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WildStar Forum » General Discussion » Wildstar - will have endgame for the solo player

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28 posts found
  Nadia

Elite Member

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11514

 
OP  2/18/13 2:34:07 PM#1

interview from 3 days ago

 

WildStar and the Search for a Better Endgame

WildStar's executive producer hints at an endgame that's just as fun for solo players.

http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/wildstar/1227411p1.html

His solution is to implement a series of single-player dungeons, similar in concept to Rift's Chronicles or Lord of the Rings Online's Skirmishes. The details are still sketchy at this point, but Gaffney at least related that many of these single-player dungeons will be tied to one of WildStar's signature "Paths," which let players focus on an element of the game they enjoy the most. If you choose Explorer, for instance, many of your missions and solo dungeons will center on climbing peaks and surveying terrain, occasionally exploring underground passageways that only you can access. "Paths also unlock a different set of dailies," he said, "or, at least, that's our intent."

  Yamota

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/05/03
Posts: 6511

"I fight so you don't have to."

2/18/13 2:39:19 PM#2
Although it is good that they are providing some end game content for the solo player, I hope the bulk of the end-game content will be for groups of people. Otherwise what would be the point in playing an MMO?

  User Deleted
2/18/13 3:23:49 PM#3
When solo and raiders both think the game is for them, it could get a bit dangerous since the old saying is "jack of all trades and master of none".  The game is still in marketing and attention mode, so only time will tell which group it's REALLY set up for.
  Cromica

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/03/09
Posts: 670

2/18/13 3:28:03 PM#4
Originally posted by Yamota
Although it is good that they are providing some end game content for the solo player, I hope the bulk of the end-game content will be for groups of people. Otherwise what would be the point in playing an MMO?

They are having 40man raids. If thats not enough groups for people I don't know what is.

  mikuniman

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/28/06
Posts: 278

2/18/13 3:32:58 PM#5
Having content for all types of gameplay is just good marketing.
  achesoma

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/05/05
Posts: 960

2/19/13 12:53:40 PM#6
Originally posted by Yamota
Although it is good that they are providing some end game content for the solo player, I hope the bulk of the end-game content will be for groups of people. Otherwise what would be the point in playing an MMO?

You don't have to worry about that.  They are planning to have a years worth of "elder game" content by release.   Carbine's goal is to have a buffet of content for all play types.  Everything from solo to 40 man raids to small groups. 

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

2/19/13 1:01:43 PM#7
I've a strong feeling the raiders will be the priority though, this game screams "wow in space" at you with the voice of Brian Blessed.

I'm not expecting much for pvpers or crafters at all.
  rodingo

Elite Member

Joined: 1/18/07
Posts: 1775

2/20/13 5:02:27 PM#8
I think that's a good thing.  There is nothing worse than alienating a portion of your playerbase (now matter how big or small) from parts of your game.  Sure some people like to play MMOs to meet  new "friends", however there is probably an equal, if not bigger portion of players that play MMOs becuase of the bigger, living world and economy. 

"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor

  udon

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/23/07
Posts: 1614

2/20/13 5:13:06 PM#9

At the end of the day they can add all the solo content they want but if the rewards are not meaninful no one will play it.  The problem with "meaninful" is that if you make it even close to what raiders can get at the hard end of solo content than many start to scream that your trivalizing raid content.  For most raiders it's more about having far away the best gear in the game than any sort of feeling of accomplishment around being able to pull together the teamwork required to kill that raid mob.

Solo content sounds good but it can not exist in a meaninful manner next to raid content long term.  EQ2 has dabbled with it from time to time and always ended up abandoning it because they had to nerf the gear so far to keep raiders happy that no one cared about it anymore and if no one is going to do the content there isn't much of a point in developing more of it.

  User Deleted
2/21/13 2:55:11 AM#10
Originally posted by udon

At the end of the day they can add all the solo content they want but if the rewards are not meaninful no one will play it.  The problem with "meaninful" is that if you make it even close to what raiders can get at the hard end of solo content than many start to scream that your trivalizing raid content.  For most raiders it's more about having far away the best gear in the game than any sort of feeling of accomplishment around being able to pull together the teamwork required to kill that raid mob.

Solo content sounds good but it can not exist in a meaninful manner next to raid content long term.  EQ2 has dabbled with it from time to time and always ended up abandoning it because they had to nerf the gear so far to keep raiders happy that no one cared about it anymore and if no one is going to do the content there isn't much of a point in developing more of it.

EQ2 was a fail game fom the starts so i wouldnt use it for any example except for "How not to make a game"

If "radiers" are not enjoying what they are doing then they shouldnt do it. Uber rewards only screw up whole game, even the latest raid by making it easier with every piece.

Solo needs better and much more content than your average MMO fare AND meaninful rewards, there are 60+% soloers after all, who do you think quits genric MMOs when they reach endgame?

And no, dailes are not "solo gamers endgame" they are "catch up" mechanism for raiders.

  Celcius

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/20/04
Posts: 933

2/25/13 11:18:45 AM#11
Really? They mention daily quests and the game is not even out yet? Between this and 40 man raiding I think they are going off the deep end. I mean, the game looks cool. I like the graphic style and cartoony/fun/comedic nature of the game. I just think they are making huge mistakes with some of their designs. Maybe if the game is B2P then it can be good competition for other themeparks I guess.
  Nadia

Elite Member

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11514

 
OP  2/25/13 11:21:23 AM#12

I hate daily quests in any mmo w a passion

I'm waiting to hear more details about the nonraider endgame

  Rthuth434

Novice Member

Joined: 12/26/12
Posts: 367

2/25/13 11:23:49 AM#13

[mod edit]

 

WildStar has no single player endgame. 

 

just confirmed today AGAIN its dungeons are set in stone 5 players, raids are 20 and 40 man. there are no singelplayer dungeons.

  Nadia

Elite Member

Joined: 7/26/03
Posts: 11514

 
OP  2/25/13 11:32:49 AM#14
Originally posted by Rthuth434

[mod edit]

its not wishful thinking when they are statements made by the game studio

 

the gamespy interview in the 1st post was with Jeremy Gaffney, executive producer

 

in addition, mmorpg.com gave a preview at Gamescom 2012

 single player progression is supposedly rewarding

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm?game=632&feature=6656&WildStar-Ensuring-That-the-Journey-is-Fun.html

The sheer level of content we can expect is kind of staggering but what is really impressive is the fact that there will be more than a few people dedicated to the task of churning out single-player content to ensure the non-PvPer and the non-Raider have something to do

 

 

as I've stated before

I'm awaiting more details of the nonraider endgame

  Vorthanion

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/02/11
Posts: 1921

2/25/13 11:44:19 AM#15
With today's technology, why aren't they building scalable dungeons, raids, quests, general content?  Not just for soloers.  There are also huge numbers of gamers who play in small groups of two or three.  Where's the content for them?  Scalability is the answer and the technology is there to make it happen.  So, what's keeping these people from embracing this technology in every MMO?

  Torvaldr

Elite Member

Joined: 6/10/09
Posts: 5850

2/25/13 11:49:21 AM#16

I hope it's true and they do pull it off, but I'm not overly optimistic.  Many games offer end-game content for the solo and duo players, but they all offer second rate progression and crafting.  This is true in Rift, EQ2, LotRO, TSW, Tera, RaiderZ, GW/GW2, etc.

All the best shinies, gear, and crafting mats come out of raids in all those games.  All those games offer end game solo and small group content.  All of that is easily superceded by entry tier raid gear.  So when I hear the claim of end game for solo/duo/small group players, I think "we'll see".

Curse you AquaScum!

  udon

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/23/07
Posts: 1614

2/25/13 11:54:17 AM#17
Originally posted by Vorthanion
With today's technology, why aren't they building scalable dungeons, raids, quests, general content?  Not just for soloers.  There are also huge numbers of gamers who play in small groups of two or three.  Where's the content for them?  Scalability is the answer and the technology is there to make it happen.  So, what's keeping these people from embracing this technology in every MMO?

It's not a question of tech it's all about player ego's and developer control over loot tables.  If solo and small group content was rewarding raiders would scream that it makes what they do meaninless.  I have seen it play out time and time again in MMO's.

I raid in EQ2 and I do enjoy it for the most part but you know it's stupid how much of a difference in power there is between a solo/small group player and a raider in that game.  Same for WoW, Rift, and every other MMO that has raiding as the top of the PVE end game content. 

I believe that raiding should reward you in ways other than more powerful gear.  I know that gear is the easiest to implement but it's posion to a PVE game long term.  When raiding rewards become the most powerful rewards than nothing else you do in game once you hit level cap matters.

  Mardukk

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/05/11
Posts: 1412

2/25/13 11:54:37 AM#18
Good. For some reason solo challenge has been sorely lacking since the old school games.
  Sagorn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/25/13
Posts: 18

2/25/13 12:42:21 PM#19

I am also very interested in a game that has end game solo content. Just because I like MMO's doesn't mean I want to deal with the egos and hassles of being in a raiding guild. Been there.. done that ... ruined games for me.

I also understand the issue that raid gear HAS to be the BEST or the raiders whine.. and whine.. and whine. I still think EQ had the best feature in any MMO... the AA system.  Now, I did play my own 6-man group so it made it easy for me to get AA's for my characters, but for the purpose of this conversation, let's assume that any solo friendly game can do the same thing. In EQ I was able to make my characters stronger by playing more and gaining AA (alternate abilities for those who never played the game). While I *was* in a raiding guild at the time, it still gave me the opportunity to have a much stronger character than many of my fellow raiders because all they had was raid gear.. and very few AA's.

My biggest complaint with every single solo "friendly" MMO I have played (which is pretty much everything) is that at max level, unless you want to rad, you're done. Sure, you can farm cloth, or herbs, or ore etc.. or grind dailies for some *ok* gear, but unless you raid, you are basically never going to be as strong as any 10 year old punk who raids a few hours a week. I normally play 10-16 hours a day (yes.. I am financially fortunate) and it really doesn't seem right that I am not rewarded for my game time by being able to make my character stronger/better somehow other than a gear grind that forces me to raid. It still doesn't make sense to me that a company hasn't realized how easy it would be to implement an EQ AA like system for their game, and make all those solo players feel like they have something to do at max level to make their characters better, without having to to raid. The raiders can't complain, because the best gear is still there, and if they want to put in the time to grind out AA's, they are welcome to do that to. I guess what it boils down to is, if I put in the time, why do I not get the rewards?, which in this case, means a stronger character.

Of course I would also like to see a really robust crafting system for end game items as well, but that is also part of my dream MMO. And I don't mean crafting gear with a crafter that takes you 2 hours to max out. I mean a game where crafting IS the game for the crafter. Taking months to max out, and farming/creating rare mats to make the *best* gear. But I digress....

-Sagorn

  Vorthanion

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/02/11
Posts: 1921

2/26/13 9:53:35 AM#20
Originally posted by udon
Originally posted by Vorthanion
With today's technology, why aren't they building scalable dungeons, raids, quests, general content?  Not just for soloers.  There are also huge numbers of gamers who play in small groups of two or three.  Where's the content for them?  Scalability is the answer and the technology is there to make it happen.  So, what's keeping these people from embracing this technology in every MMO?

It's not a question of tech it's all about player ego's and developer control over loot tables.  If solo and small group content was rewarding raiders would scream that it makes what they do meaninless.  I have seen it play out time and time again in MMO's.

I raid in EQ2 and I do enjoy it for the most part but you know it's stupid how much of a difference in power there is between a solo/small group player and a raider in that game.  Same for WoW, Rift, and every other MMO that has raiding as the top of the PVE end game content. 

I believe that raiding should reward you in ways other than more powerful gear.  I know that gear is the easiest to implement but it's posion to a PVE game long term.  When raiding rewards become the most powerful rewards than nothing else you do in game once you hit level cap matters.

I've known about the loot caste system the genre embraces for a very long time, I just didn't want to bring it up as I always get slandered for even thinking it, let alone bringing it to light.  Still, you have to wonder why companies don't embrace technologies that make designing content easier and more accessible to a wider audience, even if they stick with crappy rewards for everyone but raiders.

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