That would make a good topic:

How long have you been expecting a guarantee of entertainment duration from new games?  How's that working out so far?

1-3 months I guess

I'll be happy if GW2 keeps me 2 months of playing, then 3-6 months break before expansion. Much better for me, than like raiding in Wow every week, one raid  for next 6 months just for 1 piece of equipment because of RNG...

When WvWvW become boring which unfortunately if they don't put tweak it then it likely will after the first 3-4 months.

Outside of it being fun, why take stuff in WvWvW? I mean, ask yourself that. Maybe the buffs after months will be beneficial, but as Gamebreaker I believe said you just take it and move on. No reason to defend, no reason to stick around. Sounds like WAR to be honest.

Let's just say I'm expecting to see like 6-8 servers of lucky worth a damn in WvWvW. This all comes down to players though, likely everyone will want the easy route and roll on same server, because that's so much fun. . . . . 

I already said it in another post, you get what you pay for. 

Lets say we have 2 games, the X game and the Y game... the X game has a subscription fee thus the budget is higher than the Y's that doesn't have one.

How could you expect a company/game with a dramatically less budget to create/develop/update better and faster ?

Originally posted by gmaister22

I already said it in another post, you get what you pay for. 

 

Lets say we have 2 games, the X game and the Y game... the X game has a subscription fee thus the budget is higher than the Y's that doesn't have one.

How could you expect a company/game with a dramatically less budget to create/develop/update better and faster ?

GW2 production quality is already higher than most P2P MMOs and it's rather obvious. The problem with P2P is that they focus on systems that will keep the players resubing, mostly worthless grinding, while in B2P GW2 has shown that there is another way to keep people interested.

You can't be talking about quality when you have played at the max, 5 days of the game. I'm not gonna judge GW2 since it hasn't been released yet, I'm just saying how things are... You wont be getting like 5 new instances and new ingame content, no new end game item and things like that ,every 2-3 months like in pay to play games... thats my guess :)

I'm not saying that P2P games are 100% a success, and F2P are a fail. 

Originally posted by seridan

Originally posted by gmaister22

I already said it in another post, you get what you pay for. 

 

Lets say we have 2 games, the X game and the Y game... the X game has a subscription fee thus the budget is higher than the Y's that doesn't have one.

How could you expect a company/game with a dramatically less budget to create/develop/update better and faster ?

GW2 production quality is already higher than most P2P MMOs and it's rather obvious. The problem with P2P is that they focus on systems that will keep the players resubing, mostly worthless grinding, while in B2P GW2 has shown that there is another way to keep people interested.

same can be said for F2P Games, just build up the cash shop and make their players spend countless amounts of cash to unlock area's of the game ( by rights you should have access too ) because you purchased that game,yet ALOT of F2P games have worthless grinding, I rather spend 15 bucks a month then spend 20-30  month on crap in a cash shop.

Also, speaking about GW2 production quility is higher then most P2P games is not true at all, I found in the beta of GW2 that alot of the textures were soso, even though I still very much enjoyed the game, just making comments like that tells me you haven't played alot of mmos in the past.

Originally posted by Aeolron

same can be said for F2P Games, just build up the cash shop and make their players spend countless amounts of cash to unlock area's of the game ( by rights you should have access too ) because you purchased that game,yet ALOT of F2P games have worthless grinding, I rather spend 15 bucks a month then spend 20-30  month on crap in a cash shop.

Also, speaking about GW2 production quility is higher then most P2P games is not true at all, I found in the beta of GW2 that alot of the textures were soso, even though I still very much enjoyed the game, just making comments like that tells me you haven't played alot of mmos in the past.

There is a difference between F2P and B2P. I don't know what other B2P games do but in GW2 there is no reason to spend cash on the Cash Shop if you don't want to. No areas to unlock and no worthless grinding. It's true that some F2P are horrible and I agree with that, but they are not B2P and not GW2. There is no comparison.

As for production quality this video has some nice info about it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fu_clrndx_c&feature=youtu.be

Some textures were soso in GW2 (while it was in beta and CPU-bound) and you didn't find soso textures in other MMOs? I'm literally shocked at this. And to the fact that people believe production quality = texture quality.

Originally posted by gmaister22

You can't be talking about quality when you have played at the max, 5 days of the game. I'm not gonna judge GW2 since it hasn't been released yet, I'm just saying how things are... You wont be getting like 5 new instances and new ingame content, no new end game item and things like that ,every 2-3 months like in pay to play games... thats my guess :)

 

I'm not saying that P2P games are 100% a success, and F2P are a fail. 

I agree with you on that, another thing is this, F2P still have to maintain their servers, which means they have to get their money somehow, selling a X ammount of games is fine and dandy but what happens later when those funds dry up? how are they going to pay upkeep on their servers? Simple, sell stuff in the cash shop for a hell of alot of money, even maybe going so far as to locking certain area's of the game till that players pays to get access to those locked areas.

P2P is still cheaper to go, 15 a month is nothing, might be high to some people who can't afford 15 a month, but in the long run a sub based game is always cheaper to play, at least in a sub game you know where your money is going, F2P your not spending money on a sub, your spending it in a shop to upgrade your toon or advance through to the next area.

Originally posted by Aeolron

same can be said for F2P Games, just build up the cash shop and make their players spend countless amounts of cash to unlock area's of the game ( by rights you should have access too ) because you purchased that game,yet ALOT of F2P games have worthless grinding, I rather spend 15 bucks a month then spend 20-30  month on crap in a cash shop.

Also, speaking about GW2 production quility is higher then most P2P games is not true at all, I found in the beta of GW2 that alot of the textures were soso, even though I still very much enjoyed the game, just making comments like that tells me you haven't played alot of mmos in the past.

You're joking right?

Graphics /= a good game, and are not the only factor towards production quality. Hell, WoW has one of the best production values we've seen in the genre, period, yet some of the worst textures. While GW2's graphics don't hold up to games like FFXIV, it's mechanics, polish, content, scale, art direction, and smoothness of it's systems are top notch. I don't know a single industry professional that would dispute this.

Originally posted by seridan

Originally posted by Aeolron

same can be said for F2P Games, just build up the cash shop and make their players spend countless amounts of cash to unlock area's of the game ( by rights you should have access too ) because you purchased that game,yet ALOT of F2P games have worthless grinding, I rather spend 15 bucks a month then spend 20-30  month on crap in a cash shop.

Also, speaking about GW2 production quility is higher then most P2P games is not true at all, I found in the beta of GW2 that alot of the textures were soso, even though I still very much enjoyed the game, just making comments like that tells me you haven't played alot of mmos in the past.

There is a difference between F2P and B2P. I don't know what other B2P games do but in GW2 there is no reason to spend cash on the Cash Shop if you don't want to. No areas to unlock and no worthless grinding. It's true that some F2P are horrible and I agree with that, but they are not B2P and not GW2. There is no comparison.

As for production quality this video has some nice info about it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fu_clrndx_c&feature=youtu.be

Some textures were soso in GW2 (while it was in beta and CPU-bound) and you didn't find soso textures in other MMOs? I'm literally shocked at this. And to the fact that people believe production quality = texture quality.

well when I played the beta of GW2 got afew of these chest and I needed a key to unlock them, how do you get that key? They FORCE you into the store to buy it. I'm ok with that myself time to time but it's that idea that scares me abit, still they have to maintain their servers , nothings free in this world :P

Originally posted by aesperus

Originally posted by Aeolron

same can be said for F2P Games, just build up the cash shop and make their players spend countless amounts of cash to unlock area's of the game ( by rights you should have access too ) because you purchased that game,yet ALOT of F2P games have worthless grinding, I rather spend 15 bucks a month then spend 20-30  month on crap in a cash shop.

Also, speaking about GW2 production quility is higher then most P2P games is not true at all, I found in the beta of GW2 that alot of the textures were soso, even though I still very much enjoyed the game, just making comments like that tells me you haven't played alot of mmos in the past.

You're joking right?

Graphics /= a good game, and are not the only factor towards production quality. Hell, WoW has one of the best production values we've seen in the genre, period, yet some of the worst textures. While GW2's graphics don't hold up to games like FFXIV, it's mechanics, polish, content, scale, art direction, and smoothness of it's systems are top notch. I don't know a single industry professional that would dispute this.

No I am not joking,

that wasn't my meaning at all, I was commenting on quality, and having been playing games for over 25 years yes I know what makes a good game and mechanic wise, shit looks at LOTRO amazing graphics hated the game play, found it to slow.

But all you got out of my statement was, textures? Really? LOL come on now.

Originally posted by Aeolron

Originally posted by seridan

Originally posted by Aeolron

same can be said for F2P Games, just build up the cash shop and make their players spend countless amounts of cash to unlock area's of the game ( by rights you should have access too ) because you purchased that game,yet ALOT of F2P games have worthless grinding, I rather spend 15 bucks a month then spend 20-30  month on crap in a cash shop.

Also, speaking about GW2 production quility is higher then most P2P games is not true at all, I found in the beta of GW2 that alot of the textures were soso, even though I still very much enjoyed the game, just making comments like that tells me you haven't played alot of mmos in the past.

There is a difference between F2P and B2P. I don't know what other B2P games do but in GW2 there is no reason to spend cash on the Cash Shop if you don't want to. No areas to unlock and no worthless grinding. It's true that some F2P are horrible and I agree with that, but they are not B2P and not GW2. There is no comparison.

As for production quality this video has some nice info about it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fu_clrndx_c&feature=youtu.be

Some textures were soso in GW2 (while it was in beta and CPU-bound) and you didn't find soso textures in other MMOs? I'm literally shocked at this. And to the fact that people believe production quality = texture quality.

well when I played the beta of GW2 got afew of these chest and I needed a key to unlock them, how do you get that key? They FORCE you into the store to buy it. I'm ok with that myself time to time but it's that idea that scares me abit, still they have to maintain their servers , nothings free in this world :P

I made this post on another thread and is relevant here as well:
Someone with an army of minis, lots of town clothing, different tonics or a load of dyes will probably win against you in WvWvW for sure. /sarcasm

That's what you get from the chests. Also you get keys by finishing Personal Story quests or you can buy them with in-game gold. Nobody is FORCING you to go to the Cash Shop

Originally posted by seridan

Originally posted by Aeolron

Originally posted by seridan

Originally posted by Aeolron

same can be said for F2P Games, just build up the cash shop and make their players spend countless amounts of cash to unlock area's of the game ( by rights you should have access too ) because you purchased that game,yet ALOT of F2P games have worthless grinding, I rather spend 15 bucks a month then spend 20-30  month on crap in a cash shop.

Also, speaking about GW2 production quility is higher then most P2P games is not true at all, I found in the beta of GW2 that alot of the textures were soso, even though I still very much enjoyed the game, just making comments like that tells me you haven't played alot of mmos in the past.

There is a difference between F2P and B2P. I don't know what other B2P games do but in GW2 there is no reason to spend cash on the Cash Shop if you don't want to. No areas to unlock and no worthless grinding. It's true that some F2P are horrible and I agree with that, but they are not B2P and not GW2. There is no comparison.

As for production quality this video has some nice info about it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fu_clrndx_c&feature=youtu.be

Some textures were soso in GW2 (while it was in beta and CPU-bound) and you didn't find soso textures in other MMOs? I'm literally shocked at this. And to the fact that people believe production quality = texture quality.

well when I played the beta of GW2 got afew of these chest and I needed a key to unlock them, how do you get that key? They FORCE you into the store to buy it. I'm ok with that myself time to time but it's that idea that scares me abit, still they have to maintain their servers , nothings free in this world :P

I made this post on another thread and is relevant here as well:
Someone with an army of minis, lots of town clothing, different tonics or a load of dyes will probably win against you in WvWvW for sure. /sarcasm

That's what you get from the chests. Also you get keys by finishing Personal Story quests or you can buy them with in-game gold. Nobody is FORCING you to go to the Cash Shop

Well for a NEW player that doesn't know those things yes, that is forcing said player to the shop to purchase those items.The main idea of this game is to generate money for arena net, even after initial sales of the game, so in order to maintain servers and make some sort of profit they have to find some way to gain revenue from this game, IE cash shop.

I know it's hard to accept that your game is like this or going to be like this, hell been a number of articles online stating that this game could cost you more then a standard sub based game.

and whats with the /sarcasm? you really think thats funny? I think it just proves many points on these forums about GW2 players and in general how much they truly know about these shops.

 How long will it keep you interested?

Just 1 Dollar.

Originally posted by Aeolron

I know it's hard to accept that your game is like this or going to be like this, hell been a number of articles online stating that this game could cost you more then a standard sub based game.

and whats with the /sarcasm? you really think thats funny? I think it just proves many points on these forums about GW2 players and in general how much they truly know about these shops.

Of course. F2P/B2P generally "cost" more than P2P games, that's a proven fact by so many different articles. However they cost more for people who will actually buy staff, people who either can't or don't want to buy can compete on all levels without buying anything, it's not P2W, and that's the whole difference.

Yes I think it is funny how people make a great deal out of the Cash Shop while it only offers vanity items.

Originally posted by seridan

Originally posted by Aeolron

I know it's hard to accept that your game is like this or going to be like this, hell been a number of articles online stating that this game could cost you more then a standard sub based game.

and whats with the /sarcasm? you really think thats funny? I think it just proves many points on these forums about GW2 players and in general how much they truly know about these shops.

Of course. F2P/B2P generally "cost" more than P2P games, that's a proven fact by so many different articles. However they cost more for people who will actually buy staff, people who either can't or don't want to buy can compete on all levels without buying anything, it's not P2W, and that's the whole difference.

Yes I think it is funny how people make a great deal out of the Cash Shop while it only offers vanity items.

So you know for a fact that when launch comes, or even after launch that those items will be vanity? I hope your right Seridan I really hope so! Having played the game itself, I find it fun and exciting! But just afew things on the shop itself makes me wonder about afew things, don't mind spending afew bucks here and there, the things that concern me is this, if they don't end up selling alot of items in the shops how the hell are they going to fund more expacs? or even release more content? this is where I believe P2P shines through, prime example, Rift, F2P till what lvl 23? then you pay 15 a month and your getting aton of content updates on a regular basis.

APB was a F2P/B2P Game that was insanely fun, however the company bottom out , because they didn't make enough money, this is how companies work, they need alot of money to pay for their projects and the people that work for them, without that, well, you know :P

Originally posted by Aeolron

So you know for a fact that when launch comes, or even after launch that those items will be vanity? I hope your right Seridan I really hope so! Having played the game itself, I find it fun and exciting! But just afew things on the shop itself makes me wonder about afew things, don't mind spending afew bucks here and there, the things that concern me is this, if they don't end up selling alot of items in the shops how the hell are they going to fund more expacs? or even release more content? this is where I believe P2P shines through, prime example, Rift, F2P till what lvl 23? then you pay 15 a month and your getting aton of content updates on a regular basis.

APB was a F2P/B2P Game that was insanely fun, however the company bottom out , because they didn't make enough money, this is how companies work, they need alot of money to pay for their projects and the people that work for them, without that, well, you know :P

Your concern is obviously valid and I have the same hope as well. We still have some time until release and if they add "equipment" or P2W items on the Cash Shop I'll be the first to stop playing and demand a refund (if that's even possible at that moment)

Edit: Don't underestimate the power of vanity items. GW1 is a prime example of a game that's been active for more than 5 years without a new expansion = new revenue, it is still funded by a vanity item cash shop. Aion F2P seems to be similar now that's it is totally free. Also there are programs (or websites) who survive on donations, I think the Cash Shop works more like that. Now the game will attract lots of players and I don't know what will happen, more players isn't always good without a sub. We'll see how it goes

Originally posted by seridan

Originally posted by Aeolron

So you know for a fact that when launch comes, or even after launch that those items will be vanity? I hope your right Seridan I really hope so! Having played the game itself, I find it fun and exciting! But just afew things on the shop itself makes me wonder about afew things, don't mind spending afew bucks here and there, the things that concern me is this, if they don't end up selling alot of items in the shops how the hell are they going to fund more expacs? or even release more content? this is where I believe P2P shines through, prime example, Rift, F2P till what lvl 23? then you pay 15 a month and your getting aton of content updates on a regular basis.

APB was a F2P/B2P Game that was insanely fun, however the company bottom out , because they didn't make enough money, this is how companies work, they need alot of money to pay for their projects and the people that work for them, without that, well, you know :P

Your concern is obviously valid and I have the same hope as well. We still have some time until release and if they add "equipment" or P2W items on the Cash Shop I'll be the first to stop playing and demand a refund (if that's even possible at that moment)

I 100% agree with you Seridan, I too hope thats not the case, because I love this game, so much better than the first one :P

like I said if I have to pay ya know 10 - 20 bucks a month I'm ok with that, and I'm sure even yourself, you would be good with that as well.