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Darkfall General Article: The Conversion of a Self Proclaimed Carebear
MMORPG.com Darkfall Correspondent Kelly Price writes this article talking about how a player can go from preferring PvE aspects of MMOs to liking one of the most hardcore MMOs currently available.
By Kelly Price on May 05, 2009
Starting out in Darkfall Online is a bit like staring at a blank page. The palpable potential and nearly infinite possibilities are quite overwhelming. Because of this, it will take some time for the general MMO community to warm up to it, but once the initial culture shock wears off this game's greatest weakness will ultimately end up being its greatest strength. To alleviate some of these fears I'd like to now share some of my personal experiences and opinions from a newbie's perspective. Here is a bit about my background: I didn't play nearly as many first-person shooters or skill-based games as some say I should've done to prepare myself for Darkfall, and so I came into the world of Agon (like many of you) as a proverbial blank slate. I have been an enthusiastic MMORPG player since the good old days of Everquest, going on to play Final Fantasy XI, Everquest 2, Vanguard (PvE), and Age of Conan (PvE) among other things. As you can see, I have been known as somewhat of a 'carebear' in my time, but you will soon see why I have changed my ways.
;)
Warning: Here comes a generic, very subjective (but still true) statement about the game. If you can't handle it skip over the first few lines, keep your rage bottled up for a moment, and please hear me out.
Darkfall is fun! It has been a while since an MMO has caused this many endorphins and adrenaline to be pumped into my brain. What I loved about the game on paper, I still love in practice. The world of Agon is absolutely gorgeous! Rays of light and shadow dance atop colorful fields of flowers; the scorched sky is beautified by the commanding presence of the multiple planets and moons; the transition from one environment to the next is eerily realistic, and the "zone/chunk lines" are nonexistent. The only way to tell if you have switched "zones" is to look at the place name on your minimap. The harvesting nodes truly look part of the landscape, and on the whole the world seems "real." In my travels I have discovered many camps, ruins, and forts that are not marked on the map. The map itself works like a satellite photo. If you zoom all the way (and you can zoom very close) you can make out odd-looking marks, buildings, and discolored areas in the landscape that probably hold some interest (mobs, treasure, clan stone, etc). Aventurine has done their job, because I can't wait to explore more of their nicely-crafted world. One thing is for sure, you better take a few trusted companions or you'll loose all your gear and not remember where you died! No, there aren't mobs every five feet (I've heard this complaint a thousand times), but if you wandered in the wilderness would you expect bears, lions, hawks, wolves, goblins, etc to be standing around or walking along paths? No, of course not! They would be with their pack, or stealthily stalking in the grass, or perhaps (in the case of the goblins) banded together in a camp for protection. There are a great number of creatures in Agon, but, just as in real life, you have to be smart about where to look! Sometimes the monsters find you (and believe me you don't want to be found in these cases.) I managed to trip into the domain of a huge (and I do mean huge) red dragon who promptly began launching comet-sized fireballs at me. Only when I and a few other terrified adventurers slipped under the roots of a giant gnarly tree for sanctuary did it get bored and fly away. Another interesting incident occurred on one particularly ominous-looking evening. I ran across a rather menacing undead gentleman standing amid a field of burnt crops. Upon my hesitant greeting he summoned several zombies as a welcoming party. Needless to say I left them for more agreeable company.
;)
As far as game play itself, it is very challenging (not the boring clickfest others are claiming). Yes you have to click to perform actions, but this is a FPS-MMO guys! If you don't like to click, you are playing the wrong type of game! Combat feels like Oblivion, in my opinion. You can never scroll out to be able to see far behind you like in most MMORPGs, which adds suspense and danger to everything you do. In melee mode, you can see maybe a foot or two behind your character, but in ranged mode (spells and archery) you have to be in first person. It provides a lot more opportunities for strategy. It takes patience and real skill to actually hit anything. The mob AI is frustrating, but this is because it's realistic! They weave, dodge, strafe, and jump just like any player. They do bug out at times because of leashing issues and the fact that they cannot swim, but this can be used to your advantage. Player motivation is also a bit different in Darkfall. Raising skills and leveling is secondary to political matters and clan sovereignty. Everyone is striving to make their mark on the world.
;)
The sheer number of skills is staggering. I highly recommend you plan out exactly what you want to do, or you will be left with several skills that don't quite compliment each other. I have chosen to be a druid-type caster, Everquest-style. But being a newbie caster has been a bit frustrating at the beginning. Right now melee players have the advantage, but I believe magic will far outperform melee in PvP eventually. And as far as the skill leveling, it isn't so much of a grind that you can't handle it. It is quite slow, but not so slow as to be like EVE's skill progression.
From what limited crafting experience I have had, the system seems simple and self-explanatory (except enchanting). AV has done away with all of the complicated mechanics other games put into crafting in a vain attempt to make it "fun." In no way is the act of crafting supposed to be fun. You do it because you want to make money, gear, and items for yourself and others. Of course there is also the added danger that will definitely keep your blood pumping. It works in a skill system just as does combat and magic. You buy the ability, for example "Alchemy," and as you level that skill more recipes open up to you. There isn't any "trade" or "crafting" channel per say, so advertising your wares can be a bit of a challenge. But there is a lot of money to be made even this early in the game. Right now the flavor of the week is Armorsmithing and Weaponsmithing, but I have a feeling Jewelrycrafting and Enchanting are going to end up being the really huge money-makers.
;)
With all of this glowing commentary, I would also like to address the surge of negativity during beta and since. A lot of the bad reviews came from the fact that the world felt 'dead' without more players in it during beta. There are more than enough people, mobs, and things to do as it stands now. That being said, this game is definitely not for everyone. Even now in-game players complain about the open PvP (versus realm) and lack of safe areas. But that is what makes the game great in my opinion.
I fully believe Darkfall is going to last because Aventurine cares about the game as much as the players do, they listen to their player base, and they actually fix issues quickly. For example: We don't have anymore queue issues, the sync issues are already fixed, and several exploits that players took advantage of early on are no more. Now they are free to focus on improving the game play experience and balancing. Ultimately, this game has nowhere to go but up in quality.
Good write up, one of the more open ones I've read so far. Here's to waiting for a trial.
You know, again, this seems to be the only site that writes things like this, while i understand this was an opinion piece, it skips well, everything. Painting a pretty picture of the game. Meanwhile other sites are doing reviews of the game, and giving it abysmal marks. Its fine that he enjoys it, some will, that i don't care about.
When is MMOrpg.com going to do a review, or will we continue to get "Opinion" and "10 part overviews
(But not a review!!)" that take no responsibility of commenting on the game, AS A GAME or work in this genre.
It's like you guys are beating around the bush.....or trolling your reader base. lol.
This is still really the only site that cares about this game (To the point of a 10 part overview, and another fan opinions every other week), but recently other sites have been putting out reviews... they are directly opposite to anything this site produces.
Mainly because MMORPG.com doesn't comment on the game, as a game or work in this field, it continues to produce "opinion" entry's that hide behind the fact they "Are not reviews", and does not look at the real things people wan to know, like a review that took some responsibility, instead of fan Service. Fans, that only really exist here.
All of the above has been defended as "Opinion pieces", when will we get a professional review from someone not plucked from the fanboi ranks?
No offense to the write of this piece, it was well written, and everyone is glad you are having fun.
The Eurogamer Darkfall review is a good example at someone not looking at the "culture chock". They just wrote as if it was a WoW clone and how it was a bad WoW clone. So if you want to think of DF as a PvE MMO, the Eurogamer review is much better. This article is made by someone that does not compare DF to a ordinary PvE MMO. And can see what it really is.
Good lord, not even. You have to have some serious blinders if you think this is the case. They wrote a review of the game, it as an entry into this space, and There was very little opinion in that article, most comments where about the sad state of its construction and design in this day and age.
You REALLY need to get off this "Us" VS "Them" mentality. Thinking somehow PvE anf PvP are some sort of segment of gamers, gamers are gamers, there are good games, and there are bad games.
Well, as is the case with most games, we're giving our reviewer time to actually play and experience the game properly so that they can create the review that you're so hot and heavy for but proper reviews take time.
You don't like opinion pieces when those opinions don't jiive with your own, I get that. You make it abundantly clear in every single related thread. My suggestion to you would be to not read correspondent articles, which are opinion pieces by their nature. Here's the thing: Whie this kind of article doesn't make your personal socks roll up and down, they are quite popular and are heavily read. It's not as though we're not working on getting a review out to you, but that doesn't preclude covering the games from the players' perspective via our Correspondent program. Seriously, just don't read any articles that introduce themselves as Correspondent articles and you should be fine.
I frankly fail to see how other people enjoying a game that you don't happen to think is very good offends you so much. For now though, you've been told that there is a review coming. There is no need to continually derail comment threads on articles that you aren't interested in anyway.
Thanks.
No it wasn't looked at as a failed WoW clone. It was reviewed as a game that came no where near what it promised. The review was spot on with everything that is good and bad about darkfall. Sadly, there's alot more bad. What I find funny is that most people that defend Darkfall call us haters "carebears" and that the reason we trash the game is because of the full loot pvp. However, that couldn't be farther from the truth. We would love a game that had those kind of risks but we also want the game to play and look good. Not this dated mess that took far to long to make. What this game represents is a failed attempt to make a pvp sandbox. Hopefully Mortal Online has been keeping watch so they don't make the mistakes that occured with Darkfall.
Well, as is the case with most games, we're giving our reviewer time to actually play and experience the game properly so that they can create the review that you're so hot and heavy for but proper reviews take time.
You don't like opinion pieces when those opinions don't jiive with your own, I get that. You make it abundantly clear in every single related thread. My suggestion to you would be to not read correspondent articles, which are opinion pieces by their nature. Here's the thing: Whie this kind of article doesn't make your personal socks roll up and down, they are quite popular and are heavily read. It's not as though we're not working on getting a review out to you, but that doesn't preclude covering the games from the players' perspective via our Correspondent program. Seriously, just don't read any articles that introduce themselves as Correspondent articles and you should be fine.
I frankly fail to see how other people enjoying a game that you don't happen to think is very good offends you so much. For now though, you've been told that there is a review coming. There is no need to continually derail comment threads on articles that you aren't interested in anyway.
Thanks.
The first line was all you had to say. As for the rest, this isn't the case, i would just enjoy some journalism around here, instead of you essentially pasting "Uber fan" essays on your front page every week. Is that two much to ask for a site that claims to be THE news source for mmo's?
Is it really?
I also never said i didn't enjoy reading the pieces, they have a place.
People seem to think i hate Darkfall, this isn't the case, what the reality is, i would appreciate some honesty around here, and for the site to stop hiding behind "Opinion pieces". Doesn't matter what game it is. But hay, its your site. I think we have had, and are getting plunty of opinions around here from your staff, and your Volunteers.
You keep writing your "Opinions" so i post mine...but then you defend them (You, personally) as "opinion pieces" and not reviews.
Stop posting opinion pieces (under the heading of NEWS), and ill stop posting my opinion. Deal?
Ok, first of all, we have both opinion and news articles at the site. This is how it has always been, and this is how it will always be. if you don't like that, I'm sorry, but there's nothing that I can do for you.
I'll bottom line this for you: Stop hijacking legitimate threads to further your own agenda in how you feel this site should be run. Your opinions have been noted and there is no need to continually repeat yourself.
Hijacking? I thought i was commenting on the article. This "opinion piece" is also listed...under News.
Again, i have no issue with the writer, or this article, i have never had any issue with people finding and playing games they enjoy, i encourage it.
I'm with Mrbloodworth on this one. These unnecessary 'opinioned overviews' all carry a faint wiff of fanboism about them. I find this strange as other websites well..half decent websites have slagged this game down and with good reason too. I also think that the game should of been reviewed first on MMORPG.com and then these 'correspondents' could of posted their 'opinions' Very unprofessional.
So noone is allowed to enjoy Darkfall? Listen to yourself!
Seriously! This is a MMO site. For people enjoying MMOs.
Who said that? where? Didn't think so.
Who said that? where? Didn't think so.
NO. He is trying to say, no one can speak freely, unless its in praise of the preciousssss.
Who said that? where? Didn't think so.
Hahaha Bloodworth trolling on another Darkfall thread.....who would of guessed. Even the manager of this here website cannot under any asumption deny that calling you out on a trolling offense is warranted.
Good Job Bloodworth
NO. He is trying to say, no one can speak freely, unless its in praise of the preciousssss.
Someone said that? where?
Hahaha Bloodworth trolling on another Darkfall thread.....who would of guessed. Even the manager of this here website cannot under any asumption deny that calling you out on a trolling offense is warranted.
Good Job Bloodworth
I'm trolling? You have a loose definition there kettle.
I think Mrbloodworth just wants to point out that Opinions are not News. News should go in the News Section and Opinions should stick to the Opinions Section.... which does make lots of sense.
He also clearly doesn't hate the game. He believes that everybody has their preferate game and it is OK and respects it.
I am with Mrbloodworth on this one too. We need even handed accounts of the game play and features. Something that constitutes a review of the game. Something that evaluates how this game measures up as an mmorpg.
I say this as someone who is now playing the game (for about a month) and while I enjoy many things about it. It is not ready for release and never was and there are too many promised features that were left out. It is barely an MMORPG in my opinion.
I am with Mrbloodworth on this one too. We need even handed accounts of the game play and features. Something that constitutes a review of the game. Something that evaluates how this game measures up as an mmorpg.
I say this as someone who is now playing the game (for about a month) and while I enjoy many things about it. It is not ready for release and never was and there are too many promised features that were left out. It is barely an MMORPG in my opinion.
This what was i ment. If someone enjoys DF, they should not be allowed to write about it. As it seems. What would be the point of forcing someone that dont like PvP games to write a article about Darkfall? Maybe some hater would do it? Bur again, what would be the point. Better to hear from people that like to play the game. Same with all other articles from any other MMO.
Think if i did a WoW article??
We are stil waiting for a real Darkfall review. Mayber it will say the game sucks and everyone is happy again.
Anyway, If you dont like this NEW article, you dont need to read it. I dont read anything about games i dispise.
I'd like to know how it makes sense. I see a news tab at the top of this page, but i don't see an opinions tab. I also don't see an opinions subforum under Darkfall. Has anyone around here ever read a NEWSpaper? If you did, did you notice that there were both reviews and Op Ed pieces in them? Why don't you write to your local newspaper and tell them that they should get rid of editorials because they're not news? It's a specious argument at best, and it does constitute hijacking of this thread, because the thread was regarding observations of the game, and people are attempting to turn it into a political tirade against the website simply because they don't agree with the views of the person who wrote the article and are trying to ridicule him with arguments that, although they may have some deceptive appeal, are lacking in substance.
Actually, I have to agree with Mrbloodworth and everyone that agrees with him. There should be a review before any "opinions" are posted and they should not be posted as "News".
Also reading the references to "one of the most hardcore MMO's" and references to "Carebears".... reminds me of the "elitist" Darkfall community.
Hardcore is what you make of it.... any MMO can be hardcore.. it's all in how you play it.
Its gotta be a bit odd for someone that has the game and supposibly loves it, to spend so much time here making posts that are often full of incorrect / misleading information rather then playing? Is Dakfall really ofline that much?
Second read your sig. You might want to change it. Its funny in that if it had any truth to it then It makes you, and the other Darkfall fans that post soo much here look like carebears. Call me a carebear if you will but then lets count the forum posts over the last month or 2 and see who according to your sig fits the discription best ?
Me I don't post even a tenth as much as you I guess because I'm off playing MMO's I enjoy, rather then trying to run PR and advertise for a MMO. Not that your not allowed to do that here, you are, and I'm sure you will continue I just like to shine alittle light and add alittle honesty to the ongoing hype and drama that seems to be the norm in this forum
carry on!
Edit: lets see 13 posts today alone, and the days nowhere near over. Sure seems like alot, when does he actually play this game he loves so much? Right I'm guessing I'll be banned for pointing that out or at least warned, so to everyone else my apologies if i hijacked the thread see you maybe in another month :)
I'd like to know how it makes sense. I see a news tab at the top of this page, but i don't see an opinions tab. I also don't see an opinions subforum under Darkfall. Has anyone around here ever read a NEWSpaper? If you did, did you notice that there were both reviews and Op Ed pieces in them? Why don't you write to your local newspaper and tell them that they should get rid of editorials because they're not news? It's a specious argument at best, and it does constitute hijacking of this thread, because the thread was regarding observations of the game, and people are attempting to turn it into a political tirade against the website simply because they don't agree with the views of the person who wrote the article and are trying to ridicule him with arguments that, although they may have some deceptive appeal, are lacking in substance.
Where did i ridicule or state i disagreed with the writers opinions? I did just the opposite in fact. Editorials are not listed under "News" they are listed, and headed with, OPINION. Where was my comments a "Political tirade"? What form of politics do i belong to, I have no agenda that i am aware of.
I also, did not hijack anything. The thread was about the article.
Actually, I have to agree with Mrbloodworth and everyone that agrees with him. There should be a review before any "opinions" are posted and they should not be posted as "News".
Also reading the references to "one of the most hardcore MMO's" and references to "Carebears".... reminds me of the "elitist" Darkfall community.
Hardcore is what you make of it.... any MMO can be hardcore.. it's all in how you play it.
Would someone please define news instead of just throwing it around having no idea how the term is used? The ignorance on this website never ceases to amaze me. How do the opinions of someone who has played a game for an hour qualify as news more than the opinions of someone who has played it for days or weeks? Most "reviews" are from someone who has played a game for a very short amount of time, so the argument makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, in addition to the fact that it ignores the traditional definition of news.
Also, why are people upset that MMORPG wants to give its staff more time to play a game before forcing them to write an official "review"? Of course any sensible website that has made that decision is going to want to give people a little bit in the meantime to keep them satisfied until the official review is published. That's just the way they do things. If you don't like their business paradigm, stop trolling and hijacking the forums.
Quote from Stradden :
..." I frankly fail to see how other people enjoying a game that you don't happen to think is very good offends you so much. For now though, you've been told that there is a review coming. There is no need to continually derail comment threads on articles that you aren't interested in anyway."
Stradden don't take it heart, Sadly the forums have devolved and become some magnet for malcontents that spend huge amounts of time complaining about games they don't play. If you admit to playing a hated game and are foolish enough to claim you have fun then the malcontent descend in mass to rebut your fun and desperately try to convince you that the game is terrible and that you are some delusion fanboi for even pretending to like it.
It guess MMOPRPG just needs to get a bigger crew of Moderators to delete posts and reign in the lameness.
Would someone please define news instead of just throwing it around having no idea how the term is used? The ignorance on this website never ceases to amaze me. How do the opinions of someone who has played a game for an hour qualify as news more than the opinions of someone who has played it for days or weeks? Most "reviews" are from someone who has played a game for a very short amount of time, so the argument makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, in addition to the fact that it ignores the traditional definition of news.
Also, why are people upset that MMORPG wants to give its staff more time to play a game before forcing them to write an official "review"? Of course any sensible website that has made that decision is going to want to give people a little bit in the meantime to keep them satisfied until the official review is published. That's just the way they do things. If you don't like their business paradigm, stop trolling and hijacking the forums.
News
Pronunciation: \?nüz, ?nyüz\
Function: noun plural but singular in construction
Usage: often attributive
Date: 15th century
1 a: a report of recent events b: previously unknown information <I've got news for you> c: something having a specified influence or effect <the rain was good news for lawns and gardens — Garrison Keillor> <the virus was bad news>2 a: material reported in a newspaper or news periodical or on a newscast b: matter that is newsworthy
Editorial:
n.
1. An article in a publication expressing the opinion of its editors or publishers.
2. A commentary on television or radio expressing the opinion of the station or network.
adj.
1. Of or relating to an editor or editing: an editorial position with a publishing company; an editorial policy prohibiting the use of unnamed sources.
2. Of or resembling an editorial, especially in expressing an opinion: an editorial comment.
Editorial was the label we used as long ago as 1830 to designate a statement of the editor's opinion. "The great green table in the centre groaning under the weight of editorials, and friendly correspondence," was mentioned in the Collegian of Cambridge, Massachusetts, in 1830. Even earlier, in 1802, we find reference to "the editorial part of the paper."
By the turn of the twentieth century, newspapers had designated a separate editorial page for editorials and letters to the editor. Even the location of the editorial page is distinctive: it is always a left-hand page, usually in the front section. Modern newspapers have expanded this space by using the facing page for lengthier opinions by columnists and guest writers. They call this op-ed, that is, opposite the editorial page, a feature introduced by Herbert Bayard Swope in the New York World of the 1920s.
Technically, its not even a Editorial, its little more than an elevated blog piece. This, however was not the main point of my post. But you asked for it. Have a good day.
You just hit the nail on the head for me,I've been reading this site for years now and I have never ever read a bad review for a game and the funny thing is take a crappy console game and if it is no fun no one will play it take a crappy mmo and people will defend it to it's grave or to their utter embarassment sugar coating things isn't going to stop fanbois from markig out for these games so why keep making certain official staff doesn't provide truly objoective reviews as opposed to the "opinion" pieces we get or atleast post from both sides which as I've said I can't recall a bad review of a game here.
As much as I've posted in the last few months me and Mrbloodworth have probably disagreed here and there but he is right in a newspaper the ops are labeled as such not news tv is much different in america but if I'm reading news in the newspaper it is clearly obvious what is an opinion piece and what's not.
In the first line I think blood said it was a well written piece it was the first thing he said and I haven't heard him make any proclamations about the game not once did he point out anything bad about it he just said which I agree with that MORPG needs to take a stand and stop acting as if they are going to the prom with every dev in the business some games are lacking and that needs to be stated in a clear concise and honest review not an opinion and as stated MMORPG really doesn't do that look up aoc reviews if you don't believe me.
Example is game informer those are reviews and that is news someones opinion of a game is not news sorry.
Now as far as darkfall goes I haven't played so I can't down it but I can say it is obviously not a finished product and I refuse to pay to beta anyones game and I would hope that mmorpg can respect my hits enough to not post things in ways crafted to get me to throw good money after bad which right now they don't really have a problem with.
Do you know for a fact that's the reason why there hasn't been a review for Darkfall yet? If so, why are some games reviewed within WEEKS of launch, while others are reviewed MONTHS after launch? I remember Jon Wood mentioning that one game review (AOC or Vanguard.. can't remember) was delayed because they didn't have anyone to write the review at the time. Obviously that is not the case here.
I'd like to see some consistancy on this site.
Do you know for a fact that's the reason why there hasn't been a review for Darkfall yet? If so, why are some games reviewed within WEEKS of launch, while others are reviewed MONTHS after launch? I remember Jon Wood mentioning that one game review (AOC or Vanguard.. can't remember) was delayed because they didn't have anyone to write the review at the time. Obviously that is not the case here.
I'd like to see some consistancy on this site.
Since I read the entire thread before posting, I know that an employee of MMORPG said that it was, and I don't have any credible reason not to believe him. You obviously think that you do, or alternatively may not have read what he wrote.
Consistency is a topic for a different thread. Feel free to start that thread, if you'd like, and I'm sure people will respond. Political tirades against the site don't belong here.
Since I read the entire thread before posting, I know that an employee of MMORPG said that it was, and I don't have any credible reason not to believe him. You obviously think that you do, or alternatively may not have read what he wrote.
Consistency is a topic for a different thread. Feel free to start that thread, if you'd like, and I'm sure people will respond. Political tirades against the site don't belong here.
This wasn't known until this thread. Its fine that they are giving time. No one has an issue with that, well, i don't, but i only speak for me.
This also, is not the first time people, myself included, have asked for a review by a professional journalist before opinion pices.
Do you consider the Eurogamer review that gave the game a 2 out of 10 professional? That thing was riddled with so many inaccuracies it was laughable. The guy literally complained about laying the ground bleeding out for 60 seconds in one of his captions, when almost every noob knows you can press the spacebar to release. There are countless other examples in his article that make it obvious he spent little time and effort playing the game, or came in with a predisposition against it.
I haven't posted here in a while because I've been busy Playing the game which I have been enjoying immensily since I got my raft.. Anyways I guess things haven't changed here much.. Same old same old with the trolls. It's amazing how people get so fired up over a video game.. If you hate it so much just go worry about something else.. I'f you don't like this website just go to another one. Actualy the people here posting how much they think the game sucks or hate it are only making it more popular. lol
@Paragus
Yea I saw that review it was laughable. The guy didn't even know how to play the game lol. Spacebar 4tw
Good lord, not even. You have to have some serious blinders if you think this is the case. They wrote a review of the game, it as an entry into this space, and There was very little opinion in that article, most comments where about the sad state of its construction and design in this day and age.
You REALLY need to get off this "Us" VS "Them" mentality. Thinking somehow PvE anf PvP are some sort of segment of gamers, gamers are gamers, there are good games, and there are bad games.
When you say "this space", you seem to indicate the mmo space. Well, what is that supposed to be? Are they trying to be a better WOW with full loot pvp? Were they supposed to? Or are they trying to create a different space?
I haven't played the game and I don't know if I would like it (world looks ok, the avatars atrocious imo). But that being said it seems to me they were trying to create something different entirely from the current preconception of what a mmo is or should be. Did they succeed? Again, haven't played it thus I don't know.
This is quite shocking to say the least. I am dumbfounded how you can tell your readers, regardless of who it is, not to read articles on your site. Opinion peices or not, people come here to read the news and information on the home page. If you do not want it to be read, why even post it. Telling 1 person, 5 people, or your whole audience to not read some opinionated material is sad to say the least. Have you ever read a newspaper who states, "Don't read page B-13, because it might hurt your feelings?". That's how you plainly put it. Now i know this is your site, and your free to post whatever you want. But your starting to shoot your credibility in the foot. The only reason these articles are quite popular, is because you make them so. You post them on the front page, were most people view your site from. If these articles had to be seached for, you can bet they wouldn't be found nor be popular. You derailed your own thread by even replying to said poster instead of sending him a PM. I really don't know what else to say, you said it yourself. Quit reading this site, because that is what you want us to do, right? Can this site get anymore ......
And I just read a few post's above, and look who you have saying the same thing. Your spotlighted blogger, Paragus. You mind as well spotlight the spam adder's here, because they are atleast not making vien attempts to get people not to read this site. And let's not talk about hating "these" type video games. You can read my post history and see I love video games to death. If I played DF, i'm sure I would love it to. This is moreso about this site.
I would like to say first that this site is my main site for news by choice. I think the writers write well and the site is layed out well. Secondly, I was never gonna play Darkfall and am not interested in playing it. It is just a game and I am adult enough to know everyone's tastes differ. That is fine. what I have a complaint about is the number of opinion peices making my news feed for this site about darkfall. Fine I relaize darkfall is out there but these peices are offering nothing new to the news site. It is becoming like a personal advertisement site for Darkfall. There is a place for all these darkfall blogs and that is in the darkfall forums. This has nothing to do with liking or hating the game but I am at the point now when I would even relish the articles on all the F2P games just please no more Darkfall blogs as frontpage news. Please.
If we are to get opinion peices can they please offer a little more varity. I personally would love to read opinion peices on some of the top rated games on this site. How about some opinion peices on this week' mover and shakers on this site. It is just starting to be over the top that a game by an independant game developer that has limited copies to buy and still not a large sub base to get this much front page attention. Please
Let me preface this by saying, I love this site. I've come here every day for years to read the articles and check the messageboards, though I have never felt the need to post myself before.
That being said, this article was trash.
Its entire purpose seemed to be defending the game from people who attack it. I don't know much about the game, and after reading the article, I still don't know much about it. All I know is whoever wrote it was really excited about it (from the spam of exclamation marks they litter the article with) and that the game isn't generally well liked as he feel's the need to repeatedly throw in comments "address[ing] the surge of negativity during beta and since". He makes general comparisons between it and the rest of the mmo market, saying how much better Darkfall does things then other games. Its hard to believe this game really does everything better then all of the other mmo's out there, yet the author refuses to mention even the smallest of problems that the game has (unless its to say that it was a problem, but its fixed now!).
In the end, it just feels like a fanboi's ranting. I was really dissapointed reading this article and I am hoping that the trend doesn't continue. For whatever reason, Darkfall has always been a hotbutton issue on this site, but I never really thought it would affect the staff as well. I'm going to chalk it up to just being a poorly written article and hope to not see any more like it.
This is quite shocking to say the least. I am dumbfounded how you can tell your readers, regardless of who it is, not to read articles on your site. Opinion peices or not, people come here to read the news and information on the home page. If you do not want it to be read, why even post it. Telling 1 person, 5 people, or your whole audience to not read some opinionated material is sad to say the least. Have you ever read a newspaper who states, "Don't read page B-13, because it might hurt your feelings?". That's how you plainly put it. Now i know this is your site, and your free to post whatever you want. But your starting to shoot your credibility in the foot. The only reason these articles are quite popular, is because you make them so. You post them on the front page, were most people view your site from. If these articles had to be seached for, you can bet they wouldn't be found nor be popular. You derailed your own thread by even replying to said poster instead of sending him a PM. I really don't know what else to say, you said it yourself. Quit reading this site, because that is what you want us to do, right? Can this site get anymore ......
And I just read a few post's above, and look who you have saying the same thing. Your spotlighted blogger, Paragus. You mind as well spotlight the spam adder's here, because they are atleast not making vien attempts to get people not to read this site. And let's not talk about hating "these" type video games. You can read my post history and see I love video games to death. If I played DF, i'm sure I would love it to. This is moreso about this site.
Going to have to agree with mackdawg19 on this one.
I was under the impression that each person's opinion was just as valuable as anyone elses. Apparently that only applies if it makes your "socks roll up and down".
Sorry... but the thread got derailed by... Stradden.
The article was not trash.
Glad to see you come out and post your opinion! This is seriously getting out of hand. It's spotlight blog after blog and now "editorials" about this game that is not even by normal standards actually a released game. The unprofessionalism of Stradden and staff on this site is really getting out of control. But then again, he already told us if we don't like it we should leave. Guess I he made it pretty obvious to his readers where the door is if we don't like it. Embarrassing. PM your quarrels with specific individuals next time, what you wrote here was way out of line.
I've invested 2 months into the game.
I didn't play in the beta, and I came in with only expection that it was a sandbox FFA pvp game that uses FPS combat.
I play 2 genres of games.
FPS
MMO. I prefer pvp mmo's, FFA mostly. I played lineage two for about 3 years.
Darkfall is both a bad MMO and a bad FPS game.
To write that a mechanic of a game isn't supposed to be fun, as the author did about crafting is just incredible.
According to Av the crafting process is supposed to not only be fun, but intuitive, indepth and non repetitive. The only part they got right was non repetitive.
My first week into the game I thought it was the best MMO I'd played. It was ffa pvp with fps; I thought that was enough.
Two weeks in and the game was great, still not a problem. Some of the bugs are annoying me, but I can get past that.
One month in and I'm wondering where the hell the living mobs are at.
I'm getting tired of exploring an incredibly empty world, and having no reason to kill another player other then to kill them.
I join a clan. I siege. I defend our city.
Two months later.
The game is incredibly shallow. Entirely more linear then any sandbox game should be. Linear enough that I completely disagree with the idea that the game is a sandbox, it's not.
There are only a few things you can be, and to say nearly infinite is a gross exageration.
The combat mechanics are truelly the worst I have ever experienced in any FPS game, and for a game that is focused entirely on clan warefare that's not good.
The sad thing is the late 90's version of UO virtually blows away Darkfall.
Darkfall might be a decent game in the future, but Aventurine has a long way to go to get there.
The article was not trash.
Sorry, but it really was. It's sad how bad some articles on this site can be compared to others. The difference in quality by one staff member from the other is night and day. I feel I can be so well informed about one game, like the Jumpgate Evolution article that was recently featured, and then be left completely in the dark with someone else giving what is clearly an opinion on why they think Darkfall is a gift to mmo's. It's reminiscent of how AoC opinion "reviews" were given in parts when the game was released.
According to MMORPG.com's forum policy, what Stradden did was retaliation, and he is - therefore - eligible for a ban. xD
Category: Retaliation
If you feel that a user is breaking our Rules of Conduct by flaming, trolling, or any other action, please use the 'report' tool to notify a moderator. Responding to them in an aggressive or defensive manner simply further derails the thread, and could result in action taken against your account.
This site is going to look even more lame than usual when more reviews of Darkfall come out and don't match up with the rosy picture your writers are painting in these ridiculous puff pieces. Hope you guys are cashing in on all the marketing you're doing for these companies...
Nice write up.
Warning: Here comes a generic, very subjective (but still true) statement about the game. If you can't handle it skip over the first few lines, keep your rage bottled up for a moment, and please hear me out.
Lol .......
~Hairysun~
[b]
Agreed. The whole game correspondent thing is a bad idea. The DFO articles reek of fanboism and shouldn't be featured on the mainpage. No offense to any of the correspondents, but I don't care what some fanboi thinks about the game he's playing. What I do care about are factual, unbiased information and news posted by people who at least try to be objective.
There is no doubt that the article was based on the opinion of the writer who may be a fan of Darkfall.
Perhaps he was bit defensive due to the embarrassing lack of maturity the MMORPG posting community displays, just do a random sample of any of the sub forums for a particular game and you will find unending threads of people trashing everything and trumping any adult debate with accusations of fanboism.
Honestly the site if FREE, no one pays anything to come here and if you don't like the brand of news then take the Editors advice and just don't read articles about games you don't like....just like your Grandma says. If you can't say something nice about then don't post anything at all.
It is amazing how self important people have become, you are coming to a PRIVATELY owned free MMO site and complaining that the Editor is posting too many opinion based articles about games you don't like. The interwebs are a big place I sure there must be other places you can haunt, if hearing about games from people that enjoy playing them isn’t your thing.
But, BUT, B-U-T, ... will you count on AV to deliver in the future?
8 years, time and money, and you got this, as compared with what they promised.
How much longer will you wait, and count on them for something that is worth waiting?
There are less biased and fairly readable comment, hidden behind piles of crap from fanboys. Just need patience to slowly dig them out. AND they are really rare.
Here is my truth about the game and the features and what is in it mostly.
The devs did BS a lot of the features, lets get beyond that.
The launch was Rocky as hell and now its smooth.
People getting high pings usually something with the internet, I have yet to get Disconnected once but I know a lot who do, I havnt seen one hacker, but I have heard of them( I could of not noticed it either they might be getting smarter)
Map is big, its not all full some like it some don't, I like it. Theres no wildlife(which I like due to performance issues) or weather( if its because of performance I dont have a problem with it ) but that stuff might be subject to change.
I am in the game obviously for about a month now and I like it. but then again some people can not get in or had problems resubscribing or paying options.
PVP is good for a MMORPGFPS medieval setting. I enjoy PVP the most, mostly large battle, I hate getting ganked by 3 or 4 but who likes that.
Everything is a grind, whether it be citys to boats to warhulks. Still people who have been or exploit the mobs to help fund them for this stuff. Most of these been taken care of, but the damage is done.
GRIND GRIND GRIND DIE GRIND GRIND, is how you skill up. Now you can say well you dont have to grind if you dont want to. And thats true, but most PVPers macro afk all day and night, so if you dont you are gimped. Some people exploited skills at beginning but its not as bad as it sounds they got small if that advantages in most pvp even in 1vs1's. Truthfully biggest grind I have seen yet if you want to grind. But I havnt played all games, I played swg wow(for alittle) eve lots of Fps'ers and Planetside and some other mmorpg's like AOC spellborn(alittle) and WAR and Daoc. This to me is the biggest problem.
The much needed content, well its been said PVP and the PVE you can do is fun even tho the PVE is not always rewarding (mobs drops that are hard sometimes dont stack up to say kill 4 goblins in 3-4 hits each with a pole as it needs to be)
PVP in siege was the most fun I had in my entire gaming experiences. I mean colision detection, friendly fire, confusion, tactics, organization, flanking, add that with FPS and Full loot and 200 vs 200(very smooth for my comp) and you got yourself a winner that has me to stay in the game.
Do I macro yes, I am competitive, but this ruins immersion for lots and I dislike to discourage new players.
Every Pvp fight is different to me, never do the same thing yet in most of my pvp experiences( only been on like 5 sieges and some good raids and lots of 1vs1's and ganked a few and got ganked a lot.)
Needs more content this is the second biggest issue to me, not because I want it, because other people want it and I want to kill other people. Population is great.
I am in NA and I got 130-150 average even in 100 vs 100 fights and I dont see much interference if I turn down graphics and audio options down a bit.
The game is not balanced and no polished( some say the game is unfinished I cant agree or disagree on that but I know for a fact the core is there)
They needed to release this game or they would go broke PERIOD. They are adding in every week and changing every week.
The crafting is indeed boring but its fast, this doesnt bother me but to some it does. The skill grind is what bothers me, if they stop making it such a grind about 50 % of there problems will be gone and if they add in the small stuff to do when not PVPing PVEing(this needs work too) And questing( this needs a lot of work) like a card game or I dont know something thats in game and keeps people entertained and make the immersion better, this game will be a very great game.
But if they dont say hello to MO Earthrise FE and some others coming out. But I am staying and having fun atm, and going to stay until I find this thrill in some other mmorpg and/or mmofps.
Any other questions?
To Izure: No questions, apart from a few opinion, you pretty much sums up the general opinion there.
After DAoC and SWG, which provides a seemeless pve intergrated into pvp, and a much more meaningful pvp, I see no reason why I need to go try DFO. It does not offer anything better.
AND the community, once again, that is where you did not elaborate, like all, or most reviews. A pvp game is a game dependent totally on the quality of community, your side, their side, if there are sides.
FFS, even the managing editor of the site can't post a positive word about this game without the trolls jumping all over him.
You people need to get a life....seriously. You cast your bitterness into every single thread pertaining to this game, and the fans get their posts deleted, and get bogus warnings one after another. I personally have had several warnings for posts that did NOT violate a single rule of this site (ALL of these warnings were then removed by the community manager) due to posting positive, or even helpful messages in the Darkfall forum here.
We get it. You don't like the game. Now go play something you DO like, and stop crying like a spanked child.
To me theres more meaningful pvp in dfo then both of those put together, but thats me.
As far as saying better, now pre swg was better but do not exist anymore, Daoc, not dfo is better than daoc to me.
Community to me I didnt discuss, because to me they are down to earth people, you wont rpg too much but some times you get lucky, the forums do not make the community inside the game, I should of mentioned that. If you not trying this game for those reason i think you are missing out.
i like how the fans bash a negative opiniated piece (eurogamer) but love the opiniated pieces here.
Hypocrisy goes great with morning coffee!
If small = double, then ok. People will hit you for 2x your damage if you don't have masteries. And yeah, sure, you don't need to grind, just play the game at your normal pace -- that's what all the hardcore PVPers at forumfall repeat night and day. Problem is, they obviously have no understanding how PVP games work at all, they're stuck in their WOW mentality, thinking it doesn't really matter how fast you get through the content to the end-game. The game is very grindy and and if you don't grind, you're no competition at all. I really don't get why so many people think that repetitiveness and tediousness in all aspects of the game somehow add to the hardcore experience.
Just to give you an example, when skilling up weaponskills when it was stil possible to get gains from hitting invulnerable targets, coupled with double stamina regen (which was later nerfed to 150% of its initial value), it'd take me about 35 minutes of constantly hitting a target to get nice 1.0 gain at around 60 skill. Of course, the higher you get, the slower it goes up. It now takes a lot longer as you can't newbie weapons (additional cost), and can't skill up on invulnerable targets. Another example, archery: took me about 30 arrows to get +0.1 at around 50 skill, then at around 65 it took me around 60 arrows to get +0.1. AFAIR it takes over 15k arrows to get from ~50 to 75 skill in archery. And it doesn't matter if you hit something or not, so if you have the money/resources, you can just macro shooting arrows into the ground.
So instead of grinding character levels, gamers grind bow level, sword level, magic level. That is improvement in game design?
So instead of doing quests, gamers macro bow and shoot at the floor to level up? Hmm good design and great game?
In WoW or whatever else, you lvl up in character to pvp/pve effectively, in DF you shoot at the floor to pvp competitively. And shooting at the floor is recommended by some to be a better game play.
If the game is so real, can I log in and collect the 15k arrows each player shoot at the floor afk. I will be a rich man, beyond my wildest dreams.
About the Eurogamer piece. I wouldn't of had a problem with it BUT the review's facts were false. SImple things that a person who spent more time in game than 10mins could of figured that out. Therefore, the review loses any credibility.
As a hardcore PvPers, I can tell you that most of the grind can be igored. Why? Because you'll never find yourself in a situation where it will matter unless you are doing something wrong. A group of people with 100 weapon masteries will lose to a more compotenet group who understands stragey and tactics every day.
Which fact is wrong?
Is the UI designed in a way that sound intuitive, is the documentation, ingame help good enuf to help starter realise there are options? Be specific.
Just a line saying its wrong? Against a whole text trying to explain?
I cannot dismiss the full review with information just because you, someone I don't know, barges in a drop a completely unsubstantiated statement.
Good article.
Congratulations on being able to overlook the glaring faults that Darkfall has such as combat, crafting, exploring, PvP, sieging, GvG, etc....
I'm still waiting for a sandbox style game that's even nearly as good as UO was.
You won't get it ever.
Which fact is wrong?
Is the UI designed in a way that sound intuitive, is the documentation, ingame help good enuf to help starter realise there are options? Be specific.
Just a line saying its wrong? Against a whole text trying to explain?
I cannot dismiss the full review with information just because you, someone I don't know, barges in a drop a completely unsubstantiated statement.
I didn't point these out another reader did, but hes right Everything he list here the review states as fact, but are actually false.
I’ll leave out all the reviews opinions which I disagree with, but this is a list of quotes that are factually incorrect:
to 'do' anything - talk to an NPC, bind yourself to a location, loot a corpse, and so on - you have to click the right mouse button to toggle between interaction or movement mode.
Unbelievably, to do anything that involves any interaction at all, you have to stop still - this includes any and all inventory management, looting, chatting - anything interactive.
like an FPS, except with little to no reference point.
how slow and floaty the controls tend to be.
The difference in feedback between a sword hitting or missing is negligible
lack of hit detection
Judging the distance that one needs to be at to fight a foe is largely guesswork
your combat skills affect how often you actually connect.
changing weapon (a ten-second operation - five if you're particularly nimble)
EverQuest - which was actually graphically superior
no definition in areas except those where you spawn as a newbie
It doesn't even have [snip] some form of tutorial
horrible user interface, and broken combat system.
the few Darkfall servers Adventurine is running
You can't turn off the UI - the game just occasionally forgets to load it.
At times you'll be left waiting to die - for up to a minute.
'Mrs Butterowrth': I also, did not hijack anything. The thread was about the article.
This is a flat out lie. You used the thread to state that the opinion pieces should not be included in 'news', though you didn't say where they should be other than an imaginary tab you made up. You also started demanding a review, and continued to whine even after Wood said a review was coming.
Recieving a Op Ed piece is news. In fact, if we use your ridiculous definition, reviews themselves don't qualify to be posted under 'news'.
If you could look at yourself as critically as you do MMORPG.com, I think everyone would be a lot happier.
My ridiculous definition that has been used since the 1500?
Ok.
Oh hay! Looky there.
1. a. Information about recent events or happenings, especially as reported by newspapers, periodicals, radio, or television.
This would be like 'Dwarves are added to EVE'.
b. A presentation of such information, as in a newspaper or on a newscast.
An article about the example from A
2. New information of any kind: The requirement was news to him.
I did not know this person's opinion on DF, therefore it is news. Also, I do not know the website's official opinion on Darkfall i.e. the review, so this will also be news.
3. Newsworthy material:
As you can now see, I've made it very simple for you, that both the op ed and the reviews, do fall into the definition of news, and they fall under the same definition.
You're welcome. Drop me a message if you need any more help with the English language.
Uh, no.
News organizations are often expected to aim for objectivity; reporters claim to try to cover all sides of an issue without bias, as compared to commentators or analysts, who provide opinion or personal point-of-view.
EDIT: You're welcome. Drop me a message if you need any more help with the English language.
That's basically the case. Only it takes much longer to build a character in DFO than it'd take in your average "grindy" EverQuest/WOW type game with levels, lots of PVE etc.
A hardcore PvPer? That adds credibility to your post and I feel that I can trust you... Well, not really. What you're saying is that if you don't grind, then you can PvP something down with your gimped group, but only if it didn't have a pulse in the first place. Whoop-dee-fkin-doo, that's some competition. A group of people who understand strategy and tactics with 100 weapon masteries will curbstomp a group of people who understand strategy and tactics with no weapon masteries every time they meet. You're not able to compete unless you grind, sorry, and the amount of grind in DFO is simply horrendous. It just boggles my mind how anyone calling themselves a PvPer can honestly like this system and defend it, it just makes no sense to have a PLAYER versus PLAYER game where the deciding factor for pretty much each and every fight in the game is not player skill but character skill. Now's the time for you to tell me it's an RPG and the excruciatingly slow and tedious character development process is somehow necessary and fun.
The thing is the deciding factor isn't character skill levels, its how the character players. You are assuming that most players that are playing darkfall are hardcore PvPers who know how to PvP in an FPS settting. The sad fact is, they aren't. Also, the skills that do require grind to level in order to be good at the game, expect magic magic is insanse amount of grind, actually don't require that much grind time wise. I never said I like the system, just that the grind thats there is ignoreable.
Ditto. I haven't seen that before and am pretty disappointed in some pretty hypocritcical behaviour of the site staff. Shame.
Really nice write up , you've described the initial forray into Darkfall perfectly IMO, will look forward to reading any future write ups you do !
Hyjacking: using a high traffic thread to bring up a different topic.
I'll sum it up for you: If you don't like the site, don't use it. If you have a suggestion, here is where that goes: tr.im/kPG9
I agree, but that short. I have read the review and play the game, and the review lies. The guy have not explored enough, because theres freacking amazing areas on the game. Not understanding basic mechanics of the game. Not even knowing the keys (like space to revive).
Man.. imagine a Counter-Strike reviewer that never tried the space bar to revive. The eurogamer reviewer never tried the space bar to revive, and he writte that if you die you have to wait minutes. Hahaa..
Ok.. the game is poorly designed. Do this put betwen the player and the fun? Nope. Theres even rough corners on the game that make the game both harder and more fun.
The review is a classic problem of misunderstanding something, and choosing to think the worst.
Kelly,
I just got around to reading your article and I must say it's well done. I look forward to your next one. Its funny to see the same trolls in all the Darkfall correspondant threads saying the identical things over and over :). I think if they ever open up a new "opinion" tab they should also put in a new "petting zoo" tab where all the cute little trolls can gather together and we can pet them, feed them, and discipline them when necessary.
I am not sure why people ask why the correspondant articles are often coming from people that enjoy playing the game they are writing about. The correspondant program was designed to grab individuals actively playing and involved in all walks of mmorpgs to write pieces on various topics and news from inside the game they play. The key here is "actively playing". If someone subscribed to a game and thought it sucked, hence ending their subscription... how can they write ongoing pieces for the site if they no longer play the game?
The correspondant program works great because you can get first hand knowledge of the current ongoings on any mmorpg from people who actually play, and continue to play. If the game changes in a positive way, you'll know. If the game changes in a negative way, you'll know. If a new aspect of the game is discovered, you'll know. Paragus's writeup on his raft and subsequent boatride was a great example of this. How else would you get this information? And for those of you that dislike the correspondant program, the articles, the writers, or the placement of said articles... the first line of every correspondant article state's clearly that its a correspondant article and who its by. So they are simple to avoid should you desire to do so.
Solo...
Another possible "carebear" aspect might be solo working (although I know a very good PvP primary that works almost 100% as a solo).
I went in with the clear understanding that solo work was really not possible and I have that is not really true. Being a solo player is completly viable. In fact, if you create a clan of one you can join alliances and get 100% all the benifits you can from being in clan UNLESS you want to get into world building leadership which is nearly a game in of itself keeping up with everything.
Mobs difficulties are spread all over the map so as a solo you can venture into new lands for several days or weeks without having you clan feel like you are straying away.
When it comes to harder PvE a group is a group is a group. Its doesnt have to be a clan.
In Darkfall making a clan is not very expensive and the player cost to leaving them and joining others is null.
THE politics of this post thread are very overt. I read the article and it did seem a little sided to me but, hey, he has his right to say so. Alas, I will through my opinion into the bucket, writing is an art and not a science which seems to be the issue with this thread. I also come to MMORPG. com for all my games regarding information. That is, information of a game in deciding if it is worth dumping my dollars into which makes this site important to me as a gamer.
The author is, in my opinion, a good writer applying enthusiasm and excitement into his experience. He reported his time in game and his ability to express his observations are impressive. However, he identifies himself as a “carebear” which eludes me as I do not understand what they are. He did mention that he played other games stating, “I have been an enthusiastic MMORPG player since the good old days of Everquest, going on to play Final Fantasy XI, Everquest 2, Vanguard (PvE), and Age of Conan (PvE) among other things.” This leads the reader to conclude that if you play these games you are a “carebear.” Now, if being a carebear is some sort of weakness or flaw then I would be offended, perhaps it is good not knowing his definition.
The only other weak area I can find in his writing mixes with the politics of this thread. Commenting on a game that the author himself concludes does not fit into the site. He writes, “Yes you have to click to perform actions, but this is a FPS-MMO guys!” That is, he is providing commentary on a game for MMORPG.com that is not, in his opinion, an MMORPG causing confusion to
the reader.
V/R,
SEABEAST