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The Secret World Forum » Beta Reviews & Impressions [ARCHIVED] » The Secret World is the most original and complex MMORPG I have ever played

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143 posts found
  Derpybird

Novice Member

Joined: 4/02/12
Posts: 1006

6/14/12 6:27:11 PM#121
Originally posted by cooper85

I think much of the feeling stems from the fact that there are no predetermined rotations. You have to design you build and your rotaion for pve.  It's not easy after awhile you find a balance.

 

Example do I go with 2 builders, or 1. If I replace a builder with a more powerful consumer will I have enough X to consistanly get my finishers of.  Should I add a 3rd or a forth finisher? Do the cooldowns flow together? 

 

These are all questions you need to ask after you figure out what type of build you want to run. 

My assessment does not stem from a lack of understanding of the skill wheel nor am I looking for an easy rotation.

You see a lot of complexity there, and there certainly can be. I think this will play itself out MOSTLY in PvP theorycrafting and in harder dungeons, where you will probably need the correct build with complementary debuffing abilities. For example, I like the shotgun skill that stacks and decreases the damage done to you. So yes, you can build something theoretically interesting.

But in practice, I do a lot of pressing "1" because nothing happens without my builder. So I end up with a rotation that looks like 1-1-1-1-1-5  7  1-1-1-1-2-2 back to 1-1-1-1-1-5 and so on, with kneecapper thrown in to kite (which is habit and not always necessary), managing the cooldowns but ALWAYS returning to my builder. 

Strangely, I wouldn't even mind if the builder was an auto-attack (at least the option) so that I could just manage my other more interesting abilities.

So in sum, yes, theorycrafters may like figuring out synergy as they unlock things, but I want the PvE combat to feel more "fun" (which is of course subjective anyway), be more visually appealing, and be less frequent.

However, I appreciate that people may like it as is, and no one is making a game just for me.

"Loading screens" are not "instances".
Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.

  cooper85

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/12
Posts: 390

6/14/12 6:32:49 PM#122
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by cooper85
 

Since Aero wont respond, would agree that you can skip 95-99% of those kill quests? 

 

You have to plan your attack. You need to look at the area. See where you have room to kite and dodge. I can safly say anyone playing TSW for one month will know the basics of raiding. The game will teach you how to play, or you will quit.

you could skip 99% of quests in TERA as well but wouldn't make advancement very efficient. But yes the ones i find tedious and annoying aren't major story plots or anything and could be skipped. But honestly most MMO's you can skip a ton of quests in rift you could level to cap with just doing pvp and dungeons after level 10 if you wanted.

...You can skip an entire form (Kill x x times) of quest in TSW by design and not gimp yourself or have to grind mobs. It's not the same thing as cherry picking quests in Tera.

 

You can do just the story and sabatoge, or sabotage and investigations. Or you can be like me and thank the heavens and grab every kill X quest I can find. 

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

6/14/12 6:34:25 PM#123
Originally posted by cooper85
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by cooper85
 

Since Aero wont respond, would agree that you can skip 95-99% of those kill quests? 

 

You have to plan your attack. You need to look at the area. See where you have room to kite and dodge. I can safly say anyone playing TSW for one month will know the basics of raiding. The game will teach you how to play, or you will quit.

you could skip 99% of quests in TERA as well but wouldn't make advancement very efficient. But yes the ones i find tedious and annoying aren't major story plots or anything and could be skipped. But honestly most MMO's you can skip a ton of quests in rift you could level to cap with just doing pvp and dungeons after level 10 if you wanted.

...You can skip an entire form (Kill x x times) of quest in TSW by design and not gimp yourself or have to grind mobs. It's not the same thing as cherry picking quests in Tera.

 

You can do just the story and sabatoge, or sabotage and investigations. Or you can be like me and thank the heavens and grab every kill X quest I can find

if that's your cup of tea you must love TERA heh...

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  cooper85

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/12
Posts: 390

6/14/12 6:41:31 PM#124
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by cooper85
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by cooper85
 

Since Aero wont respond, would agree that you can skip 95-99% of those kill quests? 

 

You have to plan your attack. You need to look at the area. See where you have room to kite and dodge. I can safly say anyone playing TSW for one month will know the basics of raiding. The game will teach you how to play, or you will quit.

you could skip 99% of quests in TERA as well but wouldn't make advancement very efficient. But yes the ones i find tedious and annoying aren't major story plots or anything and could be skipped. But honestly most MMO's you can skip a ton of quests in rift you could level to cap with just doing pvp and dungeons after level 10 if you wanted.

...You can skip an entire form (Kill x x times) of quest in TSW by design and not gimp yourself or have to grind mobs. It's not the same thing as cherry picking quests in Tera.

 

You can do just the story and sabatoge, or sabotage and investigations. Or you can be like me and thank the heavens and grab every kill X quest I can find

if that's your cup of tea you must love TERA heh...

lol I don't think so ;)

 

The kill quests in TSW are much more involved where as in WoW or tera it may take 10 minutes to do a kill quest and auto attack your way through (idk if that's true about Tera). The kill quests in TSW are pretty damn challenging espeacially the name mob at the end. A kill quest in TSW will have 4-5 parts and could take an hour depending how far you decided to push the content. 

 

btw you are rewarded for each update ;)

  cutthecrap

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/29/12
Posts: 608

6/14/12 6:42:26 PM#125
Originally posted by Charlizzard

But in practice, I do a lot of pressing "1" because nothing happens without my builder. So I end up with a rotation that looks like 1-1-1-1-1-5  7  1-1-1-1-2-2 back to 1-1-1-1-1-5 and so on, with kneecapper thrown in to kite (which is habit and not always necessary), managing the cooldowns but ALWAYS returning to my builder. 

I'm aware that builds may vary from one to the next, but the build that I have, I'm good with 2 times pressing 1 after which I can use a non-builder skill.

But besides that, iirc you can pick 2 builder skills with you of 2 different weapons, and there are also skills that aren't builders or finishers.

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

6/14/12 6:44:39 PM#126
Originally posted by cooper85
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by cooper85
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by cooper85
 

Since Aero wont respond, would agree that you can skip 95-99% of those kill quests? 

 

You have to plan your attack. You need to look at the area. See where you have room to kite and dodge. I can safly say anyone playing TSW for one month will know the basics of raiding. The game will teach you how to play, or you will quit.

you could skip 99% of quests in TERA as well but wouldn't make advancement very efficient. But yes the ones i find tedious and annoying aren't major story plots or anything and could be skipped. But honestly most MMO's you can skip a ton of quests in rift you could level to cap with just doing pvp and dungeons after level 10 if you wanted.

...You can skip an entire form (Kill x x times) of quest in TSW by design and not gimp yourself or have to grind mobs. It's not the same thing as cherry picking quests in Tera.

 

You can do just the story and sabatoge, or sabotage and investigations. Or you can be like me and thank the heavens and grab every kill X quest I can find

if that's your cup of tea you must love TERA heh...

lol I don't think so ;)

 

The kill quests in TSW are much more involved where as in WoW or tera it may take 10 minutes to do a kill quest and auto attack your way through (idk if that's true about Tera). The kill quests in TSW are pretty damn challenging espeacially the name mob at the end. A kill quest in TSW will have 4-5 parts and could take an hour depending how far you decided to push the content. 

 

btw you are rewarded for each update ;)

no auto attack in TERA, but anyway I do agree many of the kill quests they try to at least make somewhat interesting.

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  cooper85

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/12
Posts: 390

6/14/12 6:49:57 PM#127
Originally posted by cutthecrap
Originally posted by Charlizzard

But in practice, I do a lot of pressing "1" because nothing happens without my builder. So I end up with a rotation that looks like 1-1-1-1-1-5  7  1-1-1-1-2-2 back to 1-1-1-1-1-5 and so on, with kneecapper thrown in to kite (which is habit and not always necessary), managing the cooldowns but ALWAYS returning to my builder. 

I'm aware that builds may vary from one to the next, but the build that I have, I'm good with 2 times pressing 1 after which I can use a non-builder skill.

But besides that, iirc you can pick 2 builder skills with you of 2 different weapons, and there are also skills that aren't builders or finishers.

My roation looks like something like 5, 4, 2,1,1,1,2,3 ->5,4,2,1,1,1,2,3 (idk if it's any good, but I made it! and the logic is sound! hah)

 

5 - GTAoE

4- Hammer consumer

2- Dot + builder

1 - multi weapon builder

3 - Second consumer

 

Now mind you these things change as the flow continues, naybe procs or just timing.

  Derpybird

Novice Member

Joined: 4/02/12
Posts: 1006

6/14/12 6:50:35 PM#128
Originally posted by cutthecrap
Originally posted by Charlizzard

But in practice, I do a lot of pressing "1" because nothing happens without my builder. So I end up with a rotation that looks like 1-1-1-1-1-5  7  1-1-1-1-2-2 back to 1-1-1-1-1-5 and so on, with kneecapper thrown in to kite (which is habit and not always necessary), managing the cooldowns but ALWAYS returning to my builder. 

I'm aware that builds may vary from one to the next, but the build that I have, I'm good with 2 times pressing 1 after which I can use a non-builder skill.

But besides that, iirc you can pick 2 builder skills with you of 2 different weapons, and there are also skills that aren't builders or finishers.

I know, I could build 2 stacks then use a harder hitting attack, but I prefer to get the 5 stack finisher off asap and then use the 2 stack abilities until the cd is up. But you get my point, right? As far as I can tell, almost ability is based off of how many builder stacks you have.

"Loading screens" are not "instances".
Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.

  cooper85

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/12
Posts: 390

6/14/12 6:55:58 PM#129
Originally posted by Charlizzard
Originally posted by cutthecrap
Originally posted by Charlizzard

But in practice, I do a lot of pressing "1" because nothing happens without my builder. So I end up with a rotation that looks like 1-1-1-1-1-5  7  1-1-1-1-2-2 back to 1-1-1-1-1-5 and so on, with kneecapper thrown in to kite (which is habit and not always necessary), managing the cooldowns but ALWAYS returning to my builder. 

I'm aware that builds may vary from one to the next, but the build that I have, I'm good with 2 times pressing 1 after which I can use a non-builder skill.

But besides that, iirc you can pick 2 builder skills with you of 2 different weapons, and there are also skills that aren't builders or finishers.

I know, I could build 2 stacks then use a harder hitting attack, but I prefer to get the 5 stack finisher off asap and then use the 2 stack abilities until the cd is up. But you get my point, right? As far as I can tell, almost ability is based off of how many builder stacks you have.

...That's the build you ise in the starting area ;) Where is you state maker, how about an AoE? 

 

Here's another neat tid bit. the difference between 5 stacks and 1 is not that large. The question with all your builds that needs to be asked is would I be better of squeezing X in and going to 3 instead of 5. 

 

The system can get incredibly complex, or you just hit 111112 3 111123. Might not make it far in nightmare mode though ;p

 

Look at my post above yours. I called that a partial pve rotaion.

  Derpybird

Novice Member

Joined: 4/02/12
Posts: 1006

6/14/12 7:00:07 PM#130
Originally posted by cooper85
Originally posted by Charlizzard
Originally posted by cutthecrap
Originally posted by Charlizzard

But in practice, I do a lot of pressing "1" because nothing happens without my builder. So I end up with a rotation that looks like 1-1-1-1-1-5  7  1-1-1-1-2-2 back to 1-1-1-1-1-5 and so on, with kneecapper thrown in to kite (which is habit and not always necessary), managing the cooldowns but ALWAYS returning to my builder. 

I'm aware that builds may vary from one to the next, but the build that I have, I'm good with 2 times pressing 1 after which I can use a non-builder skill.

But besides that, iirc you can pick 2 builder skills with you of 2 different weapons, and there are also skills that aren't builders or finishers.

I know, I could build 2 stacks then use a harder hitting attack, but I prefer to get the 5 stack finisher off asap and then use the 2 stack abilities until the cd is up. But you get my point, right? As far as I can tell, almost ability is based off of how many builder stacks you have.

...That's the build you ise in the starting area ;) Where is you state maker, how about an AoE? 

 

Here's another neat tid bit. the difference between 5 stacks and 1 is not that large. The question with all your builds that needs to be asked is would I be better of squeezing X in and going to 3 instead of 5. 

 

The system can get incredibly complex, or you just hit 111112 3 111123. Might not make it far in nightmare mode though ;p

I am perfectly aware of how resource-based dps systems work thank you. The difference is that you see this as incredibly deep and complex, whereas I see it as tedious and wish they had selected a more engaging model. Some people will like it as is, and we can simply disagree on this point as you are not going to change your opinion, and vice versa.

"Loading screens" are not "instances".
Your personal efforts to troll any game will not, in fact, impact the success or failure of said game.

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

6/14/12 7:06:29 PM#131
Originally posted by Charlizzard
 

I am perfectly aware of how resource-based dps systems work thank you. The difference is that you see this as incredibly deep and complex, whereas I see it as tedious and wish they had selected a more engaging model. Some people will like it as is, and we can simply disagree on this point as you are not going to change your opinion, and vice versa.

I do agree the straight builder rotations can get boring.. luckily you get more options in the outer ring but most decks are reliant on building resources which some people may not care for.. doesn't really bother me much.

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  cooper85

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/12
Posts: 390

6/14/12 7:06:49 PM#132
Originally posted by Charlizzard
Originally posted by cooper85
Originally posted by Charlizzard
Originally posted by cutthecrap
Originally posted by Charlizzard

But in practice, I do a lot of pressing "1" because nothing happens without my builder. So I end up with a rotation that looks like 1-1-1-1-1-5  7  1-1-1-1-2-2 back to 1-1-1-1-1-5 and so on, with kneecapper thrown in to kite (which is habit and not always necessary), managing the cooldowns but ALWAYS returning to my builder. 

I'm aware that builds may vary from one to the next, but the build that I have, I'm good with 2 times pressing 1 after which I can use a non-builder skill.

But besides that, iirc you can pick 2 builder skills with you of 2 different weapons, and there are also skills that aren't builders or finishers.

I know, I could build 2 stacks then use a harder hitting attack, but I prefer to get the 5 stack finisher off asap and then use the 2 stack abilities until the cd is up. But you get my point, right? As far as I can tell, almost ability is based off of how many builder stacks you have.

...That's the build you ise in the starting area ;) Where is you state maker, how about an AoE? 

 

Here's another neat tid bit. the difference between 5 stacks and 1 is not that large. The question with all your builds that needs to be asked is would I be better of squeezing X in and going to 3 instead of 5. 

 

The system can get incredibly complex, or you just hit 111112 3 111123. Might not make it far in nightmare mode though ;p

I am perfectly aware of how resource-based dps systems work thank you. The difference is that you see this as incredibly deep and complex, whereas I see it as tedious and wish they had selected a more engaging model. Some people will like it as is, and we can simply disagree on this point as you are not going to change your opinion, and vice versa.

tedious as in YOU need to craft your rotation, then yes I agree. Remeber though if maximizing is not you thing you could group while you 111123. Something for everybody! :)

 

 

My roation looks like something like 5, 4, 2,1,1,1,2,3 ->5,4,2,1,1,1,2,3 (idk if it's any good, but I made it! and the logic is sound! hah)

 

5 - GTAoE

4- Hammer consumer

2- Dot + builder

1 - multi weapon builder

3 - Second consumer

 

Now mind you these things change as the flow continues, naybe procs or just timing.

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

6/14/12 7:20:03 PM#133
My dungeon dps / support build goes 4, 3, q, e, q, e, q, 1, 2, 3, tab, 2, tab, 2, e, q, e, q, e, 1, 2, 3, tab, 2, tab, 2 repeat. With f straight after any time I do a penetrate.

My solo build and tank build are far more situational.
  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

6/14/12 7:21:29 PM#134
Oh some times I POP 3 earlier if I get a crit, as that resources the weapon for 3 twice
  cooper85

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/12
Posts: 390

6/14/12 7:35:44 PM#135
Originally posted by ShakyMo
My dungeon dps / support build goes 4, 3, q, e, q, e, q, 1, 2, 3, tab, 2, tab, 2, e, q, e, q, e, 1, 2, 3, tab, 2, tab, 2 repeat. With f straight after any time I do a penetrate.

My solo build and tank build are far more situational.

See you have a full pve build. I haven't ventured that far yet lol. Nice work m8.

  Valua

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/08/11
Posts: 521

6/16/12 12:31:22 PM#136
Originally posted by achesoma
Originally posted by Valua
Originally posted by GreenHell

All MMO's will not be different as a result of TSW launching. It is a different kind of game and a lot of people will not like it.  I really dont see this title being more than a niche in the genre and I would say it goes F2P in under a year.

That being said I enjoy the game. It is different enough to keep me interested for awhile. I will probably buy it when it comes out.

 

I'm not bashing anything or anyone, just want to say this:

 

People said WoW was going to be a niche audience type game because it was too casual compared to the current MMO's at that time (EQ, Lineage etc.) and look how that turned out.

 

I'm not saying that's what will happen here and TSW will become the biggest MMO or anything, but I believe that gamers want smarter games nowadays, and TSW is probably the only current MMO that fits that slot.

Really?  You think gamers want smarter games?  That's an interesting theory.  Not sure how you came to that conclusion but interesting nonetheless. 

 

 

I'm just looking at sales of games that have sold exceptionally well over the last few years. Granted most of the top sellers are mindless games like God of War or Call of Duty, but then we have some strange "smarter" games thrown into the mix like Minecraft, Skyrim and a lot of indie games that actually require intelligence.

 

I do hope this is an increasing trend, and gamers lean towards "smarter" games more often, I know it's a long shot, but it's slowly happening. Also, I can dream right?

  Alot

Novice Member

Joined: 1/04/11
Posts: 1984

Minister of Propaganda for GW2 Fascist-Capitalist Party

6/16/12 12:36:18 PM#137


Originally posted by Valua

Originally posted by achesoma

Originally posted by Valua

Originally posted by GreenHell All MMO's will not be different as a result of TSW launching. It is a different kind of game and a lot of people will not like it.  I really dont see this title being more than a niche in the genre and I would say it goes F2P in under a year. That being said I enjoy the game. It is different enough to keep me interested for awhile. I will probably buy it when it comes out.
  I'm not bashing anything or anyone, just want to say this:   People said WoW was going to be a niche audience type game because it was too casual compared to the current MMO's at that time (EQ, Lineage etc.) and look how that turned out.   I'm not saying that's what will happen here and TSW will become the biggest MMO or anything, but I believe that gamers want smarter games nowadays, and TSW is probably the only current MMO that fits that slot.
Really?  You think gamers want smarter games?  That's an interesting theory.  Not sure how you came to that conclusion but interesting nonetheless.   
 

I'm just looking at sales of games that have sold exceptionally well over the last few years. Granted most of the top sellers are mindless games like God of War or Call of Duty, but then we have some strange "smarter" games thrown into the mix like Minecraft, Skyrim and a lot of indie games that actually require intelligence.

 

I do hope this is an increasing trend, and gamers lean towards "smarter" games more often, I know it's a long shot, but it's slowly happening. Also, I can dream right?


I'm sorry to disappoint you, but you are just dreaming. Minecraft and Skyrim are games made for the mass public. Neither requires that much thinking. Compared to COD and God of War they may seem to require more brainpower of the player, but they still aren't all that "strange" or "smart".

  MattVid

Novice Member

Joined: 5/19/04
Posts: 407

6/16/12 3:07:46 PM#138

I don't see how a unpolished pay to play MMO is going to be a game changer. I played the beta some last night, and it is kind of interesting.

However, I found out that the game is still under NDA, and it releases in 2 weeks. They are apparently trying to hide something. I was much more impressed with the GW2 beta weekend than this one. Why is half the stuff disabled 2 weeks before it comes out? My guess, is it is broken and doesn't work.

I doubt I will be purchasing this, but we'll see how bored I feel come a few weeks ;)

  cooper85

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/12
Posts: 390

6/16/12 3:14:12 PM#139
Originally posted by MattVid

I don't see how a unpolished pay to play MMO is going to be a game changer. I played the beta some last night, and it is kind of interesting.

However, I found out that the game is still under NDA, and it releases in 2 weeks. They are apparently trying to hide something. I was much more impressed with the GW2 beta weekend than this one. Why is half the stuff disabled 2 weeks before it comes out? My guess, is it is broken and doesn't work.

I doubt I will be purchasing this, but we'll see how bored I feel come a few weeks ;)

The rest of the game is the same or higher quality of that which you have seen. There is nothing broken. Remeber TSW has a lot of investigations to solve and stories to tell. If the game was completely open for all the BWE's a lot of the mystery would be lost. 

 

For example, what's the code you put into the doctors computer? 90& of the game population knows the answer and only 50% have played. 

 

Yes my numbers are made up, but you get the idea.

  Falcon760

Novice Member

Joined: 4/11/12
Posts: 6

6/17/12 3:10:38 AM#140

To the original poster: if this is the most original thing you've ever played, then you haven't played very much.  It's the same darn thing except kicked up a few notches with cutscenes and fancy graphics.  The only thing that really appeals to me right now about this game is the environment and maybe the tone of the game.  Everything else is god awful. 

The missions are the same run-here-kill-this-many-guys missions that every other MMO has.

I would have to say that the cut scenes are too long and don't feel immersive.  I thought this was a more "open" game, but for the first couple of hours, I'm "directed" to certain quests and along certain storylines.  I haven't played an "open" world game since Ultima Online.  I mean, where you can go anywhere and do anything.  There doesn't even seem to be a way to diverge from the "main" storyline. 

The combat is just about as bad as it gets.  I didnt see any noticeable difference between guns and the fights were composed mostly of endless firing.  The controls are god awful.  If there is a way to map controls, that'd be nice.  Usually backing up is my problem, but there is no way you can do that during a fight and keep firing without hitting two keys at once on the keyboard. 

I wouldnt say cut scenes make or break a game anyway, so I'm not sure why there's so many of them in the game. 

The story is great and the environment is great, but I just thought there was a little more "secret" to this "secret world".  There's no sneaking around, no stealth, no disguising yourself, and so on. 

Zombies.   I really hated killing zombies at the beginning.  Everything is zombies now-a-days. 

The character creation stinks.  With the top being EVE Online's character customizations, I would have to say TSW ranks near the bottom.  It has a little more customization than Star Trek Online, but even City of Heroes and Age of Conan have nicer looking options to choose from.  Some of those ugly, spotted jackets were just atrocious.  And the facial options were god-awful and none of them looked like they went together. 

This will be a middle of the pack MMO, but most of the casual gamers will be driven away from the sheer boredom of the cut-scenes and linear stories. 

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