Originally posted by coretex666

Originally posted by Amaranthar

Originally posted by coretex666

Originally posted by Amaranthar

I'm watching AA. I'm not interested in any other MMO to date, and I'm a bit worried that AA will be too much Themepark inside that Sandbox. But it has a boatload of good ideas. I think it'll be a big success over here just because it does have so much Sand content. I hope to see it released here in America, and I'll probably play it barring any heavy Themeparkiness yet undisclosed.

I would like to ask you what makes you worried that there will be too much themepark inside the game? You are speaking about heavy themeparkiness, may I ask what makes you so?

Do not get me wrong, I am not trying to challenge your view. I am just curious and hungry for information.

Thanks

It's good that you ask.

What it boils down to is this. If the game plays like a Themepark, where the player has to move on to higher level content throughout their experience, it will lose that "world" feeling that the Sandbox features try to give it. This practically removes that feeling. So in the end, the player is playing a Themepark game and the Sandbox part becomes almost meaningless. Sure, it's a fun side dish. So was getting shot out of a canon in WoW.

So if red

...then the level of freedom the game offers (e.g. in terms of modifying the environment, long term consequences of actions, crafting, you name it) is mostly irrelevant when considering its "sanboxiness"?

I'd go one further tbh, and class any level based game as a themepark varient, as sandbox games by definition, are not level based, the only real examples we've had of that though, were SWG, before the CU, and currently, Eve online. I just don't believe that level based game mechanics can work successfully in a sandbox game.

Originally posted by Amaranthar

Originally posted by Zylaxx

Originally posted by coretex666

Originally posted by Zylaxx

AA also has alot of features I think make a game horibad such as free for all PvP and crafting centric economy.  This isnt even to mention it is a Asian game and theres little chance in hell that it gets ported over and translated well.  Plus the combat is rather WoW like.  If you are going a hotbar based combat system then you need to have a limited skill system aka GW2 or TSW style, instead of having 3 rows of 12 skills to memorize.

May I ask what makes you worried about crafting centric economy? I consider it to be a good thing, so I am curious what are the counter-arguments to it.
 

thx

#1 reason:  It makes droped loot obsolete and un-needed.  Half the fun of playing an MMO is finding new, rare and powerful items.  I much prefer crafting to be a stop gap measure to fill in where loot hasnt dropped.

Yeah, in a Sandbox, if you have a +1 Sword, it's always got that same value.

In a Themepark, you'll soon be throwing it away because it's not even worth the effort to sell it (to you). It might be to some newbie, but not to you.

That is a problem with Bind of Pickup or Bind on Aquire items.  In a loot centric economy such as Asherons Call BOE's and BOA's are relegated to quest items or Loot Items that have been upgraded through crafting to aquire certain rare stats or procs.  This is the type of crafting I like as it doesnt make loot items obsolete but instead makes them more powerful.  In the absense of an AC style tinkering/crafting system then a loot centric economy holds more benefit.  One of the worst things I disliked about DAoC was the fact that once you hit level cap you could aquire a full set of 99% crafted gear and not ever have a need to do any monster killing again. 

Originally posted by Phry

Originally posted by coretex666

Originally posted by Amaranthar

Originally posted by coretex666

Originally posted by Amaranthar

I'm watching AA. I'm not interested in any other MMO to date, and I'm a bit worried that AA will be too much Themepark inside that Sandbox. But it has a boatload of good ideas. I think it'll be a big success over here just because it does have so much Sand content. I hope to see it released here in America, and I'll probably play it barring any heavy Themeparkiness yet undisclosed.

I would like to ask you what makes you worried that there will be too much themepark inside the game? You are speaking about heavy themeparkiness, may I ask what makes you so?

Do not get me wrong, I am not trying to challenge your view. I am just curious and hungry for information.

Thanks

It's good that you ask.

What it boils down to is this. If the game plays like a Themepark, where the player has to move on to higher level content throughout their experience, it will lose that "world" feeling that the Sandbox features try to give it. This practically removes that feeling. So in the end, the player is playing a Themepark game and the Sandbox part becomes almost meaningless. Sure, it's a fun side dish. So was getting shot out of a canon in WoW.

So if red

...then the level of freedom the game offers (e.g. in terms of modifying the environment, long term consequences of actions, crafting, you name it) is mostly irrelevant when considering its "sanboxiness"?

I'd go one further tbh, and class any level based game as a themepark varient, as sandbox games by definition, are not level based, the only real examples we've had of that though, were SWG, before the CU, and currently, Eve online. I just don't believe that level based game mechanics can work successfully in a sandbox game.

Yep. And it's not that you have levels, all MMORPGs do (even "skill based"). It's the distance between levels. A Themepark is entirely based on the excitement of moving up into ever more powerfull level groups, with ever more powerfull gear, spells, abilities. The end result is that high level characters are not playing in the same worlds as they sued to, or with all those players below them. So you have zoned content accordingly.

You still have power growth in a Sandbox, it just doesn't separate the players. Tes, some are more powerfull than others, but they can still play together. This makes the social aspects work as one world instead of chunks of world.

Originally posted by Zylaxx

Originally posted by Amaranthar

Originally posted by Zylaxx

Originally posted by coretex666

Originally posted by Zylaxx

AA also has alot of features I think make a game horibad such as free for all PvP and crafting centric economy.  This isnt even to mention it is a Asian game and theres little chance in hell that it gets ported over and translated well.  Plus the combat is rather WoW like.  If you are going a hotbar based combat system then you need to have a limited skill system aka GW2 or TSW style, instead of having 3 rows of 12 skills to memorize.

May I ask what makes you worried about crafting centric economy? I consider it to be a good thing, so I am curious what are the counter-arguments to it.
 

thx

#1 reason:  It makes droped loot obsolete and un-needed.  Half the fun of playing an MMO is finding new, rare and powerful items.  I much prefer crafting to be a stop gap measure to fill in where loot hasnt dropped.

Yeah, in a Sandbox, if you have a +1 Sword, it's always got that same value.

In a Themepark, you'll soon be throwing it away because it's not even worth the effort to sell it (to you). It might be to some newbie, but not to you.

That is a problem with Bind of Pickup or Bind on Aquire items.  In a loot centric economy such as Asherons Call BOE's and BOA's are relegated to quest items or Loot Items that have been upgraded through crafting to aquire certain rare stats or procs.  This is the type of crafting I like as it doesnt make loot items obsolete but instead makes them more powerful.  In the absense of an AC style tinkering/crafting system then a loot centric economy holds more benefit.  One of the worst things I disliked about DAoC was the fact that once you hit level cap you could aquire a full set of 99% crafted gear and not ever have a need to do any monster killing again. 

I've always hated "binding" of items. No item should be so ultra powerful that any player transforms into a deity. Because, if that's the case, that means the game world's content is being divided, and thus dividing the players into "chunks".

That matters to me because it kills a worldly social element I want. Where players are all in the same world instead of dividing up into groups to play.

Originally posted by Zylaxx

Originally posted by coretex666

Originally posted by Zylaxx

AA also has alot of features I think make a game horibad such as free for all PvP and crafting centric economy.  This isnt even to mention it is a Asian game and theres little chance in hell that it gets ported over and translated well.  Plus the combat is rather WoW like.  If you are going a hotbar based combat system then you need to have a limited skill system aka GW2 or TSW style, instead of having 3 rows of 12 skills to memorize.

May I ask what makes you worried about crafting centric economy? I consider it to be a good thing, so I am curious what are the counter-arguments to it.
 

thx

#1 reason:  It makes droped loot obsolete and un-needed.  Half the fun of playing an MMO is finding new, rare and powerful items.  I much prefer crafting to be a stop gap measure to fill in where loot hasnt dropped.

 Thats not really true. Often youll need gems or other rare components that come from dungeons and the like to craft those items.

Originally posted by Kilsin

Originally posted by coretex666

Originally posted by winter

 DOOMED!!! Doomed i say! Hahahah

Thanks for the joke op, the title of this thread is just tooo funny for words.

Its doubtfull archage will even sell as well as D3 or GW2. Still keep your dream alive

every MMO needs its Fanbois, and the humerous threads are good for a laugh.

 

Doomed! we are all Doomed i say there will be only one MMO Archage! hahahah 

Dude just try to keep your dignity for christ sakes.

To the OP, it is titles of threads like yours that support the war here on the forums. It is ok that you are happy with the features list, but you should just leave other games out of it. Do not take it as an insult, more like an advice if something.

Regarding the features that ArcheAge offers, I think that it has potential to be the next big MMO. I have been waiting for a game like this for a long time. Hopefully, the features work as they are supposed to and the game lands in a polished state. The depth of building, crafting, creating promises a long run :)

 

OP is asking a legitimate question though...

If AA delivers and sets a new standard, other MMO companies will have to lift their game to compete or risk being left behind, this will be awesome for gamers if AA does well.

It will show these half arsed F2P companies that we no longer support their cheap throw together MMOs that lead us down scripted paths and will instead start throwing our hard earned money at companies who create games like AA, that cater to a much wider range of players and give us more bang for our buck, so to speak.

If they pull it off...if not, we will be stuck with this current garbage for a long time to come.

I just hope they can nail the Western translation or it will kill it for me.

And this is what the genre needs. Something to shake things up a bit.

Originally posted by alexanys1982

if im reading things right it seems AA has all the features american and EU developers have been pising on for years, but the community has been asking for, especially since this new anti-WoW clone sentiment has been growing. Short of stopping it from being published here, what is americas answer to archage?

Sandboxwise is it the Icelandic American "World of darkness online", it have as many features people have asked for as AA.

Might be a while before it releases though.

Originally posted by Zylaxx

Originally posted by coretex666

Originally posted by Zylaxx

AA also has alot of features I think make a game horibad such as free for all PvP and crafting centric economy.  This isnt even to mention it is a Asian game and theres little chance in hell that it gets ported over and translated well.  Plus the combat is rather WoW like.  If you are going a hotbar based combat system then you need to have a limited skill system aka GW2 or TSW style, instead of having 3 rows of 12 skills to memorize.

May I ask what makes you worried about crafting centric economy? I consider it to be a good thing, so I am curious what are the counter-arguments to it.
 

thx

#1 reason:  It makes droped loot obsolete and un-needed.  Half the fun of playing an MMO is finding new, rare and powerful items.  I much prefer crafting to be a stop gap measure to fill in where loot hasnt dropped.

I would not expect this opinion being expressed by someone with GW signature as in that game, once you hit max level, there is no longer any loot to be concerned with unless you hunt cosmetics.

It does not have to make dropped loot obsolete and un-needed, in my opinion. If the gear that you can craft is on par with the loot that you can pick up from a killed mob or even better than that, but the mats for it are very rare and it takes a lot of time / effort to get them, why would the loot from monsters be un-needed.

E.g. Imagine a very simple scenario where you have 2 end game swords for you char. One slightly worse would be dropped by some sort of boss or rare mob or something and the other one, slightly more powerful, would be crafted. Now if it takes a lot of effort / time to get the mats for the crafted one, how does it make the other one obsolete and un-needed? You may be chasing the one that drops from a boss and have the other one as a longterm objective or something. Maybe more casual players would be going for the loot and more dedicated HC players would be interested in the crafted one. I am not sure if this is the case of ArcheAge though.

Is there a collected concise list and details of these features how the game works and stuff? Or does one have to dig through hours of video articles twitters and what not.

please dont even compare trash that is gw2 to AA, how can people be so blind and fanatical about gw2?

Well this game is still a whiles out so I wouldn't say others are doomed coming out now such as gw2 or tsw but it could affect teso or other future games to come.

AA will be popular within the hard core MMO community for sure. But if you think it will be beating the more traditional themeparks for subscription numbers you are sadly mistaken.

Both GW2 and Neverwinter will have more mass market appeal.

I hope AA delivers and doesnt turn out to be Vanguard 2.0 because the features do sound nice.

So much clicks and replies from an 3 days old post wow

After i saw it on top 10 on this site, i decided to check around.

Then i read http://archeagesource.com/topic/636-archeage-cbt4-review-and-extensive-game-info/

this review / preview and my jaws just dropped. :O

Gonna be so epic if they polish it and dont fuck something up.

This game definately looks interesting, I just hope it came over here sooner. I also don't think it has that much mass appeal as it is, which isin't a bad thing. But, that might cause them to change it for release in the states.

My biggest gripe of AA, with all it's amazing features, is really the combat system It's the old hotkey thing. I have no doubts it will be a huge step forward in terms of MMO advancement in future, but I may just wait for what new games AA will spawn rather than play AA itself. 

Originally posted by Ezhae

My biggest gripe of AA, with all it's amazing features, is really the combat system It's the old hotkey thing. I have no doubts it will be a huge step forward in terms of MMO advancement in future, but I may just wait for what new games AA will spawn rather than play AA itself. 

I dont rly see how MMORpg's could change the Combat system to be different, thats just how they work.

GW2 did try something new, and it was fun the first few hours for sure. Now its just as boring as any other clicking 1 2 3 (+dodge in GW2). And its actually worse in GW2 with super limited spell list, cant really combo or theory craft that much.

Tho i do hope some smart people invent something new and fresh for Mmorpg's combat system ;)

But for now classic 123 works best i think.

Originally posted by gasperk

Originally posted by Ezhae

My biggest gripe of AA, with all it's amazing features, is really the combat system It's the old hotkey thing. I have no doubts it will be a huge step forward in terms of MMO advancement in future, but I may just wait for what new games AA will spawn rather than play AA itself. 

I dont rly see how MMORpg's could change the Combat system to be different, thats just how they work.

GW2 did try something new, and it was fun the first few hours for sure. Now its just as boring as any other clicking 1 2 3 (+dodge in GW2). And its actually worse in GW2 with super limited spell list, cant really combo or theory craft that much.

Tho i do hope some smart people invent something new and fresh for Mmorpg's combat system ;)

But for now classic 123 works best i think.

Thing is even with limited skill system (could argue long time about combos/theorycrafting but that's not a thread for it) in GW2 it feels more dynamic than the old "right click mob then press buttons in following order".

Another example of combat making that step further is of course TERA (still a bit to go with the locked animations) and RaiderZ. After playing all 3 of those I really find it hard to get into the "traditional" combat.

TSW that added a bit mobility and even dodge still feels mostly 1111411114, especially before you get to unlock a lot of skills to build something more varied and kept me from enjoying the game despite my love for the setting and writing in that game. 

Been playing the static combat MMOs for long enough to not have much of desire to ever play one like that again and gladly the genre seems to be moving forard slowly. We are starting to have the technology and as connection speeds go up across the world the more dynamic it can be made.