Originally posted by Gruug

Originally posted by gurugeorge

Originally posted by Gruug

I wouldn't go back to CO UNLESS I paid for the privledge. By that I mean that having made several characters and having more then on at or near level cap, I would not be willing to give that up for the so-called "f2P" model. I would much rather pay a subscritption or purchase the LTS. However, I am already involved in three MMO's and don't see me laying down any more cash for another at the moment. CO to me was a pretty good game. I just have never been that much into comic books or any of the comic types characters. I my case, when I played CO, it was just a waypoint on the way to a game I was more interested in but had not been published yet. Still, CO is a good game and I recommend it to those that do like comics and/or action oriented games....IF you are going to pay. If you don't pay just remember, YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.

You get a game with enough content to level from 1-40 FOR FREE, playing an archetype toon that's basically analogous to the class-based toons in other MMOs.

Granted, the content is only just enough for 1-40 and there's little in the way of alternative levelling paths.  But that's still a pretty decent free offering, IMHO.  That's a fair amount of fun for the cost of nothing, if the gameplay clicks with you.

 My comments have nothing to do with "content". My comments were based upon my former characters I created and the reasons I would not wish to convert them to the so-called "f2p" model. For I what you CAN GET by paying, it is a much more satifying experience then if you simply attempt to "play for free". Again, this has nothing to do with content.

I was addressing that by "analogous to class-based toons in other MMOs", i.e. what you get for free with CO, in terms of build systems, isn't noticeably of less value than what you'd pay for in an average MMO (i.e. the ATs, which amount to a fairly normal "class-based" build system) - plus you get sufficient content to level along with that.  

I'd agree that the Freeform system is cool, and worth subscribing for too, but it's like something extra - the build system actually a bit more interesting than the average MMO in many ways. Whereas what you get for free is about comparable. (So the relevance of content: content is really what let CO down compared to other MMOs, because on other levels of comparison it comes out pretty well.)

Why should Cryptic give former subscribers freeform characters? Former subscribers are the people who left the game and quit paying for it. There's no mystery as to why they chose the Pay Options they did. It's the only thing they could possibly charge for. There's also no mystery about what's free and what's not. It's all on the website.

Cryptic did one of the few smart things they've done with any of their games with the F2P transition. People certainly have the privilege to whine if they want to, but Cryptic hasn't done anything in their F2P transition to deserver it.

Originally posted by gurugeorge

Originally posted by Gruug

Originally posted by gurugeorge

Originally posted by Gruug

I wouldn't go back to CO UNLESS I paid for the privledge. By that I mean that having made several characters and having more then on at or near level cap, I would not be willing to give that up for the so-called "f2P" model. I would much rather pay a subscritption or purchase the LTS. However, I am already involved in three MMO's and don't see me laying down any more cash for another at the moment. CO to me was a pretty good game. I just have never been that much into comic books or any of the comic types characters. I my case, when I played CO, it was just a waypoint on the way to a game I was more interested in but had not been published yet. Still, CO is a good game and I recommend it to those that do like comics and/or action oriented games....IF you are going to pay. If you don't pay just remember, YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.

You get a game with enough content to level from 1-40 FOR FREE, playing an archetype toon that's basically analogous to the class-based toons in other MMOs.

Granted, the content is only just enough for 1-40 and there's little in the way of alternative levelling paths.  But that's still a pretty decent free offering, IMHO.  That's a fair amount of fun for the cost of nothing, if the gameplay clicks with you.

 My comments have nothing to do with "content". My comments were based upon my former characters I created and the reasons I would not wish to convert them to the so-called "f2p" model. For I what you CAN GET by paying, it is a much more satifying experience then if you simply attempt to "play for free". Again, this has nothing to do with content.

I was addressing that by "analogous to class-based toons in other MMOs", i.e. what you get for free with CO, in terms of build systems, isn't noticeably of less value than what you'd pay for in an average MMO (i.e. the ATs, which amount to a fairly normal "class-based" build system) - plus you get sufficient content to level along with that.  

I'd agree that the Freeform system is cool, and worth subscribing for too, but it's like something extra - the build system actually a bit more interesting than the average MMO in many ways. Whereas what you get for free is about comparable. (So the relevance of content: content is really what let CO down compared to other MMOs, because on other levels of comparison it comes out pretty well.)

 That is my point, I would not wish to play CO with characters that are simply "class based" cookie cutter characters. What makes CO unique is that amount of variation that can go into those free-form characters. FOR ME, it is the free-form that makes the game fun. Yes, you can play with cookie cutter characters....but it just is not as much fun. Therefore, TO ME, I would not play CO under the current so-called "f2p" model. Again, if I were to pay for a subscription or pay for the ability to make all my characters not free-form, I would do that....if I were able to go back CO. But then again, if I did that then my game would no longer be "f2p".

Originally posted by gurugeorge

Originally posted by vesavius

Originally posted by Wildbeard

Originally posted by bryan58

beggars can't be choosers unfortunately... and you didnt have to convert your character to silver.... I played for a couple weeks after launch then stopped... I just started with the f2p and made a new toon.. i love it.. it's free... really what DO you want from a FREE to play game.. they want you to pay the 15 bucks a month.. if it upsets you that much then pay 15 bucks and recreate your old character... and im pretty certain that it gives you a screen saying.. ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO CONVERT THIS CHARACTER TO SILVER, YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO GO BACK... i know it does.. i almost converted my old toon

i just find it quite stupid that it went free to play , yet i cant play my characters unless i pay.

 I actually agree. I was DLing while reading about it, just to look, but then i read this fact. I cancelled it.

You would think the fact that they obviously bought the box would be enough to let old customers play the characters they have already created on silver. It definitely would have bought them in some customer good will and respect from their old player base returning to give their product another go.

Instead they create this bad taste right at the start... way to go :/

Apply the new system to new characters, sure, but c'mon.. these people ahve already spent money on your game.

Do they actually give customers who have bought the box previously any bonuses at all?

Come on, surely you didn't love ALL your old toons equally?

hehe thats really not the point I am making though right? ;)

The point is I paid for their box and made those characters while subbing. In other words, i have paid already.

To be treated the same as a new player that DLs the client for free makes no recognition of the fact that I bought the box, so that money was just wasted (from my perspective) because they are now giving it away. Now, I don't mind that per say... but it would have bee a nice gesture to give us something back in recognition of the fact that we have paid in to the game already.

I am just saying that crypic could use the good will right now from a lot of ex players and blocking them off from their old characters wasnt the way to start. 

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Originally posted by vesavius

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Originally posted by gurugeorge

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Originally posted by vesavius

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Originally posted by Wildbeard

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Originally posted by bryan58
beggars can't be choosers unfortunately... and you didnt have to convert your character to silver.... I played for a couple weeks after launch then stopped... I just started with the f2p and made a new toon.. i love it.. it's free... really what DO you want from a FREE to play game.. they want you to pay the 15 bucks a month.. if it upsets you that much then pay 15 bucks and recreate your old character... and im pretty certain that it gives you a screen saying.. ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO CONVERT THIS CHARACTER TO SILVER, YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO GO BACK... i know it does.. i almost converted my old toon

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i just find it quite stupid that it went free to play , yet i cant play my characters unless i pay.

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 I actually agree. I was DLing while reading about it, just to look, but then i read this fact. I cancelled it.
You would think the fact that they obviously bought the box would be enough to let old customers play the characters they have already created on silver. It definitely would have bought them in some customer good will and respect from their old player base returning to give their product another go.
Instead they create this bad taste right at the start... way to go :/
Apply the new system to new characters, sure, but c'mon.. these people ahve already spent money on your game.
Do they actually give customers who have bought the box previously any bonuses at all?

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Come on, surely you didn't love ALL your old toons equally?
hehe thats really not the point I am making though right? ;)
The point is I paid for their box and made those characters while subbing. In other words, i have paid already.
To be treated the same as a new player that DLs the client for free makes no recognition of the fact that I bought the box, so that money was just wasted (from my perspective) because they are now giving it away. Now, I don't mind that per say... but it would have bee a nice gesture to give us something back in recognition of the fact that we have paid in to the game already.
I am just saying that crypic could use the good will right now from a lot of ex players and blocking them off from their old characters wasnt the way to start. 

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hopefully they will add an option to the store to allow a chosen character(s) to have an open open framework. From the feedback they are getting they would be stupid not to do it.

I started downloading Champions again until I found out that I would not be able to create my character the way I want.  I immediately canceled the download and never looked back.  Being able to create your hero the way you want was the best feature of that game.  If they don't want to recognize that, and make that part of the free-to-play model, they won't get as many people joining. 

Successful F2P games make their best features, and core gameplay accessible to free players.  They add other things to encourage you to spend money on the game.  At the very least, the best features are partially accessible by F2P players.  Since they couldn't do that, Champions lost my dollar, again.

Originally posted by lizardbones

 

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Originally posted by vesavius

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Originally posted by gurugeorge

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Originally posted by vesavius

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Originally posted by Wildbeard

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Originally posted by bryan58
beggars can't be choosers unfortunately... and you didnt have to convert your character to silver.... I played for a couple weeks after launch then stopped... I just started with the f2p and made a new toon.. i love it.. it's free... really what DO you want from a FREE to play game.. they want you to pay the 15 bucks a month.. if it upsets you that much then pay 15 bucks and recreate your old character... and im pretty certain that it gives you a screen saying.. ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO CONVERT THIS CHARACTER TO SILVER, YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO GO BACK... i know it does.. i almost converted my old toon

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i just find it quite stupid that it went free to play , yet i cant play my characters unless i pay.

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 I actually agree. I was DLing while reading about it, just to look, but then i read this fact. I cancelled it.
You would think the fact that they obviously bought the box would be enough to let old customers play the characters they have already created on silver. It definitely would have bought them in some customer good will and respect from their old player base returning to give their product another go.
Instead they create this bad taste right at the start... way to go :/
Apply the new system to new characters, sure, but c'mon.. these people ahve already spent money on your game.
Do they actually give customers who have bought the box previously any bonuses at all?

---

Come on, surely you didn't love ALL your old toons equally?
hehe thats really not the point I am making though right? ;)
The point is I paid for their box and made those characters while subbing. In other words, i have paid already.
To be treated the same as a new player that DLs the client for free makes no recognition of the fact that I bought the box, so that money was just wasted (from my perspective) because they are now giving it away. Now, I don't mind that per say... but it would have bee a nice gesture to give us something back in recognition of the fact that we have paid in to the game already.
I am just saying that crypic could use the good will right now from a lot of ex players and blocking them off from their old characters wasnt the way to start. 

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All the old players who stopped paying for the game?

Yes, all those that quit that I would assume that Crytpic want to come back.

All the ones who quit?

Yes, the ones that quit, after buying the box and funding the game for ongoing development, allowing it to survive even to this stage.

They'd be much better off getting good will from new players.

I very much doubt that Cryptic would say no to anyone who played the game before resubbing. In fact I am sure they would be glad to have our money, hence that it would have been in their interest to generate our good will.

And please, don't try to insult other forum users, we are just just talking about games :)

Originally posted by vesavius

Originally posted by gurugeorge

Originally posted by vesavius

Originally posted by Wildbeard

Originally posted by bryan58

beggars can't be choosers unfortunately... and you didnt have to convert your character to silver.... I played for a couple weeks after launch then stopped... I just started with the f2p and made a new toon.. i love it.. it's free... really what DO you want from a FREE to play game.. they want you to pay the 15 bucks a month.. if it upsets you that much then pay 15 bucks and recreate your old character... and im pretty certain that it gives you a screen saying.. ARE YOU SURE YOU WANT TO CONVERT THIS CHARACTER TO SILVER, YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO GO BACK... i know it does.. i almost converted my old toon

i just find it quite stupid that it went free to play , yet i cant play my characters unless i pay.

 I actually agree. I was DLing while reading about it, just to look, but then i read this fact. I cancelled it.

You would think the fact that they obviously bought the box would be enough to let old customers play the characters they have already created on silver. It definitely would have bought them in some customer good will and respect from their old player base returning to give their product another go.

Instead they create this bad taste right at the start... way to go :/

Apply the new system to new characters, sure, but c'mon.. these people ahve already spent money on your game.

Do they actually give customers who have bought the box previously any bonuses at all?

Come on, surely you didn't love ALL your old toons equally?

hehe thats really not the point I am making though right? ;)

The point is I paid for their box and made those characters while subbing. In other words, i have paid already.

Well yeah, you've paid already and you had x amount of fun for your money.  Why should you get exactly the gameplay you had before - but now for nothing?

I can understand the "courtesy" argument, and agree maybe one or two old toons for previous subscibers should have been allowed to keep Freeform.

Either that or give pre-f2p-ex-subscribers an extra slot or two over and above whatever they had before (if their slots were filled up), so they can immediately jump in and make an AT to play with, without having to worry about what old toon to sacrifice or convert.

But it would be really going too far to expect Cryptic to let you play nonchalantly as if you were still a subscriber, while not being a subscriber anymore.

Anyway, for my not-money, the game is still decent fun even while playing an AT.  It's not quite as good as Freeform and the in-depth beard-stroking one can get into with the cool build system, but it's still enjoyable for a blast now and then, and one might even say there are advantages to not having to think about build too much, and being more interdependent with other toons for teaming, so far as ATs are concerned. 

And playing the game again is making me think of subbing again for that Freeform goodness (I've already got a couple of concepts I want to try out :) ) so Cryptic have worked their evil ways with me again *shakes fist at Cryptic*

Originally posted by tifalockhart

I went back and subscribed! really enjoying the game again and to be fair enjoyed it when it was released i just loose intrest in things real fast.

Am playing on my brothers life time account and am enjoying it aswell :)

though , if you want to keep playing  your character in this FTP game you ll have to pay

Renting characters is a very bad FTP concept i reckon

I feel they not thinking longterm , to get more players , they just want more subscribers.....and are not going to have succes like FTP bussines model Turbine has

i d bet my brothters lifetime account on that :)

Of course Cryptic is not going to say no to new subscribers, but giving a player a freeform character at no charge doesn't generate a new subscriber. It just generates someone who got something for nothing. It's just another free account.

Former players didn't think the game was worth paying for before, why would they think that now? Nothing significant has changed. It makes no sense for Cryptic to give any player a freeform character slot for free.

* edit * Good grief I hate mmorpg.com's post editor.

you know i kinda miss playing CO and i think i'll give it another try. DCUO is a great game CO is to. both games has something the other doesn't (figure it out)  and i've thought long and hard whether i should be loyal to one or the other but it's kinda impossible right now for me . been playing only DCUO since beta and it's rich in content . character creation is limited at the beginning but afterwards you can add on. if CO can match or even outdo the content in DCUO , CO would be a killer i believe.

Originally posted by samuel130

. if CO can match or even outdo the content in DCUO , CO would be a killer i believe.

i thought it is the other way round?

Originally posted by binary_0011

Originally posted by samuel130

. if CO can match or even outdo the content in DCUO , CO would be a killer i believe.

i thought it is the other way round?

Putting PvP content aside and just speaking PvE, CO is the better game if you subscribe. So many more powers to choose from the get go in CO and thats what takes the cake. Both game quest systems are similar, just different mobs and zones. I got bored faster in DCUO allot faster then in CO.