While playing Bloodlines, I noticed that the Werewolf guy (can't remember his name) looked like an actual wolf when he's in Werewolf form. I was wondering if this is how all Werewolves are portrayed in the World of Darkness universe?

I ask this because when I think Werewolf I think of the more menacing humanoid looking Werewolves that you see in the Underworld movies for example. These are much cooler and scarier looking imho. So do all Werewolves look like actual wolves in the WoD? Thanks in advance =]

I believe you are referring to a Vampire in wolf form. The Werewolf in that game is most definitely a massive Wolf man walking on two legs. That part of the game I nearly pissed my pants and died many times.

Actually I didn't even know Vampires could turn into wolves in WoD. No I was referring to Beckett when you are first introduced to him in the game when you're sent to blow up that thug werehouse place with all the traincars everywhere. He first shows up running along the top of one of the traincars and he surely looks like a regular wolf.

Originally posted by dyermaker714

Actually I didn't even know Vampires could turn into wolves in WoD. No I was referring to Beckett when you are first introduced to him in the game when you're sent to blow up that thug werehouse place with all the traincars everywhere. He first shows up running along the top of one of the traincars and he surely looks like a regular wolf.

   WW Werewolves have 4 or 5 different forms if memory servers me.  They can look human, look like a regular wolf, or 2 to 3 others forms that resemble demon wolf hounds and maw-faced wolfman giants.  The different forms give them different + and - 's.  This all come from 1st edition WoD PnP books.

Beckett was a Gangrel ( a clan of Vampires). They're nature-oriented vampires that can, among other things, speak with animals, summon animals, grow claws, or even transform into one of two animal forms. Which of those things they can do depends on which disciplines they invest in (and how deeply), but they're pretty much all from the Animalism or Protean disciplines.

Werewolves (Garou) from the Old World of Darkness are utter killing machines. They were all kinds of crazy-unbalanced in terms of game mechanics. A poster on the White Wolf forums described them best:

"oWoD Garou are nine foot walls of fur and death right out of the box, and when you start adding things like Gifts and Fetishes to them it just gets worse...or better if that's what your looking for. They can regen Agg. damage in the middle of combat, jump in and out of the Umbra in one action, can take multiple actions with a normal build and naturally deal Agg. in a form that adds large stat bumps. Heaps of nasty in combat, death on a stick." Crazy-unbalanced.

Somewhat interestingly, the Gangrel are one of very few clans (the only clan in the original game) that Garou don't usually kill on sight, though that doesn't really mean much. Garou of every sort pretty much despise all Kindred, even Gangrel, considering them to be dead, unclean things (creatures of the Wyrm) that need to be eradicated from existence.

Oh ok, I didn't know he was a Gangrel. Haven't finished the game yet to be honest. Anyone have any pictures of the different Werewolf forms?

I thought Beckett was of the SS tribe of garou... guess I was wrong.

~But it does make sense he wasn't, considering the size of the one you run into later. Still though, he did turn into a wolf, and that's unsettling to me if he is a vampire.

~and I think the facts about Werewolves are off. They take aggrevated damage from silver and psychic stuff (wraiths, vamp blood, etc). They don't go berserk unless forced to, but the threshhold is different per person, and dependant on their birth moon. In fact, normal people go berserk when they see the crinos werewolf form, to where their reactions vary greatly. The only thing in common is that they will forget ever seeing one. You have to be a relative of a garou to remain sane around one past his transformation, which means you're a simple human with dormant genes that will never turn on. Hunters usually.

Originally posted by dyermaker714

Oh ok, I didn't know he was a Gangrel. Haven't finished the game yet to be honest. Anyone have any pictures of the different Werewolf forms?

Do you mean pictures of the different Garou (werewolf) tribes, or do you mean the the animals Gangrel can turn into? If the latter, do you mean specifically the Gangrel player from the Bloodlines game?

I may not have made it clear in my post that Gangrel and Garou are not at all the same things; Gangrel are vampires, Garou are werewolves, and the Garou really really do not like vampires of any kind. If you meant the forms Gangrel from the tabletop game can turn into, that's pretty much the Storyteller's call (the GM); bats and wolves are the most common, but it literally could be any animal if the Storyteller feels the backstory is good enough.

There are the Gangrel vampire bloodline that change into couple hunanoid animal forms and then there are the Garu the actual werewolfs that stand about 10 ft tall. The werewolf in VTM:Bloodlines was a little bit large but not too far off.

***Raving rabbid is not being very patient while waiting for WOD MMO!***

http://perso.wanadoo.es/bonertoner/formasgarou.htm

Homid:The homid form is the standard human form for all garou. Apart from The Curse, it is relatively difficult to tell a garou in homid form apart from that of a normal human without supernatural assistance, and thus this form is used primarily used to blend in with humans. Garou who are born as wolves tend to be a bit more minimalistic in this form, ranging from physical features (more hair, lithe build) to behavioral patterns (attentiveness, sniffing the air, "wolflike" behavior).

Glabro:In glabro form, a werewolf gains height and weight as compared to homid form, as well as added strength. Werewolves in this form tend to take on some characteristics that of old werewolf horror movies; additional hair, sharp nails, sharp teeth, etc. Most people can realize that a werewolf in this form is not a normal human. However in some uncommon cases, a garou is able to take this form and still pass for that of a bulky human.

Crinos:The crinos form is the war form of the werewolves. They gain exceedingly more mass and become incredibly strong in crinos form, which stands roughly around nine feet tall. The head becomes savagely wolflike as the rest of the body is covered in fur, the subject gains a tail, and the body adjusts to that of what could be explained as a bipedial canine (Although the crinos is just as comfortable running on four legs as much as it is on two). The claws and teeth of a crinos become weapons of destruction, able to cause massive damage easily to most anything that can be torn into.

The crinos form also instigates the delirium into humans, causing most to flee in terror from the werewolf.

Hispo:A werewolf in hispo form resembles that of a dire wolf. It appears to be a large, prehistoric-looking beast with great power. The hispo form is quadrupedal, however the claws are capable of massive damage similar to that of the crinos form. The hispo's jaws are stronger than Crinos jaws, and thus ravaging an opponent with even more damage. This extra damage makes this form more attractive to Lupus garou and a preferred war-form.

Lupus:The lupus form is the standard wolf form for the garou. As said before, it is difficult to tell the garou apart from that of a normal wolf without some sort of supernatural aid. This form is lithe and agile, making it the best form for running long distances in.

Regular wolves can usually tell that something is amiss about the werewolf, though. As a result they will often attempt to avoid the garou, but in some cases a pack will accept one into their family (in most cases only if it is born into a wolf pack).

Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks =] Man I really don't see how they would be able to add Werewolves as a playable race without mad balance issues but I hope they figure it out.

well tbh, the original content was DESIGNED for the Garou to be much, much more deadlier in melee/close combat over all but the ancient vampires. There was a reason for this...Vamps are immortal, Garou are not. What is a vamps greatest strength? Time. A Kindred's Teeth and claws should pale in comparison to a nine foot tall killing machine, per the lore.

Ofc, this was the pnp game..and it also was entirely up to the GM. I personally thought that was some of the best rp ever, GM'ing mixed groups of players. Now that it is moving into an online setting, ofc there will have to be balancing issues. I also have seen Shadow Lords make temporary deals with vamps, along with Glass Walkers...so it is not entirely unheard of that Garou and Vamps having an unease truce.

Generally, I have found players that are seeking a hack/slash type of game prefer Garou. Vampires, again imo, are much better to RP as their physical gifts don't always equal an IWIN button in battle. If you know that fighting other supernatural creatures can cause your death, why not sent minions? Why not have their forests cut down and build a shopping mall over their sacred cairn? Why don't you bankrupt their families business and have them accused of a crime and imprisoned?

Kindred's true powers have never been physical, imo. Compared to a human however they are. Not to a mage, Garou, or any of the other supernatural beings though.

It's really a matter of perspective..but I hope in balancing the game...CCP/WW stay a bit true to the lore and vamps should be at a disadvantage in strict hand to hand combat with even a young werewolf in crinos form/hispo if lupus born. It would just stand to reason.

Werewolves don't come into the cities and stay for a long time. Just like vamps don't wander into the woods for no reason as well.

Originally posted by CactusJack

well tbh, the original content was DESIGNED for the Garou to be much, much more deadlier in melee/close combat over all but the ancient vampires. There was a reason for this...Vamps are immortal, Garou are not. What is a vamps greatest strength? Time. A Kindred's Teeth and claws should pale in comparison to a nine foot tall killing machine, per the lore.

Ofc, this was the pnp game..and it also was entirely up to the GM. I personally thought that was some of the best rp ever, GM'ing mixed groups of players. Now that it is moving into an online setting, ofc there will have to be balancing issues. I also have seen Shadow Lords make temporary deals with vamps, along with Glass Walkers...so it is not entirely unheard of that Garou and Vamps having an unease truce.

Generally, I have found players that are seeking a hack/slash type of game prefer Garou. Vampires, again imo, are much better to RP as their physical gifts don't always equal an IWIN button in battle. If you know that fighting other supernatural creatures can cause your death, why not sent minions? Why not have their forests cut down and build a shopping mall over their sacred cairn? Why don't you bankrupt their families business and have them accused of a crime and imprisoned?

Kindred's true powers have never been physical, imo. Compared to a human however they are. Not to a mage, Garou, or any of the other supernatural beings though.

It's really a matter of perspective..but I hope in balancing the game...CCP/WW stay a bit true to the lore and vamps should be at a disadvantage in strict hand to hand combat with even a young werewolf in crinos form/hispo if lupus born. It would just stand to reason.

Werewolves don't come into the cities and stay for a long time. Just like vamps don't wander into the woods for no reason as well.

All excellent points and how we always played our games out.

Gangrels didn't go over the top in worshipping nature without a bit of scouting first, and even Glasswalkers kept a low profile when in urban environments.

It's not like werewolf and vtm were totally meant to be seperated, but it did mean vampires had to realize they weren't the only bumps in the night when the inevitable crossover began.

I can't wait for the MMO.

Actually wish I had made the preorder to get the new Vampire book using the new roll system.

Nah, oWoD games weren't really meant to cross-over unless you modified them heavily on your part... but that kinda works for every game out there. Out of the box, though? No and you can see it in the utter lack of balance. I mean, holy shit man, Garou did AGGRAVATED damage by default and could pretty much regenerate bashing damage like it was nothing. NWoD evened things out for all the games, although yeah, mages. Always mages.

As with Vampire I'd 'much' prefer to see Werewolf: the Forsaken but you cant have everything. I agree with several above, because the old world of darkness settings are not designed to mix, balancing things without crazy nerfing the Weres and the Mages is going to be 'very' difficult... asuming they are introduced with expansions or whatever.

Then again the game as we know it now is based on Vampire: the Masquerade but it's mechanics are based on V:tR. So that may help the situation as NWOD is build with crossovers in mind. I suppose in the end, time will tell.

Originally posted by Fion

As with Vampire I'd 'much' prefer to see Werewolf: the Forsaken but you cant have everything. I agree with several above, because the old world of darkness settings are not designed to mix, balancing things without crazy nerfing the Weres and the Mages is going to be 'very' difficult... asuming they are introduced with expansions or whatever.

Then again the game as we know it now is based on Vampire: the Masquerade but it's mechanics are based on V:tR. So that may help the situation as NWOD is build with crossovers in mind. I suppose in the end, time will tell.

man, this is one of those games that makes me want to play nothing else...I just have to sit here and stare at the computer screen for about a year...errrr

We need more hype in here ;p  I want this game to release sooo bad!

I much prefer werewolves to vampires in WoD.  I know they'd have to seriously alter the Garou to prevent them from being overpowered, but I still wish CCP would launch with both Vampires and Werewolves as playable races.

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Originally posted by Madimorga
I much prefer werewolves to vampires in WoD.  I know they'd have to seriously alter the Garou to prevent them from being overpowered, but I still wish CCP would launch with both Vampires and Werewolves as playable races.

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I'd like to have seen Hunter, Werewolf, and Vampires at launch as well. (we all like the three sided pvp aspects right?)

White Wolf likes segmented releases for their content. So when people get accustomed to the World of Darkness being "this such a way". They offer a different perspective and a typically exhaustive amount of support material to help flesh it out.

Thinking about how they could bring that to MMOs actually makes me consider a comfortable wait to see it all come together.

The problem i'm forseeing from this speculative conversation is that to my knowledge the WoD Online game is going to only have 2 factions at release and that is Vampire and Human which i assume will be hunters. That being considered you have all made relivent and concise statements...but if this is the truth about release, sorry to say they are just wasted because there will not be an unbalancing issue. If those are the only 2 factions at release there will be no worry of utter helplessnes at the hands of a garou and if not hunter then it would be mage. Fortunely Mage progresses much like the vampire in the fact that they are slow to start and destructive by their fruition. It would also make sense behind the social aspect that the MMO is trying to convey with the shadow tactics of political vying and cloak and dagger designation. Thank you and i hope you enjoyed my comments