches, but we’re definitely looking forward to being able to deliver a consistently high quality experience to all players simultaneously through processes like hotfixes.

In addition there are some pretty intense security concerns. While there’s never a fool proof solution to stopping hack and cheats, we’ve found that a strict client/server architecture is a huge barrier for their development and use.

Ultimately we made the decision to make the game client/server based because of the security and quality it can provide to those playing, and as a bonus it reinforces a lot of our ideals for a thriving online community."

...

Always online provides greater security and helps to reduce "cheats" and "hacking." Exactly as I said.

 Those are some the side benefits. Re-read the first sentence. Then you'll know why they did it. Not "The whole point of the "always online" was supposedly to greatly reduce botting/hacking/etc. "

Originally posted by TGSOL

Blizzard Community Manager "Bashiok":

...

"In addition to all the other benefits that we believe ultimately come from having everyone online such as an active, centralized community, a popular arena system, accessible character storage, etc. etc. Diablo III is built on a client/server architecture, which means not all the data for the game or mechanics reside on the client (your computer).

This is not too unlike World of Warcraft where the world itself, the art, the sounds, etc. are on your machine, but all of the NPC’s and enemies are controlled by the server. Diablo III doesn’t function in all of the exact same ways, but things like monster randomization, dungeon randomization, item drops, the outcomes of combat, among others, are all handled and verified by the client talking to the server, and vice versa.

We’ve learned a lot from this type of architecture from World of Warcraft, and the added security and oversight it provides. It allows a great deal of control over the game at all times for all players, so if we know there’s an issue or bug we can usually address it right then and there through a live hotfix. Hotfixes can’t be used for everything, we’re still going to have client patches, but we’re definitely looking forward to being able to deliver a consistently high quality experience to all players simultaneously through processes like hotfixes.

In addition there are some pretty intense security concerns. While there’s never a fool proof solution to stopping hack and cheats, we’ve found that a strict client/server architecture is a huge barrier for their development and use.

Ultimately we made the decision to make the game client/server based because of the security and quality it can provide to those playing, and as a bonus it reinforces a lot of our ideals for a thriving online community."

...

As I said, always online = a way to make the game more "secure" from hacking/cheating/duping/etc.

You win the Thread, Sir!

Why would anyone want to spend real money on items in this game blows my mind. There's no end game what so ever. I'd really like to know how much of this coin has actually sold for real money.

Originally posted by Tellax

Yet another thing Blizz "didn't" see coming..  haha, This is so entertaining..

 

 

and the worst part, the game is considered a success by the shareholders (and that's all that matters btw).

 

 

Games by gamers for gamers, is over..  Games by corporations for money..  is the 21th century motto aka reason for why gaming quality has severely declined.   sad days..

If a game sold so many copies that it made a likely 100% ROI within the first few weeks of release, it would be considered a success by shareholders even if it was the absolute crappiest game ever made.  They only care about $.

I personally have not touched the AH from very early beta up to now . I see no need for me to use the AH other than when the RMAH goes live and I can sell MY stuff to all those foolish enough to buy it. Win/Win for me. If everyone wouldjust stop buying the gear off the Ah in the first place you would not have these issues. But then hey, were a fast food,got it have it yesterday type of society today.

Originally posted by Mundus

No one forces you to use that RMAH. I for one do not use it. Though I don't buy items in general. There's just no point to it since there will always drop a better item a few minutes later. Besides it's totally unimportant what kind of items you wear, is it not? I mean there' s not even PvP. So it's not like you needed better items than your opponent or anything.

No, you're right. No one forces you to use it. The problem is, even though you youself will not use it, you already support it. Supporting this kind of behavior only shows devs that the playerbase wants this system cause they bought the game. If millions of people buy your game, that must show a fair percentage of that actually likes the system.

I can't help but think when I read stories like this, Blizzard games are becoming more politics than a actual game. They make a system, pretend its to help the everyday gamer sell his items and maybe make some money. But in reality its so Blizzard can profit from the tons of botters/hackers who are going to be the ones selling 90% of the stuff on the RMAH. Why would Blizzard fight this? They are gonna make so much money off these guys. They don't care about gamers anymore. If they did they woudln't have put such a stupid system like this in a game.

I honestly hope once it launches it crashes hard. I don't like the RMAH and I want it out of my games. Let us earn our gear by actually PLAYING the game.

Originally posted by zymurgeist

Originally posted by TGSOL

Blizzard Community Manager "Bashiok":

 

"In addition to all the other benefits that we believe ultimately come from having everyone online such as an active, centralized community, a popular arena system, accessible character storage, etc. etc. Diablo III is built on a client/server architecture, which means not all the data for the game or mechanics reside on the client (your computer).

This is not too unlike World of Warcraft where the world itself, the art, the sounds, etc. are on your machine, but all of the NPC’s and enemies are controlled by the server. Diablo III doesn’t function in all of the exact same ways, but things like monster randomization, dungeon randomization, item drops, the outcomes of combat, among others, are all handled and verified by the client talking to the server, and vice versa.

We’ve learned a lot from this type of architecture from World of Warcraft, and the added security and oversight it provides. It allows a great deal of control over the game at all times for all players, so if we know there’s an issue or bug we can usually address it right then and there through a live hotfix. Hotfixes can’t be used for everything, we’re still going to have client patches, but we’re definitely looking forward to being able to deliver a consistently high quality experience to all players simultaneously through processes like hotfixes.

In addition there are some pretty intense security concerns. While there’s never a fool proof solution to stopping hack and cheats, we’ve found that a strict client/server architecture is a huge barrier for their development and use.

Ultimately we made the decision to make the game client/server based because of the security and quality it can provide to those playing, and as a bonus it reinforces a lot of our ideals for a thriving online community."

...

Always online provides greater security and helps to reduce "cheats" and "hacking." Exactly as I said.

 Those are some the side benefits. Re-read the first sentence. Then you'll know why they did it. Not "The whole point of the "always online" was supposedly to greatly reduce botting/hacking/etc. "

Well you make one good point - it wasn't necessarily the "primary" reason.

Of course, the REAL reason, ultimately, is piracy prevention and constant-access to the RMAH. They can scream until they're blue in the face that "we totally never even thought of Piracy when we decided to do this" but everyone with at least an IQ of 2 knows that's bullcrap.

Intentions or not, this genre is plagued with short-sightedness. 24/7 farming has been a problem for over a decade, and I find it impossible to  believe that there's not a viable solution to deal with such an issue.

It may sound utterly stupid, but it's becoming my firm belief that the only way to prevent gold-farming/botting would be to utilize a system like Final Fantasy 8; a time-based, rank-based, fixed-allotment of gold per day. While extremely difficult to implement (and complimented with a severe sense of restraint and constriction on the player base) it is also, in my mind, the only way to accurately track the transfer/acquisition of gold adequately.

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Tellax

Yet another thing Blizz "didn't" see coming..  haha, This is so entertaining..

 

 

and the worst part, the game is considered a success by the shareholders (and that's all that matters btw).

 

 

Games by gamers for gamers, is over..  Games by corporations for money..  is the 21th century motto aka reason for why gaming quality has severely declined.   sad days..

If a game sold so many copies that it made a likely 100% ROI within the first few weeks of release, it would be considered a success by shareholders even if it was the absolute crappiest game ever made.  They only care about $.

 Uhh why should investors care about anything else? They have very little say in how the game is made.

I'm pretty sure the people who actually make games do care about their work. Otherwise why put up with the crappy pay and long hours? There are much better paying jobs in similar fields.

How would the crappiest game ever made have a 100% ROI? Battlecruiser 3000AD sure didn't

I don't understand the problem, people.

Lots of farmers = lots of _very cheap_ gold and loot on auction house. Those who have even a little money and don't have patience trying to farm coveted Trousers of Awesomeness with exact stats they need can buy it cheap and are happy. Those who don't want to buy anything and don't use AH are not affected at all and are happy. Farmers earn themeselves a living and are happy. Blizzard gets its cut and is happy. Everyone is happy! Where is the problem?

Yeah, you will not be able to become a farmer yourself and get rich selling Trousers of SuperAwesomeness. So, I guess, the demographics of wannabe farmers who are not as industrous as other farmers have a valid reason to complain. But other than that - come on!

So, there is going to be a million bots farming 24/7 in a _single player game_. So there is going to be a million Trousers of Awesomeness for sale for $0.01 in the AH. Who _exactly_ is going to be negatively affected by that? Nobody, that's who.

So what's wrong with you, people? Think for a second before whining!

The only negative thing is hacking of accounts, but hey, get yourself an identificator, eh?

Originally posted by Cymdai

Intentions or not, this genre is plagued with short-sightedness. 24/7 farming has been a problem for over a decade, and I find it impossible to  believe that there's not a viable solution to deal with such an issue.

It may sound utterly stupid, but it's becoming my firm belief that the only way to prevent gold-farming/botting would be to utilize a system like Final Fantasy 8; a time-based, rank-based, fixed-allotment of gold per day. While extremely difficult to implement (and complimented with a severe sense of restraint and constriction on the player base) it is also, in my mind, the only way to accurately track the transfer/acquisition of gold adequately.

 Not quite sure why anyone would buy gold for this game. It's worthless. Items is where the money will be if they ever get the auction house working. People do weird things.

Originally posted by zymurgeist

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Tellax

Yet another thing Blizz "didn't" see coming..  haha, This is so entertaining..

 

 

and the worst part, the game is considered a success by the shareholders (and that's all that matters btw).

 

 

Games by gamers for gamers, is over..  Games by corporations for money..  is the 21th century motto aka reason for why gaming quality has severely declined.   sad days..

If a game sold so many copies that it made a likely 100% ROI within the first few weeks of release, it would be considered a success by shareholders even if it was the absolute crappiest game ever made.  They only care about $.

 Uhh why should investors care about anything else? They have very little say in how the game is made.

I'm pretty sure the people who actually make games do care about their work. Otherwise why put up with the crappy pay and long hours? There are much better paying jobs in similar fields.

How would the crappiest game ever made have a 100% ROI? Battlecruiser 3000AD sure didn't

Really?  you're that naive?

Look at the series; Mass Effect, Dragon Age, WoW's EXP packs and "simplification" , just to name the big ones..

All have seen a decline in complexity, a streamlining in the whole "easy to get easy to play" and its all been funneled further on by the game companies.. no wait..  more like corporations now, that have completely lost perspective on what games originally were created for;  This all being a reason of modernization, where now even the poorest\youngest people can get a hold of a console or a low-medium end pc, games are constantly being consolified, features are being made simpler and easier so a younger and less experienced audience can pick it up without having to hit that brick wall that is better players that you experience if you hit DOTA, HON, LOL, or SC2 nowadays, complexity of character building is being shot out the window..    

And if a game do comes out specifically for PC, it rarely ever ships with complete optimization for DX11, because 90% of the customer base is based on second rate shitty technology from 2007~9, running on old DELL computers, or even worse..  MACS.. 

Gaming as a trend, and just to try and stick to one topic, MMO's.. cous the rest would be too broad to get into at the moment, have those so-callled "non-development centric" shareholders with "no say" over product development or supervision? Looking at more or less everything since WoW, have tried to implement a less than bad model based on a fluke success by Blizzard's MMO (which really wasn't so great to begin with either), but that trend spurred on the next generation of gamers aka customer base, AKA KIDS...  and parents with wallets being half controlled by their kids..   

Hey, this is a market we need to tap into, so let's LITERALLY mess up everything from this day onwards, and make everything according to a freaking business plan, making every and all desicions based on quarterly statements rather than what actually would be beneficial for the gaming industry..  

But hey, that's my take..       tip of the freaking iceberg..

Originally posted by Grahor

I don't understand the problem, people.

 

Lots of farmers = lots of _very cheap_ gold and loot on auction house. Those who have even a little money and don't have patience trying to farm coveted Trousers of Awesomeness with exact stats they need can buy it cheap and are happy. Those who don't want to buy anything and don't use AH are not affected at all and are happy. Farmers earn themeselves a living and are happy. Blizzard gets its cut and is happy. Everyone is happy! Where is the problem?

 

Yeah, you will not be able to become a farmer yourself and get rich selling Trousers of SuperAwesomeness. So, I guess, the demographics of wannabe farmers who are not as industrous as other farmers have a valid reason to complain. But other than that - come on!

 

So, there is going to be a million bots farming 24/7 in a _single player game_. So there is going to be a million Trousers of Awesomeness for sale for $0.01 in the AH. Who _exactly_ is going to be negatively affected by that? Nobody, that's who.

 

So what's wrong with you, people? Think for a second before whining!

 

The only negative thing is hacking of accounts, but hey, get yourself an identificator, eh?

Honestly, I wanted so badly to disagree with you but...you're dead-on correct. Ultimately this just means cheaper, more accessible gear. Unfortunately it also means that "buying" your way to power is going to be much easier than it otherwise would bee, but that due to the presence of an AH/RMAH, not the farmers.

I dunno, the whole thing just rankles me. MMO players are conditioned by the game studios to view farmers as "the enemy". It's tough to suddenly view them as benefac tors.

Originally posted by Tellax

Originally posted by zymurgeist

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Tellax

Yet another thing Blizz "didn't" see coming..  haha, This is so entertaining..

 

 

and the worst part, the game is considered a success by the shareholders (and that's all that matters btw).

 

 

Games by gamers for gamers, is over..  Games by corporations for money..  is the 21th century motto aka reason for why gaming quality has severely declined.   sad days..

If a game sold so many copies that it made a likely 100% ROI within the first few weeks of release, it would be considered a success by shareholders even if it was the absolute crappiest game ever made.  They only care about $.

 Uhh why should investors care about anything else? They have very little say in how the game is made.

I'm pretty sure the people who actually make games do care about their work. Otherwise why put up with the crappy pay and long hours? There are much better paying jobs in similar fields.

How would the crappiest game ever made have a 100% ROI? Battlecruiser 3000AD sure didn't

Really?  you're that naive?

 

 

Look at the series; Mass Effect, Dragon Age, WoW's EXP packs and "simplification" , just to name the big ones..

All have seen a decline in complexity, a streamlining in the whole "easy to get easy to play" and its all been funneled further on by the game companies.. no wait..  more like corporations now, that have completely lost perspective on what games originally were created for;  This all being a reason of modernization, where now even the poorest\youngest people can get a hold of a console or a low-medium end pc, games are constantly being consolified, features are being made simpler and easier so a younger and less experienced audience can pick it up without having to hit that brick wall that is better players that you experience if you hit DOTA, HON, LOL, or SC2 nowadays, complexity of character building is being shot out the window..    

And if a game do comes out specifically for PC, it rarely ever ships with complete optimization for DX11, because 90% of the customer base is based on second rate shitty technology from 2007~9, running on old DELL computers, or even worse..  MACS.. 

Gaming as a trend, and just to try and stick to one topic, MMO's.. cous the rest would be too broad to get into at the moment, have those so-callled "non-development centric" shareholders with "no say" over product development or supervision? Looking at more or less everything since WoW, have tried to implement a less than bad model based on a fluke success by Blizzard's MMO (which really wasn't so great to begin with either), but that trend spurred on the next generation of gamers aka customer base, AKA KIDS...  and parents with wallets being half controlled by their kids..   

Hey, this is a market we need to tap into, so let's LITERALLY mess up everything from this day onwards, and make everything according to a freaking business plan, making every and all desicions based on quarterly statements rather than what actually would be beneficial for the gaming industry..  

 

But hey, that's my take..       tip of the freaking iceberg..

 I'm not Naive enough to believe my opinion is the only one that's right or that all those other people evil and malicious because they don't build games perfectly suited to me. I'll tell you one thing.  Diablo was a very simple game. D3 is far more complicated and difficult. It also carries the same M ratiing so I don't think it's aimed at kids. 

Originally posted by zymurgeist

Originally posted by Tellax

Originally posted by zymurgeist

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Tellax

Yet another thing Blizz "didn't" see coming..  haha, This is so entertaining..

 

 

and the worst part, the game is considered a success by the shareholders (and that's all that matters btw).

 

 

Games by gamers for gamers, is over..  Games by corporations for money..  is the 21th century motto aka reason for why gaming quality has severely declined.   sad days..

If a game sold so many copies that it made a likely 100% ROI within the first few weeks of release, it would be considered a success by shareholders even if it was the absolute crappiest game ever made.  They only care about $.

 Uhh why should investors care about anything else? They have very little say in how the game is made.

I'm pretty sure the people who actually make games do care about their work. Otherwise why put up with the crappy pay and long hours? There are much better paying jobs in similar fields.

How would the crappiest game ever made have a 100% ROI? Battlecruiser 3000AD sure didn't

Really?  you're that naive?

 

 

Look at the series; Mass Effect, Dragon Age, WoW's EXP packs and "simplification" , just to name the big ones..

All have seen a decline in complexity, a streamlining in the whole "easy to get easy to play" and its all been funneled further on by the game companies.. no wait..  more like corporations now, that have completely lost perspective on what games originally were created for;  This all being a reason of modernization, where now even the poorest\youngest people can get a hold of a console or a low-medium end pc, games are constantly being consolified, features are being made simpler and easier so a younger and less experienced audience can pick it up without having to hit that brick wall that is better players that you experience if you hit DOTA, HON, LOL, or SC2 nowadays, complexity of character building is being shot out the window..    

And if a game do comes out specifically for PC, it rarely ever ships with complete optimization for DX11, because 90% of the customer base is based on second rate shitty technology from 2007~9, running on old DELL computers, or even worse..  MACS.. 

Gaming as a trend, and just to try and stick to one topic, MMO's.. cous the rest would be too broad to get into at the moment, have those so-callled "non-development centric" shareholders with "no say" over product development or supervision? Looking at more or less everything since WoW, have tried to implement a less than bad model based on a fluke success by Blizzard's MMO (which really wasn't so great to begin with either), but that trend spurred on the next generation of gamers aka customer base, AKA KIDS...  and parents with wallets being half controlled by their kids..   

Hey, this is a market we need to tap into, so let's LITERALLY mess up everything from this day onwards, and make everything according to a freaking business plan, making every and all desicions based on quarterly statements rather than what actually would be beneficial for the gaming industry..  

 

But hey, that's my take..       tip of the freaking iceberg..

 I'm not Naive enough to believe my opinion is the only one that's right or that all those other people evil and malicious because they don't build games perfectly suited to me. I'll tell you one thing.  Diablo was a very simple game. D3 is far more complicated and difficult. It also carries the same M ratiing so I don't think it's aimed at kids. 

The fact that games have been simplified is not an opinion, it's a fact, and if you've played enough games over the years, you can easily see the decline.. 

When did ratings on games ever do anything to prevent anyone from playing them?  

It's a requirement for having a set amount of gore in it, nothing else.. that M rating represents the company's shield against lawsuits for violent games being played by children, the eternal "it's your job as parents not ours" argument