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Neverwinter Forum » General Discussion » Should we settle with mediocre ?

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43 posts found
  thark

Elite Member

Joined: 1/01/03
Posts: 1107

 
OP  5/07/13 7:38:19 AM#1

It seems as if , gamers in general is getting more and more demanding, they do not want to pay 10-15 $ /month and they sure as hell will not pay 10$ for a bag ...

We have become spoiled with all the "Free to play" adverticing , wich really isn't free at all..

The ONLY way to create a GOOD game is to put TONS of money in your buissness investment, and If you create a GOOD game you want to make sure you get that investment back.

Todays attitude and freebee mentality doesnt make this an easy descision as a developer..Do we make a shallow easy to make Free to play game or do we really put money in our investment and make a AAA title and risk loosing all of It ?

I think ..Neverwinter is somewhat inbetween all this, It's a rather shallow DnD game, but still somewhat fun for certain individuals to shell out cash for a bag...But it's also suffering from lots of cheap things,,

Remember, there is NO such thing in life as FREE stuff..It all has to be payd for , However, If you settle with mediocre entertainment and have others pay for your mediocre entertainment (FTP) well then it's FREE in a sence..But should YOU as a consumer settle with poor quality and halfassed products when we can get great ones ?

And most importantly should paying costumers stand the fact that "mediocre" products compete with great AAA titles and make those titles fail just because they are demanding payment for their creation and isn't free ?

 

  Vannor

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 2983

5/07/13 8:34:36 AM#2
I won't spend any money on this game until I see what thier content updates are like. Simple as that really. I need to see where things are heading first. I'm certainly not putting money into it when it is still being 'called' a beta.
  Joejc7135

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/06/13
Posts: 204

5/07/13 8:38:35 AM#3

I have to disagree that dumping massive amounts of money into a game makes it "good". Talented dev teams that actually care about their game is what makes a "good" game. I guess money can improve the presentation of the game, but even then it won't matter unless their is talent behind that process as well. I don't understand why so many feel theatened by F2P games..they have their place in the market...just as AAA big budget crapfests like SWTOR have theirs. People are simply unwilling to shell out 60 dollars and a sub to demo a game these days. F2P gives them the option to try before they buy.

  DavisFlight

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2427

5/07/13 8:40:00 AM#4

Everyone already seems to have. This game would have been laughed off the market 8 years ago.

Now people are so beaten down by sub par MMORPGs that they actually praise a singleplayer game that quickly got multiplayer features added into it, and called an MMO. And that is not hyperbole, this game wasn't going to be an MMO originally. They added that "feature" in a year.

A good MMORPG is designed with multiplayer as its core. Nowadays though, it's just a slim half assed feature tacked onto linear singleplayer experiences.

  Talonsin

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 7/19/06
Posts: 1036

5/07/13 8:45:20 AM#5

As games go, Neverwinter isnt bad.  If you are not into PVP and drop less than $20 into bag and bank space you can play all the PvE content and have a good time with friends.  Not many games out there allow you to do this for less than $20. If the foundry goes as planned, you can continue playing for a long time and enjoying new content and not have to paya  dime.

 

Sadly though, I dislike Cryptic as a company and after the newness of this game wears off and they see most people have hit max level, saw the choice of a ridiculous amount of grind time needed or the high real dollar cost of gear and they have left for greener pastures, I see changes coming to the game.  Lockboxes or limits on the foundry are two things I dont ever want to see in this game.

 

  DMKano

Elite Member

Joined: 6/17/11
Posts: 4720

5/07/13 8:45:51 AM#6

Mediocre does not mean its not fun.

Case in point Neverwinter imo, very mediocre but high on fun, same as Defiance for a third person shooter, mediocre, but insanely fun to me.

On the other hand GW2 very polished very much AAA but it was so boring and underwhelming to me.

Obviously its all personal opinion, in just know that for me fun is something that I can have with any title regardless of overall quality or polish.

Neverwinter to me is about 6/10 but fun factor is 10/10

Also to above poster you don't have to spend $20 to have fun in this game you don't have to spend a cent, I certainly won't just as there is nothing in the store that is worth buying IMO.

 

  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10432

I've become dependent upon spell check. My apologies for stupid grammatical errors.

5/07/13 8:47:18 AM#7

Video games represent probably the best example of a free market and survival of the fittest in the world. There is very little arguing over copyrights and very few legal court battles compared to other industries. GameLoft is making a living writing games for mobile platforms that are nearly identical to games on the PC or game consoles. They are known for it. Nobody has litigated them out of existence. If they did go to court, it didn't last very long at all.

My point is if games fail, it's because they aren't offering something that the consumers want. If a 'mediocre' game competes with a 'AAA' game and wins, then that 'mediocre' game isn't mediocre.

Finally, why is this in the Neverwinter forum? Are you trying to say that Neverwinter is mediocre without actually coming out and saying it or trying to slip it past the mods? If so, you need to come up with some justification for saying the game is mediocre by talking about the game play rather than trying to raise some sort of moral dilemma regarding P2P vs F2P.

For every large, complex problem, there is a simple, clear solution that also happens to be absolutely wrong.

  Juice2000

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/28/13
Posts: 80

5/07/13 9:14:59 AM#8
Originally posted by Joejc7135

I have to disagree that dumping massive amounts of money into a game makes it "good". Talented dev teams that actually care about their game is what makes a "good" game. I guess money can improve the presentation of the game, but even then it won't matter unless their is talent behind that process as well. I don't understand why so many feel theatened by F2P games..they have their place in the market...just as AAA big budget crapfests like SWTOR have theirs. People are simply unwilling to shell out 60 dollars and a sub to demo a game these days. F2P gives them the option to try before they buy.

Despite what you, i or anyone else may think about SWTOR, it was created by a talented dev team that cared about their project and believed in it. The quality of their work shown in SW KotOR, ME and DA. It failed mostly because of lmplementing the server transfers to late forcing loyal customers away.

However you are right there is room for both but players will have to open their eyes and accept that F2P is actually F2T (Free 2 Trial) that trial may be 90% of the game but there will be something locked out. Like in AoC and SWTOR leveleing is free but endgame you have to purchase. Those that say they havnt payed and wont pay carry on and enjoy the game by all means but try not to be dissapointed when you hit the must purchase to continue wall that every F2P game has hidden somewhere. From what i hear NV's starts at 60 but i may be wrong.

  Pest138

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/09
Posts: 109

5/07/13 9:26:34 AM#9

I get the OP's point but in all reality the so called triple "A" titles that have launched after WoW were their own worst enemy.

 

Consumers/players are still waiting for the next really solid game to appear and while its true alot of folks expect the F2P model I believe a subscription based game can still be hugely successful.

 

Or maybe there are now too many mmo type games out there and the player base is so spread out that no one game will be able to gather enough of us in one place to make any game as successful as WoW has been.

Neverwinter is a fun little game so far but I only have about three hours of time into it so cannot really evaluate it at this point.

  Derros

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/16/09
Posts: 997

5/07/13 9:31:35 AM#10
Originally posted by Pest138

Or maybe there are now too many mmo type games out there and the player base is so spread out that no one game will be able to gather enough of us in one place to make any game as successful as WoW has been.

 

This is pretty much the key problem.  WoW was able to tap an untouched market, that lead to its massive success, and it has become a self perpetuating game, everyone plays wow, beause  they all play wow and have invested so much time into it (although there is decline now, as expected in a 8 year old game)

 

The new p2p games, not only have to compete with WoW, but also every other p2p game that people have invested their time into, AND all the f2p and b2p alternatives out there.  A game, truly needs to offer something special to succeed as p2p.

  winter

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/08/03
Posts: 2230

5/07/13 9:39:36 AM#11
Originally posted by DavisFlight

Everyone already seems to have. This game would have been laughed off the market 8 years ago.

Now people are so beaten down by sub par MMORPGs that they actually praise a singleplayer game that quickly got multiplayer features added into it, and called an MMO. And that is not hyperbole, this game wasn't going to be an MMO originally. They added that "feature" in a year.

A good MMORPG is designed with multiplayer as its core. Nowadays though, it's just a slim half assed feature tacked onto linear singleplayer experiences.

  You mean laughed off the market like DF1 was?

 Seriously Davis you haven't played Neverwinter (at least not past the tutorial) and have no idea what your talking about. (not a surprise coming from you after all you say DF had eve like success) Its clear you don't like Neverwinter and have intentions of playing it so go back to your favorite game DFUW and stop trolling every Neverwinter thread.

  DavisFlight

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2427

5/07/13 9:54:03 AM#12
Originally posted by winter
Originally posted by DavisFlight

Everyone already seems to have. This game would have been laughed off the market 8 years ago.

Now people are so beaten down by sub par MMORPGs that they actually praise a singleplayer game that quickly got multiplayer features added into it, and called an MMO. And that is not hyperbole, this game wasn't going to be an MMO originally. They added that "feature" in a year.

A good MMORPG is designed with multiplayer as its core. Nowadays though, it's just a slim half assed feature tacked onto linear singleplayer experiences.

  You mean laughed off the market like DF1 was?

Laughed off the market? You mean, released 3 expansions, got boxes in stores, opened a second server, hired 30 more devs, relaunched on Steam, and is enjoying growing subscription rates?

You know, a damn sight better than just about every MMO on the market?

 

It's a fucking fact that this game wasn't going to be an MMO and that they hammered it in at the last minute. Look it up.

  geel

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/07/04
Posts: 91

5/07/13 10:00:43 AM#13

Refuse to read the comments. OP tells it exactly like it is!

Reading the comments will probably just upset my brittle heart :P

  BrucyBonus

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 3/30/13
Posts: 224

5/07/13 10:03:33 AM#14
Originally posted by DMKano

Mediocre does not mean its not fun.

Case in point Neverwinter imo, very mediocre but high on fun, same as Defiance for a third person shooter, mediocre, but insanely fun to me.

On the other hand GW2 very polished very much AAA but it was so boring and underwhelming to me.

Obviously its all personal opinion, in just know that for me fun is something that I can have with any title regardless of overall quality or polish.

Neverwinter to me is about 6/10 but fun factor is 10/10

Also to above poster you don't have to spend $20 to have fun in this game you don't have to spend a cent, I certainly won't just as there is nothing in the store that is worth buying IMO.

 

^ I agree with this entirely.  Defiance and Neverwinter, both should be crap and are a little lazy but a hell of a lot of fun.  GW2 is highly polished and incredibly detailed but utterly tedious.  

  furbans

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/10/13
Posts: 874

5/07/13 10:15:55 AM#15
Originally posted by winter
Originally posted by DavisFlight

Everyone already seems to have. This game would have been laughed off the market 8 years ago.

Now people are so beaten down by sub par MMORPGs that they actually praise a singleplayer game that quickly got multiplayer features added into it, and called an MMO. And that is not hyperbole, this game wasn't going to be an MMO originally. They added that "feature" in a year.

A good MMORPG is designed with multiplayer as its core. Nowadays though, it's just a slim half assed feature tacked onto linear singleplayer experiences.

  You mean laughed off the market like DF1 was?

 Seriously Davis you haven't played Neverwinter (at least not past the tutorial) and have no idea what your talking about. (not a surprise coming from you after all you say DF had eve like success) Its clear you don't like Neverwinter and have intentions of playing it so go back to your favorite game DFUW and stop trolling every Neverwinter thread.

You mean laughed off just like Neverwitner will be in a few months time when the "oooo SHINEY" effect wears off?  Lay off the fanboi sauce.

Davis makes a valid point and is something that has been happening in all MMOs, the Massive Multiplayer in MMORPG.  And calling Neverwinter an MMO is laughable at best.  It's jsut a sales label when in reality it's just a CoOp sort of game.  It is only slightly more MMO than GW1.

 

  Dreamo84

Defender of Worlds

Joined: 5/20/04
Posts: 2814

I actually still like MMORPGs

5/07/13 10:52:57 AM#16
NO! Thankfully Neverwinter is an amazing game!

  Dreamo84

Defender of Worlds

Joined: 5/20/04
Posts: 2814

I actually still like MMORPGs

5/07/13 10:56:18 AM#17
Originally posted by furbans
Originally posted by winter
Originally posted by DavisFlight

Everyone already seems to have. This game would have been laughed off the market 8 years ago.

Now people are so beaten down by sub par MMORPGs that they actually praise a singleplayer game that quickly got multiplayer features added into it, and called an MMO. And that is not hyperbole, this game wasn't going to be an MMO originally. They added that "feature" in a year.

A good MMORPG is designed with multiplayer as its core. Nowadays though, it's just a slim half assed feature tacked onto linear singleplayer experiences.

  You mean laughed off the market like DF1 was?

 Seriously Davis you haven't played Neverwinter (at least not past the tutorial) and have no idea what your talking about. (not a surprise coming from you after all you say DF had eve like success) Its clear you don't like Neverwinter and have intentions of playing it so go back to your favorite game DFUW and stop trolling every Neverwinter thread.

You mean laughed off just like Neverwitner will be in a few months time when the "oooo SHINEY" effect wears off?  Lay off the fanboi sauce.

Davis makes a valid point and is something that has been happening in all MMOs, the Massive Multiplayer in MMORPG.  And calling Neverwinter an MMO is laughable at best.  It's jsut a sales label when in reality it's just a CoOp sort of game.  It is only slightly more MMO than GW1.

 

It's more MMO than DDO which people praise that game now. Just because Neverwinter has a lot of dungeons you're gonna call it a lobby game? You likely haven't actually played it past lvl 10 then if you feel that way. It's definitely an MMO.

  VikingGamer

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/08/10
Posts: 1236

The strong are sometimes wrong but the weak are never free.

5/07/13 11:11:15 AM#18
So far I am enjoying it. When i stop enjoying it I will play something else. Its really not worth overthinking this stuff. They are just games.

All die, so die well.
Join SOLA in ArcheAge.

  SupportPlayerMM

Novice Member

Joined: 12/12/12
Posts: 335

5/07/13 11:19:19 AM#19
Originally posted by DavisFlight

Everyone already seems to have. This game would have been laughed off the market 8 years ago.

A good MMORPG is designed with multiplayer as its core. Nowadays though, it's just a slim half assed feature tacked onto linear singleplayer experiences.

If we're going Hypothical... This game would of dominated 8 years ago because it wouldn't have the absurdly costing cash shop DDO released like trash, So it would of had a monthly fee and all content would be available in the game to find. This game would of played Amazing 8 years ago... So I really don't see what you're referring too. Gotta think WoW was 9 years ago, this game would of been better then nearly every game to launch after WoW and it would of came out 1 year after in your Hypothical scenario.

I still would of preferred the open PvP of Age of Conan but... we all know how many people complained about AoC.

  SupportPlayerMM

Novice Member

Joined: 12/12/12
Posts: 335

5/07/13 11:27:16 AM#20
Originally posted by DavisFlight
Originally posted by winter
Originally posted by DavisFlight

Everyone already seems to have. This game would have been laughed off the market 8 years ago.

Now people are so beaten down by sub par MMORPGs that they actually praise a singleplayer game that quickly got multiplayer features added into it, and called an MMO. And that is not hyperbole, this game wasn't going to be an MMO originally. They added that "feature" in a year.

A good MMORPG is designed with multiplayer as its core. Nowadays though, it's just a slim half assed feature tacked onto linear singleplayer experiences.

  You mean laughed off the market like DF1 was?

Laughed off the market? You mean, released 3 expansions, got boxes in stores, opened a second server, hired 30 more devs, relaunched on Steam, and is enjoying growing subscription rates?

You know, a damn sight better than just about every MMO on the market?

 

It's a fucking fact that this game wasn't going to be an MMO and that they hammered it in at the last minute. Look it up.

Growing subscriptions? WTF are you talking about? If Darkfall is so amazing why are you even here instead of earning some Prowess Points? I think you got 180 reps of mob grinding to do. I'm not going to be a hater like you and wish doom on any product but also I would never absurdly insult a product because it wasn't my cup of tea. There's nothing other than the "Zen Market" on this game worth insulting, well... maybe server lag... but thats about it, everything else functions. It's unfortunte DF:UW will fail, reason being is there is no skill cap so any new players will have to stand toe to toe in a full loot game against people with 100k PP, They'll have ot go farm 150-180 of each mob type (Horrible AI btw) in a world where they get 2-3 shot. So if you want to argue valid complaints check those out.

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