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The Secret World Forum » Beta Reviews & Impressions [ARCHIVED] » I really want to like this game. But I can't.

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77 posts found
  euthanasian

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/17/12
Posts: 2

6/17/12 3:19:04 AM#41

I just wanted to throw my support behind Adele on the immersion breaking with your own character thing...

Saying that people that don't like the Dragon scene are 'homophobic' in this thread is really off base. As a homosexual male myself, I found that scene tasteless and it certainly ripped me out of the game. When I play MMO's, I am usually never presented with a romantic/sexual scenario. I usually play with the mindset of how I would play in those scenarios, and so when I saw my character being seduced by this woman, my first thought was "WTF, I don't even get a CHOICE?"

The way that whole scene was shot, with her sitting on my chest and having her lower her head to my off-camera crotch was really, really crass. This is a whole different debate, but sexuality CAN be used relatively well in video games (ie. Catherine) but this smelled much more like heterosexual male pandering (ie Fear Effect). In the end, it was jarring to have control torn away from our characters during a scene that seemed very important to setting up who WE are as players. 

Also... Being half Korean, I know what kumiho are... And when they are in stories, they always retain some sort of fox-like characteristic when they shape shift... This woman had no indicator at all that she was a kumiho when looking at her, and I think that is very poor design. If this is supposed to be a kumiho, we are supposed to have a certain 'tell'. No fox-paw charm, no feline-like eyes, no fangs, not even a fox tattoo! This was just... very poorly thought out.

Personally, I was constantly distracted by my character not looking at people that were talking to him in cutscenes.... lol!

http://i.imgur.com/jAHlX.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/5MvPO.jpg

But again... the poor animation has been discussed many times before... haha

  Poison_Adele

Novice Member

Joined: 9/01/08
Posts: 293

 
OP  6/17/12 4:18:21 AM#42
Originally posted by euthanasian

I just wanted to throw my support behind Adele on the immersion breaking with your own character thing...

Saying that people that don't like the Dragon scene are 'homophobic' in this thread is really off base. As a homosexual male myself, I found that scene tasteless and it certainly ripped me out of the game. When I play MMO's, I am usually never presented with a romantic/sexual scenario. I usually play with the mindset of how I would play in those scenarios, and so when I saw my character being seduced by this woman, my first thought was "WTF, I don't even get a CHOICE?"

The way that whole scene was shot, with her sitting on my chest and having her lower her head to my off-camera crotch was really, really crass. This is a whole different debate, but sexuality CAN be used relatively well in video games (ie. Catherine) but this smelled much more like heterosexual male pandering (ie Fear Effect). In the end, it was jarring to have control torn away from our characters during a scene that seemed very important to setting up who WE are as players. 

Also... Being half Korean, I know what kumiho are... And when they are in stories, they always retain some sort of fox-like characteristic when they shape shift... This woman had no indicator at all that she was a kumiho when looking at her, and I think that is very poor design. If this is supposed to be a kumiho, we are supposed to have a certain 'tell'. No fox-paw charm, no feline-like eyes, no fangs, not even a fox tattoo! This was just... very poorly thought out.

Personally, I was constantly distracted by my character not looking at people that were talking to him in cutscenes.... lol!

http://i.imgur.com/jAHlX.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/5MvPO.jpg

But again... the poor animation has been discussed many times before... haha

You! Said this all much better than me. And thank you for the defense/support. 

I noticed the weird blank-eyedness too in that scene, but at the time I just figured my character was shell-shocked. I'm seeing it more now, and starting to think it's just poor cinematic design. Which I'm fine with, so long as the poor cinematic design isn't 100% necessary to watch (which it often is) or discomfort-inducing (the seduction scene).

It's a shame, I really like the dragon faction and if I do decide to purchase (which there's a very weak chance of) I'm going to deny that weird scene ever happened...lol

  Isawa

Novice Member

Joined: 6/20/08
Posts: 1066

6/17/12 4:52:06 AM#43
Originally posted by LaZyBuTCrAzY

My issues with this game:

- Combat/Animations: Disappointing. Couldn't keep my interest longer then 5 mins. Dodging, evading, hack and slash, nothing feels right. After spending 2 days on blade/blood I never want to touch them again. And this is the problem with the skill wheel, unlike GW2 I can't change weapons w/o worrying abt skills. If I'm investing so much effort in leveling my weapon it should feel rewarding, not the other way around.

 Hope? The only thing left is PvP. That will make or break TSW for me.

Combat/animations have been and continue to be improved in each patch.

Other than that, did you try a dungeon? I have beta, but not weekend ;) so, I am not entirely sure what is offered.

Originally posted by Poison_Adele

Simply put: just because women in the game aren't dressed up like porn stars doesn't mean that particular scene wasn't handled with all the delicacy of a tweenage boy.

Don't think anyone is going to shift from their original position I am also somewhat surprised that the "neanderthal" appearance of SW's characters wasn't included to support someone's claim! oh well.

  User Deleted
6/17/12 4:55:47 AM#44

I agree, the dragon intro, and notably the lesbian sex scene (since my dragon character is female), made me feel I was totally out of control of was is MY character. SW:TOR is definitely superior there, in such situations, you always had a choice.

  Connmacart

Novice Member

Joined: 2/24/12
Posts: 693

6/17/12 5:00:53 AM#45
Originally posted by eluldor
Originally posted by LaZyBuTCrAzY

My issues with this game:

- Combat/Animations: Disappointing. Couldn't keep my interest longer then 5 mins. Dodging, evading, hack and slash, nothing feels right. After spending 2 days on blade/blood I never want to touch them again. And this is the problem with the skill wheel, unlike GW2 I can't change weapons w/o worrying abt skills. If I'm investing so much effort in leveling my weapon it should feel rewarding, not the other way around.

 Hope? The only thing left is PvP. That will make or break TSW for me.

Combat/animations have been and continue to be improved in each patch.

Other than that, did you try a dungeon? I have beta, but not weekend ;) so, I am not entirely sure what is offered.

Originally posted by Poison_Adele

Simply put: just because women in the game aren't dressed up like porn stars doesn't mean that particular scene wasn't handled with all the delicacy of a tweenage boy.

Don't think anyone is going to shift from their original position I am also somewhat surprised that the "neanderthal" appearance of SW's characters wasn't included to support someone's claim! oh well.

Combat and animations will not improve drastically enough for it not to be awkward anymore until they completely redo them. This would take about a year unless they fully focus on it. 

Some of the cutscenes are really bad when you look at the animations. The first 2 cutscenes in the illuminati areas the NPCs looked liked dolls on strings. Ofcourse the crazy doctors voice really didn't fit either.

Furthermore the game is said to be a mature game, but to be honest from the amount of cursing used ingame I wiould call it quite immature. Cursing only shows an immature mind to me.

  Isawa

Novice Member

Joined: 6/20/08
Posts: 1066

6/17/12 5:13:57 AM#46
Originally posted by Connmacart

Furthermore the game is said to be a mature game, but to be honest from the amount of cursing used ingame I wiould call it quite immature. Cursing only shows an immature mind to me.

I feel like that particular bit is a solid reflection on society. The lack of cursing would, for me, appear awkward and unrealistic in a game in this setting. Just because the actions of the npcs may accurately depict society, doesn't mean those individual npcs may be "immature" if we're going to be applying such terms to npcs haha...

  Connmacart

Novice Member

Joined: 2/24/12
Posts: 693

6/17/12 5:28:53 AM#47
Originally posted by eluldor
Originally posted by Connmacart

Furthermore the game is said to be a mature game, but to be honest from the amount of cursing used ingame I wiould call it quite immature. Cursing only shows an immature mind to me.

I feel like that particular bit is a solid reflection on society. The lack of cursing would, for me, appear awkward and unrealistic in a game in this setting. Just because the actions of the npcs may accurately depict society, doesn't mean those individual npcs may be "immature" if we're going to be applying such terms to npcs haha...

I disagree, in my enviroment people do not go around cursing all the time. If it is in your case than all I can say is move to a better place. Also it isn't that the npcs are immature it's that the writing is immature.

  Poison_Adele

Novice Member

Joined: 9/01/08
Posts: 293

 
OP  6/17/12 5:35:25 AM#48
Originally posted by Connmacart
Originally posted by eluldor
Originally posted by Connmacart

Furthermore the game is said to be a mature game, but to be honest from the amount of cursing used ingame I wiould call it quite immature. Cursing only shows an immature mind to me.

I feel like that particular bit is a solid reflection on society. The lack of cursing would, for me, appear awkward and unrealistic in a game in this setting. Just because the actions of the npcs may accurately depict society, doesn't mean those individual npcs may be "immature" if we're going to be applying such terms to npcs haha...

I disagree, in my enviroment people do not go around cursing all the time. If it is in your case than all I can say is move to a better place. Also it isn't that the npcs are immature it's that the writing is immature.

Hm, perhaps you're missing the point. It's never the amount of cursing but how realistically it's placed in the dialogue. Just because you feel it's in bad form to swear, doesn't mean that swearing isn't something that a lot of people do quite often, especially in stressful situations (ie zombie apocalypses) or when they're trying to look cool.

For a game that has you kill pregnant sea-zombies, forces cunnilingus on you, and faces dark themes head on, the inclusion of swearing is pretty natural and not at all out of place.  If there's a reason the person should be swearing, it makes sense that the writer would allow the dialogue to flow however it must to sound the most natural.

  Sameer1979

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/11/12
Posts: 385

6/17/12 5:41:39 AM#49
Originally posted by Connmacart
Originally posted by eluldor
Originally posted by Connmacart

Furthermore the game is said to be a mature game, but to be honest from the amount of cursing used ingame I wiould call it quite immature. Cursing only shows an immature mind to me.

I feel like that particular bit is a solid reflection on society. The lack of cursing would, for me, appear awkward and unrealistic in a game in this setting. Just because the actions of the npcs may accurately depict society, doesn't mean those individual npcs may be "immature" if we're going to be applying such terms to npcs haha...

I disagree, in my enviroment people do not go around cursing all the time. If it is in your case than all I can say is move to a better place. Also it isn't that the npcs are immature it's that the writing is immature.

People surely love to blow up things here to make a point. In all the 40 or so missions i have done i heard cursing like 2 or 3 times in total. And it goes with the theme too. There is difference between cursing to act cool and cursing according to situation you are in.

Writing can be cheesy and immature even without cursing and GW2 is prime example of how not to write a childish and immature story and dialouges.

 

 

  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6495

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

6/17/12 5:41:48 AM#50
Originally posted by Tamanous

Now if anyone bothered to read the lore on those two characters in the room they would have found out the guy is actually a half-demon and the woman isn't even human at all. She is a 1000+ year old kumiho. It can be discribed as an eastern fey creature typically in the form of a fox or woman. They are known for two things: 1. seducing humans and corrupting morals and 2. eating human flesh.

 

Now seeing that some posting here seem rather clueless about role playing games let me point out that fey ...

A little kitsune lore makes it a killer game to play, stellar roleplaying?

Usually it's categorized under the "terrible fanfic" or even "non-human erotica" category.

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  AdamTM

Novice Member

Joined: 5/05/05
Posts: 1395

I'M PUNCHING YOUR SALAD!!!!

6/17/12 6:27:13 AM#51
Originally posted by Icewhite
Originally posted by Tamanous

Now if anyone bothered to read the lore on those two characters in the room they would have found out the guy is actually a half-demon and the woman isn't even human at all. She is a 1000+ year old kumiho. It can be discribed as an eastern fey creature typically in the form of a fox or woman. They are known for two things: 1. seducing humans and corrupting morals and 2. eating human flesh.

 

Now seeing that some posting here seem rather clueless about role playing games let me point out that fey ...

A little kitsune lore makes it a killer game to play, stellar roleplaying?

Usually it's categorized under the "terrible fanfic" or even "non-human erotica" category.

Now you are just trolling man...

  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6495

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

6/17/12 6:33:17 AM#52
Originally posted by AdamTM

Now you are just trolling man...

Sorry, his arrogance got to me.  Sometimes you just want to poke the ego balloon with a pin.

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  revelationmd

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/05/12
Posts: 33

6/17/12 6:35:02 AM#53

Well for my 2 cents..

1) Combat. It's poor, but nowhere near as bad a I was expecting from reading these forums after the last BWE. So, strangely, it's not my major gripe.

2) Horror setting. This for me, is the real letdown. Going back some 20 odd years to my d&d days my favourite setting by far was Ravenloft. For those that don't know, Ravenloft was pseudo medieval fantasy world (think wow) but with "something eerily strange". It's hard to explain but let me put it this way: when my d&d group killed vampires in a forgotten realms campaign we were just killing mobs with a few handy abilities to try and avoid, when my Ravenloft group came up against vampires you were actually frightened; the scenes were set subtly, the horror grew slowly, the anticipation of coming up against an eternal embodiment of pure evil was in some ways more unnerving than the encounter itself. The scene of the village under assault from the vampire was one of surface normality yet with an underlying air of menace and panic.

Contrast this with Kingstown - zombies everywhere & demons patrolling mindlessly. Change the zombie skins to gnolls and the demon skins to boars and you would hear shouts of "LFM Hogger". This is not how you build a horror setting.

3) Voice acted cutscenes. These were OK for me, nothing more, nothing less. I wonder how quickly the old 'track & field style' space bar mashing of SWTOR cutscenes will kick in. With the horror element so unsubtle and dumbed down I can't see players 'making the effort' to immerse themselves in the story by sitting through the cutscenes only to have to step outside to pwn zombie number 73,652.

4) Single player instances. Why? This game if done right could have been a brilliant mmo for role playing. When I first heard about this game I thought 'a cross between Ravenloft and Paranoia? - excellent!' But the game actively discourages grouping - splitting groups up every few quests or so. To me it looks like this game is aimed at a niche market (puzzle solvers and role players), but they have gone out of their way to put these natural team-players off.

5) Shared intro/starter zone. I didn't play the first BWE but according to a RL friend her Templars intro and starter zone was the same as our new illuminati characters. If that's right, that is nothing short of shoddy IMHO. May start a dragon today just to see what the fuss is about their intro and starting zone.

6) Puzzles. From what I have seen, these are really well done - I especially like the custom props you can pick up and examine (kids drawings, maps etc).

7) UI. Attractive, minimalist but poorly responsive. Had to run from one side of the map to the other with one of those custom props I rave about dragged to the base of the screen because the (x) to close it wasn't responding. Character creation was nothing short of painful with slider bars that just refused to slide reliably.

All in all, I probably have to add my name to the "I really wanted to like this game, but I can't" list...

  Tamanous

Elite Member

Joined: 3/22/09
Posts: 1788

6/19/12 1:11:42 AM#54
Originally posted by Icewhite
Originally posted by AdamTM

Now you are just trolling man...

Sorry, his arrogance got to me.  Sometimes you just want to poke the ego balloon with a pin.

I choose my words carefully for the most part. I specifically mention "some players". If this does not apply to you then I suggest you choose not to globally distribute my specific points of reference onto your very apparent insecurities. 

 

Two (or more) posters viewed explicitly obvious homophobic opinions based on ignorance and out of context assumptions without an effort to do research in a game where the developers tell you to "do research" and you think the problem resides with me? Oh no indeed, I will not coddle peevish pink haired posters and the like who can't handle learned opinions.

You stay sassy!

  Deathofsage

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/11/11
Posts: 1010

Honestly:
FFXI Fanboy
RIFT hater.
Stop rewarding wow-clones.

6/19/12 4:05:16 AM#55
Originally posted by Tocks

So I heard about this game looking for things to play while waiting for another game to come out (bet you can guess which one). I was a real fan of VtM: Bloodlines for the PC, and have always wanted to play a game like TSW set out to be. A story-driven, dark experience. I'm in love with the setting! And the quest system sounded different enough. I went in ready for a real inspired experience, not a typical MMO experience. 

Details:

  • Cheesy references, cheesy references everywhere. References are awesome but I'm surprised that the team behind such a well designed world and story would scatter them so obviously and carelessly. It really ruined both the potential magic of the references and contributed to my loss of immersion. 
  • The combat is worse than industry standard. It seems that the MMO community is generally willing to accept boring combat up until around level 20. Unfortunately, it's hard to judge progression in TSW, so it's entirely probable that I'm being unfair. Regardless, the combat felt worse than most low-end combat I've experienced in MMOs, it being a poorly implemented combination of more active combat styles like GW2, TERA, DDO, and WoW-clone style tab targeting (I cannot tell you how annoying it was to be unable to attack things right in front of me because my target had long since ran off)/hotkeying. This forced me to pay attention to the combat without actually being rewarded with any fun for doing so. Not cool. 
I'm still keeping an eye on TSW, and I will keep showing up for every beta in the hopes that the combat and animations are eventually improved, but as is I will not be spending my money on another Funcom failure.

What do you mean by cheesy references? I haven't found references to be cheesy. They haven't described it this way, but the game is almost like an alternate universe of our own reality. It's our world, but things have gone horribly wrong.

Pre-launch, fans are always soooo annoying to deal with. It's nice to see others with legitmate complaints about the combat. They put way too much effort into combat that isn't fun.

I can't tell you how torn I feel. I enjoy most quests but I logout after a few hours of play because the combat irritates me. I get sick of the diehard fans saying "If you don't like it, play something else". There's nothing like TSW in the areas it excels, unfortunately it lacked on a lame combat system.

I honestly wish the combat was standard-fare with all efforts going to the questing. They've really failed in their attempt to be different in the combat department.

Combat frustrates me because it is extremely boring.

I'm sliding closer to skeptic/hater which is sad because I really wanted to enjoy this game but the first news of the cash shop was the beginning of my descent from fanhood.

Don't care. They're charging standard-full sub fee and a cash shop? Pure greed, and I don't the vague things they've said.

 

I'm an adult.. and I liked the beginning Dragon scene (because it startled the crap out of me) but I'm uncomfortable that children may be playing this game.

Here's how I'd design the dragon cs in question:

You talk to an npc, and he tells you that he, or the girl or the tattooed gentleman would be happy to induct you, but be warned that they're a bit more edgy in comparison to his all business style.

Spec'ing properly is a gateway drug.
12 Million People have been meter spammed in heroics.
Placing bets Blizzard's "Titan" will be a wow-clone.

  DaezAster

Novice Member

Joined: 6/18/12
Posts: 790

6/19/12 4:56:33 AM#56

That dragon opening doesnt sound half as bad as the templar one with the magic bug.

I agree with the overall opinion and think the combat alone will kill this game though it will have plenty of help from other things such as the cash shop on top of the sub and the mute character you get to play. 

What's extra crazy is just how many people seem to want to like this game and just cant, I personally am one and my friend who tried it gave up on it quicker than I did but it seems to be the overwhelming view.

  TheSedated

Novice Member

Joined: 7/22/04
Posts: 84

6/19/12 10:20:41 AM#57
Originally posted by euthanasian

I just wanted to throw my support behind Adele on the immersion breaking with your own character thing...

Saying that people that don't like the Dragon scene are 'homophobic' in this thread is really off base. As a homosexual male myself, I found that scene tasteless and it certainly ripped me out of the game. When I play MMO's, I am usually never presented with a romantic/sexual scenario. I usually play with the mindset of how I would play in those scenarios, and so when I saw my character being seduced by this woman, my first thought was "WTF, I don't even get a CHOICE?"

The way that whole scene was shot, with her sitting on my chest and having her lower her head to my off-camera crotch was really, really crass. This is a whole different debate, but sexuality CAN be used relatively well in video games (ie. Catherine) but this smelled much more like heterosexual male pandering (ie Fear Effect). In the end, it was jarring to have control torn away from our characters during a scene that seemed very important to setting up who WE are as players. 

You (and many others) really missed the point of that scene.

1.) What we see in the dragon intro (and the other ones, too) are initiation rites. They're performed in three different ways and produce the dream/hallucination of the Tokyo Flashback (the subway dungeon tutorial). First way is the Dragons, performing sexual interaction, then the Illuminati, forcing drugs on you and the Templars use a kind of hypnosis/meditation. These three ways are described in the books belonging to the Cthulhu-myth (not only H. P. Lovecraft, but also the Illuminatus! trilogy and other books) and they were also used by real world cults and tribes.

2.) You're complaining about a lack of control. That's right. You are not in control. In TSW, you're not the hero or something, you're just a small part of the secret organisations, not in charge of anything. In the Illuminati intro there's a very important sentence which describes it all. "Find us, or we'll find you." You really have no choice.

The Dragon intro is lacking a bit when it comes to make this clear. But also there's a different mindset needed for playing TSW. In most other MMO's you're "in charge", you're the big hero and everyone's happy to see you. In TSW, this is not the case. You're not anyone special, you're just a person which happens to have some magic powers and the factions use you to fulfill their higher goals. And that's something where TSW is quite good in to show you and very close to the literary it's inspired by.

  MMO_REVIEWER

Novice Member

Joined: 8/20/09
Posts: 374

MMO's are the ark of the gaming world. let it take us in new directions

6/19/12 4:31:39 PM#58
Originally posted by cutthecrap
Originally posted by Poison_Adele

2. It's not a lack of maturity on the part of players to feel awkward and uncomfortable with the unsubtle, hamhanded and immature way the developers of the game force certain things down your throat. Little tip here: the inclusion of sexual themes is not automatically a marker of maturity. In fact a lot of people often feel otherwise. Take a look at TERA--now, they could have designed TERA in a way that was mature. A land where people dressed with little shame, where sexuality was more liberated, where the major republic was a more enlightened and sexually progressive state. Instead, they forced everyone to look like porn stars. Revealing skin and open sexuality could have been designed into that game in a more careful way, instead they designed the game with the maturity of a fifteen-year-old boy and forced it on players.

Actually, they're treating sexuality in a very mature, no nonsense way, by not making a big fuss about it. There's a very big difference in that Dragon scene in TSW or how sexuality is treated in games like TERA or singleplayer games (too many examples) on one side.

The biggest example is, look how sexuality is treated in the rest of the game: regular clothes, no overdose of lsexy underwear/bikini armor and miniskirts and skin (TERA, Aion are good examples but not the only ones), no oversexualised character models, that should already give a clue of the attitude towards sexuality in TSW, a casual, down-to-earth one. The whole Dragon scene wasn't a break of that, certainly not immature because it fitted perfectly in the TSW lore and setting.

I didn't have a problem with the scene, nor did I feel embarassed or get aroused by it: Illuminati got drugged to transfer to a past event, Templar got hypnotised and Dragon got seduced and mesmerised to get transferred, nothing more to it. There isn't even a loveline a la Bioware games about it, it was just getting down to business and getting you there where you needed to be. Nothing immature about it.

I can see how some people might feel uncomfortable about it, just like people can feel uncomfortable when confronted with nudists even when for them it's nothing special, but that doesn't mean that some people's discomfort means that nudism is immature. Neither is the Dragon astral transfer scene.

 

Seriously, it should be obvious that the whole approach towards sexuality in a TSW or TERA is miles, miles apart: in one is the appeal to sensuality and sexuality one of the core foundations, while in the other the single sensual scene ingame is a casual, business-as-usual no big deal thing: nothing to romanticize or glorify but also nothing to shy away from. If anything, it's a more mature or adult approach than the (adolescent) oversexualisation you see done in MMO's - TERA, MMO bikini armor etc - and a hell of a lot of singleplayer games.

+10 INTERNETS. Well said.

MMO's are the ark of the gaming world. Let it take us in new directions.

  Thane

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/14/03
Posts: 1919

I'm a leaf on the wind. Watch how I soar.

6/19/12 4:38:50 PM#59

seriously? all that rage because of one scene?

 

everyone talking about "mature" here, but you cry over some little romance that has been "forced" on you? (sounds abit extreme, but that was the term that was used i think hehe)

i wonder how you raged over the duke *G*

 

it's a game, that first char we met surely was not unimportant, but since this isnt the dating world, i dont think it'S a major concern in the story or conflict in the game ^^

maybe you missunderstood the game abit... just wondering

"I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"

  MMO_REVIEWER

Novice Member

Joined: 8/20/09
Posts: 374

MMO's are the ark of the gaming world. let it take us in new directions

6/19/12 4:43:07 PM#60
Originally posted by Connmacart
Originally posted by eluldor
Originally posted by Connmacart

Furthermore the game is said to be a mature game, but to be honest from the amount of cursing used ingame I wiould call it quite immature. Cursing only shows an immature mind to me.

I feel like that particular bit is a solid reflection on society. The lack of cursing would, for me, appear awkward and unrealistic in a game in this setting. Just because the actions of the npcs may accurately depict society, doesn't mean those individual npcs may be "immature" if we're going to be applying such terms to npcs haha...

I disagree, in my enviroment people do not go around cursing all the time. If it is in your case than all I can say is move to a better place. Also it isn't that the npcs are immature it's that the writing is immature.

This 'immature dialogue' argument makes me think this:

"hey we have these words over here in this box covered in stickers...Don't use those words..."

"Why?"

"Because they're bad..."

"Well if they're bad, then why do they exist?"

Many profane words we are capable of suggesting have a very specific function. The easiest example to give is "fuck" the most versatile word in the english language(literally). If it's not safe to use these words here, in a fantasy space, then where is it safe to use them? If you say nowhere...then why do the hell do they exist?

"We exist to not be used..."

It's almost as bad as the N-word argument and who is 'allowed' to use it. Though I'd rather not open that can of worms.

All I can really say is; if you can't handle a word as versatile as "fuck" then who is really the immature one? It's not my place to point the finger at one side or the other, but think of this:

Is it immature to use the word, or immature to not handle the word well?

EDIT: Of course, I'm using "fuck" as an example, but the idea is there. Fuck can simply refer to all profane words.

MMO's are the ark of the gaming world. Let it take us in new directions.

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