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MMORPG | Genre:Fantasy | Status:Final  (rel 08/27/13)  | Pub:Square Enix
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37 posts found
  Theft82

Novice Member

Joined: 1/19/09
Posts: 16

An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, evil for evil. Burn away.

1/03/13 9:49:06 AM#21
Concurred. 
  Homitu

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/01/09
Posts: 2006

1/03/13 9:55:39 AM#22
Originally posted by Rhoklaw
Originally posted by jimdandy26
Its threads like this that make me glad that the players have no actual say in what the sub model will be. So much horribly wrong information on all sides.

Wrong information on all sides? Does that mean everyone is correct?

Yeah, I would definitely say every post that preceeded Jimdandy26's contained nothing more than gross hyperbole that failed to acknowledge any of the pros or cons of any of the payment models they praised or criticized.  

  Cod_Eye

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/04/09
Posts: 996

1/03/13 10:19:27 AM#23
Originally posted by Khrymson
Originally posted by Satimasu
Every type of subscription plan has their pros and cons. If they're going to charge a sub fee, they need to make it worth our while. If they do that, then we won't have a problem.

I'd have to say what SE has already done to basically remake FFXIV almost entirely over the past 2 years is more than enough to warrant the "worth our while" quote!  And many of the changes are due to listening to the community through official polls and our requests on their forums.

 

The future of XIV is to become only better with Yoshida-san at the helm...

 

83 bullet points for improvements that was fedback from testers, Yoshi is taking players seriously and respects their views.


[video]http://xivpads.com/?Cod-Eye-Ragnarok[/video]

  drivendawn

Elite Member

Joined: 4/17/11
Posts: 782

1/03/13 7:38:37 PM#24
Originally posted by Cod_Eye
Originally posted by Khrymson
Originally posted by Satimasu
Every type of subscription plan has their pros and cons. If they're going to charge a sub fee, they need to make it worth our while. If they do that, then we won't have a problem.

I'd have to say what SE has already done to basically remake FFXIV almost entirely over the past 2 years is more than enough to warrant the "worth our while" quote!  And many of the changes are due to listening to the community through official polls and our requests on their forums.

 

The future of XIV is to become only better with Yoshida-san at the helm...

 

83 bullet points for improvements that was fedback from testers, Yoshi is taking players seriously and respects their views.

Yeah, can't wait to see what changes they make in beta.

  jolting21

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/19/08
Posts: 4

1/05/13 10:00:21 AM#25
Originally posted by loudermp
Let me start by stating FFXIV is graphically the most beautiful game to date and I have not played it since the beta, but I think the game needs to change its marketing skim to buy the game and play for free, I favor this marketing which is used for Guild Wars 2 which I currently play, another game to adopt this is The Secret World which I am tempted to try now, I understand FFXIV is at least graphically better looking than these two games that is why I could see it charging more for the game, in a world dominated by free to play games I think this would be a winner marketing wise and they could still make money from a in game and online shops not to mention charging for expansions.

     I hope this game never becomes free to play. There are still many games that have a subscription to play the games and an expensive item shop. A game that is free to play like secret world has big problems. If you ever want to see the problems look at the forums. Just by looking at several posts I found the game worse than FFXIV 1.0. I understand now why they went B2P. The samething happened with many other games.

     Now lets take a look at a game that has been running for some time. WOW is free to play up to level 20, afterwards you still have to pay. Why is that, because it is a good game and is always making money. How about FFXI, well they still have not gone free to play. This is another good game and not to mentiuon the free games are overun with bots, scammers, hackers, very rude people, and many other things. This model of free to play shows me that the gaming community wants more money for a game that is less than the pay to play games.

     Games like Runes of magic, very good game and free to play. You will always find gold sellers, bots and many other problems. The game also has many bugs and they refuse to fix the bugs. To play in any of the real game content, you have to pay an absurd amount of money or spend a lot of time farming. Some of the players even spent over $1,000 from what they said to get to end game in less than a year. This game has always been free to play and if done right you can play for free forever(Just be prepared to spend half of your life getting there, lol).

     Lets look at a game that went to free to play with a subscription model. Lord of the Rings is a very good polished game. To get anywhere in the game, you will have to spend money. A lot of guilds will not let a free to play person in because they are severally limited. When i first looked at this cash shop, I found that you could get almost everything except usable gear and items dropped in the game. The game is great, but either you slowly spend money to get what you need or you are stuck. Many of the games that went this route have went this way to limit the people so much it is not really a good experience.

     Some of them have limited chat features and access to only certain classes. So in all honesty, they are not free to play. I would prefer a game like runes of magic as it is completely free content wise, you just need the gear to do it. If they make the free to play out of final fantasy, i will still pay my monthly dues as the free to play will be a cut down version of the game. If this game went free to play, it would look like this:

Players have limited chat Option: Can only say, tell, party, and guild chat. (Shout would be out)

Can only create one charater per account (This is really all you need)

Can only be certain classes (3 classes at most)

Charater has only one bag slot (so much for farming)

Charater can hold a max of 100k gold (not enough to do much with as the game gets older)

Limited to 1 raid per day (you really did not want to do more than that to get an item, lol)

Unable to make a guild (Who wants to be leader of a guild anyways, Linkshell in this game)

Limited to level 20 (You will not be able to experience any of the real content)

     These are just some of the things that these companies do to get you hooked to the game and convert you to pay to play. I want the full experience, not some knocked down version of the game. That is not fun to me and I would feel it is more of a watse of time. Not to mention sooner or later you will convert over to pay to play if you like it that much.

  drivendawn

Elite Member

Joined: 4/17/11
Posts: 782

1/05/13 10:21:37 AM#26
Originally posted by jolting21
Originally posted by loudermp
Let me start by stating FFXIV is graphically the most beautiful game to date and I have not played it since the beta, but I think the game needs to change its marketing skim to buy the game and play for free, I favor this marketing which is used for Guild Wars 2 which I currently play, another game to adopt this is The Secret World which I am tempted to try now, I understand FFXIV is at least graphically better looking than these two games that is why I could see it charging more for the game, in a world dominated by free to play games I think this would be a winner marketing wise and they could still make money from a in game and online shops not to mention charging for expansions.

     I hope this game never becomes free to play. There are still many games that have a subscription to play the games and an expensive item shop. A game that is free to play like secret world has big problems. If you ever want to see the problems look at the forums. Just by looking at several posts I found the game worse than FFXIV 1.0. I understand now why they went B2P. The samething happened with many other games.

     Now lets take a look at a game that has been running for some time. WOW is free to play up to level 20, afterwards you still have to pay. Why is that, because it is a good game and is always making money. How about FFXI, well they still have not gone free to play. This is another good game and not to mentiuon the free games are overun with bots, scammers, hackers, very rude people, and many other things. This model of free to play shows me that the gaming community wants more money for a game that is less than the pay to play games.

     Games like Runes of magic, very good game and free to play. You will always find gold sellers, bots and many other problems. The game also has many bugs and they refuse to fix the bugs. To play in any of the real game content, you have to pay an absurd amount of money or spend a lot of time farming. Some of the players even spent over $1,000 from what they said to get to end game in less than a year. This game has always been free to play and if done right you can play for free forever(Just be prepared to spend half of your life getting there, lol).

     Lets look at a game that went to free to play with a subscription model. Lord of the Rings is a very good polished game. To get anywhere in the game, you will have to spend money. A lot of guilds will not let a free to play person in because they are severally limited. When i first looked at this cash shop, I found that you could get almost everything except usable gear and items dropped in the game. The game is great, but either you slowly spend money to get what you need or you are stuck. Many of the games that went this route have went this way to limit the people so much it is not really a good experience.

     Some of them have limited chat features and access to only certain classes. So in all honesty, they are not free to play. I would prefer a game like runes of magic as it is completely free content wise, you just need the gear to do it. If they make the free to play out of final fantasy, i will still pay my monthly dues as the free to play will be a cut down version of the game. If this game went free to play, it would look like this:

Players have limited chat Option: Can only say, tell, party, and guild chat. (Shout would be out)

Can only create one charater per account (This is really all you need)

Can only be certain classes (3 classes at most)

Charater has only one bag slot (so much for farming)

Charater can hold a max of 100k gold (not enough to do much with as the game gets older)

Limited to 1 raid per day (you really did not want to do more than that to get an item, lol)

Unable to make a guild (Who wants to be leader of a guild anyways, Linkshell in this game)

Limited to level 20 (You will not be able to experience any of the real content)

     These are just some of the things that these companies do to get you hooked to the game and convert you to pay to play. I want the full experience, not some knocked down version of the game. That is not fun to me and I would feel it is more of a watse of time. Not to mention sooner or later you will convert over to pay to play if you like it that much.

You said it much more articulately than I could have agree 100%

  User Deleted
1/06/13 6:48:48 PM#27
Originally posted by Silok
Originally posted by loudermp
Let me start by stating FFXIV is graphically the most beautiful game to date and I have not played it since the beta, but I think the game needs to change its marketing skim to buy the game and play for free, I favor this marketing which is used for Guild Wars 2 which I currently play, another game to adopt this is The Secret World which I am tempted to try now, I understand FFXIV is at least graphically better looking than these two games that is why I could see it charging more for the game, in a world dominated by free to play games I think this would be a winner marketing wise and they could still make money from a in game and online shops not to mention charging for expansions.

I dont agree at all, i prefer by far i sub fee. The reason is simple, better customers services, the sub fee prevent the gold seller to screw witht he economics, at least with SE, Final fantasy XI as proven this.

In GW2 customers services suck and the game is plagued with bots and they dont do nothing about it and this. Final fantasy is a pure sub game without cashshop so this is the best option for me.

If someone cant spend 15$ a month for a mmorpg, they can stick witht the F2P or B2P games, that ok but for me 15$ for a game withtout cashshop its perfect.

Now if FFXIV can be a game who will can keep me playing for month i give them my 15$ a month without a blink and i will even give more if it where needed. Time will tell.

 

You are so wrong I don't even know where to begin. 

Better customer service? We're talking about SE. Did you play their first MMO? Not very many people have nice things to say about SE customer support. 

And just what in the hell are you talking about RMT not being able to interfere with the economy in a P2P game like FFXI? Have you set foot in Dreamland Dynamis in the last three years? It's a bunch of invisible BSTs with Dipper Yuly. It a gigantic swarm of RMT Ladybugs. No? How about FC leech parties run by RMT that charge 500k/5 hours? SE actively battles RMT, but there's still a metric shitton of RMT in FFXI, which is several orders of magnitude less than there used to be when the game was more popular.

Ever hear of claimbots when everybody camped ground kings and drops weren't rare/ex? How about the fishing bots that basically forced SE to re-design fishing? How about the multi-tool Mr. Argus? How about Spellcasting .xml's? FFXI is botted and hacked all to hell and has been for a long time. 

I don't mind if FFXIV is F2P or P2P. I'll play either way, but you, good sir, have no clue what the hell you're talking about. 

 

 

  Snowdon_Cloudripper

Novice Member

Joined: 11/10/12
Posts: 604

I was a 5 star elite member but my awesomeness was showing and the Mods cant have that

1/06/13 8:28:08 PM#28

This is nonsence . SE already said the game will be Sub based. If you goto ALL the info page i made Yoshi states the reasons why. He said the reason why is because FFXIV was going to have a Sub base anyway before it failed. It went almost 2 full years free to play wile they were fixing it. Then charged a fee for it. SE gave the players who stayed with it Legacy status . Witch is a discount on the month fee + credits in the new game. Yoshi has said because a Sub based game offers more for the play and company. SE is beholden to no outside or 3rd party investors , So there is no rush to make money to pay the investors . With a Sub fee SE can take the money and invest it back in the game witch means we will get more  better updates , more content , more Expanision packs , in less time. When XI came out 10 years ago it has had now 5 or 6 Major Exp packs , and new content added every 2 or 3 months from Seasonal events , to Lore events . 15$ USD breaks down to .50cents a day or &3.50 a week . If you have a job and work say part time 24 hours a week and make $6.00 per hour in one week you have made $144 . Subtract tax your looking at about $118 ~ $124 depending on where you live. Subtract $3.50 a week for the game your at $114.50 ~$120.5 pay a week. Or more over per month you make $472 ~$496 and a month fee of $15 makes it $457 ~ $481 . Now i am sure most i would guess 98% of us make more then 6$ an hour and work more then 24 hours a week . If you dont have a job....Thats your own fault dont bring the rest of us down because you cant afford to play the game. And if your a child then thats your parents call. NO ONE is entitled to play FFXIV:ARR .

 

From my Post

#12 VG24/7 interview with Yoshi - P http://www.vg247.com/2012/11/19/final-fantasy-xiv-a-realm-reborn-squares-second-chance/ *MARRIAGE , WHY THE GAME IS P2P*

Read it.

 

Now for a great Marketing idea . SE needs to attack the commerical TV waves hard , Mix in the End of a Realm video that made us all shead a tear , and the New Realm with awesome combat and a sence of community to win over the masses. Having the PS3 version launch at the sametime Will help a lot on that front

http://absoluteretribution.enjin.com/ Guild Website and Recruitment link

  Snowdon_Cloudripper

Novice Member

Joined: 11/10/12
Posts: 604

I was a 5 star elite member but my awesomeness was showing and the Mods cant have that

1/06/13 8:33:27 PM#29
Originally posted by ezpz77
Originally posted by Silok
Originally posted by loudermp
Let me start by stating FFXIV is graphically the most beautiful game to date and I have not played it since the beta, but I think the game needs to change its marketing skim to buy the game and play for free, I favor this marketing which is used for Guild Wars 2 which I currently play, another game to adopt this is The Secret World which I am tempted to try now, I understand FFXIV is at least graphically better looking than these two games that is why I could see it charging more for the game, in a world dominated by free to play games I think this would be a winner marketing wise and they could still make money from a in game and online shops not to mention charging for expansions.

I dont agree at all, i prefer by far i sub fee. The reason is simple, better customers services, the sub fee prevent the gold seller to screw witht he economics, at least with SE, Final fantasy XI as proven this.

In GW2 customers services suck and the game is plagued with bots and they dont do nothing about it and this. Final fantasy is a pure sub game without cashshop so this is the best option for me.

If someone cant spend 15$ a month for a mmorpg, they can stick witht the F2P or B2P games, that ok but for me 15$ for a game withtout cashshop its perfect.

Now if FFXIV can be a game who will can keep me playing for month i give them my 15$ a month without a blink and i will even give more if it where needed. Time will tell.

 

You are so wrong I don't even know where to begin. 

Better customer service? We're talking about SE. Did you play their first MMO? Not very many people have nice things to say about SE customer support. 

And just what in the hell are you talking about RMT not being able to interfere with the economy in a P2P game like FFXI? Have you set foot in Dreamland Dynamis in the last three years? It's a bunch of invisible BSTs with Dipper Yuly. It a gigantic swarm of RMT Ladybugs. No? How about FC leech parties run by RMT that charge 500k/5 hours? SE actively battles RMT, but there's still a metric shitton of RMT in FFXI, which is several orders of magnitude less than there used to be when the game was more popular.

Ever hear of claimbots when everybody camped ground kings and drops weren't rare/ex? How about the fishing bots that basically forced SE to re-design fishing? How about the multi-tool Mr. Argus? How about Spellcasting .xml's? FFXI is botted and hacked all to hell and has been for a long time. 

I don't mind if FFXIV is F2P or P2P. I'll play either way, but you, good sir, have no clue what the hell you're talking about. 

 

 

Lol i remember when XI was filled with bots.  and RMTs it was fun getting a whole LS to try to out claim a RMT for Leaping boots , Or the Yag in Castle Oz. Punisher i think it was. ( thats going way back) i remember when they added the gobs to the fishing spots , then added "you caught a monster" . RMTs will be in every game there is no way around that. Until people stop buying Gil and earning it . How someone can justify shelling out 100's of $s for fake money is beyond me.

http://absoluteretribution.enjin.com/ Guild Website and Recruitment link

  AlBQuirky

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 1/24/05
Posts: 2710

Tomorrow's just a future yesterday...

1/06/13 8:34:00 PM#30


Originally posted by Silok
If someone cant spend 15$ a month for a mmorpg, they can stick witht the F2P or B2P games, that ok but for me 15$ for a game withtout cashshop its perfect.

My thoughts exactly!

- Al

Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
- FARGIN_WAR

  Snowdon_Cloudripper

Novice Member

Joined: 11/10/12
Posts: 604

I was a 5 star elite member but my awesomeness was showing and the Mods cant have that

1/06/13 8:43:18 PM#31

More over the direct Quotes from Yoshi

"With A Realm Reborn, Yoshida is certainly playing a long game, but we asked him if – in a world now obsessed with the notion of free-to-play, sticking to a subscription model is a potential mistake waiting to happen.

He replied, “The main reason why we haven’t decided to take the free-to-play option is that, at the game’s original launch, it didn’t live up to expectations and it let down a lot of fans. We lost the trust of fans who had followed us across our 25-year history. We want to regain that trust and to deliver on past promises.

“One of the promises we originally stated was that we would release the game with a subscription model. Players will be able to play it 24 hours a day, seven days a week, 365 days in the year if they paid a subscription fee. So to regain the trust of our players we must of course fulfil this promise. Right now we believe that to be more important than any kind of business decision.

“The other thing is that – depending on what kind of game you have – its hard to say which model is better. Is free-to-play better? Are subscriptions better? It just really depends, and it’s hard to say which one is better.

“The last thing is that our aim is to make an MMO, and a lot of companies do their development for MMOs by getting money from investors. Then the investors want their money back, so if the game doesn’t make enough money or doesn’t have enough users, then what do we do?

“We’d have to pay our investors back, and free-to-play is an option to get that money back to investors quickly. Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn is a product that is independent to Square-Enix. All of the money’s coming from us, so we had more time to put it into what we wanted to do. We’re not in a rush to pay anyone back.”

When Yoshida framed his response at the time, his methodology for sticking to subscriptions made sense, but now we’ve slept on it a while, we’re still not entirely convinced. Perhaps free-to-play MMOs really are putting on a brave face, chipping away at colossal debt with microtransaction revenue? "

 

Now end the silly F2P notions it will never happen at least not right away. If the game Fails again then maybe , but i do not see that happining

http://absoluteretribution.enjin.com/ Guild Website and Recruitment link

  Silok

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/22/06
Posts: 741

1/07/13 1:40:57 AM#32
Originally posted by ezpz77
Originally posted by Silok
Originally posted by loudermp
Let me start by stating FFXIV is graphically the most beautiful game to date and I have not played it since the beta, but I think the game needs to change its marketing skim to buy the game and play for free, I favor this marketing which is used for Guild Wars 2 which I currently play, another game to adopt this is The Secret World which I am tempted to try now, I understand FFXIV is at least graphically better looking than these two games that is why I could see it charging more for the game, in a world dominated by free to play games I think this would be a winner marketing wise and they could still make money from a in game and online shops not to mention charging for expansions.

I dont agree at all, i prefer by far i sub fee. The reason is simple, better customers services, the sub fee prevent the gold seller to screw witht he economics, at least with SE, Final fantasy XI as proven this.

In GW2 customers services suck and the game is plagued with bots and they dont do nothing about it and this. Final fantasy is a pure sub game without cashshop so this is the best option for me.

If someone cant spend 15$ a month for a mmorpg, they can stick witht the F2P or B2P games, that ok but for me 15$ for a game withtout cashshop its perfect.

Now if FFXIV can be a game who will can keep me playing for month i give them my 15$ a month without a blink and i will even give more if it where needed. Time will tell.

 

You are so wrong I don't even know where to begin. 

Better customer service? We're talking about SE. Did you play their first MMO? Not very many people have nice things to say about SE customer support. 

And just what in the hell are you talking about RMT not being able to interfere with the economy in a P2P game like FFXI? Have you set foot in Dreamland Dynamis in the last three years? It's a bunch of invisible BSTs with Dipper Yuly. It a gigantic swarm of RMT Ladybugs. No? How about FC leech parties run by RMT that charge 500k/5 hours? SE actively battles RMT, but there's still a metric shitton of RMT in FFXI, which is several orders of magnitude less than there used to be when the game was more popular.

Ever hear of claimbots when everybody camped ground kings and drops weren't rare/ex? How about the fishing bots that basically forced SE to re-design fishing? How about the multi-tool Mr. Argus? How about Spellcasting .xml's? FFXI is botted and hacked all to hell and has been for a long time. 

I don't mind if FFXIV is F2P or P2P. I'll play either way, but you, good sir, have no clue what the hell you're talking about. 

 

 

Blah blah blah .... this is all i read in your post. I play FFXI right now and this game is not plague by gold seller like in any other mmo. I dont see one any message from gold seller in global chat ever. Sometime you will see a GWGJDD telling you in private but this will happen like 1 times in two weeks.

I dont mind good sir what you think but for me SE has good customer services, they put a lots of effort for banning bots and gold sellers with features like the fatigue fishing system, they have remove there free trial exactly because it was too easy for gold sellers to plague the game etc etc.

There will always bots and gold sellers in mmo but at leats in FFXI the amount is a lot less then in any f2p or b2p games. This was the real subject of this topics by the way.

  User Deleted
1/07/13 2:14:15 AM#33
Originally posted by Silok
Originally posted by ezpz77
Originally posted by Silok
Originally posted by loudermp
Let me start by stating FFXIV is graphically the most beautiful game to date and I have not played it since the beta, but I think the game needs to change its marketing skim to buy the game and play for free, I favor this marketing which is used for Guild Wars 2 which I currently play, another game to adopt this is The Secret World which I am tempted to try now, I understand FFXIV is at least graphically better looking than these two games that is why I could see it charging more for the game, in a world dominated by free to play games I think this would be a winner marketing wise and they could still make money from a in game and online shops not to mention charging for expansions.

I dont agree at all, i prefer by far i sub fee. The reason is simple, better customers services, the sub fee prevent the gold seller to screw witht he economics, at least with SE, Final fantasy XI as proven this.

In GW2 customers services suck and the game is plagued with bots and they dont do nothing about it and this. Final fantasy is a pure sub game without cashshop so this is the best option for me.

If someone cant spend 15$ a month for a mmorpg, they can stick witht the F2P or B2P games, that ok but for me 15$ for a game withtout cashshop its perfect.

Now if FFXIV can be a game who will can keep me playing for month i give them my 15$ a month without a blink and i will even give more if it where needed. Time will tell.

 

You are so wrong I don't even know where to begin. 

Better customer service? We're talking about SE. Did you play their first MMO? Not very many people have nice things to say about SE customer support. 

And just what in the hell are you talking about RMT not being able to interfere with the economy in a P2P game like FFXI? Have you set foot in Dreamland Dynamis in the last three years? It's a bunch of invisible BSTs with Dipper Yuly. It a gigantic swarm of RMT Ladybugs. No? How about FC leech parties run by RMT that charge 500k/5 hours? SE actively battles RMT, but there's still a metric shitton of RMT in FFXI, which is several orders of magnitude less than there used to be when the game was more popular.

Ever hear of claimbots when everybody camped ground kings and drops weren't rare/ex? How about the fishing bots that basically forced SE to re-design fishing? How about the multi-tool Mr. Argus? How about Spellcasting .xml's? FFXI is botted and hacked all to hell and has been for a long time. 

I don't mind if FFXIV is F2P or P2P. I'll play either way, but you, good sir, have no clue what the hell you're talking about. 

 

 

Blah blah blah .... this is all i read in your post. I play FFXI right now and this game is not plague by gold seller like in any other mmo. I dont see one any message from gold seller in global chat ever. Sometime you will see a GWGJDD telling you in private but this will happen like 1 times in two weeks.

I dont mind good sir what you think but for me SE has good customer services, they put a lots of effort for banning bots and gold sellers with features like the fatigue fishing system, they have remove there free trial exactly because it was too easy for gold sellers to plague the game etc etc.

There will always bots and gold sellers in mmo but at leats in FFXI the amount is a lot less then in any f2p or b2p games. This was the real subject of this topics by the way.

 

Blah blah blah? I gave you examples of things that go on every single day. I can take you into Dreamlands and show you the Dipper Yuly swarm if you want. You're free to go read FFXIAH shouts for FC PT's that are run 24/7 by RMT. You can find archived claimbots and information about Mr. Argus. I can give you tons of examples of out-of-game scripting that utilizes Spellcasting which is a plug-in for a 3rd party program. Just because you don't see these things going on, or the fact that you don't get spammed by gold sellers doesn't mean that it's not going on, which it very clearly is if you care to look. 

FFXI had a HUGE bot problem that didn't just vanish because people were paying a sub. It's gotten a lot better now, but I suspect that it would after a DECADE of fighting against them. 

Might I remind you that in FFXIV, from launch until the time it closed, there were bot armies at aetherytes chain running leves. Massive groups of Taru's named, "awerlkjas" and other nonsense would be swarmed around a camp. The proliferation of crafting bots was ridiculous. Mostly because all you needed was a controller with a turbo function, but I digress.

 

On to the real subject of your posts, "FFXI has less bots than any F2P or B2P game because it is P2P and the same will apply to FFXIV." You have no way of qualifying that statement with any type of information. Just because you're paying a sub doesn't mean there's going to be less RMTs. That's called a logical fallacy, and is a really terrible and weak justification. 

 

I'm a huge fan of SE, FFXI, and can't wait for FFXIV, but your reasoning for FFXIV having a sub fee is plain wrong. Paying a sub will not automatically give you better customer service nor will it magically eliminate bots/RMT. Some of the most financially profitable games in the world are F2P i.e. LoL and they work very hard to eliminate hacks. Just call it what it is: SE is most experienced with a sub game and want to give P2P a chance to work before going F2P. 

  Silok

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/22/06
Posts: 741

1/07/13 2:43:41 AM#34
Originally posted by ezpz77
 

Blah blah blah? I gave you examples of things that go on every single day. I can take you into Dreamlands and show you the Dipper Yuly swarm if you want. You're free to go read FFXIAH shouts for FC PT's that are run 24/7 by RMT. You can find archived claimbots and information about Mr. Argus. I can give you tons of examples of out-of-game scripting that utilizes Spellcasting which is a plug-in for a 3rd party program. Just because you don't see these things going on, or the fact that you don't get spammed by gold sellers doesn't mean that it's not going on, which it very clearly is if you care to look. 

This is exaclty why is said blah blah blah.. i never say the game was 100% free of bots, i said the game ist plague by bots like f2p or b2p games.

FFXI had a HUGE bot problem that didn't just vanish because people were paying a sub. It's gotten a lot better now, but I suspect that it would after a DECADE of fighting against them. 

10 years old f2p games are still full of of gold sellers spaming the chat.. why? cause these devs games doesnt do shit about these problems. Why would they? the game is free.

Might I remind you that in FFXIV, from launch until the time it closed, there were bot armies at aetherytes chain running leves. Massive groups of Taru's named, "awerlkjas" and other nonsense would be swarmed around a camp. The proliferation of crafting bots was ridiculous. Mostly because all you needed was a controller with a turbo function, but I digress.

 

On to the real subject of your posts, "FFXI has less bots than any F2P or B2P game because it is P2P and the same will apply to FFXIV." You have no way of qualifying that statement with any type of information. Just because you're paying a sub doesn't mean there's going to be less RMTs. That's called a logical fallacy, and is a really terrible and weak justification. 

Omg did you just said logical fallacy? why people need to use this word when they trying to make a point? A fallacy is a way to lost people in a conversation by saying platitude, so after a while people have lost the real subject of the topics and btw this is exaclty what you do here. So this is quite ironics for you to use this word dont you think?

 Now to get back on topiyou will see sub game with a lots of spam too, that just mean the devs doesnt care about it, SE care about it so they fighting it.

If a games has sub, devs will care way more so yes with a sub you have more chance to see less gold sellers or bots.

I'm a huge fan of SE, FFXI, and can't wait for FFXIV, but your reasoning for FFXIV having a sub fee is plain wrong. Paying a sub will not automatically give you better customer service nor will it magically eliminate bots/RMT. Some of the most financially profitable games in the world are F2P i.e. LoL and they work very hard to eliminate hacks. Just call it what it is: SE is most experienced with a sub game and want to give P2P a chance to work before going F2P. 

Again no one said a sub will magically eliminate bots/RMT, but it will help again it. You said the most financially profitable games in the world are the F2P games, well do you have something to prove that back? dont bother anyway i dont care cause one thing i know is all f2p are way more plague by bots then sub games.

 

 

  User Deleted
1/07/13 3:35:26 PM#35
Originally posted by Silok
Originally posted by ezpz77
 

Blah blah blah? I gave you examples of things that go on every single day. I can take you into Dreamlands and show you the Dipper Yuly swarm if you want. You're free to go read FFXIAH shouts for FC PT's that are run 24/7 by RMT. You can find archived claimbots and information about Mr. Argus. I can give you tons of examples of out-of-game scripting that utilizes Spellcasting which is a plug-in for a 3rd party program. Just because you don't see these things going on, or the fact that you don't get spammed by gold sellers doesn't mean that it's not going on, which it very clearly is if you care to look. 

This is exaclty why is said blah blah blah.. i never say the game was 100% free of bots, i said the game ist plague by bots like f2p or b2p games.

FFXI had a HUGE bot problem that didn't just vanish because people were paying a sub. It's gotten a lot better now, but I suspect that it would after a DECADE of fighting against them. 

10 years old f2p games are still full of of gold sellers spaming the chat.. why? cause these devs games doesnt do shit about these problems. Why would they? the game is free.

Might I remind you that in FFXIV, from launch until the time it closed, there were bot armies at aetherytes chain running leves. Massive groups of Taru's named, "awerlkjas" and other nonsense would be swarmed around a camp. The proliferation of crafting bots was ridiculous. Mostly because all you needed was a controller with a turbo function, but I digress.

 

On to the real subject of your posts, "FFXI has less bots than any F2P or B2P game because it is P2P and the same will apply to FFXIV." You have no way of qualifying that statement with any type of information. Just because you're paying a sub doesn't mean there's going to be less RMTs. That's called a logical fallacy, and is a really terrible and weak justification. 

Omg did you just said logical fallacy? why people need to use this word when they trying to make a point? A fallacy is a way to lost people in a conversation by saying platitude, so after a while people have lost the real subject of the topics and btw this is exaclty what you do here. So this is quite ironics for you to use this word dont you think?

 Now to get back on topiyou will see sub game with a lots of spam too, that just mean the devs doesnt care about it, SE care about it so they fighting it.

If a games has sub, devs will care way more so yes with a sub you have more chance to see less gold sellers or bots.

I'm a huge fan of SE, FFXI, and can't wait for FFXIV, but your reasoning for FFXIV having a sub fee is plain wrong. Paying a sub will not automatically give you better customer service nor will it magically eliminate bots/RMT. Some of the most financially profitable games in the world are F2P i.e. LoL and they work very hard to eliminate hacks. Just call it what it is: SE is most experienced with a sub game and want to give P2P a chance to work before going F2P. 

Again no one said a sub will magically eliminate bots/RMT, but it will help again it. You said the most financially profitable games in the world are the F2P games, well do you have something to prove that back? dont bother anyway i dont care cause one thing i know is all f2p are way more plague by bots then sub games.

 

 

 

[mod edit]

FFXI had and still has a bunch of RMT and botting, scripting, hacking etc. I've listed several examples of things you can go and see for yourself.

FFXIV, like every other MMO regardless of business model, will be infested with RMT, bots, hacks, exploits etc.

The conclusion that P2P games have less problems with RMT, bots, and hacking because of the sub fee is completely false. Look at World of Warcraft for an example. I've seen gold selling sites spelled out with level 1 corpses in the main city. You say P2P games that do have problems with RMT like World of Warcraft are run by people who just don't care, which is also utter bullshit.

I'm done arguing this with you. Your idea of RMT and botting being less of a problem soley because of a sub fee is garbage. SE is not making this game P2P so they can better battle RMT and bots. They don't care about the game any more or any less based on their business model.

  drivendawn

Elite Member

Joined: 4/17/11
Posts: 782

1/07/13 5:31:00 PM#36
Originally posted by ezpz77
Originally posted by Silok
Originally posted by ezpz77
 

Blah blah blah? I gave you examples of things that go on every single day. I can take you into Dreamlands and show you the Dipper Yuly swarm if you want. You're free to go read FFXIAH shouts for FC PT's that are run 24/7 by RMT. You can find archived claimbots and information about Mr. Argus. I can give you tons of examples of out-of-game scripting that utilizes Spellcasting which is a plug-in for a 3rd party program. Just because you don't see these things going on, or the fact that you don't get spammed by gold sellers doesn't mean that it's not going on, which it very clearly is if you care to look. 

This is exaclty why is said blah blah blah.. i never say the game was 100% free of bots, i said the game ist plague by bots like f2p or b2p games.

FFXI had a HUGE bot problem that didn't just vanish because people were paying a sub. It's gotten a lot better now, but I suspect that it would after a DECADE of fighting against them. 

10 years old f2p games are still full of of gold sellers spaming the chat.. why? cause these devs games doesnt do shit about these problems. Why would they? the game is free.

Might I remind you that in FFXIV, from launch until the time it closed, there were bot armies at aetherytes chain running leves. Massive groups of Taru's named, "awerlkjas" and other nonsense would be swarmed around a camp. The proliferation of crafting bots was ridiculous. Mostly because all you needed was a controller with a turbo function, but I digress.

 

On to the real subject of your posts, "FFXI has less bots than any F2P or B2P game because it is P2P and the same will apply to FFXIV." You have no way of qualifying that statement with any type of information. Just because you're paying a sub doesn't mean there's going to be less RMTs. That's called a logical fallacy, and is a really terrible and weak justification. 

Omg did you just said logical fallacy? why people need to use this word when they trying to make a point? A fallacy is a way to lost people in a conversation by saying platitude, so after a while people have lost the real subject of the topics and btw this is exaclty what you do here. So this is quite ironics for you to use this word dont you think?

 Now to get back on topiyou will see sub game with a lots of spam too, that just mean the devs doesnt care about it, SE care about it so they fighting it.

If a games has sub, devs will care way more so yes with a sub you have more chance to see less gold sellers or bots.

I'm a huge fan of SE, FFXI, and can't wait for FFXIV, but your reasoning for FFXIV having a sub fee is plain wrong. Paying a sub will not automatically give you better customer service nor will it magically eliminate bots/RMT. Some of the most financially profitable games in the world are F2P i.e. LoL and they work very hard to eliminate hacks. Just call it what it is: SE is most experienced with a sub game and want to give P2P a chance to work before going F2P. 

Again no one said a sub will magically eliminate bots/RMT, but it will help again it. You said the most financially profitable games in the world are the F2P games, well do you have something to prove that back? dont bother anyway i dont care cause one thing i know is all f2p are way more plague by bots then sub games.

 

 

 

[mod edit]

FFXI had and still has a bunch of RMT and botting, scripting, hacking etc. I've listed several examples of things you can go and see for yourself.

FFXIV, like every other MMO regardless of business model, will be infested with RMT, bots, hacks, exploits etc.

The conclusion that P2P games have less problems with RMT, bots, and hacking because of the sub fee is completely false. Look at World of Warcraft for an example. I've seen gold selling sites spelled out with level 1 corpses in the main city. You say P2P games that do have problems with RMT like World of Warcraft are run by people who just don't care, which is also utter bullshit.

I'm done arguing this with you. Your idea of RMT and botting being less of a problem soley because of a sub fee is garbage. SE is not making this game P2P so they can better battle RMT and bots. They don't care about the game any more or any less based on their business model.

Sorry have to respectfully disagree, I have played a ton of different MMO's, free and PTP and the FTP were the ones i saw the most RMT. Alot of times they filled my chat log wether in city or not , didnt see that nearly as much in my PTP games.

  Divinefairy

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/03/11
Posts: 67

1/07/13 5:55:04 PM#37

i think WoW is quite the exception to any rule.  So let's leave it out of the equation.

I agree that P2P impacts RMT volume, as devs have more financial resources to combat the issues.

In general I have personally found that P2P games have less spam and bot volume that F2P games such as Rappelz or Flyff, regnarok.

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