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Guild Wars 2 Forum » General Discussion » The Botting Epidemic is Disheartening [updated]

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138 posts found
  User Deleted
10/06/12 12:58:45 PM#101
Originally posted by Zzad
Originally posted by sfc1971

I am still amazed people are suprised.

Korean MMO's have never had quality, that is why they could afford to be free. Because they were very simple games with just lot of flash in the frontend.

Before and during launch, you saw countless posts how GW2 lnot needing a subscription was proof western developers were lying with their claim they needed subs to pay for servers and support.

Well guess what? Those posters were wrong.

Did you know ARENANET is an American Studio ,right ???

Not Korean....

Well guess what? You were wrong......

Did you know ArenaNet is owned by NCSoft? Did you know NCSoft is a South Korea based gaming company?

  User Deleted
10/06/12 1:02:50 PM#102
Originally posted by Lukain
Originally posted by squalleonaha

botting is consequence of gold  buying.

you give those farmer income then of course they keep making and ruin your game.

if that same money go into Anet pocket through gems sell, i think they can hire more techniction to develove anti -bot.

You are correct Botting is connected to Gold Farmers/Sellers  & there is an easy Fix , Make Gold Hierloom / & usable thru Auction House only

So gold can be handed down to any character on your account  or when U use it in the AH the gold goes from Your Hierloom Gold to the Seller/Buyer Hierloom gold ..

 

So you can't transfer gold from one player to another as easy as now.. while I doubt it would totally stop gold farmers it would slow em down .

 

 

The core issue with botting is the craptacular authentication system. They do not provide either a phone app or a phystical token (ala WoW, SWTOR several other games) to utilize 2 factor authentication. Because of this and stupid players, accounts are hacked on a regular basis. The botters use hacked accounts. You report hacked account, botters utilize another hacked account. 

 

If regular GW2 accounts were more secure, via some form of two factor authentication (and the ip/email authentication IS an improvement but still not enough) there would be less account hacking. Botters would more likely be required to actually PURCHASE accounts to bot with, thereby reducing their profit margin. 

  User Deleted
10/06/12 1:04:34 PM#103
Originally posted by Jyiiga

The botting thread grows daily on the official forums.  It has 376 replies and a staggering 72,000 views at this point. They have started deleting any screenshots or youtube links that provide proof of botting. Which seems a little odd to me, since anyone playing the game (that has a brain) has already noticed them. 

The same bots have been in Penitent Path for well over a week now. 

And THAT's the problem. You can report bots all damn day and you'll see the SAME bots in the SAME areas for days even weeks.

  Ryowulf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/28/05
Posts: 671

10/06/12 1:06:08 PM#104
Originally posted by cahenderson
Originally posted by jmcdermottuk

Rampant botting! An epidemic! Really? I'm a pretty observant guy, I tend to notice things a lot of other people miss. I also report people I see botting, along with gold sellers.

So far I've reported ... wait for it ... 4 bots in GW2. 4, not 40, nor 400, just 4. Count them, 1,2,3,4. OMFG! We've got an epidemic of rampant bots!

I'm eagerly awaiting the next installment of "How to Derail GW2 with Bullshit Posts".

So if you can't/don't see it, it CAN'T be true?

i haven't seen them either.

See YOU are saying they are there, so its up to you to prove they are. Words are meaningless.

  dlld

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/31/08
Posts: 516

10/06/12 1:08:28 PM#105
I'm playing on Pikens square and the botters seem to have increased lately or moved to higher zones, about 5 of them at minos and 10 at the grawl tunnel and 5 at the ice trolls in frostgorge sound, i reported some of them 2 days ago but they are still there.
  Purutzil

Elite Member

Joined: 10/02/11
Posts: 2863

The Critical Hit Pretzel!

10/06/12 1:11:29 PM#106
Originally posted by Ryowulf
Originally posted by cahenderson
Originally posted by jmcdermottuk

Rampant botting! An epidemic! Really? I'm a pretty observant guy, I tend to notice things a lot of other people miss. I also report people I see botting, along with gold sellers.

So far I've reported ... wait for it ... 4 bots in GW2. 4, not 40, nor 400, just 4. Count them, 1,2,3,4. OMFG! We've got an epidemic of rampant bots!

I'm eagerly awaiting the next installment of "How to Derail GW2 with Bullshit Posts".

So if you can't/don't see it, it CAN'T be true?

i haven't seen them either.

See YOU are saying they are there, so its up to you to prove they are. Words are meaningless.

I've seen it before, it depends on if you want to be ignorant about it or just play along a blind path they don't farm. When you do see bots... oh boy... they swarm let me tell you. Being ignorant to a problem doesn't fix it, it makes it worst. If you enjoy GW2 you should WANT stuff to be improved, because having so many bots around is only going to demean the experience of the game.

  FrodoFragins

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/29/10
Posts: 2772

10/06/12 2:11:39 PM#107
Originally posted by GrumpyCharr

UPDATE:  Since I've posted this, ArenaNet has stated that they are combating botting in three ways (summary of their statements):

1. Diminishing Returns.  When a bot farms a group of enemies over a period of time, drops go down.  The purpose is to limit their damage until they can be reported and banned.  They have clearly stated that they are still tweeking this since many legit players have also found that this had limited their drops as well.

This never works.  It only hurts the legit players.  Bots can always be rewritten to change zones regularly.

2. Bot detection.  They've stated on their forums that they have recently hired data experts to improve their ability to detect and remove bots.  This is obviously incomplete at this time since some bots are active for days at a time without detection.  

Glad to hear this.  But if after all the years, Blizzard still hasn't been able to tackle the issue, I'm not extrtemely hopeful.

3. Player reporting.  This is, at this stage, the only known reliable way to remove bots.  Sadly, the epidemic is strong enough that there just isnt the manpower to allow for the proper investigation for each individual botting case.  Imagine there are five accounts all multiboxing.  They have to look into each of those accounts and investigate them one at a time.  They don't want to accidentally ban a legit player who was mistakenly reported because he was near the bots at the time the report went down.

Always a helpful means to combat bots, but they probably only hit a small % of them.

I made this original post in a moment of genuine frustration.  The following must happen:

1. Response time must be improved.  Bots at work for days is not acceptable.

2. Bot/exploit detection must improve.  Goes without saying.

3. All of this must be done without damaging the experience of legit players.

Easier said than done.  Hiring GMs to hunt reported bots is time consuming and expensive.  They are obviously a lower priority than serious character/account issues. 

  Vesavius

Old School

Joined: 3/08/04
Posts: 7197

Players come for the game, but they stay for the people- Most Devs have forgotten this.

10/06/12 3:41:09 PM#108
Originally posted by tank017
Originally posted by Vesavius
Originally posted by tank017
Originally posted by ste2000
I heard of Bots from other players, but never met one in game yet, so it is not rampant as the OP make out to be.

 

You're probably aren't noticing them

 

then I have to ask... what does it even matter?

If they are THAT unnoticable I mean.

 

I have seen a  few bots, but I only really PvE and I don't use the cash shop, so I don't report them because I don't play to protect ANet's gold sales. They are no more impactful for me then the real players that have exploited and farmed tbh. If anything bots keep market prices down, and for someone that hasn't farmed or exploited that is kinda a good thing..

becuase on other servers they are VERY noticeable.. I just switched servers becuase of them.I see packs of anywhere from 2-10 everytime I log on. Just becuase you arent having a problem, doesnt mean others arent.

 

The part in red... I never denied this bothered some people, nor did I deny the fact that they exist or that they were noticable for others, I was just giving my experience based on the activity in my space.

But... please explain to me how bots in this game actually impact your gameplay? Apart from you not liking to see them I mean. And aside from  them actually driving broker prices down to make stuff more affordable for the average player.

 

  Vesavius

Old School

Joined: 3/08/04
Posts: 7197

Players come for the game, but they stay for the people- Most Devs have forgotten this.

10/06/12 3:45:21 PM#109
Originally posted by cahenderson
Originally posted by Vesavius
Originally posted by tank017
Originally posted by ste2000
I heard of Bots from other players, but never met one in game yet, so it is not rampant as the OP make out to be.

 

You're probably aren't noticing them

 

then I have to ask... what does it even matter?

If they are THAT unnoticable I mean.

 

I have seen a  few bots, but I only really PvE and I don't use the cash shop, so I don't report them because I don't play to protect ANet's gold sales. They are no more impactful for me then the real players that have exploited and farmed tbh. If anything bots keep market prices down, and for someone that hasn't farmed or exploited that is kinda a good thing..

Bots DO impact you because ANet introduced the DR code to combat them. The DR code is buggy, however, and ANet have several times already adjusted the code because it was a detriment to honest, Terms of Service/Code of Conduct abiding, players.

 

But the question I have posed is that, without after the fact rules sets such as DR imposed by ANet in an effort to protect their own gold sales, what  difference to you as a player do these bots actually make in terms of game play?

I didn't ask 'what is the impact of Anet's policy to deal with the bots?'.

  pedrostrik

Novice Member

Joined: 4/07/10
Posts: 400

10/06/12 5:21:15 PM#110

Bots rampage on start damaged AION forever, but lately (3 months later) they almost gone or maybe they move to another game (this nobody never will know).
I hope Arenanet start to hammer them asap, and i know if they keep negligent about this problem it will cause severe harm to this beautiful game, unfortunately.

  Zzad

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/14/11
Posts: 1294

10/07/12 10:45:53 AM#111
Originally posted by amber-r
Originally posted by Zzad
Originally posted by sfc1971

I am still amazed people are suprised.

Korean MMO's have never had quality, that is why they could afford to be free. Because they were very simple games with just lot of flash in the frontend.

Before and during launch, you saw countless posts how GW2 lnot needing a subscription was proof western developers were lying with their claim they needed subs to pay for servers and support.

Well guess what? Those posters were wrong.

Did you know ARENANET is an American Studio ,right ???

Not Korean....

Well guess what? You were wrong......

Guild wars 2 is owned by a Korean company, they have total say in how much money it gets, if it will get new content, if it is shut down and about how it's run,  and everything else.  Arenanet work for Ncsoft which is a Korean company.

 

That has nothing to do with the first quoted statement.

GW2 is developed & programed & designed by an American Studio : ARENANET will TOTAL freedom,

therefore It is a "Western MMO" not a Korean MMO.....

NcSoft is just the publisher.

  SirBalin

Warmonger

Joined: 11/22/06
Posts: 1069

10/07/12 10:48:58 AM#112
Tab target games are so easy to build bots in...part of the reason I like the aim to shoot games better.  Not saying they can't be exploited...but its a lot harder

Incognito
www.incognito-gaming.us
"You're either with us or against us"

  IPolygon

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/20/11
Posts: 707

10/07/12 11:12:14 AM#113
Originally posted by afhn2110
Tab target games are so easy to build bots in...part of the reason I like the aim to shoot games better.  Not saying they can't be exploited...but its a lot harder

 

Hi Aimbot.

Edit: Bots are easily programmed for FPS games aswell. CoD has been infested with bots since forever. Just because you don't see it, doesn't mean it is not there.
  grimal

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/11/05
Posts: 2222

10/07/12 11:19:16 AM#114

The bot problem does exist.  Simply because you have not seen them does not mean they are not there.

Please, can we just move forward with this and perhaps try to discuss meaningful ways of dealing with this?  Simply ignoring them will only make the situation worse (hello, APB).

I've made it a habit to report each and every bot I have seen.  Recently I swapped servers so I haven't been able to check if those botters were in fact removed.  But, I have noticed the server I am on, in the zones I am exploring, I have noticed much less bots.  So, if you are feeling a bit disheartened, I might recommend moving there (Tarnished Coast).  The server I was previously on was Yak's Bend.

Outside of reporting via the interface, is there anything else we can do?  Not sure. Open for suggestions.

Edit:

Ways of noticing a bot:

1) Typically has bizarre key-generated like name "dhdhs" or "sdhasj".  This in itself does not mean they are botting, however.

2) Usually run in groups and are doing the exact same actions in synchronization.

3) Move directly from mob to mob or don't move at all.  More like robotic moving.

4) Teleport anywhere from 5-20 ft in-game.  I've also noticed using ranged attacks that seem to shoot much further than they should.

If you spot all 4, you could send them a tell and see if they respond.  Otherwise, use your judgment.  Don't abuse and report falsely.  This could really hurt someone's account.

 

"I'm sorry, if you were right, I'd agree with you." - Robin Williams

  Ryowulf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/28/05
Posts: 671

10/07/12 11:26:52 AM#115
Originally posted by Purutzil
Originally posted by Ryowulf
Originally posted by cahenderson
Originally posted by jmcdermottuk

Rampant botting! An epidemic! Really? I'm a pretty observant guy, I tend to notice things a lot of other people miss. I also report people I see botting, along with gold sellers.

So far I've reported ... wait for it ... 4 bots in GW2. 4, not 40, nor 400, just 4. Count them, 1,2,3,4. OMFG! We've got an epidemic of rampant bots!

I'm eagerly awaiting the next installment of "How to Derail GW2 with Bullshit Posts".

So if you can't/don't see it, it CAN'T be true?

i haven't seen them either.

See YOU are saying they are there, so its up to you to prove they are. Words are meaningless.

I've seen it before, it depends on if you want to be ignorant about it or just play along a blind path they don't farm. When you do see bots... oh boy... they swarm let me tell you. Being ignorant to a problem doesn't fix it, it makes it worst. If you enjoy GW2 you should WANT stuff to be improved, because having so many bots around is only going to demean the experience of the game.

What I am saying is when people proclaim "The Botting Epidemic", they need to back up their words with actual proof.

Your experiences in the game aren't universal. You aren't speaking for anyone other than yourself.  There might be a problem with botting, but a few opinions on this forum isn't enough to convince me.

  TwoThreeFour

Novice Member

Joined: 3/26/12
Posts: 2148

10/07/12 11:27:45 AM#116
Originally posted by Zzad
Originally posted by amber-r
Originally posted by Zzad
Originally posted by sfc1971

I am still amazed people are suprised.

Korean MMO's have never had quality, that is why they could afford to be free. Because they were very simple games with just lot of flash in the frontend.

Before and during launch, you saw countless posts how GW2 lnot needing a subscription was proof western developers were lying with their claim they needed subs to pay for servers and support.

Well guess what? Those posters were wrong.

Did you know ARENANET is an American Studio ,right ???

Not Korean....

Well guess what? You were wrong......

Guild wars 2 is owned by a Korean company, they have total say in how much money it gets, if it will get new content, if it is shut down and about how it's run,  and everything else.  Arenanet work for Ncsoft which is a Korean company.

 

That has nothing to do with the first quoted statement.

GW2 is developed & programed & designed by an American Studio : ARENANET will TOTAL freedom,

therefore It is a "Western MMO" not a Korean MMO.....

NcSoft is just the publisher.

 

Source for this "TOTAL freedom" claim?

  niceguy3978

Elite Member

Joined: 6/14/06
Posts: 1995

10/07/12 11:27:54 AM#117
Originally posted by Zzad
Originally posted by amber-r
Originally posted by Zzad
Originally posted by sfc1971

I am still amazed people are suprised.

Korean MMO's have never had quality, that is why they could afford to be free. Because they were very simple games with just lot of flash in the frontend.

Before and during launch, you saw countless posts how GW2 lnot needing a subscription was proof western developers were lying with their claim they needed subs to pay for servers and support.

Well guess what? Those posters were wrong.

Did you know ARENANET is an American Studio ,right ???

Not Korean....

Well guess what? You were wrong......

Guild wars 2 is owned by a Korean company, they have total say in how much money it gets, if it will get new content, if it is shut down and about how it's run,  and everything else.  Arenanet work for Ncsoft which is a Korean company.

 

That has nothing to do with the first quoted statement.

GW2 is developed & programed & designed by an American Studio : ARENANET will TOTAL freedom,

therefore It is a "Western MMO" not a Korean MMO.....

NcSoft is just the publisher.

While I disagree with the premise of the poster you are responding to, NCsoft isn't just the publisher.  This is at the bottom of the GW2 homepage:

©2010–2012 ArenaNet, Inc. and NC Interactive, Inc. All rights reserved. Guild Wars, Guild Wars 2, ArenaNet, NCsoft, the Interlocking NC Logo, and all associated logos and designs are trademarks or registered trademarks of NCsoft Corporation. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners.

NCsoft owns everything dealing with GW2 including Anet.  Though, it is impossible to say how much influence the parent company has, it is possible they have 100% say in everything, and it is possible they took a completely hands off approach to Anet (I'm pretty sure anet has said this was the case) but it is an unknowable to anyone not working within the organization.

  AwDiddums

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/09/12
Posts: 381

10/07/12 11:37:43 AM#118
Originally posted by Sentime
Originally posted by squalleonaha

botting is consequence of gold  buying.

you give those farmer income then of course they keep making and ruin your game.

if that same money go into Anet pocket through gems sell, i think they can hire more techniction to develove anti -bot.

Botting is consequence of designing a game with boring monotonous tasks that if done enough times will benefit your character.

Lets be honest here and look at the real root cause.

If game companies continue to put in such "features" they should embrace botting.

So what the devs need to do is take away all the creatures in the game and just have us as the prey, thats about the easiest way to solve it and get rid of your "Boring Monotonous Tasks" aspect.

Ofc thats never going to happen, no matter what MMO your playing there will be mobs that have spawns points and wander in any given area, can't think of a single MMO that does this differently and has managed to deter Botters, where ever there is a demand for in game cash there will be a botter setting up shop, the tasks aren't the problem here, it's the fact players think they need this cash to advance in the game, just like you have players who must hit max ASAP, you have ppl who HAVE to have it all NOW.

 

  Ramonski7

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/21/03
Posts: 2696

"A wise man has something to say, but a fool just has to say something."

10/07/12 11:45:07 AM#119

I honestly wasn't paying attetion enough to notice if players were bots or actual players. Then one night while in WvWvW I was unlocking the skill point and PoI for Green Land when I came across something very odd. There was a huge group of players on my side (Ferguson’s Crossing) in the area killing Skritt. Nothing seemed out of the ordinary until I noticed a defender from green world attacking our side as they were running around. Odd thing is no one was switching their focus on the enemy player.

 

But his focus turned to me when he noticed I was targeting him. Well after a few deaths in the area I asked for a rez after being passed up with these players walking over my dead body over 20 times. It seemed a couple of "real" players joined the area so I started following the crowd. Lo and behold I noticed that everyone except for the 3 or 4 real players were basically running in a figure 8 while actively targetting skritts. It had to be about a dozen or so players running what appeared to me as a script. Not once did I get any verbal responses from the runners.

 

I eventually got bored of observing these guys after about 20 minutes. And since I didn't have fraps or anything to run a screenshot wouldn't really prove anything. So after I made a few reports I left the area scratching my head in disbelief.


"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."

  Regomar

Novice Member

Joined: 11/06/08
Posts: 130

10/07/12 12:40:08 PM#120

I play 3-4 hours a day.  I have NEVER seen a bot.  Don;t know what to tell you guys, maybe Im just lucky and chose a good server.  I'm not saying they dont exist, I watched the vids posted in this thread but I have NEVER seen a single person with a name like 'gdfjgfff' or seen a person port, or any of those obvious bot chains.

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