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Star Wars: The Old Republic Videos: MMOFTW - Ep 17 - The Doctors Leave BioWare (6:49)

This week's MMOFTW talks about Ray and Greg's exit from BioWare, Planetside 2's F2P model, and Darkfall Unholy Wars. Plus we chat about the days of longer leveling times and whether we miss those days or not. Check it out!

This week's MMOFTW talks about Ray and Greg's exit from BioWare, Planetside 2's F2P model, and Darkfall Unholy Wars. Plus we chat about the days of longer leveling times and whether we miss those days or not. Check it out!
Duration: 6:49
Views: 6,082  43 comments
Game: Star Wars: The Old Republic
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Wizardry writes:

:D sober for once !

I do question the term retirement.I think they were pushed out.

AV the little dev that couild,i like their direction.

SOE no pay to win??Well i happen to play EQ2 where they released the make your own maze content that revolved around cash shop.Housing is cash shop,AOD was the wrost ripoff expac i have ever seen,it had virtually zero content,just a crafting npc and mercs.

Bottom line is SOE can't be trusted,we will see when game goes live.

FFXI NO HAND holding :) I don't like hand holding at all in games.

I do agree 100% about levels, i don't like levels unless they are actually treated like an aging process.In gaming right now ,levels are treated like some finish line you have to race for.

Mon Sep 24 2012 7:00AM Report
erictlewis writes:

Another good video there Bill.

Now soe as far as playing to win.  We currently have the store in eq2.  Nothing there is play to win for the most part. There is tons of clothing, and various nick nacks.  However there are what I term play to win items.  These are potions that you can buy that allows you to level faster, get more AA, and more xp, those items are borderline.

When I heard the comments that thy are making all the game features available to everybody,  one has to wonder, how they will make money.  If you give it all away most folks will play it and not buy items in the store.  So I kind of look at it like that. What are the benefits of a sub vs free to play,  that is something we need to know.

Now lets talk about the doctors,  I honestly believe they wanted out because ea/bioware has totally been disassociated with what the doctors stand for. I not sure if they were forced our, or what I think they decided to get out while still having a golden parachute.  I believe they signed a non compete agreement, and later will will see them back, probably in 2 years that is the usual length for a non compete.

Mon Sep 24 2012 7:52AM Report
Evelknievel writes:

Hopefully future developers will go back to the drawing boards on online games and integrate sandbox with some themepark elements in the new generation of mmorpgs.

 Player made content in game is where it's at for more of a persistent and changing mmo world.

Mon Sep 24 2012 8:11AM Report
roo67 writes:

No its definatly not just him I would like to see leveling done away with and many of the things he mentions in the webcast . Theres too much handholding in mmos these days . Do we really need quest trackers telling us where everything is .

Sadly I think Bioware wont produce any more decent games now . I'm sure Dragon Age and Mass Effect will continue to spawn sequals for a while to come .

As for planet side 2 Im assuming you have to pay for the client which makes it Buy to Play in my books and not Free to Play . I much prefer B2P .

Mon Sep 24 2012 8:12AM Report
Freezzo writes: So no comment on the incorrectness of Doctor's? How sad... shouldn't be there to begin with. I'm sorry, mistakes like that even a non-native can spot annoy me to no end. Mon Sep 24 2012 8:39AM Report
BillMurphy writes: Typo fixed.  Thanks for pointing out so humbly and politely, Freezzo. ;) Mon Sep 24 2012 8:46AM Report
iamrta writes: great show. thanks! Mon Sep 24 2012 8:58AM Report
gieger808 writes:

Uh oh. He admited to being a sandbox mmo lover. Oh  the forum hate will decend!

I got your back!

Mon Sep 24 2012 9:15AM Report
BillMurphy writes: FWIW, I love ALL MMOs, if they're worth my time. I'm hoping for a sandbox that will be worth my time again is all.  :) Mon Sep 24 2012 9:25AM Report
piehole writes: I also love sandbox games. Really missing all you said about games that challenges you not only beeing tough with hard monsters but also by the means to learn it and explore functions etc. Hate the themepark genre. And levels. And classes. And games without houses. And my boss at work. Mon Sep 24 2012 9:43AM Report
i_evil_i writes:

I agree wholeheartedly about getting rid of leveling completely.

Concerning progression and in particular unlocking of skills, I liked the GW1 way of getting skills. Going forward in the game world / story and unlocking skills that way. Also the capping of elite skills by killing certain elite bosses (who also use said skills in there attacks).



Mon Sep 24 2012 9:56AM Report
winter writes:

Hummm whose been waiting/looking forward to DF2? Really its just another monwey grab for a product that will be overhyped and deliver just like DF1 did. (ie poorly) I do have to wonder about anyone that takes anything AV/taso says at face value anymore. Hears betting DFUW will not be out in Nov per AV's long standing dismall track record.

  As to SOE we've seen the downward direction they've taken with most of their games. EQ2 etc. the free to play model thats actually more expensive then the subscriptuion. the dumbing down of the product (more then 2 stats that actually do anythingis just tooo much! and Lets put wings on everythingthat will fix it!) So I'll pass soe's most recent attempt.

   Yeah there was alot to be said for older games where things took a bit longer. I disagree that throwing out lvls and just making your character static never growing in power and instead rewarding it with a house or new hairstyle is the way to go though, but yeah I'm old scholl and able to handle more then just a power and a life stat

Mon Sep 24 2012 10:57AM Report
ajax7 writes: There were no lvl's when SWG first came out what a idea before its time! Mon Sep 24 2012 11:01AM Report
Gravarg writes:

Woot blurb about me XD


Good one again Bill, and I have to agree with you.  Although I do love leveling my character and getting those shiny gears, I think it's time for something new.  Levels have been around since the original MMO, it's an old, outdated way of saying, "I'm super!"  Being able to just "live" in a game is what I love about MMOs.  In Skyrim, for instance,  I have an orc blacksmith...yeah a blacksmith.  He's no warrior, he's no mage, he's no thief...he's a blacksmith.  I know I'll never be able to sell my wares to anyone that's going to actually use them, but I just like to run around gather ores, head back to my hut (mods rule hehe) and bang out some dragon armor just to sell to the local armor store :)  This is what I like about MMOs personally.  I really never liked being the protaganist, it's fun, but that's just not me.  I'd rather be a carpenter or blacksmith that sells things to those protaganists :)

Mon Sep 24 2012 11:28AM Report
BillMurphy writes: You guys should see what Origins of Malu are planning... we'll have the scoop on that probably next week.  :)  You'll love it, if you liked Galaxies. Mon Sep 24 2012 11:38AM Report
123443211234 writes:

Good vid really excited about Darkfall UW, Darkfall is the single most thrilling gaming experience I have EVER had (I'm 34).  this will be my main game for many years to come.  

As for PS2 I am really excited for it as well but don't believe a single word from Matt Higby about how f2p is not always p2w.  It clearly is p2w since being a subscriber and or using large amounts of station cash enables you to gain your levels, skills and weapons upgrades much much faster.  This in turn gives you a huge time advantage over the standard "free" player, where you will be significantly more powerful and versatile.  (also a big early lead in character development usually stays a big lead all factors being equal) thus making the game pay 2 win.  The propaganda and hypocrisy of the game devs and their marketing departments in the f2p models these days is hilarious to watch.  


Personally i'll still be playing and might drop a little cash, I just wish these hypocrites would stop trying to propagandize their payment model.  It is what it is p2w, still gonna be fun though.

Mon Sep 24 2012 11:41AM Report
Gravarg writes: Wow that Origins of Malu game sounds great Bill.  I never heard of it until now XD.  It sounds like it'll have to go on my "want to play" list :) Mon Sep 24 2012 12:08PM Report
PsyMike3d writes: 5:29? and after... is he talking about Darkfall? i think so ;) Mon Sep 24 2012 12:41PM Report
Jonoku writes: "Don't let a bad pug, get you down." -Bill Murphy Mon Sep 24 2012 12:43PM Report
Vorthanion writes: I am missing the virtual world aspect of MMOs, whether they be sandbox or themepark.  I love casual gameplay, but it doesn't have to be set up like a console or lobby game.  I want a living, breathing world to explore. Mon Sep 24 2012 1:11PM Report
Freezzo writes: @Bill: I'm always in such a humble mood ;) But other than the typo you're makign a great show :) Mon Sep 24 2012 1:15PM Report
Kooshdin writes:

one reason why these mmo games fail is ?????


Subscriptions    Pay evey mnoth so you have to play every hour possible in order to limit the amount of times you have to keep repaying for something not brand new


gw2 for twh win :D    Guild wars in general for teh win


Mon Sep 24 2012 1:59PM Report
BelegStrongbow writes:

You ended off talking about exactly what Darkfall is. 

And what Unholy Wars will be.  @Bill I hope you guys get really interested and involved in DF Unholy Wars,  they are really pushing the bar and making the game we all always wanted. 

300 vs 300 epic seige battles with a better UI, controls, balance and Character progression than Darkfall 1.

Mon Sep 24 2012 2:00PM Report
bcbully writes: I'm with you Bill.  Mon Sep 24 2012 3:19PM Report
punkrock2 writes: Haha awesome vid, i miss the old MMO days*Played since the start in 1997* We need to go back. Mon Sep 24 2012 3:47PM Report
wrekognize writes: I enjoyed your piece on DFUW and talking about more sandbox MMORPGs.  Plus, there is really a sense of accomplishment when building a character is not so easy. Mon Sep 24 2012 4:16PM Report
CujoSWAoA writes:

Casey Schreiner's show seems to be over since the great g4 collapse of 2012.

So, good on you Bill.  Your the top MMO news webcast on the net.


Mon Sep 24 2012 4:28PM Report
BARDSTALE000 writes:

Thanks Bill, another great one.

This patern of buyout and bail is certainly not a new thing.  Espcailly with EA.  I can understand the reasons, but most of the time the outcome is negative for both the company and unfortunatly it's employess, and everyone else invested internally (that dosn't have stock then options et al).

This is the usual pattern:

  1. Take EA, Activision, some investment groups, etc., for a lot of which might have been game companies at one time but now consist of mostly investment banker types. They approach a successful company, usually one that has a recent string of hits, and offer them a huge sum of money to buy the company out from the owner(s).
  2. The principles of the company are now many millions richer which gives them freedom and so on. All go's well for a while but then they see this new corperate control trying to manipulate things more and more. It goes from more of a creative process to the typical big corperation push of make as much money as you can in any given second. They get a bunch of biz school suits running around with no F'ing clue telling them now how to make their games, trying to squeeze as much money out of things, ad Draconion DRMs, etc.
  3. The owners, the principles, get tired of the BS. They are now so damn wealthy from the buyout anyhow they say "F-this!" and leave.  Many retire, go sailing around the world,  fly a rocket into space or what have you.  The comapny as it was just a shell of it's former glory land slides into death within a few years.
Some examples:
  1. EA buys Origin Systems for $35m.  Richard Garriott leaves a few years later. Except for on going UO MMO, the main thing seen out of "Origin" since was the totally unrelated EA answear to Valve's Steam.
  2. EA buys Bullfrog. Peter Molyneux leaves. The main thing seen from Bullfrog since was EA's horrible FPS redition of the once great Syndicate series.
  3. EA buys Maxis (that was hurting at the time), Will Wright splits, and EA makes the horrible Sims 3, etc.
  4. Sierra Entertainment sold out to CUC International for $1.5 billion.  Ken and Roberta Williams left a year later leaving the employees in a lurch, many being layed off a few years later.  Like WTF happened to Sierra you might ask? Meanwhile the William left game dev entierly and are sailing around the world as I write this.
There are many more cases, Microsoft has their share of these but then some seems to stay intact like Microsoft purchased Bungie w/continued success of the Halo series et al.
Finally reacall EA bought Bioware for close to a billion (that's right a billion).  Only a guess if they had a reason to leave it was out of the loss of control, frustration, and the usual BS with goose stepping corperate suits.  At any rate the Docs are probably not hurting for cash what ever their cut was..
Mon Sep 24 2012 4:31PM Report
FrodoFragins writes: I bet the shirt under that jacket has holes for the nipples and reveals the belly. Mon Sep 24 2012 4:35PM Report
FrodoFragins writes: WE'll never know how much responsibility the doctors bear with respect to BW's lackluster releases and poor design choices.  I'm sure EA has a lot to do with those failures, but SWTOR had to have been mishandled across the board. Mon Sep 24 2012 4:40PM Report
GreenWidow writes:

Bill I caught that you would be playing the New Conglomerate...I look forward to wearing the Gold and Blue with you man!


Played PS1 with NC for years and loved it. Was a member of Mostly Harmless during the beta. Amazingly fun group of cutups like myself and this game really shined up until the football.

I have high hopes for this game.  Thanks for updating us!

Mon Sep 24 2012 5:41PM Report
NobleNerd writes:

Great Segment Murph!


I too am like the poster you quoted at the end. I remember the days where leveling took a long time and even the crafting was a lot more time consuming (the items created were more valued though). I miss the days where it wasn't so much about how fast you leveled as it was the journey getting there, the friends made and the tales told. Today I can go from 1- level cap without even the need to enlist the help of another adventurer's aide. Even in GW2 (who put a more social emphasis on gaming) I can go through the world without building friendships from fellow adventurers.


Somewhere through out the years of MMO gaming and building it seems there has been a gradual loss of emphasis on the story being told or unfolded, the adventures around the horizon and a more focus on the thrill of the combat. In my days of FFXI I had more tales and stories of friends and fellow linkshell mates adventures than in the years that followed. I am not sure if I was just more social back then or if it was the game's layout that pushed me to be more social. Either way I miss though days.

Mon Sep 24 2012 6:21PM Report
Greefer writes:

DF:UW = as close to old school mmo as anyone will ever get today.  Embrace it.

Mon Sep 24 2012 7:27PM Report
Nivisiru writes: Best episode yet!  Keep up the good work. Mon Sep 24 2012 8:41PM Report
Hokie writes:

These are getting better and better.

Thanks Bill!

Mon Sep 24 2012 8:57PM Report
Foomerang writes:

Bill,  you're a good guy so don't take this wrong, but you should probably think about a graphic for mmoftw.  Every episode its the same sad image: a vidcap of you looking worried, standing by a tv.

This segment needs a graphic or logo or something.  Not you looking like a mouth breather for the 17th time.


Thank you. 


Tue Sep 25 2012 12:56AM Report
Loke666 writes:

I have to agree, with you Bill. Levels never been that good even in pen and paper games. I think future MMOs seriously needs to rethink the character progression and how to keep players interested for a long time. Same thing with gear progression by raiding.

And not only personal progression but also guildprogression, those 2 should really go hand in hand, working together with other players for common goals is really fun and the best part off MMOs.

Tue Sep 25 2012 2:50AM Report
verenov writes: I enjoy your show, Bill. Keep up the good work! Tue Sep 25 2012 7:25AM Report
zellmer writes:

Praising SoE's F2P model feels like an insult no matter what they currently say after all the junk they've pulled with EQ and EQ 2..


Tue Sep 25 2012 3:30PM Report
Faced1111 writes:

i dont think there even was a level cap in asherons call, and i remember it took an entire week to hit level 20 with at least 5 hours of gaming a day...simply i would like to see no level cap at all but that being said i dont want levels to be such a huge gap of stats that i wouldnt be able to do 2 level 40's should be able to take out a level 80 character or at least put up a good fight, most mmos these days have a 2 level gap, when i first was playing wow it was me and one other friend and we couldnt even come close to fighting some guy 5 levels above me. In Aion the one thing i liked as a gladiator was people would always try to come gank me, even if i was 10 levels below them i would still be able to put up an hour fight, it was awesome...i want that again

Tue Sep 25 2012 4:10PM Report
BillMurphy writes: @Frodo: How'd you know... stalker. Tue Sep 25 2012 4:45PM Report
xpiher writes: OMG THE SANDBOX REVOULTION AT MMORPG!? Fri Sep 28 2012 4:42AM Report
Dren_Utogi writes: :o Fri Sep 28 2012 11:39AM Report