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Darkfall General Article: Overview Part II, Looking at the Down Side
MMORPG.com Darkfall Correspondent Andy Cormier takes a look at some of the current issues that are present in Aventurine's sandbox MMORPG, Darkfall.
By Andy Cormier on May 07, 2009
In my initial overview of Darkfall, I went over the game in very broad strokes. Now I'm going to kick off this overview a bit differently than most. Instead of peppering in the good with the bad like most other articles, we are going to delve exclusively into the negative. I wanted to do things this way since there is such an over abundance of misinformation floating around, leaving many undecided people that have no idea if many of the alleged problems in Darkfall actually exist, or not.
To start, I would like to touch on the most obvious... buying the game. This can feel like an "epic quest" in and of itself. Aventurine is what you call an "Indie" company (small company, not much experience, not a lot of cash, etc). Sadly, there are no boxed versions of this game available. You can't go to your local retailer and pick up a copy. The game is purchased via digital download exclusively. So the first logical step would be to go to the Darkfall website, and press the "Order Now" button. That is, if you could find the "Order Now" button. In fact, if you go to the Darkfall website one would be led to believe that the game is still undergoing beta testing. The website is so outdated that the second newest article in the news section talks about the "first wave of beta invites" that were recently sent out. So, as a potential customer, you are left with no choice but to fish through the official message forums just to find the link to their store, which then appears to be closed 24/7.
This is because while the game is indeed released, it was done via a "limited" release. What they intended to do was allow small numbers of players in at a time to bring the server to optimum capacity, before opening another. However, with the massive demand for this game, the daily sales quotas were being consumed in under 5 minutes. This made it extremely infuriating for players waiting to purchase Darkfall with cash in hand. They attempted to increase their daily quotas, which caused queue times of two hours or more that lasted several days. Shortly after however, Tasos stated sales would halt and a fix would be coming that Monday, fixing the queues for good. Monday came and what did I find... no queue times at all, seemingly for good. Keep in mind that this game was developed with architecture to allow for 10,000 simultaneous players online at the same time. So while Aventurine seems to do things in a very eclectic manner, I must commend them for their dedication in fixing major issues so quickly.
;)
To be honest, the rest of the "problems" you will see discussed on the message forums are non issues. The most talked about topic is obviously regarding rampant cheating. I can confirm that cheating does in fact exist in this game, but it's the equivalent of seeing a hundred thousand dollar sports car smoke you on the highway. You may see this from time to time, but for all intents and purposes it's a rare occurrence. Most of the claims of cheating revolve around speed hacking. For instance, I had a player that continued to attack me with melee weapons while running alongside my mount, eventually killing me. This was before I had even heard about the speed hacking so I wasn't exactly sure what had happened. Later on, I heard several other players making claims against this same individual. I then realized what had happened. Recently Aventurine has made some strong statements toward banning cheaters without warning, and I must say many of the people that had become known for this no longer appear to be in the game world. So in my opinion cheating appears to be a fairly rare occurrence with fairly hefty consequences, at least until it's patched out of the game completely.
;)
The other huge complaint is macroing. I again have to say that this is a non-issue as well. This game primarily has two scenarios where you will see people macro: magic and harvesting. You get a free school of magic to start with called "Lesser Magic". A few of these spells do not take reagents to cast, and they slowly get better as your skill increases through use of the spell(s). So the prevailing logic is that if players cast spells overnight, they will be kick ass mages by morning. While you would certainly be skilled at the lowest form of magic, you won't really be skilled in anything overly useful. Once you reach a certain skill level in Lesser Magic, it opens up Greater Magic, which in turn opens up a slew of other magic schools.
;)
The last remaining hang-up I have is with the so called "Alignment System". This is the game's form of crime and punishment if you will, very similar to that of Ultima Online. The basic premise is that all characters start with +10 alignment on a scale of -50 to +100. Anyone with a positive alignment will show as blue, or lawful. If a blue player strikes another blue player, the offending player will turn "grey" for a length of ten seconds. During this time they can be freely attacked by any player without repercussion. If during this time the grey player attacks any blue player again, he will stay grey for a full two minutes. If you kill a player of the same alliance (races are aligned between the good and evil races) you lose eight alignment for dropping a player (where they remain incapacitated for a minute or two) and another four for ganking the player, which is like a finishing blow. If your alignment goes negative, you turn red wherein anyone can freely kill and loot you without penalty. Your alignment must become positive again before your character returns to being blue. This can be done by killing other reds, or by killing players from an enemy race. This system actually works well for the most part, with a few glaring issues. The largest being the fact that clans can easily exploit the alignment system. Clans will often have "red" players bound to their clan stone where clanmates will repeatedly kill (and gain alignment) over and over all night long. This farmed alignment is usually taken and used on their own race, many times in the form of griefing. Clanmates can essentially just replenish their alignment within 30 minutes or so using this method, completely invalidating the penalty accrued for killing friendly races. There are a few other methods of reproducing the same scenario. To make matters worse, you can kill the same player over and over and continuously gain alignment. While I have no doubt both of these issues will be fixed in the near future, it's hard to leave them out at this point since they currently play such integral roles in the game world.
I thought the alignment system was -100 to +10 now or did I miss a patch note? :)
1 same race kill+gank now turns you red. Alignment can't be gained from party members, clan or alliance, and you can't bind at a clan stones unless you're in an alliance from what I remember.
ie. they're making it hard to farm alignment but alignment doesn't mean anything if you're in an established clan/alliance any way as you never need to go to an NPC town.
so in other words... there is nothing wrong with the game. All bad reviews and negative aspects signaled by others are just non issues and overstatements.
I see. Have you recently been fired from Eurogamer?
Lmao /salute
Someone must be scared of getting the same treatment as eurogamer.....
I'm sure we will be seeing touted by Tasos on the Darkfall forums going "SEE! They get it!".
Nice article. Too bad you are so misunformed about the cheating angle. There are some really good mages out there today and they did not get that way by playing fair. Easy to do, teleport to a high level area, use broken game mechanics to kill and loot, sell and then macro all night with the purchased reagents. Cash is never a problem. There are how to lists on several websites detailing such.
As to the claims by Aventurine that they log everything, it is obvious that their logs are so primitive they only catch the really obvious cheaters.
But, the game is still in beta essentially and they are constantly improving it. Just that there will be no character wipe when they do get most of the bugs out and you will still be dealing with these overly powerful characters obtained by illicit means.
You also did not mention how neglected the crafting is. Until they institute a market, auction house or some form of NPC market it will be very marginal.
You also did not address how much a grind this game is for the legitimate players. I used to think the Last Chaos was the worst grind in the industry. Darkfall does it one better. It is currently the number one grinder in the genre.
Hopefully they will delay more servers starts until they get these issues sorted out.
Huis review was about the bad things friend. Grind is not one of the downfalls of DF is just a feature.
For myself being an old EQ vet ( i mean old EQ btw ) grinding was what made the game good. So yes DF is the biggest grind i have came across yet, and hopefully it stays that way as it's what keeps me playing it :)
On a side note i have only been playing twoo weeks so maybe all the cheating has stopped, but i have not come across anything yet. then again i havent been looking so unless it's obvious i wouldnt have noticed.
Hope this is a joke. So basically the game is 100% perfect minus 3 things.
Lol cant anyone even say bad things about DF without someone complaining that theres not enough bad things now? he didnt say the rest is perfect anywhere i read! if he diod i will gladly apologise, if not then come on all get a grip. he was just following up another review adding a few things he thinks are downsides to the game.
To me there are more downsides to the game. But for christs sake if i were to try to make a review mentioning every single fault and every single good point in the game i would have to write a novel lol.
Look forward to the link where he says that the rest of the game is 100% perfect.
Yes but we know that the reviewers/overviewers or whatever they are called at anyh given time are friendly towards DFO, so those of us looking for an unbiased report on DFO will not find one on MMORPG.com, then again I really haven't seen any unbiased reviews/overviews from any other source, but nor have I seen any other site than this give DFO as much coverage or leniency in that coverage.
Are you serious? this is it?
So Darkfall's most important and glaring issues in a nutshell (in order of importance):
1-buying the game.
2-cheating.
3-macroing.
4-The notorious Alignment System!
"To be honest, the rest of the "problems" you will see discussed on the message forums are non issues."
In other words, the other issues are not important enough to be mentioned, such as the extreme lack of content (closer to non existent actually), extreme lack of polish, broken combat to say the least, prehistoric UI, and I'm not even mentioning the 1998 graphics, the fact that there's NO lore, the awful control system etc.
So the best games on the market have more issues than DF I guess. Totally blinkered 'overview'.
'Yay I can kill anyone and take his loot!'
Seriously.. some people are incredibly easy to please.
Yes but we know that the reviewers/overviewers or whatever they are called at anyh given time are friendly towards DFO, so those of us looking for an unbiased report on DFO will not find one on MMORPG.com, then again I really haven't seen any unbiased reviews/overviews from any other source, but nor have I seen any other site than this give DFO as much coverage or leniency in that coverage.
If you don't like the Correspondent program, wherein people who play and enjoy their games write about the games, then I would simply suggest that you don't read the Correspondent articles (which are clearly labelled as such) and wait for the site's official review.
As to the frequency of Darkfall coverage... Darkfall articles consistently perform well in terms of traffic. This idicates to me that there are people who want to read about the game. As such, we will provide articles. It just makes sense.
Sorry i dont get it.
whats broke about the combat?
Non existent content? how come i havent gone a day yet when i havent been raided by enemies? and i havent left the newbie area yet and surrounding Leafhelm there are 3 goblin camps i have found and a Large Skeleton/zombie area. and i'm too scared to go far lol! oh ye and the crafting i started last night is going to keep me busy it seems.
Control system is different from what were used to, but it works and is actually more fun that most mmo's
Graphics are not as good as Aoc/Vanguard maybe but i would call them average if i am honest.
Polish i agree with, theres non. But i dont think there ever will be much. It's not a bells and whistles game is it?
Prehistoric UI...hmm ye your close there. seems to be workable but could be so much better.
But come on mate his review was at least honest, your statments are misleading.
If you don't like the Correspondent program, wherein people who play and enjoy their games write about the games, then I would simply suggest that you don't read the Correspondent articles (which are clearly labelled as such) and wait for the site's official review.
As to the frequency of Darkfall coverage... Darkfall articles consistently perform well in terms of traffic. This idicates to me that there are people who want to read about the game. As such, we will provide articles. It just makes sense.
I mean this in the most respectful way. but ever since 2003, this site has gone downhill, and i suspect this is why, and why the tone here changed. On the forums, and in its daily content.
You are intentionally fanning the flames on your own site by posting intentionally baited material. I understand the need to create traffic.... but yeah... I understand capitalizing on controversy. Your presentation of the articles are misleading to your player base. You know this, OR you would NOT have to keep coming into threads defending them, or dismissing the comments made on the with "This is an overview/opinion piece". This goes for any game.
Can we go back to creating traffic buy posting things of value? I highly enjoy the new columnists, as well as reviews from your PAID professional staff. This correspondent program is little more than your addition of player blogs. Please separate the two (News and opinion).
This is also, again, listed under news.
Guys,
I need to post some corrections. Articles get submitted often times weeks prior to actually getting them posted. At the extremely fast pace that Aventurine has been patching, several things are now changed:
- Cheating has dropped off dramatically after the nice big ban of over 200 cheaters. Yes it still exists, but I see complaints of cheating far far less now
- The alignment system has changed (twice) now. First they dropped the maximum alignment of +100 to +10. So 1 kill and 1 gank will turn you red. Then, in the most recent patch, they changed the alignment gain from killing enemies from +2 for kill and +2 for gank to +1 for a kill and +1 for a gank.
I must commend Aventurine on keeping to their promise of weekly patches. I actually find myself getting excited to read the patch notes each Friday. If you read the official message boards its often comical because you will see players upset about one facet or another, and multiple threads on the same subject will consume the first page of the forums. It seems the more people scream the more likely they are to put that issue at the forefront and fix it (or modify it) via patch. Then after the patch you don't see another word about it and someone else takes hold. For a small company they are damned good at correclty problems on the fly and making huge changes to the game mechanics quickly (weekly!). This game is progressively getting better and better. And each weeks its actually a noticable difference.
-Andy Cormier
You can honestly say that you think that was a fair assessent of DarkFall's negatives?
This statement from the second article pretty much sums it:
"So macroers seem to do nothing more than fill the pockets of those that hunt them, and play little to no significance in the game whatsoever."
Seriously? Umm... really? You honestly believe that statement?
I won't be viewing or reading the rest of the 8 "Overview" articles... they seem to be based in reality about as much as DarkFall's web-site.
You know the one that even after they've "gone through it" still says they have Weather effects, Trade Boards for crafters both in and out of game, etc.
Not too surprised I was correct in how objective this article would be... but I was still hoping for something a bit closer to reality... oh well.
Thankfully there are a few blog sites out there that are a bit more reality-based. (Keen & Graev's comes to mind).
No game is perfect, but I wanted to tackle the primary negatives you see floating around about the game. Interestingly enough all of the mains ones have been fixed already via patches. Are there still issues? Sure. But at the rate they are patching this game there won't be for long.
In the most recent patch they even addresses an annoyance of mine (although not many bitching about it) which was the difficulty of solo players to hunt, and find uncamped hunting spots. So they made some out of the way locations with newb spawns to let the solo players have a better go at things. Most of the spawns were too far off to be of use, but it was there first attempt at the change and I expect more to come this Friday. If you currently play Darkfall its very hard to fault Aventurine for not listening to players and fixing this quickly.
-Andy Cormier
I still enjoy the site but I can see where you are coming from. Still most people secretly enjoy the national enquirer. Personally I feel this 'article' should have been in a blog. As to the article itsel it made me laugh, does the 'correspondant' seriously believe those are the only troubles with the game?
In my opinion in order to give a game a proper overview (in my case 10 parts) you physically have to play the game. I fail to see how playing the game makes the overview in any way biased. If you don't play the game and make comments about the game you suffer the same consequences that Eurogamer is now. Truthfully, if I play the game and enjoy it the overview is "biased", but if I play the game and don't enjoy it doesn't that make the article "biased" as well?
-Andy Cormier
Sorry i dont get it.
whats broke about the combat?
Non existent content? how come i havent gone a day yet when i havent been raided by enemies? and i havent left the newbie area yet and surrounding Leafhelm there are 3 goblin camps i have found and a Large Skeleton/zombie area. and i'm too scared to go far lol! oh ye and the crafting i started last night is going to keep me busy it seems.
Control system is different from what were used to, but it works and is actually more fun that most mmo's
Graphics are not as good as Aoc/Vanguard maybe but i would call them average if i am honest.
Polish i agree with, theres non. But i dont think there ever will be much. It's not a bells and whistles game is it?
Prehistoric UI...hmm ye your close there. seems to be workable but could be so much better.
But come on mate his review was at least honest, your statments are misleading.
Combat is extremely clunky and lacks polish. for example, you don't hit every time even though you're in range, and it's worse for ranged combat.
There is a lack of content, even fanboys are complaining about this. there is very few pve content, but of course if you're happy grinding goblins, gank and be ganked for days, then more power to you.
What don't you get? you actually agreed with me on the other points (Graphics (character models are especially bad), polish, UI, no lore). Also how is this overview in any way honest? If I didn't know anything about the game and read this, the major cons of DF, I would be on the official site spamming F5 to buy an account lol. I don't think I have ever read something as biased as this.
http://www.keenandgraev.com/
Go there for an actual attempt at an unbiased opinion
If you don't like the Correspondent program, wherein people who play and enjoy their games write about the games, then I would simply suggest that you don't read the Correspondent articles (which are clearly labelled as such) and wait for the site's official review.
As to the frequency of Darkfall coverage... Darkfall articles consistently perform well in terms of traffic. This idicates to me that there are people who want to read about the game. As such, we will provide articles. It just makes sense.
Not because the game is Great! or even popular. People just like to read about drama. The Darkfall forums are like a soap opera, I cant wait to see what Tasos does next.
Well, for one, macroing, this is dual issue. Many players use the auto-loot macro, legally according to the developers, this indicates, while a nod to UO, the loot system, and its reason for being (making you pause, and become vulnerable) is negated for all long term players, and the entire system is there to punish new players, that do not use macros.
You dismissed all marcoing.
I understand you are a correspondent, but that in its self (This dismissal) ether means you are unaware of the whole of the topic you are writing about, or simply, dismiss it due to bias.
You are welcome to be biased, that's fine, its your article.
The articles are limited in size, and mine was at the maximum. I posted what is my opinion on the largest issues currently holding Darkfall back, plain and simple. So to answer your question yes, I absolutely feel those are (were) the biggest issues in Darkfall. There is no less "content" in this game that in Eve Online, or any other sandbox game in its first months after release. This game is not for everyone, those words come directly from the developers. Many players love mmorpgs and will hate Darkfall simply because of the sandbox playstyle. Some players LOVE to have free reign over what happens in the world, what they do and who they do it to. Other players LOVE to have the next set of goals laid out of them in advance. Places to hunt, what they can kill, etc. And honestly, I've played both styles and both are fun to me. But saying the game has no content is simply not accurate. Neither is your graphics statement. The graphics are very nice in my opnion and while they don't rival games like Lord of the Rings Online, those games do not regularly have 500 people on the screen at the same time attacking each other's cities.
You are spot on with the Lore, there is absolutely none. This is a big deal to some, and not to others. Most games I dont care at all, as it usually is hokey and uninspired. Asheron's Call however, had some of the best lore I have ever seen and often times the quest rewards was a deeper look at the lore. Very cool. But Asherons Call has about 7 years of development on this game so time will tell.
-Andy Cormier
Hate? No. Not play, yes. This is hive thinking your showing here. You are swamped in the culture of this games fan base.
And again, that's fine.
As I have previously stated, I am giving an overview on what was delivered, not what was promised. Regardless of what this game could have been, should have been, or someday will be. I am giving an overview of what currently exists, for better or worse. In my opinion, if I had never heard the name Darkfall, and new nothing about it, bought it on day 1 and enjoyed the game... I dont see how realizing there are features not yet implemented somehow ruins that enjoyment. The game lives or dies based on what it currently has, not what is missing, or what is coming in the future.
-Andy Cormier
Andy,
Great job on the article and I really appreciate your honest view on darkfalls shortcomings. A few things I felt like commenting on, for one they are an "Indie" or "Rookie" game company and it seems that they are making rookie errors. This is common for most new game companies, take Funcom's start with Anarchy Online's painful launch for example. However, after months of hard work and many patches it became one of the longer running games in the MMO genre. I played it for some months and enjoyed it, however I didn't play DF for the same reason that you stated "I just couldn't buy it."
And when I sent an email to them about a problem I had finding the game, I recieved a really rude, short and curt email in return. Well, in that case I will just keep it moving and they do not get my business. With the mmo market expanding by huge strides and the 500 pound behemoth called Blizzard gobbling up so much market share, indie companies like Adventurine have little to no room for error.
For one, having space for only 10,000 players seems very inclusive which makes it a very hot commodity. BUT IT HAS TO BE QUALITY! If they are going to take that stance they need to put out a very good product, from what I am hearing from the community is that it's not. Just the game cheating, macroing imbalances and the alignment exploit you stated alone makes the game unnactractive. But I also hear they are trying to fix things with patches and I do commend them for that as well. I would like to see them succeed, it will take some very hard work and sacrifice on their part; the gaming community is very unforgiving and do not forget being slighted so easily. And I don't blame them, even with my time and money at a premium anything spent on a game has to be worth 110%. Nowadays I look before I leap and use the gaming community as a barometer or "guinea pigs" of a sort and then choose if I will even invest in the software at all. And the growth of the free to play market is making that easier to just "try before I buy." The chronicles of spellborn is a great example of that.
All in all, I hope things work out for Adventurine, that they sort things out and can actually retain a big enough fanbase to establish that coveteted "long tail" of the game business cycle. The positive point that comes from this is that new companies can look at them and learn what NOT to do when releasing their game; they also need to understand that their is a timeclock looming over their head, their are some really big games coming out their on the horizon. Whatever they are going to do, do it quick or become another "Tabula Rasa" tale.
Have fun,
Ink
Combat is extremely clunky and lacks polish. for example, you don't hit every time even though you're in range, and it's worse for ranged combat.
There is a lack of content, even fanboys are complaining about this. there is very few pve content, but of course if you're happy grinding goblins, gank and be ganked for days, then more power to you.
What don't you get? you actually agreed with me on the other points (Graphics (character models are especially bad), polish, UI, no lore). Also how is this overview in any way honest? If I didn't know anything about the game and read this, the major cons of DF, I would be on the official site spamming F5 to buy an account lol. I don't think I have ever read something as biased as this.
********
Please explain your point on combat. You in fact do hit every time if your are in range and your crosshairs are over the intended target (FPS style). The same goes for ranged combat. There were sync issues in the first two weeks of the game that could cause what you are describing, but other than that your statement is not accurate at all. In fact their are no hit or miss die rolls. If you are in range and your crosshairs are over the target, you hit 100% of the time, no exceptions. Maybe I am misunderstanding what you were trying to say.
-Andy Cormier
Andy,
Great job on the article and I really appreciate your honest view on darkfalls shortcomings. A few things I felt like commenting on, for one they are an "Indie" or "Rookie" game company and it seems that they are making rookie errors. This is common for most new game companies, take Funcom's start with Anarchy Online's painful launch for example. However, after months of hard work and many patches it became one of the longer running games in the MMO genre. I played it for some months and enjoyed it, however I didn't play DF for the same reason that you stated "I just couldn't buy it."
And when I sent an email to them about a problem I had finding the game, I recieved a really rude, short and curt email in return. Well, in that case I will just keep it moving and they do not get my business. With the mmo market expanding by huge strides and the 500 pound behemoth called Blizzard gobbling up so much market share, indie companies like Adventurine have little to no room for error.
For one, having space for only 10,000 players seems very inclusive which makes it a very hot commodity. BUT IT HAS TO BE QUALITY! If they are going to take that stance they need to put out a very good product, from what I am hearing from the community is that it's not. Just the game cheating, macroing imbalances and the alignment exploit you stated alone makes the game unnactractive. But I also hear they are trying to fix things with patches and I do commend them for that as well. I would like to see them succeed, it will take some very hard work and sacrifice on their part; the gaming community is very unforgiving and do not forget being slighted so easily. And I don't blame them, even with my time and money at a premium anything spent on a game has to be worth 110%. Nowadays I look before I leap and use the gaming community as a barometer or "guinea pigs" of a sort and then choose if I will even invest in the software at all. And the growth of the free to play market is making that easier to just "try before I buy." The chronicles of spellborn is a great example of that.
All in all, I hope things work out for Adventurine, that they sort things out and can actually retain a big enough fanbase to establish that coveteted "long tail" of the game business cycle. The positive point that comes from this is that new companies can look at them and learn what NOT to do when releasing their game; they also need to understand that their is a timeclock looming over their head, their are some really big games coming out their on the horizon. Whatever they are going to do, do it quick or become another "Tabula Rasa" tale.
Have fun,
Ink
Excellent comments. I cannot fault you one bit for not purchasing based on the reasons you stated. If there were a plethora of free for all PVP with full loots games I wouldn't have considered Darkfall at all to be honest. I had to go out of my way to purcahse the game and it was hell :). Thankfully, I took a risk that (for me) seems to have paid off as I have enjoyed myself for the two or so months I have been in game. There really is no excuse though, rookies or not, in making it so strange and difficult to purchase their game. And I fully agree that this single issue needs to be fixed before much of the sidelined players will begin to take Darkfall seriously.
-Andy Cormier
I'm glad you are enjoying the game as it stands currently. When it is a more finished product I may yet get to try it out.
Sorry, I won't be reading any of other 8 Articles. I did what I said and read your second Article. It failed to be what I would deem an objective article. Thanks anyway though.
I agree with the part in Red.
In my opinion the game as it currently stands is not worth my time or money. Perhaps that will change in the future.
I think this write up is supposed to be sarcasm.
Alignment is (-100 to +10)
I'm playing the game and am quite aware of several key flaws which seems to have been purposely ignored.
Yes, the interface is "clunky", but it's a very fluid control system once you get the hang of it. After a week I've come to be very fond of the RightClick to toggle between interface and fps modes - I think it's truely ingenious!
Shield blocking - very clunky. This cannot be intentionaly by design. I would bet someone lunch that shield blocking will get improved so that when you hit "V" to "Parry" (parry, block, same difference in Darkfall) it has a form of delay that can lock out an action or 2 and this does not seem to be an intentional design. As it is, it's very easy to play around it and take a few extra seconds when switching between "V" and "gonna kick your ass with my weapon" mode.
Speedhacks - not seen any. I think the two times I "thought" someone was cheating might have actually been due to lag from my ping being between 220-480 as the player seemed to be desyncing. I'm aware how this can also be exploited and actually faciliated by a player if they desire. (a total of 2 occasions and both I think were honest issues related to my ping; for reference Seattle WA U.S.; it's usually 220ms and very playable)
There are some balance issues, but I have yet to experiance any online game that doesn't have them even when they've been out for many years. To me, the balance issues seem to require very minor tweaks even though it might be applied to many different aspects of weapon range, spell damage to archery+movement.
I'm struggling to think of other issues which are more then minor "gloss" or better detailed descriptions...
My understanding is that a lot of the people who tried this game during the first month had it VERY BAD and almost all of those issues, besides what I mentioned above, have been resolved.
What's most important to me is the fun factor and I am currently finding this game to provide a level of detail, immersion and thrill above and beyond anything I've played before. I'm not a big PvP person, but I've totally accepted it in Darkfall.
Fact is, the game is far from perfect regardless how much fun it is. My understanding is that EVE Online was even worse then Darkfall when it launched, kind of crazy where that game is now isn't it. ;)
this is complete bullshit and a total lie, unless you're basing the accusation on your 10 year old "gaming" pc.
I'm not saying it's better looking then EVE Online, but I it does look much better then a lot of the "other" mmo's many of the trolls here at MMORPG support.
Yes, there is a learning curve to the controls and it took me a few days to get it down. Now, I've grown very fond of it and think it's truely an ingenous design as far as how you interface with the GUI and toggle in/out of combat mode. This does not mean it wont feel clunky, it's just that when you use it the way it was designed it works incredibly well.
Lore? Right...
I'm not playing a FPS Open PvP game to read fucking stories from every NPC with a "!" above their head. I want history, not lore. I want player history, you know, like the kind that's present in EVE Online.
This game is very niche. If you like silver spoons and game play that only requires 1 hand then avoid Darkfall. If you like rich atmospherical environments and a heavy Risk Vs Reward game play experiance while accept games with a moderate learning curve then you will likely be playing Darkfall sometime in the near future.
p.s. seriously, the people talking about 1999 graphics don't know what the <expletive> they're talking about.
this is complete bullshit and a total lie, unless you're basing the accusation on your 10 year old "gaming" pc.
I'm not saying it's better looking then EVE Online, but I it does look much better then a lot of the "other" mmo's many of the trolls here at MMORPG support.
Yes, there is a learning curve to the controls and it took me a few days to get it down. Now, I've grown very fond of it and think it's truely an ingenous design as far as how you interface with the GUI and toggle in/out of combat mode. This does not mean it wont feel clunky, it's just that when you use it the way it was designed it works incredibly well.
Lore? Right...
I'm not playing a FPS Open PvP game to read fucking stories from every NPC with a "!" above their head. I want history, not lore. I want player history, you know, like the kind that's present in EVE Online.
This game is very niche. If you like silver spoons and game play that only requires 1 hand then avoid Darkfall. If you like rich atmospherical environments and a heavy Risk Vs Reward game play experiance while accept games with a moderate learning curve then you will likely be playing Darkfall sometime in the near future.
p.s. seriously, the people talking about 1999 graphics don't know what the <expletive> they're talking about.
Spot on with the graphics and UI. You also touched on a very important aspect that I feel many other fans of sandbox style games will agree with. While I had some interesting stories to tell from games like World of Warcraft, or Lord of the Rings online, so did everyone else. Because we all went through the same progression path to get to the same place. We all experienced the same raid content, sometimes winning and other times getting wiped. I have stories to tell from games like Ultima Online and Asheron's Call that to this day I will never forget. And more importantly, no one else will ever tell them because these stories are unique to me and my adventures. Thats because in these game worlds anything can, and will happen. Players that need a story created for them will find sandbox game worlds (UO, AC, EVE, Darkfall) bland, lacking life, and lacking content. Those that enjoy them can once again play in an all new sandbox world full of new stories to create. Out of all the standard style mmorpgs I have played, very rarely do I take experiences with me that I do from sandbox games. To each his own.
Why do you think lore means story line? More specifically, Guided experience?
UO, AC, EVE, all have lore. In game and out.
If you don't like the Correspondent program, wherein people who play and enjoy their games write about the games, then I would simply suggest that you don't read the Correspondent articles (which are clearly labelled as such) and wait for the site's official review.
As to the frequency of Darkfall coverage... Darkfall articles consistently perform well in terms of traffic. This idicates to me that there are people who want to read about the game. As such, we will provide articles. It just makes sense.
Yet another post by you Stradden telling viewers not to read articles placed on your main page. You mind as well just tell them to not read your site at all, because is that not what you want? Be honest here man, this is an opinionated forum and site, yet you keep interjecting yourself into the threads telling people to just not read them. Yes he doesn't like the article, but he has a right to comment on it. Would you just like the community who helped you reach a million + viewers, just give up and leave your site to yourself? Or can you take an opinion, let your community debate against it, and move on to the next article? If anything, you have a tool right in front of you that you can use for these issues. It's called a PM, or Personal Message. Let's not become Tasos here and flaunt these issues in the public. This is getting to be comical to say the least. Please learn to use your own systems for this type of request so you don't make a fool of yourself, in the public nonetheless.
By the way, this is just a suggestion. Kind of like you suggesting people not read articles on the main page regardless of who posts or made them.
If you don't like the Correspondent program, wherein people who play and enjoy their games write about the games, then I would simply suggest that you don't read the Correspondent articles (which are clearly labelled as such) and wait for the site's official review.
As to the frequency of Darkfall coverage... Darkfall articles consistently perform well in terms of traffic. This idicates to me that there are people who want to read about the game. As such, we will provide articles. It just makes sense.
Yet another post by you Stradden telling viewers not to read articles placed on your main page. You mind as well just tell them to not read your site at all, because is that not what you want? Be honest here man, this is an opinionated forum and site, yet you keep interjecting yourself into the threads telling people to just not read them. Yes he doesn't like the article, but he has a right to comment on it. Would you just like the community who helped you reach a million + viewers, just give up and leave your site to yourself? Or can you take an opinion, let your community debate against it, and move on to the next article? If anything, you have a tool right in front of you that you can use for these issues. It's called a PM, or Personal Message. Let's not become Tasos here and flaunt these issues in the public. This is getting to be comical to say the least. Please learn to use your own systems for this type of request so you don't make a fool of yourself, in the public nonetheless.
By the way, this is just a suggestion. Kind of like you suggesting people not read articles on the main page regardless of who posts or made them.
I think you mean "might", rather than "mind." Your suggestion is disingenuous, because you completely miss or ignore Stradden's entire point. If you want to engage in an honest debate, you need to listen to the other side. If you simply want to jump on the bandwagon and mindlessly bash a game and a site that doesn't agree with the view that you think is fashionable and to which therefore you wish to subscribe, just keep doing as you're doing.
The only people making fools of themselves here are the ones jumping on the bandwagon and mindlessly bashing each other rather than attempting to engage in honest discussion.
I mentioned AC specifically in a previous post in this thread, as being the only sandbox in my opinion with meaningful lore. I often quested knowing full well the reward to said quest often times would be more lore, but it was so neatly woven into the game that I didnt care. The other examples you gave in my opniion the lore second rate, and debatable as to the impact on the games themselves. The games you metioned also have an average age of 7-8 years where darkfall has an age of 60 days.
Background, story, and lore all typically come from in game events which primarily come in the form of quests. I remember in one of the first World of Warcraft patches they added the ability to skip all of the quest text and immediately press the "accept quest" button instead of being forced to read what the quest was about first. This was of course by popular demaind.
The bottom line is that lore is like big tits, it may be nice to have but it certainly doesnt make the girl. And if this is one of your few criteria you follow when evaluating women, you are more than likely going to miss out on something special. Again, just my humbled opinion.
Thoes are the games you mentioned. Not me. Again, why is it you think that having in game lore, means guided experience?
This has nothing to do with your opinion of "Games with the best lore". 7-8 years is irrelevant, they all had lore in the game, and in the world, in different forms from launch.
To follow your analogy, Lore is not the Tits, lore is a brain, you are the one staring at the tits, and not noticing the brain, or lack there of.
This is what you said:
You are attempting to put forth that Sandbox games have no lore, or story, or quests and that this somehow excuses Darkfall from having any.
This is simply, not true.
The definition of a sandbox does not mean lacking content, nor does it mean it has no story (as a matter of fact, most have more, as its the basis of all RP, a segment of players sanboxes attract). So saying its OK for a sandbox game to be lacking such things, is a fallacy. As history, and precedence has shown otherwise.
No, people will find Dar fall lacking content, lore, and bland, because its incomplete. Incomplete is also, not part of the definition of a sandbox, something the developers seem to have a hard time understanding.
Yet another post by you Stradden telling viewers not to read articles placed on your main page. You mind as well just tell them to not read your site at all, because is that not what you want? Be honest here man, this is an opinionated forum and site, yet you keep interjecting yourself into the threads telling people to just not read them. Yes he doesn't like the article, but he has a right to comment on it. Would you just like the community who helped you reach a million + viewers, just give up and leave your site to yourself? Or can you take an opinion, let your community debate against it, and move on to the next article? If anything, you have a tool right in front of you that you can use for these issues. It's called a PM, or Personal Message. Let's not become Tasos here and flaunt these issues in the public. This is getting to be comical to say the least. Please learn to use your own systems for this type of request so you don't make a fool of yourself, in the public nonetheless.
By the way, this is just a suggestion. Kind of like you suggesting people not read articles on the main page regardless of who posts or made them.
I think you mean "might", rather than "mind." Your suggestion is disingenuous, because you completely miss or ignore Stradden's entire point. If you want to engage in an honest debate, you need to listen to the other side. If you simply want to jump on the bandwagon and mindlessly bash a game and a site that doesn't agree with the view that you think is fashionable and to which therefore you wish to subscribe, just keep doing as you're doing.
The only people making fools of themselves here are the ones jumping on the bandwagon and mindlessly bashing each other rather than attempting to engage in honest discussion.
His entire point is continually telling/suggesting to people not to read main page over-views. This has nothing to do with this article in question, but apparently you missed that. I'm not bashing what the over-view states nor did I ever. What I am saying is that he, a Site Editor, should take these to PM's instead of derailing his own threads with this non-sense. The honest discussion can be stated here. But maybe you should read what I typed before glancing at the first line and coming to this conclusion. His point was to suggest someone not read an article because he does not agree with it. Something that clearly could of been placed in a PM. So please point to me the other side of his lack to use his own forum tools, and maybe you might be right. Other than that, these articles can continue. But Site Editors should not be telling people publicly what to read and not to read. If he does not want him to comment, he has the tools to make that happen.
May I write one as I beta tested and have played release?
" Cheating has dropped off dramatically after the nice big ban of over 200 cheaters. Yes it still exists, but I see complaints of cheating far far less now"
Only the obvious cheating like speed hacks has dropped off, the vast majority of hacks available are still ongoing. There are plenty of ways to cheat without other players being aware of it, I know alot of players that use them. At present Aventurine seems to have few methods in place to detect them.
So I think you are wrong to discount cheating as minimal, my experience says otherwise. Maybe your guild is not, but I know some guilds still require it.
If you don't like the Correspondent program, wherein people who play and enjoy their games write about the games, then I would simply suggest that you don't read the Correspondent articles (which are clearly labelled as such) and wait for the site's official review.
As to the frequency of Darkfall coverage... Darkfall articles consistently perform well in terms of traffic. This idicates to me that there are people who want to read about the game. As such, we will provide articles. It just makes sense.
Shocker, I was expecting a PM and a few stars to suddenly disappear from under my name once I posted such negatives.
People will get disappointed as they wanted better troll-food, and will try to post their trollviews.
This game currently has the elements to develop into a juggernaut, just got to wait until it can handle more players.
And my already low opinion regarding the reviews done by MMORPG.com drops several more notches.
I've played this game for six weeks now, and the author of this "review" is showing blantant favoritism by either glossing over or directly avoiding any disscusion about the serious lapses of this game.
Pretending that problems don't exist won't make them go away ( or make them any less noticeable, for that matter ).
Ok, well then can you give us YOUR perspective of what the you feel about the game after playing it for 6 weeks.
Enquiring minds want to know.
Well not to go in circles, but when UO, and Eve was released they had little to no stories whatsoever. The same goes for lore. Again, lore is typically told through stories, which typically come in the form of quests. Games with heaving duty PvE and excellent quests, both in quality and number and never FFA PvP. The quests in both UO and Eve were extremely bland because they were not the primary focus of the game.
Also, the term sandbox is often misued. It means a world where you can do anything, but that anything is primarily player created. For instance if you stare at a sandbox it looks boring. Some kids will get, and play for hours and hours building sand castles and the like. Other kids will just get in and throw sand in someone elses face, and get out. To each his own. I think you are attempting to mix two genres together where this is not clearly the case. To sum it up would lore be nice in the game? To some perhaps, even to myself. Do I want lore at the expense of features that didnt make it in at launch... or new features entirely? Not on your life.
While this may be partially true, the same can be said for anything. Claiming you know people that cheat but no one else knows how and its not detectable by devs is the same as claiming things like their is an undetectable gold dupe. The cheats most people have been concerned with since day 1 are the teleporting problems and the speedhacking. And I can say with 100% certainty that asking anyone who currently subscribes to the game will tell you that these have been dramatically curbed.
I don't discount what you say necessarily, but I believe nothing without proof. And I witnessed both the speedhacking and teleporting first had. I don't any longer...
I dedicated a complete article exclusively to the largest negative aspects currently in Darkfall Online. Articles can be 1500 words max, if it were longer maybe I would have included minor things which are easily fixable and not major problems such as
But I cannot honestly place these over things like speedhacking, and the most important of all, inability to buy the game. Those are things I can easily include in the upcoming 8 parts as I go into detail on each aspect.
Everyone has differences of opinion. Many believe that macroing will ruin the game. Certainly hasn't done so for Ultima Online. They even have had a term coined for rapid macroing techinques that have been around for years (8x8 anyone?). If someone wants to sit in their clan town and blow spells off in the air wasting coin on resources they will never see a gain from, why the hell do I care? I have snuck into many clan towns I am at war with, killed the macroers and gotten literally thousands of free reagents. There is no may to macro coin gain, and nearly all combat skill gain costs $$$.
Maybe I missed what you are saying completely. Can you please specifiy issues I have "glossed over or directly avoiding..."? Please use specific examples and I would be happy to address any of them.
You obviously didnt read the "overview" or you would know that the 3 things you claim are minuses are actually "non issues". I guess we know where the iraq minister of information found work after the invasion.
Why exactly do we have more darkfall news threads on this site than the game has subs?
Combat is extremely clunky and lacks polish. for example, you don't hit every time even though you're in range, and it's worse for ranged combat.
There is a lack of content, even fanboys are complaining about this. there is very few pve content, but of course if you're happy grinding goblins, gank and be ganked for days, then more power to you.
What don't you get? you actually agreed with me on the other points (Graphics (character models are especially bad), polish, UI, no lore). Also how is this overview in any way honest? If I didn't know anything about the game and read this, the major cons of DF, I would be on the official site spamming F5 to buy an account lol. I don't think I have ever read something as biased as this.
I dont get how the combat is broke! you dont hit all the time even if in range? i havent noticed that at all, which makes me feel that it's something that, A: was broke but has been fixed at least 3 weeks ago, or B: it's something you have read in some other post and just decided to jump on the bandwagon :) yes i agreed to other points, just because i am honest! but combat being broke i really dont get, it works fine for me. Yes i dont hit everytime but isnt that normal in combat? lol even EQ was doing that from the first day, and WoW still does it to this day!
Oh ye and by the way! you wouldnt be spamming F5 to buy a copy cause you already have one dont you? or are you just making your factual statments of what you have read from others who dont like the game lol? surely not :)
Oh and as for just farming goblins i said also that i found skeletons and zombies close to the newbie area. And this morning i was at the Troll camp that i recently discovered, after trying the Elements and finding them too tough for me at the min. So ye lol i can see the lack of content :)
Come on mate wait till your more informed at least or maybe try the game yourself. I mean you believe the negative comments but wont believe the positive ones? whats that all about, it's almost like your trying to find reasons not to like it and convince others not to either. Stand up mate and make your own judgment just like i am.
What's Darkfall? LOL. That game is still going?
LOL
@ The trolls of course.
Talk about bias.
EDIT: What about those hissy fits now and the panty ripping?
the part about macroing being a nonissue made me laugh.
Try going into one of the big player cities. All you will see if afk macroers leveling up skills whether its magic / archery solo or a team macro for weapon skill. The game pretty much forces you to do this to compete. Macrofall am i right?
better to give the game an honest heartfelt 2/10 then try and feed this line of BS to people.
No it doesnt force you friend! i am a solo Darkfall player who has never macroed once and seem to be competing rather well so far. Of course if i felt like it i could but that agin would be a choice of mine. Personally i have never tried to max skills as fast as poss, i prefer to "play" the game.
But your right it is better to give the game a heartfelt 2/10 than feed bullshit. But it's also better to give an honest overveiw than just go along with what you read in other posts isn't it? For instance i make my own opinion and like the game.
I think Graphics are not top line but they are good solid graphics.
i think the UI is very bland but workable.
Combat i have no problem with at all. seems fluid and smooth to me.
Cheating i hate. Havent seen any yet but also i am not naive enough to not know it exists. Just like in any game.
Macorers dont bother me. they might level up faster than me but, hey who cares! if it becomes a problem for me then ill complain :)
Open area's with no mobs? at last a game that feels no need to fill every square inch with content. i prefer goblins to hang about in a camp rather than be everywhere! makes me feel like im in a RPG :)
I explained clearly in my article why macroing is a non issue, but I shall reiterate here. I never said macroing doesn't happen, because it absolutely does.
Macroing magic, and archery takes resources (arrows and reagents). Gold in this game is tough to come by. Arrows, and reagents especially are very expensive in this game. As an example, a newbie goblin will drop 5 gold about 75% of the time. Reagents on average cost 3g EACH. So if you have arrows or reagents you really want to be using those on monsters to try and recoup some of your costs. If someone wants to spend their money with zero return, and blow off arrows or spell in the air then more power to them. This in no way effects how you play, or your character in any way. If they earn enough money to blow arrows and reagents on the thin air, then so be it. Not to mention they have big red targets painted on their backs for anyone sneaking into their city because you can hear bow shots and spell casting from a mile away.
Please understand the mechanics of the game before bashing them. Macroing is, and will continue to be a non issue in this game. The same as it has been in UO for 10 years running now.
To be honest, the rest of the "problems" you will see discussed on the message forums are non issues.
If I came to this site to find some information about DFO from the articles written by people trying to pass themselves off as journalists, I'd probably think that that there is nothing wrong with the game and all the bad press surrounding it is generated by a bunch of angry trolls. You admit that there are indeed some issues, seemingly breaking the trend of constantly praising the game and its dev team, but the things you list as the game's greatest shortcomings aren't really issues at all. Not because there aren't any bigger problems to be worried about, but because you conveniently forget to include them in your article, giving all uninformed readers the impression that the game's pretty much perfect. I'm sure there's some kind of definition for this kind of cover up dance you're doing in your little article. Or is it that you're simply clueless and ignorant?
Let's start off with the alignment system. I doubt anyone who wants to PVP in a legitimate manner (that excludes griefing newbies under the disguise of a lawful citizen), has been playing the game for a while, and/or has access to a player run city cares whether he's blue or not. The alignment system is simply a bad copy of the alignment system they had back in UO. In UO:
- you couldn't grind your way back to being a lawful citizen in a matter of minutes by rezkilling your alt
- you couldn't grief someone by constantly looting their kills without any repercussions, because you'd go grey, and then they'd be able to kill you without taking an alignment hit
- you couldn't as easily grief someone into going grey/red, because of the personal flag; if you're grey and someone attacks you, you remain grey to him for as long as it takes for him to kill you, while in DFO if you don't attack back while you're grey, you'll always remain grey for the set duration of 120 seconds, and as soon as you go back blue, the person attacking you will go grey, or red if he's unlucky enough to score a killshot or a "gank" the second you turn blue
- you could actually defend yourself if you were grey (because of mistakenly looting someone's corpse, for example), once again, because of the personal flag; if you were grey or red and someone decided to attack you, he'd flag grey to you and be attackable and freely killable throughout the whole duration of the fight
- you couldn't accidentally kill a person that easily, and even if you did, you wouldn't immediately go red because of it
Yes, the system was exploitable, but much less so than the one in DFO. And no, DFO is not UO2, but if you're going to copy something, then copy it well or don't copy it at all (speaking of doing a piss-poor job copying features from UO... hello, inventory and skill systems!). You didn't even touch any of the stuff I mentioned, I guess these are just some of the non-issues people whine about for no reason at all.
Cheating has a huge impact on the game, since it revolves around PVP and competition, and yet, once again, you're trying to margninalize the issue by saying that it's is not as widespread as some people claim, which is a load of crap. You might want to take a look at the video where a legitimately stolen boat gets hijacked by a cheater (member of the guild the boat got stolen from). Not that big of a deal, right? Just do a search on youtube if you want to find more videos of people cheating or even actual cheat ads. Yes, they've made some strong statements toward banning cheaters etc., but anyone who believes any word that leaves Tasos' mouth at this point should be immediately put under medical observation. If they can simply go through the server logs and find cheaters based on what they see in there, then why the need to report every cheater by name? I'm guessing having a piece of code that highlights logs with some suspicious client behaviour is out of the question? The GMs cannot and will not do anything unless they have the name of the suspected person, because they have no means to determine whether someone is cheating or not other than to follow them, watch them, and catch them red handed, so anyone being careful with their 3rd party tools, for example only using the part of the hack that negates stamina drain (that's how "the best pvpers" of darkfall can sprint/shoot/jump for 5+ minutes straight without having to worry about running out of stam), or only using the radar hack that allows them to see every player in their range on the minimap is never going to get caught.
Exploiting falls under the same category. The exploiters have it great in Darkfall. If I was the kind of person who doesn't care about actual competition and tries to win at any and all cost, I'd love this game. There are exploits in every game out there, what's important is how quickly and efficiently a dev team can deal with both bugs and people exploiting them. Aventurine has this original, one of a kind, ass-backwards way of fixing exploits, that actually rewards exploiters and punishes those who play fair. Acid pools, guard towers, newbie weapons, skilling up on invulnerable targets etc. Every player who took advantage of any of the aforementioned exploits was already ahead of everyone who played fair, but by fixing the exploits and not doing anything about the exploiters, Aventurine indirectly punished everyone else, because they now have to fight people who are much stronger than them and work twice as hard to catch up ("twice as hard" is a major understatement in most cases). There are many other exploits that have existed since the game's not-so-official release and haven't been fixed to this day, like people farming tons of gold and high-end equipment by sitting inside walls, trees, rocks, and other similar objects, chain-soloing mobs that are nearly impossible to solo. Some people are already insanely rich, they're way ahead of the curve in every way imaginable since they can easily afford buying all the stuff they'll ever need to finish building their characters, they get a huge edge over normal players thanks to the high-end equipment, they don't have to worry about losing any of the stuff they wear, since they've got tons of it banked anyway. Nothing is being done about it. How the hell is this a non-issue in a PVP game? Do explain.
Aside from AutoIt loot macros allowing you to empty a tombstone filled to the brim with nearly weightless items in a matter of seconds, I wouldn't say there are any macros that hurt the game at all. Macros are not the problem. The problem is the insanely slow skill grind coupled with the fact that the game is devoid of any actual content, which leads to a situation where macroing is the only way of building a character without going batshit insane.
There are so many other issues with Darkfall, that it would take at least 10 more overviews to list them all. Not like this one, however, since all you do is beat around the bush as much as possible to distract the readers from the real problems. Client and server performance being one of them, considering that city building, sieging, and zerging each other is supposed to be one of the key features of the game. Unfortunately for everyone paying for the game, though, the server lags and crashes every time a big siege is about to take place. The lack of communication with the customers is another thing someone writing an article like this one would most likely list as a problem. It's funny in a sad kind of way how we had to beg Aventurine to start posting some patch notes, and all it takes to make that big-mouthed fraud, Tasos, go on a posting spree is to post some half-assed review consisting of pretty much the same amount of factual-substanse as their official website. I guess they just can't take what they dish out on a regular basis.
tldr version: MMORPG.com game correspondents are full of crap.
Your post is well thought out, but again is devoid of many concepts. For one, you like to use Ultima Online as the example of what they did right, and what in your opinion Darkfall does wrong. In reality UO had far more exploits, far more cheating, then most mmorpgs in history. It was the pioneer this is to be expected. But if you are going to compare the good, please show both sides and compare the bad. Throughout UO's history there were all sorts of duping bugs, primarily for gold but for resources as well. There were also MANY player trading exploits that have popped up over the years.
The alignment system is not perfect. I mentioned this in my article. However 2 months into it and they have already made large strides in balancing it, and Im sure more will come. I'm not sure why you make it seem as though what is here is here to stay and can never at any time be fixed, changed, balanced or altered in any way. The crux of the entire post revolves around this all important statement:
There is not a single issues in Darkfall that cant be patched and balanced out of the game. Not a single one. The core of the game is solid. Games with no solid core can't be changed, Age of Conan being the example. Games can try and change their core, Star Wars Galaxies being the example of that :).
You call the game a grind because its slow gaining skills. I think thats one of the large problems in this game where people expect to play 24 / 7 and see and do all there is to the game in a month... much like you saw with World of Warcraft expansions. This game was not designed in a way where you max your weapon, magic or archery skills in a week. If you are a high end mage, then you earned it. If your goal is to become the max skill level in everything then perhaps this is not the game for you. If you play the game, simply play it... go pk, siege, PvE, craft and trade, your skills will go up naturally and over time, with use as intended. Skills will feel like a grind if your sit in town shooting spells and arrows into the air watching your skill gains.
99% of the cheating videos you see are recycled videos from the first 2 weeks of the game. I actually saw the boat video and from what I heard it was a legit exploit. In one way this is a shame but in another it's almost expected. In one of the first games to actually intoduce sailable ships... and then kick it up a notch and offer up all out naval warfare (even against other cities) I will be expecting major balance issues, tweaks, and exploit fixes to be incoming. I think this may be a ways out though since the amount of big boats crafted to date can still be counted with my own two hands.
Lastly, to put things into perspective, I had 1500 words max to use in this article. Your entire post was 100 words short of my entire article.
Wow. Can't say I really expected much else. I'll stick with K&Gs blog on the subject.
Macroing is a non-issue except all the guilds who control the majority of the world are ones that got their before anyone else, and MACROED to get their players skilled and harvesting supplies needed. Who controls the game world is a non-issue though.
You also left out the worst part of the alignment system. The fact that a game like Ultima online and Lineage2 have targeting and DF doesn't. Fighting mobs in camps or group PvP became a joke. A very frustrating unfunny joke.
And then there is exploiting. Exploiting in DF probably needs an article on its own. The exploits and the alignment system combined are what killed the game for me.
Why are DF reviews so blatantly biased one way or the other?
I explained clearly in my article why macroing is a non issue, but I shall reiterate here. I never said macroing doesn't happen, because it absolutely does.
Macroing magic, and archery takes resources (arrows and reagents). Gold in this game is tough to come by. Arrows, and reagents especially are very expensive in this game. As an example, a newbie goblin will drop 5 gold about 75% of the time. Reagents on average cost 3g EACH. So if you have arrows or reagents you really want to be using those on monsters to try and recoup some of your costs. If someone wants to spend their money with zero return, and blow off arrows or spell in the air then more power to them. This in no way effects how you play, or your character in any way. If they earn enough money to blow arrows and reagents on the thin air, then so be it. Not to mention they have big red targets painted on their backs for anyone sneaking into their city because you can hear bow shots and spell casting from a mile away.
Please understand the mechanics of the game before bashing them. Macroing is, and will continue to be a non issue in this game. The same as it has been in UO for 10 years running now.
I have been a DF player since day one until a couple weeks ago. As a solo player in the newb cities it may be a non issue, this is not where the bulk of the players who actually matter in the game play. (by "matter" I mean those that belong to the guilds who are shaping this PvP sandbox world) Money is not an issue in this game for those that belong to the large guilds / alliances, resources are just about unlimited in and around player cities. Because of territory control you don't have much at all to risk as far as getting ganked. This gives these guild members an unnatural advantage over those who do not have access to these resources and is, in effect, a game breaking imbalance, especially when the death penalty is what it is (which, for the record, is what I like about this game in the first place.)
This coupled with the fact that the guilds that have built these cities did so from exploits that were available from day 1. I couldn't understand how these cities were springing up so early in the game until I learned of the mob glitch that caused some camps to drop 500g each, which was very quickly taken advantage of. Next thing we see is people running around with 100 rigor from abusing another exploit (yeah try fighting a naked ork with 100 rigor sometime, it's not fun).
Also, let's face it, Aventurine never stress tested their servers. Everyone who bought the game up to this point has been involved in a paid beta program. Had they waited and done an open or even just a larger scale closed beta test for bug reporting purposes and capacity tests, this game could have could have been much finer tuned. Instead we have a community that was built on exploits and has enabled an unfixable imbalance in the game.
Most of us that have left are waiting for the NA server to come up in hope that the exploits will be fixed and everyone can start on a level playing field. However, since the Aventurine team can't even get enough manpower to update their front page and seemingly always are addressing crashes due to hardware or connectivity issues, this just doesn't seem like it will be coming to fruition any time soon.
So yes, I understand, have used, and now bash the mechanics of the game.
I will say the fact that they actually did take action on the hackers is a good sign. But they have a long way to go before they get subs back.
Ok I have to call bullshit on your comments :). Hmm where to start:
If you don't like the game thats ok, many won't. Just make sure what you post is accurate and up to date.
If you're going to write an article that makes the accusation that there's a lot of misinformation floating around, you may want to make sure you got all your facts straight.
"The basic premise is that all characters start with +10 alignment on a scale of -50 to +100."
The maximum possitive aliengment a player can gain is 10.
From the patch notes: • Alignment has been tweaked. The maximum positive alignment you can have has been reduced to 10.
"However, with the massive demand for this game, the daily sales quotas were being consumed in under 5 minutes."
No. It never sold out in less then 5 minutes. Some days it took 45 some days it took 15, but it never took 5. One day in fact it took almost an hour and a half.
"The game is purchased via digital download exclusively"
No. If you read thier EULA you would also understand why they aren't allowed to sell you a copy of the game, and what you actually purchase is an account. From the EULA: 1. Limited License to the World. Your participation in the Game and the World are subject to your ongoing agreement to and compliance with these TOS. Aventurine grants you a non exclusive, non transferable, revocable license to the Game and the World, subject to these TOS and the EULA.
The game client itself is free to download, and not dependant upon the purchase of your limitted lisence.
"I can confirm that cheating does in fact exist in this game"
Cheating in any form is never a "non-issue"; the fact that you can confirm it and say "You may see this from time to time," is not a good thing in any game. In the 3 years of Lineage 2, and 4 years of WoW the worst cheating I encountered were bots. I never encounterd speed hacks, teleport hacks, flying hacks, or aim hacks in those games. You're attempting to downplay a serious issue with the game. It blows my mind that anyone can in one sentence state that it's a non-issue, and in another say that you'll see it from time to time.
AFK macroing is cheating. It can get you banned. Tasos himself has had to make mulitple posts covering this topic; that in itself implies a problem. AFK macroing accures a LOT. No, it won't make you uber overnight, but again you took a serious issue and attempt to downplay it. The guy that will afk macro his lesser magic, will also afk macro is greater magic; they don't do this just one night, they do this for days on end. This sort of cheating is gives people a considerable advantage and allows them to advance at a rate that a normal player has no chance of competing with. It's hardly a non-issue.
The alignment change was in the April 10th patch.
Harvesting was changed in the May 1st patch notes.
Either the author isn't actually playing the game anymore, or this article was written over a month ago, and contanes "misinformation".
Ok I have to call bullshit on your comments :). Hmm where to start:
If you don't like the game thats ok, many won't. Just make sure what you post is accurate and up to date.
Based on you list of items here I just have 1 question.
And please bear with me, as it is an honest question...
If combat skils do not effect damage or hit rate, or I'm assuming effect the outcome of combat at all, why are there combat skills?
Leveling combat skills build str / dex which increases damage.
I have been a DF player since day one until a couple weeks ago. As a solo player in the newb cities it may be a non issue, this is not where the bulk of the players who actually matter in the game play. (by "matter" I mean those that belong to the guilds who are shaping this PvP sandbox world) Money is not an issue in this game for those that belong to the large guilds / alliances, resources are just about unlimited in and around player cities. Because of territory control you don't have much at all to risk as far as getting ganked. This gives these guild members an unnatural advantage over those who do not have access to these resources and is, in effect, a game breaking imbalance, especially when the death penalty is what it is (which, for the record, is what I like about this game in the first place.)
This coupled with the fact that the guilds that have built these cities did so from exploits that were available from day 1. I couldn't understand how these cities were springing up so early in the game until I learned of the mob glitch that caused some camps to drop 500g each, which was very quickly taken advantage of. Next thing we see is people running around with 100 rigor from abusing another exploit (yeah try fighting a naked ork with 100 rigor sometime, it's not fun).
Also, let's face it, Aventurine never stress tested their servers. Everyone who bought the game up to this point has been involved in a paid beta program. Had they waited and done an open or even just a larger scale closed beta test for bug reporting purposes and capacity tests, this game could have could have been much finer tuned. Instead we have a community that was built on exploits and has enabled an unfixable imbalance in the game.
Most of us that have left are waiting for the NA server to come up in hope that the exploits will be fixed and everyone can start on a level playing field. However, since the Aventurine team can't even get enough manpower to update their front page and seemingly always are addressing crashes due to hardware or connectivity issues, this just doesn't seem like it will be coming to fruition any time soon.
So yes, I understand, have used, and now bash the mechanics of the game.
I will say the fact that they actually did take action on the hackers is a good sign. But they have a long way to go before they get subs back.
You bring up 2 good points. The first 3 days the game was released there were issues with mobs becoming out of synch with the world. This made it so that many camps did not actually attack back. The players in beta apparently knew where the higher end mob camps were and when they realized the sync issues they began to exploit. This is both a true and legit statement. They then garnered the 10k gold necessary to purchase a clanstone and grabbed a city. Keep in mind 10k is actually not that much. Consider your clan has 100 players, and each players donates 100g. This is the equivalent of killing 25 - 30 goblins. At any rate this caused people to gain cities faster than normal. However this is brought up time and time again as some sort of game breaking issue where in reality it is not. Games like Ultima online used to cost a shitload to build a castle or a large structure. But its not like these were popping up on day 1 :). In Darkfall there are set plots of land laid out for hamlets (small cities) all the way up to the full cities. I believe there are 97 total spread out all over the place. It doesnt matter if players grabbed all 97 sites on day 1, day 11, day 111, day 1111 or whatever. At some point all cities are going to be owned. FYI any and all cities can be stolen, and this includes any and all resources spent on building the city up. Once you take it over its yours. Its called sieging. Cities change hands on a daily basis, and I have been called on more than one occasion as a solo mercenary who does good work in city defense. I have been paid quite hansomly on several occasions.
The second comment you make is also valid, about the stress testing. However, at some point they have to release like any mmorpg. 30 days from now the game will be be better than it was 30 days ago. In fact, every mmorpg works that way. Lord of the Rings Online, one of the most stable mmorpgs ever released, contantly adds content. Would they hold many more subs if they waited years (until now) to release with the included content that has been developed over the past several years? Probably. But at some point the developement needs to stop, the game needs to be released, and what didnt make it into release becomes future content.
Your comment about clans having some fair unbalance is not as accurate. Owning a city provides only one real benefit other than having a safe area outside of the newbie cities to hang out in. That benefit is having in town nodes for various resources. These nodes are the equivalent of 20 or so regular nodes in one, and regen very slowly. This happens to be the only way to harvest rare ore other than killing the spefic golems themselves. This is the reason cities are both sought after and warred after. The resources are typically turned into building blocks used to create more structures in the city. It actually takes massive amounts of resources to build structures in Darkfall. But say they have an unfair advantage is like complaining that the well orgranized group of 100 just slayed the dragon and is flashing all sorts of loot in your face, all the while you tried and failed to solo the dragon on your own. I am a through and through solo player and have been all the way back to UO. I like grouping with close friends but I am not a fan of clans, especially large "leet" ones. But its not fair for me as a player to expect to accomplish the same thing as a large clan for that very reason. Some clans literally have hundreds and hundreds of active players. But claiming an unbalance is a bit harsh. Its just a numbers game short and simple.
The rigor exploit was well known and was corrected within 10 days of the game's release. It was actually fixed before I even knew what rigor was. This was again used by beta testers that apparently already knew about it. And as you have already pointed out there werent enough beta testers :). And we have done quite a few tests against people with 100 rigor. Through normal play to this point your should have around 30-50 rigor which gives .3 - .4 in your applicable defenses. 100 Rigor gives you 1.0. A suit of scale (which is mid grade armor, costs 1000 gold or so for a full suit) gives you about 7.0 or so to your applicable defenses. So exploiting at this point would put you at about 8.0 vs 7.4 in the given defensive area. Thats approximately a 7.5% advantage to the beta players who decided to exploit in the first 10 or so days the game went live.
If you went to another server, played for 60 days or so, and all of the towns are swallowed up by clans, won't your same issues with the alleged imbalance exist?
Based on you list of items here I just have 1 question.
And please bear with me, as it is an honest question...
If combat skils do not effect damage or hit rate, or I'm assuming effect the outcome of combat at all, why are there combat skills?
I'd also like to know how you could never macro for resources?
Because I macroed for resources before they implimented the harvesting toggle.
And I would really like to know if Andy is still playing the game.
Some of the things mentioned in the article were changed over a month ago.
Edit:
There are NPC vendors that can only be accessed if you have a clan city/ hamlet and place that vendor.
Vendors that sell things like recipes that unless you have access to a clan city you can't get. I also believe that there are supposed to be other skills that clans in control of cities will gain access to through vendors only they can put in place.
If you're going to be a correspondent for a game you should at least be playing that game. I'm quickly coming to the conclusion that Andy isn't playing any longer as much of the things I'm seeing him write aren't relevant to the game today, or he's very uniformed about some of the mechanics of the game.
Based on you list of items here I just have 1 question.
And please bear with me, as it is an honest question...
If combat skils do not effect damage or hit rate, or I'm assuming effect the outcome of combat at all, why are there combat skills?
That is a very legit question, and is answered in my next part of the overview on skills. Darkfall is very strange in the way it works its skills, and its not like other skill based games (UO, AC, etc). Darkfall does everything it can to put as much of the final outcome of a battle into the hands of the player themselves. We will call this player skill. They do this by offering advantages to higher skills, but not necessarily how you would expect. For instance if I have a skill of 1 in sprint, I will run just as fast as someone that has 100 sprint skill. The difference will be that my stamina will deplete faster at a skill level of 1, meaning I can travel that much farter while sprinting the higher my skill goes.
In regards to combat fighting skills do 3 things:
* They make you consume less stamina per swing (more ttacks before you are out of stam)
* At skill level 1 you can use any weapon in the game. However each weapon (all items really) have a durability that decreases with use. Once it reaches 0 it breaks and disappears, no repair skills or repair NPCs... the item is gone forever. The more higher rank (higher end) the weapon, the faster it will degrade without proper skill. So this saves you a shitload of money later on because the real high end stuff is insanely expensive, and if it breaks after an hour its hardly worth it. Very neat system in that it allows anyone to use anything, but for a price
* Using weapon skills increase your strength (or dex for archery) which also secondarily increases your damage
Based on you list of items here I just have 1 question.
And please bear with me, as it is an honest question...
If combat skils do not effect damage or hit rate, or I'm assuming effect the outcome of combat at all, why are there combat skills?
That is a very legit question, and is answered in my next part of the overview on skills. Darkfall is very strange in the way it works its skills, and its not like other skill based games (UO, AC, etc). Darkfall does everything it can to put as much of the final outcome of a battle into the hands of the player themselves. We will call this player skill. They do this by offering advantages to higher skills, but not necessarily how you would expect. For instance if I have a skill of 1 in sprint, I will run just as fast as someone that has 100 sprint skill. The difference will be that my stamina will deplete faster at a skill level of 1, meaning I can travel that much farter while sprinting the higher my skill goes.
In regards to combat fighting skills do 3 things:
* They make you consume less stamina per swing (more ttacks before you are out of stam)
* At skill level 1 you can use any weapon in the game. However each weapon (all items really) have a durability that decreases with use. Once it reaches 0 it breaks and disappears, no repair skills or repair NPCs... the item is gone forever. The more higher rank (higher end) the weapon, the faster it will degrade without proper skill. So this saves you a shitload of money later on because the real high end stuff is insanely expensive, and if it breaks after an hour its hardly worth it. Very neat system in that it allows anyone to use anything, but for a price
* Using weapon skills increase your strength (or dex for archery) which also secondarily increases your damage
ARE YOU STILL PLAYIG THE GAME!
You have informatin in your article that is WRONG!
The alignment system was changed over a month ago.
How can you not know this?
Edit: You also made a comment in this thread about clan cities not giving any real benefit and that is also WRONG. Clan cities have access to vendors that sell things you can't get unless you have a city and have placed that vendor.
[quote]
You bring up 2 good points. The first 3 days the game was released there were issues with mobs becoming out of synch with the world. This made it so that many camps did not actually attack back. The players in beta apparently knew where the higher end mob camps were and when they realized the sync issues they began to exploit. This is both a true and legit statement. They then garnered the 10k gold necessary to purchase a clanstone and grabbed a city. Keep in mind 10k is actually not that much. Consider your clan has 100 players, and each players donates 100g. This is the equivalent of killing 25 - 30 goblins. At any rate this caused people to gain cities faster than normal. However this is brought up time and time again as some sort of game breaking issue where in reality it is not. Games like Ultima online used to cost a shitload to build a castle or a large structure. But its not like these were popping up on day 1 :). In Darkfall there are set plots of land laid out for hamlets (small cities) all the way up to the full cities. I believe there are 97 total spread out all over the place. It doesnt matter if players grabbed all 97 sites on day 1, day 11, day 111, day 1111 or whatever. At some point all cities are going to be owned. FYI any and all cities can be stolen, and this includes any and all resources spent on building the city up. Once you take it over its yours. Its called sieging. Cities change hands on a daily basis, and I have been called on more than one occasion as a solo mercenary who does good work in city defense. I have been paid quite hansomly on several occasions.
The second comment you make is also valid, about the stress testing. However, at some point they have to release like any mmorpg. 30 days from now the game will be be better than it was 30 days ago. In fact, every mmorpg works that way. Lord of the Rings Online, one of the most stable mmorpgs ever released, contantly adds content. Would they hold many more subs if they waited years (until now) to release with the included content that has been developed over the past several years? Probably. But at some point the developement needs to stop, the game needs to be released, and what didnt make it into release becomes future content.
Your comment about clans having some fair unbalance is not as accurate. Owning a city provides only one real benefit other than having a safe area outside of the newbie cities to hang out in. That benefit is having in town nodes for various resources. These nodes are the equivalent of 20 or so regular nodes in one, and regen very slowly. This happens to be the only way to harvest rare ore other than killing the spefic golems themselves. This is the reason cities are both sought after and warred after. The resources are typically turned into building blocks used to create more structures in the city. It actually takes massive amounts of resources to build structures in Darkfall. But say they have an unfair advantage is like complaining that the well orgranized group of 100 just slayed the dragon and is flashing all sorts of loot in your face, all the while you tried and failed to solo the dragon on your own. I am a through and through solo player and have been all the way back to UO. I like grouping with close friends but I am not a fan of clans, especially large "leet" ones. But its not fair for me as a player to expect to accomplish the same thing as a large clan for that very reason. Some clans literally have hundreds and hundreds of active players. But claiming an unbalance is a bit harsh. Its just a numbers game short and simple.
The rigor exploit was well known and was corrected within 10 days of the game's release. It was actually fixed before I even knew what rigor was. This was again used by beta testers that apparently already knew about it. And as you have already pointed out there werent enough beta testers :). And we have done quite a few tests against people with 100 rigor. Through normal play to this point your should have around 30-50 rigor which gives .3 - .4 in your applicable defenses. 100 Rigor gives you 1.0. A suit of scale (which is mid grade armor, costs 1000 gold or so for a full suit) gives you about 7.0 or so to your applicable defenses. So exploiting at this point would put you at about 8.0 vs 7.4 in the given defensive area. Thats approximately a 7.5% advantage to the beta players who decided to exploit in the first 10 or so days the game went live.
If you went to another server, played for 60 days or so, and all of the towns are swallowed up by clans, won't your same issues with the alleged imbalance exist?[/quote]
No, because the exploits used for resources around these towns still exist and are used daily. For the new server to succeed these will need to be looked at and patched. Hacking was the next big concern, but it seems that since they are taking action on this we can check this one off the books. Macroing still needs to be addressed in a big way.
The rigor exploit was just one example of the exploits that can be used to alter stats. There are still exploitable mobs in this game that can be used for stat increase as well as material gain, not to mention macro tactics that can also build these stats. Your comment about armor brings up another good point, these naked pk's have nopthing to lose while the honest citzen is out a set of plate. Unfair, imbalanced.
My comments on the imbalance of clan cities has nothing to do with a numbers game, it's about providing a worry free macro environment which others are not privy to, as well as access to the exploits in that area which are also in a worry free environment so far as getting ganked is concerned.
Read post #16, this explains the discrepency in the alignment info. Artciles are submitted up to 2 weeks prior to posting. I noted the changes as soon as the article was posted.
For anyone that tried to buy the game the first few weeks, it was gone in 5 minutes. I am not sure what to tell you. From what I am told recently the store has been open for as long as 45 minutes, as you claim.
I am not sure why you are nitpicking about the digital download. You give them 50 bucks, you get the game to download, you pay your 15 bucks a month after your free month like every other mmorpg. You cant buy it in a store. Not sure why that was confusing.
I never said cheating was a non issue, thats why it was mentioned in the article relating to "the downside of Darkfall".
AFL macroing does "occur" (hrm) a lot. I mention this as well. The reasons its a non issue were explained clearly. If you want to macro something that will make a difference, every arrow shot, or spell cast will cost you the same as someone using the same attacks on legit targets. On one hand you lose the cost, the other you supplement it. If you want to take your hard earned arrows and reagents and shoot them in the air go ahead. I prefer to use my gold to make more of it. Or at least break even.
Based on you list of items here I just have 1 question.
And please bear with me, as it is an honest question...
If combat skils do not effect damage or hit rate, or I'm assuming effect the outcome of combat at all, why are there combat skills?
I'd also like to know how you could never macro for resources?
Because I macroed for resources before they implimented the harvesting toggle.
And I would really like to know if Andy is still playing the game.
Some of the things mentioned in the article were changed over a month ago.
Edit:
There are NPC vendors that can only be accessed if you have a clan city/ hamlet and place that vendor.
Vendors that sell things like recipes that unless you have access to a clan city you can't get. I also believe that there are supposed to be other skills that clans in control of cities will gain access to through vendors only they can put in place.
If you're going to be a correspondent for a game you should at least be playing that game. I'm quickly coming to the conclusion that Andy isn't playing any longer as much of the things I'm seeing him write aren't relevant to the game today, or he's very uniformed about some of the mechanics of the game.
To answers your comments:
* You cannot macro to the capacity of massive gains as some are suggesting. As I have already stated, each node carries 51 resources and can be wiped in 8-10 minutes. If you have a macro that can run from resource to resource, hide from PKs, defends against PKs, run to the bank when you are full of resources, switch tools when they break with use, then I stand corrected. If your macro just pressed the mouse button 51 times instead of you doing it with your finger, I fail to see the game breaking nature of this.
* Your comment on special vendors in towns that are not available elsewhere is false. There was one spell in the game which was bugged and only appeared in Player Cities (on T2 Mage vendors) and this was the spell Teleport Anchor which allows you to bind a runestone to a location. As of a patch or two ago, this was fixed and is now found in all racial capital cities
Just for the fact that this company is indie ill give them the benefit of the doubt. I understand its hard to start from sratch and only limited copies are released. But they need to shape up soon and start giving out Trials or something so they can defend themselves, as well as players in the game, properly. Right now the future of this game does not look so pretty....
That is a very legit question, and is answered in my next part of the overview on skills. Darkfall is very strange in the way it works its skills, and its not like other skill based games (UO, AC, etc). Darkfall does everything it can to put as much of the final outcome of a battle into the hands of the player themselves. We will call this player skill. They do this by offering advantages to higher skills, but not necessarily how you would expect. For instance if I have a skill of 1 in sprint, I will run just as fast as someone that has 100 sprint skill. The difference will be that my stamina will deplete faster at a skill level of 1, meaning I can travel that much farter while sprinting the higher my skill goes.
In regards to combat fighting skills do 3 things:
* They make you consume less stamina per swing (more ttacks before you are out of stam)
* At skill level 1 you can use any weapon in the game. However each weapon (all items really) have a durability that decreases with use. Once it reaches 0 it breaks and disappears, no repair skills or repair NPCs... the item is gone forever. The more higher rank (higher end) the weapon, the faster it will degrade without proper skill. So this saves you a shitload of money later on because the real high end stuff is insanely expensive, and if it breaks after an hour its hardly worth it. Very neat system in that it allows anyone to use anything, but for a price
* Using weapon skills increase your strength (or dex for archery) which also secondarily increases your damage
ARE YOU STILL PLAYIG THE GAME!
You have informatin in your article that is WRONG!
The alignment system was changed over a month ago.
How can you not know this?
Edit: You also made a comment in this thread about clan cities not giving any real benefit and that is also WRONG. Clan cities have access to vendors that sell things you can't get unless you have a city and have placed that vendor.
See post #16, this explians that the articles are often submitted weeks before they are published. It was patched after I submitted my article. In fact it was patched after I submitted my third part :).
See the above post in regards to your clan city vendor comment.
I guess that depends on if you are playing or not :). That being said a trial is a great idea. But truthfully the way they are focusing their attention, it seems the next 6 months will be consumed by patches, content additions, and primarily opening up new servers in Europe as well as North America.
Truthfully if its so much work just to buy the damn game I doubt we will see a trial ever :). But here's to hoping.
Am I mistaken in that the resource nodes outside of clan cities give the same 51 resources and regenerate at the same rate as ones found around newb cities, and ever other place in the game? I actually found an uninhabitted island where half of the nodes are ore. I have never seen another single player on the island. I go there twice a day and come back with like TONs of ore. Its actually been my bread and butter for 2 weeks now. Try exploring some and get away from the newb areas if you cant find nodes. They are literally everywhere. And they are all identical...
Read post #16, this explains the discrepency in the alignment info. Artciles are submitted up to 2 weeks prior to posting. I noted the changes as soon as the article was posted.
For anyone that tried to buy the game the first few weeks, it was gone in 5 minutes. I am not sure what to tell you. From what I am told recently the store has been open for as long as 45 minutes, as you claim.
I am not sure why you are nitpicking about the digital download. You give them 50 bucks, you get the game to download, you pay your 15 bucks a month after your free month like every other mmorpg. You cant buy it in a store. Not sure why that was confusing.
I never said cheating was a non issue, thats why it was mentioned in the article relating to "the downside of Darkfall".
AFL macroing does "occur" (hrm) a lot. I mention this as well. The reasons its a non issue were explained clearly. If you want to macro something that will make a difference, every arrow shot, or spell cast will cost you the same as someone using the same attacks on legit targets. On one hand you lose the cost, the other you supplement it. If you want to take your hard earned arrows and reagents and shoot them in the air go ahead. I prefer to use my gold to make more of it. Or at least break even.
Post 16 has nothing to do with why you have informatin in the article that became irrelivent over a month ago.
This article could have been written in under 2 hours.
If it was submitted 2 weeks ago the information you provided in it is still outdated as the change to the alignement system was at the beginning of april
I purchased the game the start of the second week.
I purchased it more then 20 minutes after the shop opened.
The shop also had periods of being open for up to 45 min, and this was within the first month. Believe me, I have nothing better to do, and if I have to sift there the filth on thier website to find the threads, I will.
It sold out the second day in in just under 15 min.
The day after that it took 9-11 min.
Nitpicking? You wrote an article making the acusation of misinformation floating around and your atricle has information that is wrong!
In the first 2 weeks of the shop opening one of the biggest contributers outside of the demand that prevented people from purchasing the game was.
1. shop server crashing.
2. no one being aware at the time that if you refreshed the page before it timed out you would get banned for 10 min.
These two things had a drastic impact on the ability of people to purchase the game; regardless of the demand.
No. People playing the game legitimatly do not gain the same advantage of people that afk macro.
If AFK macroing wasn't providing people with an unfair advantage then Av wouldn't ban you for doing it.
They will even ban you for afk swimming!
You're attempting to downplay one of the biggest issues that people have with the game. This isn't a haters perspective, this is a fan perspective. Read thier forums. There are post after post after post of people complaining about it. For you to say it's a non-issue is ludicris. The FANS are very clear, and extremely vocal that it's an issue they take seriously.
"To be honest, the rest of the "problems" you will see discussed on the message forums are non issues. The most talked about topic is obviously regarding rampant cheating."
Either you wrote the article or you didn't. You can't say that you didn't call it a non issue when it's clearly written in the article. Did you write it? If yes then you yourself used the words non issue. You were trying to down play the problem as not being that big a deal. I do know how to read between the lines.
Edit:
So there aren't clan vendors in game that sell crafting recipies that utilize the clan resource nodes?
Second edit: If what you're saying is true, could you please explain to me what the advanced skill trainers that city controlling clans can place are for? Cause I've never seen them in the NPC cities.
Would it be to much to ask you to PM me your character name please. I'd like to actually verify you play the game.
Post 16 has nothing to do with why you have informatin in the article that became irrelivent over a month ago.
This article could have been written in under 2 hours.
If it was submitted 2 weeks ago the information you provided in it is still outdated as the change to the alignement system was at the beginning of april
I purchased the game the start of the second week.
I purchased it more then 20 minutes after the shop opened.
The shop also had periods of being open for up to 45 min, and this was within the first month. Believe me, I have nothing better to do, and if I have to sift there the filth on thier website to find the threads, I will.
It sold out the second day in in just under 15 min.
The day after that it took 9-11 min.
Nitpicking? You wrote an article making the acusation of misinformation floating around and your atricle has information that is wrong!
In the first 2 weeks of the shop opening one of the biggest contributers outside of the demand that prevented people from purchasing the game was.
1. shop server crashing.
2. no one being aware at the time that if you refreshed the page before it timed out you would get banned for 10 min.
These two things had a drastic impact on the ability of people to purchase the game; regardless of the demand.
No. People playing the game legitimatly do not gain the same advantage of people that afk macro.
If AFK macroing wasn't providing people with an unfair advantage then Av wouldn't ban you for doing it.
They will even ban you for afk swimming!
You're attempting to downplay one of the biggest issues that people have with the game. This isn't a haters perspective, this is a fan perspective. Read thier forums. There are post after post after post of people complaining about it. For you to say it's a non-issue is ludicris. The FANS are very clear, and extremely vocal that it's an issue they take seriously.
"To be honest, the rest of the "problems" you will see discussed on the message forums are non issues. The most talked about topic is obviously regarding rampant cheating."
Either you wrote the article or you didn't. You can't say that you didn't call it a non issue when it's clearly written in the article. Did you write it? If yes then you yourself used the words non issue. You were trying to down play the problem as not being that big a deal. I do know how to read between the lines.
Edit:
So there aren't clan vendors in game that sell crafting recipies that utilize the clan resource nodes?
We will simply have to agree to disagree on the times. Accounts sold in 5 minutes or less, I dont know what else to say.
Can you please explain how AFK macroing grants anyone some kind of massive advantage? They do not ban you for AFK macroing, they never have and they never will. They have made one giant banning of 200+ players, and in the news section Tasos specifically mentioned that macroing was not a factor. In fact, in my article where I talk about macroing, I took a picture of a guy afk macroing swimming in town :). If you go to Heimdal in Dwarf land, you will see at least half a dozen people macroing in the water there at any given time of the day. I am sure the same goes for all newb towns all over the world.
I personally am not a fan of macroing, never have and never will be. Others are the min / maxers that feel every hour not in the game is some kind of gain that is lost. To each his own. If I felt someone else's AFK macro someone hurt me in any way, I would be up in arms as well. But the truth is I have profited heavily off of AFK macroers by snaeaking into clan towns, killing them, looting their arrows and reagents, banking them and repeating. Macroing AFK is a huge risk for skills that matter... all of this was fairly well laid out in the article. I am sorry you feel someone macroing up skills like swimming and resting someone have this tremendous advantage over you in PvP, PvE, or any other aspect of the game.
Macros have exited in every skill based game going back to UO. I would be "shocked" if anyone who had ever played UO didnt know what 8x8 meant. Or anyone who ever played Asherons Call didnt know what UCM meant. Or anyone who played Eve Online had never heard the term "macro miner". Macroing is a biproduct of skill based systems, always has been and always will be.
For one, you like to use Ultima Online as the example of what they did right, and what in your opinion Darkfall does wrong.
Stop putting words in my mouth and go reread my post if you have to. At no point did I state or even hint that UO is the example of an MMORPG done right. What I said was that if Aventurine decided to copy some of the systems employed in UO (and that is exactly what they were going for), they should've made sure that they were making exact replicas of those systems, and not some poor-man's xerox copies, each of them missing some of the most important parts.
Yes, UO was full of holes and exploits, but what kind of argument is that? That was 12 years ago. Different era for MMORPG-s and games in general. Besides, like I wrote in my previous post, it doesn't matter how many exploits there are in the game as long as the company developing it can deal with them all in an efficient manner. It's been proven time after time that Aventurine is not capable of doing that, and if they do "fix" something, they usually make things worse than they were in the first place for the legit players. They took their sweet time developing the game, the beta test was a joke and a waste of time for everyone involved, as they basically took a huge, steaming pile of crap on all our feedback and suggestions, ignorning everything and going their own way of fixing the game 0.000001 bug at a time. Which is why I believe there's no fixing this game, not by Aventurine. It takes them weeks to fix minor client issues, they have not implemented any improvements/new content other than some world changes and the scale armor parts for months now. I'm not one of those people who believe in miracles or miracle patches, and so I don't think that Aventurine's going to change their ways all of a sudden and actually start fixing the game instead of only applying small balancing tweaks which they never even test beforehand. The core of the game might be solid, but unfortunately, the people operating on it are just a bunch of incompetent amateurs. It actually seems as if they outsourced the development of the game client and are now trying to fix it and add new stuff, but they're holding the manual upside down.
You know what might help them keep their subs? Acting like they're a professional company. Being apologetic instead of lying their way out of each and every one of their screw ups and basically telling people to gtfo if they don't like their product. My theory is that if Tasos can pull as many lies as necessary out of his ass at any given moment, then he'd surely be able to cover up the fact that they're just a bunch of assholes, and pretend that they do care about their customers, by often posting long, informative, truthful (maybe except for the part where he'd say they care etc.) updates.
You call the game a grind because its slow gaining skills. I think thats one of the large problems in this game where people expect to play 24 / 7 and see and do all there is to the game in a month...
You really do need to get a clue. Trying to talk to you about PVP is like explaining astrophysics to a chimp. It's nice that you can write articles about DFO and stuffs, but due to the fact that you don't really know what you're talking about, it makes them largely misleading to newbies and completely worthless to anybody who knows a thing or two about the game. I call the game a grind because IT IS A GRIND. Every aspect of the game is incredibly grindy and there is no looking at it from a different perspective. You don't play competitive games to watch the sunset and enjoy long walks on the beach with your fellow griefers; you play them to compete, and the only way to do that is to max your stats as quickly as everyone else. A new/casual player cannot go pk people who hit twice as hard, he cannot siege towns populated by people who hit twice as hard, he cannot PvE because he is going to get pked by people who hit twice as hard. Get the picture? And yes, that's always been the case with MMO games, through years of rigoruous training the developers have taught us that the character development process has to be the most consuming part of any MMORPG, since it's much easier to put heavy emphasis on gaining experience/skillpoints than to develop some actual end-game content. It's even more of a problem in Darkfall than in any other PVP game before, since it takes so incredibly long to build a character.
9% of the cheating videos you see are recycled videos from the first 2 weeks of the game.
You really don't need to explain cheating to me. I've run into enough cheaters on my own to know how many of them are in the game, guess you could blame it on bad luck... Speedhackers, people teleporting into dungeon walls or away from me to escape, people teleporting in and jacking mounts from right in front of me and teleporting out. As for the boat video, I'm afraid you've heard wrong. There are 3rd party multihack programs that allow people to go invisible (which is probably what the cheater in the video did, so none of the people on the boat saw him coming), speedhack (incredible speed of the boat), ignore the laws of physics (flying boat), and it is obvious to anybody with at least a tiny bit of a clue that such a program was used in this case. So again, you're wrong. Darkfall isn't one of the first games to introduce ships, you could sail ships in UO, which was a 2D game released almost 12 years ago as you well know, but that's beside the point since you were just going on about how the introduction of sailable ships has to do with them being exploitable, even though that player was clearly cheating.
Post 16 has nothing to do with why you have informatin in the article that became irrelivent over a month ago.
This article could have been written in under 2 hours.
If it was submitted 2 weeks ago the information you provided in it is still outdated as the change to the alignement system was at the beginning of april
I purchased the game the start of the second week.
I purchased it more then 20 minutes after the shop opened.
The shop also had periods of being open for up to 45 min, and this was within the first month. Believe me, I have nothing better to do, and if I have to sift there the filth on thier website to find the threads, I will.
It sold out the second day in in just under 15 min.
The day after that it took 9-11 min.
Nitpicking? You wrote an article making the acusation of misinformation floating around and your atricle has information that is wrong!
In the first 2 weeks of the shop opening one of the biggest contributers outside of the demand that prevented people from purchasing the game was.
1. shop server crashing.
2. no one being aware at the time that if you refreshed the page before it timed out you would get banned for 10 min.
These two things had a drastic impact on the ability of people to purchase the game; regardless of the demand.
No. People playing the game legitimatly do not gain the same advantage of people that afk macro.
If AFK macroing wasn't providing people with an unfair advantage then Av wouldn't ban you for doing it.
They will even ban you for afk swimming!
You're attempting to downplay one of the biggest issues that people have with the game. This isn't a haters perspective, this is a fan perspective. Read thier forums. There are post after post after post of people complaining about it. For you to say it's a non-issue is ludicris. The FANS are very clear, and extremely vocal that it's an issue they take seriously.
"To be honest, the rest of the "problems" you will see discussed on the message forums are non issues. The most talked about topic is obviously regarding rampant cheating."
Either you wrote the article or you didn't. You can't say that you didn't call it a non issue when it's clearly written in the article. Did you write it? If yes then you yourself used the words non issue. You were trying to down play the problem as not being that big a deal. I do know how to read between the lines.
Edit:
So there aren't clan vendors in game that sell crafting recipies that utilize the clan resource nodes?
We will simply have to agree to disagree on the times. Accounts sold in 5 minutes or less, I dont know what else to say.
Can you please explain how AFK macroing grants anyone some kind of massive advantage? They do not ban you for AFK macroing, they never have and they never will. They have made one giant banning of 200+ players, and in the news section Tasos specifically mentioned that macroing was not a factor. In fact, in my article where I talk about macroing, I took a picture of a guy afk macroing swimming in town :). If you go to Heimdal in Dwarf land, you will see at least half a dozen people macroing in the water there at any given time of the day. I am sure the same goes for all newb towns all over the world.
I personally am not a fan of macroing, never have and never will be. Others are the min / maxers that feel every hour not in the game is some kind of gain that is lost. To each his own. If I felt someone else's AFK macro someone hurt me in any way, I would be up in arms as well. But the truth is I have profited heavily off of AFK macroers by snaeaking into clan towns, killing them, looting their arrows and reagents, banking them and repeating. Macroing AFK is a huge risk for skills that matter... all of this was fairly well laid out in the article. I am sorry you feel someone macroing up skills like swimming and resting someone have this tremendous advantage over you in PvP, PvE, or any other aspect of the game.
Macros have exited in every skill based game going back to UO. I would be "shocked" if anyone who had ever played UO didnt know what 8x8 meant. Or anyone who ever played Asherons Call didnt know what UCM meant. Or anyone who played Eve Online had never heard the term "macro miner". Macroing is a biproduct of skill based systems, always has been and always will be.
Unattended macroing anywhere is forbidden. Offenders will be kicked. Repeat offenders will be banned.
www.http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=150640
Afk macroing gives you an advantage because I can set up a macro to cast magic or shot a bow and then go to sleep or work while my character continues to progress. The normal player actually has to log out at some point.
I shouldn't have to explain how afk macroing gives an advantage over legitimate players or why it's considered cheating in pretty much every MMO out.
Av has made it very clear, see the link and quote above, that if you get caught afk macroing you can get banned.
8x8 was an exploit. It wasn't just a macro and EA banned people for it; my brother included.
Edit: You can stop telling people that the accounts were selling out in 5 min or less because it's a lie.
I already told you, I purchased my account the start of the second week, 20 minutes after the shop opened.
The fastest is sold out was something like 9 min.
Edit again: I'm really irritated with this article.
I LOVE the correspondents program and appreciate it. However, this article and a lot of what you've posted in this thread is misinformation; the very thing you attempted to adress in your piece. You were wrong on numerous accounts in the article, you were wrong about a few things in this thread as well. If you're going to be a correspondent you should at least be knowledgable in what you're writing about.
you better be careful Fariic dont make RBlackheart break out the LOGS
No kidding.
I'm not kidding. This article bothers me.
I've got WELL over 100 hours played in DFO. I was a member of one of the larger clans on the server and had the opportunity to experience pretty much everything the game has to offer today.
I've very clear about my dislike of the game and the company behind it.
I'm also well aware that there are plenty of people that frequent this these forums and use misinformation to both paint this game in a negative and positive light.
With over 100 hours of play time I have NOTHING BUT FACTS to support anything I have to say about the game.
This article IS NOT FACTUALLY CORRECT.
We have here a correspondent who stated that Av never has, and never will, ban anyone for AFK macroing! This is a lie, and anyone that's been playing for the last 2 months knows full well that Av does not allow you to AFK macro!
Correspondents should be knowledgable about what they are writting about, and shouldn't have to resort to spreading misinformation to discredit other peoples misinformation.
Get Paragusis (sp?) as a corespondent. The guy knows what he's talking about and is actually a GOOD writter.
Umm... you do realize that is absolutely false and incorrect... right?
forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php
"Any macroing or disruptive skilling up within the protective radius of the towers is strictly forbidden. Offenders will be kicked. Repeat offenders will be banned."
"Unattended macroing anywhere is forbidden. Offenders will be kicked. Repeat offenders will be banned."
You do realize that AFK and unattended mean the same thing...right?
We will simply have to agree to disagree on the times. Accounts sold in 5 minutes or less, I dont know what else to say.
Can you please explain how AFK macroing grants anyone some kind of massive advantage? They do not ban you for AFK macroing, they never have and they never will. They have made one giant banning of 200+ players, and in the news section Tasos specifically mentioned that macroing was not a factor. In fact, in my article where I talk about macroing, I took a picture of a guy afk macroing swimming in town :). If you go to Heimdal in Dwarf land, you will see at least half a dozen people macroing in the water there at any given time of the day. I am sure the same goes for all newb towns all over the world.
I personally am not a fan of macroing, never have and never will be. Others are the min / maxers that feel every hour not in the game is some kind of gain that is lost. To each his own. If I felt someone else's AFK macro someone hurt me in any way, I would be up in arms as well. But the truth is I have profited heavily off of AFK macroers by snaeaking into clan towns, killing them, looting their arrows and reagents, banking them and repeating. Macroing AFK is a huge risk for skills that matter... all of this was fairly well laid out in the article. I am sorry you feel someone macroing up skills like swimming and resting someone have this tremendous advantage over you in PvP, PvE, or any other aspect of the game.
Macros have exited in every skill based game going back to UO. I would be "shocked" if anyone who had ever played UO didnt know what 8x8 meant. Or anyone who ever played Asherons Call didnt know what UCM meant. Or anyone who played Eve Online had never heard the term "macro miner". Macroing is a biproduct of skill based systems, always has been and always will be.
Unattended macroing anywhere is forbidden. Offenders will be kicked. Repeat offenders will be banned.
www.http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=150640
Afk macroing gives you an advantage because I can set up a macro to cast magic or shot a bow and then go to sleep or work while my character continues to progress. The normal player actually has to log out at some point.
I shouldn't have to explain how afk macroing gives an advantage over legitimate players or why it's considered cheating in pretty much every MMO out.
Av has made it very clear, see the link and quote above, that if you get caught afk macroing you can get banned.
8x8 was an exploit. It wasn't just a macro and EA banned people for it; my brother included.
Edit: You can stop telling people that the accounts were selling out in 5 min or less because it's a lie.
I already told you, I purchased my account the start of the second week, 20 minutes after the shop opened.
The fastest is sold out was something like 9 min.
Edit again: I'm really irritated with this article.
I LOVE the correspondents program and appreciate it. However, this article and a lot of what you've posted in this thread is misinformation; the very thing you attempted to adress in your piece. You were wrong on numerous accounts in the article, you were wrong about a few things in this thread as well. If you're going to be a correspondent you should at least be knowledgable in what you're writing about.
If you read the TOS of any game, you will see all sorts of strange things. As much as I hate macroing, I will again make this statement. No one has been banned to date for macroing, afk or otherwise.
As I have explained several times, you make it sound as though anyone has the ability to launch spells and arrows all night long without penalty. This is extremely innaccrutate. Arrows and spell reagents are not free. They are damned expensive! So if you choose to shoot gold into the air all night long then so be it. If we all had bottomless pockets that regrew gold while we slept, then I would agree with your point on unfair advantages. Since this is clearly not the case, I again, have to respectfully disagree.
Umm... you do realize that is absolutely false and incorrect... right?
forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php
"Any macroing or disruptive skilling up within the protective radius of the towers is strictly forbidden. Offenders will be kicked. Repeat offenders will be banned."
"Unattended macroing anywhere is forbidden. Offenders will be kicked. Repeat offenders will be banned."
You do realize that AFK and unattended mean the same thing...right?
http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=182316
"We banned 213 cheaters today. These are the people using 3rd party programs to cheat with. They were not banned for macroing, they were banned for cheating. They were automatically detected and also verified manually in a variety of ways. This number represents 90% of the cheaters in Darkfall right now. The rest have also been detected, and we’re waiting for them to be verified before we ban them as well.
These people were warned repeatedly. They chose to believe that we cannot detect what’s going on in our game. They took the word of the makers of these hacks over the word of the creators and administrators of the game. There are no exceptions. We don’t care if journalists, clan leaders, or our friends are among them. They were cheating in order to gain an unfair advantage over the rest of us. They deserve to be banned.
What comes into play here is something called “selfish punishment” in social science. Cheaters are likely to be some of the most outspoken people against cheating, and more likely to report cheaters. This is as so to maximize the benefit for themselves - taking it away from others. This is also the case here; we recognize some of the people from the boards habitually accusing the company for not doing anything and complaining that cheating is rampant in Darkfall, when in reality it’s not.
If you cheat in the game, you will lie about it too. Whenever we ban a cheater he or she will appeal to the community, denying it on the forums. Then come the excuses to Darkfall support about their little brother, their roommate, or about their account being hacked. So now we expect a couple of hundred people to take to the boards. Threads along these lines will be removed and posters will be banned. Darkfall Support has been instructed to not provide more than the automated ban message. Do not side with these people just because you may have played with them and didn’t happen to observe them cheating. They were cheating beyond a shadow of a doubt, detected and verified in more than one ways. There is no appeals process, our decision is final, and we will not reveal our methods.
We will keep aggressively detecting and banning players that cheat in the game. If you’re not running 3rd party cheats, you have nothing to worry about. Those that don’t take our word for it, will be banned like those banned today.
Thank you,
The Darkfall Team"
I made the key elements bold. I say again, they have never banned people for AFK macroing. Please walk into any racial newb town and you will see this to be the case.
Just to prove a point:
In Texas, it's against the law for anyone to have a pair of pliers in his or her possession.
In Philadelphia, you can't put pretzels in bags based on an Act of 1760.
Alaska law says that you can't look at a moose from an airplane.
In Corpus Christie, Texas, it is illegal to raise alligators in your home.
In Miami, it is forbidden to imitate an animal.
It is against the law to mispronounce the name of the State of Arkansas in that State.
But again, if someone shooting gold into the air all night long somehow strips the fun out of the game world for you, then thats that with that.
http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=182316
"We banned 213 cheaters today. These are the people using 3rd party programs to cheat with. They were not banned for macroing, they were banned for cheating. They were automatically detected and also verified manually in a variety of ways. This number represents 90% of the cheaters in Darkfall right now. The rest have also been detected, and we’re waiting for them to be verified before we ban them as well.
These people were warned repeatedly. They chose to believe that we cannot detect what’s going on in our game. They took the word of the makers of these hacks over the word of the creators and administrators of the game. There are no exceptions. We don’t care if journalists, clan leaders, or our friends are among them. They were cheating in order to gain an unfair advantage over the rest of us. They deserve to be banned.
What comes into play here is something called “selfish punishment” in social science. Cheaters are likely to be some of the most outspoken people against cheating, and more likely to report cheaters. This is as so to maximize the benefit for themselves - taking it away from others. This is also the case here; we recognize some of the people from the boards habitually accusing the company for not doing anything and complaining that cheating is rampant in Darkfall, when in reality it’s not.
If you cheat in the game, you will lie about it too. Whenever we ban a cheater he or she will appeal to the community, denying it on the forums. Then come the excuses to Darkfall support about their little brother, their roommate, or about their account being hacked. So now we expect a couple of hundred people to take to the boards. Threads along these lines will be removed and posters will be banned. Darkfall Support has been instructed to not provide more than the automated ban message. Do not side with these people just because you may have played with them and didn’t happen to observe them cheating. They were cheating beyond a shadow of a doubt, detected and verified in more than one ways. There is no appeals process, our decision is final, and we will not reveal our methods.
We will keep aggressively detecting and banning players that cheat in the game. If you’re not running 3rd party cheats, you have nothing to worry about. Those that don’t take our word for it, will be banned like those banned today.
Thank you,
The Darkfall Team"
I made the key elements bold. I say again, they have never banned people for AFK macroing. Please walk into any racial newb town and you will see this to be the case.
Just to prove a point:
In Texas, it's against the law for anyone to have a pair of pliers in his or her possession.
In Philadelphia, you can't put pretzels in bags based on an Act of 1760.
Alaska law says that you can't look at a moose from an airplane.
In Corpus Christie, Texas, it is illegal to raise alligators in your home.
In Miami, it is forbidden to imitate an animal.
It is against the law to mispronounce the name of the State of Arkansas in that State.
But again, if someone shooting gold into the air all night long somehow strips the fun out of the game world for you, then thats that with that.
Umm... did you not even look at the link I put out there for you?
Did Tasos post this link or not?
forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php
Have they posted a new policy on AFK macroing since that one?
You are saying that the 213 banned is the TOTAL players banned?
I'm sorry, you are wrong on this one.
Tell you what. Post your stance on AFK macroing on the official DarkFall boards and see how many players, mods, and Devs agree with your stance... and I'll do the same. Heck, just make a poll on the official boards asking how many agree with your stance.
You are wrong on this one... not looking good for a Coorespondant of a game advocating that players can cheat at will and not get banned. Especially when there is a post on the News section of the official site that says just the opposite.
http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=182316
"We banned 213 cheaters today. These are the people using 3rd party programs to cheat with. They were not banned for macroing, they were banned for cheating. They were automatically detected and also verified manually in a variety of ways. This number represents 90% of the cheaters in Darkfall right now. The rest have also been detected, and we’re waiting for them to be verified before we ban them as well.
These people were warned repeatedly. They chose to believe that we cannot detect what’s going on in our game. They took the word of the makers of these hacks over the word of the creators and administrators of the game. There are no exceptions. We don’t care if journalists, clan leaders, or our friends are among them. They were cheating in order to gain an unfair advantage over the rest of us. They deserve to be banned.
What comes into play here is something called “selfish punishment” in social science. Cheaters are likely to be some of the most outspoken people against cheating, and more likely to report cheaters. This is as so to maximize the benefit for themselves - taking it away from others. This is also the case here; we recognize some of the people from the boards habitually accusing the company for not doing anything and complaining that cheating is rampant in Darkfall, when in reality it’s not.
If you cheat in the game, you will lie about it too. Whenever we ban a cheater he or she will appeal to the community, denying it on the forums. Then come the excuses to Darkfall support about their little brother, their roommate, or about their account being hacked. So now we expect a couple of hundred people to take to the boards. Threads along these lines will be removed and posters will be banned. Darkfall Support has been instructed to not provide more than the automated ban message. Do not side with these people just because you may have played with them and didn’t happen to observe them cheating. They were cheating beyond a shadow of a doubt, detected and verified in more than one ways. There is no appeals process, our decision is final, and we will not reveal our methods.
We will keep aggressively detecting and banning players that cheat in the game. If you’re not running 3rd party cheats, you have nothing to worry about. Those that don’t take our word for it, will be banned like those banned today.
Thank you,
The Darkfall Team"
I made the key elements bold. I say again, they have never banned people for AFK macroing. Please walk into any racial newb town and you will see this to be the case.
Just to prove a point:
In Texas, it's against the law for anyone to have a pair of pliers in his or her possession.
In Philadelphia, you can't put pretzels in bags based on an Act of 1760.
Alaska law says that you can't look at a moose from an airplane.
In Corpus Christie, Texas, it is illegal to raise alligators in your home.
In Miami, it is forbidden to imitate an animal.
It is against the law to mispronounce the name of the State of Arkansas in that State.
But again, if someone shooting gold into the air all night long somehow strips the fun out of the game world for you, then thats that with that.
Umm... did you not even look at the link I put out there for you?
Did Tasos post this link or not?
forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php
Have they posted a new policy on AFK macroing since that one?
You are saying that the 213 banned is the TOTAL players banned?
I'm sorry, you are wrong on this one.
Tell you what. Post your stance on AFK macroing on the official DarkFall boards and see how many players, mods, and Devs agree with your stance... and I'll do the same. Heck, just make a poll on the official boards asking how many agree with your stance.
You are wrong on this one... not looking good for a Coorespondant of a game advocating that players can cheat at will and not get banned. Especially when there is a post on the News section of the official site that says just the opposite.
I didn't advocate anything, in fact I deeply oppose macroing. I but also take note to anyone who says macroing (in the case of Darkfall) gives some kind of deep game breaking advantage because it doesn't. And yes, I stand by my statement that a single player has never been banned from Darkfall for AFK macroing to date. Will this change in the future? Maybe. But please dont make statements that I advocate and promote cheating because neither statement is true.
Stop it!
You're lying.
There have been multiple posts on the official DFO forums from people that HAVE been banned for macroing. One guy was even banned for AFK swimming.
I have watched fist hand people AFK macroing archery.
It takes one ingot and one timber to make 20 arrows.
I personally made near 10k one evening after spending a single night harvesting.
Someone AFK macroing lesser magic to 100 hundred in a night or two is gaining a massive advantage over someone who's playing legit. There is a world of dif. between 99 mana missile and 20. The macroed person also gains access to other spells at a much higher rate then someone playing legit.
Av just removed the cooldown for ES.
People are macroing thier greater magic at a much faster rate giving them a much larger advantage of people who play legit.
Cheaters don't care about the consiquences, are you really trying to say that they won't care about reagents? Spells with a cooldown become even more appealing to macro since they can raise those skills at a rate INCREDIBLY faster then someone that is playing legit.
There is a world of dif. between AFK macroing and legal macroing. I have no problem with being at your computer and doing it, and do it myself. It's not being there that is a problem. AFK macroing is the same thing as botting; even if it's considerably less advanced. Players are actually using the same software to macro that is used in other games to bot. I know this for a FACT and have been incredibly vocal on the official forums that people running autoit at the same time as DFO should be banned. It's software that FPS games will ban you fork, Blizzard will ban you for running it at the same time as WoW.
Ask me why I quit my guild?
Cheating! I sat in vent and listened to them exploit mobs. I got sick of seeing the guys sitting in the city afk macroing spells.
The cheating was a big issue for me, and for you to downplay it as a "non issue" is spreading misinformation. The official forums for the game are filled with threads of people unhappy with the cheating in game.
One of the rampant cheats people are using in game is the loot macro; something you didn't even mention even though it's probably the MOST discussed cheat on the official forums.
Tasos NEVER said that they didn't ban anyone for afk macroing; thier official stance is very clear, it's been posted in the news forums on more then one occasion.
Cheating, no matter how rare or rampant is NEVER a non issue in a game. You're implication that it is, even though you admit that you'll see people doing it, is just disturbing and wrong. The fact that a correspondent would actually be willing to write a piece in wich he admits that you'll see people cheating is just beyond me! That's not a good thing!
One of my favourite comments ever. In fact I liked it so much it has become my sig :)
Heh... backpedaling a bit now I see.
According to the Devs. own statements AFK macroing IS cheating, and they will be banned for doing so.
You told players they would NOT be banned for AFK macroing, and never would be.
You also told players that they were free to AFK macro if they wanted to.
So... I am in the wrong for telling players to abide by the rules that the Devs of the game YOU are a Coorespondant for have set forth? Hmm... I see.
Stop it!
You're lying.
There have been multiple posts on the official DFO forums from people that HAVE been banned for macroing. One guy was even banned for AFK swimming.
I have watched fist hand people AFK macroing archery.
It takes one ingot and one timber to make 20 arrows.
I personally made near 10k one evening after spending a single night harvesting.
Someone AFK macroing lesser magic to 100 hundred in a night or two is gaining a massive advantage over someone who's playing legit. There is a world of dif. between 99 mana missile and 20. The macroed person also gains access to other spells at a much higher rate then someone playing legit.
Av just removed the cooldown for ES.
People are macroing thier greater magic at a much faster rate giving them a much larger advantage of people who play legit.
Cheaters don't care about the consiquences, are you really trying to say that they won't care about reagents? Spells with a cooldown become even more appealing to macro since they can raise those skills at a rate INCREDIBLY faster then someone that is playing legit.
There is a world of dif. between AFK macroing and legal macroing. I have no problem with being at your computer and doing it, and do it myself. It's not being there that is a problem. AFK macroing is the same thing as botting; even if it's considerably less advanced. Players are actually using the same software to macro that is used in other games to bot. I know this for a FACT and have been incredibly vocal on the official forums that people running autoit at the same time as DFO should be banned. It's software that FPS games will ban you fork, Blizzard will ban you for running it at the same time as WoW.
Ask me why I quit my guild?
Cheating! I sat in vent and listened to them exploit mobs. I got sick of seeing the guys sitting in the city afk macroing spells.
The cheating was a big issue for me, and for you to downplay it as a "non issue" is spreading misinformation. The official forums for the game are filled with threads of people unhappy with the cheating in game.
One of the rampant cheats people are using in game is the loot macro; something you didn't even mention even though it's probably the MOST discussed cheat on the official forums.
Tasos NEVER said that they didn't ban anyone for afk macroing; thier official stance is very clear, it's been posted in the news forums on more then one occasion.
Cheating, no matter how rare or rampant is NEVER a non issue in a game. You're implication that it is, even though you admit that you'll see people doing it, is just disturbing and wrong. The fact that a correspondent would actually be willing to write a piece in wich he admits that you'll see people cheating is just beyond me! That's not a good thing!
If you can walk into any racial town and see people openly macroing at the bank at any time in the day, and say there are bans for macroing... I am sorry to say thats simply not the case. If you can show me one newb town on the map where you won't hear the sounds of mana missiles flying and arrows being shot, I will be utterly shocked and amazed. I'm done discussing the validity of macroing, its like debating religion. Everyone believes what they believe. This article simply discusses the negatives of the game, nothing more nothing less. Agree, disagree, you are free to do either.
In part 3 we will take a deeper look into the skill system, and part 4 will be all about combat. Until then...
If you can walk into any racial town and see people openly macroing at the bank at any time in the day, and say there are bans for macroing... I am sorry to say thats simply not the case. If you can show me one newb town on the map where you won't hear the sounds of mana missiles flying and arrows being shot, I will be utterly shocked and amazed. I'm done discussing the validity of macroing, its like debating religion. Everyone believes what they believe. This article simply discusses the negatives of the game, nothing more nothing less. Agree, disagree, you are free to do either.
In part 3 we will take a deeper look into the skill system, and part 4 will be all about combat. Until then...
AFK macroing!!
That's unattended.
That's not the same thing as being at your PC and doing.
People,
If you AFK macro in this game you can get banned.
You're correspondent is giving you misinformation.
Edit: Make sure part 3 and 4 have more factual informatin in it!
Am I mistaken in that the resource nodes outside of clan cities give the same 51 resources and regenerate at the same rate as ones found around newb cities, and ever other place in the game? I actually found an uninhabitted island where half of the nodes are ore. I have never seen another single player on the island. I go there twice a day and come back with like TONs of ore. Its actually been my bread and butter for 2 weeks now. Try exploring some and get away from the newb areas if you cant find nodes. They are literally everywhere. And they are all identical...
the macroing of resources is one of the spots where, in my opinion, macroing should be allowed. Aventurine has gone so far as to institute auto harvesting from what I have seen in their recent patch notes, so another thumbs up there. That being said, when you aquire a city, these cities will have resources such as mines and groves which produce up to 5 resources per swing and you can wack on those for a good long time, so again there is an advantage for the clans here, but not one that they wouldn't have anyways.
The macroing of combat skills is what is at the heart of the matter. greater magic, weapon skills, etc can be leveled using AFK macros and with the clan city it goes uninterupted. The mats needed for G Magic are readily available thanks to the exploitable mobs around these cities. Even with the steps that were taken (and again, kudos for acting on these, ie making it to where you cant hit afk guild members or use non decaying newb weapons for leveling) there are still plenty of macros out there that will swap weapons for you so you can go for several hours before you need to recycle your hot bar inventory. This is what is killing the game, not the resources.
Other games have gone so far as to add in client side protection to prevent these things (NProtect), but in most of those games, macroing skills like this isn't a game breaker. Granted, NProtect is more of a nuisance to deal with as you cant do anything outside the game while you are playing because it blocks windows processes, but it does the job. In a game such as this where keeping your gear is dependant on your ability to fight, something like this should be considered. Unfortunately, with their low number of staff, it is highly unlikely this will occur either.
I looked forward to Darkfall for many years and truly wish it was the game we all hoped it would be. Unfortunately, many many factors have given us nothing but dissappointment. If you know any millionaiore philanthropists who can hire a decent staff for Aventurine, please let them know they are needed and tell them to act fast, because right now everyone has a bad taste in their mouths and word of it is spreading quickly.
If you can walk into any racial town and see people openly macroing at the bank at any time in the day, and say there are bans for macroing... I am sorry to say thats simply not the case. If you can show me one newb town on the map where you won't hear the sounds of mana missiles flying and arrows being shot, I will be utterly shocked and amazed. I'm done discussing the validity of macroing, its like debating religion. Everyone believes what they believe. This article simply discusses the negatives of the game, nothing more nothing less. Agree, disagree, you are free to do either.
In part 3 we will take a deeper look into the skill system, and part 4 will be all about combat. Until then...
I am sorry then.
I must ask that mmorpg.com remove you as a Correspondent for DarkFall.
The Devs for DarkFall have been very clear on what they consider to be a bannable offense in DarkFall.
forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php
AFK macroing is clearly labeled as a bannable offense.
You have told players they are free to do AFK macro and they will not be banned.
That is akin to telling players they are free to cheat. Advocating cheating for the MMO that you are a Correspondent for is not something mmorpg.com should be associated with.
If you can walk into any racial town and see people openly macroing at the bank at any time in the day, and say there are bans for macroing... I am sorry to say thats simply not the case. If you can show me one newb town on the map where you won't hear the sounds of mana missiles flying and arrows being shot, I will be utterly shocked and amazed. I'm done discussing the validity of macroing, its like debating religion. Everyone believes what they believe. This article simply discusses the negatives of the game, nothing more nothing less. Agree, disagree, you are free to do either.
In part 3 we will take a deeper look into the skill system, and part 4 will be all about combat. Until then...
I am sorry then.
I must ask that mmorpg.com remove you as a Correspondent for DarkFall.
The Devs for DarkFall have been very clear on what they consider to be a bannable offense in DarkFall.
forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php
AFK macroing is clearly labeled as a bannable offense.
You have told players they are free to do AFK macro and they will not be banned.
That is akin to telling players they are free to cheat. Advocating cheating for the MMO that you are a Correspondent for is not something mmorpg.com should be associated with.
Just a quck update on this...
According to Brannoc (DarkFall Community Manager)
"We HAVE on many occasions and will continue to do so. Don't afk macro."
forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php
Granted he is no DarkFall Dev., but he probably knows the rules and what is and is not bannable.
Ok I have to call bullshit on your comments :). Hmm where to start:
If you don't like the game thats ok, many won't. Just make sure what you post is accurate and up to date.
-what i meant by macro to get resources was of course a macro to harvest it. Not a macro that magically creates it.
-never said you could macro for equipment. You putting words in my mouth.
-Raising your combat skills does help your dmg. It does this by raising your skill level so that you can use better weapons without them breaking insanely quick, by raising stats like quickness that raise your overall dps, and by granting you access to spells that do more dmg. I might be leaving some other methods out.
-The fact that there is not targetting in DF has nothign to do with the alignment system? How about i swing horizontally and accidentally hit 2 players in one swing and no im flagged for 2 minutes. That's the kind of thing that is frustrating.
-here's an example of an exploit. I go into a hobgoblin camp and stand on the roof and all the hobglobins pile together at the wall below me, and occasionally run in lil circles while i nuke em down with mana missle. Here's another example. I'm blue, my teammate is blue, and you're blue. Me and him take turns hitting you and backing off every 10 seconds until you're dead.
-This is not new stuff at all man. Same stuff from beta pretty much with a few differences. Hope everything is clear for you now.
-what i meant by macro to get resources was of course a macro to harvest it. Not a macro that magically creates it.
-never said you could macro for equipment. You putting words in my mouth.
-Raising your combat skills does help your dmg. It does this by raising your skill level so that you can use better weapons without them breaking insanely quick, by raising stats like quickness that raise your overall dps, and by granting you access to spells that do more dmg. I might be leaving some other methods out.
-The fact that there is not targetting in DF has nothign to do with the alignment system? How about i swing horizontally and accidentally hit 2 players in one swing and no im flagged for 2 minutes. That's the kind of thing that is frustrating.
-here's an example of an exploit. I go into a hobgoblin camp and stand on the roof and all the hobglobins pile together at the wall below me, and occasionally run in lil circles while i nuke em down with mana missle. Here's another example. I'm blue, my teammate is blue, and you're blue. Me and him take turns hitting you and backing off every 10 seconds until you're dead.
-This is not new stuff at all man. Same stuff from beta pretty much with a few differences. Hope everything is clear for you now.
You raise some good points, but they are not necessarily exploits, they are more an abuse of current game mechanics. When someone says exploit I would consider that to be duping gold or items, going invisible, teleport hacking, etc.
You are correct about the weapon and spell damage. But nearly every skill in game increases your attributes in one way or another. so really performing any action in the game has the same effect, including swimming, just sprinting around, or taking your horse for a stroll.
I am not sure if you are aware, but there are actually 2 types of standard attacks. A "left to right" swing if you will, and a "top to bottom swing". You can switch from one to the other at will, and is used for exactly this purpose. If 5 guys are whacking away on a mob with something that swings with a very wide arc (polearms being the best example) you will in fact all hit each other. You need to switch to overheard swings in close quarters and then you only hit what is directly in front of you. Taking that a step further I actually fell in love with this mechanic because it can work in your favor, and it brings a new element to mmorpgs which is the ability to hit multiple mobs with melee attacks that are not necessarily an AOE (area of effect) ability. If three mobs charge me I can actually swing my polearm from left to right and hit all three. I freakin' love that.
You make a good point about abusing the landscape to in essence become invulnerable. This definitely exists in places in this game, and many other games as well. The problem is if you are sitting on the roof and no one else is around then you have aggroed the whole camp to you. Which means when you hop off and try and loot anything you will get gang banged. Also, you do not mention that nearly all mobs, including goblins have ranged attacks either arrows or spells so you are not invulnerable completely.
And how long should we wait? I'm not really interested in paying AV an allowance to bring the game to a level that it should have been in at launch.
I spent an hour and a half today running to a racial enemy city.
The only people I came across was a group of naked guys using a wall exploit to kill overlords.
Cheating is def. non issue.
Overlords are inside of racial cities? And towers didnt shoot you? Amazing. What race? I want to reroll one of those guys.
I mean this in the most respectful way. but ever since 2003, this site has gone downhill, and i suspect this is why, and why the tone here changed. On the forums, and in its daily content.
You are intentionally fanning the flames on your own site by posting intentionally baited material. I understand the need to create traffic.... but yeah... I understand capitalizing on controversy. Your presentation of the articles are misleading to your player base. You know this, OR you would NOT have to keep coming into threads defending them, or dismissing the comments made on the with "This is an overview/opinion piece". This goes for any game.
Can we go back to creating traffic buy posting things of value? I highly enjoy the new columnists, as well as reviews from your PAID professional staff. This correspondent program is little more than your addition of player blogs. Please separate the two (News and opinion).
This is also, again, listed under news.
I agree, if I didn't actually read the comments and find out what an actual " correspondant " meant, then I would have took them as credible articles.
This is why I'm skeptical often of reviewers of games, there is far too much going on around the state of this game for this review to be even taken seriously basically you are saying that there are really only three problems with this game and the rest is just the player base hmm. I think since you are involved in the politics of the gaming industry I'll have to defer to the player base on this one and assume that the problems most mention in fact do exist regardless of if you've come across them or not.
This reinforces that I will continue to get my reviews from these forums and not from staff but from users who leave their opinion on the games on site of course we can clearly read that some people are just having bad days sometimes and some truly have an axe to grind with certain companies etc. but it's much easier seeing through the players bs than those who write for this or any other publication.
If you don't like the Correspondent program, wherein people who play and enjoy their games write about the games, then I would simply suggest that you don't read the Correspondent articles (which are clearly labelled as such) and wait for the site's official review.
As to the frequency of Darkfall coverage... Darkfall articles consistently perform well in terms of traffic. This idicates to me that there are people who want to read about the game. As such, we will provide articles. It just makes sense.
Darkfall get's lot's of coverage hmmm no stuff I'd say so did AOC,SWG (during their messy years),D&L and look at the sub numbers for those games, of course it get's lot's of traffic it's a train wreck and everyone knows we'd rather see a picture of a train wreck than a picture of a beautiful garden.
I just think that we need to consider what the end result of what we say could be and let's be honest you know damn well if everyone who read your article coughed up fifty bucks to play this turd you'd have a lot more people pissed at you for suggesting it than you would have people thanking you and my problem is that does not come across in your article at all you basically suggest there is nothing wrong with this game which just isn't the case.
I do think you should be cut a bit of slack personally but I think MMORPG should do a better job of highlighting that this is not a true review but an opinion of someone who plays and enjoys the game which is an impression I didn't get until you said it above. I would only hope you'd have a bit more of a journalistic attitude and have atleast mentioned there are other problems that people may percieve though you don't see it that way.