Originally posted by Starpower

Originally posted by eyeswideopen

Originally posted by Starpower

Originally posted by Adamantine

Originally posted by Starpower

Meanwhile in Ethiopia ....

This is an interesting attitude.

"We dont solve this problem because somebody at the other end of the planet has a bigger problem"

So can you actually help that guy at the other end of the planet ?

It's meant to put things into context. For instance to provoke the thought. "is this really a problem?" Obviously he thinks it is but is it really?

The context is this is a gaming forum, thus it's meant for game related "issues" and "problems".

Save the Earth forums are that way. ---->.

Kids and their spoiled lives

Says the guy writing on a gaming forum when there's so many more important "world problems" he should be fixing, aye?

Well can we fix THIS problem and get the damn original thread back?  Seems to have been removed over on the TERA forums, but for what reason, I don't know.  I hope it's not a case of Mods not liking people giving their opinions about the game, therefore they remove them.

Not seeing any "censorship" here.

Frogster wants to be allowed to sell games to 12yo. In Europe apparently if you try to sell a game to a 12yo it cannot have excessive blood and gore. So Frogster is WILLINGLY taking the excessive blood out. They don't HAVE TO. NOONE is forcing them to. If they REALLY wanted to keep blood in they would change who they are targeting the game for. Simple.

No censorship here folks. Just greed.

Originally posted by bartoni33

Not seeing any "censorship" here.

Frogster wants to be allowed to sell games to 12yo. In Europe apparently if you try to sell a game to a 12yo it cannot have excessive blood and gore. So Frogster is WILLINGLY taking the excessive blood out. They don't HAVE TO. NOONE is forcing them to. If they REALLY wanted to keep blood in they would change who they are targeting the game for. Simple.

No censorship here folks. Just greed.

Self censorship is still censorship. Apparently, people think something is censorship only if a government does it, which is wrong.

Blizzard is a prime example. They self censored WoW so they could sell it in China. China didn't enforce the censorship, Blizzard had the choice of sticking to their game design and telling China to get screwed. Blizzard made the choice to censor their own game out of greed, as you say, but it was still SELF censorship.

Originally posted by eyeswideopen

Originally posted by bartoni33

Not seeing any "censorship" here.

Frogster wants to be allowed to sell games to 12yo. In Europe apparently if you try to sell a game to a 12yo it cannot have excessive blood and gore. So Frogster is WILLINGLY taking the excessive blood out. They don't HAVE TO. NOONE is forcing them to. If they REALLY wanted to keep blood in they would change who they are targeting the game for. Simple.

No censorship here folks. Just greed.

Self censorship is still censorship. Apparently, people think something is censorship only if a government does it, which is wrong.

But why the raging?

It was their decision. For monetary gain. I always hear people defending companies for "just wanting to make a profit". This is what they are doing. You cannot be aganist this can you?

Originally posted by bartoni33

Originally posted by eyeswideopen

Originally posted by bartoni33

Not seeing any "censorship" here.

Frogster wants to be allowed to sell games to 12yo. In Europe apparently if you try to sell a game to a 12yo it cannot have excessive blood and gore. So Frogster is WILLINGLY taking the excessive blood out. They don't HAVE TO. NOONE is forcing them to. If they REALLY wanted to keep blood in they would change who they are targeting the game for. Simple.

No censorship here folks. Just greed.

Self censorship is still censorship. Apparently, people think something is censorship only if a government does it, which is wrong.

But why the raging?

It was their decision. For monetary gain. I always hear people defending companies for "just wanting to make a profit". This is what they are doing. You cannot be aganist this can you?

I'm not "against" anything, they want to dilute their game for profit, it's their choice. My only gripe was people trying to pretend one form of censorship is valid and another is not, when it's all censorship regardless.

Originally posted by eyeswideopen

Originally posted by bartoni33

Originally posted by eyeswideopen

Originally posted by bartoni33

Not seeing any "censorship" here.

Frogster wants to be allowed to sell games to 12yo. In Europe apparently if you try to sell a game to a 12yo it cannot have excessive blood and gore. So Frogster is WILLINGLY taking the excessive blood out. They don't HAVE TO. NOONE is forcing them to. If they REALLY wanted to keep blood in they would change who they are targeting the game for. Simple.

No censorship here folks. Just greed.

Self censorship is still censorship. Apparently, people think something is censorship only if a government does it, which is wrong.

But why the raging?

It was their decision. For monetary gain. I always hear people defending companies for "just wanting to make a profit". This is what they are doing. You cannot be aganist this can you?

I'm not "against" anything, they want to dilute their game for profit, it's their choice. My only gripe was people trying to pretend one form of censorship is valid and another is not, when it's all censorship regardless.

When TERA is told not to make a MMO period then I will cry censorship. Choosing to target a younger audience and willingly following the laws of the land by changing your own product IMHO is not censorship. It is a business decision. Just like the Blizzard thing you talked about eariler. They are just changing a VERY small aspect of their unreleased game.

I am a dad and have been a sports coach of kids.  I know very few young ones 12+ who will actually buy a subscription game and then pay the subscription or even pay for an online game as they have very little income and what pocket money they do get they spend on sweets and other things.  This bracket is mainly a console market as well.  Those kids who do pick up MMORPGS usually only play wow and this is a very small number 1-2 out of 100 I talk to.

The 16+ kids are different story.

I'd like to sign a petition that makes petitions actually accomplish something.

Originally posted by CujoSWAoA

I'd like to sign a petition that makes petitions actually accomplish something.

You are surfing the wrong forums to accomplish that wish.

Originally posted by CujoSWAoA

I'd like to sign a petition that makes petitions actually accomplish something.

But then your petition would actually have to change something. Which it can't until someone signs a petition that actually accomplishes something!

Originally posted by Jenuviel

I don't think you understand what censorship is. This isn't a government forcing them to change their content, Frogster made that decision themselves to enlarge their market. You can argue that the ratings board is a government agency, but its sole reason for existence is to accurately describe content so parents can make informed purchasing decisions and keep more adult content out of the hands of children. They can't force Frogster to change anything, they can't prevent Frogster from bringing a product to market; all they can do is label it.

 

This is all about money, and Frogster determined that the sales lost from reducing blood, nudity, or whatever they're removing will be eclipsed by the number of sales they gain from a larger pool of potential customers. It's not a conspiracy or totalitarianism, it's just plain old business.

Parents have different opinions about what is and is not adult content. Parents should be responsible and decide what is OK or not. Its a mistake to trust some agency. Why would it be able to accurately describe content?

And they have power and an agenda. Because it will ruin a game and possibly a company if a game that was intended for 12 or 15 YO gets a mature rating. Some retailers would even refuse to sell the game. And the target audience would be smaller.  What if the company and some parents have a different opinion and think the game is OK as it is? And not bad for 12/15 YO kids.... Or perhaps sometimes the agency think a game is OK for a 15 YO but some parents with other moral ideas think its not.

Personally I dont think its a good idea to allow some agency to make decisions that really parents should make. So I cant agree its just business. If you believe the individual and in this case parents should be more responsible its not good. I dont think the state or some agency should interfere. This is about both economical and moral power.

OMG I GOT IT!

I figured out the solution! I'm going to send it to Frogster right now. But since I like all of you people here I'll tell you what it is. I hope I don't ruin anything.

"Blood slider and settings were a bug!"

Worked for EA and TOR when they lied about "Hi-rez textures and the Menu setting were a bug" fiasco.

Hope this helps!

Originally posted by Hurvart

Originally posted by Jenuviel

I don't think you understand what censorship is. This isn't a government forcing them to change their content, Frogster made that decision themselves to enlarge their market. You can argue that the ratings board is a government agency, but its sole reason for existence is to accurately describe content so parents can make informed purchasing decisions and keep more adult content out of the hands of children. They can't force Frogster to change anything, they can't prevent Frogster from bringing a product to market; all they can do is label it.

 

This is all about money, and Frogster determined that the sales lost from reducing blood, nudity, or whatever they're removing will be eclipsed by the number of sales they gain from a larger pool of potential customers. It's not a conspiracy or totalitarianism, it's just plain old business.

Parents have different opinions about what is and is not adult content. Parents should be responsible and decide what is OK or not. Its a mistake to trust some agency. Why would it be able to accurately describe content?

And they have power and an agenda. Because it will ruin a game and possibly a company if a game that was intended for 12 or 15 YO gets a mature rating. Some retailers would even refuse to sell the game. And the target audience would be smaller.  What if the company and some parents have a different opinion and think the game is OK as it is? And not bad for 12/15 YO kids.... Or perhaps sometimes the agency think a game is OK for a 15 YO but some parents with other moral ideas think its not.

Personally I dont think its a good idea to allow some agency to make decisions that really parents should make. So I cant agree its just business. If you believe the individual and in this case parents should be more responsible its not good. I dont think the state or some agency should interfere. This is about both economical and moral power.

Great post! I agree 100%.

Still not censorship but still great post.

You know why such agencys exists? Two reasons: Bad Parents and lawers.

What exactly are they censoring? Dirty minds will see things that aren't there. For everyone else TERA plays as bad as it looks.

Originally posted by Novusod

What exactly are they censoring? Dirty minds will see things that aren't there. For everyone else TERA plays as bad as it looks.

Don't point that thing at me little girl!

Sexualized little girls with big phallic symbols in their tiny hands are not the problem. THEY WANT BLOOD!

FWIW my dirty mind sees all kinds of stuff that isn't meant (maybe) to be there. But to me anime and all that jazz is kinda strange to me. It's my Mid-west upbringing shining through!

Originally posted by Wizardry

I am not a fan of Frogster what so ever ,i actually despise them however...

This has mixed reactions,although i know Frogster's ONLY concern is to reach a wider audience to make more money,i personally have no problem with them making a game that allows a younger audience,afterall it is gaming not a strip club.

Wait for it....

Strip Club MMO!!!!!!

Legen...... DARY.

Originally posted by Novusod

What exactly are they censoring? Dirty minds will see things that aren't there. For everyone else TERA plays as bad as it looks.

Because of pictures like this:

Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

Originally posted by Novusod

What exactly are they censoring? Dirty minds will see things that aren't there. For everyone else TERA plays as bad as it looks.

 

Because of pictures like this:

Eww! Dude she's over a thousand years old! That is gross! She's someones great(x10)grandma!

Signed, TERA player.

Originally posted by bartoni33

Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

Originally posted by Novusod

What exactly are they censoring? Dirty minds will see things that aren't there. For everyone else TERA plays as bad as it looks.

 

Because of pictures like this:

Eww! Dude she's over a thousand years old! That is gross! She's someones great(x10)grandma!

Signed, TERA player.

It is perfectly normal to feel protective about "human child"-like creatures and that can translate into wanting them to wear proper cloths.