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General Discussion Forum » The Pub at MMORPG.COM » List of Sandbox MMOs - Sticky Please

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99 posts found
  azzamasin

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/06/12
Posts: 2827

We live in a fantasy world, a world of illusion. The great task in life is to find reality.

6/29/13 4:47:59 PM#41
Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by nerovipus32
Originally posted by bcbully

Age of Wushu. 

 

add to your list. It's probably the best on the list. if you like people more than space ships 15-20 million worldwide. 

How exactly is age of wushu a sandbox? You can't build things in that game.

 Show me in the definition of where you need to be able to build something to label it a sandbox.  Sandbox means non-linear, open ended gameplay. Period.

That's your definition. In my sandbox I built things...a game without "sand" isn't a sandbox to me.

 And you'd be wrong.

Of course he's right. Why call something a sandbox if you can't build anything?

The base of the appelation is the "sand" the player can mold. No "sand"... no sandbox.

I played AC1 for 7 years. It's not a sandbox. Or if AC1 is a sandbox, then WoW and GW2 (for instance) are too.

 WoW and GW2 aren't sandboxes because you are guided from creation to cap through certain zones and there is massive amounts of instancing to create the illusion of a dynamic world or to give you a story.

 

AC is a sandbox because yo ucan do anything go anywhere and progress, not only that you can progress how you want or not progress at all and still play the game.  Total freedom.

 

If your idea of a Sandbox is open FFA Full Loot PvP, full crafted world with minimal support for anything combat then your sandbox ideas are bad! Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

  Kazuhiro

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/03/07
Posts: 437

6/29/13 4:48:36 PM#42
Originally posted by legendsolo
Originally posted by azzamasin
Originally posted by nerovipus32
Originally posted by bcbully

Age of Wushu. 

 

add to your list. It's probably the best on the list. if you like people more than space ships 15-20 million worldwide. 

How exactly is age of wushu a sandbox? You can't build things in that game.

 Show me in the definition of where you need to be able to build something to label it a sandbox.  Sandbox means non-linear, open ended gameplay. Period.

that's how you define 'sandbox'.

how i see it: you have openworlds and sandboxes. In an open world the player can roam freely through the virtual world and is given freedom in how or when to approach objectives.No invisible walls and loading screens that block you from certain parts of the world.In a sandbox, the player has tools to modify the world themselves and create how they play. openworlds dont necessarily imply a sandbox. For me AoW is a openworld.

That is the one and only correct definition of a sandbox. Thank you sir for seperating openworld games and sandboxes properly. I award you one internet.

Ravenhill99: "All of the games out now and even the ones coming are either lobby console casual crap or Asian anime throw-up."

  User Deleted
 
OP  6/29/13 4:49:30 PM#43
Originally posted by DamonVile
Originally posted by mCalvert
Originally posted by legendsolo
there is already a list http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/349518

Ah well then, 1. mmorpg search box sucks and 2. mods, please sticky THAT thread, although mines a bit more strict I guess. Fallen Earth is not an obvious sandbox. It just has some elements.

That thread is just a bunch of ppl arguing about what a sandbox is and the OP almost never comes to the forums to update it.

This one of course will become just another argument but atleast you're active...for now :P

 

its not supposed to be a debate, just a list in the OP. Didn't know there was another one

  User Deleted
 
OP  6/29/13 4:53:54 PM#44
Originally posted by arieste

Fallen Earth is missing. 

 

Also, if you consider AO a sandbox, you can probably consider AoC one too, in terms of being able to build cities, attack other people's cities, etc.  They're both hybrids really.

AOC is definetly not a sandbox, Fallen Earth has some sandbox elements, but its basically on rails, quests, storyline.

  Jean-Luc_Picard

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/10/13
Posts: 2890

There... are... four... lights!

6/29/13 4:54:33 PM#45
Originally posted by azzamasin
 

AC is a sandbox because yo ucan do anything go anywhere and progress, not only that you can progress how you want or not progress at all and still play the game.  Total freedom.

Anyone who played AC1 knows this is totally wrong. Go to the obsidian plains at level 1, and you won't even touch the mobs, if you ever make it there. You'll be bashed so hard that your lifestone will flinch.

But that has nothing to do with what a sandbox is anyway. UO is a sandbox, yet you can't get into Hyloth and kill a dragon with a new character either, you'll get your ass handed to you properly and end a roasted newbie dragon meal. Sandbox never meant lack of progression, lack of character power increase.

I'm a big AC1 fan, but I won't try to turn the game into what it never was. You don't build anything in AC1 (except crafting, like in all other MMOs). You don't alter the world, the developers do that. A sandbox is a place where players alter the world actively, without developer intervention. They mold the sand.

AC1 is not a sandbox for the same reasons Age of Wushu or Guild Wars 2 aren't sandboxes.

Playing now: WoW, Landmark, GW2

Got a refund: Archeage. First refund since I started MMOs.

Top 3 MMORPGs played: UO, AC1 and WoW

Honorable mentions: AO, LotRO and GW2.

"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn. After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that neither does the ability to write.

  dalewj

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/24/12
Posts: 73

6/29/13 4:54:54 PM#46
Originally posted by mCalvert
Originally posted by arieste

Fallen Earth is missing. 

 

Also, if you consider AO a sandbox, you can probably consider AoC one too, in terms of being able to build cities, attack other people's cities, etc.  They're both hybrids really.

AOC is definetly not a sandbox, Fallen Earth has some sandbox elements, but its basically on rails, quests, storyline.

I agree its very quest driven

HomePage/Gaming Blog - http://dalewj.com . MMORPGer - Current game: http://AfterWorld.ru .
Author of Diaries of Afterworld- http://www.jconsult.com/afterworld and the Outside Sci-Fi series- http://www.jconsult.com/outside

  User Deleted
 
OP  6/29/13 4:56:19 PM#47
Originally posted by waynejr2
Originally posted by mCalvert
Originally posted by legendsolo
there is already a list http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/349518

Ah well then, 1. mmorpg search box sucks and 2. mods, please sticky THAT thread, although mines a bit more strict I guess. Fallen Earth is not an obvious sandbox. It just has some elements.

 You don't like it so it sucks.  Ok.  The world doesn't really work that way.

No, I mean I searched for 'sandbox' and got one result. Thus it sucks.

  User Deleted
 
OP  6/29/13 4:58:25 PM#48
Originally posted by AlmightyGod

Shores of Hazeron is another.

 

On sandbox definition: My opinion is that a sandbox must have some sort of free build or world editing element.  Other games are simply open-world, non-linear games.  If I see a tree, can I cut it down is always a good test.  Even games like DF and MO, where you can only build in certain areas, are semi-sandbox in my opinion.

Shores doesn't appear to be an MMORPG though.

  User Deleted
 
OP  6/29/13 5:00:22 PM#49
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by mCalvert
Originally posted by legendsolo
there is already a list http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/349518

Ah well then, 1. mmorpg search box sucks and 2. mods, please sticky THAT thread, although mines a bit more strict I guess. Fallen Earth is not an obvious sandbox. It just has some elements.

Everyone has their own criteria for it. The great part about that other thread is it has a set criteria and we've adhered to the criteria it assigns for the purpose of the thread. IMO, it's one of the most useful threads on the subject we've had here in years.

Well like I said, they should sticky that as you cant find it with a search. I don't mind abandoning this thread.

  User Deleted
 
OP  6/29/13 5:01:30 PM#50
Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
Originally posted by Loktofeit
Originally posted by mCalvert
Originally posted by legendsolo
there is already a list http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/349518

Ah well then, 1. mmorpg search box sucks and 2. mods, please sticky THAT thread, although mines a bit more strict I guess. Fallen Earth is not an obvious sandbox. It just has some elements.

Everyone has their own criteria for it. The great part about that other thread is it has a set criteria and we've adhered to the criteria it assigns for the purpose of the thread. IMO, it's one of the most useful threads on the subject we've had here in years.

This present thread would be "useful" if there weren't games which are obviously not sandboxes in the list. AO, while a good game, definitely isn't a sandbox. If you have UO and AO on the same list saying it's all sandbox MMOs, then the list is not credible. And don't get me started with Age of Wushu...

And threads trying to define what a sandbox should be have already been done by the dozen.

So yeah, this is just another thread trying to define what a sandbox is, and failing at it.

I agree the other list is MUCH better than this one, even though Mortal Online is still a "tricky" entry in any list because of it's failure to control PvP and therefore ending in a PvP gank fest instead of a sandbox allowing every play style to have fun.

That's what a sandbox is. The players control whether its a gankfest or not. They are given tools and decide what to do with them.

  Jean-Luc_Picard

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/10/13
Posts: 2890

There... are... four... lights!

6/29/13 5:05:56 PM#51
Originally posted by mCalvert

That's what a sandbox is. The players control whether its a gankfest or not. They are given tools and decide what to do with them.

Wrong. The "real world" is a sandbox, yet people most of the times don't kill each others in the streets mindlessly, and when they do, there are VERY harsh consequences often ending with the permanent loss of their own life.

The big flaw of most of those "sandbox wannabe" PvP gank fest games is that they didn't implement the drawbacks for being a serial killer properly. They forgot that in a video game, you have unlimited lives, therefore people don't care about the pathetic consequences those games implement for being an ass. Most asshats who enjoy more making other people's time miserable than to actually play the game don't care about the stupid limitation implemented because they just aren't harsh enough. You don't have life prison sentences and perma-death in video games.

A few games managed to do it properly, and they flourish. The others remain crappy niche games only played by those who enjoy killing each other all day long without any kind of depth to the gameplay.

Playing now: WoW, Landmark, GW2

Got a refund: Archeage. First refund since I started MMOs.

Top 3 MMORPGs played: UO, AC1 and WoW

Honorable mentions: AO, LotRO and GW2.

"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn. After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that neither does the ability to write.

  dalewj

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/24/12
Posts: 73

6/29/13 5:06:19 PM#52
a true sandbox is controlled a good deal by the players..  not easy but yes i have seen it

HomePage/Gaming Blog - http://dalewj.com . MMORPGer - Current game: http://AfterWorld.ru .
Author of Diaries of Afterworld- http://www.jconsult.com/afterworld and the Outside Sci-Fi series- http://www.jconsult.com/outside

  User Deleted
 
OP  6/29/13 5:07:29 PM#53

Anyhoo, back to the list, I don't mind removing things if theres a debate as to whether it qualifies. I supposed I will have to define my criteria since its not as obvious as I thought.

 

All obvious sandbox MMORPGs have some things in common:

 

freedom - the player is given tools and a general nudge in the right the direction to start but can then basically do whatever they want

open world - limited instancing and walls

massive number of players possible in one logical space

role playing - a general lore or story which sets the background

competition of some form

 

  User Deleted
 
OP  6/29/13 5:09:15 PM#54
Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
Originally posted by mCalvert

That's what a sandbox is. The players control whether its a gankfest or not. They are given tools and decide what to do with them.

Wrong. The "real world" is a sandbox, yet people most of the times don't kill each others in the streets mindlessly.

The big flaw of most of those "sandbox wannabe" PvP gank fest games is that they didn't implement the drawbacks for being a serial killer properly. They forgot that in a video game, you have unlimited lives, therefore people don't care about the pathetic consequences those games implement for being an ass.

A few games managed to do it properly, and they flourish. The others remain crappy niche games only played by those who enjoy killing each other all day long without any kind of depth to the gameplay.

In mortal you don't HAVE to kill each other. Same as in EVE. You can exist by avoiding everyone. Its also a GAME. Its fun because there is competition, be it trade or combat. This is not a virtual world, this is a game.

  Jean-Luc_Picard

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/10/13
Posts: 2890

There... are... four... lights!

6/29/13 5:26:48 PM#55
Originally posted by mCalvert
Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
Originally posted by mCalvert

That's what a sandbox is. The players control whether its a gankfest or not. They are given tools and decide what to do with them.

Wrong. The "real world" is a sandbox, yet people most of the times don't kill each others in the streets mindlessly.

The big flaw of most of those "sandbox wannabe" PvP gank fest games is that they didn't implement the drawbacks for being a serial killer properly. They forgot that in a video game, you have unlimited lives, therefore people don't care about the pathetic consequences those games implement for being an ass.

A few games managed to do it properly, and they flourish. The others remain crappy niche games only played by those who enjoy killing each other all day long without any kind of depth to the gameplay.

In mortal you don't HAVE to kill each other. Same as in EVE. You can exist by avoiding everyone. Its also a GAME. Its fun because there is competition, be it trade or combat. This is not a virtual world, this is a game.

Comparing EvE to MO is killing your credibility. The second is a badly designed gank fest played by a small niche, while the first one (EvE) is the most successful sandbox MMORPG for now.

You never have to kill each other, yet when no well designed safeguards are implemented, some people will just do it because they can and don't have to fear any noticeable repercussions. That's the difference between a poorly designed game and a masterwork like EvE.

Playing now: WoW, Landmark, GW2

Got a refund: Archeage. First refund since I started MMOs.

Top 3 MMORPGs played: UO, AC1 and WoW

Honorable mentions: AO, LotRO and GW2.

"The ability to speak doesn't make you intelligent" - Qui-gon Jinn. After many years of reading Internet forums, there's no doubt that neither does the ability to write.

  Quirhid

Elite Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5725

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

6/29/13 6:53:19 PM#56
Admins should steer clear from the minefield and not sticky any thread similar to this. It would be just asking for trouble.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  Robokapp

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/15/09
Posts: 4813

The only luck I had today was to have you as my opponent.

6/29/13 6:54:36 PM#57
Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
Originally posted by mCalvert

That's what a sandbox is. The players control whether its a gankfest or not. They are given tools and decide what to do with them.

Wrong. The "real world" is a sandbox, yet people most of the times don't kill each others in the streets mindlessly, and when they do, there are VERY harsh consequences often ending with the permanent loss of their own life.

I'm not sure the american suburbia is a good sample of the real world, sir. 

  User Deleted
 
OP  6/29/13 7:05:40 PM#58
Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
Originally posted by mCalvert
Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
Originally posted by mCalvert

That's what a sandbox is. The players control whether its a gankfest or not. They are given tools and decide what to do with them.

Wrong. The "real world" is a sandbox, yet people most of the times don't kill each others in the streets mindlessly.

The big flaw of most of those "sandbox wannabe" PvP gank fest games is that they didn't implement the drawbacks for being a serial killer properly. They forgot that in a video game, you have unlimited lives, therefore people don't care about the pathetic consequences those games implement for being an ass.

A few games managed to do it properly, and they flourish. The others remain crappy niche games only played by those who enjoy killing each other all day long without any kind of depth to the gameplay.

In mortal you don't HAVE to kill each other. Same as in EVE. You can exist by avoiding everyone. Its also a GAME. Its fun because there is competition, be it trade or combat. This is not a virtual world, this is a game.

Comparing EvE to MO is killing your credibility. The second is a badly designed gank fest played by a small niche, while the first one (EvE) is the most successful sandbox MMORPG for now.

You never have to kill each other, yet when no well designed safeguards are implemented, some people will just do it because they can and don't have to fear any noticeable repercussions. That's the difference between a poorly designed game and a masterwork like EvE.

Whatever.

  User Deleted
 
OP  6/29/13 7:06:26 PM#59
Originally posted by Quirhid
Admins should steer clear from the minefield and not sticky any thread similar to this. It would be just asking for trouble.

They already did. Look at the stickies.

  User Deleted
6/29/13 7:12:48 PM#60

And hopefully there NEVER will be a way to filter it.

Sandbox means too many things to too many people for it to be seen as a defined category. Just think of the rage threads against MMORPG.com every time someone didn't like their interpretation of the word 'sandbox'. What a waste of forum space that would be.

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