Originally posted by BigLuvin

Swtor is the nickelback of MMORPGs.  Theres some good and a lot of bad (for an MMO) but everyone loves to hate it. 

Really?

I would concider SWTOR more like the Coldplay of MMOs

Originally posted by GMan3

Originally posted by DanitaKusor

There are some pretty basic problems with SWTOR

1) No looking for group system, but all the gear worthwhile for your class comes from group quests on the worlds.  On later world it becomes impossible to do most of these group quests even on high population servers.

    LFG tool is coming.  They didn't think it was necessary before, have admitted the mistake and are fixing it.  Funny thing is though, I never have a problem finding a high level group to team with on any of the 5 servers I play on, so not sure what your problem is.

2) PvP is basically stun stun root root root stun unless you are a sage/sorcerer then its still that, but you get to do the stunning and rooting.

    I seldom get stunned or rooted with any of the toons I play, but I guess knowing what powers nullify them helps me.

3) Endgame is your typical grindfest for gear and so boring that even wow's raiding looks good by comparison. Again see the no LFG system so it's impossible to get dungeon group.  3 weeks at 50 as a healing sage on a high population server and I got 1 dungeon group.  That's a fail.

    Here I am sensing a lie.  Other than that, I already addressed this.

4) Lifeless worlds.  Mobs just standing around in pack of 3-8 everywhere even on Tatoonine there are mobs everywhere across the whole world just standing around.  It's supposed to be a desert planet, wtf are these packs of mobs everywhere doing. MMO developers just have to get over the idea that every single corner of a world has to be filled with stuff to kill.

    You do realise that you complain about a lifeless world, then go on to recommend taking even MORE life out of the world?  I will agree that some basic movement / patrolling needs to be added / enhanced.

5) Server queues.  If you get disconnected, straight back into the server queue no matter what you were doing. Disconnected in PvP... sorry you lose all your rewards from that 20mins of play and return to the world dead with a repair cost.

    You complained twice about not enough people playing the game, and now you are complaining about server queues.  So which one is actually the problem?

6) One faction fancied and therefore overpopulated.  This isn't so much an issue on the Australian PvE server, but all the other servers have a Sith overpopulation.

    Faction balance is a problem caused by the players and the developers have almost NO ability to change it except to force people to only play certain classes / factions.

I could go on...

    Please no, do not go on.  So far you have already managed to contradict yourself enough to make yourself look foolish.  Don't make it worse.

Patch 1.2 fixes none of the above.

It is not adding a LFG system.  It's not making endgame more interesting.  It's no fixing any of the hundred or more other things wrong with the game.  All it's doing is adding stuff that should have been in at launch like the legacy system.

      1.2 is a free update to the game, not a paid expansion. Even so, it manages to add a lot more to the game than you normally see going in at one time.  Besides that coulda, woulda, shoulda, but thank god they didn't.  I'm just glad to be playing the game, even with the minor problems I have with certain features than to be still waiting.  So far, they are adding and fixing at a decent pace, so I am happy.    Besides, coulda, woulda 

And you still can't transfer characters from US servers to the Australian ones.

    Now this is a fully legitimate complaint.  A little early to be complaining, but still legitimate and for your sake, I hope they do fix it soon.

    My answers in RED above.

1) It may be coming, but it's taken them 4 months so far with no hints on when it may be coming.  Maybe because I'm not willing to spend an hour sitting in Fleet LFG... which I shouldn't have to do.

2) Sure... No one who actually PvPs would believe that lie.  None of the tools to prevent stuns (e.g. your own stuns, interrupts, whatever) work while you are stunned.

I have litterly been stunned from 100% to death if my trinket ability is on cooldown with no avenue of escape.  Even their resolve system will not work on a stun that is already in effect.

3) Sorry that is true.  I played my sage for 3 weeks at 50 every evening and got 1 flashpoint group (hard-mode false emperor).  I also did a couple of eternity vault runs (2x8 man and 1x16 man).  That was the limit of the 50 pve content I was able to experience in 3 full weeks of playing the game every evening at 50.  And this was on a high population server (Ajunta Pall).

4) You fail to understand.  Mobs standing around in a paddock does not = life in the world.  I found that I was litterly starting to view packs of mobs as just scenary to drive around in my speeder by the time I got to later world because they do nothing but stand there for no reason.  There is no need to have them there at all most of the time they add nothing to the world at all.  This is a problem a lot of MMOs have though, so its not specific to SWTOR, although I think SWTOR takes it to new heights by filling every square inch of every world with enemies even on worlds like Tatooine and Hoth which are supposed to be lifeless deserted worlds.

5) Both.  The worlds are empty (except for the 150-200 people sitting on fleet) but there are queues on the server.  Something doesn't fit there.

Oh and 1.2 isn't a free update to the game.  Anyone still subscribed has paid around $45 for it.  Is it worth that amount of money?

Originally posted by DanitaKusor

Originally posted by GMan3

Originally posted by DanitaKusor

There are some pretty basic problems with SWTOR

1) No looking for group system, but all the gear worthwhile for your class comes from group quests on the worlds.  On later world it becomes impossible to do most of these group quests even on high population servers.

    LFG tool is coming.  They didn't think it was necessary before, have admitted the mistake and are fixing it.  Funny thing is though, I never have a problem finding a high level group to team with on any of the 5 servers I play on, so not sure what your problem is.

2) PvP is basically stun stun root root root stun unless you are a sage/sorcerer then its still that, but you get to do the stunning and rooting.

    I seldom get stunned or rooted with any of the toons I play, but I guess knowing what powers nullify them helps me.

3) Endgame is your typical grindfest for gear and so boring that even wow's raiding looks good by comparison. Again see the no LFG system so it's impossible to get dungeon group.  3 weeks at 50 as a healing sage on a high population server and I got 1 dungeon group.  That's a fail.

    Here I am sensing a lie.  Other than that, I already addressed this.

4) Lifeless worlds.  Mobs just standing around in pack of 3-8 everywhere even on Tatoonine there are mobs everywhere across the whole world just standing around.  It's supposed to be a desert planet, wtf are these packs of mobs everywhere doing. MMO developers just have to get over the idea that every single corner of a world has to be filled with stuff to kill.

    You do realise that you complain about a lifeless world, then go on to recommend taking even MORE life out of the world?  I will agree that some basic movement / patrolling needs to be added / enhanced.

5) Server queues.  If you get disconnected, straight back into the server queue no matter what you were doing. Disconnected in PvP... sorry you lose all your rewards from that 20mins of play and return to the world dead with a repair cost.

    You complained twice about not enough people playing the game, and now you are complaining about server queues.  So which one is actually the problem?

6) One faction fancied and therefore overpopulated.  This isn't so much an issue on the Australian PvE server, but all the other servers have a Sith overpopulation.

    Faction balance is a problem caused by the players and the developers have almost NO ability to change it except to force people to only play certain classes / factions.

I could go on...

    Please no, do not go on.  So far you have already managed to contradict yourself enough to make yourself look foolish.  Don't make it worse.

Patch 1.2 fixes none of the above.

It is not adding a LFG system.  It's not making endgame more interesting.  It's no fixing any of the hundred or more other things wrong with the game.  All it's doing is adding stuff that should have been in at launch like the legacy system.

      1.2 is a free update to the game, not a paid expansion. Even so, it manages to add a lot more to the game than you normally see going in at one time.  Besides that coulda, woulda, shoulda, but thank god they didn't.  I'm just glad to be playing the game, even with the minor problems I have with certain features than to be still waiting.  So far, they are adding and fixing at a decent pace, so I am happy.    Besides, coulda, woulda 

And you still can't transfer characters from US servers to the Australian ones.

    Now this is a fully legitimate complaint.  A little early to be complaining, but still legitimate and for your sake, I hope they do fix it soon.

    My answers in RED above.

1) It may be coming, but it's taken them 4 months so far with no hints on when it may be coming.  Maybe because I'm not willing to spend an hour sitting in Fleet LFG... which I shouldn't have to do.

    So how many MMOs in the last 10 years have released with a LFG tool?  It is not needed, it is a nice thing to have though.

2) Sure... No one who actually PvPs would believe that lie.  None of the tools to prevent stuns (e.g. your own stuns, interrupts, whatever) work while you are stunned.   

I have litterly been stunned from 100% to death if my trinket ability is on cooldown with no avenue of escape.  Even their resolve system will not work on a stun that is already in effect.

    Dozens of hours in PvP playing several classes and so far, never been stun locked. As a matter of fact, this is one of the few games that has features in it to prevent stun locking someone. Now granted, if you are ganged up on AFTER being stunned, you are in a hurt locker.  Last I knew, that was part of PvP.  Sometimes life just isn't fair.  Most of us just get over it after we realise that.   

3) Sorry that is true.  I played my sage for 3 weeks at 50 every evening and got 1 flashpoint group (hard-mode false emperor).  I also did a couple of eternity vault runs (2x8 man and 1x16 man).  That was the limit of the 50 pve content I was able to experience in 3 full weeks of playing the game every evening at 50.  And this was on a high population server (Ajunta Pall).

    Maybe this is where being a part of a GOOD guild helps me out.  On all 5 servers I play on.  Or maybe you are just exxagerating.  Not sure which is more likely.

4) You fail to understand.  Mobs standing around in a paddock does not = life in the world.  I found that I was litterly starting to view packs of mobs as just scenary to drive around in my speeder by the time I got to later world because they do nothing but stand there for no reason.  There is no need to have them there at all most of the time they add nothing to the world at all.  This is a problem a lot of MMOs have though, so its not specific to SWTOR, although I think SWTOR takes it to new heights by filling every square inch of every world with enemies even on worlds like Tatooine and Hoth which are supposed to be lifeless deserted worlds.

    Life standing around IS life, just not what you would prefer.  I admit to hoping that they add some to this part of the game, patrols and such, but I would also hate to see much taken out of Tatooine.

5) Both.  The worlds are empty (except for the 150-200 people sitting on fleet) but there are queues on the server.  Something doesn't fit there.

    See this is where I have a problem with your statements.  I play on US West Coast servers (5 of them as I have said before) and except for the latest hours of the night/morning, I almost never have a hard time getting a group together.  I also never have a problem with server queues.  Ever. 

Oh and 1.2 isn't a free update to the game.  Anyone still subscribed has paid around $45 for it.  Is it worth that amount of money?

    No, you have not paid a dime for 1.2.  This may be hard to understand, but your purchase of the game gave you the access to the game for one month and maybe some goodies depending on what version you bought.  Your subscription money allows you to keep playing the game for a month at a time AND it should cover small things like bug fixes.  A content patch though is not part of your subscription money.  A content patch is the developers investing their profits into expanding the game in an effort to keep people interested.

    As for being worth the price?  I am having fun still, so yes.

    Again, my answers in RED above.

Originally posted by Damon

Well, I am bored with the game for different reasons, but I probably have the same sense of "blah" when it comes to this game.  The content progression was too fast and easy, when playing casually, and then the Hard Mode versions of the Flashpoints are still ridiculously easy.  A couple of friends and I ran one with just 3 of us the other day, and it was just so boring and easy I haven't logged in since.  Smashing the spacebar to get through the Flashpoint dialogue, which I've heard too many times already, is tedious in and of itself.  There just isn't enough Flashpoints or other content in the game.  As polished as the game really is, it's missing more than I thought it would be.  Still, the game was fun and new up to that point.  The upcoming patch is too little to interest me in resubscribing.  I'm sure the game will have some longtime subscribers, though.  Espeically with those who are new to the genre and haven't "been there, done that" as much.

I agree with most of what you say but the problem is that once you finish your class story line and hit lvl 50 the game dies. The high level raid content is paper thin and Illum is a ghost town which leaves only repeating Flash Points and instanced PvP Warzones for gear and to me that is just plain dull.

Really can't understand what a long time subscriber would do in this game. Except playing alts I guess but even then, beside the class story lines, you will be repeating alot of quests so after the third or fourth reroll I can imagine it getting really boring.

EA/Bioware need to wake up and realise that they need to add some longetivity to this game because having rerolling alts as the only viable long therm playabibility is just not enough.

With the past 2 days messups get ready for the game to be even more emptier soon. First they basically tell customers we're sorry we took out a core feature from 1.2 just hours before the release of the patch, it ticks people off because rated bg's was what most pvp'ers were looking forward too.

Then they panick because a lot of people were cancelling subs and threatening to, so they announce those valuable customers with level 50's get 30 free days of playtime, totally ticking off those that have been paying since early access that don't have 50's yet...so today they will prob fix it so all of paying customers get the 30 days to calm those people down. Then they have a patch today the 13th that breaks the new patch and they have to take the servers down again for hours more and give all customers a day of playtime.  The desperation is strong with BW the past few days.

It's kinda sad watching the ship go down with not enough lifeboats aboard. SWTOR is truly what people are calling it, Tortanic. Glad I unsubbed 2 months ago, lol.

Bioware is good at putting bugs in the game as of 1.2 at least there good at somthing.

 I dont really get all this hate. Surely, it plays like 2004 mmo, just slightly worse version and less polished, and has graphics like 2007 game, but still... it has a story! 

seriously now, it IS fun to play it once, just like you would any other non-mmo game, because it does have a story. And even then, it gives you much much more compared to usual 30-60hrs you get from other solo games. So with all that in mind, if you were going to buy some other game which would last you for 30ish hours, this one is actually quite nice investment, even if you abandon it after just a month.

Now if we compare it to other mmos, that would be another story, as it really does lack quite a few things here and there :/

My biggest grip with this game, from day one, was how they never, ever tried to make something at least slightly different, and they never tried to hide it. But if youre going to make a blatant copy of another (8 yrs old) game, at least do it right, so you dont end up with 200m worth, worse version of an 8 years older game. 

I don't get the hate either....except that we are reading it here. Makes sense now. Get over it people, some games aren't what you thought they would be.

Stop talking about it and do something....jeez

It's not hate, it's just sad. The game had been hyped up so much and fell flat on its face. Like someone else said previously, if you're going to copy a 2004 game at least do it right. BW couldn't even get core features in for release. It's just sad to see so much money go down the drain on a p***poor game. BW's ego's didn't help either, if anything it help sink them faster.

Originally posted by Tayah

It's not hate, it's just sad. 

No...it's hate.  When I dont' like a game, I move on to one I do like.   Period.  Doesn't seem to be the case for people that spend half their days griping about this game when they don't even play it.  Maybe it angers them that the game has been very successful financially so far, despite not being particularly innovative?  Maybe it angers them that people are still paying money for a WoW-clone when it flies in the face of all the conventional "wisdom" on this board that nobody cares for that kind of game anymore?  I don't know exactly what it is, but this game inspires hate from so many.  

Originally posted by Cthulhu23

Originally posted by Tayah

It's not hate, it's just sad. 

No...it's hate.  When I dont' like a game, I move on to one I do like.   Period.  Doesn't seem to be the case for people that spend half their days griping about this game when they don't even play it.  Maybe it angers them that the game has been very successful financially so far, despite not being particularly innovative?  Maybe it angers them that people are still paying money for a WoW-clone when it flies in the face of all the conventional "wisdom" on this board that nobody cares for that kind of game anymore?  I don't know exactly what it is, but this game inspires hate from so many.   

I think people misinterpret it as hate. It's not hate, it's disappointment. I hope every mmo will do well when looking forward to it coming out and while playing it, heck even if it fails, I hope it can gimp back. You know why? It's a win win for us all playing mmos. It forces game companies to compete and do well for customers.  

SWTOR has most likely failed for someone looking for MMO to play for next several years.

However, I would recommend it as a single player RPG for a month or two.

Buy the game, play Imperial Agent to 50, reroll Jedi Knight, play him to 50 and do some PVP on the side while leveling those classes.

That's about it. Don't take this game as long term MMO and you'll feel much better.

Originally posted by DeniZg

SWTOR has most likely failed for someone looking for MMO to play for next several years.

However, I would recommend it as a single player RPG for a month or two.

Buy the game, play Imperial Agent to 50, reroll Jedi Knight, play him to 50 and do some PVP on the side while leveling those classes.

That's about it. Don't take this game as long term MMO and you'll feel much better.

Ya I completely disagree with said statement. If you're looking for a single player RPG do Mass Effect  or Dragon Age(1 not 2). TOR is so utterly boring as a single RPG because unlike ME OR DA your decisions mean nothing, your not the center of the story, your not 'unique' but what you are is on rails until 50 then the real pain starts, sitting in the city hub waiting..and waiting.  Do crafting, PvP BG's, Flashpoints ect some will say to that I say it's all done much better in other games. I had full BM and 2million credits and still bored to tears because this DOES NOT feel like Star Wars. It feel like a complete plagarism of WoW done with lightsabers, outsourced art to India or China and a horrible engine that can't handle modern PvP.