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Star Wars: The Old Republic Forum » Spoilers » 20 Examples of Choices Effecting Events Beyond the Cutscene

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93 posts found
  Robsolf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/21/06
Posts: 4013

Let go of my ears, I know what I'm doing!

2/08/12 2:39:09 PM#41
Originally posted by dimmit77

 

Are you being sarcastic or is this an actual proposal ? Banning people from doing quests on a planet based on one quest choice? Damn the SWTOR developers for not thinking that one first . 

I mean it would be so succesfull .... 

 

/facepalm

PS. 

Even better , if you make 3 wrong choices you get to not level at ANY planet. 

ROFL

I remember, for a long time in earlier RPG's that they quite often had false choices.  And what I mean by that is, like you said, acting a certain way pretty much blacklisted you from getting things done, EVEN IN MAIN QUESTLINES!!!

And yep.  It was absurd then(with load and save buttons), and it would be just beyond silly now, in a game where you may have played 80 hours to get to that choice, and there's no reloading your last save.

  baritone3k

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/02/10
Posts: 225

 
OP  2/08/12 4:04:01 PM#42
Originally posted by Robsolf
Originally posted by dimmit77

 

Are you being sarcastic or is this an actual proposal ? Banning people from doing quests on a planet based on one quest choice? Damn the SWTOR developers for not thinking that one first . 

I mean it would be so succesfull .... 

 

/facepalm

PS. 

Even better , if you make 3 wrong choices you get to not level at ANY planet. 

ROFL

I remember, for a long time in earlier RPG's that they quite often had false choices.  And what I mean by that is, like you said, acting a certain way pretty much blacklisted you from getting things done, EVEN IN MAIN QUESTLINES!!!

And yep.  It was absurd then(with load and save buttons), and it would be just beyond silly now, in a game where you may have played 80 hours to get to that choice, and there's no reloading your last save.

Instead of following suit with the person who you quoted to a reductio ad absurdum version, check out my actual version of a branching storyline with options.

In my off the cuff version, the choice could shut you off from a portion of the game. It doesn't have to be extreme, but it should change the course of your journey.

Let's say the game gives you 2 or 3 planets to quest on between 20 and 25. You make this choice on one planet (it could even tell you, this will block you from future quests on this planet - like it does when you make the advanced class choice). Either way, you have 1 or 2 other planets to go to with the same level reqs.

If the choice is only available on one of the planets, then this crushing, terrible, debiliatating inability to quest on planet X doesn't even mean you can't pack up with your friends who didn't make the choice and proceed leveling elsewhere.

I am not sure why this would be such a big deal? It would be "dynamic" and influence your story. It would't have to be like losing age or statistics like if a lich touched you in D&D.

 

You choose to be a certain race. You are stuck with it. Permanent (except in WoW you can buy a change). You are stuck with a class and then at level 10 make the IRREVOCABLE decision to choose an advanced class. There are already fundamental decisions that shape your path.

 

Why not have some more dynamic ones as you go?

Someone please make a good MMO.

  Bladestrom

Elite Member

Joined: 4/04/11
Posts: 3296

2/08/12 4:20:08 PM#43
Originally posted by baritone3k
Originally posted by Robsolf
Originally posted by dimmit77

 

Are you being sarcastic or is this an actual proposal ? Banning people from doing quests on a planet based on one quest choice? Damn the SWTOR developers for not thinking that one first . 

I mean it would be so succesfull .... 

 

/facepalm

PS. 

Even better , if you make 3 wrong choices you get to not level at ANY planet. 

ROFL

I remember, for a long time in earlier RPG's that they quite often had false choices.  And what I mean by that is, like you said, acting a certain way pretty much blacklisted you from getting things done, EVEN IN MAIN QUESTLINES!!!

And yep.  It was absurd then(with load and save buttons), and it would be just beyond silly now, in a game where you may have played 80 hours to get to that choice, and there's no reloading your last save.

Instead of following suit with the person who you quoted to a reductio ad absurdum version, check out my actual version of a branching storyline with options.

In my off the cuff version, the choice could shut you off from a portion of the game. It doesn't have to be extreme, but it should change the course of your journey.

Let's say the game gives you 2 or 3 planets to quest on between 20 and 25. You make this choice on one planet (it could even tell you, this will block you from future quests on this planet - like it does when you make the advanced class choice). Either way, you have 1 or 2 other planets to go to with the same level reqs.

If the choice is only available on one of the planets, then this crushing, terrible, debiliatating inability to quest on planet X doesn't even mean you can't pack up with your friends who didn't make the choice and proceed leveling elsewhere.

I am not sure why this would be such a big deal? It would be "dynamic" and influence your story. It would't have to be like losing age or statistics like if a lich touched you in D&D.

 

You choose to be a certain race. You are stuck with it. Permanent (except in WoW you can buy a change). You are stuck with a class and then at level 10 make the IRREVOCABLE decision to choose an advanced class. There are already fundamental decisions that shape your path.

 

Why not have some more dynamic ones as you go?

Thats a bit topsy turvy, much better approach is that you have 20 - 25 planets and at say level 1-10 there are 2-3 planets that have level 1-10 quests, etc.  That would be your dynamic open universe right there potentially.  Cutting you off from a zone is removing choice not adding it, just like only having restricted corridors to choose from is reducing choice and the sense of freedom.  Another angle - your sense of immersion is much greater where there are not invisible barriers or annoying logic prevent you from going where you decide to go.

 

rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW (1000 hrs on main mage)> oblivion > LOTR (480 Hunter) > Rift (230 hours mage) > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(900 elementalist), Wildstar

Now playing GW2, AOW 3

  Clocksimus

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/07/10
Posts: 356

2/08/12 4:23:43 PM#44
Originally posted by baritone3k

I am not sure why this would be such a big deal? It would be "dynamic" and influence your story. It would't have to be like losing age or statistics like if a lich touched you in D&D.

 

You choose to be a certain race. You are stuck with it. Permanent (except in WoW you can buy a change). You are stuck with a class and then at level 10 make the IRREVOCABLE decision to choose an advanced class. There are already fundamental decisions that shape your path.

 

Why not have some more dynamic ones as you go?

You know that is a very good way of looking at it.  You pick a class and if you play for 30 hours and end up not liking your adv class, you don't get a free redo  class change button.  I can't see the big issue with having choices ingame that you can not take back, that change the course of your characters story.  Even if you make a choice you later regret you can try to make up for it with your later actions..... Just think about that.  Instead of a story on rails you just sit and enjoy the ride, you have an active enaging story where you as the player actually feel responsible for your actions.  In the end it will always remain the players therefore not trapping them in any way simply giving them a choice.

  User Deleted
2/08/12 4:29:59 PM#45
Originally posted by Bladestrom

Thats a bit topsy turvy, much better approach is that you have 20 - 25 planets and at say level 1-10 there are 2-3 planets that have level 1-10 quests, etc.  That would be your dynamic open universe right there potentially.  Cutting you off from a zone is removing choice not adding it, just like only having restricted corridors to choose from is reducing choice and the sense of freedom.  Another angle - your sense of immersion is much greater where there are not invisible barriers or annoying logic prevent you from going where you decide to go.

 

How would you then handle the thing that I find most immursive (Spelling) The story?

 

There are already four zones (Or so) a planet that you can level on. You're not cut off from it and you can do it anytime.

  RizelStar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/12/11
Posts: 2823

We all breathe and we all die.

2/08/12 4:40:07 PM#46
Originally posted by Snaylor47
Originally posted by Bladestrom

Thats a bit topsy turvy, much better approach is that you have 20 - 25 planets and at say level 1-10 there are 2-3 planets that have level 1-10 quests, etc.  That would be your dynamic open universe right there potentially.  Cutting you off from a zone is removing choice not adding it, just like only having restricted corridors to choose from is reducing choice and the sense of freedom.  Another angle - your sense of immersion is much greater where there are not invisible barriers or annoying logic prevent you from going where you decide to go.

 

How would you then handle the thing that I find most immursive (Spelling) The story?

 

There are already four zones (Or so) a planet that you can level on. You're not cut off from it and you can do it anytime.

With one character?

I mean as for story just have it scale that way you can go to the other zones if you choose to level at other places.

Would be a solution IMO.

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  Tardcore

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/13/09
Posts: 2370

"A strange game. The only winning move is not to post."

2/08/12 4:51:02 PM#47
Originally posted by Laughing-man

They said early on in development that choices you make will have long term effects.

Then later on they recanted saying that they didn't like gameplay choices that made you feel stuck that you couldn't take back later. 

Thats why they went with dark side and light side not having much difference...   Only cosmetic and thats it...

Kinda disapointing.

I've been told that most of the Bioware ideas that didn't make it to launch were changed due to feedback from their testing community. IE companion leaving or death, light/dark side choices dictating what powers you received, etc. Not sure if that is entirely accurate. Any long time testers around that could shed some light on that?

 

And on the choices not mattering, (I'm leaving out operations as I've only played the first one for each side) while I didn't buy the game I did still play every class up to around 11th (Gunslinger and Marauder up to high 20s) to see what the story was like.  Like the others complaining here I found my choices were almost entirely meaningless. As a dark side jedi or consular I was never in jepardy of getting discovered and thrown out of the order. With the exception of one or two sharp tongued one sentece retorts from my quest gver it was just business as usual. Same on sith side. My warrior could take all light side choices and still be the chosen one. My Imperial Agent could do likewise and still be thought of as the ruthless space pirate the was pretending to be. In all of this the only real effect these choices had was how much or how little affection I received from my companions. At first this did impact how I decided to make my choices. But then sadly I found out those choices turned out to be meaningless as you can just shower them with gifts and buy their loyalty that way.

"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "

  Robsolf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/21/06
Posts: 4013

Let go of my ears, I know what I'm doing!

2/08/12 5:19:53 PM#48
Originally posted by baritone3k
Originally posted by Robsolf
Originally posted by dimmit77

 

Are you being sarcastic or is this an actual proposal ? Banning people from doing quests on a planet based on one quest choice? Damn the SWTOR developers for not thinking that one first . 

I mean it would be so succesfull .... 

 

/facepalm

PS. 

Even better , if you make 3 wrong choices you get to not level at ANY planet. 

ROFL

I remember, for a long time in earlier RPG's that they quite often had false choices.  And what I mean by that is, like you said, acting a certain way pretty much blacklisted you from getting things done, EVEN IN MAIN QUESTLINES!!!

And yep.  It was absurd then(with load and save buttons), and it would be just beyond silly now, in a game where you may have played 80 hours to get to that choice, and there's no reloading your last save.

Instead of following suit with the person who you quoted to a reductio ad absurdum version, check out my actual version of a branching storyline with options.

In my off the cuff version, the choice could shut you off from a portion of the game. It doesn't have to be extreme, but it should change the course of your journey.

Let's say the game gives you 2 or 3 planets to quest on between 20 and 25. You make this choice on one planet (it could even tell you, this will block you from future quests on this planet - like it does when you make the advanced class choice). Either way, you have 1 or 2 other planets to go to with the same level reqs.

If the choice is only available on one of the planets, then this crushing, terrible, debiliatating inability to quest on planet X doesn't even mean you can't pack up with your friends who didn't make the choice and proceed leveling elsewhere.

I am not sure why this would be such a big deal? It would be "dynamic" and influence your story. It would't have to be like losing age or statistics like if a lich touched you in D&D.

 

You choose to be a certain race. You are stuck with it. Permanent (except in WoW you can buy a change). You are stuck with a class and then at level 10 make the IRREVOCABLE decision to choose an advanced class. There are already fundamental decisions that shape your path.

 

Why not have some more dynamic ones as you go?

Well... what Bladestorm said regarding that it REMOVES choice from a game, resulting in less freedom, but also...

Players will generally choose the dialogue and decisions which do NOT cut them off from content.  Which, as in the examples I mentioned, makes those NON-choices and thus limits role and gameplay.  the only way to do it is to create full content for each different option, which I think is what you're getting at.

Different planet options... that WOULD work if you do basically a non-faction character roll in the beginning because you're NOT going to have the resources to have 3 separate advancement paths for each and every class in a game.

So you start off as some neutral Joe who, through his decisions(let's use TOR) gets kicked off of neutral-world and ends up on Korriban training as a Sith.  And so the story branches on.

Thing is though... though I DO like the idea of building my character without a premade beginner story and having that play out through my actions, you're either not going to get any more replayability out of it, or, each playthrough will be much shorter. 

There's only ever a finite amount of content. 

To illustrate my point... say you DID roll your character and enter TOR completely classless, on a neutral world.  Say your actions then led you on the path to a class and everything was set up as it is now, EXCEPT you can choose to go to Dromund Kaas OR your could choose to go to Coruscant.  And so on it went; each time you get to choose between the 2 factions.  Now I'm not saying the content would be EXACTLY the same; it would be made in a way which makes sense for good/evil to be able to do missions there and have it make sense.  But it would STILL be the same amount of content.

Would that offer more replay value than you have now?

What if we were to cut it from 2 sides to 3, adding a nuetral side, which would make each playthrough 2/3 as long.  Would that offer more replay value?  Maybe.  But you're still only getting X hours out of the game til' you've done everything.

See, I LIKE the freedom idea.  But replayability... hmmm... not so sure that would be enhanced by choice.  And I'd hesitate to consider it "dynamic".

  ButeoRegalis

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/02/10
Posts: 388

2/08/12 5:21:10 PM#49
Originally posted by Tardcore Same on sith side. My warrior could take all light side choices and still be the chosen one. My Imperial Agent could do likewise and still be thought of as the ruthless space pirate the was pretending to be.

Worse yet, the dialogs still tell me how the dark side is strong in me, as a Light Side rank V Assassin. That seems like something glaring that could have been fixed with moderate effort. Just change that dialog part accounting for different degrees of light side/dark side characters: full on light/dark, somewhat ls/ds and still undecided.

I do remember a few times where I could choose different ways to accomplish an objective on my IA. Go in and shoot or blow the place up, or... Well, I never tried the other option, but the strong indication in the dialog was that the other choice would have let me finish the mission in a different way. But these choice-of-method missions were few and far between.

I also let the bad guy at the end of my IA's Act 1 get away. During the dialog it was mentioned that my choice would probably have that outcome and that another choice would have resulted in his demise, though it would have also had other bad consequences. I wonder if the bad guy would have made his escape in either case because he is needed later in the plot line, or if I could have really killed him off and now that he is still alive I will run into him again.

Probable reasons for lack of branching :

  • BW would have had to create a lot more content, and a part of it would have been wasted in that you wouldn't get to see it. The more meaningful choices, the more you would have missed.
  • Part of the meaningful choice would have been different rewards, which would have caused a lot of QQing about the lack of fairness. Similar to the manner to how a few patches ago we ended up with Biochem and Slicing being the only intelligent choices, we would have ended up with the perfect path through your story to grab the best rewards. Making a choice means having to live wit the consequences.
  Robsolf

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/21/06
Posts: 4013

Let go of my ears, I know what I'm doing!

2/08/12 5:34:43 PM#50
Originally posted by Tardcore
Originally posted by Laughing-man

They said early on in development that choices you make will have long term effects.

Then later on they recanted saying that they didn't like gameplay choices that made you feel stuck that you couldn't take back later. 

Thats why they went with dark side and light side not having much difference...   Only cosmetic and thats it...

Kinda disapointing.

I've been told that most of the Bioware ideas that didn't make it to launch were changed due to feedback from their testing community. IE companion leaving or death, light/dark side choices dictating what powers you received, etc. Not sure if that is entirely accurate. Any long time testers around that could shed some light on that?

I wasn't there in the beginning but I could take a swipe at it.

By giving someone something of even remotely high significance, OR of taking it away, you are forcing players(thoruhg their nature) to make decisions which grant/preserve that thing, rather than choosing what they want to say.

Say you have X force power and you like it alot, but it's designated light side only.  This would force you to avoid DS decisions to keep from losing it.

"Then just create a DS power which does pretty much the same thing!", someone might say.

Well... then where'd the significance, the consequence of your action go, again?

People will pretty much always gravitate toward doing whatever it is that makes their character as powerful as they can be.  This is why many players will raid/grind/borrow/steal for weeks to get gear that makes them .2% more powerful than they were.

So, by promising anything like that in dialogue options, you're pretty much guiding people to make the "most profitable" dialogue choice, instead of having their character say what they want them to say.

Like I'd said before, this was the way alot of early RPG's did things.  Being a total kiss-ass to NPC's who in turn would often treat you like day-old mop water is what got you the biggest rewards.  Or at best, they'd just cut you off if you were a jerk.

  Isawa

Novice Member

Joined: 6/20/08
Posts: 1066

2/08/12 5:38:31 PM#51

Example Spoiler! I did not bow to a Sith Lord as Imperial Agent, I was given the option again, and I refused again and the bastard killed me. That is right, he shocked me with lightning and I freakin died and had to rez. More annoying than game changing.

  Isawa

Novice Member

Joined: 6/20/08
Posts: 1066

2/08/12 5:43:00 PM#52

Another example, has occurred a few times playing imp and republic. You will be given two choices to do for a quest, you choose to do one and the other is either left out entirely or added as a bonus. Most recently, the other choice was added as a bonus for me.

  Tardcore

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/13/09
Posts: 2370

"A strange game. The only winning move is not to post."

2/08/12 5:53:16 PM#53
Originally posted by Robsolf
Originally posted by Tardcore
Originally posted by Laughing-man

They said early on in development that choices you make will have long term effects.

Then later on they recanted saying that they didn't like gameplay choices that made you feel stuck that you couldn't take back later. 

Thats why they went with dark side and light side not having much difference...   Only cosmetic and thats it...

Kinda disapointing.

I've been told that most of the Bioware ideas that didn't make it to launch were changed due to feedback from their testing community. IE companion leaving or death, light/dark side choices dictating what powers you received, etc. Not sure if that is entirely accurate. Any long time testers around that could shed some light on that?

I wasn't there in the beginning but I could take a swipe at it.

By giving someone something of even remotely high significance, OR of taking it away, you are forcing players(thoruhg their nature) to make decisions which grant/preserve that thing, rather than choosing what they want to say.

Say you have X force power and you like it alot, but it's designated light side only.  This would force you to avoid DS decisions to keep from losing it.

"Then just create a DS power which does pretty much the same thing!", someone might say.

Well... then where'd the significance, the consequence of your action go, again?

People will pretty much always gravitate toward doing whatever it is that makes their character as powerful as they can be.  This is why many players will raid/grind/borrow/steal for weeks to get gear that makes them .2% more powerful than they were.

So, by promising anything like that in dialogue options, you're pretty much guiding people to make the "most profitable" dialogue choice, instead of having their character say what they want them to say.

Like I'd said before, this was the way alot of early RPG's did things.  Being a total kiss-ass to NPC's who in turn would often treat you like day-old mop water is what got you the biggest rewards.  Or at best, they'd just cut you off if you were a jerk.


Well and I can understand that outlook, but really I see it as the players locked themselves into their choices as soon as they picked the blue or red icon at character creation.

"Gypsies, tramps, and thieves, we were called by the Admin of the site . . . "

  baritone3k

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/02/10
Posts: 225

 
OP  2/08/12 6:41:29 PM#54

Well... what Bladestorm said regarding that it REMOVES choice from a game, resulting in less freedom, but also...

Players will generally choose the dialogue and decisions which do NOT cut them off from content.  Which, as in the examples I mentioned, makes those NON-choices and thus limits role and gameplay.  the only way to do it is to create full content for each different option, which I think is what you're getting at.

 

I understand the fear of losing content , but if there was parallel content you would level past some of it any ways.

Why not be able to pull the badass or pariah card and be dismissed or hunted when on  a given planet dueto your actions - not just because plot device x has ordained it?

Another variation that would ADD content would be that by doing it, you unlock the parallel planet. So you get an equal amount of content to go explore that is parallel to the path with similar rewards but reflects a consequence for your disobedience.

I personally would rather say - fuck it. Fuck you, empire. I am a bounty hunter. I do what people pay me to do, and I have decided I would rather make some coin on the colorfull side for a bit, you gray-toned lunatics. So I would wear getting banned from a planet as a badge of honor.

A variation is that I could come back to the planet/never leave it by falsifying my identity. An agent could do that by hacking, a bounty hunter could by killing a guy and assuming his role and the sith could just easily mind trick some people to get back in line. But make it hard and have a consequence.

 

I thought long and hard about betraying in EQ2. I knew what it would mean. I would lose out on my starting area, etc. And it was an irrevocable change. THAT made it cool as hell. "Wow, that wood elf must be a real prick to have betrayed his kind and joined up with us." 

 

It doesn't have to be irrevocable or shut you down forever. But to have it limit your choice would be awesome.

Shit, there should always be enough to do that you don't HAVE to go down the yellowbrick road. Lay in those poppies, gather them up and start a drug cartel in Oz. Fuck going home. Then when you decide to take your earnings and go, then click your heels. Or maybe you never find out about the slippers and clicking so you just save up all your money and buy the wizard's ballon and go home. Whatever. You still get home. It doesn't have to shut you off from endgame or anything.

 

That is content. That is dynamic. That can be fun.

 

It's not for everyone, but it could be cool as hell.

 

Shit, in the way class imbalance works and the overabundance of dps, you are more likely to restrict your options at character creation than by making colorful choices in the game.

Someone please make a good MMO.

  gestalt11

Novice Member

Joined: 5/17/06
Posts: 6165

2/08/12 7:08:46 PM#55

There are actually quite a few dark/light choices which will decide whether or not you fight or don't fight.  There is also a case on Alderaan for the Inquisitor in which if you choose the dark side choice and don't help your imperial contact you actually lose out on a quest and get everyone pissed off at you.

  baritone3k

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/02/10
Posts: 225

 
OP  2/08/12 7:18:03 PM#56
Originally posted by gestalt11

There are actually quite a few dark/light choices which will decide whether or not you fight or don't fight.  There is also a case on Alderaan for the Inquisitor in which if you choose the dark side choice and don't help your imperial contact you actually lose out on a quest and get everyone pissed off at you.

We aren't even close to 20 examples yet, so please feel free to list them individually.

 

We can count the one from Alderaan.

 

Someone please make a good MMO.

  Distopia

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Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15541

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

2/08/12 7:48:39 PM#57

One example would be (I have no idea what class, I assume one of the jedi classes) You have the option to kill or spare a sith, later in the story you see him again and he has returned to the light or some such.

 

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  baritone3k

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/02/10
Posts: 225

 
OP  2/08/12 8:33:48 PM#58
Originally posted by Distopia

One example would be (I have no idea what class, I assume one of the jedi classes) You have the option to kill or spare a sith, later in the story you see him again and he has returned to the light or some such.

 

Praven. Yeah I did that on my Guardian. It is jedi warrior.

 

Basically, you send him to the council from Tattoine in the 20s and then you see him again on Corellia when you line up all the people from your past to take on the bad guys.

Someone please make a good MMO.

  dubyahite

Novice Member

Joined: 1/17/11
Posts: 2506

2/09/12 8:42:27 AM#59
Well there are many people that will show up later and help you if you don't kill them.

There are also many times when someone will show up for revenge or show up to reward you if you kill that same person.


Let's not forget that there are DS/LS choices that completely refuse to do a quest if you pick them.

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  Cavod

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Joined: 11/23/10
Posts: 299

2/09/12 12:44:48 PM#60
Originally posted by Msenge

While that is partially true about GW2 you are forgetting that those events are not a part of the player's personal story in the game.  On top of those event you also have an individual story wherein the player can make meaningful choices.  The most commonly known example of this is when human characters have to choose to save an orphanage or a military hospital from being burned down (there isn't enough time to save both).  If you save the hospital the orphange is then forever burnt down leaving a bunch of sad orphans milling about and vice versa.  How the story branches off after that we don't yet know but seeing the orphange or hospital burnt husk forever afterwards seems to me to be a meaningful effects from the choices you make.

No, I am not forgetting, you completely missed my point.

 

Letting one burn down and saving the other is much like letting Praven die vs turning him to the light side.(as mentioned earlier)  So now, not only does your point miss it's mark, it's simply wrong too.

 

Back on topic, you can also gain more credits from certain dialog options.  It was one of the nice things playing along side a dark character.  You still get your LS points when they win, but you also get the credits they shook out of the NPC.

We really need separate forums for every newly launched game. There can be the anti-<MMO> one and there can be the 'what general discussion should be' one. All the lamenting can happen together where each can find solace in like minded can't-move-on-ers leaving the rest of us to actually move forward and discuss meaningful and relevant topics.

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