Unfortunately, once so many game companies say the cash cow that was the 15 bucks subscription, the quality of the game actually fell off. 

FOrcing game studios to do better by speaking with our pocketbook is the only way to regain the power and bring creativity back.  GW2 allows that.  Buy the game play it a month, u like it u never haveto pay a dime, u dont like it u never have to pay a dime. HOpefully though you will support them if you likei t that month, even if you are just buying trinkets. 

Originally posted by just1opinion

Originally posted by Deleted User

Originally posted by SuprGamerX

 Heh , you gotta be pretty naive on believing that a game that is F2P with a cash shop won't be B2W.  Even if the Devs say otherwise.   Scratching this game off my list of trials , NEXT!

 Too bad 95% of the gaming community are on social welfare and can't support a 10-15$ a month MMO , we would of had ALOT of epic titles.

THIS ... lol

 

You're both full of baloney.  We've been paying monthly fees for years, so where are all these epic titles? 

this^ ...couldnt find them anywhere.

Originally posted by dontadow

According to Jad Raddoff author of anatomy of an MMO, the average cost for a AAA MMO is $10 million to develop. This does not include the cost to market or for upkeep.  Unlike a AAA console game title, which costs between 3 to 6 million dollars and has no future upkeep and maintainance costs, says Erik Bethke in his book Game development and production.  

Arenanet has been working on this game since 2007, when it was announced, and it is safe to presume that they have not been paid for this game since its development.  

A Lexus/Nexus search of Arenanet finds that they have 270 employees.  This would mean that for 5 years, these 270 employees have not been paid from the earnings of Guild Wars 2.  According to the US Census, the average american makes 50,000 a year.  

 

So lets observe the debt that Arenanet is already in to provide us this great game.   That would mean that, just for salaries, they are in the hole 67 million just to feed the people who work for their company who must put food on their tables.  Let's say they sell 1 million units.  They would still not recoup their salary costs.  This does not include equipment or marketing.

You are right.  Guild Wars 1 sold 6.5 million boxes in 3 years.  No way GW2 would recoup those costs if they went with a B2P business model. 

 

The subscription module is losing popularity because it requires all users to pay, and those who do not pay can not play.  This drops the population, thus making it more difficult for paying customers who need more players to do specific content.   

The subscription model isn't losing popularity with players.  Publishers like P2W because it has a low cost of development, maintence, and can support a lower population game.  The risk is a lot lower when you only need 10,000 - 50,000 active users, and 10% of those to purchase items from your game.     

Turbine claimed an increase of 400% in revenue from the time they moved from P2P to F2P / B2P in LOTRO. Of course I haven't really heard much since. I'm no expert in researching, wouldn't know where to begin to look. However, finding out the financial status of Turbine from the beginning of LOTRO to present, might give a glimpse into whether or not the gaming community supports F2P / B2P over P2P.

Wow ze topic changed, but I hope the OP got his answers.

Originally posted by just1opinion

Originally posted by Deleted User

Originally posted by SuprGamerX

 Heh , you gotta be pretty naive on believing that a game that is F2P with a cash shop won't be B2W.  Even if the Devs say otherwise.   Scratching this game off my list of trials , NEXT!

 Too bad 95% of the gaming community are on social welfare and can't support a 10-15$ a month MMO , we would of had ALOT of epic titles.

THIS ... lol

 

You're both full of baloney.  We've been paying monthly fees for years, so where are all these epic titles? 

I don't think you understood what he wrote.

because you don't win when you unlock them, nor are you made better than those who don't.

Originally posted by atticusbc

because you don't win when you unlock them, nor are you made better than those who don't.

They might as well just replace some of your inventory slots with advertisements to the cash shop.  It is basically the same thing.

This aspect of GW2 I do not consider pay2win, just obnoxious and crass in game cash shop advertisements.

Originally posted by gainesvilleg

Originally posted by atticusbc

because you don't win when you unlock them, nor are you made better than those who don't.

They might as well just replace some of your inventory slots with advertisements to the cash shop.  It is basically the same thing.

This aspect of GW2 I do not consider pay2win, just obnoxious and crass in game cash shop advertisements.

Oh yeah, if they will put those little icon advertisments everywhere I would be angry.

Originally posted by gainesvilleg

Originally posted by atticusbc

because you don't win when you unlock them, nor are you made better than those who don't.

They might as well just replace some of your inventory slots with advertisements to the cash shop.  It is basically the same thing.

This aspect of GW2 I do not consider pay2win, just obnoxious and crass in game cash shop advertisements.

agreed. it irks me too, but last i heard you can get inkeys in game too, so there's that.

Would someone please explain why ANYTHING bought from the cash shop (whether real or perceived) bothers them ?

As I understand it if you buy gems for real money you can only turn that into in game gold by selling the gems to another player.

Why would anyone be bothered if you can buy experience scrolls ? So another player can level faster than you. Big deal. Why is that a problem ? I will tell you - JEALOUSY. The whole CS debate is just a complete waste of time IMHO.

Originally posted by FezVizzini

Would someone please explain why ANYTHING bought from the cash shop (whether real or perceived) bothers them ?

the only thing that would bother me is constant injection of the cash shop into my experience, basically it being indoctrined into the experience at every {or every other} step of the way. Large on-screen icons, long grinds to get things that are designed as an incentive to just buy it with cash/gems, etc.. That sort of thing would ruin the game IMO.

Originally posted by BilboDoggins

I would like to see how anyone can logically come to the conclusion that chests which can only be unlocked by buying keys from the cash shop isnt Pay 2 win.

 

Cuz i dont think anyone can and if they do claim its not Pay 2 win I think they are being willfully ignorant and/or intellectually dishonest.

 

So lets hear it. Defend this obvious pay 2 win scam.

win what? A gear that will get replaced after a few levels?? Or gear that is in the same tier as every other gear at max level?

No matter how you haters try. Fact is fact. Spare us your ignorance.

Originally posted by FezVizzini

Would someone please explain why ANYTHING bought from the cash shop (whether real or perceived) bothers them ?

As I understand it if you buy gems for real money you can only turn that into in game gold by selling the gems to another player.

Why would anyone be bothered if you can buy experience scrolls ? So another player can level faster than you. Big deal. Why is that a problem ? I will tell you - JEALOUSY. The whole CS debate is just a complete waste of time IMHO.

because they are leechers who dont wish to spend an extra penny and just want to f2p. The majority of us will use the monthly $15 we saved and spend on the cashshop.

I suspect this will all blow over after game launch...

Originally posted by dontadow

Unfortunately, once so many game companies say the cash cow that was the 15 bucks subscription, the quality of the game actually fell off. 

 

FOrcing game studios to do better by speaking with our pocketbook is the only way to regain the power and bring creativity back.  GW2 allows that.  Buy the game play it a month, u like it u never haveto pay a dime, u dont like it u never have to pay a dime. HOpefully though you will support them if you likei t that month, even if you are just buying trinkets. 

I agree.  Your pocketbook can be your voice, up to and including not buying the game, but frankly, I doubt the CS is gonna destroy the game.

Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by FezVizzini

Would someone please explain why ANYTHING bought from the cash shop (whether real or perceived) bothers them ?

the only thing that would bother me is constant injection of the cash shop into my experience, basically it being indoctrined into the experience at every {or every other} step of the way. Large on-screen icons, long grinds to get things that are designed as an incentive to just buy it with cash/gems, etc.. That sort of thing would ruin the game IMO.

This!

Other than that, I have almost 0 issue with it (I strongly loathe the fact you can buy guild influence with gold, I hope they'll change that)

Oh and one more thing, I posted it few times before, noone really reply to it

What do you consider Xpacs in P2P games such as in world of warcraft ?? Isnt it a premium content you cant acces without paying additional money?? It also usually contains much stronger gear, spells, levels and basicaly all kind of stuff that will definately make you stronger than people who didnt buy the Xpac - Which pretty much makes all those Xpacs a P2W games...You all just have been somehow tricked into not realising it IMO

Noone ever seemed to bother with that

Originally posted by Pigozz

Originally posted by Distopia

the only thing that would bother me is constant injection of the cash shop into my experience, basically it being indoctrined into the experience at every {or every other} step of the way. Large on-screen icons, long grinds to get things that are designed as an incentive to just buy it with cash/gems, etc.. That sort of thing would ruin the game IMO.

This!

Other than that, I have almost 0 issue with it (I strongly loathe the fact you can buy guild influence with gold, I hope they'll change that)

Agreed with you and Distopia both.

Originally posted by Pigozz

Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by FezVizzini

Would someone please explain why ANYTHING bought from the cash shop (whether real or perceived) bothers them ?

the only thing that would bother me is constant injection of the cash shop into my experience, basically it being indoctrined into the experience at every {or every other} step of the way. Large on-screen icons, long grinds to get things that are designed as an incentive to just buy it with cash/gems, etc.. That sort of thing would ruin the game IMO.

This!

Other than that, I have almost 0 issue with it (I strongly loathe the fact you can buy guild influence with gold, I hope they'll change that)

Oh and one more thing, I posted it few times before, noone really reply to it

What do you consider Xpacs in P2P games such as in world of warcraft ?? Isnt it a premium content you cant acces without paying additional money?? It also usually contains much stronger gear, spells, levels and basicaly all kind of stuff that will definately make you stronger than people who didnt buy the Xpac - Which pretty much makes all those Xpacs a P2W games...You all just have been somehow tricked into not realising it IMO

Noone ever seemed to bother with that

Distopia's post already answered your question as well... you pay for the XPac once, and that's it. Your payment has no impact on the gameplay other than simply allowing you to access the content.

You won't see the issues mentioned by Distopia with regular XPacs, only in cash shop games (although the P2P can cause similar issues, like devs trying to "strech" content and add grind)

I thought I heard gear doesn't really matter in this game so why would loot matter?

Kinda like in GW1 you can just create a lvl 20 and get handed the same max gear everyone else gets.