Originally posted by zonzai

I'm just curious.  I played GW1 and there was a lot of strategy in having 160+ skills to choose from and build characters with.  But I'm getting really bored with GW2 PvE.  There's not much strategy to my warrior or elementalist.  I can pretty much just mash buttons and defeat 99% of the PvE game content.  Is there a class that allows you to have a variety of strategies to deploy?  Is there a way for me to be entertained by the strategy portion of this game?  I haven't found it yet. 

Please don't turn this into a discussion about how much strategy GW2 has, how strategic PvP is, or the merrits of the GW2 system.   I'm not complaining and I don't care if you like GW2 better, didn't like GW1 or anything else.  I just want to know what does have strategy.

Thanks in advance for the help.

Forget all those boring rush thru the game professions spsssh, you need a leather clad scout profession. 

Engineering, Thief, Ranger (sans the short bow of course) Wanna talk strategy? those are the professions to choose. They have utilities for everything, you gotta pick the right ones, you gotta get the right kits together, you gotta make sure you get the right pet out. It's not just some run around faceroll profession we're talkin about here. 

:) nah but seriously i would suggest those three because I love strat as well and subterfuge and cunning these classes give me that.

Originally posted by Aerowyn

you ele is IMHO proably the most  strategic  just for the sake of needing to juggle the 4 elements to really be effective.. That on top of how damn squishy they are even with heavy toughness spec you have to be on your toes constantly moving, CCing, and dodging. But much of it in any class comes down to traits/utility skills and how you have your character setup

I think the kind of "strategic" between elementalists and engineers are very different.

 

Elementalist got high base dps, but they got to manage survivability. They don't have to use combos to be effective.

 

Engineer is even on everything, but they got pretty slow dps. They can survive if they play smart, but HAVE to learn to use combos if they want to do good damage. Lvl 70 onwards will be very difficult if you don't learn to use combos.

Thanks for the great replies everyone. 

There is a certain amount of strategy to the elementalist but it is a different sort than the GW1 elementalist (which I played a lot).  How you build your character isn't actually that important in the case of the GW2 elementalist (at least not for PvE).  Weapon choice is of course much more important than other classes due to only having one weapon.  But that's the kind of thing I want to avoid.  I want to have to micromanage what skills I take not, simply what weapons I take and when to use which skills, which is mostly what elementalist calls for.  Not that it isn't strategic and fun to do so.  It's just not enough for me.

I've enjoyed my warrior but he is really the character I will go to when I don't want to have to think.  There are times when I get bored with that.  But maybe the Guardian will be more interesting if it can provide me a balance between strategy and mindlessnes.  I'll give it a shot anyway.

I'll also check out the mesmer since it sounds like skill selection is actually very important.  That's one of the main things I miss about GW1 and one of the things that kept me interested in it for so long. 

All of them really. Some professions have more combo fields (ele, mesmer, necro), some have more finishers (warrior, ranger, thief) and some are pretty balanced (guard and engineer). The trick to performing well is to match up field makers with finishers. Rangers are particularly awesome at using other peoples fields for extra damage for instance, but they don't have many fields themselves.

Also you will find that you won't get away with button mashing later on with any class. Youll have to swap weapons / attunements / kits on the fly if you want to do well. You should always carry a high level version of each weapon so you can swap out of combat if need be for a certain fight.

Originally posted by zonzai

I'm just curious.  I played GW1 and there was a lot of strategy in having 160+ skills to choose from and build characters with.  But I'm getting really bored with GW2 PvE.  There's not much strategy to my warrior or elementalist.  I can pretty much just mash buttons and defeat 99% of the PvE game content.  Is there a class that allows you to have a variety of strategies to deploy?  Is there a way for me to be entertained by the strategy portion of this game?  I haven't found it yet. 

Please don't turn this into a discussion about how much strategy GW2 has, how strategic PvP is, or the merrits of the GW2 system.   I'm not complaining and I don't care if you like GW2 better, didn't like GW1 or anything else.  I just want to know what does have strategy.

Thanks in advance for the help.

The way GW2's system is setup, each class can be as strategic or as simple as you make them out to be. I know that sounds like a cop-out answer, but take the elementalist as an example:

On the one extreme, you can play elementalist as a condition spammer, practically staying in earth attunement the entire fight, or doing the same with fire. And yes, that would be extremely boring, as you are just using the same couple of skills forever, with very little timing involved.

However on the other extreme, you have arcane heavy elementalists, who build off of the attunement swapping mechanic. This can be a lot more challenging to play, as you have to not only keep an internal clock of various cooldowns, but also guage attunement cooldowns with using various attacks in different orders. The benefits, though, are you can chain lots of buffs together, you can stack some powerful conditions together before applying a heavy-hitting spike attack. Attunement swapping also can give you an insane amount of CC with certain weapon setups. There's a lot of strategy involved w/ that.

Overall, though, the strategy in GW2 is more obvious with certain classes than others, as it's less hidden. Mainly, the Mesmer, Elementalist, and Engineer are the easiest to see this with. All classes have a lot of potential strategy involved, though, but as with GW1 it really depends on your build. If you spec your class to just spam a few skills and have a bunch of passive buffs, then you're class will appear extremely simple. If you spec your class for lots of varied synergies and application, then it will be a lot more complex.

- In addition to what I stated above, the strategy compounds once you get into organized group play. For example, how you setup your class synergies can greatly change how a dungeon run goes. Some combinations even make dungeons insanely easy when used correctly.

Originally posted by zonzai

Thanks for the great replies everyone. 

There is a certain amount of strategy to the elementalist but it is a different sort than the GW1 elementalist (which I played a lot).  How you build your character isn't actually that important in the case of the GW2 elementalist (at least not for PvE).  Weapon choice is of course much more important than other classes due to only having one weapon.  But that's the kind of thing I want to avoid.  I want to have to micromanage what skills I take not, simply what weapons I take and when to use which skills, which is mostly what elementalist calls for.  Not that it isn't strategic and fun to do so.  It's just not enough for me.

Elementalist is definitely different from the first game, in that GW1 mostly focused around 1-2 elements at a time, and you worked off that. In this game you mostly synergize between all 4, and build to favore certain ones over others. However, that doesn't mean that utilities aren't super important. 

The elementalist (more than any other class, really) does have a lot of mostly useless utilities, however they also have some really useful / versatile ones. For example 'Glyph of Storms' is an insanely versatile skill. Depending on your attunement you can either make it an AoE blind, or an AoE chill, etc. Same deal w/ the pets, the attunement you're in when you summon the pets makes a big difference, and it's the difference between a more support heavy pet, a more tanky pet, and one that will help your dmg but die easily.

The class intricacies are there, u just gotta look for them. Most of the skill complexities of the first game actually did make it into GW2, but they aren't all as obvious.

While I respect your opinions on elementalists, I won't be playing one because it isn't right for me. I want to find a profession closer to GW1 where every single skill slot is cruicial.  I do not feel that the elementalist gives me that.  I will try the engineer and mesmer as they both sound more like what I am looking for.

I like the idea of the engineer but with no actual melee weapon equippable I lost interest before trying it.

I'm a melee guy I hate staying at ranged fighting and in gw2 all classes but engineer can melee. (Ok they have a wrench tool which is nothing special)

Originally posted by bloodaxes

I like the idea of the engineer but with no actual melee weapon equippable I lost interest before trying it.

I'm a melee guy I hate staying at ranged fighting and in gw2 all classes but engineer can melee. (Ok they have a wrench tool which is nothing special)

Engineer can actually be a pretty respectable melee with Tool Kit and Traits that support it.

Originally posted by zonzai

Thanks for the great replies everyone. 

There is a certain amount of strategy to the elementalist but it is a different sort than the GW1 elementalist (which I played a lot).  How you build your character isn't actually that important in the case of the GW2 elementalist (at least not for PvE).  Weapon choice is of course much more important than other classes due to only having one weapon.  But that's the kind of thing I want to avoid.  I want to have to micromanage what skills I take not, simply what weapons I take and when to use which skills, which is mostly what elementalist calls for.  Not that it isn't strategic and fun to do so.  It's just not enough for me.

i'm not defending ele like it's mine as i play all 8 classes (all above 50, and 3 at 80), but this is what i was talking about when i say it's easy to play an ele, but hard to play a good ele. your entire build is key. timing of attunement swaps, weapon choice, ability use, utility builds/choices, elite, heal, runes, traits, combos, distance, etc. all have a huge part in what makes up a pro ele. your traits can make or break you, even in PvE.

sigil builds, glyph builds, conjured weapons, arcane, mix and match, etc. also with all the elements you have a huge choice in combos. i've often found that a good ele is the foundation of most of the pro 5 man groups i run with. they tend to set up group wide buffs with attunement swaps, and lay combo fields depending on the situation.

So anybody have any opinions on anything other than the elementalist?  Or is this thread all about elementalists now?

 

Originally posted by zonzai

So anybody have any opinions on anything other than the elementalist?  Or is this thread all about elementalists now?

 

Elementalist and engineer allow for the most strategizing on the go simply due to the fact they have the opporunity to use so many different skills at any given time with the widest range of effects.  Stuns, roots, heals, knockbacks, DoTs...  easily the most strategic as far as ability utilization on the go.

 

Strategy as far as positioning and team play,  the guardian can change the flow of battle in terms of the kinds of strategy you employ throughout teamplay.  They can focus on healing or mitigating damage, as well as controlling the flow of enemies.

 

The ranger has a lot of good self started combos which doesn't necessarily require much strategy to use once you get the flow of it,  but positioning is key for maximum effect and DoT.

 

The mesmer requires some strategy if you are focusing on counterbalancing ranged characters, or melee characters,  but overall once you get a build of any kind together, they are mostly one-note and repetitive in just about every situation.

Originally posted by Stayonboard

Engineer definitely -  I can't play any other profs (which is both good and bad) :(

 

Yep, Engineer is a fantastic character.  Just got one to 30 and got Supply Crate, Combat Suit and Golem (temporary) pet which are fun.  I usually use Healing Turret and switch between Grenades, Elixir Gun and Flamethrower depending on my mood and if I'm in an Event.  Grenades are a hell of a good weapon which few Engineers use, at least from what I've seen.

Elementalists are also a strategic character class, and if anyone thinks it isn't they're too stupid to play one.  I like Mesmer, too.  Very survivable class if you keep on the move and keep your wits about you.

Originally posted by Dibdabs

Elementalists are also a strategic character class, and if anyone thinks it isn't they're too stupid to play one.

Well at least that's better than being too stupid to read a thread before posting in it.

 

Weapon swapping is not the same type of strategy as having 180 skills and choosing only eight.  It's a completely different type of strategy.  Strategy of play and strategy of build.  Strategy of play is fine, but the GW2 elementalist has almost zero strategy of build compared to the GW1 elementalist.  They are different things.  As I stated clearly, I want more strategy of build than the elementalist provides. 

Now, I have tried to be nice to everybody and I know I should have been more clear on that in my original post.  I will edit it.  But shut the **** up about the elementalist already.  You guys just keep repeating the person above you over and over again.  I get that you all love the elementalist and please don't let me stop you from being BFF with them but I don't want stragey of attunement swapping.  The elementalist isn't challenging enough for me and doesn't challenge me in the way that I want to be challenged.