Originally posted by BigHatLogan

Originally posted by toddze

one of the biggest hurdles a full loot game has to overcome is the mindset about gear, that themeparks have instilled upon the gamer mentality. Gear is the ultimate goal in those games, and they just cant fathom playing a game where another player could steal that gear. They dont understand that in full loot games gear doesnt have near the importance (atleast it shouldnt).

But everything being said about the toxic community is 100% spot on. majority of gamers do not like what takes place in ffa games. It only takes a handfull of players on at any given time to ruin an entire server. If AA's outlaw systems fails to instill fear on the community then I fear for AA's popularity, because if becoming an outlaw has no real punishment then that toxic community will take over, and run the majority off.  

You are spot on with the gear issue.  WoW clones have brainwashed the community and they need to get over it.  A game designed around full loot can function perfectly well.  As for the community being toxic, I don't believe that for a second.   I have played a lot of these types of games and the community is no different than in your standard mmorpg.  People just get a bit more upset when they get killed.  The fun part of these games is pvp SO PEOPLE ARE GOING TO DIE.  The challenge in these games is from avoiding the tougher players and killing the weaker ones.  Solo players aren't going to do well unless they know how to play solo in this kind of environment.  You need to F*ing pay attention to the world around you and avoid high population areas.  You also need to be able to run away a lot.  Otherwise your best bet is to find a good guild.  Not a crappy one with people you like to chat with, an actual good guild.  A guild that can train it's members and protect them when it is really needed.   Good guilds in these circumstances can have a very strong bond much unlike your PVE server guilds.   If someone isn't willing to step up their game then of course this game won't be fun.  Your standard mmorpg soloer will get his face crushed.  Often.  It is good to have these kind of games as there is real challenge.  Fighting mobs is almost never challenging.  When two well organized guilds go to war, then all hell breaks loose and you get some real fun. 

Being, "no different than in a standard mmorpg," does not mean that a game's community is not toxic. In a, "standard mmorpg," systems exist to limit the impact of community toxicity.

Originally posted by Anubisan

I think full loot is vital to the success of a good sandbox game. Without it, there is no point in anything. Sandbox games feel more real and alive when there is something to lose when you step out of a safe zone. It gets your heart beating and adrenaline flowing and actually makes you invest emotionally in everything you do with your character.

I'm not saying that this was done correctly in Darkfall. In my opinion, there needs to be a sufficiently large area that is safe for newer players to adventure in. EVE has high security space for instance where newer players can stay and play the game in relative safety. The greatest rewards and adventure lie in 0 sec space, but newer players don't have to venture there until they really feel ready. And they can always return to the safer areas when they feel like they need a break. I think this type of system would work really well in a fantasy sandbox...

No point in anything? I agree that it creates a panic, but to say that it equates to the definition of what a sandbox game is, might be a little too much.  AA has a lot for you to do. I would think that if the panic of me losing my loot was the only thing that made me feel atatched to the game, I would probably have to admit to myself that I really don't like all of the features of sandbox gaming.