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Atlantica Online General Article: Solving the Double Monk Issue II
MMORPG.com Atlantica Online Correspondent Andrew Corpuz writes this look at the issue surrounding the double Monk issue in Atlantica Online and gives some possible solutions.
By Andrew Corpuz on August 31, 2009
In part one, we discussed decreasing Double Monk Formation (DMF) Prevalence by increasing the relevance of Dispel Scrolls & Guard Dispel. In part two, we'll continue finding sophisticated strategies to decreasing DMF while trying not to harm SMF by focusing on ideas that modify HG, Awakening, and overall PvP balance.
Category B: Modifying the Monk's Skills
This category focuses on modifying the monk's seemingly overpowered skills.
1) Create a Penalty for Holy Guard; turn Heal into a DoT or Debuff
Summary: Recently in Korea, the heal from Holy Guard has been reduced. However, this has had little effect on double monk strategy. The real benefit of Holy Guard isn't its heal; it's the protection from magic. Currently, players almost automatically Holy Guard their front-line to protect from an opponent's Viking's Freezing Axe / Ice Ridge. This, of course, isn't the case if the opponent has no Viking or if the player is under greater pressure such as stun, however, if Holy Guard's heal is turned into a DoT or debuff, players will have to wonder whether or not the protection from magic is worth the Dot or Debuff sacrifice.
Pros:
- If the debuff isn't too strong, this can enhance strategic thinking
- A DMF will be unwilling to have two or more rows under HG, especially if they have no healers
Cons:
- Holy Guard's negative effects may be too confusing to deal with that many will opt out of Holy Guard altogether, decreasing both DMF and SMF
- An opposing player may simply scare an opponent into using Holy Guard without actually ever having to use skills; this may give magic-heavy builds too much of an advantage
Suggestion Rating: B
)
2) Create a Penalty for Holy Guard; AP Drain or Paralysis
Summary: Similar to Suggestion 1), decreasing the ability to act for those mercenaries under HG will make players re-think HG use. Additionally, mercenaries that are the most susceptible to magic
Skills are most usually the most adept to deal with physical attack; for example, a Melee tank under HG is likely to receive relatively little damage, especially if he guards.
Take away the ability to guard, and damage to a mercenary under HG increases significantly.
Pros:
- Decreases DMF turtling significantly
Cons:
- -May increase use of high AP cost skills or powerful near death skills such as Deadly Shot
Suggestion Rating: A
3) Increase the Duration of Holy Guard
Summary: One of the negative effects of Holy Guard is the inability to heal a mercenary while under HG. As of now, the only build types that can truly take advantage of this are snipe builds, which can kill one mercenary under HG before they ever get a chance to receive a heal (which explains the rise of the Bow main). Increasing the duration of Holy Guard will prevent mercenaries from receiving heals for a longer period of time, giving the opponent more time to kill off mercenaries.
Pros:
- Turtling would decrease significantly
- HG use on staff and other mercenaries who may die quickly would decrease
- Favors snipe builds with Silence skill to an even greater degree
- Since a single HG would basically draw in focus fire to a mercenary in that row, this may not affect DMF much more than SMF
Suggestion Rating: B
4) Reduce the heal or target range on Awakening
Summary: Another function of the monk is to reduce stun counters with the skill, Awakening. With Awakening comes an added bonus - a heal. While many have suggested nerfing the heal on Awakening, they seem to forget that the heal is already small.
Pros:
- Awakening could no longer be used as a heal
- A monk not stunned wouldn't be able to cure much stun with a smaller awakening range
Cons:
- Monk loses some functionality, decreasing strategic application
- Stun builds would increase, and may actually encourage use of DMF
Suggestion Rating: D
)
5) Nerf the Passives
Summary: Monk's passive skills do a very good job of protecting the main, but have no direct effect on how the other eight mercenaries are protected. A few individuals have suggested this idea.
Pros:
- Levels the playing field for those who don't use monk
- Greatly punishes those who frontline their mains late in battle
Cons:
- Favors snipe and deadly strike/shot builds to an even greater degree
- Degrades monk utility and build strategy significantly
Suggestion Rating: F
Category C: Decrease Need for Monk's Skills
This category focuses on suggestions that affect the need to use the monk's skills. By decreasing magic power or stun power, which are nullified by Holy Guard and Awakening respectively, one may hope DMF would decrease. Though many people have suggested these ideas, they usually do it out of their own formation's inability to deal with magic or stun, rather than looking at the entire picture.
1) PvP Stat Balancing - Decrease Magic Power
Summary: When AoE builds were king, many felt these builds required little thought to become effective. Just spam your AoE and win. When physical damage returned, AoE builds declined. In part due to high prevalence of DMF, the current strength of magic skills is no longer the damage they inflict, but rather the ability to control or limit the actions the opponent takes.
Pros:
- More builds may be willing to forgo use of a monk since the strength of certain skills won't be as threatening
Cons:
- May have little effect on DMF use
- Hurts formation variety as a whole, possibly significantly harming mains that depend on magic
Suggestion Rating: D
)
2) PvP Stat Balancing - Decrease Stun Power
Summary: Almost every successful Division 1 Free League build has an ample amount of Gun and Cannon mercenaries whose primary purpose is to inflict stun. Additionally, Gun mercenaries are extremely efficient at scroll canceling, which makes it even more difficult to relieve stun. If the required amount of stun counters required to inflict stun was increased, the viability of applying stun pressure in a build that isn't primarily focused around stun would decrease, thus decreasing the need to use Awakening.
Pros:
- May increase formation variety
Cons:
- Dramatic effect on current core mechanics
- May have little effect on DMF use, DMFs continuing to focus on Holy Guard
Suggestion Rating: D
3) Modify skills that almost require a monk or two
Summary: Many skills almost require the opponent to have a monk to use HG. DMF makes mercenaries such as the Witch and Elementalist, (as well as mains such as the Musician,) almost useless in terms of damage output. However, if some of the skills of these mercenaries (and mains) became innately less threatening or were modified greatly, many speculate there would be less need to have DMF. For example, if the Elementalist's skills were to miss more often or were less damaging, more players would be willing to risk omission of a monk or two for a melee mercenary. To compensate for less powerful skills, the affected mercenaries would have to receive some other benefit, such as a new skill or a stat buff.
Pros:
- Reduces need for monk altogether
- May increase formation variety
Cons:
- May greatly affect current PvP stability; changes core mechanics
- Too risky, greatly affecting mercenaries' utility and presence
Suggestion Rating: Variable
)
What are your ratings for each suggestion? How can each of these suggestions be improved further? Discuss in the comment section below!
To stop DMFs simply give "every class" a dispell "action". Sort of how everyone can "Search All". Make it not count as part of the total spells you can learn. You dont get enough slots as it is and most people dont waste a spell slot on dispell because not everyone uses DMF or hell sometimes even a monk in a formation period.
Have the dispell "action" cost 150 or even 200 AP. Not something you would really throw around. Make it usable only every 2 or 3 turns. But at least this way everyone can nullify this strategy equally. I think nerfing the skill in any way is not the answer but simply giving everyone else more counters instead of just the melee classes.
Very typical of many MMO's they dream up spells, but forget to provide counters to them. And then they wonder why players complain about the pvp. Sadly this pervades the genre.
I have to agree, MMO dev's need to "Make" additional features to counter the current issue, not NERF the damn issue itself. Give players a way to counter it.
Even Square-Enix on ffxi has made the mistake of Nerfing jobs and each time 1 out of 4 or 5 of my friends quit right after. Even the hardcore 3 4 5 year players..... it wasn't until the 6th year S-E finally figured out to stop nerfing players classes and give the gimpier classes boosts instead......
Giving other jobs ways to counter it may be a nerf in the end, but not up front in view because it is still possible for them to do it if the other player is bad and/or just don't know about it. When the other players learn about it, it will become something fun for them instead of something that pisses current players off.
Don't nerf.....give others a counter...... traditional developer mmo mistake if this is done.......
I mean the debuff sounds good but what if you give other players a spell that "turns" HG into a debuff instead of just making HG a debuff itself? that way it is technically not a nerf either just a counter....
You have to let current players have the option of doing what they do at least once in a while, thats what it comes down to.
If you add a new spell that turns into a debuff current players will view it as "ah more competition for us now" instead of "gdi i wasted all this time and money on monk dmg blah blah and now its all completely useless" by going the nerfing route There go they end up quitting.
3) Increase the Duration of Holy Guard
I just wanted to point out that this is a very bad idea. Increasing the duration would mean that if you HG, the mercenaries that you cast it on will just get stunned before the HG expires.
Some of your options are very good points, though. This was definitely a good read.
DMF DMF yawn..maybe it's because free leauge is so stupid to begin with that I don't care...lol FL in Atlantica is so rediculous I have never thought the DMF mattered anyway. The fact that FL PVP is totally in the hands of the computer for the most part makes the whole argument rediculous...it randomly chooses between the two players as to who is gonna get uber stunned, then it adds a random choice of who is gonna get Nike's Spellbook or Dark Forces cast on them by the computer AI and THAT is the issue that decides almost every FL battle. Now if they took out the random spells and let players face of against one another on their own talent it would be different. Countless times I've seen myself or the opponent fall to these spells and in the end IT decides the winner, not the talent of me or my opponent. How the hell is that PVP? It's actually PVP-V-AI.
As long as any nerfs or further retarded moves by the banana squad at NDoors (AKA the developers) is kept soley in FL and does not effect the rest of the game then 95% of the players won't care (As that is about the accurate percentage of those who do FL ONLY because they are forced to, to be able to enter most high lvl dungeons). As to the whiners about the DMF, well, get one yourself then or pressure NDoors into making more d-mercs, perhaps some with abilities that make the Monk not quite as attractive or essential. So far they have only introduced B mercs (90+% of players cant get them and never will) and another c-merc (only for lvls 112 and over which is a laugh in itself). Messing with the Monk isn't gonna solve the problem, as the problem is lack of choices for mid-range average players NOT the DMF....the DMF works, and so most average mid-range players use it because there are no other choices if they want to compete with the 5% who can get the B mercs and the lvl 112 HaWrang.