Originally posted by neobahamut20

Next BWE ill be testing the ele healing and a guardian to see if healing aids the team. However, seeing the "I keep getting 1shot" threads in the last BWE, I doubt that the limited heals will have any effect.

I think that had more to do with people needing to play this game in a manner that they were not accustomed to. Most folks aren't used to getting taken out by a level 2 mob in the starter area if they don't dodge. Warriors don't think twice when charging into a hail of arrows in some games. People thinking that their class is "only" melee and treating it as such sometimes had trouble as well.

I applaud you for thinking about the team and how members of that team need to work together, that's how the game was designed.

Originally posted by GenreNinja

I played as a guardian last beta and my best advice is don't expect to build a "condition removal" guardian, and only play a condition removal guardian. Chances are you'll have several rolls you can fill and adaptng to the situation is the best idea.

When I was in mass PvP during sieges, condition removal was great for bursting in and getting back out. Because one ability the guardians have while equipping a staff, pulls all the debuffs your allies have to you, then gives you powerful buffs based on what you pull off of your allies. So running into the center of a mass battle and activating this ablities, cleanses your allies and turns you into a juggernaut for a few seconds. But it was viable consistantly, so I also had a mace and sheild as my secondary weapon set and would spam aoe shield buffs into the fray, and knockback enmies when I could.

When I was roaming with a group of 3 or 4, My role was mostly CC, slowing the enemies as they tried to flee, knocking back persuers as we tried to flee, or buffing allies with shields during fights and trying to keep the enemy still with snares. 

If you expect to do condition removal, and only condition removal it's not really viable 24/7 in PvP or PvE. But if it's what you enjoy, be prepared to fill the roll when the opportunity arises but not being willing to fill other roles when they are needed will gimp you and your allies.

Thank you for your advice my aim was to go for a high survivability build that could in theory outlast your opponent while applying boons to you and your allies but like you said this game is all about versatility and experimenting around and i cannot wait to finally play it :)

Originally posted by Charlizzard

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Next BWE ill be testing the ele healing and a guardian to see if healing aids the team. However, seeing the "I keep getting 1shot" threads in the last BWE, I doubt that the limited heals will have any effect.

I think that had more to do with people needing to play this game in a manner that they were not accustomed to. Most folks aren't used to getting taken out by a level 2 mob in the starter area if they don't dodge. Warriors don't think twice when charging into a hail of arrows in some games. People thinking that their class is "only" melee and treating it as such sometimes had trouble as well.

I applaud you for thinking about the team and how members of that team need to work together, that's how the game was designed.

 

true, one reason i want to play this game so badly is that it is designed in a way where you want to support and aid your fellow players instead that just out-dps them and i find it a very refreshing and constructive approach

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

To be honest with you, I rarely got conditions that lasted more than 3 seconds.  As a buffer/debuffer build, I felt like the most useless piece of crap on the playing field. I suppose the same would be also true for a condition removal build. The only good builds in that game are dps and more dps. Ranged dps is even better because of the higher survival rate.

     I wouldn't listen to advice like this. Not that your advise, mr Neobahamut20, is any worse than anyone elses but its pretty clear you have some bias there against some pretty viable builds.

     For one the game is not tuned to its final state. Even so though conditions are pretty nasty if you know what your doing. I know this because I know other people that have owned the battlefield with a buffer/debuffer build. I think it would have been more truthful if you had said 'The only good builds FOR ME in that game..." and then continued to state them.

     I know its not true for the whole game because I've seen otherwise already in the very first beta event. Ranged Dps, by the way, sucks.

     You backpeddle slower than you run forward by about half. In PvP once people figure out that you just have to run directly at ranged classes rather then flail around wildly it becomes very easy to trap and destroy ranged. Ranged classes that know what they are doing can snare and keep distance. Then again melee characters that know what they're doing can dodge snars and use their own ranged cripples and snares to close distance. Its really dependent on skill here.

     In PvE you only have a high survival rate as a ranged DPS if you have melee to keep everything away from you. If you are on your own you need some fancy footwork. Also take into account that all ranged attacks do about a 1/3 of melee attack damage.

     In the end I'd try out what best suits your playstyle. Guardians have plenty of builds but the one you mentioned sounds nice.

     There is a running joke that ranged DPS is for people who are too afraid to do anything useful. This generally comes from the idea that ranged DPS just likes to sit behind all of the melee characters who are "actually contributing" and fire arrows to feel like they are part of the battle too. Ranged DPS generally is safer in that you can keep away from heavy hitters better. Then again you are also barely contributing to your group and its pretty hard to stay at ranged versus a lot of mobs by yourself.

     My auto attack did more damage then a rangers skill. This is for balance reasons. I'm taking more risk being in the thick of things. The ranger is just standing in safety zone firing off mosquito damage.

     Not to say rangers aren't completely viable (they are) but just be aware of these things. Distance is hard to keep in some situations unless you are good with your skills, you don't contribute as much in group situations as other classes (then again other people rarely have to worry about a good ranger dying).

     Also be aware that ranged ONLY is not viable at all. Not only does it not do enough damage but in PvP it is starting to lack as more people become comfortable with dealing with rangers. Again, that mainly has to do with not flailing around but charging rangers and dodging snares. You catch up to them in no time. So even as a ranged character you will need some melee unless your really good at keeping distance for long periods of time to finally kill stuff.

Classes I tried (each were lvl 8 at least) : Engy, theif, warrior (highst was lvl 15 - only one I pvp with), necro, ele.

My post was obviously if the game stays as is and far more PvE oriented as it was mentioned by OP that he was unsure about PvE.. In PvP warrior the buffer (especially with the speed buff and retarded stun lock) was viable. But not as good as 2h sword + bulls charge (lol).

No one should back peddle, you should be able to backwards run and strafe, like in all other games. I had no real problems doing it, especially with knockback skills.

PVE wise:

There are many, many bugs, here are few of the important ones I reported (I dont report useless ones, because companies tend to focus on the useless ones first for some reason)

As ele (fire) or engi, the running in a strafing circle worked just fine in PvE. Yes I reported as a bug. Another invicibility bug I found was that if you are underwater, and move above melee mobs while weilding a spear, you cannot be hit and you just wait there until the kill is complete.

As a warrior though, you shouldnt be getting 2shot or 1shot... you are most useless to a team dead. I seriously took less damage on a necro than a warrior. However, the warrior did kill much faster, I just dont feel like much of a warrior in heavy armor when I get 2shot.

Also, a necro with +5 vitality had more HP than a guardian with +25 vitality. So either theres a bug with how vitality is counted or guardians should just not even have the vitality attribute. (next BWE im testing ele + guardian for healing and I will build the guardian with toughness, to see how it goes.)

Overflow servers broke up parties. This should be the top priority fix, although a work around was to go in town and spam click a tele point until it let you in the main server.

Originally posted by orator1970

Originally posted by Charlizzard

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Next BWE ill be testing the ele healing and a guardian to see if healing aids the team. However, seeing the "I keep getting 1shot" threads in the last BWE, I doubt that the limited heals will have any effect.

I think that had more to do with people needing to play this game in a manner that they were not accustomed to. Most folks aren't used to getting taken out by a level 2 mob in the starter area if they don't dodge. Warriors don't think twice when charging into a hail of arrows in some games. People thinking that their class is "only" melee and treating it as such sometimes had trouble as well.

I applaud you for thinking about the team and how members of that team need to work together, that's how the game was designed.

 

true, one reason i want to play this game so badly is that it is designed in a way where you want to support and aid your fellow players instead that just out-dps them and i find it a very refreshing and constructive approach

Well, as a warrior, it was quite discouraging. At least I could rez, but past lvl 8 rezzing doesnt cut it. I play with my gf, so we strategize a lot too, this game isnt really prone to encourage that, during battle, its more planning than strategy. Sometimes we call pushbacks or shields, but thats about  all we can do. So hopefully they add someting to make it more engaging with your teammates during battle rather than taking turns to kite.

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by orator1970

Originally posted by Charlizzard

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Next BWE ill be testing the ele healing and a guardian to see if healing aids the team. However, seeing the "I keep getting 1shot" threads in the last BWE, I doubt that the limited heals will have any effect.

I think that had more to do with people needing to play this game in a manner that they were not accustomed to. Most folks aren't used to getting taken out by a level 2 mob in the starter area if they don't dodge. Warriors don't think twice when charging into a hail of arrows in some games. People thinking that their class is "only" melee and treating it as such sometimes had trouble as well.

I applaud you for thinking about the team and how members of that team need to work together, that's how the game was designed.

 

true, one reason i want to play this game so badly is that it is designed in a way where you want to support and aid your fellow players instead that just out-dps them and i find it a very refreshing and constructive approach

Well, as a warrior, it was quite discouraging. At least I could rez, but past lvl 8 rezzing doesnt cut it. I play with my gf, so we strategize a lot too, this game isnt really prone to encourage that, during battle, its more planning than strategy. Sometimes we call pushbacks or shields, but thats about  all we can do. So hopefully they add someting to make it more engaging with your teammates during battle rather than taking turns to kite.

I prefer taking turns kiting and being pressured to standing around thinking about maximizing my dps/threat. Just sick of tank and spank strategies vs nobody is safe. As a warrior did you try to tank or be a part of a team?

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

To be honest with you, I rarely got conditions that lasted more than 3 seconds.  As a buffer/debuffer build, I felt like the most useless piece of crap on the playing field. I suppose the same would be also true for a condition removal build. The only good builds in that game are dps and more dps. Ranged dps is even better because of the higher survival rate.

     I wouldn't listen to advice like this. Not that your advise, mr Neobahamut20, is any worse than anyone elses but its pretty clear you have some bias there against some pretty viable builds.

     For one the game is not tuned to its final state. Even so though conditions are pretty nasty if you know what your doing. I know this because I know other people that have owned the battlefield with a buffer/debuffer build. I think it would have been more truthful if you had said 'The only good builds FOR ME in that game..." and then continued to state them.

     I know its not true for the whole game because I've seen otherwise already in the very first beta event. Ranged Dps, by the way, sucks.

     You backpeddle slower than you run forward by about half. In PvP once people figure out that you just have to run directly at ranged classes rather then flail around wildly it becomes very easy to trap and destroy ranged. Ranged classes that know what they are doing can snare and keep distance. Then again melee characters that know what they're doing can dodge snars and use their own ranged cripples and snares to close distance. Its really dependent on skill here.

     In PvE you only have a high survival rate as a ranged DPS if you have melee to keep everything away from you. If you are on your own you need some fancy footwork. Also take into account that all ranged attacks do about a 1/3 of melee attack damage.

     In the end I'd try out what best suits your playstyle. Guardians have plenty of builds but the one you mentioned sounds nice.

     There is a running joke that ranged DPS is for people who are too afraid to do anything useful. This generally comes from the idea that ranged DPS just likes to sit behind all of the melee characters who are "actually contributing" and fire arrows to feel like they are part of the battle too. Ranged DPS generally is safer in that you can keep away from heavy hitters better. Then again you are also barely contributing to your group and its pretty hard to stay at ranged versus a lot of mobs by yourself.

     My auto attack did more damage then a rangers skill. This is for balance reasons. I'm taking more risk being in the thick of things. The ranger is just standing in safety zone firing off mosquito damage.

     Not to say rangers aren't completely viable (they are) but just be aware of these things. Distance is hard to keep in some situations unless you are good with your skills, you don't contribute as much in group situations as other classes (then again other people rarely have to worry about a good ranger dying).

     Also be aware that ranged ONLY is not viable at all. Not only does it not do enough damage but in PvP it is starting to lack as more people become comfortable with dealing with rangers. Again, that mainly has to do with not flailing around but charging rangers and dodging snares. You catch up to them in no time. So even as a ranged character you will need some melee unless your really good at keeping distance for long periods of time to finally kill stuff.

Classes I tried (each were lvl 8 at least) : Engy, theif, warrior (highst was lvl 15 - only one I pvp with), necro, ele.

My post was obviously if the game stays as is and far more PvE oriented as it was mentioned by OP that he was unsure about PvE.. In PvP warrior the buffer (especially with the speed buff and retarded stun lock) was viable. But not as good as 2h sword + bulls charge (lol).

No one should back peddle, you should be able to backwards run and strafe, like in all other games. I had no real problems doing it, especially with knockback skills.

 

 

PVE wise:

There are many, many bugs, here are few of the important ones I reported (I dont report useless ones, because companies tend to focus on the useless ones first for some reason)

As ele (fire) or engi, the running in a strafing circle worked just fine in PvE. Yes I reported as a bug. Another invicibility bug I found was that if you are underwater, and move above melee mobs while weilding a spear, you cannot be hit and you just wait there until the kill is complete.

As a warrior though, you shouldnt be getting 2shot or 1shot... you are most useless to a team dead. I seriously took less damage on a necro than a warrior. However, the warrior did kill much faster, I just dont feel like much of a warrior in heavy armor when I get 2shot.

Also, a necro with +5 vitality had more HP than a guardian with +25 vitality. So either theres a bug with how vitality is counted or guardians should just not even have the vitality attribute. (next BWE im testing ele + guardian for healing and I will build the guardian with toughness, to see how it goes.)

Overflow servers broke up parties. This should be the top priority fix, although a work around was to go in town and spam click a tele point until it let you in the main server.

     I fought rangers who tried to use knockbacks as well, dodge them. They all have windups. Needless to say I found no problem closing distance at all. I don't know where your skill level is in comparison to the average though. Necromancers are not squishy classes in this game btw. They have a ton of health.

     In general its wise to throw out any judgements you may have about a class. Necromancers are extremely vitality based.

Originally posted by orator1970

The reason that i actually wanted to play a condition removal build was that i thought this game was different than most and it was heavily reliant on a condition/boon style of gameplay but like i said i have not play the so i can be easily miss informed

youre absolutely right. however, you cant see the type of gameplay that centres around boons/conditions from a bunch of noobs in open beta. trust me, buffing/cleansing guardians will be epic. i played a staff guard in pvp, and mace/shield guard in pve, and made a huge difference for my team. spamming 33% damage reduction, blocking attacks and removing conditions is HUGE.

Originally posted by Magnetia

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by orator1970

Originally posted by Charlizzard

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Next BWE ill be testing the ele healing and a guardian to see if healing aids the team. However, seeing the "I keep getting 1shot" threads in the last BWE, I doubt that the limited heals will have any effect.

I think that had more to do with people needing to play this game in a manner that they were not accustomed to. Most folks aren't used to getting taken out by a level 2 mob in the starter area if they don't dodge. Warriors don't think twice when charging into a hail of arrows in some games. People thinking that their class is "only" melee and treating it as such sometimes had trouble as well.

I applaud you for thinking about the team and how members of that team need to work together, that's how the game was designed.

 

true, one reason i want to play this game so badly is that it is designed in a way where you want to support and aid your fellow players instead that just out-dps them and i find it a very refreshing and constructive approach

Well, as a warrior, it was quite discouraging. At least I could rez, but past lvl 8 rezzing doesnt cut it. I play with my gf, so we strategize a lot too, this game isnt really prone to encourage that, during battle, its more planning than strategy. Sometimes we call pushbacks or shields, but thats about  all we can do. So hopefully they add someting to make it more engaging with your teammates during battle rather than taking turns to kite.

I prefer taking turns kiting and being pressured to standing around thinking about maximizing my dps/threat. Just sick of tank and spank strategies vs nobody is safe. As a warrior did you try to tank or be a part of a team?

I tried both, but 2h DPS (rifle included) is the only one I felt useful in. Tank = Quick death, dagger necros tank better - but to be fair, I tried vitality gear for tanking, not toughness gear, which might be what is needed. I rarely am NOT in a team. Always 2. My gf and I. After a while, taking turns kiting... we wrote a ticket saying it had to be a bug as anything melee, simply sucked. When its just a grind to take down hp, its not enjoyable.

On some bosses, they do this AoE thing (their AoE works and isnt limited to 5 targets, unlike ours). So close-range is really for trashmobs.

There is still much testing to do. Perhaps there is a bug with armor ratings too, but I didnt do math for that, that I admit, but you can only do so much in 1 weekend. All I am saying is, the class named warrior is misleading. They should rename to samurai and give em cloth, that way, we expect a quick death at least. I honestly, did not notice any difference between armor and cloth.

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

To be honest with you, I rarely got conditions that lasted more than 3 seconds.  As a buffer/debuffer build, I felt like the most useless piece of crap on the playing field. I suppose the same would be also true for a condition removal build. The only good builds in that game are dps and more dps. Ranged dps is even better because of the higher survival rate.

     I wouldn't listen to advice like this. Not that your advise, mr Neobahamut20, is any worse than anyone elses but its pretty clear you have some bias there against some pretty viable builds.

     For one the game is not tuned to its final state. Even so though conditions are pretty nasty if you know what your doing. I know this because I know other people that have owned the battlefield with a buffer/debuffer build. I think it would have been more truthful if you had said 'The only good builds FOR ME in that game..." and then continued to state them.

     I know its not true for the whole game because I've seen otherwise already in the very first beta event. Ranged Dps, by the way, sucks.

     You backpeddle slower than you run forward by about half. In PvP once people figure out that you just have to run directly at ranged classes rather then flail around wildly it becomes very easy to trap and destroy ranged. Ranged classes that know what they are doing can snare and keep distance. Then again melee characters that know what they're doing can dodge snars and use their own ranged cripples and snares to close distance. Its really dependent on skill here.

     In PvE you only have a high survival rate as a ranged DPS if you have melee to keep everything away from you. If you are on your own you need some fancy footwork. Also take into account that all ranged attacks do about a 1/3 of melee attack damage.

     In the end I'd try out what best suits your playstyle. Guardians have plenty of builds but the one you mentioned sounds nice.

     There is a running joke that ranged DPS is for people who are too afraid to do anything useful. This generally comes from the idea that ranged DPS just likes to sit behind all of the melee characters who are "actually contributing" and fire arrows to feel like they are part of the battle too. Ranged DPS generally is safer in that you can keep away from heavy hitters better. Then again you are also barely contributing to your group and its pretty hard to stay at ranged versus a lot of mobs by yourself.

     My auto attack did more damage then a rangers skill. This is for balance reasons. I'm taking more risk being in the thick of things. The ranger is just standing in safety zone firing off mosquito damage.

     Not to say rangers aren't completely viable (they are) but just be aware of these things. Distance is hard to keep in some situations unless you are good with your skills, you don't contribute as much in group situations as other classes (then again other people rarely have to worry about a good ranger dying).

     Also be aware that ranged ONLY is not viable at all. Not only does it not do enough damage but in PvP it is starting to lack as more people become comfortable with dealing with rangers. Again, that mainly has to do with not flailing around but charging rangers and dodging snares. You catch up to them in no time. So even as a ranged character you will need some melee unless your really good at keeping distance for long periods of time to finally kill stuff.

Classes I tried (each were lvl 8 at least) : Engy, theif, warrior (highst was lvl 15 - only one I pvp with), necro, ele.

My post was obviously if the game stays as is and far more PvE oriented as it was mentioned by OP that he was unsure about PvE.. In PvP warrior the buffer (especially with the speed buff and retarded stun lock) was viable. But not as good as 2h sword + bulls charge (lol).

No one should back peddle, you should be able to backwards run and strafe, like in all other games. I had no real problems doing it, especially with knockback skills.

 

 

PVE wise:

There are many, many bugs, here are few of the important ones I reported (I dont report useless ones, because companies tend to focus on the useless ones first for some reason)

As ele (fire) or engi, the running in a strafing circle worked just fine in PvE. Yes I reported as a bug. Another invicibility bug I found was that if you are underwater, and move above melee mobs while weilding a spear, you cannot be hit and you just wait there until the kill is complete.

As a warrior though, you shouldnt be getting 2shot or 1shot... you are most useless to a team dead. I seriously took less damage on a necro than a warrior. However, the warrior did kill much faster, I just dont feel like much of a warrior in heavy armor when I get 2shot.

Also, a necro with +5 vitality had more HP than a guardian with +25 vitality. So either theres a bug with how vitality is counted or guardians should just not even have the vitality attribute. (next BWE im testing ele + guardian for healing and I will build the guardian with toughness, to see how it goes.)

Overflow servers broke up parties. This should be the top priority fix, although a work around was to go in town and spam click a tele point until it let you in the main server.

     I fought rangers who tried to use knockbacks as well, dodge them. They all have windups. Needless to say I found no problem closing distance at all. I don't know where your skill level is in comparison to the average though. Necromancers are not squishy classes in this game btw. They have a ton of health.

     In general its wise to throw out any judgements you may have about a class. Necromancers are extremely vitality based.

    

Well, I didnt play Ranger, its just the 1 class that doesnt appeal to me. The only reason I'll play it at release is the 30/50 HOM rewards involve rangers (too much).

But for engineers there is a knockback, a snare, and a slow. (on 2 sets of weapons). You can only dodge so much. But PvP aside, the strafe kiting works wonders, which dumbs down the game quite a lot.

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

To be honest with you, I rarely got conditions that lasted more than 3 seconds.  As a buffer/debuffer build, I felt like the most useless piece of crap on the playing field. I suppose the same would be also true for a condition removal build. The only good builds in that game are dps and more dps. Ranged dps is even better because of the higher survival rate.

     I wouldn't listen to advice like this. Not that your advise, mr Neobahamut20, is any worse than anyone elses but its pretty clear you have some bias there against some pretty viable builds.

     For one the game is not tuned to its final state. Even so though conditions are pretty nasty if you know what your doing. I know this because I know other people that have owned the battlefield with a buffer/debuffer build. I think it would have been more truthful if you had said 'The only good builds FOR ME in that game..." and then continued to state them.

     I know its not true for the whole game because I've seen otherwise already in the very first beta event. Ranged Dps, by the way, sucks.

     You backpeddle slower than you run forward by about half. In PvP once people figure out that you just have to run directly at ranged classes rather then flail around wildly it becomes very easy to trap and destroy ranged. Ranged classes that know what they are doing can snare and keep distance. Then again melee characters that know what they're doing can dodge snars and use their own ranged cripples and snares to close distance. Its really dependent on skill here.

     In PvE you only have a high survival rate as a ranged DPS if you have melee to keep everything away from you. If you are on your own you need some fancy footwork. Also take into account that all ranged attacks do about a 1/3 of melee attack damage.

     In the end I'd try out what best suits your playstyle. Guardians have plenty of builds but the one you mentioned sounds nice.

     There is a running joke that ranged DPS is for people who are too afraid to do anything useful. This generally comes from the idea that ranged DPS just likes to sit behind all of the melee characters who are "actually contributing" and fire arrows to feel like they are part of the battle too. Ranged DPS generally is safer in that you can keep away from heavy hitters better. Then again you are also barely contributing to your group and its pretty hard to stay at ranged versus a lot of mobs by yourself.

     My auto attack did more damage then a rangers skill. This is for balance reasons. I'm taking more risk being in the thick of things. The ranger is just standing in safety zone firing off mosquito damage.

     Not to say rangers aren't completely viable (they are) but just be aware of these things. Distance is hard to keep in some situations unless you are good with your skills, you don't contribute as much in group situations as other classes (then again other people rarely have to worry about a good ranger dying).

     Also be aware that ranged ONLY is not viable at all. Not only does it not do enough damage but in PvP it is starting to lack as more people become comfortable with dealing with rangers. Again, that mainly has to do with not flailing around but charging rangers and dodging snares. You catch up to them in no time. So even as a ranged character you will need some melee unless your really good at keeping distance for long periods of time to finally kill stuff.

Classes I tried (each were lvl 8 at least) : Engy, theif, warrior (highst was lvl 15 - only one I pvp with), necro, ele.

My post was obviously if the game stays as is and far more PvE oriented as it was mentioned by OP that he was unsure about PvE.. In PvP warrior the buffer (especially with the speed buff and retarded stun lock) was viable. But not as good as 2h sword + bulls charge (lol).

No one should back peddle, you should be able to backwards run and strafe, like in all other games. I had no real problems doing it, especially with knockback skills.

 

 

PVE wise:

There are many, many bugs, here are few of the important ones I reported (I dont report useless ones, because companies tend to focus on the useless ones first for some reason)

As ele (fire) or engi, the running in a strafing circle worked just fine in PvE. Yes I reported as a bug. Another invicibility bug I found was that if you are underwater, and move above melee mobs while weilding a spear, you cannot be hit and you just wait there until the kill is complete.

As a warrior though, you shouldnt be getting 2shot or 1shot... you are most useless to a team dead. I seriously took less damage on a necro than a warrior. However, the warrior did kill much faster, I just dont feel like much of a warrior in heavy armor when I get 2shot.

Also, a necro with +5 vitality had more HP than a guardian with +25 vitality. So either theres a bug with how vitality is counted or guardians should just not even have the vitality attribute. (next BWE im testing ele + guardian for healing and I will build the guardian with toughness, to see how it goes.)

Overflow servers broke up parties. This should be the top priority fix, although a work around was to go in town and spam click a tele point until it let you in the main server.

     I fought rangers who tried to use knockbacks as well, dodge them. They all have windups. Needless to say I found no problem closing distance at all. I don't know where your skill level is in comparison to the average though. Necromancers are not squishy classes in this game btw. They have a ton of health.

     In general its wise to throw out any judgements you may have about a class. Necromancers are extremely vitality based.

    

Well, I didnt play Ranger, its just the 1 class that doesnt appeal to me. The only reason I'll play it at release is the 30/50 HOM rewards involve rangers (too much).

But for engineers there is a knockback, a snare, and a slow. (on 2 sets of weapons). You can only dodge so much. But PvP aside, the strafe kiting works wonders, which dumbs down the game quite a lot.

     Just saw a post from Anet on the beta forums and ranged is still being worked on. The next BWE will feature a perma slow on ranged weapon sets. They are also going to experiment with ranged DPS attracting the attention of monsters faster.

     We'll see what they do.

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

To be honest with you, I rarely got conditions that lasted more than 3 seconds.  As a buffer/debuffer build, I felt like the most useless piece of crap on the playing field. I suppose the same would be also true for a condition removal build. The only good builds in that game are dps and more dps. Ranged dps is even better because of the higher survival rate.

     I wouldn't listen to advice like this. Not that your advise, mr Neobahamut20, is any worse than anyone elses but its pretty clear you have some bias there against some pretty viable builds.

     For one the game is not tuned to its final state. Even so though conditions are pretty nasty if you know what your doing. I know this because I know other people that have owned the battlefield with a buffer/debuffer build. I think it would have been more truthful if you had said 'The only good builds FOR ME in that game..." and then continued to state them.

     I know its not true for the whole game because I've seen otherwise already in the very first beta event. Ranged Dps, by the way, sucks.

     You backpeddle slower than you run forward by about half. In PvP once people figure out that you just have to run directly at ranged classes rather then flail around wildly it becomes very easy to trap and destroy ranged. Ranged classes that know what they are doing can snare and keep distance. Then again melee characters that know what they're doing can dodge snars and use their own ranged cripples and snares to close distance. Its really dependent on skill here.

     In PvE you only have a high survival rate as a ranged DPS if you have melee to keep everything away from you. If you are on your own you need some fancy footwork. Also take into account that all ranged attacks do about a 1/3 of melee attack damage.

     In the end I'd try out what best suits your playstyle. Guardians have plenty of builds but the one you mentioned sounds nice.

     There is a running joke that ranged DPS is for people who are too afraid to do anything useful. This generally comes from the idea that ranged DPS just likes to sit behind all of the melee characters who are "actually contributing" and fire arrows to feel like they are part of the battle too. Ranged DPS generally is safer in that you can keep away from heavy hitters better. Then again you are also barely contributing to your group and its pretty hard to stay at ranged versus a lot of mobs by yourself.

     My auto attack did more damage then a rangers skill. This is for balance reasons. I'm taking more risk being in the thick of things. The ranger is just standing in safety zone firing off mosquito damage.

     Not to say rangers aren't completely viable (they are) but just be aware of these things. Distance is hard to keep in some situations unless you are good with your skills, you don't contribute as much in group situations as other classes (then again other people rarely have to worry about a good ranger dying).

     Also be aware that ranged ONLY is not viable at all. Not only does it not do enough damage but in PvP it is starting to lack as more people become comfortable with dealing with rangers. Again, that mainly has to do with not flailing around but charging rangers and dodging snares. You catch up to them in no time. So even as a ranged character you will need some melee unless your really good at keeping distance for long periods of time to finally kill stuff.

Classes I tried (each were lvl 8 at least) : Engy, theif, warrior (highst was lvl 15 - only one I pvp with), necro, ele.

My post was obviously if the game stays as is and far more PvE oriented as it was mentioned by OP that he was unsure about PvE.. In PvP warrior the buffer (especially with the speed buff and retarded stun lock) was viable. But not as good as 2h sword + bulls charge (lol).

No one should back peddle, you should be able to backwards run and strafe, like in all other games. I had no real problems doing it, especially with knockback skills.

 

 

PVE wise:

There are many, many bugs, here are few of the important ones I reported (I dont report useless ones, because companies tend to focus on the useless ones first for some reason)

As ele (fire) or engi, the running in a strafing circle worked just fine in PvE. Yes I reported as a bug. Another invicibility bug I found was that if you are underwater, and move above melee mobs while weilding a spear, you cannot be hit and you just wait there until the kill is complete.

As a warrior though, you shouldnt be getting 2shot or 1shot... you are most useless to a team dead. I seriously took less damage on a necro than a warrior. However, the warrior did kill much faster, I just dont feel like much of a warrior in heavy armor when I get 2shot.

Also, a necro with +5 vitality had more HP than a guardian with +25 vitality. So either theres a bug with how vitality is counted or guardians should just not even have the vitality attribute. (next BWE im testing ele + guardian for healing and I will build the guardian with toughness, to see how it goes.)

Overflow servers broke up parties. This should be the top priority fix, although a work around was to go in town and spam click a tele point until it let you in the main server.

     I fought rangers who tried to use knockbacks as well, dodge them. They all have windups. Needless to say I found no problem closing distance at all. I don't know where your skill level is in comparison to the average though. Necromancers are not squishy classes in this game btw. They have a ton of health.

     In general its wise to throw out any judgements you may have about a class. Necromancers are extremely vitality based.

    

Well, I didnt play Ranger, its just the 1 class that doesnt appeal to me. The only reason I'll play it at release is the 30/50 HOM rewards involve rangers (too much).

But for engineers there is a knockback, a snare, and a slow. (on 2 sets of weapons). You can only dodge so much. But PvP aside, the strafe kiting works wonders, which dumbs down the game quite a lot.

     Just saw a post from Anet on the beta forums and ranged is still being worked on. The next BWE will feature a perma slow on ranged weapon sets. They are also going to experiment with ranged DPS attracting the attention of monsters faster.

     We'll see what they do.

When you say things like that... do post links so we can read it too =)

Originally posted by sonoggi

Originally posted by orator1970

The reason that i actually wanted to play a condition removal build was that i thought this game was different than most and it was heavily reliant on a condition/boon style of gameplay but like i said i have not play the so i can be easily miss informed

youre absolutely right. however, you cant see the type of gameplay that centres around boons/conditions from a bunch of noobs in open beta. trust me, buffing/cleansing guardians will be epic. i played a staff guard in pvp, and mace/shield guard in pve, and made a huge difference for my team. spamming 33% damage reduction, blocking attacks and removing conditions is HUGE.

Funny you said that i was actually going to use vthe same weapons set as yours :)

yes, mobs do use conditions, but an full condition removal build that works great in pvp vs necros and such...it wil work ofc. but not rlly sure if the mobs can keep up with ur condition removal :P

Originally posted by grimm6th

 

Long story short.  Play game, then make builds.

+1

Originally posted by timeraider

yes, mobs do use conditions, but an full condition removal build that works great in pvp vs necros and such...it wil work ofc. but not rlly sure if the mobs can keep up with ur condition removal :P

lol :)

Originally posted by fiontar

Originally posted by neobahamut20

To be honest with you, I rarely got conditions that lasted more than 3 seconds.  As a buffer/debuffer build, I felt like the most useless piece of crap on the playing field. I suppose the same would be also true for a condition removal build. The only good builds in that game are dps and more dps. Ranged dps is even better because of the higher survival rate.

Not an unexpected reaction from someone who only has played a few days of the game. My only lay experience is from the BWE as well, but at least I understand that we have only just barely scratched the surface of what the game offers during that limited exposure. I was learning new things and adjusting my game over the course of the entire weekend.

To assume that the highest DPS builds are always the best builds seems short sighted.

I really hope I run into neobahamut in PvP, lol.

1) All of the top DPS builds rely HEAVILY on long CD buffing abilities. (boons). Take those away, and they are really squishy dps characters that deal about half as much damage as they should.

2) Certain classes have the abilities to strip boons off of enemies (some of which can even convert them into random conditions). That alone can easily counter the top DPS builds, not even counting the use of block abilities, proper dodging, evasion abilities, & stuns.

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

Originally posted by Nightshade55

Originally posted by neobahamut20

To be honest with you, I rarely got conditions that lasted more than 3 seconds.  As a buffer/debuffer build, I felt like the most useless piece of crap on the playing field. I suppose the same would be also true for a condition removal build. The only good builds in that game are dps and more dps. Ranged dps is even better because of the higher survival rate.

     I wouldn't listen to advice like this. Not that your advise, mr Neobahamut20, is any worse than anyone elses but its pretty clear you have some bias there against some pretty viable builds.

     For one the game is not tuned to its final state. Even so though conditions are pretty nasty if you know what your doing. I know this because I know other people that have owned the battlefield with a buffer/debuffer build. I think it would have been more truthful if you had said 'The only good builds FOR ME in that game..." and then continued to state them.

     I know its not true for the whole game because I've seen otherwise already in the very first beta event. Ranged Dps, by the way, sucks.

     You backpeddle slower than you run forward by about half. In PvP once people figure out that you just have to run directly at ranged classes rather then flail around wildly it becomes very easy to trap and destroy ranged. Ranged classes that know what they are doing can snare and keep distance. Then again melee characters that know what they're doing can dodge snars and use their own ranged cripples and snares to close distance. Its really dependent on skill here.

     In PvE you only have a high survival rate as a ranged DPS if you have melee to keep everything away from you. If you are on your own you need some fancy footwork. Also take into account that all ranged attacks do about a 1/3 of melee attack damage.

     In the end I'd try out what best suits your playstyle. Guardians have plenty of builds but the one you mentioned sounds nice.

     There is a running joke that ranged DPS is for people who are too afraid to do anything useful. This generally comes from the idea that ranged DPS just likes to sit behind all of the melee characters who are "actually contributing" and fire arrows to feel like they are part of the battle too. Ranged DPS generally is safer in that you can keep away from heavy hitters better. Then again you are also barely contributing to your group and its pretty hard to stay at ranged versus a lot of mobs by yourself.

     My auto attack did more damage then a rangers skill. This is for balance reasons. I'm taking more risk being in the thick of things. The ranger is just standing in safety zone firing off mosquito damage.

     Not to say rangers aren't completely viable (they are) but just be aware of these things. Distance is hard to keep in some situations unless you are good with your skills, you don't contribute as much in group situations as other classes (then again other people rarely have to worry about a good ranger dying).

     Also be aware that ranged ONLY is not viable at all. Not only does it not do enough damage but in PvP it is starting to lack as more people become comfortable with dealing with rangers. Again, that mainly has to do with not flailing around but charging rangers and dodging snares. You catch up to them in no time. So even as a ranged character you will need some melee unless your really good at keeping distance for long periods of time to finally kill stuff.

Classes I tried (each were lvl 8 at least) : Engy, theif, warrior (highst was lvl 15 - only one I pvp with), necro, ele.

My post was obviously if the game stays as is and far more PvE oriented as it was mentioned by OP that he was unsure about PvE.. In PvP warrior the buffer (especially with the speed buff and retarded stun lock) was viable. But not as good as 2h sword + bulls charge (lol).

No one should back peddle, you should be able to backwards run and strafe, like in all other games. I had no real problems doing it, especially with knockback skills.

 

 

PVE wise:

There are many, many bugs, here are few of the important ones I reported (I dont report useless ones, because companies tend to focus on the useless ones first for some reason)

As ele (fire) or engi, the running in a strafing circle worked just fine in PvE. Yes I reported as a bug. Another invicibility bug I found was that if you are underwater, and move above melee mobs while weilding a spear, you cannot be hit and you just wait there until the kill is complete.

As a warrior though, you shouldnt be getting 2shot or 1shot... you are most useless to a team dead. I seriously took less damage on a necro than a warrior. However, the warrior did kill much faster, I just dont feel like much of a warrior in heavy armor when I get 2shot.

Also, a necro with +5 vitality had more HP than a guardian with +25 vitality. So either theres a bug with how vitality is counted or guardians should just not even have the vitality attribute. (next BWE im testing ele + guardian for healing and I will build the guardian with toughness, to see how it goes.)

Overflow servers broke up parties. This should be the top priority fix, although a work around was to go in town and spam click a tele point until it let you in the main server.

     I fought rangers who tried to use knockbacks as well, dodge them. They all have windups. Needless to say I found no problem closing distance at all. I don't know where your skill level is in comparison to the average though. Necromancers are not squishy classes in this game btw. They have a ton of health.

     In general its wise to throw out any judgements you may have about a class. Necromancers are extremely vitality based.

    

Well, I didnt play Ranger, its just the 1 class that doesnt appeal to me. The only reason I'll play it at release is the 30/50 HOM rewards involve rangers (too much).

But for engineers there is a knockback, a snare, and a slow. (on 2 sets of weapons). You can only dodge so much. But PvP aside, the strafe kiting works wonders, which dumbs down the game quite a lot.

     Just saw a post from Anet on the beta forums and ranged is still being worked on. The next BWE will feature a perma slow on ranged weapon sets. They are also going to experiment with ranged DPS attracting the attention of monsters faster.

     We'll see what they do.

When you say things like that... do post links so we can read it too =)

      I'm going to shamelessly admit that I can't find it right now. I'm looking for the post though. I did a search but there are dozens of pages of posts regarding melee versus ranged and I'm not sure how to narrow it down yet to just dev posts.

     The second I find it again I'[ll post it on here for you to see. Anet is actually incredable about posting feedback. They have responded to almost everything, even down to what could be considered pointless posts.

     Such as a women wanting bigger boobs for the charr. Yeah, an Anet character developer came in and responded. They don't just do one or two sentance responses either. They are long and in depth responses.

      I'd be glad to post it here as soon as I find it again. If anyone else is in the beta and knows the thread I'm talking about please help me out here if you have its location on the beta forums.

     Also I'll have to post a screenshot, not a link. Because you have to actually have a beta GW2 account to sign in to the beta forums. So I'll try to snipe that as soon as I can.

Originally posted by fenistil

Originally posted by grimm6th

 

Long story short.  Play game, then make builds.

+1

Agreed, unfortunately due to the lock region system in place i am in a part of the world where the game is not easy to purchase so i have not being able to get my hands on it yet so while i wait i just thought i get some opinions on builds and stuff :)