Originally posted by Unlight

Originally posted by chaintm

Originally posted by Bladestrom

Originally posted by Unlight

Originally posted by Spector88

I am a more "hardcore" type of player. So not having ANY grind at the end of a game for me would be pretty dull, and pointless.

 

I've played almsot every MMO out there, the cost is nothing to be. However, I read that end game is this game is no raids, anti grind, and from what I read borderline pointless. So basically I hit max level and, walk around trying to get titles?

 

I will point out that the videos and gameplay reviews for this game has kind of won me over, but I hated Guild Wars 1.

There is no end game at all.  There won't be much for you to do once you hit 80.  You should probably save yourself some disappointment and steer clear, no matter how interesting it looks right now.  You will tire of it quickly.

No, you cannot see or understand or appreciate or want what end-game is on offer (latter is fine thats your choice, but your choice does not equal fact for all).  I Started GW1 7 years ago while playing wow full time and have been at end-game (max level 20) for all that time and up to yesterday I was still playing and loving the game.  GW2 is shaping up to be an GW1 expanded x-fold.

 

End game is pvp, it's in the title man, sorry but even the new ideas taken from other games I might add, won't extend the pve content. In the end guild wars has and always will be a pvp oriented game.

First, you are wrong.  I played GW1 on and off since launch and hardly ever touched PvP.  There is far more PvE content in the game than there is PvP content.  Don't confuse the original vision with the reality that came to pass. 

Second (@bladestrom), my point was that no one here can sell the game to someone that isn't interested in buying.  We shouldn't even be trying.  The game sells itself better than anyone here can.  When someone comes sniffing around about GW2 and wrinkles their nose at what most of us consider it's strengths, we're better off politely directing them elsewhere.  The more you try to convince them, the more they need convincing.  We've all seen it so many times.  Is there any point to trying to change someone's mind who's already made it up?  Only if you're interested in padding your post count.  If they end up wanting to play it at some point, they'll do it on their own.

"dont confuse the original vision", you must know something that no dev, publisher, media person or for that matter player knows. Guild wars base premise to this day is guilds fight guild = guild wars o_0 , you know how silly you sound right about now right?

Don't take me wrong , if you never touched pvp and stat that there is far more pve content then pvp? What game are you playing, do you realize that one expansion alone had 4 areas of pve and rest pvp? I mean, I get it, if you play maybe once a month and do other things this game can seem huge. But if you compair it to what the OP is asking about (main stream MMO end game) there is not comparison. I could make your same statement about any game I have played, such as I have played LOTRO sense launch and still play it, yet I have not finished all the content. It's not because the content is so huge , it's because I chose other things to do.

However if you again go by the OP's original question, the intent was "What happens at the end game? " to which most people with half a brain know it to be when you finish all the content to your max level what do you do then? Then to most of not all MMO's currently have dugeon boss equipement grinds or pvp. Guild wars is pvp, has been always will be, that is it's focus. You may not play one ounce of pvp, doesn't make that fact any different on what the core objective of the game play is. Hell you don't beleive all your read, look up guild wars 2 home page, read what the game is about. What is the main subject concept you get from reading that material... hmm big suprise, pvp.

Edit : sorry again grammar, spelling, @ work, does it to you when u keep getting... *(just now) phone calls, haha yea, I should get back to work anyways, I mean it's your opinion Unlight, but the facts are on the offical sites, the end game for this game is pvp. Anyways good luck on the discussion, duty calls! Later all.

Originally posted by Unlight

Originally posted by chaintm

Originally posted by Bladestrom

Originally posted by chaintm

Originally posted by Bladestrom

Originally posted by Unlight

Originally posted by Spector88

I am a more "hardcore" type of player. So not having ANY grind at the end of a game for me would be pretty dull, and pointless.

 

I've played almsot every MMO out there, the cost is nothing to be. However, I read that end game is this game is no raids, anti grind, and from what I read borderline pointless. So basically I hit max level and, walk around trying to get titles?

 

I will point out that the videos and gameplay reviews for this game has kind of won me over, but I hated Guild Wars 1.

There is no end game at all.  There won't be much for you to do once you hit 80.  You should probably save yourself some disappointment and steer clear, no matter how interesting it looks right now.  You will tire of it quickly.

No, you cannot see or understand or appreciate or want what end-game is on offer (latter is fine thats your choice, but your choice does not equal fact for all).  I Started GW1 7 years ago while playing wow full time and have been at end-game (max level 20) for all that time and up to yesterday I was still playing and loving the game.  GW2 is shaping up to be an GW1 expanded x-fold.

 

End game is pvp, it's in the title man, sorry but even the new ideas taken from other games I might add, won't extend the pve content. In the end guild wars has and always will be a pvp oriented game.

Ive spent about 1000 hours in GW1 so far and done virtually no PVP.  You need to research more.

 

[mod edit]

Hehe.  Yup the content was added over the years, I noticed this while I was playing as well, Especially when I paid for the expansions - boy was my slow brain shocked when i realised buying expansions gave more content I can tell you! 

Originally posted by chaintm

Originally posted by Unlight

Originally posted by chaintm

Originally posted by Bladestrom

Originally posted by Unlight

Originally posted by Spector88

I am a more "hardcore" type of player. So not having ANY grind at the end of a game for me would be pretty dull, and pointless.

 

I've played almsot every MMO out there, the cost is nothing to be. However, I read that end game is this game is no raids, anti grind, and from what I read borderline pointless. So basically I hit max level and, walk around trying to get titles?

 

I will point out that the videos and gameplay reviews for this game has kind of won me over, but I hated Guild Wars 1.

There is no end game at all.  There won't be much for you to do once you hit 80.  You should probably save yourself some disappointment and steer clear, no matter how interesting it looks right now.  You will tire of it quickly.

No, you cannot see or understand or appreciate or want what end-game is on offer (latter is fine thats your choice, but your choice does not equal fact for all).  I Started GW1 7 years ago while playing wow full time and have been at end-game (max level 20) for all that time and up to yesterday I was still playing and loving the game.  GW2 is shaping up to be an GW1 expanded x-fold.

 

End game is pvp, it's in the title man, sorry but even the new ideas taken from other games I might add, won't extend the pve content. In the end guild wars has and always will be a pvp oriented game.

First, you are wrong.  I played GW1 on and off since launch and hardly ever touched PvP.  There is far more PvE content in the game than there is PvP content.  Don't confuse the original vision with the reality that came to pass. 

Second (@bladestrom), my point was that no one here can sell the game to someone that isn't interested in buying.  We shouldn't even be trying.  The game sells itself better than anyone here can.  When someone comes sniffing around about GW2 and wrinkles their nose at what most of us consider it's strengths, we're better off politely directing them elsewhere.  The more you try to convince them, the more they need convincing.  We've all seen it so many times.  Is there any point to trying to change someone's mind who's already made it up?  Only if you're interested in padding your post count.  If they end up wanting to play it at some point, they'll do it on their own.

 

"dont confuse the original vision", you must know something that no dev, publisher, media person or for that matter player knows. Guild wars base premise to this day is guilds fight guild = guild wars o_0 , you know how silly you sound right about now right?

Don't take me wrong , if you never touched pvp and stat that there is far more pve content then pvp? What game are you playing, do you realize that one expansion alone had 4 areas of pve and rest pvp? I mean, I get it, if you play maybe once a month and do other things this game can seem huge. But if you compair it to what the OP is asking about (main stream MMO end game) there is not comparison. I could make your same statement about any game I have played, such as I have played LOTRO sense launch and still play it, yet I have not finished all the content. It's not because the content is so huge , it's because I chose other things to do.

However if you again go by the OP's original question, the intent was "What happens at the end game? " to which most people with half a brain know it to be when you finish all the content to your max level what do you do then? Then to most of not all MMO's currently have dugeon boss equipement grinds or pvp. Guild wars is pvp, has been always will be, that is it's focus. You may not play one ounce of pvp, doesn't make that fact any different on what the core objective of the game play is. Hell you don't beleive all your read, look up guild wars 2 home page, read what the game is about. What is the main subject concept you get from reading that material... hmm big suprise, pvp.

 

 

Edit : sorry again grammar, spelling, @ work, does it to you when u keep getting... *(just now) phone calls, haha yea, I should get back to work anyways, I mean it's your opinion Unlight, but the facts are on the offical sites, the end game for this game is pvp. Anyways good luck on the discussion, duty calls! Later all.

 For me End-Game is actually titles and achievments, with PVP as a nice side-dish.  PVP is obviously the main focus of End-Game but it is by no means the only facet. My point was more that there is plenty PVE in there for those who want it.   

Originally posted by Distopia

It's really hard to put into words, all I can say is, you know it when you see it. Games that have been successful in bringing communities together have content at end-game, so it's no surprise many think it's the content that does it. When it isn't. It's something forged on opening day that carries on until the lights go out, albeit on a shrinking basis of late. Maybe it's common ground, or even "the perfect storm" that  tends to create it.

GW2 could be that perfect storm, it really hasn't happened since WOW.

In my experience I've seen it twice. DAOC, SWG, many others saw it with WOW, EQ, UO or possibly AC. I remember standing in Anchorhead after an Imperial rush a few weeks after launch in SWG, just thinking this game has something others don't, I had the same feeling in DAOC yet never since. It's the complete opposite feeling you get when stepping into something like AOC, TOR etc.. While they may be fun, there is a tension in the air, a proverbial black-cloud.

Not trying to get all poetical or anything it's just the only way to describe what I had in mind.

Ah... I see what you mean.

Ya, unfortunately that's something you just don't know until you experience yourself. I would say though that it starts with building & supporting a good community, and I'd argue that Anet has managed to do that so far with GW2. A good measure of this would be that the examples you listed are all very different types of MMOs, with entirely different endgames. I would also throw Eve and FFXI up there (at least old FFXI, I'm told it's gotten a lot worse), two MMOs which don't really revolve around endgame at all.

If you still love grinding away then you have plenty of clone games to do that in each one with near the same end result, as for many of us older gamers grinding for gear with a guild and friends is to been there done that 50 times, i am looking for something different something that makes gaming fun again instead of the same repeated yawnfest...

There is no real skill required to do these repetitive non random dungeons only an orderly rehearsed approach as seen on many a guilds web site and a skill rotation set...

Yawn...

It is an awesome feeling to be the first guild to accomplish one of these dungeons on your own without help but other then that your guild puts it up on a web site and then it is a repeatable yawnfest..

guildwars is buy to play, doesn't need to have "endgame". play until you get bored then stop playing and go play something else, maybe start playing again when they release expansion pack.

"THE ENTIRE GAME IS THE ENDGAME"

This. The only reason most mmo's have grind to endgame is to increase revenue because they are pay to play.

again?

...and when THE END  game for this threads?

I mean there are tons of it in this forums...

do some research ffs...or try a better way to flame a post....

old is old

Originally posted by DarkPony

Originally posted by Spector88

I read that in WvWvW you get pushed to lvl 80 and have the same stats as every1?

 

Um.. whats the point of PvPing then if no one has to earn their gear and being geared doesnt help you slay opponents easier???

 

Good points most of you, just adding more.

Played Stwor? There was statboosting in pvp in that game as well ...

Didn't prevent the boosted lowbies from being completely facestomped by true max levels.

Not only their gear will be worse, but having access to all abilities and elite skills and talents will have the biggest impact.

And that is fine: there should be a difference but it shouldn't be too easy to kill them either.

But, gee, Pony. I thought this game was not gear/level based but skill based.

endgames starts at lvl 1

Originally posted by Tardcore

Originally posted by DarkPony

Originally posted by Spector88

I read that in WvWvW you get pushed to lvl 80 and have the same stats as every1?

 

Um.. whats the point of PvPing then if no one has to earn their gear and being geared doesnt help you slay opponents easier???

 

Good points most of you, just adding more.

Played Stwor? There was statboosting in pvp in that game as well ...

Didn't prevent the boosted lowbies from being completely facestomped by true max levels.

Not only their gear will be worse, but having access to all abilities and elite skills and talents will have the biggest impact.

And that is fine: there should be a difference but it shouldn't be too easy to kill them either.

But, gee, Pony. I thought this game was not gear/level based but skill based.

But gee Tardcore, WvW isn't supposed to be balanced PvP.  The non gear/level based PvP is in the structured PvP. 

Oh, and a lower level manning a cannon or battlesuit is just as effective as a max level player in said artilary/weaponry.

Originally posted by Spector88

I am a more "hardcore" type of player. So not having ANY grind at the end of a game for me would be pretty dull, and pointless.

 

I've played almsot every MMO out there, the cost is nothing to be. However, I read that end game is this game is no raids, anti grind, and from what I read borderline pointless. So basically I hit max level and, walk around trying to get titles?

 

I will point out that the videos and gameplay reviews for this game has kind of won me over, but I hated Guild Wars 1.

go and play some asia grinder then.

Originally posted by Msenge

Originally posted by Tardcore

Originally posted by DarkPony

Originally posted by Spector88

I read that in WvWvW you get pushed to lvl 80 and have the same stats as every1?

 

Um.. whats the point of PvPing then if no one has to earn their gear and being geared doesnt help you slay opponents easier???

 

Good points most of you, just adding more.

Played Stwor? There was statboosting in pvp in that game as well ...

Didn't prevent the boosted lowbies from being completely facestomped by true max levels.

Not only their gear will be worse, but having access to all abilities and elite skills and talents will have the biggest impact.

And that is fine: there should be a difference but it shouldn't be too easy to kill them either.

But, gee, Pony. I thought this game was not gear/level based but skill based.

But gee Tardcore, WvW isn't supposed to be balanced PvP.  The non gear/level based PvP is in the structured PvP. 

 

Oh, and a lower level manning a cannon or battlesuit is just as effective as a max level player in said artilary/weaponry.

Sounds good to me, as I think that balancing PVP is a lesson in futility anyway, and leads only to frustrating everyone in the end. However your description of structurted PVP has me worried now, as in other games where players were given an option, players have often opted with sticking to the structured PVP areas and just avoided unbalanced (or untiered) content. Hopefully A-net has figured a way around this.

Originally posted by Tardcore

Sounds good to me, as I think that balancing PVP is a lesson in futility anyway, and leads only to frustrating everyone in the end. However your description of structurted PVP has me worried now, as in other games where players were given an option, players have often opted with sticking to the structured PVP areas and just avoided unbalanced (or untiered) content. Hopefully A-net has figured a way around this.

Well, structured PvP gives absolutely no rewards you can cart back to WvW or PvE.  It's purely cosmetic stuff, no leveling or skills or anything you can use elsewhere.

So you play structured PvP because you like structured PvP and want rewards for the sake of showing off internally within the structured PvP community.

Most other games, the structured PvP rewards were more efficient than rewards for other types of PvP.

While WvW gives rewards comparable to playing PvE content, including gold and item drops.

So you play WvW because you want to kill people and get stuff and help out your server with bonuses.  Different crowds there, shouldn't be too much of one stealing horribly from the other.

Originally posted by Spector88

I am a more "hardcore" type of player. So not having ANY grind at the end of a game for me would be pretty dull, and pointless.

 

I've played almsot every MMO out there, the cost is nothing to be. However, I read that end game is this game is no raids, anti grind, and from what I read borderline pointless. So basically I hit max level and, walk around trying to get titles?

 

I will point out that the videos and gameplay reviews for this game has kind of won me over, but I hated Guild Wars 1.

To me the idea of spending extra money for the privelege of doing repetitive chores for months on end for the reward of digital purple carrots that do nothing except give you access to more repetitive chores seems extremely pointless. Would you play any of those games if there were no carrots? I dont see how that is any more interesting than trying to get titles to be honest. It seems like you are more of an addict that has been conditioned to expect repetition from mmos.

Besides GW2 does not charge you "rent" each month so there is no need for you to feel compelled to live there. You can come and go whenever the fancy takes you.

Originally posted by DarkPony

People will try to convince you GW2 doesn't have that.

Methinks they are wrong.

Ugh... Y U DO DIS.

This thread is basically...

Cancer:  "HI... so umm, this doesn't look like a very good host for me." 

Everyone else:  "NO, COMEBACK CANCER,  We can make it work!"

Originally posted by Tommay
The endgame is guild wars 2 for the hardcore players would be competive PvP, improving your rank world wide rank, that would be the thing to work for. If your looking for PvE end game, then sadly guild wars 2 just isn't the game

Gee I dunno.  There is those things you have mentioned yea. 

But the entirety of the zones are full of random dynamic events.  I could be wrong not having played it but I cant think you'd possibly see all thats going on or all that is possible to have gone on in those zones just running through them once.  And since you scale down when interacting with lower level content, the whole game will always be challenging. 

Missed the dragon attacking the town?  Go back and explore and see if it happens.  I want to think that might be why people are saying "End game starts at level 1 ".  Because it kind of does.  In that regard.  

So I do disagree with you saying PVE endgame doesnt exist.  Usually there is very little forward progression for most end game in most mmorpgs besides running an instance or raid dungeon 2000 times.  Not sure why thats entertaining for some people.  Easily amused by doing the exact same thing repeatedly I guess. 

There's also a lot of guild functions.  And thats likely to get you into doing things for the guild and earning rewards for said guild.  Which no matter if you are 1 or 80, there's going to be never ending ways to contribute there. 

But end game in most games is raiding the dungeons for the best gear or PVP.  The game does have PVP and Realm VS Realm which is amazing and great.  But the raiding dungeons over and over for gear is not a focus of GW2.  Which honestly is the most boring thing Ive ever done in a game. 

Originally posted by DarkPony

Originally posted by Spector88

I read that in WvWvW you get pushed to lvl 80 and have the same stats as every1?

 

Um.. whats the point of PvPing then if no one has to earn their gear and being geared doesnt help you slay opponents easier???

 

Good points most of you, just adding more.

Played Stwor? There was statboosting in pvp in that game as well ...

Didn't prevent the boosted lowbies from being completely facestomped by true max levels.

Not only their gear will be worse, but having access to all abilities and elite skills and talents will have the biggest impact.

And that is fine: there should be a difference but it shouldn't be too easy to kill them either.

You see Pony the thing that made that sort of bolstering inferior was 2 things:

1. PvP gear had a PvP stat which wasnt bolstered so the advantage of the true level 50 was still much higher.   AND

2.  You didnt have all your skills, theres a huge difference between a level 11 with only 2 talent points and a level 49 with all their talent points (not to mention their 31 point talent tree ability).

Now in GW2 the only thing that doesnt get bolstered is your traits, which on the surface would appear to be not a big deal at least in theory we hope.  But I can safely say that theres a huge difference between getting bolstered up to level 80 with all your skills and not having to worry about some silly PvP stat.

Originally posted by Corehaven

So I do disagree with you saying PVE endgame doesnt exist.  Usually there is very little forward progression for most end game in most mmorpgs besides running an instance or raid dungeon 2000 times.  Not sure why thats entertaining for some people.  Easily amused by doing the exact same thing repeatedly I guess.  

I was wondering about what I could do next to WvWvW when I reached level 80. I honestly couldn't think of much, except getting more cosmetic stuff and doing areas I haven't been before. Then I thought of what I did when I reached the max level in other MMO's. I cleared old stuff, did some PvP and instances/raids in WoW, Rift and Aion. Pretty much the same.

So to the OP, End Game is probably the same as in other MMO's, minus the raids. To be honest, I won't miss those much. Sure, it's fun when everything goes as planned, but often I experienced problems.

Endgame = End of the Game

Play another game?

Originally posted by Spector88

I am a more "hardcore" type of player. So not having ANY grind at the end of a game for me would be pretty dull, and pointless.

 

I've played almsot every MMO out there, the cost is nothing to be. However, I read that end game is this game is no raids, anti grind, and from what I read borderline pointless. So basically I hit max level and, walk around trying to get titles?

 

I will point out that the videos and gameplay reviews for this game has kind of won me over, but I hated Guild Wars 1.

Wake up brother, you have reached the promise land. There's no such thing as Endgame in GW2.  Erase that word from your vocabuliary.  What you would describe as a RAid would be the level 70+ dynamic events that will be filtrated through 8 zones and change ever cosntantly.  The level 80 and 70 dungeon have 4 different dungeon paths. Each of these will have dynamic events and sometimes changing bosses to keep it active.  

So , for the record, there are tons of things to do pve wise when you reach level 80.  IF you don't want to exploer all the high leel things, you can go back and do quests at any other level that are just as challenging.  You can also complete your storymode, again just as difficult at 80.  

IF all else fails you can do WvW.  Which isn't your normal pvp.  There is pve dyanmic quests in the system and you can do fullscale raise or find a small team and go Inglorious bastards through the countryside.  

The key to GW2 is the experience at every level will be about having fun, not racing to get to maximum level. The game is he same from 1 to 80.  It doesnt reach 80 and all of a sudden you're playin a different game "the dreaded in game".