I has become interesting to me that so many people have compared SWTOR to WOW and said that Bioware is completely fail because it doesn't have a recount system in the game for players who raid.

I absolutely understand that Blizzard's game has this due to their reliance on the use of Addons in their game.  (Don't think for a minute that Blizzard doesn't rely on addons for their game.)  When you look at a bare bones stock UI though Bioware isn't missing many things in relation to Blizzard.  World of Warcrafts UI without the use of any addons is pretty lazy as well.  I can't think of many games that have actually done their UI very well.  I would say the best so far has been RIFT.

Anyway what do you guys think?  I'm not talking about opening the game to mods, but does SWTOR NEED the recount feature as long as they don't allow the use of addons/mods?

***I will probably throw some of your answers up on my site because i'm covering this topic today and tomorrow.  Hopefully this isnt' against any of the sites TOS, I enjoy getting people to talk about subjects like this and MMORPG has a great community to do that. 

[mod edit - a single link will suffice. thanks!]

No, they haven't failed. I hope they never have the ability to run a recount type of mod in the game.

** edit **
It's not just about having mods either. The game should not be about maximum damage output (or maximum healing output). Adding a recount type of functionality would shift the focus of the game towards micromanaging damage output.

What's recount? Is it some kind of DPS meter?

I agree with lizard. Only thing recount does is further seperate the communities and the raiding guilds are already barely more tolerable than inmates in general.

Personally I think add-ons like recount and gearscore ruined WoW, so no I don't think Bioware should have included them in SWTOR. I hate everything that these add-ons represent and the mentality of elitism that they create. If you ask me, games are better off without them.

I think this is less about the specific recount mod and more about having a UI that allows for user modification.

Personally...I loved WoW's modability and community created mods like Auctioneer.  I wish all MMORPGs had as many user created mods as WoW has.

I personally agree with you guys.   I think that if someone isn't "pulling their weight" a good raid/ops leader should be able to recognize that on their own.  Recount does bring on a certain amount of eliteism that I don't care for much.

On the other hand I can understand a hardcore players demand for it.

Originally posted by Creslin321

I think this is less about the specific recount mod and more about having a UI that allows for user modification.

Personally...I loved WoW's modability and community created mods like Auctioneer.  I wish all MMORPGs had as many user created mods as WoW has.

The new UI customization that they showed off is going to blow WOW out of the water.  The coolest part is that they are making it a part of the game and not an additional mod download--which means it will never be broken after a patch.

If you're going to put silly enrage timers in your encounters, then people will demand damage meters.

I'm sure the real reason behind not having a damage log is due to how unbalanced the classes are though.

The more they hide the mechanics behind the game the better.

I only want to be bothered with mechanics when I level or change the specc, the rest of the time it just kills my immersion (Lokes buzzword of the day).

The most incompetent players will be sorted out anyways.

Originally posted by Alders

If you're going to put silly enrage timers in your encounters, then people will demand damage meters.

I'm sure the real reason behind not having a damage log is due to how unbalanced the classes are though.

I dont know that what youre saying is really the case.  Before the game they didn't know what features would have the most demand.  While recount seems a bit silly to some to have left out you have to remember that if it was so integral to the success of an MMO Blizzard would have had it in WOW 7 years ago. 

So I see your point but I don't know that they are trying to hide class imbalance by not having it in.  I think they just didn't find it to be somthing that was important--at least not at launch.

To each their own opinion though.  TY for your feedback. 

Originally posted by dollada06

Originally posted by Alders

If you're going to put silly enrage timers in your encounters, then people will demand damage meters.

I'm sure the real reason behind not having a damage log is due to how unbalanced the classes are though.

I dont know that what youre saying is really the case.  Before the game they didn't know what features would have the most demand.  While recount seems a bit silly to some to have left out you have to remember that if it was so integral to the success of an MMO Blizzard would have had it in WOW 7 years ago. 

Considering BW didn't think item linking was something people really wanted, i wouldn't be surprised. Having a guildie that works for them and hearing stuff like that made me facepalm. You may be right.

It's possible to play wow without any addons (I did so for long time and I was a tank). SWTOR UI is missing one big thing for tanking and that's target-of-target which wow does have. WOW mods aren't so rellevant for gameplay itself but it helps and it makes your life easier alot. Mods in wow allow you to customize your UI as you wish and set it up as you want it, I know it's not perfect but atleast you have that option. SWTOR misses it, all you can do is change the position of your raid icons and chat which is kinda irrelevant tbh. 

To conclude, it would be good to add some of the options to make your life as a tank or dps easier not to overaggro or something like that and even adding the ToT system because it's really hard to tank without it. But adding mods to micromanage every single thing in the game is just stupid and ruins the game. Tbh, gearscore ruined the game for me. Also other parts of recount like DPS output was sucky and always hated it. 

Is OP trying to say all games should come out with a Dps meter???

NO THANK YOU.

Of all the things missing or launched subpar with this game can't say recount made it on my list. Would it be nice? Sure for those that care.

For me? I simply don't.

Think I read somewhere  they're adding this in anyways. For personal use I believe, not something that some schmuck can spam chat with people's numbers after every fight.

Originally posted by Zzad

Is OP trying to say all games should come out with a Dps meter???

NO THANK YOU.

I rather like the idea of playing the game instead of a numbers game.

I suppose I can see having a combat log but not an in game running meter like recount.

Heck no, that is far from the big issues this game has going for it.

Originally posted by dollada06

I has become interesting to me that so many people have compared SWTOR to WOW and said that Bioware is completely fail because it doesn't have a recount system in the game for players who raid.

I absolutely understand that Blizzard's game has this due to their reliance on the use of Addons in their game.  (Don't think for a minute that Blizzard doesn't rely on addons for their game.)  When you look at a bare bones stock UI though Bioware isn't missing many things in relation to Blizzard.  World of Warcrafts UI without the use of any addons is pretty lazy as well.  I can't think of many games that have actually done their UI very well.  I would say the best so far has been RIFT.

Anyway what do you guys think?  I'm not talking about opening the game to mods, but does SWTOR NEED the recount feature as long as they don't allow the use of addons/mods?

 

***I will probably throw some of your answers up on my site because i'm covering this topic today and tomorrow.  Hopefully this isnt' against any of the sites TOS, I enjoy getting people to talk about subjects like this and MMORPG has a great community to do that. 

The problem with DPS meters, is that they don't really tell you as much as you might think. Most players are too busy looking at how hardcore they are, being at the top of the meter, to realize they've pulled agro, and wiped the group, then they usually blame the healer for not healing them, or the tank for not holding agro, but it's definately not their fault.... they had the best DPS, how could it be their fault? Less info=better players. 

Originally posted by Anubisan

Personally I think add-ons like recount and gearscore ruined WoW, so no I don't think Bioware should have included them in SWTOR. I hate everything that these add-ons represent and the mentality of elitism that they create. If you ask me, games are better off without them.

Completely agree with you on this with the exception of one major point. These addons were not the disease but the symptom of change of focus of core Wow game play mechanics by the wow devs themselves. Ghostcrawler and crew "ruined" Wow, the annoying add-ons just reflect the switch to e-sport gaming.

As to the OPs SWTOR question, no I do not think Bioware failed by not allowing or adding these pointless digital e-peen stroking devices. I'd much rather see them focus their energy creating more content for raiders to enjoy rather than waste it making crap for the kewl kids crowd to flagellate themselves with in a frenzy of self-backpatting.