Originally posted by t0nyd

MMO stands for massive multiplayer online, so I guess it all depends on what you would consider massive. Games are usually only 5v5, but there are probably thousands of people logged in and playing at any given time. I can find a game at any time of the day. I used to play guild wars and when you are playing in RA or TA its actually smaller than playing in a LoL arena.

 

Well by that definition the following games are MMO'S as well:

Supreme commander 1 & 2 [i regually play on maps with 7 others  ]

Guildwars [the devs of guildwars also agree its not a MMO]

All Alien v Predator games.

Unreal Tournament.

Counterstrike.

And so on.....

To correct your definition i shall say that if this example of yours i highlighted was to become a true mmo those "thousands of people" as you put it would all need to be able to interact with there toons in the same maps at the same time. And not just in some chat room.

League of Legends is ok. It would be a much better game if not a good third of it's community would consist of nerd raging kids. As soon as they are not clearly winning (and sometimes way before even that) they start insulting the opponents and their teammates and blaming each other and complaining and what not. It's horrible. I had people in that game who insulted their teammembers less than 5 seconds after the game started. Sure, there is a block list, but I'd prefer any gm or similiarto sometimes warn or temporarily (or permanently) ban people for beeing so offensive.

Also the matchmaking process, where the program tries to put people against each other in such a way that the teams are fair, seems flawed at times. Like yesterday, I played a round of LoL. I'm lvl 20 in that game, and was put up against a premade team of lvl 30s meaning they knew each other, probably beeing in ts/vent/mumble/skype or something, have a strategy involving champ selection and so on) while I never saw my teammates before. And from the first minute on, two guys in my team started insulting everyone else: opponents, teammates, whatever. Then I noticed they knew each other too, so the game obviously thought "if you have two people in your team that know each other, I can let you fight against a premade team as well". Yeah that worked... not. Especially when I had to put those two guys on my ignore list for the constant insults (and they were bad players too).

Or like, when you are new to the game, the matchmaker tries to put you in a team with other newbies against an opposing team of newbies. And what will happen? Right, people will insult each other as newbies in the game. /facepalm

So the game is free. It has a cash shop, but none of the cash shop items has a direct impact no the combat, and everything (apart from some stuff like skins) can be optained by playing at reasonable pace.

Yeah the game is fun, despite it having only two maps (one for 5vs5 and one for 3vs3) matches. But the community is horrible, one of the worst I have ever seen. The european one seems to be a bit less horrible than the US one, but they're both still abyssmal. Sometimes while playing, I lose all urge to try hard to play well, because my insulting teammates simply don't deserve to win. I mean, will I play better for friendly people I like, or for immature raging brats?

There seems to be a similiar game in beta status right now (heroes of newerth or something), I applied to the beta but got no key so far. Oh well...

LoL is fun in small doses as it's impossible to bear the community for a longer time.

Edit:
Oh yeah, and not to mention people who join a game but are afk from start. Yes, they might have computer problems. Or they just let the game run in the background to get some points (even on game loss). Or people who quit the game or go afk as soon as they died a few times. Or the other way round: when you and your team clearly lost, and the opponents are simply teasing you and could wipe you out when they want you, but instead of using the surrender option and move on to the next game, some of your teammates shout "no, we can still win! Oh, I died again... but we can still win!!". T_T

Edit:
And it's no "MMO", as 5vs5 is hardly "massive".

Edit:
Oh, and the game is buggy. Like often the chat doesn't work in the screen where you choose champs and spells and such before the game starts. Which means that you can't ask teammates stuff like "do you tank?" or "are you sure you want to use that spell, it's useless" or "which position on the map you want to start at?" and similiar, all that doesn't work more than half of the time. So you are left to stare at horrible choices and can't do anything about it.
Not to mention the people who look at the champs of their teammates and then leave the game if the team is not made up by the champs they consider to be the best. T_T 
Oh, and not to mention the people who completly don't use any sort of communication during the game. They totally ignore the chat or marks you set on the minimap or whatnot. Those games are horrible too. You see your teammates run intro traps, buy horrible equipment and behave like lemmings, and you can't do anything about that because they ignore the chat, because the boring letters ain't as interesting as the colorful stuff that's going on at the rest of the screen.
And the amount of teamplay is limited as well. For example, you place invisible wards in the game, that reveal nearby territory for you and your teammates for several minutes. They're great, they let you and your team know where the opponent, is preventing them from ganking you, and allowing you to gank them in return or get out of their way or whatever. Those wards cost a tiny amount of gold in the game. Yes, I see maybe once every 20 games or so a player to buy one of them. Why? Because they don't help your char to become the uber-super-slayer, they're no fancy swords or something for your champ, they "just" help your team. And so the people won't spend these lousy tiny amounts of gold for the wards when they could decide games. Teamplay my ass. T_T

If this is here, where is Heroes of Newerth?

They are both based off of Dota.

They both have horrible communitys. (Its the dota community, it has been voted by far the worst.)

The only diffrences are as follows.

1. HoN has no Runes.

2.LoL has many more "Unique" Heroes

3.LoL has an Item shop.

4. In HoN you can deny creatures, to create a more skill based laning phase.

5. HoN does not have super powerful towers so a early rush is possible.

If LoL is here, why isn't HoN?

It is odd that league of legends (and many other games) are listed on this site.  There is a clear debate on many games' mesage boards here about whether they should be listed as MMO's or not...

I believe this site should "define" what it calls an MMORPG and list only those games...  If not, just rename the domain to computergames.com...

---

Originally posted by pdavey

It is odd that league of legends (and many other games) are listed on this site.  There is a clear debate on many games' mesage boards here about whether they should be listed as MMO's or not...

 

I believe this site should "define" what it calls an MMORPG and list only those games...  If not, just rename the domain to computergames.com...

---

200+ players playing together on a server is the entry point of a MMO in my book. LoL defiantly is a far cry from a MMO tho it does contain some RPG elements.

This is simply a question about how you interpret things.

LoL has the summoner system. So you can customize your avatar with Levels, Masteries (Talents), Runes, And Summoner spells.

So there we have the persistent avatar / character coverd.

And i would say a persistent world dosent need to be graphically generated. And LoL has the chat / friends system.

A network of chatrooms, but still i can interact with other players and there are large chat rooms where more then 200+ people gather at given times.

And while in a game instance you can still interact with people outside of it.

And there you have the persistent world.

The champions you play are also very strong characters with some customability, making roleplaying very easy for those that want. Thats the RPG part coverd.

So i fit it to a MMORPG.

Can someone make a compare between LoL and HoN?

Originally posted by iZakaroN

Can someone make a compare between LoL and HoN?

I can tell you how i compare the two. I played both for about a month each.

The major difference between the games is the pace. HoN is passive gaming and you sit around playing very defensive, Trying to score those last kills and denying all those creeps / towers. Sometimes there are nice group fights etc wich are quite enjoyable. Id say this is the game most like DoTA of the two.

And LoL is a fast paced game, you start killing directly. Group fights happen all the time. You have a mana pool that allows for more spells to be cast and such the game is always in full throttle. LoL also has the Summoner system wich adds another layer of strategy.

As for me LoL is the obvious winner.

Originally posted by iZakaroN

Can someone make a compare between LoL and HoN?

HoN is nearly a carbon copy of DotA. The meta game and map are identical, and the majority of heroes have been directly lifted from DotA, although HoN has added some heroes. LoL is a completely new game developed from scratch.

Both games have several maps, with the most commonly played map being the three laned map with outer/mid/inner towers made famous by DotA. There are differences between the maps though. Firstly LoL's map is smaller which induces increased interaction between characters earlier in the game. The upshot being LoL's early game often includes more ganking while HoN's is often more passive.

LoL's jungle (the area outside the lanes) is more linear though (the only word I can find to describe it), pathways are clearly defined, and there are only certain ways through, while HoNs has lots of nooks, crannies and small pathways through the jungle which can be used offensively or defensively in ganks. LoL's equivalent to this is brush, which are small areas of reeds in which a char gets invisibility and can only be seen if you have vision inside said brush. LoL's fog of war is also 2d, and the only mechanic impeding the distance of FoW is brush and walls/trees. HoN has a raised terrain, and chars on lower ground are unable to see above ground. These may seem like small differences, but they do give the games a hugely different feel.

LoL's interface is probably its biggest strength over HoN. When casting abilities you get a shaded area showing the range and aoe of the skill you are using while you get nothing in HoN. Also the shop in LoL is very intuitive and easy to use, while even someone coming from DotA will take a while getting used to HoN's shop. LoL in general is far more accessabile, which is important in a genre that is notoriously newb unfriendly.

HoN's biggest strength over LoL is the amount of features it has that LoL lacks. Replays, Ranked Games, Public Stats, Built in VOIP and Clans are examples of features that HoN has which LoL doesn't have currently, although all are slated for release "soon". HoN often gets credit for being a "higher skill" game too, though I'm of the opinion alot of those assertions are due to a greater understanding of high level competetive play in HoN through a mature DotA competetive scene and the aformentioned replays, and a more team based skillset being required in LoL. Juking is the one high skill tactic that HoN has which LoL doesn't though.

As eluded to earlier, LoL's battles are faster paced than HoN's due to a higher ratio of damage to health. Additionally casters in HoN, while powerful, mostly do not scale damage wise late game. All chars in LoL are able to scale with either physical stats (crit/damage/attack speed) or ability power (works largely like spell power in WoW with different spells getting a different co efficient).

LoL is also free :) Riot points can be purchased to buy access to heroes (there are 10 free heroes available to everyone every week), boosts to XP gains, boosts to Influence gains (Influence is a currency you get by playing games, which can be used to purchase access to heroes and runes) and unique skins for your heroes. However the game can be fully enjoyed for free, and no amount of money can make you more powerful than someone who has paid nothing, though it will get you to optimum power quicker. HoN is a one time fee of $30 (or it will be when it gets out of beta) which gives you access to all heroes, maps and features.

As you may have guessed I'm more familiar with LoL with over 450 games played. I love the game, and personally enjoy it more than HoN despite it's flaws. They are very different games though, despite their similarities, but both are very very enjoyable games to play. I recommend trying both.

BTW gday Frostbite, Nether here ;)

Originally posted by pdavey

It is odd that league of legends (and many other games) are listed on this site.  There is a clear debate on many games' mesage boards here about whether they should be listed as MMO's or not...

 

I believe this site should "define" what it calls an MMORPG and list only those games...  If not, just rename the domain to computergames.com...

 Last time I checked (years ago) there was a definition.  But it really doesn't matter what us forum dwellers think.  It's their house and their rules. Be respectful of  that.

Well i have tried both games as well.  I think the major flaw with LoL in my opinion is the ability to deny ur enemies the extra xp and gold from creep kills by denying.  I mean for what it is in my opinion its a good game but i think its subpar with HoN.  I have probably played over 2k games in HoN and i still have fun everytime i play it.  Some poster above me said that HoN doesnt have runes which is not true they have runes as well. 

In the end it does depend on what you like the most however for me the skill lvl to play LoL just doesnt cut it for me and having to buy characters to play them is a big turn off.  I would rather jus pay 30 bucks and get EEEEEEEVERY character and every future character made like i did in HoN i have already pre ordered and am very happy with it.

I tried HoN for a weak, and it's community was the worst I ever met.

Like, I found no single game with just new players. There were smurfs in all games. No matter if games said "newbies" or "noobs", you got raped 90% of the times by people who knew the game very well. And you got of course insulted in most games as well. I read guides, I playtest, but the games have still a learning curve, so I'm naturally not as good as someone who plays the game far longer than me.

And... well as said, the community was horrible. When I asked if there were bots to practice at, I was insulted. When I joined a game that was labelled "new players", and asked a newbie question, I got kicked. I went to games that said "new players only" to face a group where 4 of the opponents consisted of a single clan. In the whole week I played the game: about 60% of the people just didn't communicate or simply ignored everyone, 39% of the people kept constantly insulting others (sometimes even seconds after the game started), and 1% seemed ok.

I couldn'T even ask questions without getting insulted. It was really the worst community I ever met in any game. To stress it: I'm talking about HoN. It seemed like a few players played it competetively, but the huge majority had as job to rape and insult new players.

Of course in LoL you have dudes as well who insult you and what not. But it was by far not as bad as in HoN. In short: you can play both games only if you have buddies with voice chat to play with.

And about the title of this thread: yeah, neither HoN nor LoL are MMOs. There is nothing massive about them.