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World of Warcraft Forum » General Discussion » BBC - World of Warcraft subscribers are leaving, Activision warns

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156 posts found

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/23/09
Posts: 3426

I thought what I'd do is I'd pretend I was one of those Deaf-mutes.

6/08/13 1:05:56 PM#121
Originally posted by crasset15
Wow sounds like a good game to try, but something in me tells me I really shouldn't invest time into a 9 year old game, since I'm late to the party anyway. Losing 1,3 mil subs isn't exactly the best marketing campaign to attract new players, either. I was so invested into other MMOs and FPSes during the wow explosion that I didnt even know it existed until 2008 when a friend briefly mentioned it.

People are eating through content and unsubbing and resubbing when new content comes out, they're doing it quicker and faster than normal because a lot of them have caught on that is the best way to get all the content and then be done with the game at a more casual level.

They lose a lot of casual players due to this, that is why they are investing in developing 'flex raids' and more content for every level of game play.  A lot of other games are doing this as well.


Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/01/13
Posts: 113

"Keep dancing baby, it's the end of the world."

6/08/13 1:17:46 PM#122

All good things must come to an end.  WoW is already 30+% below it's peak subs and falling.  Nonetheless, it's still probably a decade from being shut down.


Which is all fine and dandy if you ask me.  They had a good run, stealing their formula from EQ and all.

That's just, like, my opinion, man.


Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/14/09
Posts: 1380

6/08/13 2:45:34 PM#123
Originally posted by Squeak69

what game is he talking about cause i don't know of any NEW major MMO being launched over there that want already over there at least not recently.

i could just be ignorant on this one i don't pay a ton of attention to oversea gameing, aside from JRPGs

The game here is usually referred to as Age of Wushu or Age of Wulin. Yes, it's not actually the "newest" one. That is too part of the problem with the excuse. Snail games once claimed 10M registered accounts created worldwide. But first its a F2P game where you can create as many accounts as you want, second that was over half a year since registration was possible, with many of them already long inactive, third it's a F2P MMO in China, where its normal to have at least several million of registered accounts for and big title right after launch, even for P2P games, more so for F2P.

Hyperbole, mixed with some individual dishonesty of Western AoW fans, some irrational "F2P game" fans and the big language barrier here have created a myth that AoW had flushed over the Chinese MMO market, reaching peaks of over 20 M actual player. But it was only a big game release. Nothing much more than that.

Blizzard lately vaguely pointed at this game blaming Chinese F2P MMO releases as reason for WoWs losses in the East. This is why we see WoW player lately starting to point at Chinese F2P games. They devoured the misleading hints exactly like Blizzard wanted them to.

Tencent however, the Chinese publisher of WoW, unintentionally handed Blizzards PR on damage control mode, a big but generally unnoticed slap to the face, when they released their own earnings report, revealing that the two most played P2P MMOs in China actually saw a rise in popularity and earnings, despite all the AoW hype over here, while only WoW recoded losses as a P2P title. Completely contradicting the notion that P2P games in general where loosing customer because of the "new Chinese free games".


Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/20/12
Posts: 433

6/10/13 1:04:09 AM#124

WOW is the last man standing in fantasy based MMO's. Take EVE and that one is the last man standing in SF based MMO's.

Last man standing as ... having active SUBSCRIPTIONS.


The rest went free to play and seriously free to play in an AAA developped MMORPG is the last road to nowhere.

Because these MMORPG's (at least those with a real open world behind them - not like World of Tanks) are simply too costly to produce for the free to play model.

F2P works perfectly for small program groups on small games with little development costs and very casual game play.

Blizzard knows this and so they changed to games like HS, BAS and of course Diablo 3 (on consoles)

Much easier to program, hardly content updates needed and money makers from the start.


I bet HS will bring in more money in its first 6 months than any new MMORPG from Blizzard could gather. Because the sub model is simply finished for mmo's and so a "new" mmorpg will never have a return of investment.

Not for the next 5 years anyway. People are fed up by them.


Novice Member

Joined: 11/14/12
Posts: 52

6/10/13 1:10:06 AM#125
think we just need a change in all systems. from house to  the collection of crafting mats.

Novice Member

Joined: 3/19/13
Posts: 34

6/10/13 1:50:40 AM#126

Having played WoW from the vanilla to Wrath for me it has nothing to do with it not being F2P, but simply because Blizzard made the game so easy it no longer presented any challenge.   I remember when pulling more than one mob in even the lower level dungeons meant death or just barely scraping through, now it's pull the whole room or even two plus rooms worth of mobs and just AoE them down and Blizzard think that's supposed to be fun.  They completely destroyed any tactical elements from the game so that even a two fingered chimpanzee could breeze to end game content all whilst eating a banana and hanging from a tree.


Blizzard have backed themselves into a corner where they are now stuck with the simplified gameplay that they have created.  The crazy thing is even now I see people complaining that it's to hard or takes to long to do something, I'd like to think these people are just kidding, but sadly they aren't.   I often wonder why some people play MMORPG's because they really only want to play them like a single player game.


Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/25/07
Posts: 21

6/10/13 9:23:38 AM#127
Yeah, I just recently cancelled my subscription. The game has grown too 'cutesy' for me. It feels too simple for a practiced mmo player like me. I had wished the game had grown with me. Somehow, I feel we have went our separate ways. I have been playing Rift and loving it. I also am taking my money back to Warhammer Online as the ultimate sign of my dissatisfaction in WoW. Could you imagine beleagured WAR teeming with disaffected WoW vets as the ultimate protest vote? As WoW's subscriber leak away, WAR's grows? What message would that send? Hey, we want a more serious version of this universe--maybe?


Novice Member

Joined: 4/14/06
Posts: 145

6/11/13 12:26:42 PM#128
Originally posted by strangiato2112
Originally posted by MadDemon64

I smell a potential f2p conversion coming on.

Lets face facts.  Games like TERA, SW:TOR, Aion, and LOTRO were only kinda popular when they were s2p games, but once they converted to f2p, they experienced HUGE population booms.  The same will happen if/when WoW converts to f2p, and right now, I think it's less of a matter of "if" than it is of "when".  In fact, even if they made it b2p where players had to buy the expansion packs but not need to pay a subscription, that would create a similarly huge population boom (and might be enough to bring me back).

f2p doesnt typically bring players back, and brings in new people.  there isnt a large pool of people who havent played WoW that will suddenly play it if its f2p.


I'd disagree, even friends that played hundreds of LoL games that took a break are now back to wasn't indefinite. For it to work though, Blizzard's next expansion would have to be free and then turn over to a f2p model more than likely. Could wait two more expansions but by that point f2p might not be enough because wow will be like 10+ years old.


Novice Member

Joined: 5/30/07
Posts: 85

6/11/13 1:11:45 PM#129

People seem to be forgetting that WoW lost more subs then any 3 sub based games currently have combined. Its far from dieing people still play games like EQ1, DAOC, Ultima Online and EQ2 which also came out the same time as WoW. WoW will continue losing subs but I really doubt blizzard is going to just let the game die without a fight. They are pumping out major content patches at a rapid pace and some of these patches have more content then other MMOs xpacs. And anybody that has done the Legendary Questline will see they are allluding to a burning legion themed xpac which should hopefully bring more players back and at least keep the game going strong till Titan (which I really hope is WoW 2) comes.


Lets face it WoW is the number 1 MMO for a reason, sure it has allot of easy mode content but they have a ton of content to for hardcore gamers like challenge modes, hardmode raids and heroic scenarios. Not to mention WoW has extremely competative pvp with arena and BGs and they also have cross-realm play so no matter what time you come on to play you can always find people to do any content with. 


Advanced Member

Joined: 5/17/12
Posts: 451

6/11/13 4:35:18 PM#130
Resubbed on Sunday and bought Mists of Panda Land after a year and half break from the game. Having alot of fun but i had to transfer off of my old server Natherizm because of how dead it was. Last i played nath i believe was full or high pop now sitting at medium. Stormwind * Ironforge were like ghost towns as was the MOP content. 

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/12/05
Posts: 1285

6/29/13 6:18:42 PM#131
Originally posted by Datastar
I feel thier problem isnt the f2p/b2p games out there, its the dumbing down/lack of innovation across the board on all of blizzards games over the past few years.  Thats just my personal opinion.

I think it's a combination of both.

So many games are going F2P now, many of them "premium" mmos.  WoW's subscription doesn't seem to have the value it used to.  If you think about it, vanilla's final patch was 1.12 while BC's was 2.4, that's a drop of 2/3 in the content patches released in the 1st cycle.  As WoW aged, less and less content was added but the price stayed the same (less bang for your buck).

The other factor is how Blizzard is ignoring it's players and doing what it wants and how it wants it.  They admitted arenas were a mistake that imbalanced pvp, yet.... they are still doing arenas.  They say they want to "simplify" resource management then... add another resource to manage.   They say they want you to "bring the player" but in MoP they put in so much phasing tech that people can't bring their players.

I also think that the 3rd problem is recycled content.

Heroics are just recycling an existing instance.  I'm in the same dungeon, fighting same mobs, who path the same way.  Sure they hit harder and take longer to kill but it IS still essentially the same thing all over again.  Then when Wrath hit, they went into recycling overdrive.  First Raid?  Naxx Recycled.  Next Raid?  OS recycled 4 times (0D, 1D, 2D, 3D).  Later on we get 10m, 25m, 10m HM, 25m HM instances.  It's the Same Map, with the Same Mobs, in the Same Place, doing the Same Attacks.  Sure the 25m HM fireball hits harder than the 10m normal, but it's Still A Fireball.  So this led to burnout and people leaving.

It's like Blizzard is just getting lazy and tries to do the minimum possible work.  Why make 4 unique instances when we can just reuse the same one 4 times!  /yawn


Novice Member

Joined: 5/11/10
Posts: 112

Brazilian Jiu Jitsu is my PVP

6/29/13 6:21:16 PM#132
My wife and I tried playing WoW again for a few weeks.  During that I was doing that, school, and finishing up The Last of Us.  I kept trying to level my 89 druid to 90 but I just couldn't will myself to do it!  To my surprise my wife, once a diehard WoW fan, couldn't do it either.  We just found the game tried and worn out.  WoW's still good and has the population to prove it has a fanbase, but we just can't get into it anymore, it just doesn't have the luster it used too

Playing: TSW, D&D NW, Defiance (more the tv show than game >.> ) LotRO, DCUO

  User Deleted
6/29/13 6:35:42 PM#133
Well, I'll just keep playing until it dies. Maybe by then something better will be released. Right now it's trash clones, half-assed sandboxes, or "hipster" games (you know, the ones that try so hard to be different that they end up just like the others), or WoW. Not much choice.

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/16/12
Posts: 741

6/29/13 6:43:39 PM#134
Take away flying mounts, lfr, lfg, and make leveling a little difficult.

Elite Member

Joined: 6/06/12
Posts: 2995

We live in a fantasy world, a world of illusion. The great task in life is to find reality.

6/29/13 6:45:16 PM#135
Originally posted by Datastar
I feel thier problem isnt the f2p/b2p games out there, its the dumbing down/lack of innovation across the board on all of blizzards games over the past few years.  Thats just my personal opinion.

 This and their inability to add content that is MMO worthy and not what people want.



Dumbing down of their game, such as removing talents and the inclusion of stupid non-mmo activities like Pokémon wil be their utter downfall.  Sure casuals and once a week players might like that, but the backbone of community driven is their hardcore players and until WoW includes more MMO-Like activities like:
  • Housing
  • Alternate Advancement systems
  • Alternate content
  • Removal of PUGable Raids
Strengthen the binds that keep players playing long-term and you grow your base.  Dumb the game down and you fail miserably.

Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!

Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!


Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/18/10
Posts: 1425

6/29/13 8:07:22 PM#136

oh good, i was wondering when we were gonna have this important discussion again.

LFD tools are great for cramming people into content, but quality > quantity.
I am, usually on the sandbox .. more "hardcore" side of things, but I also do just want to have fun. So lighten up already :)

  User Deleted
6/29/13 8:27:28 PM#137

Originally posted by Iselin
It's because Bliz has lost touch wit pop culture. Kung Fu Panda? Really? Madagascar, Finding Nemo and Land Before Time were much, much better. So where are the penguin, fish and dino people, eh?

Please don't give them ideas! I can just see the next 3 expansions...

When WoW reaches less than 3 million subscribers, then I'll worry.


Novice Member

Joined: 1/10/08
Posts: 718

PC is not political correctness, it means Political Cowardice!

6/29/13 8:45:50 PM#138
Originally posted by AlBQuirky


Originally posted by Iselin
It's because Bliz has lost touch wit pop culture. Kung Fu Panda? Really? Madagascar, Finding Nemo and Land Before Time were much, much better. So where are the penguin, fish and dino people, eh?

Please don't give them ideas! I can just see the next 3 expansions...


When WoW reaches less than 3 million subscribers, then I'll worry.

They won't do the Dino race because EQ2 already has that.  Blizzard takes what new games are hyping and expansion for that matter, change it enough to not get sued and release it in their own expansions.  WoW always has been and always will be a clone. MMO players that have been around longer than Blizzards clone now that.  Those that cut their teeth on WoW are the ones that think it was the first at anything other than dumbing down the genre.


Novice Member

Joined: 3/17/07
Posts: 6678

"Had to be me. Someone else might have gotten it wrong.” - Mordin Solus

6/29/13 8:50:23 PM#139
It had it's day in the sun. It simply is time to move onto something better.

Novice Member

Joined: 4/11/13
Posts: 880

6/29/13 9:46:40 PM#140
Originally posted by ThomasN7
It had it's day in the sun. It simply is time to move onto something better.


What game(s) that will be is the multi-billion dollar question.

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