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Guild Wars 2 Forum » PvP » PVP. whats the point?

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92 posts found
  Hrimnir

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/24/10
Posts: 1090

 
OP  9/04/12 10:13:36 PM#1

Ok, so, i know they wanted to avoid a gear grind with PVP and such in this game.  So i know the highest level set of stuff was supposed to be cosmetic only, but from what i gathered there would be some gear upgrades to work towards with PVP.

As far as i can tell there isnt.  You port to pre pvp area and you immediately get bumped to 80 and slapped into a full set of nice gear.  I run around looking at the vendors and all i can see are cat boxes or something like that, which i google and find out they basically drop some useless crap like glory boosters, etc.

Now. Correct me if im wrong about the gear, but if there is NO gear grind vs a "light" gear grind.  I honestly can't see the point of PVPing.  I certainly am not going to spend hundreds of hours doing it to get some fluff gear that just looks cool.

Why? Lets be honest. If i wanted pure, 0 gear grind PVP, i'm gonna go play counterstrike, or something like that.

I play MMO's for character development, if im going to invest 100 hours of play into some piece of gear i want it to do something for me.  It doesnt have to be a HUGE advantage, but it should grant some sort of advantage.  I know people are going to disagree with me, and frankly i don't care.  Its my opinion and what i look for in an mmo.

I'm not saying the game is crap because of it, im just saying i dont quite understand the point of doing that in an RPG when things like RTS's and FPS's etc exist.

"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

- Friedrich Nietzsche

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

9/04/12 10:18:35 PM#2
not everyone plays games for the same reasons.. no game caters to all players... millions played GW1 and enjoyed PVP for cosmetic gear grind and the FUN of it.. if that doesn't sound fun to you game just isn't for you then.. me personally I play games for fun.. Gear grind is fine and all but at the end of the day it's a game and fun is the most important thing for me

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  nightfallrob

Novice Member

Joined: 5/10/08
Posts: 170

9/04/12 10:19:42 PM#3
The point is that PvP is supposed to be fun in and of itself. A lot of us remember playing games without gear grinds for PvP, where if you didn't have the best of the best of the best stuff you could still win through skill. And a lot of us liked it. Gear grinds are for raiding, and that's fine, if that's what you want to do. PvP is for fighting other players only because it's more fun. If you need a gear grind for PvP, then a game like GW2 isn't going to be for you. There's nothing wrong with that, it's just not your thing, much like gear grinds for PvP aren't mine. 
  Thornz2000

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/25/12
Posts: 139

9/04/12 10:20:43 PM#4

Well when you kill a player in W v W they drop a pvp badge that you save up for gear I have noticed.

Also, play GW2 they way YOU want to play it, because it has PVP does not mean you have to play it.

Find what you enjoy about the game and just do it.

The world we know is going away http://www.graystatemovie.com/
Look up Agenda 21 as well.

  Jackdog

Elite Member

Joined: 3/19/04
Posts: 6372

9/04/12 10:20:55 PM#5
just a wild ass guess mind you but I think it might be entertainment

I miss DAoC

  Hrimnir

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/24/10
Posts: 1090

 
OP  9/04/12 10:55:48 PM#6

I get what you guys are saying, trust me i do.  My point was why in this format? I understood the original GW, i didnt play it because it wasnt my cup of tea.  But now it seems like they took the PVP of original guild wars and then kind of stuck into a more traditional MMO, which is why i get this weird vibe from it ya know.

And again, the whole "a lot of us remember playing PVP without gear grinds" hasnt gone anywhere.  Those game still exist.  i've been a pc gamer for the better part of 20 years, I used to play modem to modem games of warcraft 1 with people and do co-op over modem on doom 2, etc.  So i get the idea of PVP based purely on skill, and i enjoy that,  but i dont see the purpose of it in a traditional MMO.

GW1 seemed like they did it the right way.  You basically didnt have a set world, you sat around in an area and waited for your instanced PVP match to start, much like you do on say battlenet, instead its not a chat room, its just a social area you can run around in.

I guess my beef is once you add in levels that take more than a few hours to pass through (seems like the number is around 100 hours or so for the average person to hit 80)  It just seems dumb to then go, "welp, now you've leveled to 80 and your character progression is done.  Go spend countless hours PVPing for basically nothing more than the enjoyment of it".

/shrug.  I just think me and lots of people play RPG's for the character advancement aspect of it, and part of that is gear grinds.  I'm not saying there should be some ultra hardcore gear grind, but the way the devs implied it was that there would be a minor gear grind, i.e. you could get 1 piece every 2 or 3 hours of PVPing, and then after that you could start saving up for the super uber "Looks" equipment that didnt give a stat bonus.

But, as far as i can tell, you start out with the best stat gear you can get, so the only thing you are getting rewards for is the appearance related stuff.

 

"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

- Friedrich Nietzsche

  TheScavenger

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/05/12
Posts: 681

Those who ask a question, are stupid for 30 seconds. Those who never ask, are stupid for life.

9/04/12 11:02:42 PM#7
To have fun.

Isabella and Laenaya are on Photobucket!

http://s4.photobucket.com/user/Vendayn/library/Skyrim/Anime%20Skyrim

My (mostly) scenery screenshots of heavily modded Skyrim

http://s4.photobucket.com/user/Vendayn/library/Skyrim/Anime%20Skyrim/Aesthetics

  Sciva

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/08/07
Posts: 307

9/04/12 11:06:09 PM#8
Life. What's the point when you're just gunna die in the end?
  Failtrain

Novice Member

Joined: 12/04/10
Posts: 130

9/04/12 11:13:37 PM#9
I like to PvP because I get to stomp all the bad players who complain that they want better gear to get an advantage over me.
  pierth

Novice Member

Joined: 4/14/06
Posts: 1515

9/04/12 11:17:22 PM#10


Originally posted by Sciva
Life. What's the point when you're just gunna die in the end?

"You're all going to die. And then you're going to be dead for way longer than you're going to be alive. That's mostly what you're going to be. You're just dead people that didn't die yet." -Louis C.K.

As others in the thread have said- enjoy what little amount of time you're not dead. If it's not this game then try another. Your time is running out either way.

  Magnetia

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/07/11
Posts: 967

Any fool can know. The point is to understand.

9/04/12 11:18:30 PM#11

Let's break it down.

I want to do Player versus Player

not Player vs gear grind

 

Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?

  Odinthedark1

Novice Member

Joined: 10/06/11
Posts: 338

"A fool learns from his own mistakes, a wise man learns from the mistakes of others."

9/04/12 11:31:55 PM#12
Originally posted by Hrimnir

I get what you guys are saying, trust me i do.  My point was why in this format? I understood the original GW, i didnt play it because it wasnt my cup of tea.  But now it seems like they took the PVP of original guild wars and then kind of stuck into a more traditional MMO, which is why i get this weird vibe from it ya know.

And again, the whole "a lot of us remember playing PVP without gear grinds" hasnt gone anywhere.  Those game still exist.  i've been a pc gamer for the better part of 20 years, I used to play modem to modem games of warcraft 1 with people and do co-op over modem on doom 2, etc.  So i get the idea of PVP based purely on skill, and i enjoy that,  but i dont see the purpose of it in a traditional MMO.

GW1 seemed like they did it the right way.  You basically didnt have a set world, you sat around in an area and waited for your instanced PVP match to start, much like you do on say battlenet, instead its not a chat room, its just a social area you can run around in.

I guess my beef is once you add in levels that take more than a few hours to pass through (seems like the number is around 100 hours or so for the average person to hit 80)  It just seems dumb to then go, "welp, now you've leveled to 80 and your character progression is done.  Go spend countless hours PVPing for basically nothing more than the enjoyment of it".

/shrug.  I just think me and lots of people play RPG's for the character advancement aspect of it, and part of that is gear grinds.  I'm not saying there should be some ultra hardcore gear grind, but the way the devs implied it was that there would be a minor gear grind, i.e. you could get 1 piece every 2 or 3 hours of PVPing, and then after that you could start saving up for the super uber "Looks" equipment that didnt give a stat bonus.

But, as far as i can tell, you start out with the best stat gear you can get, so the only thing you are getting rewards for is the appearance related stuff.

 

I agree we all know what mmorpg stands for, and ROLE PLAYING revolves around ur character and progression not saying you necessarily have to RP but the game itself should revolve around your char, i feel the cosmetic gear helps that a bit but an MMORPG should be an rpg through and through. like  if i wanted pvp purely for fun i dont mind it in this setting but it would get boring fast. i would rather play like LoL or sumthin. I would be so happy if they made a game utilizing the common moba upgrade scheme but used an mmo control system...rather than a top down view and strategic gameplay, give me like tera's combat in a quake/doom arena style setting with moba skill/item upgrades gaining money per kill. but to answer ur question, there really is no point in it, its for people looking just for fun with no progression at all.

  dinos_21

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/26/05
Posts: 190

9/04/12 11:32:32 PM#13
i remember but in the days of MUD ( some oldtimers around here know what i am talking about) , or even L2 , we used to PVP for fun/honor/make  a name on the server/family war ...never pvped to get better eq , i went raiding so i can get better eq and be better at pvp, that yes , now days eq makes the pvpers, not skills, thats why i still pvp, even at WvW, cause when i kill someone that has better pvp eq, with my skills , that my friends is the ultimate satisfaction

Tormented echoes of a fallen Eden
I longed for her beauty
Yet from dust, she returned
The dream, an enigma.... silent

  sk8chalif

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/18/10
Posts: 591

9/04/12 11:38:44 PM#14
has For me its to have fun and get a blast with my friend . iam not here to work , ialready have a job. i do pvp because its entertainment me


~The only opinion that matters is your own.Everything else is just advice,~

  vort3x

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/05/06
Posts: 124

9/04/12 11:39:06 PM#15
Originally posted by Magnetia

Let's break it down.

I want to do Player versus Player

not Player vs gear grind

 

+1.

 

Seriously, I don't understand why people don't get the point of arena pvping. And actually to be honest, how a pvp where people are diferently geared is even called pvp...The reason why I love GW sPvP because everyone are gear-wise equal.

I've played probably more than 10 MMOs where you could go to Arena, but people were not equaly equiped. And you know what? That's bullshit, that's not even arena. And no, I will not go and play Counterstrike, or Quake or whatever instead of GW2 sPvP, because that's just different. And I like MMO PvP, I can't see a reason why MMOs wouldn't have an sPvP that is not based on equipment, but rather skill. Is it really cool when you've played an MMO for 2 months, you go into arena and there you meet some dork, that has been playing that game for 3 years every day, and he just owns you because he's better geared than you, but you can see he actually has no fucking skill at all?

How would counter-strike look like if players that played 16 hours per day were runing arround with pimped up M4a1s, that did 3 times the normal damage?

I don't understand how so many of MMO community seems to be doing stuff just to achieve something, rather than to simply have FUN. Sometimes I get the feeling you're all like "No, this is acutaly not fun, but I'm doing it, because i want that armor!"

I spent arround 4000 hours playing Guild Wars 1 pvp. Just because it's fun for me trashing people. That it! Nothing to achieve! Out of sheer fun!

On the other hand

  teakbois

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/06/06
Posts: 2190

9/04/12 11:40:01 PM#16
Originally posted by Jackdog
just a wild ass guess mind you but I think it might be entertainment

LOL

  Hrimnir

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/24/10
Posts: 1090

 
OP  9/04/12 11:47:44 PM#17
Originally posted by dinos_21
i remember but in the days of MUD ( some oldtimers around here know what i am talking about) , or even L2 , we used to PVP for fun/honor/make  a name on the server/family war ...never pvped to get better eq , i went raiding so i can get better eq and be better at pvp, that yes , now days eq makes the pvpers, not skills, thats why i still pvp, even at WvW, cause when i kill someone that has better pvp eq, with my skills , that my friends is the ultimate satisfaction

IF you played MUDs then you know they are responsible for bringing EQ to life, and are pretty much the core of all the design decisions that people hate so much now in MMO's.  All the gear grinds, etc.  At least as far as PVP was concerned.

Hell, even if you look at UO, they had gear advantages.  But, what they did is make it relatively easy to get the gear with the gear advantages.  This solved the problem because if you didnt have the best gear you were just being lazy cus you could get it in a few hours of works.  This still allowed for the sense of character progression.

 

As to the person who brought up RP'ing.  NO, RPG's on PC's and Consoles were not about RP'ing.  Tabletop games like D&D were about RP'ing, but character progression was just as, if not, a more important part of the system.  Hell, games like Diablo and other Action RPG's MAIN PURPOSE is gear grind.  Thats why D3 is failing so hard because they screwed up the gear grind in that game, HORRIBLY, and thats what people who play diablo want, to get badaass gear and wtf pwn their enemies.

Now, ONCE AGAIN.  I GET that you guys don't want a gear advantage in the game. But, my point is WHY put THAT system into an MMORPG.  When the purpose behind an MMORPG has been twofold, 1. Having a living breathing world that you can explore, that continues on "doing stuff" even when you log off, and 2. Character progression / Increase in power through gear and gaining XP for levels and/or skills".

It just seems to me like you're trying to make a minivan into a race car.  Can it be done?  Yes.  But it will never be as good as the real thing.  And IMO, the real thing people like you want can be found in games like SMITE and such.

"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

- Friedrich Nietzsche

  Mardukk

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/05/11
Posts: 1386

9/04/12 11:50:44 PM#18

I play MMO's for character developement/building a character.  Many talk about hating building a character, but they still choose to play MMO's, with MMO's being almost the only games through time that have character development.  It's funny that people act like building a character is 90% of the games released when it's really closer to 5%.

 

Edit:  And all those console games I grew up on were played for "fun" only, sure didn't last long.  Do you all want to swap games every month???

  Hrimnir

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/24/10
Posts: 1090

 
OP  9/04/12 11:53:54 PM#19
Originally posted by vort3x
Originally posted by Magnetia

*clipped* 

I don't understand how so many of MMO community seems to be doing stuff just to achieve something, rather than to simply have FUN. Sometimes I get the feeling you're all like "No, this is acutaly not fun, but I'm doing it, because i want that armor!"

Ok, im going to explain this simply for you.  ITS FUN!  *gasp* wait a minute, grinding for gear is fun? how is this possible?  this is madness, this is blasphemy?!!?!

Do you think the guy that spend 200 hours carefully putting together a ship in a bottle is enjoying the hand cramps, and the constant starting over because you make a tiny mistake and screw the whole thing up?  No. Of course its not FUN, but it gives a sense of satisfaction, and that is fun.  Same thing for the guy who spends 50 hours putting a 4000 piece puzzle together.

Just like making love to a woman you are in love with and care for is going to be far more enjoyable than just banging some drunk chick you took home from the bar.

The difference comes from being invested into something, it creates a different type of enjoyment.

I swear the modern generation doesn't get this.  They're so used to having everything at their fingertips that they've never learned the sense of enjoyment and satisfaction that comes from pursuing and completing a long term project.

"The surest way to corrupt a youth is to instruct him to hold in higher esteem those who think alike than those who think differently."

- Friedrich Nietzsche

  Talketzanto

Elite Member

Joined: 11/14/11
Posts: 182

9/04/12 11:55:24 PM#20

I understand what the OP is saying....its hard for alot of people to get use to having no grind including me......also it might have to do with (I died...next week ill die....next week ill die) rather then the traditional thinking of (next week ill get that new bow and rock him...ect).......

 

But once you get use to messing around with specs / sigils its awsome....so many combinations that you really need to think about what you want out of your toon and work hard to figure out how your gonna get it....

 

but I do understand ya....its a new way of thinking and just takes time to get use to

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