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33 posts found
  BadSpock

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7699

Logic be damned!

6/17/13 1:59:37 PM#21
Originally posted by Hyanmen
Originally posted by Alberel
Originally posted by superpata
Just to make it clear, Jobs can only have cross class skills from their main class and subclass right?

That's correct. Every job has a requirement to unlock; a primary class at 30 and a subclass at 15. When playing as that job you can only use cross-class skills from those two classes (in addition to the job's own skills).

Nope.

Jobs can have cross-class skills from two pre-determined subclasses. For example, Monk can have cross-class skills from Gladiator and Lancer. Paladin can have cross-class skills from Marauder and Conjurer. Etc...

So not everyone can pick up some White Mage type healing spells and such?

Kind of sad in terms of customization, but pushes players together more if each Job is more specialized - which is a good thing.

Thanks for the responses.

Another question-

Is Gladiator slower to kill stuff due to sword+shield combo like in EVERY other MMO - or can you burn through mobs as satisfyingly quickly as other more "dps" oriented classes like say Lancer or Archer?

And is the same true for the mage type or "healer" type classes?

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  Murugan

Novice Member

Joined: 4/18/08
Posts: 1567

6/17/13 2:08:54 PM#22
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by Hyanmen
Originally posted by Alberel
Originally posted by superpata
Just to make it clear, Jobs can only have cross class skills from their main class and subclass right?

That's correct. Every job has a requirement to unlock; a primary class at 30 and a subclass at 15. When playing as that job you can only use cross-class skills from those two classes (in addition to the job's own skills).

Nope.

Jobs can have cross-class skills from two pre-determined subclasses. For example, Monk can have cross-class skills from Gladiator and Lancer. Paladin can have cross-class skills from Marauder and Conjurer. Etc...

So not everyone can pick up some White Mage type healing spells and such?

Kind of sad in terms of customization, but pushes players together more if each Job is more specialized - which is a good thing.

Thanks for the responses.

Another question-

Is Gladiator slower to kill stuff due to sword+shield combo like in EVERY other MMO - or can you burn through mobs as satisfyingly quickly as other more "dps" oriented classes like say Lancer or Archer?

And is the same true for the mage type or "healer" type classes?

Everyone can equip cure, and other abilities to their CLASS, but when you equip a job to a class you lose that ability, because they are for party roles.  They specialize you into a niche so that you are uniquely beneficial to your group.

 

Gladiator can deal decent damage, but not as much as actual damage dealers.  Though damage dealers take more damage when hit, so it balances out (well except archers, I mean if we are talking solo a ranged class always has an advantage)

Conjurers have a decent set of offensive spells..

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  striderbob

Novice Member

Joined: 5/02/10
Posts: 177

6/17/13 3:37:37 PM#23
It is also worth noting that after level 10 you start getting bonus points to put into attributes, so if you're a Lancer putting points into Strength and you equip cure, your heals won't do as much as a Conjurer and vice versa.
  Homitu

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/01/09
Posts: 2039

6/17/13 8:22:55 PM#24
Originally posted by BadSpock

Here's a question - what if initially you want to "max out" a single Job to get into the high-end stuff sooner, and plan to build up your secondary/tertiary classes/jobs later on?

Are you going to be severely gimped if you don't level multiple classes to 10,20,30 etc. as you level up your "main" class/job?

Like if I want to roll Gladiator - get it to 30, bring my Conj up to 15 and unlock Paladin, then just stick with Glad/Pal to max level am I going to be severely gimped for solo and group content without having tons of cross-class options?

Thanks

I don't think anyone has an exact answer to this question, since nobody has gotten a primary class to end game with sub classes leveled and then another without sub classes leveled for comparison.  You have to assume that you'd be missing out on a ton of your utility though.  You can be sure, though, that players will definitely frown upon you clearly not having kept yourself optimized.  There's min/maxing, then there's just neglecting to progress yourself.  

There's also the fact that you either shouldn't feel left behind because you know virtually everyone else will be forced to level several classes simultaneously as well, or, if you're playing on a legacy server, you'll already be behind several max level players by default, so it wouldn't really matter.  

That said, I'm actually not sure if it'll hurt you as much in groups with your advanced job, as they are supposed to have a more defined role in the group and use their own advanced job abilities.  From my understanding, the primary class and its two sub classes (in this case, Gladiator, Conjurer, and Marauder) add more diversity without excelling in any one area, and are thus more efficient at dealing with various solo situations.  In a group, your advanced class (Paladin, in this case).

  superpata

Novice Member

Joined: 5/06/04
Posts: 190

6/17/13 8:32:18 PM#25
Originally posted by striderbob
It is also worth noting that after level 10 you start getting bonus points to put into attributes, so if you're a Lancer putting points into Strength and you equip cure, your heals won't do as much as a Conjurer and vice versa.

Ok so how do you change your class, say if you want to change to a healer class from your dps class? Besides changing weapon, how would you make up for the fact all your attributes might be distributed to support your dpser? Can you change the attributes somehow?

  Murugan

Novice Member

Joined: 4/18/08
Posts: 1567

6/17/13 8:35:42 PM#26
Originally posted by superpata
Originally posted by striderbob
It is also worth noting that after level 10 you start getting bonus points to put into attributes, so if you're a Lancer putting points into Strength and you equip cure, your heals won't do as much as a Conjurer and vice versa.

Ok so how do you change your class, say if you want to change to a healer class from your dps class? Besides changing weapon, how would you make up for the fact all your attributes might be distributed to support your dpser? Can you change the attributes somehow?

each class has its own base attributes, and then the stats you allocate are remembered by each individual class.  Also all the gear you wear for that class is remembered and automatically equipped from your Armory Chest (an inventory system with 40 spaces for each slot) but you can have multiple sets to choose from as well.

 

It is a great system, really can't think of anyway they could improve it further gameplay wise.

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  superpata

Novice Member

Joined: 5/06/04
Posts: 190

6/17/13 8:41:36 PM#27
That looks awesome, I imagine you can also "respec" those attributes if you do a silly mistake while leveling. Another question if you do not mind: Are the starting attributes for each race very important later on, or can you go with any race you want without gimping yourself in any class/job?:)
  Murugan

Novice Member

Joined: 4/18/08
Posts: 1567

6/17/13 9:29:51 PM#28
Originally posted by superpata
That looks awesome, I imagine you can also "respec" those attributes if you do a silly mistake while leveling. Another question if you do not mind: Are the starting attributes for each race very important later on, or can you go with any race you want without gimping yourself in any class/job?:)

Yes you can it just costs in-game currency like any normal MMO (this game has no cash shop)

 

No, just ignore them.  The differences mean nothing once you are 50 because there are stat caps in place, and you can also allocate your own attributes/choose your gear in a way that you will not be at a disadvantage.  However even if you kept it at the difference you start out with, by 50 that tiny difference would amount to a fraction of one percent's worth of difference in effect.  Racial differences don't grow over time, it is just what you start with.

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  superpata

Novice Member

Joined: 5/06/04
Posts: 190

6/17/13 9:39:05 PM#29
Thank you, can't wait for the next weekend:)
  Seilan

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/30/04
Posts: 804

"Blue, blue."

6/17/13 11:52:06 PM#30

Just curious -  is there going to be some way to specialize your character when it comes to jobs and such? Considering the cross skill selection is so much more restrictive when playing as a job, are we basically going to see a ton of Paladins (for instance) running around as copies of one another, or will be there be some way to differentiate ourselves, while still maintaining effectiveness?

I know you can't ever really be unique in an mmorpg like this, but it's nice to have some room for variety.

  Murugan

Novice Member

Joined: 4/18/08
Posts: 1567

6/18/13 12:19:14 AM#31
Originally posted by Seilan

Just curious -  is there going to be some way to specialize your character when it comes to jobs and such? Considering the cross skill selection is so much more restrictive when playing as a job, are we basically going to see a ton of Paladins (for instance) running around as copies of one another, or will be there be some way to differentiate ourselves, while still maintaining effectiveness?

I know you can't ever really be unique in an mmorpg like this, but it's nice to have some room for variety.

Maintaining effectiveness will depend on choosing the best skill loadout, stat allocation, and gear selection depending on the encounter (in addition to actual play).  To be unique you need to innovate a better setup than the "other paladin" that is the only real way to stand out.  Honestly there is always a better way, and a worse way.  Sometimes there are multiple ways that achieve the same outcome.  People just need to use their heads, and when in doubt engage the community for support.

 

It is not scary, and no one is forcing you to join the borg.  If someone laughs at you for proposing doing something different then they are a troll, however people who insist on doing whatever they want in a group in spite of the result are equally as bad.  It is rude to the rest of the group who may not have volunteered for a non-healing white mage's unique experiment in melee damage dealing.

 

But basically not everyone can be a unique butterfly and be just as good as everyone else.  That isn't the way it works because that isn't the way reality ever works I'm afraid.  That said don't be afraid to forge your own path as long as you are considerate of others when you are playing with them and they are depending on you.

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  Hyanmen

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/11/06
Posts: 4969

6/18/13 12:21:38 AM#32
Originally posted by Seilan

Just curious -  is there going to be some way to specialize your character when it comes to jobs and such? Considering the cross skill selection is so much more restrictive when playing as a job, are we basically going to see a ton of Paladins (for instance) running around as copies of one another, or will be there be some way to differentiate ourselves, while still maintaining effectiveness?

I know you can't ever really be unique in an mmorpg like this, but it's nice to have some room for variety.

Yes, it will be restrictive. Jobs are basically specs so one spec isn't going to be drastically different from the players of the same spec. Once more specs are released (as an example the Arcanist branching off as Summoner or Scholar in the launch) you can differentiate yourself from the rest of the players easier, by playing a unique combination of jobs.

For example, you can choose to focus on Warrior and Bard for your character, or you can decide to take up Summoner, Monk and Paladin. The more jobs branching off of classes (specs) we get, the more combinations there are to make your character's career different from the rest.

This of course also includes the crafting/gathering classes.

FF:ARR FATE grinding: People not having fun by doing something not actually intended to get to a point that doesn't really matter as fast as possible. Just so they can do the same thing over and over again to gain a piece of virtual loot.

  Seilan

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/30/04
Posts: 804

"Blue, blue."

6/18/13 2:56:11 AM#33

Thanks for the info guys, I kind of figured that's how it was. The cool thing about FFXI was the sheer amount of jobs (especially once they started adding more), so I could play a taru DRK with a less orthodox subclass and feel a bit different. Obviously I wasn't anything a min/maxer would ever approve of, but it was fun, nonetheless. I enjoy that kind of variety.

Ultimately, I just hope they eventually add in all the cool jobs that FFXI sports. I'd kill for SAM or DRK.

 

Edit: Ah, by the way, what about the itemization in the game? Is there going to be a decent variety on gear, as well as styles of it? And will we be able to find decent stuff off of mobs, or will most of it be crafted?

 Also, what about the materia system? I've heard it mentioned, but I wasn't sure on any of the specifics.

Thanks again for the info :).

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