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59 posts found
  Murugan

Novice Member

Joined: 4/18/08
Posts: 1567

4/02/13 10:59:10 AM#21
Originally posted by Keitaro333
I've read that you also have an overall rank (level). Do crafting classes count toward that? Or is that something entirely separate and no class/job has anything to do with it?

Physical Level was removed in 1.0 because under that system you were limited to one stat build basically, and it was just a mess.

 

So when you start a new class/job/craft/gathering you are level 1, but if you have others leveled you get the benefit of some of their abilities.  This is useful in crafting/gathering too as you can use boosting abilities from other crafts/gathering jobs.

http://xivpads.com/?1595680
http://guildwork.com/users/murugan

  ElRenmazuo

Elite Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 4176

4/02/13 11:12:47 AM#22
In Final Fantasy 11 I was a Dark Knight/Warrior and Sometimes Dark Knight/Thief because Subbing Thief raised dex a lot which made hits more accurate but subbing warrior maximized strength.
  flizzer

Elite Member

Joined: 11/10/12
Posts: 1212

4/02/13 11:21:10 AM#23

My first MMO experience was in Runescape and I just assumed all these type of games gave you one character who had the ability to do whatever you wanted.  I would put on mage robes and I was a mage!   I would equip a bow and I was an archer!   I absolutely loved this type of play.  I was irritated when no onther game that I played allowed me to do this.  Then I discovered you had to buy additional character slots and realized companies liked us making alts so they could sell us more space for our characters.   When I first started telling people that why can't my one character do everything I want, they would laugh at me and say , "This is an MMO".    

 

I would love to see this in Final Fantasy XIV.

 

  dave6660

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/26/08
Posts: 2344

"Next time I see you, remind me not to talk to you."

4/02/13 1:23:15 PM#24

It is a great system.  It's nice not having to repeat certain parts of the game after you've completed it (crafting for instance).  FFXI was great because not only could you level up every job on one character but they also had the job / subjob system which created so many possibilities.

"Why so serious?"
-- The Joker

  ElRenmazuo

Elite Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 4176

4/02/13 4:30:00 PM#25
What I want to know is if I wanted to level up another class will i be able to repeat all the quest i already did for the experience points?
  dreamscaper

Elite Member

Joined: 8/14/08
Posts: 1271

4/02/13 5:28:47 PM#26
This is one of the features of FFXIV that I don't particularly like. I understand that it's convenient, but I personally tend to make a character's class a part of my character's identity. Not to mention, as a roleplayer, systems like this lead me to running into a neverending supply of Mary Sue types - characters who are just so good at pretty much everything. Sure, nothing stops me from focusing on whatever class appeals to me, but it still creates an environment that promotes Mary Sue-ism and solo play.

<3

  Keitaro333

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/04/08
Posts: 36

4/02/13 5:48:50 PM#27
Originally posted by tkreep
What I want to know is if I wanted to level up another class will i be able to repeat all the quest i already did for the experience points?

No. Not the regular quests and story quests. Only repeatables, dailies and such.

 

What i want to know is, how does it work with class/job switching? (or if its NDA, how was it in v 1.0) 

If everyone can level up all the classes but use only certain abilities of each class at a time, when can you switch weapon to be a different class/set of abilities? Out of combat? X minute cooldown? In town for some cash?

  nbtscan

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/06/06
Posts: 461

4/02/13 5:49:12 PM#28
Originally posted by tkreep
What I want to know is if I wanted to level up another class will i be able to repeat all the quest i already did for the experience points?

Quests aren't repeatable.  There are levequests which are sort of like daily quests.  There will be other ways of leveling up once you run out of quests though.  Yoshi-P said they will also add more quests over time, but probably what there will be at launch is maybe enough to level 1 or 2 out of the 8 battle classes.

 

 

Originally posted by Keitaro333
 What i want to know is, how does it work with class/job switching? (or if its NDA, how was it in v 1.0) 

If everyone can level up all the classes but use only certain abilities of each class at a time, when can you switch weapon to be a different class/set of abilities? Out of combat? X minute cooldown? In town for some cash?

In 1.0, swapping your weapon changed your class and automatically equipped the abliities you had set when you were last on the class.  This had to be done out of combat, but you could do it anywhere; in fact it was common for people with multiple leveled classes to change on the fly in dungeons depending on the situation.  The abilities activated their cooldown as you changed classes so you'd have to wait for those to be available before being able to use them.  Was kind of obnoxious with the 15 minute cooldown Job specific abilities, but it did prevent abuse of the system.

I can't say whether or not it'll be the same in ARR or not.

  Br3akingDawn

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/01/11
Posts: 1316

4/02/13 10:09:25 PM#29
Originally posted by BadSpock

You know, I am starting to think more and more that the way FFXI and FFXIV do the whole "one character, switch to any combination of class/builds etc." is really the way to go.

I've got like... 3 level 85's and a level 89 in WoW I'm trying to level to 90 - but I keep finding myself seeing another player and being all like... "Man, I should level my Paladin..." or "Man, I should level my Priest..."

It's SO much work, and it is nothing but 100% redundant / nausia inducing tedium to level multiple toons through the same content over, and over, and over again.

Not to mention gearing them up, building reputation, and for the love of Jesus grinding through professions and secondaries...

I hate it.

And in the end, I want a character that heals like a Priest, Tanks like a Paladin, and DPS' like a Elemental Shaman.

#firstworldproblems I know

But I'm starting to really, really like the idea of "one character to rule them all" if anything just for the consistency.

 

 

One character all class is the best! rather than working multiple jobs on a account, you can just focus on your character and build his/her story. I also had multiple classes for wow, and it sure was lame to have to do the same achievements twice, thrice, heck 8 times!! especially when theres rewards for certain achievements!

  Magiknight

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/10/09
Posts: 744

4/02/13 10:15:18 PM#30
If you agree that an MMO should have a degree of permanence, then one toon is the best way to go. It makes you more invested in your single character. You will spend all your time working on this one character so you're invested in it. Also, everyone knows who you are. You wont want to start over with a new character because you've invested so much time and effort into this one character. If you're starting a character over again then all of the sudden you're a stranger to everyone. Starting over should be strongly discouraged in a persistent world.
  Yaevindusk

Elite Member

Joined: 9/05/10
Posts: 1221

Logic, reason and fact do not supersede human nature. Ignorance reigns without justice.

4/03/13 7:22:04 PM#31

 

There's still a reason to make alts if that's your sort of thing.  When you pick what Nation you want to start in, you'll most likely have Nation Specific quests to contend with for a short while as well.  Then there's the fact that Levequests were allotted to each character on something like a six Levequest per eight hour ratio or something.  It's likely lower than that, but this was mainly because you could earn expensive crafting materials or significant amounts of gil by doing them.  I'm not able to say how it is in Beta, but if the first version is any indication, the more characters you have the more Levequests you have access to and the more money you can make.  Though this isn't anything new, as it's a matter of how much work you put into something and the rewards you get from it.  

Hard work = guaranteed extra spoils.

In some games hard work does not always mean extra spoils, which makes me sad.  You could spend all night at something just for a chance to get an item that doesn't sell for much and you felt like you wasted the entire evening.  The less RNG something has, and the more hard, honest work it requires the better in my opinion.  Hard work will likely be well received if there is a proper reward to go hand and hand with it.

When faced with strife or discontent, the true nature of a man is brought forth. It is then when we see the character of the individual. It is then we are able to tell if he is mature enough to grin and bare it, or subject his fellow man to his complaints and woes.

  Alberel

Novice Member

Joined: 12/02/09
Posts: 1121

4/05/13 10:07:59 AM#32
Originally posted by Yaevindusk

 

There's still a reason to make alts if that's your sort of thing.  When you pick what Nation you want to start in, you'll most likely have Nation Specific quests to contend with for a short while as well.  Then there's the fact that Levequests were allotted to each character on something like a six Levequest per eight hour ratio or something.  It's likely lower than that, but this was mainly because you could earn expensive crafting materials or significant amounts of gil by doing them.  I'm not able to say how it is in Beta, but if the first version is any indication, the more characters you have the more Levequests you have access to and the more money you can make.  Though this isn't anything new, as it's a matter of how much work you put into something and the rewards you get from it.  

Hard work = guaranteed extra spoils.

In some games hard work does not always mean extra spoils, which makes me sad.  You could spend all night at something just for a chance to get an item that doesn't sell for much and you felt like you wasted the entire evening.  The less RNG something has, and the more hard, honest work it requires the better in my opinion.  Hard work will likely be well received if there is a proper reward to go hand and hand with it.

I thought they removed the limits on leves?

  nbtscan

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/06/06
Posts: 461

4/05/13 2:09:25 PM#33
Originally posted by Alberel
I thought they removed the limits on leves?

In 1.0 you could accumulate up to 99 of them, but they still accrued at the rate of 4 every 12 hours.  They haven't announced how it's changed in ARR yet.

  aesperus

Elite Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4755

4/05/13 2:17:25 PM#34
Originally posted by BadSpock

You know, I am starting to think more and more that the way FFXI and FFXIV do the whole "one character, switch to any combination of class/builds etc." is really the way to go.

I've got like... 3 level 85's and a level 89 in WoW I'm trying to level to 90 - but I keep finding myself seeing another player and being all like... "Man, I should level my Paladin..." or "Man, I should level my Priest..."

It's SO much work, and it is nothing but 100% redundant / nausia inducing tedium to level multiple toons through the same content over, and over, and over again.

Not to mention gearing them up, building reputation, and for the love of Jesus grinding through professions and secondaries...

I hate it.

And in the end, I want a character that heals like a Priest, Tanks like a Paladin, and DPS' like a Elemental Shaman.

#firstworldproblems I know

But I'm starting to really, really like the idea of "one character to rule them all" if anything just for the consistency.

You do realize that the difference between lvling multiple characters through the same content (WoW), and lvling 1 character through the same content repeatedly (FFXI) is actually quite minimal. Either way you are still repeating the same content to lvl up each class.

I do like FFXI's system, but it sounds like what you're looking for might be closer to what GW1 had. Lvl up once, and be free to customize whatever class you want. While I did enjoy FFXI's class system, it was one of the most tedious & grindy forms of class progression.

- Really the biggest difference between having one character or many, is storage space.

  sketocafe

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/19/11
Posts: 580

4/05/13 2:25:12 PM#35
I love this. My first MMO was MXO and I still don't get why most devs want me to make a completely different character just to do something different. Freedom is a good thing.
  Alberel

Novice Member

Joined: 12/02/09
Posts: 1121

4/06/13 2:46:57 AM#36

Originally posted by nbtscan

Originally posted by Alberel
I thought they removed the limits on leves?

In 1.0 you could accumulate up to 99 of them, but they still accrued at the rate of 4 every 12 hours.  They haven't announced how it's changed in ARR yet.

Ah yes, I remember now, thanks for clarifying.

Originally posted by aesperus

You do realize that the difference between lvling multiple characters through the same content (WoW), and lvling 1 character through the same content repeatedly (FFXI) is actually quite minimal. Either way you are still repeating the same content to lvl up each class.

I do like FFXI's system, but it sounds like what you're looking for might be closer to what GW1 had. Lvl up once, and be free to customize whatever class you want. While I did enjoy FFXI's class system, it was one of the most tedious & grindy forms of class progression.

- Really the biggest difference between having one character or many, is storage space.

In terms of basic gameplay yes it's not much different.

However you seem to be overlooking the fact that you never have to repeat storyline content, you never have to fight the same boss for the same drop, you are instantly recognised by everyone you meet because you still have the same name and every additional job you levelled on one character unlocked new sub-job possibilities across the board. That's all ignoring the psychological effect of always playing the same character which helps with immersion and makes the player more invested in the game.

The benefits of the system may be subtle but there are nothing but benefits. There's honestly no reason why every MMO shouldn't adopt the same system as it's just plain superior.

  Keitaro333

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/04/08
Posts: 36

4/06/13 6:58:30 AM#37
Originally posted by Alberel

However you seem to be overlooking the fact that you never have to repeat storyline content, you never have to fight the same boss for the same drop, you are instantly recognised by everyone you meet because you still have the same name and every additional job you levelled on one character unlocked new sub-job possibilities across the board. That's all ignoring the psychological effect of always playing the same character which helps with immersion and makes the player more invested in the game.

The benefits of the system may be subtle but there are nothing but benefits. There's honestly no reason why every MMO shouldn't adopt the same system as it's just plain superior.

Oh but it does have a disadvantage - i'll never play the game because i'll be stuck on the character creation screen not knowing what to pick. And when i'll say screw it, it doesnt matter that much and finally play, i'll later hate myself for not picking "that other thing". :D

I know, its just race and gender but its fun to have different ones with different armor designs and all that.

But yeah, the single character thing has many advantages.

And speaking of boss drops, how was it done in FFXI/XIV 1.0 in dungeons when looting? Do you "need" all items because theyre all theoretically usable by you? (even if you dont have said class leveled yet)  Cuz we can all see how this could be a problem in some parties.

O is it restricted by the game itself that you cant take a BOP item if you dont have the class yet?

  Alberel

Novice Member

Joined: 12/02/09
Posts: 1121

4/06/13 10:36:27 AM#38
Originally posted by Keitaro333
Originally posted by Alberel

However you seem to be overlooking the fact that you never have to repeat storyline content, you never have to fight the same boss for the same drop, you are instantly recognised by everyone you meet because you still have the same name and every additional job you levelled on one character unlocked new sub-job possibilities across the board. That's all ignoring the psychological effect of always playing the same character which helps with immersion and makes the player more invested in the game.

The benefits of the system may be subtle but there are nothing but benefits. There's honestly no reason why every MMO shouldn't adopt the same system as it's just plain superior.

Oh but it does have a disadvantage - i'll never play the game because i'll be stuck on the character creation screen not knowing what to pick. And when i'll say screw it, it doesnt matter that much and finally play, i'll later hate myself for not picking "that other thing". :D

I know, its just race and gender but its fun to have different ones with different armor designs and all that.

But yeah, the single character thing has many advantages.

And speaking of boss drops, how was it done in FFXI/XIV 1.0 in dungeons when looting? Do you "need" all items because theyre all theoretically usable by you? (even if you dont have said class leveled yet)  Cuz we can all see how this could be a problem in some parties.

O is it restricted by the game itself that you cant take a BOP item if you dont have the class yet?

I don't know how it was in XIV but in XI it was usually just down to the groups to set their own loot rules ahead of time. Typically you were only given priority on loot for your 'main' job, which was usually the job you were playing at the time, though different linkshells operated differently. It was rare to see PUGs form for slaying a boss for a specific drop though; it was nearly always a linkshell farming it for a specific member.

I'm hoping that XIV has different loot rulesets that the party leader can set at the start. In XI you played nice because if you didn't you'd probably never get another party. XIV is a little less harsh in that respect which means the game needs stronger systems in place to prevent ninja-looting.

  Xiaoki

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/07/04
Posts: 2438

4/06/13 10:55:26 AM#39


Originally posted by Epic1oots
One character all class is the best! rather than working multiple jobs on a account, you can just focus on your character and build his/her story. I also had multiple classes for wow, and it sure was lame to have to do the same achievements twice, thrice, heck 8 times!! especially when theres rewards for certain achievements!

Yeah, and that character's story is the same as everyone elses "jack of all trades, master of none".


Your character has no identity and no personality because you can freely swap between all classes.


Your character is not "Grock Highshield the Immovable Tank" its actually more like "Grock Whatever the It Doesnt Matter".

  drivendawn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/17/11
Posts: 934

4/06/13 11:29:15 AM#40
Originally posted by Xiaoki

 


Originally posted by Epic1oots
One character all class is the best! rather than working multiple jobs on a account, you can just focus on your character and build his/her story. I also had multiple classes for wow, and it sure was lame to have to do the same achievements twice, thrice, heck 8 times!! especially when theres rewards for certain achievements!


Yeah, and that character's story is the same as everyone elses "jack of all trades, master of none".

 


Your character has no identity and no personality because you can freely swap between all classes.


Your character is not "Grock Highshield the Immovable Tank" its actually more like "Grock Whatever the It Doesnt Matter".

Aaah, well I can argue that having all jobs on one character is better because I feel more invested in that one character. Also why shouldn't I be able to have multiple jobs, for some reason i'm great with a bow but can't even dream of pickinup a sword, seems ridiculously limiting to me.

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