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General Discussion Forum » The Pub at MMORPG.COM » Please, tell me why you hate PVP so much. I just don't understand.

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542 posts found
  Sain34

Novice Member

Joined: 9/15/04
Posts: 293

Why not?

6/26/13 5:37:12 PM#21

The gathered information on this I have seen is a few years old at this point but the results tended to be: About 10% of people PvP nearly exclusivly, 40% of people never PvP and 50% of people PvP "Sometimes" Now whatever "Sometimes" means I have no idea. 

Some people don't PvP because they don't want to be competitive. This thread kind of is your own answer. PvPers are always trying to cram pvp down peoples throat. "Why won't you pvp, man? It's the only thing that's fun"  How many threads have you seen trying to convince your to NOT PvP?

 

Personally I don't like most PvP because 15 year old Blake from the OC who's character is named XXXKillerEliteElfXXX is not someone I even want to associate with let alone actually play with.

  Sinella

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/03/09
Posts: 336

6/26/13 5:39:17 PM#22

I never PvP because I don't like the feeling that I'm causing anger or loss for someone else. I hate to win in a PvP match even more than to lose.

I totally hate forced PvP games, because they attract the biggest a-holes in the gaming world. I don't like to spend my free time with psychopats. I'm not saying all PvPers are like that, most of them not, but some rotten apples can ruin the whole basket.

  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 7166

 
OP  6/26/13 5:39:17 PM#23
Originally posted by zymurgeist
Actually some people do hate PvP. The way you phrased the question isn't going to get you an answer why though. At least not one you can understand.

How should it be phrased? I'll change the title.

When I eat chocolate chip pie it just doesn't feel like chocolate chip cookies. The texture, the consistency, it's just not the same and this is disappointing.

  illorion

Novice Member

Joined: 6/05/08
Posts: 476

6/26/13 5:41:01 PM#24

I think its that some people just really really hate loosing... like to the point of quitting if it happens. The content of the modern day mmo... no... the modern day video game is just stupid easy... its almost impossible to loose. Quests are torn through with not so much as a ho hum and people like it that way.

Personally i rely on PvP and the possibility of getting ganked to make the game exciting. Steam rolling prefabricated content all day is boring and should be reserved for single player games... the whole point of MMO is that you are supposed to have to deal with other players... either good or bad.

Games haven't really been challenging since back in the days of the original NES. So I turn to MMO's and my fellow players to at least keep things interesting... 

"Don't mistake a fun game for a good game... Checkers is fun to play but its not exactly the highest point of gaming design... and definatly not worth $60 plus $15 a month"

  Thorqemada

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/30/04
Posts: 1199

6/26/13 5:41:12 PM#25

In real life i would kill you amd you are gone forever.

In a mmo you just log out, come back when i do my rl and destroy my homestaed.

Do you really believe that is a working Business model?

"Torquemada... do not implore him for compassion. Torquemada... do not beg him for forgiveness. Torquemada... do not ask him for mercy. Let's face it, you can't Torquemada anything!"

MWO Music Video - What does the Mech say: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FF6HYNqCDLI
MWO Machinima - Revival (Clan Invasion): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=saheVNMp7qQ

  tank017

Novice Member

Joined: 7/09/06
Posts: 2206

6/26/13 5:42:36 PM#26

Here's an example why..

 

Say there's a quest you want to go on and you have to travel all over to get certain items you have to bring together.You come up on the location of the first piece,but have to fight your way into a dungeon.The battle is grueling,but you are making progress and are just about to come up on the area where this quest piece lay,but a named,even stronger mob stand between you and the item.So you  heal up,wait for any cool downs on vital skills and proceed to commence the battle.*PULL*

 

The battle is close,but youre getting the upper hand when........

 

*YOU JUST GOT BACK STABBED BY DOUCHEY MCDOUCHERTON FOR 760 DAMAGE*

 

Shocked,you scramble to remedy the major influx of damage,though your heal spells and/or heal pots can not sustain the punishment.You give in to death,laying their watching as Douchey McDoucherton capitalizes on your hard work,finishing off the named mob and seizing your precious item..

 

In frustration you respawn and head back to the dungeon,hoping that the griefer got what he came for and left.To your dismay,the whole dungeon has respawned.Is Douchey still in there? perhaps waiting to cause more grief for his/her personal enjoyment?

 

who knows? ....back to square one.

 

 

  Athena_Starfire

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/25/09
Posts: 177

UH! Whats this lever do?

6/26/13 5:43:01 PM#27

Please, tell me why you hate PVP so much. I just don't understand?

Myself, I outgrew "My genitals are bigger than yours" a long time ago, which is pretty much the attitude of most pvp'ers I have met.

 

 

  erictlewis

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/08/08
Posts: 3058

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over while expecting different results.

6/26/13 5:44:31 PM#28

I been play mmo's since 1999. I seen all kinds of pvp.  The worst is forced open world pvp.  You always have those that are the best at it, and then the bully other folks   Open world pvp lends itself to the high level's camping the lower level players.   Not to mention you always have nerf after nerf and what they call class balance. 

The pvp I like is counterstrike you get in there get it done over with then you go at it again.  There is no griefing like mmo's have. 

 

  atticusbc

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/22/07
Posts: 1059

I hated hipsters before hating hipsters was cool.

6/26/13 5:45:14 PM#29

my issue is that most pvp centric mmos don't allow me to manage the risk of going out and doing things. if i got out i stand to lose everything i have, be that gear or progress,so it's sort of all or nothing, and i don't like that. i don't live like that and i don't play like that. that's what finally turned me off eve, and later dfuw. simple as that. that and anyone who attacks me is a much higher level/more experienced than me and has superiority in numbers. see?! even the brain dead gankers know that you need to manage risk!

EDIT: oh and the whole wannabe alpha, epeen, obviously has psychological issues thing. sure there are nice pvpers/gankers, but they are far and few between. actually i've met one. ever.

EDIT2: i have told a horrid lie. in potbs i kept getting killed by this one high level guy. it was literally impossible for me to out run him. after about three deaths i got a message from him that contained only equipment and money, and he never attacked me again. i am ashamed that i didn't remember him just now. so that's two good pvpers.

  Arcticnoon

Novice Member

Joined: 4/20/13
Posts: 146

6/26/13 5:46:10 PM#30
I dont hate PvP. I've spent hundreds of hours playing LoL and various FPs. PvP is the best part of those games. I dont play MMOs to play PvP. I play them for PVE. I think you are asking the wrong question. So let me ask you one... Which is more impressive? Defeating the top Boss on hardmode first on your server, Or being top PvP ranked? I would say the former. Everyone remembers the first guild to beat the toughest endgame. Most people cant even tell you who the number one pvper on their server is unless the are close to the top themselves. Besides Hardmode engame is always constant. PvP has too many varitables. How do people know you didnt win against noob players? Or that you had an unfair advantage in gear?
  PhoenixC13

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/23/05
Posts: 117

6/26/13 5:48:19 PM#31
I am a long time gamer, never been a big PVP'er.  For me I not a hardcore gamer any more but above casual and when I play a game I have to pick what I want to work on when I log in being that I maybe have 1-2 hours to play a couple nights a week.  If I get in a situation like you can in some games that there is a griefer I can't really get anything done.    Yoo just don't always have time to deal with PVP.

  arieste

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/11/04
Posts: 3308

6/26/13 5:48:36 PM#32
Originally posted by bcbully

I mean to me PVP is the pinnacle off multiplayer gaming. You test your skills against mine. We use what we found in the world and see if it works. 

 

I have two separate explanations for you.  One in general and one referring to the point you make above.

 

The first and simplest is that due to base human nature and existing game design, PvP ends up taking away immersion from the world more often than it adds immersion.  PvP adds immersion because it is realistic that anyone you meet CAN attack you and kill you.  This "potential" adds immersion.  Unfortunately, it rarely stays as potential. The fact that almost everyone you ever DOES attack and try to kill you - usually for no reason whatsoever - completely ruins immersion.  The world simply isn't full psychopaths our to kill everyone they meet for the pleasure of it.   Give an FFA PvP game where killing someone has an automatic 50% chance of "being caught" and having spend a month in the game's "prison" or unable to play and you'll create a more realistic world where "everyone CAN kill you, but most WON'T"

 

That's the general explanation, it ruins immersion.  This really applies only to "non-consensual" as it's recently been called PvP.   If you walk into a fighting arena or onto a war battlefield to fight, you certainly expect to be fought - in any world.

 

Now onto your "pinnacle of multiplayer gaming".   To me, the pinnacle of MMO gaming is collaboration.  

 

Let me give you this RL example.  You are in a room with another person.  You've never met.  You don't know anything about them.  Not their skills, nor personality, not what language they speak, nothing.     What do you think is easiest to hardest to accomplish:

1.  get into a fight with this person

2.  build a house with this person

3.  fend off a bear attack in cooperation with this person

 

Getting into a fight with someone for no reason is the most primal and basic way of relating to them.  All you need is your fists and off you go swinging.  Now if you need to build a house or fight a bear together, you need to communicate with them, to complement each others' skills, etc.   

 

Of course, if you follow this same logic, then the pinnacle of MMO gaming is cooperating with another person to build a house, while fending off a bear attack and fighting other people bent on stopping you from building that house.  This I fully agree with.  But then, when it comes to playing an RPG, i also want immersion, so unless those "other people" are willing to play by the same immersion rules as me (fight only with good reason when all else fails), then i'd rather just build houses and fend off bears.

"I’d rather work on something with great potential than on fulfilling a promise of mediocrity."

- Raph Koster

Tried: AO,EQ,EQ2,DAoC,SWG,AA,SB,HZ,CoX,PS,GA,TR,IV,GnH,EVE, PP,DnL,WAR,MxO,SWG,FE,VG,AoC,DDO,LoTRO,Rift,TOR,Aion,Tera,TSW,GW2,DCUO,CO,STO
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Currently Playing: EQ2, Firefall

  chakalaka

Novice Member

Joined: 5/01/10
Posts: 240

The thing is... you're important to a lot of people.

6/26/13 5:49:08 PM#33
I love PVP but I will say that allowing any character more than 5-10 levels above another character  (based on the game, gw1 is an exception =  }  ) is just down right absurd. Keep the playing field as well balanced as you can and it creates fun entertainment as both (or more) characters know that it will be a challenge. I think it's pretty much as simple as that. Then you have the "safe zones" where you can tag yourself or the contested zones, the point is to not allow uneven match-ups occur.
  maplestone

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/08
Posts: 3109

6/26/13 5:49:46 PM#34
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by zymurgeist
Actually some people do hate PvP. The way you phrased the question isn't going to get you an answer why though. At least not one you can understand.

How should it be phrased? I'll change the title.

Before you worry about that, I'm curious if you understood my answer.

  zymurgeist

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/24/04
Posts: 5185

6/26/13 5:49:47 PM#35
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by zymurgeist
Actually some people do hate PvP. The way you phrased the question isn't going to get you an answer why though. At least not one you can understand.

How should it be phrased? I'll change the title.

It's not the title it's the post. You're implying either they suck at it, they can't handle it, or that simply not liking it isn't a valid reason. You've set up an adversarial conditions and dismissed any reason that you're unwilling to accept as invalid.

"Strong and bitter words indicate a weak cause" ~Victor Hugo

  bcbully

Elite Member

Joined: 3/03/12
Posts: 7166

 
OP  6/26/13 5:50:22 PM#36
Originally posted by Sinella

I never PvP because I don't like the feeling that I'm causing anger or loss for someone else. I hate to win in a PvP match even more than to lose.

I totally hate forced PvP games, because they attract the biggest a-holes in the gaming world. I don't like to spend my free time with psychopats. I'm not saying all PvPers are like that, most of them not, but some rotten apples can ruin the whole basket.

I get this, I really do. I have those feelings at times too. For lack of better terms it can be awkward. 

 

The are no "Forces PvP games" you are never forced to fight. At the same time griefers should be punished, as long as there is a way to do that, within reason, I really don't have an issue.

 

Killing for the sake of killing with no risk gets old quick for everyone. If that one social path just can't get enough arrest him, and put him on time out. 

When I eat chocolate chip pie it just doesn't feel like chocolate chip cookies. The texture, the consistency, it's just not the same and this is disappointing.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17080

6/26/13 5:50:40 PM#37
Originally posted by bcbully
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by bcbully

 

Why, please tell me. Maybe developers have done studies and stuff, but I haven't, I really don't get it.

  

Well I personally like pvp but I can EASILY (didn't you just make a post on critical thinking and that a good amount of people can't do it?) see why people don't like some pvp'ers.

I'm not talking about "some pvp'ers" I'm talking about in general. I wondered for years. The reasons I gave are the ones I've come up with. Please tell me if there are more lol. I swear I'm trying. 

 

A previous poster said something about time. I thought to myself, "Ok." Then I thought back on my 8 years of mmorpg'n and couldn't think of a time where I lost more than a few minutes, and even then, did I really lose them?

it's all about the hostile dismissive attitude of some coupled with a need to work out their own anger.

I can't tell you how many times in Lineage 2 some asshole took the chance to waste an entire noob village only to eventually be shut down and then cry about it.

I seem to remember a few times being pk'ed only to find my pk'er and exact retribution and then get the hate whispers and the crying.

Or the time we had a great bit of pvp (went on for a while) in the Cemetary outside of Aden and everyone on both sides was in pretty good spirits. We got to talking to one of the enemy and he was so good natured about the whole thing we decided to rez him. Only to have some guy come over and ask us what we were doing. We explained and he responded with "that's so f'kin carebear.

How about the time I was in tera only to see two people ganging up on a lower level player. I joined in, killed one of them as their victim found "shelter" and then the other, instead of facing me (one level above me mind you) ran. He ran like a sissy. and then gloated about it.

Unfortunately the pvp community is polluted with cowards, psychopaths, a##holes, rude little children (of a variety of ages) who don't know when to stop. I remember one guy who was just a plain sh&t. I was talking to some people who knew him in real life and essentially he really was  an unwashed, cranky, bitter Assh*le.

People don't want to deal with that stuff. They just want to log in and have fun. Not make it an evening of dealing with those who weren't hugged enough or can't express themselves in any postiive way. I can easily see why some people don't want to pay money and spend time dealing with others' issues.

I suspect that's why arena pvp is so popular. You get equal sides of people who are more or less geared the same and who don't speak with the other side so it's all about that one moment of pvp. I suspect that a good many people who love arena pvp don't like ffa pvp because all those barriers to all that piss poor behavior are gone.

and it's a shame because ffa pvp can be some of the best pvp around.

Probably why I liked EvilSeed so much. He pk'ed everyone but wasn't a sh*t about it.

 

  Demalis

Novice Member

Joined: 5/12/13
Posts: 133

6/26/13 5:55:45 PM#38

Ok help me out here is this irony, the op with the word bully in his name is asking why some people don't like pvp???

I am not sure if that would classify... But to answer your question, I play rpg's on my time, when I am level 15 getting harassed by three level capped players, it is affecting my game time. I all ways play on a pvp server, but think it is time to switch. Developers are not addressing the many down side effects of open world pvp, I likes the way dayz did the bandit skin.  If they could make pvp a little more meaningful and address the grieving factors then I could change my mind.

 

  Scott23

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/05/10
Posts: 80

6/26/13 5:56:24 PM#39
Originally posted by bcbully
Why not beat the guy (or lose) and go about your business. You win some you lose some. YOu can even run, I'm sure there is another node right around the corner. Is it that big of a deal?

I would be ok with PvP if there were consequences for PvP. 

No consequences lead to griefing, ganking, or whatever you want to call it.

If I lose - bummer, but if I get trounced repeatedly by someone of much higher level that gets his fun by ruining my fun - well... that is a sure way for me to uninstall the game.

  DeserttFoxx

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/11/04
Posts: 2328

Cry Havok; and let loose the dogs of war.

Si vis pacem, para bellum

6/26/13 5:56:25 PM#40

I love pvp.

 

I hate king of the hill, i hate capture the flag, i can tolerate terriroy control. But when it comes to MMO, sometimes, i just want to kill the other player for the pure and simple purpose of killing him.

 

NO MMO offers that, i either need to run up and down some arbitrary space capture and holding some object for some arbitrary reason, or hold some keep that after 10minutes it sends me back to whereever i came from and nobody gives a shit anymore until the next one.

 

Pvp is often always meaningless, that is why the only pvp system i enjoyed was lineage 2, pvping for the sake of changing the game world i will do, pvping for the sake of farming tokens or whatever bullshit is in place to get better gear to pvp better for more gear that only matters when i pvp.. pass on that shit.

Quotations Those Who make peaceful resolutions impossible, make violent resolutions inevitable. John F. Kennedy

Life... is the shit that happens while you wait for moments that never come - Lester Freeman

Lie to no one. If there 's somebody close to you, you'll ruin it with a lie. If they're a stranger, who the fuck are they you gotta lie to them? - Willy Nelson

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