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Lord of the Rings Online Forum » General Discussion » Please help, I can't justify it

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69 posts found
  Kicksave321

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/26/13
Posts: 309

12/12/13 12:06:26 PM#61
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by fantasyfreak112

 Well you have your opinion I have mine.  These games are based around the name for example Swtor it's based around Star Wars, just for the record the biggest fail ever has over a million players a month and making a profit sounds like a failure nice try.  These games would not exist just like Halo, cod, metal gear , Zelda, Mario without the main aspect of them their ip.  To say x game would close without the name is ridiculous because the game wouldn't never been made without that ip.

This is true in the case of cash grab MMO's that attempt to leech off an IP's name; such as, LOTRO.

 

So a game that has never merged servers still releasing content 6+ yrs in is cash grab?  Cash grab usually refers to quick, fast, instant
How else do you explain them firing their veteran developers 9 month before launch, and restructuring the game to be a WoW clone, other than a quick cash grab?

 

 

Oh you must have missed part of what I said seems to be a trend here...

 

What part of 6+ years =quick, fast, instant?  

As for the firing please provide a link that one confirms your story and two says it's was done to make a quick cash grab thanks. 

You're going to have to dig deep into the internet archives of the MEO board, to learn the fate of Keeper, Sol, and the other veteran devs that used to host Turbine Nation (2004). Some were put on DDO, some were let go. In 2005, at the fan hosted Turbine Nation (because Turbine stopped being good with its community right around that time), the new devs showed up, all were under 28 and were trying to convince a fanbase that even though the focus of the game was entirely shifted from sandbox to instanced quests and combat, it wasn't so bad!

There was never another Turbine Nation Luncheon after that.

I don't think you know what a quick cash grab is. They made MEO a WoW clone in an attempt to cash in on a trend, and it backfired. Quick was in how quickly they restructured their game. The most popular IP in the world has been limping along with a small studio putting out small expansions for years. It's sad. Middle Earth deserved better.

 

I don't have to go back archive anything I'm not making the claims.  

See you think of it as a quick cash grab because it's not what you thought it should be

No, I think it was a quick cash grab because they literally changed the game at the last minute, QUICKLY, to cash in on a trend.

 

And I would say they made the right decision.  There was no telling if the mmo community was ready for the Meo you describe.  At the time there was room for an improvement over some aspects to WoW.  

See you probably think I'm some fb who thinks lotro is the greatest game ever, and that is so far from the truth.  I think lotro for what it is a them park set in middle earth is a good game.  For a theme park it has one of the best looking most immersive worlds, the epic story is very well done and one of the better community some meo vets even.  Does it have issues sure it does is it perfect not close.  But a few of your comments have been inaccurate so I wanted to point them.

 In general your comparison to meo is invalid.  I don't know how you can compare something that some say never made it to beta and was never released.  Lotro is not meo it is not ment to be this video game you keep referring to.  

 

  Tibernicuspa

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/03/13
Posts: 986

12/12/13 12:25:56 PM#62
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by fantasyfreak112

 Well you have your opinion I have mine.  These games are based around the name for example Swtor it's based around Star Wars, just for the record the biggest fail ever has over a million players a month and making a profit sounds like a failure nice try.  These games would not exist just like Halo, cod, metal gear , Zelda, Mario without the main aspect of them their ip.  To say x game would close without the name is ridiculous because the game wouldn't never been made without that ip.

This is true in the case of cash grab MMO's that attempt to leech off an IP's name; such as, LOTRO.

 

So a game that has never merged servers still releasing content 6+ yrs in is cash grab?  Cash grab usually refers to quick, fast, instant
How else do you explain them firing their veteran developers 9 month before launch, and restructuring the game to be a WoW clone, other than a quick cash grab?

 

 

Oh you must have missed part of what I said seems to be a trend here...

 

What part of 6+ years =quick, fast, instant?  

As for the firing please provide a link that one confirms your story and two says it's was done to make a quick cash grab thanks. 

You're going to have to dig deep into the internet archives of the MEO board, to learn the fate of Keeper, Sol, and the other veteran devs that used to host Turbine Nation (2004). Some were put on DDO, some were let go. In 2005, at the fan hosted Turbine Nation (because Turbine stopped being good with its community right around that time), the new devs showed up, all were under 28 and were trying to convince a fanbase that even though the focus of the game was entirely shifted from sandbox to instanced quests and combat, it wasn't so bad!

There was never another Turbine Nation Luncheon after that.

I don't think you know what a quick cash grab is. They made MEO a WoW clone in an attempt to cash in on a trend, and it backfired. Quick was in how quickly they restructured their game. The most popular IP in the world has been limping along with a small studio putting out small expansions for years. It's sad. Middle Earth deserved better.

 

I don't have to go back archive anything I'm not making the claims.  

See you think of it as a quick cash grab because it's not what you thought it should be

No, I think it was a quick cash grab because they literally changed the game at the last minute, QUICKLY, to cash in on a trend.

 

And I would say they made the right decision.

Limping along with very modest subscription numbers, in the shadow of WoW, with very few features to call its own, was a good decision?

" In general your comparison to meo is invalid.  I don't know how you can compare something that some say never made it to beta and was never released.  Lotro is not meo it is not ment to be this video game you keep referring to.  "

Except that it literally is MEO. MEO was in alpha at the time of the change. People had played it. It had trailers. It's the same game engine.

Would you say that Star Wars Galaxies after the NGE patch "is not SWG, it was not meant to be this video game you keep referring to"?

 

Learn something.

  Kicksave321

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/26/13
Posts: 309

12/12/13 12:35:25 PM#63
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by Kicksave321
Originally posted by fantasyfreak112

 Well you have your opinion I have mine.  These games are based around the name for example Swtor it's based around Star Wars, just for the record the biggest fail ever has over a million players a month and making a profit sounds like a failure nice try.  These games would not exist just like Halo, cod, metal gear , Zelda, Mario without the main aspect of them their ip.  To say x game would close without the name is ridiculous because the game wouldn't never been made without that ip.

This is true in the case of cash grab MMO's that attempt to leech off an IP's name; such as, LOTRO.

 

So a game that has never merged servers still releasing content 6+ yrs in is cash grab?  Cash grab usually refers to quick, fast, instant
How else do you explain them firing their veteran developers 9 month before launch, and restructuring the game to be a WoW clone, other than a quick cash grab?

 

 

Oh you must have missed part of what I said seems to be a trend here...

 

What part of 6+ years =quick, fast, instant?  

As for the firing please provide a link that one confirms your story and two says it's was done to make a quick cash grab thanks. 

You're going to have to dig deep into the internet archives of the MEO board, to learn the fate of Keeper, Sol, and the other veteran devs that used to host Turbine Nation (2004). Some were put on DDO, some were let go. In 2005, at the fan hosted Turbine Nation (because Turbine stopped being good with its community right around that time), the new devs showed up, all were under 28 and were trying to convince a fanbase that even though the focus of the game was entirely shifted from sandbox to instanced quests and combat, it wasn't so bad!

There was never another Turbine Nation Luncheon after that.

I don't think you know what a quick cash grab is. They made MEO a WoW clone in an attempt to cash in on a trend, and it backfired. Quick was in how quickly they restructured their game. The most popular IP in the world has been limping along with a small studio putting out small expansions for years. It's sad. Middle Earth deserved better.

 

I don't have to go back archive anything I'm not making the claims.  

See you think of it as a quick cash grab because it's not what you thought it should be

No, I think it was a quick cash grab because they literally changed the game at the last minute, QUICKLY, to cash in on a trend.

 

And I would say they made the right decision.

Limping along with very modest subscription numbers, in the shadow of WoW, with very few features to call its own, was a good decision?

" In general your comparison to meo is invalid.  I don't know how you can compare something that some say never made it to beta and was never released.  Lotro is not meo it is not ment to be this video game you keep referring to.  "

Except that it literally is MEO. MEO was in alpha at the time of the change. People had played it. It had trailers. It's the same game engine.

Would you say that Star Wars Galaxies after the NGE patch "is not SWG, it was not meant to be this video game you keep referring to"?

 

Learn something.

No having modest sub numbers for six plus years makes it the right decision.  Limping along again this goes back to your opinion which I've outlined has an alternative motive you know like lotro is not the MEO you wanted.  So keep saying limping along all the way to Mordor.  While the rest of us will ride our war steeds into battle.  

  APThug

Novice Member

Joined: 3/19/13
Posts: 39

12/13/13 7:04:28 AM#64

MMO's with gear treadmills will never be difficult. Combine that with time played and everything becomes laughably easy. For Lotro's case I would suggest scaling the dungeons to higher tiers. You can also try upping the difficutly while playing skirmishs.

If your looking for other games that have a bit of higher difficulty however, I would recommend the following:

  • Rift
  • EVE
  • Final Fantasy 14
  • Guild Wars 2
  • Firefall
  • And DarkFall 2

  Kicksave321

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/26/13
Posts: 309

12/13/13 7:18:33 AM#65
Originally posted by APThug

MMO's with gear treadmills will never be difficult. Combine that with time played and everything becomes laughably easy. For Lotro's case I would suggest scaling the dungeons to higher tiers. You can also try upping the difficutly while playing skirmishs.

If your looking for other games that have a bit of higher difficulty however, I would recommend the following:

  • Rift
  • EVE
  • Final Fantasy 14
  • Guild Wars 2
  • Firefall
  • And DarkFall 2

You could put age of Conan on this list.  You will find yourself running away a lot in that game. 

  anthonyx3

Novice Member

Joined: 11/14/08
Posts: 2

12/13/13 11:11:03 AM#66

I have put my time in LOTRO. I started a few months after release. What keeps me in the game is that fact that I love the Tolkien world. I love the lore and I love putting myself in the middle of it all (sure they stretch, twist a little and even break lore from time to time; RKs for examples, Hobbits and Elves and Dwarfs in Helm's deep but overall it is outstanding). I think maybe if I wasn't such a LOTR fan I would have left but who knows. There are times when some vets and I get nostalgic and talk about the times where there was no quest trackers, no mobs on radar, there was no instance finder. Back in those days you had to run around and find the area to complete a quest which meant one would have to read the quest and pay attention to landmarks (LOTRO is HUGE). Our weekly raids required either a common gathering place and we as a raid would ride though the wilds to get to the place of the raid. Or some brave Hunter would take a Captain so they could make it to the safe spot and summon the fellowship. It was harder back then, more complex, and had a sense of danger. But the reality is that if they made this game for us there wouldn't be a whole lot of people still playing. The market has changed over the last 5 - 6 years. So even though we reminisce about the past we embrace what it is. If you are not a fan of LOTR then chances are you will come and go. They have an excellent F2P model that will cater to those who want it given to them (at a price).

 

But it can still be difficult. To make life more difficult go to your options panel (ctrl O) Click on the UI settings tab then scroll down. Unclick the NPC names, Overhead Quest Icons. Skip down to Quest Guide and unclick the three options (there are more options such as removing the name on items, map and radar locater options). On your mini map (radar) right click and go to filters and clear all. On the main map (M) you click on filters and clear all.

The game takes on a whole new feeling. I have done this when leveling up a new character with someone totally new to the game. Even though I did these quests years ago it was like a totally new experience. It was like exploring Middle Earth for the first time again. My partner loved it so much that it took forever to level. We even used an XP disabler to not out level certain zones. All the difficulty wasn't there but we improvised. Instead of going to the instance finder we actually traveled to the POI first.

So that is why I know longer complain about how easy the game has become (a lot less complaining I should say). Because you can play this game how you want to. If you are a lore monkey and want to enjoy LOTR and take you time you can. If you are causal and want to spend some money to move more quickly you can. Or if you want to grind your way through it you can.

I am an MMO vet and I know there are flaws with the game. I haven't played one that doesn't have flaws. But I still remember when I was 14 y/o and picked up The Fellowship of the Ring for the first time knowing nothing about the book. I spent the whole summer reading everything I could (not much beyond the trilogy). We would play games in the woods recreating parts of the books. I always thought how cool it would be to be a Hunter Elf that was a lot like Legolas. Many years later I am able to do that. There is an instance in the early epic books where you go on a quest with freaking Legolas himself!

Happy Hunting! 

 

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17007

12/13/13 11:26:10 AM#67
Originally posted by anthonyx3

 

 

But it can still be difficult. To make life more difficult go to your options panel (ctrl O) Click on the UI settings tab then scroll down. Unclick the NPC names, Overhead Quest Icons. Skip down to Quest Guide and unclick the three options (there are more options such as removing the name on items, map and radar locater options). On your mini map (radar) right click and go to filters and clear all. On the main map (M) you click on filters and clear all.

I've tried that. The problem is that they are no longer writing quest that requires you to "figure out" where the objective is.

So, for instance, last night I was doing a quest that merely said "meet Frijolde (or whatever her name was) at her campfire".

That was it.

Without opening up the map and seeing the glowing ring there is no actual way to find it. It's a damn shame.

  anthonyx3

Novice Member

Joined: 11/14/08
Posts: 2

12/13/13 6:15:38 PM#68
You are right and it is a shame. I was in Rohan and turned off all the indicators and it was way too frustrating. I guess when I did this (my cappy that I am duoing with is level 47)  the old quests were still there. It will be disappointing when we get to those level when Turbine changed how they wrote the quests. I wonder how the lotro RPs handle those situation?
  BarCrow

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/25/07
Posts: 2145

12/14/13 5:56:47 PM#69
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by BarCrow
Originally posted by Tibernicuspa
Originally posted by BarCrow
How did someone play Middle Earth Online beta?...I thought Sierra had to scratch that when they went belly up and got purchased by Vivendi. It never got to Beta..or alpha as far as I know..which may not be much.

How do people remember the Sierra project, which wasn't publicized at all, more than the Turbine Middle Earth Online, which was advertised and developed for 4 years? Boggling.

 

LotRO IS Middle Earth Online. 9 months before the initial launch they renamed it to LotRO, delayed the game 8 months, and turned the game into a WoW clone from a sandbox.

 

The Sierra project was entirely unrelated.

I was actually subscribed to some Sierra newsletter. Not sure how I signed up for it. I seemed to remember something I filled out for Police Quest. Maybe that was how . I did play Space and Kings and Police quest so it could have been any of them but I really only remember ever filling some survey or what not from Police Quest. So I think that is how I started receiving a newsletter. On one of them, possibly two...I remember it had little tidbits hinting at the game. Even a screen shot I think. So long ago..lol.  I remember the Sierra project for this reason and because..at the time.. I was really only familiar with UO. Although a fan of the Ultima series I was going to hold out for a similar game based on Tolkien's creation. Of course, that incarnation never came and I gradually just forgot and never really delved into MMOs at all until years later. (Wish I'd hopped on the EQ train though).  I wasn't really hyped over the Turbine game tbo.  The first MMO I ever played was City of Heroes then WOW so by the time Turbine release LOTRO I was pretty engrossed in those two games still.  So I admit I never even heard of the Turbine Middle Earth Online precursor to LOTRO. I've since experienced LOTRO and enjoyed my brief time playing (12 months or so off and on) but sounds like it's earlier version (MEO) might have ended up a better game. Who knows.

Turbine's MEO did have a massive following. Far bigger than what ended up in LotRO (though that's an unfair measurement, as most pre release games have bigger followings than the post release games).

MEO wasn't the perma death project Sierra had in mind, but it was a sandbox with the tag line "Live in Middle Earth." It was very much focused on simulating how life would work in Middle Earth. There was an alignment/morality system, and everything was really wide open. No instances.

About 9 months before launch Turbine delayed it and renamed it LotRO, and turned it into an easy, hand holding, quest grinding, instance centric WoW clone. Probably half the reason was because it turned out simulating life in ME was too hard, and it's just easier to make a shallow WoW clone. The other reason, I suspect, is publisher involvement. Turbine won a court case that gave them sole control over the game, and with that power, they turned it into LotRO, fired or relocated their veteran staff members, and hired a bunch of 23ish year old folks to run the game.

The MEO community was devastated.

That sounded sweet. You'd think Turbine would have learned a lesson from SOE and  SWG that preceded...not to f@ck with your loyal early supporters. I guess they're fine with all the money the cash shop generated in the last few years. Oh well. Too bad. Wish I'd got to play that other game.

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