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General Discussion Forum » The Pub at MMORPG.COM » Why is there not an MMO that you can solo 100% of everything?

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272 posts found
  marlborz

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/26/12
Posts: 40

12/17/12 4:45:06 PM#201

in response to the games you chosen as completely soloable or made for the single player I would disagree with you on one, lineage/2 and the oter runescape i haven't played so i will believe that is true. Both of these games however are over 10 years old. Let me rephase the quesion , name one recent major mmo that was made for the single player or that can be played completely soloable.

 

 

orginal post:

Originally posted by marlborz

 Your honest view is appreciated. Answer this, name one major mmo that was made for single player or that a single player can solo all the way through.

 

orginal post was:

 

"If you want to play by yourself, go grab a single player game and have at it. MMORPG's are about interaction and socialization, amongst other things of course. Dont get why people want a single player console game as a mmorpg, its silly. You already ahve thousands of solo type games out there, why try to ruin the industry even more."

Lineage, Lineage 2 (back when 85 was maxlevel, dunno bout now), Runescape (doesnt even have groups per se :) )

As always the problem is defining the things we argue about, soloers generally do not want a singleplayer experience, they just prefer to do things on their own, which does not stop them from socializing, trading and helping other people.

Which is the biggest problem about newer mmos, people who are in a groups and raids 24/7 but dont talk, dont interact, dont care a rats butt, isnt that truly THE singleplayer experience? :)

Flame on!

:)

  marlborz

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/26/12
Posts: 40

12/17/12 4:46:35 PM#202
fyi - browser games do not count, period.
  TwoThreeFour

Novice Member

Joined: 3/26/12
Posts: 2148

12/17/12 4:51:41 PM#203
Originally posted by Banaghran
Originally posted by LadyEuphei
This thread should be closed on a mmo forum. This is rediculous. No mmo should be soloable, it is just AGH! I need to breathe...seriously this idea is rediculous and it makes no sense. If you want to solo and be by yourself go play a multiplayer card game in a corner with your imaginary friends.... 

This is a good example how narrow minded, burned out and jaded we have become as a community.

This person has never ever considered that the "soloability" could take , say, 10 times as long as the grouping, actually ENCOURAGING the grouping instead of FORCING it as the new mmos do and why everyone behaves like Dfense inside a pug raid.

Because in this twisted twilight zone we operate these days, the prolonged time required would be UNFAIR to all the soloers for some reason not even the soloers understand.

Flame on!

:)

 Your form of "encouragement" is what people would refer to as "forcing".

  Latronus

Novice Member

Joined: 1/10/08
Posts: 718

PC is not political correctness, it means Political Cowardice!

12/17/12 4:56:15 PM#204
Originally posted by marlborz
fyi - browser games do not count, period.

I can't think of a single modern game that isn't a browser game that is successful that is an MMO and was designed from the begining to be 100% soloable.  If there are, they are PC versions of console games and not MMOs.  Just because you can solo WoW from level 1 until you get to the endgame, that doesn't qualify either since the endgame is not soloable. 

Besides, how boring would a raid be by yourself?  Oh wait, there wont be raids, PvP (that is not soloable by definition.  Even 1V1 requires another player to fight), but you could still have dungeons.  Sounds more and more like Skyrim the more I write doesn't it?

  marlborz

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/26/12
Posts: 40

12/17/12 5:02:12 PM#205

I think people are mislead by who defines what an mmo/rpg is.

-an mmo does not have to require groups of people to complete objectives.

-an mmo does not have to require you  joining groups to gain extra incentives that signle players cannot get. (such as extra stats for completeing guild quests.)

-an mmo does not have to require 5 people to complete a guild petition.

 

what is an mmo?

a game that more then one person/character/buildbot ect. can log into.

 

 

 

  marlborz

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/26/12
Posts: 40

12/17/12 5:04:34 PM#206
now i need to get out my dictionary to define sucessful mmo, the word challenge, and the term guild.
  xAPOCx

Elite Member

Joined: 10/25/12
Posts: 811

12/17/12 5:19:45 PM#207
Originally posted by Latronus
Originally posted by xAPOCx
Originally posted by VengeSunsoar

I would agree with that.  The way solo is done now is typically grindy, easy or both. 

However group content still has the best loot, coin and xp even in todays' games. 

As it should be.

I agree with you but that flies in the face of this entire thread.  Those that support this thread want to be able to get exactly what you and I would get for grouping.  Otherwise they are being treated unfairly and you know that in America at least, everyone deserves to get their fair share even if they don't have to work to get it.

I dont agree with the OP on most things. This topic was goin to be no different. Making solo content just as hard as group content? please. If the solo content is to hard then you just get someone to help you.... OOOPS That would be grouping.

 

These are the same people that cant be bothered with others and still want end game gear even though they dont raid or do high end grouping to get said gear/items. They feel as if they are entiteled to it.

 

And it doesnt stop at adventuring. Even the solo task of crafting is a chore for most. Should have heard all the complaining and crying VG.

 

If you want a 100% solo game, Play the 1000s of console games thats available.

Want to play a 100% solo game with other people? Call some friends over to watch you play.

Want to play a 100% solo game With other people and trade? Call some friends over to watch you play and tell them to bring something with them to trade with you.

 

The idea of a full on MMORPG that is 100% solo centric is laughable at best. Even the crap MMos that are being pumped out now, as easy as they are, still require the best stuff to come from harder content. ( Group content )

 

 

 

 

  AG-Vuk

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/26/04
Posts: 804

Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son.
Oh, I see it's too late to help you.

12/17/12 5:31:55 PM#208
I'm just here to see how the flaming is going. Total and pure curiousity. Hell has nothing on this thread. Please continue.  I think it's starting to cool a little. Flame on !

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 11822

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ESO, and Combat Arms

12/17/12 5:51:40 PM#209
Originally posted by xAPOCx

The idea of a full on MMORPG that is 100% solo centric is laughable at best. Even the crap MMos that are being pumped out now, as easy as they are, still require the best stuff to come from harder content. ( Group content )

Thou dost laugh at UO?

  xAPOCx

Elite Member

Joined: 10/25/12
Posts: 811

12/17/12 6:28:32 PM#210
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by xAPOCx

The idea of a full on MMORPG that is 100% solo centric is laughable at best. Even the crap MMos that are being pumped out now, as easy as they are, still require the best stuff to come from harder content. ( Group content )

Thou dost laugh at UO?

I never played UO. Is the game 100% soloable? No group content what so ever? Everything thats ingame can be attained completely through 100% solo gameplay? Any pvp and or rewards from pvp

Not being a smartass. I really want to know.

  Banaghran

Novice Member

Joined: 1/17/12
Posts: 872

12/17/12 6:57:06 PM#211
Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
Originally posted by Banaghran
Originally posted by LadyEuphei
This thread should be closed on a mmo forum. This is rediculous. No mmo should be soloable, it is just AGH! I need to breathe...seriously this idea is rediculous and it makes no sense. If you want to solo and be by yourself go play a multiplayer card game in a corner with your imaginary friends.... 

This is a good example how narrow minded, burned out and jaded we have become as a community.

This person has never ever considered that the "soloability" could take , say, 10 times as long as the grouping, actually ENCOURAGING the grouping instead of FORCING it as the new mmos do and why everyone behaves like Dfense inside a pug raid.

Because in this twisted twilight zone we operate these days, the prolonged time required would be UNFAIR to all the soloers for some reason not even the soloers understand.

Flame on!

:)

 Your form of "encouragement" is what people would refer to as "forcing".

Compared to what exactly? Raids?

Flame on!

:)

  Banaghran

Novice Member

Joined: 1/17/12
Posts: 872

12/17/12 7:00:51 PM#212
Originally posted by marlborz

in response to the games you chosen as completely soloable or made for the single player I would disagree with you on one, lineage/2 and the oter runescape i haven't played so i will believe that is true. Both of these games however are over 10 years old. Let me rephase the quesion , name one recent major mmo that was made for the single player or that can be played completely soloable.

 

So for which goal would the player need a group in L2 ?

Its 8 years old, btw.

If recent mmos would do it we would not have this thread, would we?

Flame on!

:)

  UsualSuspect

Elite Member

Joined: 11/01/04
Posts: 1211

12/18/12 1:41:22 AM#213
Originally posted by Banaghran

Why do you think a soloable mmo MUST have an ending?

Because if you can solo everything then it's naturally going to be easy to complete. Even the hardest single player game is just a case of timing and knowing when to hit the buttons, it's not rocket science. More players gives more room for error and more people to split the rewards between, hence there is a reason to repeat content. In a solo only game, once you've done something then that content is complete and you'll be wanting something else. It's not possible to give unlimited content in that fashion.

Where do you see a difference between raid grind hamster wheel and solo grind hamster wheel? Especially if either is optional.

So you'd want to repeat the same content on your own over and over? It would have to be a really good game for me to want to repeat something indefinitely.

Why do you think "saving time and effort" is NO reason to group?

Why are you mentioning grouping when we're talking about a soloable game?

Do you really think "soloable" means "as fast and utterly easy as with a group"?

It would have to be, especially if the game has different classes, as the content would have to be soloable by each one of those classes, otherwise the game fails as a solo experience. Naturally some of those classes are going to have an easier time than others, such as the Wizard who will have lots of damage but take few hits.

Do you really think 90% of the lfr crowd would even notice if the players would be replaced by NPCs ?

Yes. I'm not sure about the current WoW crowd but from the raids I've done, which have been EverQuest and Lord of the Rings Online (before they become little more than large group content), the raid was just something fun for the guild to do as a whole, while gaining extra equipment. Multiplayer games are about the people you're sharing the game with - perhaps that's the part you're missing out on and why you think a single player version would better suit you.

Flame on!

You smell like cheese.

:)

 

  Sheista

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/30/05
Posts: 1202

12/18/12 1:51:29 AM#214

It's been mentioned several times in the thread, but Asheron's Call was entirely soloable.

It was a skill based game so anyone could take the Healing skill or the Life Magic skill.  Even random drop items would sometimes have a spell imbued in them that the item would cast, such as a heal spell or a stamina to health spell or something of the sort.  So even if you didn't have the skills, you could still help yourself in other ways.  Life Magic had healing spells, as well as spells which let you juggle your health/stamina/mana back and forth and convert them into each other for 50-100%+ returns on the conversions.  It allowed you to run into a massive group of enemies, pull them all, and take them out one by one or in groups if you were a mage.  You'd juggle your stats, or even drain health/stam/mana from the enemies and use it yourself.

It was an excellent system that allowed for you to be entirely self sustainable.  Relying on others for heals wasn't really the playstyle of the game, although grouping took place often.  Groups were great because after level 50 you could group with anyone 50+ and it would split XP evenly in the group.  Less people meant more XP split.  But the great thing was, even with a large group, you could still have 50% or higher XP split meaning you benefited hugely from a group of people slaughtering dozens of enemies at once.

 

  lorewise

Novice Member

Joined: 12/16/12
Posts: 17

12/18/12 2:25:12 AM#215

This discussion has created some interesting questions. In a recent interview with Gamebreaker, Greg Street the lead system designer for World Of Warcraft admitted that 25 man raiding suffers from logistical problems and most guilds / raid groups are adopting the 10 man set up. Because of this they feel like they have to incentivize 25 man raids by having better loot.

This makes me wonder, how many people actually like group content that requires more than 5-10 people? Do they enjoy it for that reason? If the biggest MMO in the world feels like their players will only play through content if the rewards are better than what's available in other content, what does that say about the game? What does it say about the players?

 

TLDR: If you really enjoy group content, would you still enjoy it if the in game rewards were no better than what could be achieved without a group?

  dreamscaper

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/14/08
Posts: 1208

12/18/12 3:31:16 AM#216
Originally posted by lorewise

TLDR: If you really enjoy group content, would you still enjoy it if the in game rewards were no better than what could be achieved without a group?

 

I'm a completionist. If it was indicated somehow that I had completed that content, then yes, I would. The loot isn't important to me, beyond aethetics.

<3

  Banaghran

Novice Member

Joined: 1/17/12
Posts: 872

12/18/12 4:05:50 AM#217
Originally posted by UsualSuspect
Originally posted by Banaghran

Why do you think a soloable mmo MUST have an ending?

Because if you can solo everything then it's naturally going to be easy to complete. Even the hardest single player game is just a case of timing and knowing when to hit the buttons, it's not rocket science. More players gives more room for error and more people to split the rewards between, hence there is a reason to repeat content. In a solo only game, once you've done something then that content is complete and you'll be wanting something else. It's not possible to give unlimited content in that fashion.

Soloable =/= singleplayer

Soloable == killable by a single player, by any means

Singleplayer == killable by a single player and balanced so that a player of a set skill in set quality gear and a toon of set power can comfortably complete it within a set amount of time

Again, and let me rephrase that, where do you see a difference between a solo player killing a mob (boss or otherwise) in 100 minutes while the group of 10 kills him 10 times in those 100 minutes?

It is not rocket science. :)

Where do you see a difference between raid grind hamster wheel and solo grind hamster wheel? Especially if either is optional.

So you'd want to repeat the same content on your own over and over? It would have to be a really good game for me to want to repeat something indefinitely.

So you want to exclusively complete the same content with the group over and over?

Why do you think "saving time and effort" is NO reason to group?

Why are you mentioning grouping when we're talking about a soloable game?

Just because you jumped to the wild conlusion that in a soloable game grouping MUST be pointless it does not mean everyone has.

Do you really think "soloable" means "as fast and utterly easy as with a group"?

It would have to be, especially if the game has different classes, as the content would have to be soloable by each one of those classes, otherwise the game fails as a solo experience. Naturally some of those classes are going to have an easier time than others, such as the Wizard who will have lots of damage but take few hits.

When did we go from "soloable" to "easy for all", just because you envision every pve experience as a 5minute dps race with enrages against a boss, not everyone does.

Do you really think 90% of the lfr crowd would even notice if the players would be replaced by NPCs ?

Yes. I'm not sure about the current WoW crowd but from the raids I've done, which have been EverQuest and Lord of the Rings Online (before they become little more than large group content), the raid was just something fun for the guild to do as a whole, while gaining extra equipment. Multiplayer games are about the people you're sharing the game with - perhaps that's the part you're missing out on and why you think a single player version would better suit you.

I am not quite sure of that :)

Flame on!

You smell like cheese.

:)

 

Flame on!

:)

  TwoThreeFour

Novice Member

Joined: 3/26/12
Posts: 2148

12/18/12 5:18:23 AM#218
Originally posted by Banaghran
Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
Originally posted by Banaghran
Originally posted by LadyEuphei
This thread should be closed on a mmo forum. This is rediculous. No mmo should be soloable, it is just AGH! I need to breathe...seriously this idea is rediculous and it makes no sense. If you want to solo and be by yourself go play a multiplayer card game in a corner with your imaginary friends.... 

This is a good example how narrow minded, burned out and jaded we have become as a community.

This person has never ever considered that the "soloability" could take , say, 10 times as long as the grouping, actually ENCOURAGING the grouping instead of FORCING it as the new mmos do and why everyone behaves like Dfense inside a pug raid.

Because in this twisted twilight zone we operate these days, the prolonged time required would be UNFAIR to all the soloers for some reason not even the soloers understand.

Flame on!

:)

 Your form of "encouragement" is what people would refer to as "forcing".

Compared to what exactly? Raids?

Flame on!

:)

If grouping is far more efficient than soloing, people would argue that this is equivalent to "forcing" them to group. 

  pkerguy

Novice Member

Joined: 7/04/08
Posts: 14

12/18/12 5:21:49 AM#219
Simply because it will beat the whole purpose of playing an MMO..that's why single player games exist..
  Banaghran

Novice Member

Joined: 1/17/12
Posts: 872

12/18/12 5:54:19 AM#220
Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
Originally posted by Banaghran
Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
Originally posted by Banaghran
Originally posted by LadyEuphei
This thread should be closed on a mmo forum. This is rediculous. No mmo should be soloable, it is just AGH! I need to breathe...seriously this idea is rediculous and it makes no sense. If you want to solo and be by yourself go play a multiplayer card game in a corner with your imaginary friends.... 

This is a good example how narrow minded, burned out and jaded we have become as a community.

This person has never ever considered that the "soloability" could take , say, 10 times as long as the grouping, actually ENCOURAGING the grouping instead of FORCING it as the new mmos do and why everyone behaves like Dfense inside a pug raid.

Because in this twisted twilight zone we operate these days, the prolonged time required would be UNFAIR to all the soloers for some reason not even the soloers understand.

Flame on!

:)

 Your form of "encouragement" is what people would refer to as "forcing".

Compared to what exactly? Raids?

Flame on!

:)

If grouping is far more efficient than soloing, people would argue that this is equivalent to "forcing" them to group. 

The efficiency is not given, you have to share with your groupmates.

And sure, if you have problems weighting the pros and cons of having the "hassle" with other individuals, you can go to the area of "I want to be a good mother, but i also want to raid, so, how do i make my toddler eat his dinner later so that i can raid?", but you will have to travel in that swamp of stupidity on your own.

Flame on!

:)

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